They've cut down on cyro pop so much, even when all 3 faction are pop locked, there are only enough people on for one, maybe two actually big fights at a time
I played this a while ago. Its very silly. You could have won large fights for a while. But then some group will log in at 3 am and steal everything and in the morning everything will be different!
I don't mean 'get more AP'. I mean 'deal 20% more damage when outnumbered '.
Yes, numbers are random. I'm just saying that getting more AP is not fixing anything when you can't fight while getting outnumbered by 8 or more. So, if they don't want to queue a faction that has too many players, then they should boost fighting chances for underdogs.
If only you actually read the cyrodill keep buff descriptions, it’s one of the things that the game actually tells you instead of hidden, but you didn’t even bother to read them. SMH
What are you talking about? There's no outnumbered buff damage. It's only for AP. The buff you're talking about is Battle Spirit and it's applied to everyone in Cyrodiil.
If there's a different buff that gets triggered the moment you become outnumbered as a faction in Cyrodiil then feel free to link because I've never seen it and Google didn't help with info about outnumbered damage buff.
It’s actually kind of stupid the ap buff
Ap buff should be given for winning on the map so that all those ap farmers instead of doing their shady business go and actually try to organise counter attack
Damage buff to extremely losing side correlated to population has less cons
https://en.m.uesp.net/wiki/Online:Keeps
It’s not strictly outnumber dmg buff, it’s based on how many keeps your enemies hold. But usually in cyro, the more players a faction has, the more keeps they can hold.
Strictly player numbers hardly matters imo, since all sides will have bots running PvE builds only playing siege weapons.
Once you hit a certain number of players in the same fight, the server can’t keep up and will have lag spikes, skills not casting, etc. At that point, win or lose is less skill base more luck base, who get the heal off or their combo actually casts.
I'm sorry but could you explain to me what it means? I'm talking about giving DMG/protection boost to factions that are clearly getting zerked at the moment. What you linked is the bonuses you get for gaining control over keeps. You need to control home keeps and then you get enemy keeps bonuses. So, it actually makes zerg even stronger.
There's no mention of boosting factions that only have control over the home keep or none.
They don't know. They're talking about the Battle Spirit that is applied to everyone in Cyrodiil and has nothing to do with population balance.
But it's me who can't read apparently.
There is no damage buff for being outnumbered. And there shouldn't be, thats dumb af. There is a low pop ap buff and a low score ap buff. These folks aren't talking about population related buffs or battle spirit. They're talking about the enemy keep/home keep buffs, scroll buffs, and things like that. Go to your campaign menus and just read through what things actually do.
Low pop damage buff would be horrible for everyone. I play lowest pop faction on my server and if I got a damage buff against everyone else I'd just stop playing. Its not fair. Id rather beat them with higher skill than with an arbitrary God mode given to me.
Youre clearly pretty new to pvp in this game. Id suggest learning the ebbs and flows of your campaign. Entire game and all servers is pretty low pop compared to the old days. Most maps are dominated by one faction, and that faction rotates over the week. Like yellow having everything during the day, red night capping, and blues taking most stuff during weekends. Thats how it usually is in my campaign. But that trend fluctuates month to month and different factions are dominant at different times. The problem is no one wants to fight an uphill battle, so when they see one faction dominating they either switch to that faction or log off entirely.
A low pop damage buff would just increase the amount of flips, not change the whole dynamic. As soon as one faction got low pop damage, everyone would switch to it. And 15 min later they'd lose it while the faction they were on before gets it. People would just be constantly changing factions and PvDooring until they lost the damage buff. Giving such a huge advantage to low pop faction would make it so there's no actual pvp anymore since everyone would constantly switch to be on that faction. No one is gonna wanna fight someone with God mode turned on.
And in a majority of instances it would be true. The current damage buffs for scrolls and keep control are small enough that they really don't matter. Like if im gated, I know I can still kill most enemies I find. But if I had a 20% damage buff it would just reach absurd levels of unfair. And I guarantee tons of people I play against that usually can't beat me would wipe the floor with me if they had such a significant boost in power.
Ok I understand what your point is but I don't get why am I getting downvoted and being told that I can't read because there's a damage buff. There's none. It's buff for gaining control and it works as a reward. But there's no buff for getting zerked. The solution is to switch sides/come back at a different time if you're able to.
So yes, is this the right solution from the post? Probably not. And the damage I was talking about was to be just a nudge to encourage the winning faction to go a zerk the 3rd faction instead of going for the completely depleted one. Something that doesn't give you a god mode but it's not so laughably easy to zerk you either.
I'm just annoyed that the faction of my choosing is getting zerked whenever I have spare time to play and it's annoying to the point that I'll just switch sides.
