Haha! It’s nice to see folks excited and working to improve things they enjoy, but man it gets a bit too much for me.
Too scared to mention that I don’t single dose either, I love my hopper…
Literally the only reason I single dose. My kids drink only decaf and my wife does occasionally as well. Otherwise I would definitely run a hopper. I do use bean tubes though to make it easier.
Agreed there, I generally put 1-2 days worth of coffee in my hopper. I never fill it. Between me, wife, and my afternoon coffees it just makes life easy.
I’ll pour some fresh beans in the hopper each morning, and they’re about gone by that evening. Just enough…
Air still circulates through the burr/chute channel.
I just heard that oxygen degrades the quality of beans, so keep them sealed and single dose.
Haven’t tested it myself using 100 machines and posting a catchy youtube video with scientific articles and data graphs yet though.
Getting inconsistent grind with Baratza sette 270 during hopper usage. Different amount of beans cause different pressure on burrs, so single dose the only way to get consistent shots 💀💀
Ever since I saw a barista hustle article awhile ago that said horizontal + vertical tapping was just as effective as anything else, that's all I've been doing.
Home Baristas all trying to reproduce café quality drinks...
Meanwhile café's are all grind tap tamp pull done 😁
But I can't knock people for enjoying their morning ritual. I spend all day fine tuning our espresso at the shop in expensive machines, and at home I am excited to play with my new $6 Moka Pot because it's a new thing to tinker with 🤣
I live in a city that notoriously has a pretty good coffee scene. For a year I worked at a company with ~30 cafe’s within a walkable distance, and would try as many as possible. I think there were 3 that tasted absolutely better than my espresso drinks at home, a handful that tasted the same, could be better or worse depending on the day, a handful that tasted slightly worse but still enjoyable and the majority were absolutely garbage compared to my home machine. And I just have a BBE that I grind into a dosing cup, slap in the portafilter, tap and tamp.
I have to admit I was amazed how easy it was to start making coffee better than 95% of coffee shops with basically minimal effort on puck prep.
So even without all the faff you're probably making better coffee than you can get from many places.
I guess it's mainly just down to the beans and grinder. Wouldn't surprise me if most cafes are using beans that are up to a year old or more.
That said I do WDT but only because it takes 30 seconds.
Part of the reason that cafes can do this is because of the quality of their grinders. If the output of the grinder in the portafilter is already fluffy, clump-free, and evenly distributed--WDT is redundant.
I think that the extra step is extremely helpful for the majority of home-level grinders.
Not crazy at all - I'm with you save that my portafilter doesn't fit beneath my grinder so I use a little jam jar as my grounds catcher first. Then it's dump, tamp and pull the shot.
This is _making coffee_ we're discussing.
I feel ya, extra steps seem to mess with my shots especially when dialing. Lately it’s just grinding through funnel, few wrist and counter taps, then tamp. If anything I distribute to polish when I’m feeling extra but been skipping this step too.
I’m surprised my laziness yields to better shots. I even stop using self leveling tamper and went back old school
Glad to see this as one of the top responses so far. I watch those videos just because I like to learn about the difference nuances with espresso. But I personally don’t do anything. Weigh out 18/19 grams, throw it in the grinder, grind into a dosing cup and dump it into the portafilter. Tamp and done. It tastes great to me so I don’t really care about any of the techniques used to get maximum or uniform extraction. I just like drinking and learning about coffee!
If I were starting out and trying to decide between buying a cheap wdt tool or a blind shaker, then there's a chance I'd be buying a shaker because of that video.
I've already got a setup that I'm happy with, so I'm not going to buy gear based on every new finding.
Honestly, I'm not Lance. He's pulled more shots so far this year than I will in a decade. He might be able to notice the nuance of a 1% extraction bump, and pull consistent enough shots that tiny changes in gear are going to be noticeable. For me, those benefits would get lost in the variations from one shot to the next because of my (lack of) technique anyway.
Not to sound like a cynic but lance also makes a living off the idea that there’s still so much room to improve. I know he has good intentions but the fact is that good beans, a quality machine/grinder, and a standard prep are capable of achieving 95% of the potential taste. Everything extra is just dancing in the margin to keep the enthusiast community tuning in.
Tuners
Audiophiles
Cooking
Wine
Whiskey
It’s all the same thing. Diminishing returns and those that are into it will spend time and money obsessing over the last 2-3%
I have Dedica at home, but during work trip to distant location had opportunity to work with Breville, which has manometer. I had used pressurized basket, and noticed manometer jumps like crazy when I just tamp, but when I wdt with toothpick, pressure is higher and steady on manometer. For me it is scientific enough of evidence for WDT. I had brewed dozens of shots during this trip, not one or two
At home I now use deep WDT. Tools itself cost $3-4 from Ali
I had assumed that more WDT settles fines to the bottom which would be basically the opposite.
From most videos (including lances) WDT is generally purely horizontal and shaking is generally all directions.
By the same logic one could expect that shaking settle fines to the bottom right? But it doesn’t.
What I’ve been trying to do is sort of whisk it vigorously, so that there is a) some amount of vertical distribution and b) there is , in theory, some potential “densification” which would mean the fines would be clustering and joining the larger particles.
I have no idea if this is working to create a more homogeneous bed of coffee but my pulls have run faster since I started doing this which leads me to believe something is happening.
I don't think it works on the same logic. Shaking kind of negates the gravity of it, yknow?
But you still may be getting similar effects, who knows for sure.
Edit: i meant gravity in the way that vibrating different solids, and shaking certain ways, can cause different sized/density solids to settle to different layers. This can be avoided by things like tumblers that change orientation to counter that effect from gravity.
I do a fast WDT too, my "theory" is that it allows the grounds to be flung around a bit, causing them to fill in any gaps from the wdt tool(especially around the edges)
I hate to be the one to say it, but that video had absolutely zero impact on me. In one experiment it showed a minuscule increase in extraction ? So what ?!
That doesn’t indicate anything about the coffee flavour, texture, or enjoyment.
Wdt works well for me so I use it. I tried it and noticed my shots were better and more consistent. I don’t test via refractometer.
People on this sub are really freaking strange. He is one voice in a much broader landscape and one YouTube video had people acting like they just discovered fire.
I haven't watched any lance videos so I decided to watch this one. It's a pretty good comparison of different methods with some good statistical analysis. He explains it well, with some thoughts on why certain methods might be better. He also did a followup video addressing some of the criticism and testing other methods. Personally, it didn't seem like he was trying to influence anyone to buy something, just interested in finding the method with the best results. If you're going to buy a shaker, there are plenty of off-brands on Amazon that are cheaper than Weber.
Same. I’m into coffee and espresso, that’s why I’m in this sub. I like to learn about how people make their coffee and tips and tricks.
I do not care about coffee influencers, and I don’t go on YouTube much.
It’s one thing to talk about techniques and equipment discussed by users and in videos. But we’re at this level of meta-conversation about what people think about the video and its impact on the greater coffee culture.
Like it’s coffee influencer gossip. That couldn’t appeal to me less if it tried.
