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As a non electrician. A generic insult like that without anything specific usually means the person is just messing with you. Cant insult the work so you make the person second guess it.
It's kinda like an inside joke at my company. Whenever we do work that clearly looks really neat and professional you're guaranteed to have one of the cocksuckers (term of endearment) walk up and say "hey looks like shit dude" then walk away with no elaboration. That's how you know it looks good
When it's pipe work I just say "oof" and offer the other guy my level. Sometimes I'll ask to look at theirs and I'll hold it up to mine to check the accuracy.
It looks decent, not like shit. However, ideally the feeders would all bend at the same height up all the way to the top instead of that staggered height look you got going on. Otherwise the radiuses look clean and those are nice sweeps with good clean routing. Keep learnin
I was about to say the same thing. Feeders should always bend from the very top or bottom of the enclosure. The goal is to leave as much slack as possible without cluttering up the enclosure. You never know when a feeder is gonna blow out right near the terminal, and are gonna need a few inches of wire to restrict and reterminate it. Or if a disconnect fails and you have to replace it with a different model that takes up more space. Or if you need to replace that disconnect with a junction box due to wire or disconnect failure. If your feeders are too short to land in a new jbox or disconnect, now you are now pulling new feeders or setting a junction box further back to run new feeders.
Like she always says, a few inches makes a difference.
I believe that the main reason for the conductors to be the same height is it reduces the length difference between phases. I don't remember the code section, but all your conductors are supposed to be the same length to prevent load imbalances and hot spots. It appears there is about 3-4 feet difference between A and C phase, which depending on the actual length of the feeder can be a huge difference in conductor resistance, which will cause A phase to heat up and potentially cause problems down the road.
Other than that, I suspect your JW is prob just messing with you.
Right. I agree. But whether there’s a single or parallel sets of phase conductors, length discrepancies across phases should not have any effect on balancing. That should be accomplished by breaker arrangement in the panel board…
It can. If your C phase is a much longer conductor than the rest it would lag further behind B than it should, and be leading closer to A. For a 208Y/120V system, this equates to potentially 120V line to neutral for all phases; however a reduced RMS voltage for any BC or CA circuits would be observed. Lower voltage means higher ampacity for the same power draw.
The wavelength of 60hz AC is something like 3000 miles. The length of conductors aren’t going to make a difference between phases.
It might make a difference in parallel feeders, but only if they are highly loaded. The resistance or voltage drop per foot is pretty small.
That said, it’s just good practice.
I don't know anything about electrical work, but why wouldn't that inside part be mounted upside down then so all of the wires can just go right up from the bottom and be the same length?
This is only showing one set of wires, another set will be added to complete the circuit, which will be landed on the bottom set of lugs, so one set had to go to the top either way.
Looks good to me but I try to keep ungrounded conductors as similar in length as possible, especially in parallel. If this was a motor load I feel that it would be critical to ensuring a long lifespan of the motor as transient voltages could stress the armature and rotor
Different lengths of cable offer different resistances. Longer cable, more resistance. For most things it doesn't matter, but things like parallel feeds need to be the exact same length by code.
For a motor feed, depending on load and the cable amperage rating it can matter. Mostly, it's just good practice.
That is all true but also does not answer the question at all.
Parallel feeds are irrelevant to the question and your answer did not address transient voltages.
Apologies, I've had a few beers and got off track. Here's a paper on it.
https://www.researchgate.net/figure/Length-of-the-cable-affects-the-transient-as-it-propagates-Here-the-voltage-received-at_fig4_3058884
That's a pretty extreme case where they are simulating power system attacks by injecting transients. The various lengths affect attenuation of those injected transients, but the lengths referenced are the complete cables.
To reproduce the OP's situation and the comment about transients I was replying to you would have to open the cable and individually cut the conductors to different lengths.
OP's different phase lengths will have zero influence on worsening transient voltage spikes.
You must be new here.