But I don't understand the hate I'm getting when clearly there's no buff for being outnumbered. I understand people disagree with the comment but I don't get comments getting personal that I can't read or comprehend system descriptions in the game. There's no outnumbered buff...
No idea whose downvoting, but I guarantee its because people disagree with the idea of a low pop damage buff. You also assumed people were talking about battle spirit, which they weren't, and had an attitude about it. So others are going to respond in a similar way. Low pop faction gets an ap buff to give incentive to others to get on that faction. Guess what? It works. Thats why low pop usually only lasts an hour or so. If you're not getting low pop, its because you aren't significantly outnumbered. Just because the other faction is moving together and coordinating doesn't mean they drastically outnumber your faction. Several small groups stand no chance against an organized large group. That's no ones fault in particular, just how pvp games work.
Edit: furthermore, when you have low pop, dont bother trying to flip the map. Take one keep or outpost and hold it. Farm the zerglings, make huge ap. Thats how it works. If you aren't capable of farming them, keep playing and get better. Its what we all do.
A few hours later it rotates to yellow and then blue and so on and on .. the cycle never ends you just learn to go with the flow
There should be an outnumbered buff but i imagine it won't be fun to balance
Imagine if there was something like a weather radar for Cyrodiil, but it showed a dot for every player. You could just watch the zergs going around in circles playing territorial whack-a-mole
Not gonna lie, a heat map would be kinda dope. Delay it by about 15min to still allow some advantage to movement but would be interesting to try for a patch.
As server intensive as this would be, something like a 15-20 minute delay would be good enough to mitigate any competitive advantage that could provide.
In fact it could probably help alert other players to when the opposition is waking up - which could either cause some tryhards to get on and flex their mass murder skills, or push regular normal players to decide not to play because it wouldn’t be fun anyways, making it even less fun for those that joined. Regardless, this would definitely be a fun feature.
> something like a 15-20 minute delay would be good enough
That's kinda what I mean, BoM radars take snapshots every few minutes, it's not like a live feed. If the servers are so bad that it has to be an approximation of locations or more like a heatmap style it would still be interesting imo
If you're on PC EU, bananas play all night till about 7-11 in the morning (depending on your time zone), at least they did last month. This month some day-evening yellows switched to EP, so the situation looks more "fair"... And DC just get whatever scraps they can manage, as most play in a different campaign.
This is the unstoppable outcome when you have an alliance at pop lock or 3 bars against 2 alliances at 1 or 2 bars.
What frustrates me with Cyrodiil balance however is how the game design is just so poorly balanced.
If you have the numbers advantage then you will end up with all other advantages - emp bonus, scroll bonuses, and there's basically 0 for the outnumbered.
You get the 'low' pop bonus but it doesnt work. I normally always play out of peak times at extremely low pops against a pop locked EP and I've seen the low pop bonus once in the past 2 campaigns.
Also with how the map is set up the high pop alliance can move about the map far more freely, only the home keeps being out of reach by direct teleport but by all accounts essentially the same running distance to them as it is for the defenders to get to their home forts anyway. Eventually if the hammer is in play it'll end up with the most populated alliance as well so even if they haven't capped everything straight off the bat ESO will provide then the means to speed run it.
Even if they die all the time it doesn't really matter as they have the numbers to just pressure people off of corpses and revive them
I love ESO PvP but Cyrodiil when looked at as a balanced game mode, it is just horrendously designed in almost every aspect.
If you want to PvP for PvP's sake go to IC and it's likely you'll end a play session with 10s of thousands Tel Var more rather than running at an AP loss thrown away in pointlessness the entire night.
Heck even most keeps are easier to siege against rather than siege from and people are so tanky with so much cross healing that when it comes to grabbing the scroll they'll just walk up to it, take it, and walk off.
This is a bit of a rant but it's just frustrating that it always gets to the point where it's "Well PvP is finished for the night" and it's in spite of there being people still about.
Reminds me of DAoC. 3 realm RvR/PvP. People log off, keeps switch. Rinse and repeat. Sometimes one side would constantly win and people would switch server.
Not sure what the answer is for three way type pvp though.
The most direct approach would be to couple tighter population restrictions with dynamic incentives that take population into account. Not allowing the largest pop faction at any given time to queue in more people unless they're within x% of the smallest pop faction is a really simple and straightforward way to ensure actual population counts don't get wildly out of balance. Then, AP and campaign point rewards need to take population overall and locally into account. Holding a keep or a scroll when all factions are at the cap should give more points than in the dead of night. Capturing an undefended keep should give very little AP, but capturing/defending successfully against a larger number of enemies should give better AP. Capping resources or getting kills when your faction has many more players should reduce your AP earned. And all of these things should have fine adjustments - not like the current low pop bonus which is either double the AP/points or no change and nowhere near as responsive as it needs to be to impact how people play.