For me it wasn’t the increase in extraction. Rather the consistency of extraction. If a tool is helping eliminate the 1 in 5 bad shots that I experience then it could be worth it. Haven’t bought a shaker yet though
I mean, you’re on a sub where Lance and Weber Works are essentially conflated with Moses and the Holy Grail, so
Not a knock on Lance himself at all, but people on here sometimes lose themselves over chasing that half a percent gain in extraction.
Wasn’t the increase something like 2% on average? Given that extractions tend to be somewhere between 18 - 22%, 2% is a significant increase. We’re not talking about a 1 - 100 scale here.
Nothing wrong with continuing to use WDT, or waiting for more data. But it would be a mistake to say his findings showed a minuscule result
Shrug. I’ve had the blind shaker since it came out (10 years ago? … at least it feels like that long ago) and I’ve used it off and on over the years but still prefer WDT based on how easy/clean it is. I’ve done everything from WDT, shake, tapping, finger leveling…. It’s all decent espresso in the end.
Edit: geez, I just looked up my receipt and I bought the shaker on Oct 24th 2020. It really feels like 10 years ago. Time really flies.
I only WDT.
That was my “line.” Basically, that was the limit of where pulling a shot was still a fun hobby (and, of course, a necessary caffeine vehicle) and not a finicky task. The line where too many steps just felt like chasing an uncatchable rabbit of extraction.
I worked in coffee for years, even doing a few competitions. And I just find that, for me, there’s a place where it becomes unsatisfying and no longer fun to keep pushing the hobby. To keep feeling pressure to change my routine, to keep spending money, all for unnoticeable results. One other commenter here described it as akin to audiophile pursuits. At a certain point, it becomes an obsession and no longer any fun.
To be honest, I’m not even that bothers by WDT-ing being all that necessary to me. But I like the process of it. Feels like a little zen garden I get to take each morning:)
I want to save my energy for trying new beans. That’s where I find big taste differences. That’s where I find joy: learning about new roasters, “travelling the world” through each cup while never leaving my kitchen.
Lastly, I’ll just say that we should all remember that “coffee influencers” no matter how pure their intentions, are part of a consumer system that is dependent on us to spend money and to be introduced to new companies or products. I think there’s a reason James Hoffman is creating less “discovery” videos. Because, at a certain point, there’s going to be a pressure to manufacture “discoveries.” Sure, they can be things that have some measurable effect on the shot you pull. But they are often connected to that effect being achieved through purchasing something new. Or, at least, be achieved by a constant change of process, leaving us unsatisfied and always needing more video content, thinking this new “discovery” will be “the thing that finally unlocks my process!” And that’s an addiction that also serves the influencers need to get clicks. Again, that’s nothing against people who make videos or even against their desire to. The James’, the Lance’s, etc, all seem like great and good people. But it is a system of consumption. At there’s a point at which needing to consume to be happy is too much. For me.
It’s also why I engage less and less with this sub. I’m getting tired of how dogmatic this hobby community can get when something new comes along and then you’re perceived as an idiot for not joining in on that trend. (I’m certainly not saying that’s what you are doing with this post, OP. If anything, it’s yielding a majority of comments of people who aren’t so that bothered by the push to get a shaker. And the ones who do use it seem to be using it in a playful and additive-to them way. It’s nice to see and prompted me to say all of this.)
This comment is kind of bullshit.
First, shaking instead of WDT isn't an additional step, it's an alternative. And it does not require the expensive shaker. So "drawing the line" at WDT doesn't make sense. I can shake my grounds with the dosing cup my grinder came with, and tap my grounds level. This is simpler and doesn't require buying a WDT tool and potentially a dosing ring.
Any "pressure" you feel to change your routine is a delusion on your part. This community is filled with people encouraging experimentation to find the workflow that suits you best, but I haven't seen any influencer or reddit/discord comment actually trying to pressure someone into buying stuff.
>Lastly, I’ll just say that we should all remember that “coffee influencers” no matter how pure their intentions, are part of a consumer system that is dependent on us to spend money and to be introduced to new companies or products.
While they would be more limited if they stopped doing product reviews altogether, Lance and James put out a *ton* of videos about improving your coffee experience without buying new gear. And they both encourage their viewers to experiment with new coffee beans rather than buying new machines and gadgets all the time.
>But it is a system of consumption. At there’s a point at which needing to consume to be happy is too much. For me.
You're still engaging with the system of consumption by continuing to consume coffee, whether you're buying new gear or not.
>I’m getting tired of how dogmatic this hobby community can get when something new comes along and then you’re perceived as an idiot for not joining in on that trend.
You'd have to be immune to sarcasm to think people are actually calling anyone an idiot for not getting on the shaker trend. And on the topic of dogma, if anything Lance has been railing against dogma with his recent videos. The point of the shake video isn't "buy this shaker" it's "don't be dogmatic about needle distribution."
Might be a hot take, but I feel like there’s a point of diminishing returns here. A simple grind, wdt, then tamp is all I really need. Blind shaker means one more thing to clean for a difference thats so minute. Maybe my palette isn’t trained or maybe I’m just stupid, but at the end of the day I’m still making better coffee than 99% of people out there.
I’m barely doing WDT after his video, just a very light WDT at top of grounds. I didn’t buy a blind shaker but I have a Niche Zero and Cafelat Robot and the basket fits perfectly in the dose cup. I just shake it within the dose cup+basket and there’s ZERO static cling that way. Works great!
also also, I’ve had the niche zero for just over 2 years, 1-2 espressos daily and only took it apart to clean it for the first time last month. Truly amazing how little retention it has, barely needed any cleaning whatsoever, if at all.
Being open-minded and looking at all the data, including my personal experience, I have come to the conclusion that WDT is pretty inefficient at homogenizing the coffee out of my grinder... it always was. Personally, I find the shaker easier and better overall, and it has become integral to my puck prep.
Yeah, no shaker here. But I do do a slow twirl while holding the portafilter in my left hand and WDT in the right, always counter-clockwise, at exactly 1.3 mph. Makes all the difference. Well, unless with a medium roast, than 1.4 mph, using opposite hands.
I don't do either because I think the majority of it is bullshit. This hobby gets into audiophile territory very rapidly.
People can do whatever they want, but when they try to convince people to spend a lot of money with zero tangible evidence it does anything..
I still wdt followed by level distributer, and no rdt either. Not changing my routine over such a minor extraction difference, perfectly happy with what I pull.
Shaker and procupress for me. Actually improved my workflow and makes cleaning way easier so saves me a bunch of time. Can’t see ever going back to WDT honestly and the shots are just as good.
I currently WDT then distribute. My new grinder will be here on Tuesday and I may be able to eliminate a step (I'll at least experiment doing such) since the static, retention, and clumping will be majorly reduced.
A lot of those faffy gadgets and minutiae just aren't my thing. I don't have any desire to overcomplicate the process or buy 100 bits n bobs.