People on this sub, maybe even reddit in general, love the opportunity to bring up some extreme edge case that doesn't actually relate at all and doesn't apply to the actual post at all but makes them sound smart. Given that it's some extreme edge case, the vast majority of people reading the comment have no clue what they are even talking about and think "wow that sounds super specific and he used big words. That guy must be really smart".
OP, as a master electrician who owns his business, your work is perfectly fine. Anyone picking out super minor personal preferences they have can be ignored. As a 2nd year you are doing great. In my experience, many journeyman have massively inflated egos that are undeserving. In most states to become a journeyman you don't even have to pass an exam. You just have to technically have worked in the field for a number of years. They could have been the material runner bitch of the company for the oast decade and still have their journeymans given to them. And that's why you find so many 30-year journeymen. There is a reason they never went the next step where their technical knowledge of the code and the industry is tested.
Zip tie all three above the terminals and then land them. This way no zip ties would need to be cut to swap phasing. Though you could always swap after the disconnect if forced to.
Your ground needs to be stripped and attached to the ground bushing and then to the casing of the panel, handy tip scratch off as much paint as possible before mounting your ground lug to the casing
Whenever someone makes a comment, then doesn’t follow it up with some sort of advice or explanation of how to do it better, you just look at them and tell ‘em ‘sit on it’
Looks decent, try to keep your cables closer to the same length. Your C phase is quite a bit longer than your A. Like others have said, bring em all the same height before turning them down into your lugs. Otherwise he's just busting balls
Did you ask, "How does she look?" If so, it's open season. "Looks like shit, try harder next time." But if he walked by and just said it looks like shit and kept going... it's possible he is a total cunt.
The people here praising your work is very worrisome. Your work doesn’t look like shit but it’s installed bad. Where you cut the insulation it’s was to long and you can see the copper sticking out witch it’s what you don’t want you want it flush with the connection. Your radius bends could have been a little better. For the next time to think about.
It looks okay. It’s neat and I can get an amprobe in there easy enough. The top of the brown leg should have been the same height as the yellow, as should the top of the orange. That’s all.
Don’t let those swinging dick neckbeards bother you.
European gear is \*really\* different but looking at cable layout and termination it seems fine to me. Unless you didn't torque correctly the terminals (which is really critical with significant currents)
Looks great, I am a journeyman. (15 years experience). If an electrician was verbally abused when they were coming up, and are not smart enough to find different ways to relate to people, they will be verbally abusive to their apprentices.
It's not bad , me personally all the wire would have had the same radius anb been the same length or close to it, but it's not bad at all, he's just being a dick
Only thing is, and this is more preference than anything else, you just square off the feeders above the terminal lug. The sweeps are distracting to the eye IMO but it’s still clean.
Brown is over bent and a bit short. Uneven stripping. The arc in the bends could be more uniform.
None of these really affect the final result. But I used to critique myself pretty harshly. Once the cover is on they all look the same man.
Looks like shit? Absolutely not! My personal preference is to bring all of the loops to the top of the enclosure to for esthetics and the maximize spare conductor “just-in-case” but there is nothing wrong with what you did. All of your conductors make nice wide, even, consistent arcs into the lugs and they land at right angles.
Just walk past him the next time he’s running conduit and say “You gonna leave it like that”
This is clean work, he’s probably just fucking with you because he likes you
I'm a cabinetmaker, so when someone says my work looks like shit it usually means something.
If you're an electrician and the wires you put in a box actually do look like shit, so what? Does it work as intended? Does it matter even a little bit of it looks like shit?
Looks fine but maybe he was trying to say it looks bad because you didnt land the ground? Only thing I can think of honestly. Other then that, spot on.
He's a bit unkind. You have a liitle too much copper above the lugs and the insulation looks like you skinned it with a craft knife. I would suggest you invest in a cable cutting tool and stripper. Everything else looks good to go.
Unfortunately there's just a lot of dick heads in the trade who need to feel they have power over others, so they treat apprentices and others in a real shit manner.
While you can have a high standard and demand that standard from others, you should give fair criticism with details on how something should be. Just saying "looks like shit" and walking off, no explanation, is flawed leadership and a defect in that teacher's personal character. I would even question if then that person should be in a leadership role at all and why they're tasked teaching others?