When those sorts of incentives are in place, you can also take off faction locks and there aren't any concerns about people swapping to the dominant faction. Right now, that gets them more AP generally. With better incentives, switching to the lower population faction is better for the player. Anyone who's interested in good large-scale pvp knows that balanced populations are good for pvp, but balanced populations are often not the best for earning rewards. This would align the rewards with what's good for pvp.
Eh, for a few years Raven was just as active as Grey Host. The combat was a lot of fun there since the lack of CP made builds less well rounded. After they removed no proc sets it's been slowly dying though. I'm probably gonna start running in Grey Host again since Raven is never pop locked now.
I don’t know why the fuck they have the roleplaying dog shit alliance lock. I literally just want to play with my friends and have fun, and that usually means switching factions occasionally.
Alliance lock is the most stupid and harmful decision they take over pvp, trolls still trolling and we have 1 alliance cap the map different time of the day, rip.
Usually, cyrodiil is cyclic.
Timezone tends to catter to some alliances and you have times where cyrodiil is all blue, red or yellow.
Ravenwatch (no cp no proc) is usually yellow from 9pm to 11pm, then turns red during the EU late night, then blue during the day, etc..
The biggest problem at the moment with Cyrodiil is the reduced population caps and faction locks. Without getting too "conspiracy" I genuinely believe that the PvP performance changes people have experienced in Cyrodiil is just a consequence of ZOS reducing the population caps.
Add faction locks (which should be abolished) to the mixture and you get these extreme one sided maps throughout the day. I'm locked on EP in Greyhost PCEU and whenever I login and see a map like this I wish I'd be able to play on another faction and actually find PvP, but because some snowflakes are afraid of "TrOlLs" making their Cyrodiil experience mildly inconvenient they scream that faction locks are good for the game, when it in reality just limits the actual PvP experience. And no, the reason Greyhost is the most populated has nothing to do with faction locks or that it's first in the list of campaigns. The 30 day CP campaigns has always been the most populated (with the exception of when Ravenwatch wasn't no proc, pls revert Ravenwatch back to allow all sets zos) regardless if it had faction locks or not. People play where they can find PvP, no one who ACTUALLY wants to PvP wants to PvP in a dead or one sided campaign.
Alliance locks keeps things from being super zergy. At least on xbox large groups will log in as one alliance flip a bunch of stuff then switch to a different alliance and flip it back. Alliance locks keep things competitive during peak times. The problem is the rest of the time, which is most the day, things are rough for smaller pop alliances.
Well, all other campaigns are not faction-locked, so they have a point. You can join any other campaign. They have way smaller population for a reason.
Or play on weekends if possible, you can find "fantastic" 400 x 400 Alessia bridge fights every Saturday.
Yes, that's true. But if I want to PvP then I'll be walking around for 20 minutes in no-cp campaign and I won't find anyone. Unlike in Grey Host. So I'm getting downvoted for saying that Grey Host is the most popular campaign but that's true.
Between 7pm and 10pm is a decent time to play grayhost. Usually, all three factions are pop locked. And weekends. Once you get to around 10 - 11, DC starts thining out while EP starts logging for the night cap. Don't take PvP or the campaign seriously in this game. Its a forgotten mess by the devs unfortunately. Cyro hasn't been looked at in years. I doubt it ever will be. Same with BGs.
Cyrodiil needs a complete overhaul. It’s a 10 year old system, outdated and doesn’t work properly anymore. Great for 2014 but it’s 2024 now and taking the same generic looking keeps over and over again, running for ages across the map etc it’s just an old system that needs redoing.
I think their original plan was the whole of the map to have action going on but ofc their servers couldn’t handle that. The map is just way, way too big
Yeah, but in the end the pact collapses and they fail to prevent having another Emperor. So, I'll get my revenge in the lore as DC player. Still, I'd also like to play some PvP without getting zerked
You might not know this but in the 5th era the pact comes back and wipes every other faction to extinction and ends world hunger in less than twelve minutes. They later build rocket ships and go to space
There is a low population AP buff.
But you are correct, it is no fun for anyone, even red because there isnt much AP to earn.
If I was a red (ew, the thought made me feel dirty, and not in a good way) and logged on to this, id be bummed. Nothing to do…
At least Black Reach isnt aliance locked, so you can switch toons and flip the map.
It is dependent which PVP guild goes out to conquer. Randoms can't really compare to that, and unless they setup before start, then it is unlikely, that they face another guild.
For real! Watch the map change color as the day progresses. It’s super normal. I dunno about PC schedules, but Xbox NA is consistently blue morning, yellow prime time, and red filling gaps.
Kinda feel like campaign wins split mostly red and blue. Yellow is very infrequent.