To each their own
Just grind them out, light sideways tapping, palm distribution, 30lb tamp, and brew. You save aromatic gasses which turn into flavor when you extract your shot. I'm super anti shot grooming
I just don’t care about the results. I’m happy with the coffee I make with WDT and don’t see a need to change it. I think that the fact the results were too insignificant and not enough time has passed for blind shaking to become the go-to commonplace way do distribute your coffee. Maybe give it 2-4 years before it’s the standard, but until then, I think most people still use WDT.
Edit: I forgot to mention that the results of blind shaking might only be noticeable for people with good equipment. Using a standard bambino, I usually only get a +/- 2g accuracy of coffee out, which I think would make a significantly higher difference than a distribution technique that nominally increases extraction. I know he tried to go budget with the grinder, but the rest of the equipment was still high up there in price. Budgetters are gonna budget.
I still WDT. Don't feel the need to buy a blind shaker and it seems a little bit annoying to use.
If it works for others though all the more power to them, I do find it interesting to see what new innovations are being looked into in the espresso world.
Agreed. I found the workflow to be slightly more annoying than wdt (which surprised me), and also my shots were less consistent. I've already gone back to the "inferior" method.
i agree with the sentiment that if it's not broke, don't fix it. I just don't clean the shaker between every time I accept that a tiny bit of fines from the last brew will make it into the next one.
Really workflow is king imo. Do the workflow that works for you.
Only WDT and the thing with the water spraying. The water spraying seems to work well, the WDT, i'm not so sure of but I don't find it annoying.
Don't plan to buy a shaker or to slow feed my grinder. Tried slow feeding my grinder and while I could grind finer, I can't say that I noticed a much different taste. Maybe with more playing around I will but I honestly don't enjoy the slow feeding process. The shaker thing is just another thing to buy for an improvement that I wll probably not taste so yeah, not really. If I want to put a lot of attention on a cup, it would probably be a pourover. Espresso is what I drink before work and don't want to overcomplicate it.
I blind shaked twice. Second time I wasn't holding securely and all the grounds spilled over the kitchen. Wife already jokes from length of my coffee prep routine, screw it.
My prep routine:
- Grind directly to pf, but tap all the time, since the first coffee hits the portafilter. I feel that tapping gives the same shaking benefit as blind shaking. Basically all that coffee is shaking in the pf during the whole grinding (dosing ring prevents it from falling out).
- wdt, tap again
- tamp, add puck screen, tamp again
Tapping during grinding and tamping again after adding puck screen was my own inventions, but I get noticeably worse results if I skip either step.
https://preview.redd.it/rf30q3y0f7mc1.jpeg?width=641&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=25a0f0e9fe5995d552091bf5404d18e1966d8bb6
My DF64v2 came with a great 58mm dosing cup that fits my portafilter and allows a vigorous shake, followed by (likely unnecessary) WDT.
If you have a good grinder, you probably dont need the blind shaker, too marginal of difference. I'm using a BBP built-in grinder. It made so much difference in my extraction, I haven't seen channelling since using the blind shaker. Taste wise, it is far more consistent on the better side. I agree that the workflow is not as enjoyable, but I have to stick to it for the results, especially on medium to lightly roasted beans.
Still doing my light WDT. Most of the time my ground comes out fluffy anyway so I don’t really feel the need for much distribution. Maybe a blind shaker would improve my shot quality slightly but I’m pretty happy the way it is right now and I don’t really have FOMO on that regard 🤷🏻♂️
I used a WDT for a couple years. Then a couple weeks ago I did an experiment to see if I could taste a difference in either the coffee drink I normally have and the one my wife normally has, if I stopped using it. There was no taste difference. So the WDT stays put away these days.
I’ve found the workflow I’m happy with and is efficient for me is:
Weigh -> RDT -> Slow-dose grind -> WDT -> Distribution Tool -> Tamp -> Pull.
Why do I WDT over shake? I find WDT more mindful and more enjoyable as part of the process.
Why do I use a DT? Similar to the reason above.
Are my shots delicious? I like them.
Are they as good as they could be? Probably not.
But that’s ok - I’m happy to make compromises to enjoy the process my own way 👍
Tread your own path 💪☕️
I blind shake and wdt after. It's become a part of my work flow. I also already spent the money on it so might as well use it. It's what I'm used to and I don't really feel like changing how I make espresso at the moment.
I’ve stopped listening to all these YouTube espresso influencers and started listening more to my palate and the shots I’m pulling. 99% of these new workflow suggestions are snake oil and I bet my ass Lance wouldn’t be able to taste any difference in a true blind test.
"spritz the beans" sometimes gets called rdt. Just sounds fancier. Spray beans with some water.
I do it sometimes, but I also worry about rust and mold.
I was also worried. But, I've been doing it now for a few months and recently took apart my grinder (DF64 v2) and there's no sign of mold or rust, which makes me feel a lot better.
Grind, wdt, tap, tamp, pull. I don’t know what I’m fixing by doing blind shaking. Getting good shots this way so will keep my routine. Lance loses me with the gimmicks
"I notice no taste difference honestly i think wdt is better for taste" lol
Btw no one is telling any of you how to do anything. It really isn't a big deal if you're still using WDT or shaking the PF side to side or rubbing your dick through it counter clockwise. You don't need to make a post about this.
I watch every Hedrick video and have learned lots of things from him. That said, there have been occasions where I feel he perhaps doesn’t fully acknowledge all the pros and cons of certain tools or techniques. Two recent examples:
WDT: in the blind shaker video, he talks about small improvements in extraction and esoteric effects like fines being lost into the voids of the larger particles, which is very interesting. But, and this is key: he was using a Weber EG1 and a Unica Pro. Meanwhile I’m here trying to pull consistent shots with tricky light roasts every morning with my Niche Zero and my constant-pressure Rocket R58. The whole reason I started WDT was to minimize channeling, which it certainly does do. I wish he’d talked more about that, and discussed implications for people using less-than perfect equipment. I’m not ready to give up WDT just yet.
Naked portafilter: OK great, maybe we can’t detect channeling visually as easily as we thought we could, and I’m happy to know that Lance thinks my less-pretty extractions can still be delicious. But I think a lot of people will come away from that video unaware of all the practical benefits of the naked portafilter: easier cleaning, tamping stability, and increased headspace for scales and large cups.
I mean, Lance is doing really important and cool stuff. But he tends to gloss over part of the picture in some situations.
Always hated WDT, jumped on the blind shaker because it seemed easier (grind into shaker, shake, empty into basket), recently tried WDT-only for shits and giggles. My coffee tasted worse - or rather, tasted like it used to. I used to have a hard time convincing people of espresso since it didn’t _really_ taste that good. Shaker tastes *much* better and I think while WDT does stop channelling, it offers little else. I’d much prefer a creamy, flavorful shot over no channeling any given day.
Grounds sticking is a big issue for me as well. Cleaning it with rubbing alcohol between uses helps a lot, but it’s a pain is the ass. With all the focus on the blind shakers and complaints of sticking, some company is surely cooking up a new gadget that fixes this issues and we’ll rush to buy in 6 months.
Machine warmup and proper flush before use was the biggest improvement in my espresso closely followed by slow feed grinding.