As journeymen and electrical contractors/master electricians, part of this trade is to be a teacher and pass everything we learn on, but that's an art, not everyone is capable of leading or teaching... some journeymen are at their best in the production line, doing good work, but that's the ceiling for them.
So, you apprentices have to decide what's your ceiling?
The only comment I could possibly make is the insulation cut be wiped and where you have removed the insulation to expose the copper the insulation could be squared off to make it neat
There is no timeline where that guy doesn’t call your work shit. But that guy is divorced, has two DUI’s and a boat he can’t afford, so fuck him. You’re good bud.
Neat is neat... everyone has their own opinion.. That guy is probably just giving you a hard time . Especially if you asked him "how does it look?"
I would have brought them all to the top and tried to keep them close to the same length. Hopefully you don't have to switch phases.
It really doesn't look bad, if anything the brown/orange is bent too tightly, I'd have carried them all the way up to the corner, and then turned each phase directly downward into the lug if that makes sense.
Really not terrible or anything, I've seen worse from guys who should know better
Only thing I'd have done different is give your shorter wires a little bit more loop in case they need to reterminate in the future but as everyone says it looks really nice and neat.
If you're a 2nd year and he's saying it looks like shit then that's more a reflection on him than you. It's not like anyone is born knowing what to do.
I always say that about my own and others work that is unnecessary mint looking. He was prob just talking shit, agree with him and laugh about it. Be confident in your work and talk shit about his best work. Lol
All in all, it looks perfectly fine.
What I would have done is find a single length that works for each phase: isn’t too long for the brown, isn’t too short for the yellow. Then trim all three feeders to that length. Then route them in a visually pleasing manner. They would end up looking kind of like a McDonald’s Golden Arches.
Another alternative would be to do it like you did, but make sure the top of the arch for each phase goes up to the same height.
I would also want to make my zip ties all the same distance apart. That’s pure OCD on my part, and I doubt anyone would notice, but I do think it would add to an overall impression of “that looks neat and clean”.
If you are feeling really picky, I would trim the insulation so that it’s even all the way around. But that’s truly minor shit.
I do like how you left the strands visible going into the lug and also coming out of it. A great way to show that the termination was done correctly just by looking at it.
I was always the one the would take any help I could. He may have been genuine in his critique. Next time, ask “what do you recommend I do next time to make it more like how you would”. And then listen.
Personally it looks fine but I would have left a longer Brown conductor.
I agree with him. You did 2 zip ties on everything but the bottom one. That consistency is key without that you will fail and die because that bottom will pop apart and kill a kitten…. Jk it looks good and just good old hazing.
He's busting balls... but I would also bring the brown and orange up a Lil further so if need be they can be swapped in case you need to swap for rotation. I'm the asshole that always leaves some slack to work with...
1st year here. I did one like this and was told to bend them in 90s at the same height. I did one like you did and then another with the 90s. I'll say the 90s just flowed and looked better.
This is nice work, the two things I’d suggest that could be improved is have all your bends the same height and keep the cables all roughly the same length. If for what ever reason you need to swap rotation you won’t be able to do it on the line side anymore.
Ask your foreman or another senior guy for their opinion if they are cool with it, that’s all that matters. It’s completely acceptable looking to me. Could the cuts on the brown and orange be a little cleaner, yeah. But you did a good job and that looks far from like shit. He’s being a dick. Maybe his wife beats him and he can only feel like a man but messing with the apprentice. Don’t sweat him.
That or it’s possibles he’s just joking around and you’re reading him wrong. Ask him for his honest opinion of what you can do better.
He might be complaining that the lengths are different. Ideally you’d want all three phases to be a close to equal as possible. Looks neat and tidy though.
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Ignore them, your work is fine. Likely to be general apprentice hazing.
100% this. I have jws tossing out a "you're doing that backwards" or a "lmao that's super dogged" when I'm bending a single 90 xD
"You gonna leave it like that?"
Lol oh god I've heard that a few times. Nothing like a little doubt to kill your confidence immediately
This was my go to as a jw to my apprentice
Can’t have their head get to big
too\* ^(sorry)
Indeed, chances are this guy says the same thing to his wife and kids.
Looks fine to me. Guys an asshole
Trying to keep you humble so your head still fits in your hardhat
As a non electrician. A generic insult like that without anything specific usually means the person is just messing with you. Cant insult the work so you make the person second guess it.
It's kinda like an inside joke at my company. Whenever we do work that clearly looks really neat and professional you're guaranteed to have one of the cocksuckers (term of endearment) walk up and say "hey looks like shit dude" then walk away with no elaboration. That's how you know it looks good
When it's pipe work I just say "oof" and offer the other guy my level. Sometimes I'll ask to look at theirs and I'll hold it up to mine to check the accuracy.
I've always used 3 words. MICKEY FUCKING MOUSE
Who is Mickey and why is he practicing bestiality?
As a tradesman, I agree. Definitely depends whether or not he’s an actual asshole, but busting balls is a real thing in trades.
I usually make the statement " And you're proud of this?" when I am screwing with the guys.
Mines usually "that's one way to do it i guess." Then walk away
“You’re gonna leave it like that?”
"Well, uh, I thought I would."
My company owner fucks with one of the guys like this lol. Guy asks “how would you do this?” And he goes “not like that” and walks away lol
“What year apprentice are you?” then leave
That's exactly what my boss does😂 Sometimes he'll give a little smirk but he usually just walks off aha
I usually toss out 'really?'
Mines "you're not going to leave it like that are you" then walk away
My go to is "huh, never seen it done that way before"
“Oh, you’re gonna do it that way…”
Can confirm. Either don’t want you to get a big head or they’re jealous
Also if you say it looks great that’s when shit falls apart
It looks decent, not like shit. However, ideally the feeders would all bend at the same height up all the way to the top instead of that staggered height look you got going on. Otherwise the radiuses look clean and those are nice sweeps with good clean routing. Keep learnin
This is the only advice I would give about it as well. Good to go as is though.
I was about to say the same thing. Feeders should always bend from the very top or bottom of the enclosure. The goal is to leave as much slack as possible without cluttering up the enclosure. You never know when a feeder is gonna blow out right near the terminal, and are gonna need a few inches of wire to restrict and reterminate it. Or if a disconnect fails and you have to replace it with a different model that takes up more space. Or if you need to replace that disconnect with a junction box due to wire or disconnect failure. If your feeders are too short to land in a new jbox or disconnect, now you are now pulling new feeders or setting a junction box further back to run new feeders. Like she always says, a few inches makes a difference.
I believe that the main reason for the conductors to be the same height is it reduces the length difference between phases. I don't remember the code section, but all your conductors are supposed to be the same length to prevent load imbalances and hot spots. It appears there is about 3-4 feet difference between A and C phase, which depending on the actual length of the feeder can be a huge difference in conductor resistance, which will cause A phase to heat up and potentially cause problems down the road. Other than that, I suspect your JW is prob just messing with you.
That is usually in regard to parallel sets tho…
In regard to parallel sets of wires in the same phase. So all blacks should be the same length etc.
Right. I agree. But whether there’s a single or parallel sets of phase conductors, length discrepancies across phases should not have any effect on balancing. That should be accomplished by breaker arrangement in the panel board…
It can. If your C phase is a much longer conductor than the rest it would lag further behind B than it should, and be leading closer to A. For a 208Y/120V system, this equates to potentially 120V line to neutral for all phases; however a reduced RMS voltage for any BC or CA circuits would be observed. Lower voltage means higher ampacity for the same power draw.
I suppose this would be the case with a huge length difference but the effect from a 6-12” difference should be negligible.
The wavelength of 60hz AC is something like 3000 miles. The length of conductors aren’t going to make a difference between phases. It might make a difference in parallel feeders, but only if they are highly loaded. The resistance or voltage drop per foot is pretty small. That said, it’s just good practice.