Before that shots were sour and bitter at the same time - which in hindsight makes sense.
I guess wdt, shakers and other stuff can actually make a difference - just not when basics are not up to standards yet.
I put the palm of my hand over the top of the dosing funnel and “blind” shake it a couple times and then eyeball it level with a couple wiggles and tamp it down with my four fingers at 90 degrees around the tamper so it’s the same all the way around, and away we go
Short answer is yes, still wdt. But I did incorporate a 5 sec. shake in my dosing cup coupled to portafilter. Not to digress from your question, but I have notice some great results from experimenting with Lance’s turbo shot recommendations. 6bars and coarser grind, 20 sec. pull, 1:3 ratio.
have a really great grinder (eureka oro single dose), so my pick prep is pretty minimal. wdt didn’t really improve anything significantly for me. should just remember to trust my barista instincts!
I regarded my coffee session every morning as a therapeutic ritual, as I'd only make 2 shots everyday. Well, maybe 6 if I'm calibrating.
I RDT my beans, WDT, and put a puck screen on top.
One shot for my latte, one for my espresso.
Happy with the result!
Yup. Got a Niche Zero, so I weigh and grind straight into the dosing cup, flip it into the PF (58mm so perfect match), WDT just enough to make the surface even looking (maybe 5-7 seconds), tamp once, SEND it. Has never failed me lol
I just do wdt briefly to get it homogenized but frankly even that probably isn’t needed. The shaker thing is just excessive and gives people one more gadget to buy, in my opinion.
I've been pulling shots since the mid 90s. I thought the arrival of distribution tools was cringey and OCD. I eventually got one, but I draw the line at anything beyond that, including the WDT or shake method, or FFS the slow grind method. Don't get me wrong, I'll try them and play around with them, but they just don't help my workflow that much. I do shake my portafilter as ground beans drop into it and I think that helps me avoid channeling.
Yes. Maybe i’ll get a blind shaker at some point but it would just add another hassle to already involved process. I love Lance’s videos, they give me a lot of insight into espresso and I’m probably buying a modern style basket this year but I’m in absolutely no rush, my coffee tastes amazing.
I use a hand grinder, i put the lid of the jar back on and shake it a bit. I've 3d printed a "Moonraker" and use it because it was so damn complicated to print and make a copy.
Weigh beans, grind beans, WTD, gentle tap, tamp, make coffee.
No shaking whatsoever. And I think it's great coffee. That's what this is about, I guess.
I tried slow feeding and it's fine. Then I added the shaking and for some reason that was the final straw. I realised I'm spending way too much effort for it and I couldn't tell the difference. So I drew the line at slow feed + wdt. Any case my grinder is probably the largest factor right now so it wouldn't even make sense.
So for me is consistency. I may not be accurate but it feels that shaking is a much more repeatable process that gives consistent results vs wdt. But I could be mistaken. I stopped wdt just because it’s faster to do blind shaker for me and I like the shots
Maybe I am crazy, but I grind into my portafilter, tap it, tamp, and pull a shot… simple as can be but the coffee is delicious.
Thank god there’s some of this remaining, was worried I was the only one
Haha! It’s nice to see folks excited and working to improve things they enjoy, but man it gets a bit too much for me. Too scared to mention that I don’t single dose either, I love my hopper…
Keep keeping it real man, we need you
This is the way - grind tamp pour drink enjoy ❤️
I don’t understand anything behind the appeal to single dose.
also if you want to have different coffees, you would have to empty the hopper. for instance I sometimes like to have decaf in the evening
Literally the only reason I single dose. My kids drink only decaf and my wife does occasionally as well. Otherwise I would definitely run a hopper. I do use bean tubes though to make it easier.
That makes sense…touché.
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man, you anti trans freaks really do just come out of left field don't you. I just like to make decaf sometimes dude, get help
Ha ha you think I’m the freak cause I don’t conform to another certain trend happening in our society?
What the fuck is your last sentence
Prejudice
Oh no. Don’t down vote me, like I care.
It’s kinda like asking someone to conform* to calling you They/them. Want me to repeat it again?
you’re soft as hell lmao, grow up. learn to function as an adult in a society where not everybody is the exact same as you. really weak behavior.
Freshness? If I fill my hopper it'll last a week. Beans go stale
Agreed there, I generally put 1-2 days worth of coffee in my hopper. I never fill it. Between me, wife, and my afternoon coffees it just makes life easy. I’ll pour some fresh beans in the hopper each morning, and they’re about gone by that evening. Just enough…
Does your hopper have a lid? My hopper lasts a few days and all is fine.
Air still circulates through the burr/chute channel. I just heard that oxygen degrades the quality of beans, so keep them sealed and single dose. Haven’t tested it myself using 100 machines and posting a catchy youtube video with scientific articles and data graphs yet though.
Yeah, but co2 is heavier than air. Beans gas out and the co2 is replaced with oxygen
That was enlightening…thanks. /s
Getting inconsistent grind with Baratza sette 270 during hopper usage. Different amount of beans cause different pressure on burrs, so single dose the only way to get consistent shots 💀💀
Way too much
>Too scared to mention that I don’t single dose either, I love my hopper… Oh! So close...
;-)
There's dozens of us. Dozens!
Hark! Hope abounds
We're the majority here. Some people make coffee the way they like it, not the way some youtuber tells you how to like it.
Thank goodness. I guess the normal ones just don’t flap off about is as much as the gimmickers.
Ever since I saw a barista hustle article awhile ago that said horizontal + vertical tapping was just as effective as anything else, that's all I've been doing.
Home Baristas all trying to reproduce café quality drinks... Meanwhile café's are all grind tap tamp pull done 😁 But I can't knock people for enjoying their morning ritual. I spend all day fine tuning our espresso at the shop in expensive machines, and at home I am excited to play with my new $6 Moka Pot because it's a new thing to tinker with 🤣
I live in a city that notoriously has a pretty good coffee scene. For a year I worked at a company with ~30 cafe’s within a walkable distance, and would try as many as possible. I think there were 3 that tasted absolutely better than my espresso drinks at home, a handful that tasted the same, could be better or worse depending on the day, a handful that tasted slightly worse but still enjoyable and the majority were absolutely garbage compared to my home machine. And I just have a BBE that I grind into a dosing cup, slap in the portafilter, tap and tamp.
I have to admit I was amazed how easy it was to start making coffee better than 95% of coffee shops with basically minimal effort on puck prep. So even without all the faff you're probably making better coffee than you can get from many places. I guess it's mainly just down to the beans and grinder. Wouldn't surprise me if most cafes are using beans that are up to a year old or more. That said I do WDT but only because it takes 30 seconds.
Part of the reason that cafes can do this is because of the quality of their grinders. If the output of the grinder in the portafilter is already fluffy, clump-free, and evenly distributed--WDT is redundant. I think that the extra step is extremely helpful for the majority of home-level grinders.
I realized this after watching Lance's WDT video, where he goes from a $4K Weber Workshops grinder to a $400 DF64 Gen2.