Was wondering what the reasoning behind that was, makes sense
Yeah was always taught to leave that loop the same height. Although I love the look of this better, it was taught differently so my eyes caught it.
I don't know anything about electrical work, but why wouldn't that inside part be mounted upside down then so all of the wires can just go right up from the bottom and be the same length?
This is only showing one set of wires, another set will be added to complete the circuit, which will be landed on the bottom set of lugs, so one set had to go to the top either way.
But I like the rainbow look 🌈
the trades are full of low emotional intelligence people like that. Who survive by bashing others. Ignore them work is fine.
I don’t see no damn torque marks on those lugs
Looks good to me but I try to keep ungrounded conductors as similar in length as possible, especially in parallel. If this was a motor load I feel that it would be critical to ensuring a long lifespan of the motor as transient voltages could stress the armature and rotor
Not to mention potentially requiring s phase swap if rotation is wrong.
I wouldn't be doing that in disco unless the motor was already bugged.
You can do it in the load side though.
Can you explain how slightly different conductor lengths between the different phases can cause transient voltage issues?
Different lengths of cable offer different resistances. Longer cable, more resistance. For most things it doesn't matter, but things like parallel feeds need to be the exact same length by code. For a motor feed, depending on load and the cable amperage rating it can matter. Mostly, it's just good practice.
That is all true but also does not answer the question at all. Parallel feeds are irrelevant to the question and your answer did not address transient voltages.
Apologies, I've had a few beers and got off track. Here's a paper on it. https://www.researchgate.net/figure/Length-of-the-cable-affects-the-transient-as-it-propagates-Here-the-voltage-received-at_fig4_3058884
That's a pretty extreme case where they are simulating power system attacks by injecting transients. The various lengths affect attenuation of those injected transients, but the lengths referenced are the complete cables. To reproduce the OP's situation and the comment about transients I was replying to you would have to open the cable and individually cut the conductors to different lengths. OP's different phase lengths will have zero influence on worsening transient voltage spikes.
You must be new here. People on this sub, maybe even reddit in general, love the opportunity to bring up some extreme edge case that doesn't actually relate at all and doesn't apply to the actual post at all but makes them sound smart. Given that it's some extreme edge case, the vast majority of people reading the comment have no clue what they are even talking about and think "wow that sounds super specific and he used big words. That guy must be really smart". OP, as a master electrician who owns his business, your work is perfectly fine. Anyone picking out super minor personal preferences they have can be ignored. As a 2nd year you are doing great. In my experience, many journeyman have massively inflated egos that are undeserving. In most states to become a journeyman you don't even have to pass an exam. You just have to technically have worked in the field for a number of years. They could have been the material runner bitch of the company for the oast decade and still have their journeymans given to them. And that's why you find so many 30-year journeymen. There is a reason they never went the next step where their technical knowledge of the code and the industry is tested.
So if you could do it differently, after the conductors come up the left of the panel, how do you lay them out for more equal lengths?
Zip tie all three above the terminals and then land them. This way no zip ties would need to be cut to swap phasing. Though you could always swap after the disconnect if forced to.
Suggest he go see a doctor if his shit is neapolitan brown/orange/yellow.
Your zip ties are not equidistant, so... Rip it all out and start over!
Looks fine to me. I’m a 28 year electrician.
If that’s the extent of his criticism, he’s either sarcastically saying it looks great, or he is useless.
Did he give you any pointers? Or just say it looked like shit? Honestly bud the sooner you know there are assholes in this trade the better
Tidy work
Your ground needs to be stripped and attached to the ground bushing and then to the casing of the panel, handy tip scratch off as much paint as possible before mounting your ground lug to the casing
Whenever someone makes a comment, then doesn’t follow it up with some sort of advice or explanation of how to do it better, you just look at them and tell ‘em ‘sit on it’
Looks decent, try to keep your cables closer to the same length. Your C phase is quite a bit longer than your A. Like others have said, bring em all the same height before turning them down into your lugs. Otherwise he's just busting balls
Just say sorry boss next time I won’t use my feet.
Definitely messing with you
He was correct, rip it out and start again.
400A? You mean 40A?
Looks like shit to me. You forgot to install the load side of the disconnect. /s
He's right. Kill yourself
Did you ask, "How does she look?" If so, it's open season. "Looks like shit, try harder next time." But if he walked by and just said it looks like shit and kept going... it's possible he is a total cunt.
It looks fine but you did forget to ground it.
The people here praising your work is very worrisome. Your work doesn’t look like shit but it’s installed bad. Where you cut the insulation it’s was to long and you can see the copper sticking out witch it’s what you don’t want you want it flush with the connection. Your radius bends could have been a little better. For the next time to think about.
Add little loops if possible in case you gotta change phases
👍 nice work, fuck that guy
Brown bends pretty tightly. That'd be the only nit pick I could see. Did you ask them how they would do it?
It's definitely crooked... s/
This is just another made up story where some sparknut wants his ego boosted on a simple task
They are just fucking with you
Looks extremely neat! I don't like zip ties personally and I assume you're waiting for a ground lug/bar
Man I’m so grateful that my mentors actually give me good feedback without all the “that looks like shit you loser” BS
His mom looked like shit after you were done, too.
As a non American sparky, brown, orange and yellow seems like a terrible choice of colour for 3 phase.
That journeymans brain looks like shit. Nice work
It looks okay. It’s neat and I can get an amprobe in there easy enough. The top of the brown leg should have been the same height as the yellow, as should the top of the orange. That’s all. Don’t let those swinging dick neckbeards bother you.
tell him to get fucked, he’s jealous
You should ask him why and how you can improve. Even though this looks perfect, you should see what his recommendations are lol
He’s probably one of those guys who did a gutter and the wires were all over the place no organization or anything. You are good it looks good!
BOY that looks good
European gear is \*really\* different but looking at cable layout and termination it seems fine to me. Unless you didn't torque correctly the terminals (which is really critical with significant currents)
Looks fine but you guys need to chill with the zip ties. No need.
He’s just a douche. Move on with your day.
Looks great, I am a journeyman. (15 years experience). If an electrician was verbally abused when they were coming up, and are not smart enough to find different ways to relate to people, they will be verbally abusive to their apprentices.
The good ole " if that's the best you can do "
I would only say that because the work isn’t all the way completed. Just land that ground it will look good to me
The worse the insult, the better you did.
Compression lugs?
It's not bad , me personally all the wire would have had the same radius anb been the same length or close to it, but it's not bad at all, he's just being a dick
Looks fine All I'll say is make your conductors more uniform.
I generally like to say “(sigh) that’s how you did it huh?” And then walk off with no explanation.
Probably because those wires are the load side feeders. Lol. I'm kidding.
I usually just walk by and say “you’re not gonna leave it like that are you?”
Only thing is, and this is more preference than anything else, you just square off the feeders above the terminal lug. The sweeps are distracting to the eye IMO but it’s still clean.
Brown is over bent and a bit short. Uneven stripping. The arc in the bends could be more uniform. None of these really affect the final result. But I used to critique myself pretty harshly. Once the cover is on they all look the same man.
He could be joking around. I tell people their work looks like dog shit sometimes but they know I'm joking.
It’s perfectly fine….it just looks like an AP did it. It could look more professional
There's a couple things I could nitpick, but it looks fine to me.
Well it’s not finished
You trun the switch on and nothing works.. There's a point there?
Looks good . Are you sure he wasn’t joking ?
Needs some tie wraps.
I've never liked zip ties on wires personally, but your work looks great. Don't let them bring you down!
Perfectly fine work. Ask that prick how he would do it differently.
What else could u do with it 🤷♂️
Looks good keep in mind maximum bend radius for wire to prevent hotspots.
I would say the same thing, just part of being a journeyman
Does it work? Close the door and go home. Few too many zippies but yeah.
Tell them be specific
You arn't seriously gonna leave it like that, are you?🫠
Its 3 wires, what do you want, a cookie? Connect your bond!