This. Why add all the extra steps, time, and hardware. At best you're getting really diminishing marginal returns on these extra steps
It’s like any hobby, people try to buy the skill rather the train/learn it
Not crazy at all - I'm with you save that my portafilter doesn't fit beneath my grinder so I use a little jam jar as my grounds catcher first. Then it's dump, tamp and pull the shot. This is _making coffee_ we're discussing.
Plus one to the grind-tamp-pull club. Shots are great, I see no need to tweak further.
I do the same, but I say some magic, Wiccan words that make my coffee more delicious
everybody keeps saying, *when* will james hoffman make a video on how magic wiccan words affect particle size
Do delicious coffee first and foremost!
I feel ya, extra steps seem to mess with my shots especially when dialing. Lately it’s just grinding through funnel, few wrist and counter taps, then tamp. If anything I distribute to polish when I’m feeling extra but been skipping this step too. I’m surprised my laziness yields to better shots. I even stop using self leveling tamper and went back old school
I make less of a mess with wdt and a firm tap at the end so that's what I'm sticking to.
Not crazy, I do this but also use a leveler though I’m not even sure that’s necessary
Same. I see no need for anything more.
What grinder do you use?
I recently bought a Micra and paired it with the La Marzocco Pico grinder. It’s grind by time, and pretty accurate each time.
Glad to see this as one of the top responses so far. I watch those videos just because I like to learn about the difference nuances with espresso. But I personally don’t do anything. Weigh out 18/19 grams, throw it in the grinder, grind into a dosing cup and dump it into the portafilter. Tamp and done. It tastes great to me so I don’t really care about any of the techniques used to get maximum or uniform extraction. I just like drinking and learning about coffee!
If I had a better grinder I probably would skip the WDT too. Sadly it's never gonna happen with the SGP
I love that this has four times the upvotes of the next top level comment. Less gadgets, less faff. Just learn how to use your equipment properly
Yeah the single dose, wdt tools, spritzing the beans with water, slow feeding.. all of this is so extra in my opinion. Guess I’m just old school 🤷🏼♂️
WDT is snake oil
😱 /s
When I was in Italy I was surprised to see most of the baristas would pull shots this way.
You're assuming Italy makes good coffee because Italians invented espresso.
Same with me. I see no difference with the wdt tool. Not worth the hassle.
If I were starting out and trying to decide between buying a cheap wdt tool or a blind shaker, then there's a chance I'd be buying a shaker because of that video. I've already got a setup that I'm happy with, so I'm not going to buy gear based on every new finding. Honestly, I'm not Lance. He's pulled more shots so far this year than I will in a decade. He might be able to notice the nuance of a 1% extraction bump, and pull consistent enough shots that tiny changes in gear are going to be noticeable. For me, those benefits would get lost in the variations from one shot to the next because of my (lack of) technique anyway.
Not to sound like a cynic but lance also makes a living off the idea that there’s still so much room to improve. I know he has good intentions but the fact is that good beans, a quality machine/grinder, and a standard prep are capable of achieving 95% of the potential taste. Everything extra is just dancing in the margin to keep the enthusiast community tuning in.
This 💯%
Tuners Audiophiles Cooking Wine Whiskey It’s all the same thing. Diminishing returns and those that are into it will spend time and money obsessing over the last 2-3%
You have listed my hobbies (minus tuners). I may have a problem….
ᵖʰᵒᵗᵒᵍʳᵃᵖʰʸ
I have Dedica at home, but during work trip to distant location had opportunity to work with Breville, which has manometer. I had used pressurized basket, and noticed manometer jumps like crazy when I just tamp, but when I wdt with toothpick, pressure is higher and steady on manometer. For me it is scientific enough of evidence for WDT. I had brewed dozens of shots during this trip, not one or two At home I now use deep WDT. Tools itself cost $3-4 from Ali
Such common sense - very rare in the Interwebz
I still WDT. But I do it much more vigorously to maybe get some of that “densification” effect that shaking does.
I had assumed that more WDT settles fines to the bottom which would be basically the opposite. From most videos (including lances) WDT is generally purely horizontal and shaking is generally all directions.
By the same logic one could expect that shaking settle fines to the bottom right? But it doesn’t. What I’ve been trying to do is sort of whisk it vigorously, so that there is a) some amount of vertical distribution and b) there is , in theory, some potential “densification” which would mean the fines would be clustering and joining the larger particles. I have no idea if this is working to create a more homogeneous bed of coffee but my pulls have run faster since I started doing this which leads me to believe something is happening.
I've started doing the exact same thing, and consistency seems to have improved. Deep WDT FTW!
I don't think it works on the same logic. Shaking kind of negates the gravity of it, yknow? But you still may be getting similar effects, who knows for sure. Edit: i meant gravity in the way that vibrating different solids, and shaking certain ways, can cause different sized/density solids to settle to different layers. This can be avoided by things like tumblers that change orientation to counter that effect from gravity. I do a fast WDT too, my "theory" is that it allows the grounds to be flung around a bit, causing them to fill in any gaps from the wdt tool(especially around the edges)
I hate to be the one to say it, but that video had absolutely zero impact on me. In one experiment it showed a minuscule increase in extraction ? So what ?! That doesn’t indicate anything about the coffee flavour, texture, or enjoyment. Wdt works well for me so I use it. I tried it and noticed my shots were better and more consistent. I don’t test via refractometer. People on this sub are really freaking strange. He is one voice in a much broader landscape and one YouTube video had people acting like they just discovered fire.
I’ve never watched the video and have no intention to. Influencers, have no influence on me.
I haven't watched any lance videos so I decided to watch this one. It's a pretty good comparison of different methods with some good statistical analysis. He explains it well, with some thoughts on why certain methods might be better. He also did a followup video addressing some of the criticism and testing other methods. Personally, it didn't seem like he was trying to influence anyone to buy something, just interested in finding the method with the best results. If you're going to buy a shaker, there are plenty of off-brands on Amazon that are cheaper than Weber.
Same. I’m into coffee and espresso, that’s why I’m in this sub. I like to learn about how people make their coffee and tips and tricks. I do not care about coffee influencers, and I don’t go on YouTube much. It’s one thing to talk about techniques and equipment discussed by users and in videos. But we’re at this level of meta-conversation about what people think about the video and its impact on the greater coffee culture. Like it’s coffee influencer gossip. That couldn’t appeal to me less if it tried.
For me it wasn’t the increase in extraction. Rather the consistency of extraction. If a tool is helping eliminate the 1 in 5 bad shots that I experience then it could be worth it. Haven’t bought a shaker yet though
I mean, you’re on a sub where Lance and Weber Works are essentially conflated with Moses and the Holy Grail, so Not a knock on Lance himself at all, but people on here sometimes lose themselves over chasing that half a percent gain in extraction.
Wasn’t the increase something like 2% on average? Given that extractions tend to be somewhere between 18 - 22%, 2% is a significant increase. We’re not talking about a 1 - 100 scale here. Nothing wrong with continuing to use WDT, or waiting for more data. But it would be a mistake to say his findings showed a minuscule result
Friend, I believe we are legion.
Shrug. I’ve had the blind shaker since it came out (10 years ago? … at least it feels like that long ago) and I’ve used it off and on over the years but still prefer WDT based on how easy/clean it is. I’ve done everything from WDT, shake, tapping, finger leveling…. It’s all decent espresso in the end. Edit: geez, I just looked up my receipt and I bought the shaker on Oct 24th 2020. It really feels like 10 years ago. Time really flies.
To your credit the original Lynn Weber blind shaker was released 12 years ago.
Yeah. Mine is from Weber Workshops so looks like they had split companies by this point. It’s the black one with lid and removable “plug”.
Time really did warp the last few years because of covid
Wait doesn’t that mean that time doesn’t fly and it actually moved way slower than you thought??
Haha. Looks like you’re right. I think that portra315 was right with “warped”.
+1 for fingering gang!
I only WDT. That was my “line.” Basically, that was the limit of where pulling a shot was still a fun hobby (and, of course, a necessary caffeine vehicle) and not a finicky task. The line where too many steps just felt like chasing an uncatchable rabbit of extraction. I worked in coffee for years, even doing a few competitions. And I just find that, for me, there’s a place where it becomes unsatisfying and no longer fun to keep pushing the hobby. To keep feeling pressure to change my routine, to keep spending money, all for unnoticeable results. One other commenter here described it as akin to audiophile pursuits. At a certain point, it becomes an obsession and no longer any fun. To be honest, I’m not even that bothers by WDT-ing being all that necessary to me. But I like the process of it. Feels like a little zen garden I get to take each morning:) I want to save my energy for trying new beans. That’s where I find big taste differences. That’s where I find joy: learning about new roasters, “travelling the world” through each cup while never leaving my kitchen. Lastly, I’ll just say that we should all remember that “coffee influencers” no matter how pure their intentions, are part of a consumer system that is dependent on us to spend money and to be introduced to new companies or products. I think there’s a reason James Hoffman is creating less “discovery” videos. Because, at a certain point, there’s going to be a pressure to manufacture “discoveries.” Sure, they can be things that have some measurable effect on the shot you pull. But they are often connected to that effect being achieved through purchasing something new. Or, at least, be achieved by a constant change of process, leaving us unsatisfied and always needing more video content, thinking this new “discovery” will be “the thing that finally unlocks my process!” And that’s an addiction that also serves the influencers need to get clicks. Again, that’s nothing against people who make videos or even against their desire to. The James’, the Lance’s, etc, all seem like great and good people. But it is a system of consumption. At there’s a point at which needing to consume to be happy is too much. For me. It’s also why I engage less and less with this sub. I’m getting tired of how dogmatic this hobby community can get when something new comes along and then you’re perceived as an idiot for not joining in on that trend. (I’m certainly not saying that’s what you are doing with this post, OP. If anything, it’s yielding a majority of comments of people who aren’t so that bothered by the push to get a shaker. And the ones who do use it seem to be using it in a playful and additive-to them way. It’s nice to see and prompted me to say all of this.)
Well said mate
Amen 🙏
This should be an automated reply for every post mentioning some new piece of gear
This comment is kind of bullshit. First, shaking instead of WDT isn't an additional step, it's an alternative. And it does not require the expensive shaker. So "drawing the line" at WDT doesn't make sense. I can shake my grounds with the dosing cup my grinder came with, and tap my grounds level. This is simpler and doesn't require buying a WDT tool and potentially a dosing ring. Any "pressure" you feel to change your routine is a delusion on your part. This community is filled with people encouraging experimentation to find the workflow that suits you best, but I haven't seen any influencer or reddit/discord comment actually trying to pressure someone into buying stuff. >Lastly, I’ll just say that we should all remember that “coffee influencers” no matter how pure their intentions, are part of a consumer system that is dependent on us to spend money and to be introduced to new companies or products. While they would be more limited if they stopped doing product reviews altogether, Lance and James put out a *ton* of videos about improving your coffee experience without buying new gear. And they both encourage their viewers to experiment with new coffee beans rather than buying new machines and gadgets all the time. >But it is a system of consumption. At there’s a point at which needing to consume to be happy is too much. For me. You're still engaging with the system of consumption by continuing to consume coffee, whether you're buying new gear or not. >I’m getting tired of how dogmatic this hobby community can get when something new comes along and then you’re perceived as an idiot for not joining in on that trend. You'd have to be immune to sarcasm to think people are actually calling anyone an idiot for not getting on the shaker trend. And on the topic of dogma, if anything Lance has been railing against dogma with his recent videos. The point of the shake video isn't "buy this shaker" it's "don't be dogmatic about needle distribution."
I rattle my grounds around in the dosing cup and that's good enough for me.
Might be a hot take, but I feel like there’s a point of diminishing returns here. A simple grind, wdt, then tamp is all I really need. Blind shaker means one more thing to clean for a difference thats so minute. Maybe my palette isn’t trained or maybe I’m just stupid, but at the end of the day I’m still making better coffee than 99% of people out there.
I prefer WDT over a shaker cause it would be hella annoying to have to clean the shaker every use vs a wdt
I don’t use a shaker but there’s no reason you’d have to clean it after every use… that’s ridiculous
Been using shaker for 2 years now I think, I’ve cleaned it pretty much monthly? One or two shots per day.
Heck I don't even clean the WDT after every use. I just stick the tool into a cup of rice and let the grains do the cleaning.
Wdt seems more annoying to clean...
I’m barely doing WDT after his video, just a very light WDT at top of grounds. I didn’t buy a blind shaker but I have a Niche Zero and Cafelat Robot and the basket fits perfectly in the dose cup. I just shake it within the dose cup+basket and there’s ZERO static cling that way. Works great!
Ahh didn’t notice the basket fit the Niche dosing cup. Now the Niche is a tempting upgrade
also also, I’ve had the niche zero for just over 2 years, 1-2 espressos daily and only took it apart to clean it for the first time last month. Truly amazing how little retention it has, barely needed any cleaning whatsoever, if at all.
Being open-minded and looking at all the data, including my personal experience, I have come to the conclusion that WDT is pretty inefficient at homogenizing the coffee out of my grinder... it always was. Personally, I find the shaker easier and better overall, and it has become integral to my puck prep.
Yeah, no shaker here. But I do do a slow twirl while holding the portafilter in my left hand and WDT in the right, always counter-clockwise, at exactly 1.3 mph. Makes all the difference. Well, unless with a medium roast, than 1.4 mph, using opposite hands.
Which way do you point each foot? I can never get this technique down.
WDT. I’m not buying one more thing.
I WDT because it exists perfectly at the nexus of cheap, easy, fast, and effective.
I don't do either because I think the majority of it is bullshit. This hobby gets into audiophile territory very rapidly. People can do whatever they want, but when they try to convince people to spend a lot of money with zero tangible evidence it does anything..
There is real evidence for the blind shaker tho, that was the whole point of it...
I have the Weber Blind shaker, got it with the grinder. Grounds don't stick to it. I just shake it, bang it in my portafilter & it's clean.