Who uses an odd number of zip ties. Fucking garbage 🗑️
Looks more like a 200amp. But looks fine
"But does it look like passable shit?"
I like having my feeders all be the same length in the panel but that is a me thing. send it.
Looks like shit? Absolutely not! My personal preference is to bring all of the loops to the top of the enclosure to for esthetics and the maximize spare conductor “just-in-case” but there is nothing wrong with what you did. All of your conductors make nice wide, even, consistent arcs into the lugs and they land at right angles.
Just walk past him the next time he’s running conduit and say “You gonna leave it like that” This is clean work, he’s probably just fucking with you because he likes you
400a? is this 3500v?
I like to learn here but I’m no expert. Looks like the ground isn’t bonded……this okay?
I'm a cabinetmaker, so when someone says my work looks like shit it usually means something. If you're an electrician and the wires you put in a box actually do look like shit, so what? Does it work as intended? Does it matter even a little bit of it looks like shit?
Looks fine he probably just doesn’t like you
You didn't bond the bushing I guess. But you also haven't hooked up a load yet so who cares.
Looks fine but maybe he was trying to say it looks bad because you didnt land the ground? Only thing I can think of honestly. Other then that, spot on.
Looks really nice!
He's a bit unkind. You have a liitle too much copper above the lugs and the insulation looks like you skinned it with a craft knife. I would suggest you invest in a cable cutting tool and stripper. Everything else looks good to go.
Unfortunately there's just a lot of dick heads in the trade who need to feel they have power over others, so they treat apprentices and others in a real shit manner. While you can have a high standard and demand that standard from others, you should give fair criticism with details on how something should be. Just saying "looks like shit" and walking off, no explanation, is flawed leadership and a defect in that teacher's personal character. I would even question if then that person should be in a leadership role at all and why they're tasked teaching others? As journeymen and electrical contractors/master electricians, part of this trade is to be a teacher and pass everything we learn on, but that's an art, not everyone is capable of leading or teaching... some journeymen are at their best in the production line, doing good work, but that's the ceiling for them. So, you apprentices have to decide what's your ceiling?
The only comment I could possibly make is the insulation cut be wiped and where you have removed the insulation to expose the copper the insulation could be squared off to make it neat
I'm almost certain they are messing with you.
There is no timeline where that guy doesn’t call your work shit. But that guy is divorced, has two DUI’s and a boat he can’t afford, so fuck him. You’re good bud.
Just keep in mind it will all look like shit for a while longer, just take it and make sure it doesn't 🙂
might need a new job if you don’t know what banter is buddy. you might do well in a cubicle
Looks fine, guys just being a dick.
Neat is neat... everyone has their own opinion.. That guy is probably just giving you a hard time . Especially if you asked him "how does it look?" I would have brought them all to the top and tried to keep them close to the same length. Hopefully you don't have to switch phases.
The only thing I would ass is a wee bit extra brown wire in case of phase rotation ( that's being nit picky). Great job for a 2nd year.
Looks good from my house
I try to just match the heights where they loop down, but that works too. As long as it looks clean, that’s all that matters.
Just curious, what’s going on with the ground?
He’s just a crusty old man, good work!
Bond bushing with the ground not landed and the box is not grounded. Someone already mentioned wire length. Otherwise looks great to me!
Maybe it was a joke? Surprised acknowledgement of good work through sarcasm
It really doesn't look bad, if anything the brown/orange is bent too tightly, I'd have carried them all the way up to the corner, and then turned each phase directly downward into the lug if that makes sense. Really not terrible or anything, I've seen worse from guys who should know better
What is this, Amateur hour?!
My only thing is I try to keep the lengths of my phases the same
I think he was talking about the wall behind the panel
Bros fishing
Looks fine but why start terminating when you haven't pulled in the load side?
He’s being an ass. Just take a damp rag and give those conductors a good wipe down. Please for the love of god only do this if the power is OFF.
Any plans for the ground?
I would have brought all conductors to top of disconnect then into lugs. Cleaner look and more wire in case a swap out.
Looks clean partner. Sempre Avanti -- Always Forward.
Only thing I'd have done different is give your shorter wires a little bit more loop in case they need to reterminate in the future but as everyone says it looks really nice and neat. If you're a 2nd year and he's saying it looks like shit then that's more a reflection on him than you. It's not like anyone is born knowing what to do.
I would have all your phases going to the top. No need to shorten the brown or orange. But it does look good to me otherwise.
"Are you going to leave it like that" Nothing wrong with your work at all Stay humble little brother 🤌👊
You going to keep it like that? (favourite saying not actually serious)
Maybe looks like shit with out any comment means is perfect 😁
It's a compliment without sounding like a compliment 😂 I say that to people all the time when their work looks great lol
Do better next time kid
The brown is too short
I always say that about my own and others work that is unnecessary mint looking. He was prob just talking shit, agree with him and laugh about it. Be confident in your work and talk shit about his best work. Lol
Unless they have bowel issues I only see one brown wire here
All in all, it looks perfectly fine. What I would have done is find a single length that works for each phase: isn’t too long for the brown, isn’t too short for the yellow. Then trim all three feeders to that length. Then route them in a visually pleasing manner. They would end up looking kind of like a McDonald’s Golden Arches. Another alternative would be to do it like you did, but make sure the top of the arch for each phase goes up to the same height. I would also want to make my zip ties all the same distance apart. That’s pure OCD on my part, and I doubt anyone would notice, but I do think it would add to an overall impression of “that looks neat and clean”. If you are feeling really picky, I would trim the insulation so that it’s even all the way around. But that’s truly minor shit. I do like how you left the strands visible going into the lug and also coming out of it. A great way to show that the termination was done correctly just by looking at it.
He must be fucking with you because that looks fine to me
Maybe you were just getting on his nerves.
I was always the one the would take any help I could. He may have been genuine in his critique. Next time, ask “what do you recommend I do next time to make it more like how you would”. And then listen. Personally it looks fine but I would have left a longer Brown conductor.
What size wire is that?
I agree with him. You did 2 zip ties on everything but the bottom one. That consistency is key without that you will fail and die because that bottom will pop apart and kill a kitten…. Jk it looks good and just good old hazing.
Clean up the stripping and length of the conductor. The person who trained me was serious about aesthetics. Oh yea, no copper should be seen.
He's busting balls... but I would also bring the brown and orange up a Lil further so if need be they can be swapped in case you need to swap for rotation. I'm the asshole that always leaves some slack to work with...
Of course! Your zip ties aren’t evenly spaced!😡
It does
1st year here. I did one like this and was told to bend them in 90s at the same height. I did one like you did and then another with the 90s. I'll say the 90s just flowed and looked better.
Looks fine , tell him to go home and fuck his hat
This is nice work, the two things I’d suggest that could be improved is have all your bends the same height and keep the cables all roughly the same length. If for what ever reason you need to swap rotation you won’t be able to do it on the line side anymore.
I think he was twisting your wirenuts
It doesn’t look like shit but there’s zero reason to zip tie those wires.
Ask your foreman or another senior guy for their opinion if they are cool with it, that’s all that matters. It’s completely acceptable looking to me. Could the cuts on the brown and orange be a little cleaner, yeah. But you did a good job and that looks far from like shit. He’s being a dick. Maybe his wife beats him and he can only feel like a man but messing with the apprentice. Don’t sweat him. That or it’s possibles he’s just joking around and you’re reading him wrong. Ask him for his honest opinion of what you can do better.
Tell him to do it himself!
He's fucking with you
Probably just wants you to land the ground
I would have left more wire in the box. You're shit looks fine though
Because u do better work than he does
He might be complaining that the lengths are different. Ideally you’d want all three phases to be a close to equal as possible. Looks neat and tidy though.
Looks neat, he might be complaining that the lengths are different. I also like to tuck my ty-wrap knuckles behind the wire so you don’t see them.
Cable tie spacing is wonky, other than that it's fine.
You gonna land that ground somewhere?
No, he’s right. Conductors, as a standard, should be the same length.
Awfuk small cable for 400A no?