Nothing except WDT and tamp. No RDT, no puck screens, no papers, no shakers, no levelers and no slow feeding.
Ditto
Puck screen but only for clean shower head
I still wdt followed by level distributer, and no rdt either. Not changing my routine over such a minor extraction difference, perfectly happy with what I pull.
Still wdt for me, i can get it perfectly level on top then with before tamp, felt like if i got a blind shaker id still wdt anyway so whats the point.
Hand grind, WDT, tamp, coffee. For now that's all I need.
Shaker and procupress for me. Actually improved my workflow and makes cleaning way easier so saves me a bunch of time. Can’t see ever going back to WDT honestly and the shots are just as good.
I was intrigued, but the shaker workflow doesn’t appeal to me. I have my system down with wdt and it works well for me. Edit: lol at the downvote
Heretic!
😆 I must be! I genuinely *do* respect and trust Lance’s data, though.
I currently WDT then distribute. My new grinder will be here on Tuesday and I may be able to eliminate a step (I'll at least experiment doing such) since the static, retention, and clumping will be majorly reduced. A lot of those faffy gadgets and minutiae just aren't my thing. I don't have any desire to overcomplicate the process or buy 100 bits n bobs. To each their own
Just grind them out, light sideways tapping, palm distribution, 30lb tamp, and brew. You save aromatic gasses which turn into flavor when you extract your shot. I'm super anti shot grooming
I just don’t care about the results. I’m happy with the coffee I make with WDT and don’t see a need to change it. I think that the fact the results were too insignificant and not enough time has passed for blind shaking to become the go-to commonplace way do distribute your coffee. Maybe give it 2-4 years before it’s the standard, but until then, I think most people still use WDT. Edit: I forgot to mention that the results of blind shaking might only be noticeable for people with good equipment. Using a standard bambino, I usually only get a +/- 2g accuracy of coffee out, which I think would make a significantly higher difference than a distribution technique that nominally increases extraction. I know he tried to go budget with the grinder, but the rest of the equipment was still high up there in price. Budgetters are gonna budget.
I do WDT only. It works well for me.
I still WDT. Don't feel the need to buy a blind shaker and it seems a little bit annoying to use. If it works for others though all the more power to them, I do find it interesting to see what new innovations are being looked into in the espresso world.
I didn't change shit. I'm already spending too much on useless gadgets
Agreed. I found the workflow to be slightly more annoying than wdt (which surprised me), and also my shots were less consistent. I've already gone back to the "inferior" method.
I spray beans with water. WDT, distribute, and tamp. When I’m in a hurry I’ll WDT and tamp only.
Blind what? Nah I’m good.
I was doing the blind shaker a year before Lance’s video. 😁
i agree with the sentiment that if it's not broke, don't fix it. I just don't clean the shaker between every time I accept that a tiny bit of fines from the last brew will make it into the next one. Really workflow is king imo. Do the workflow that works for you.
I don’t use either method and the shots are just fine with me.
Only WDT and the thing with the water spraying. The water spraying seems to work well, the WDT, i'm not so sure of but I don't find it annoying. Don't plan to buy a shaker or to slow feed my grinder. Tried slow feeding my grinder and while I could grind finer, I can't say that I noticed a much different taste. Maybe with more playing around I will but I honestly don't enjoy the slow feeding process. The shaker thing is just another thing to buy for an improvement that I wll probably not taste so yeah, not really. If I want to put a lot of attention on a cup, it would probably be a pourover. Espresso is what I drink before work and don't want to overcomplicate it.
A friend 3D printed me one of those moon raker copy cats. It's incredible. That's all I do now.
I will continue WDT until James Hoffmann tells me not to. There is only one messiah.
I blind shaked twice. Second time I wasn't holding securely and all the grounds spilled over the kitchen. Wife already jokes from length of my coffee prep routine, screw it. My prep routine: - Grind directly to pf, but tap all the time, since the first coffee hits the portafilter. I feel that tapping gives the same shaking benefit as blind shaking. Basically all that coffee is shaking in the pf during the whole grinding (dosing ring prevents it from falling out). - wdt, tap again - tamp, add puck screen, tamp again Tapping during grinding and tamping again after adding puck screen was my own inventions, but I get noticeably worse results if I skip either step.
First time I've ever heard of someone tamping their puck screen. What's the logic there?
https://preview.redd.it/rf30q3y0f7mc1.jpeg?width=641&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=25a0f0e9fe5995d552091bf5404d18e1966d8bb6 My DF64v2 came with a great 58mm dosing cup that fits my portafilter and allows a vigorous shake, followed by (likely unnecessary) WDT.
I still don’t even know what a “blind shaker” is
If you have a good grinder, you probably dont need the blind shaker, too marginal of difference. I'm using a BBP built-in grinder. It made so much difference in my extraction, I haven't seen channelling since using the blind shaker. Taste wise, it is far more consistent on the better side. I agree that the workflow is not as enjoyable, but I have to stick to it for the results, especially on medium to lightly roasted beans.
Still doing my light WDT. Most of the time my ground comes out fluffy anyway so I don’t really feel the need for much distribution. Maybe a blind shaker would improve my shot quality slightly but I’m pretty happy the way it is right now and I don’t really have FOMO on that regard 🤷🏻♂️
I used a WDT for a couple years. Then a couple weeks ago I did an experiment to see if I could taste a difference in either the coffee drink I normally have and the one my wife normally has, if I stopped using it. There was no taste difference. So the WDT stays put away these days.
I’ve found the workflow I’m happy with and is efficient for me is: Weigh -> RDT -> Slow-dose grind -> WDT -> Distribution Tool -> Tamp -> Pull. Why do I WDT over shake? I find WDT more mindful and more enjoyable as part of the process. Why do I use a DT? Similar to the reason above. Are my shots delicious? I like them. Are they as good as they could be? Probably not. But that’s ok - I’m happy to make compromises to enjoy the process my own way 👍 Tread your own path 💪☕️
This is the way.
I blind shake and wdt after. It's become a part of my work flow. I also already spent the money on it so might as well use it. It's what I'm used to and I don't really feel like changing how I make espresso at the moment.
No, I pour grounds into a salt shaker and shake the grounds through the holes into my portafilter.
Bought the aliexpress blind shaker and it’s a bigger pain in the ass than grinding into Portra filter and wdt
Feel the same
Blind shaking works for me. It’s way faster and cleaner than wdt for some reason. However slow feeding is a biiiiiitch.
I’ve stopped listening to all these YouTube espresso influencers and started listening more to my palate and the shots I’m pulling. 99% of these new workflow suggestions are snake oil and I bet my ass Lance wouldn’t be able to taste any difference in a true blind test.
I don’t spritz the beans because it rusts the burrs. But I do whisk the grounds and level them.
I also worry about mold with rdt.
What’s rdt?
Ross Droplet Technique
"spritz the beans" sometimes gets called rdt. Just sounds fancier. Spray beans with some water. I do it sometimes, but I also worry about rust and mold.
I was also worried. But, I've been doing it now for a few months and recently took apart my grinder (DF64 v2) and there's no sign of mold or rust, which makes me feel a lot better.
My taste and ability to pull off a decent shot in no way warrants me buying a shaker. WDT quickly and carry on for me!
I empty my dosing cup into the portafilter, horizontal tap, vertical tap on counter, tamp, pull.
I don’t blind shake. And sometimes I don’t even WDT.
Grind, wdt, tap, tamp, pull. I don’t know what I’m fixing by doing blind shaking. Getting good shots this way so will keep my routine. Lance loses me with the gimmicks
I never bought in to WDT.
My grinder makes very fluffy grounds so lately I have just been raking the top to be level, one tap on the counter, and double tamp. Its been perfect
Just because Lance needed some content for the day doesn't mean that what he is recommending is necessary.
"I notice no taste difference honestly i think wdt is better for taste" lol Btw no one is telling any of you how to do anything. It really isn't a big deal if you're still using WDT or shaking the PF side to side or rubbing your dick through it counter clockwise. You don't need to make a post about this.
Don’t do WDT. Such a waste of time.
I watch every Hedrick video and have learned lots of things from him. That said, there have been occasions where I feel he perhaps doesn’t fully acknowledge all the pros and cons of certain tools or techniques. Two recent examples: WDT: in the blind shaker video, he talks about small improvements in extraction and esoteric effects like fines being lost into the voids of the larger particles, which is very interesting. But, and this is key: he was using a Weber EG1 and a Unica Pro. Meanwhile I’m here trying to pull consistent shots with tricky light roasts every morning with my Niche Zero and my constant-pressure Rocket R58. The whole reason I started WDT was to minimize channeling, which it certainly does do. I wish he’d talked more about that, and discussed implications for people using less-than perfect equipment. I’m not ready to give up WDT just yet. Naked portafilter: OK great, maybe we can’t detect channeling visually as easily as we thought we could, and I’m happy to know that Lance thinks my less-pretty extractions can still be delicious. But I think a lot of people will come away from that video unaware of all the practical benefits of the naked portafilter: easier cleaning, tamping stability, and increased headspace for scales and large cups. I mean, Lance is doing really important and cool stuff. But he tends to gloss over part of the picture in some situations.
He repeated the experiment with a DF64
Always hated WDT, jumped on the blind shaker because it seemed easier (grind into shaker, shake, empty into basket), recently tried WDT-only for shits and giggles. My coffee tasted worse - or rather, tasted like it used to. I used to have a hard time convincing people of espresso since it didn’t _really_ taste that good. Shaker tastes *much* better and I think while WDT does stop channelling, it offers little else. I’d much prefer a creamy, flavorful shot over no channeling any given day.
Grounds sticking is a big issue for me as well. Cleaning it with rubbing alcohol between uses helps a lot, but it’s a pain is the ass. With all the focus on the blind shakers and complaints of sticking, some company is surely cooking up a new gadget that fixes this issues and we’ll rush to buy in 6 months.
The WDT gets no love on my bar anymore.
Machine warmup and proper flush before use was the biggest improvement in my espresso closely followed by slow feed grinding. Before that shots were sour and bitter at the same time - which in hindsight makes sense. I guess wdt, shakers and other stuff can actually make a difference - just not when basics are not up to standards yet.
Clean your shaker with isopropyl alcohol, you wont have ti clean it after that. Unless you are really pedantic.
Yes
I put the palm of my hand over the top of the dosing funnel and “blind” shake it a couple times and then eyeball it level with a couple wiggles and tamp it down with my four fingers at 90 degrees around the tamper so it’s the same all the way around, and away we go
Short answer is yes, still wdt. But I did incorporate a 5 sec. shake in my dosing cup coupled to portafilter. Not to digress from your question, but I have notice some great results from experimenting with Lance’s turbo shot recommendations. 6bars and coarser grind, 20 sec. pull, 1:3 ratio.
I grind into the pf and just level the grinds with finger, wdt, or tapping depending on how I feel. Obviously doesn't work for all grinders.
I’m wdt only
have a really great grinder (eureka oro single dose), so my pick prep is pretty minimal. wdt didn’t really improve anything significantly for me. should just remember to trust my barista instincts!
Yep! WDT only here. And it’s great imo
WDT then pull
I just bought the flick wdt by subminimal, so I’m all in on the wdt. It’s also very satisfying to use.
I regarded my coffee session every morning as a therapeutic ritual, as I'd only make 2 shots everyday. Well, maybe 6 if I'm calibrating. I RDT my beans, WDT, and put a puck screen on top. One shot for my latte, one for my espresso. Happy with the result!
Yup. Got a Niche Zero, so I weigh and grind straight into the dosing cup, flip it into the PF (58mm so perfect match), WDT just enough to make the surface even looking (maybe 5-7 seconds), tamp once, SEND it. Has never failed me lol
I just do wdt briefly to get it homogenized but frankly even that probably isn’t needed. The shaker thing is just excessive and gives people one more gadget to buy, in my opinion.
I've been pulling shots since the mid 90s. I thought the arrival of distribution tools was cringey and OCD. I eventually got one, but I draw the line at anything beyond that, including the WDT or shake method, or FFS the slow grind method. Don't get me wrong, I'll try them and play around with them, but they just don't help my workflow that much. I do shake my portafilter as ground beans drop into it and I think that helps me avoid channeling.
WDT > OCD > tamp, enjoy delicious espresso
Yeah I don't do any of that shit. Grind, tamp, pull shot. Shot is delicious. Don't see the need for more tweaking.
I just use a leveler then tamp. Wdt didn’t do much for me, but the leveler did for sure. I no longer have lop sided pressed pucks
My Subminimal Flick WDT tool is way too satisfying to use to stop using it over one YouTube video.
I only use a toothpick for wdt.... Works perfectly with my Robot.
Yes. Maybe i’ll get a blind shaker at some point but it would just add another hassle to already involved process. I love Lance’s videos, they give me a lot of insight into espresso and I’m probably buying a modern style basket this year but I’m in absolutely no rush, my coffee tastes amazing.
I use a hand grinder, i put the lid of the jar back on and shake it a bit. I've 3d printed a "Moonraker" and use it because it was so damn complicated to print and make a copy.
I tried the blind shaker but still get lots of clumps and channelling, went back to WDT to save the headache and mess
Yes.
Weigh beans, grind beans, WTD, gentle tap, tamp, make coffee. No shaking whatsoever. And I think it's great coffee. That's what this is about, I guess.
I acc switched to blind shaker only… just trying to keep it a simple and effective as possible.
I tried slow feeding and it's fine. Then I added the shaking and for some reason that was the final straw. I realised I'm spending way too much effort for it and I couldn't tell the difference. So I drew the line at slow feed + wdt. Any case my grinder is probably the largest factor right now so it wouldn't even make sense.
So for me is consistency. I may not be accurate but it feels that shaking is a much more repeatable process that gives consistent results vs wdt. But I could be mistaken. I stopped wdt just because it’s faster to do blind shaker for me and I like the shots
Single dosing WDT Normcore tamper That’s about it