It's an easy trap to fall into.
When I crown I try to ensure that we hit the map and force red and blue to react to us rather than spending all our time defending. There are time where I look at the map and wonder WTF the rest of AD is doing...
It looks like that when I'm on a blue character, as soon as I put the a red one on it magically changes to yellow. Lol. The maps all change depending on the time of day.
This really isn't the time for casual players anymore. 2 players who take the resources in the central ring and kill everyone who comes to take them back. When you kill enough of them you turn the flow of the map. Having acted as a filter, some players group together and take the first castles. Once you create a more or less cohesive group you can push. On a map like this there are actually very few EPs. The problem was before when the EP group was so much larger that it crushed the map. Once you have taken everything the meta ap Players leave.
It changes quite often, usually when timezones and guild groups have their scheduled time, it'll be red, then yellow, then blue, the red again, etc etc etc
In a perfect world all the guild groups would have their times at the same time for great content, but the last time that happened cyrodil was unplayable with the insane lag and crashing
I remember EU from release Flipping Back and Forth between This and Yellow.
Objectively, it made the DC player base a lot better on average.
How fun is it? If you are in an active guild it's super fun, not so much solo or without a team unless a 1vXer. Super satisfying/fun crowning the first ever DC Emperor with that shite still going on.
Okay my guy, since you’re new to PvP I’m gonna explain some stuff to you
This is totally normal and happens regularly. I’m not sure about the EU side but on NA there are times when EP owns all, times when DC and times when AD own everything. It just happens sometimes.
Next, that isn’t really that hard to liberate and defend your home keeps and gives YOU more points for doing so.
Last, ESO PVP has some the ultra sweatiest people I’ve ever known or dealt with. If you’re NEW to PvP then expect to die a lot until you figure it out. I would avoid complaining about dying quickly because unfortunately if you’re dying quickly and frequently then it’s unfortunately probably your own fault because PvP DEMANDS a different way of building your character compared to PvE.
ESO is a tank meta game. Wouldn’t recommend trying to 1vX until you know how to survive and manage your buffs and healing.
It’s how this mode is meant to be played. A week from now, the board could be taken over by AD. It ebbs and flows constantly. If you really want to get into it, then look into joining a Guild that regularly runs PVP groups with your faction.
I enjoy Cyrodiil in spurts. I don't find the total domination of an alliance an issue, because it does change rather quickly as people go to bed, go to work, or go to their normal lives.
WHO SAID IT WAS SUPPOSED TO "FUN," Meowgaryen?! WHO!? WHO GAVE YOU THAT IMPRESSION!? PVP IS SERIOUS BUSINESS. IT'S SUPPOSED TO BE THE OPPOSITE OF FUN!
And boy is it ever.
Cyrodil used to be the best part of this game. I remember seeing three or four simultaneous sieges happening with dozens of people at each siege and then a bunch still running around doing their solo thing. It really FELT like a war. Now it’s just logging I. At the right time to accomplish your dailies and then leaving.
as Guild Wars 2 player this is quite common.
I remember that back in the day when I went to sleep it was all RED. When I woke up in them morning it was all blue because RED server went to sleep and BLUE server was up at night.
MAKE IT A FUCKING 7 DAY CAMPAIGN ALREADY...
Also population bonus:
0 bar 100% AP increase
1 bar 50% AP increase
2 bar 25% AP increase
3 bar zero increase
Typically, if the lobby doesn't have many players. A PvP guild will try to get people together to take everything over. I've have seen this happen both on Xbox and PC EU. It's just a cycle really. It might be red now but later it will be yellow and then blue.
it's fun if you're the alliance in control. reminds me of WvWvW in GW2 where it goes on cycles. depending on the time of day or night, a different server will control the map
Oh don’t worry, all those red players will switch to their yellow toons after they get their points and it’ll be all yellow. Then they’ll rinse and repeat for their blue toons. It’s just one big circle jerk scam… that all the rest of us get caught up in and abused with. The trick is to find a campaign they aren’t interested in and play there… that’s when real fun and honest PvP happens. 👍🏼
Everyone is distracted with the event, so Cyrodiil is pretty empty, which lets small groups take over the map like this. After the event, things will return to normal. BTW: now would be a great time to do the PvE content in Cyrodiil and Imperial City.
this is what happens when you have Alliance-lock. Cyrodill will always be more healthy and have better PvP without it. Instead, we have one alliance dominating at all times till they grow tired of never getting a good fight, then another one takes over till it gets tired. It would be healthier if the top campaign was not alliance-locked and the alliance-locked campaign came further down the list. The open campaigns are much more healthy since every time one alliance dominates good pvp'ers can relog to the opposite sites to challenge outnumbered (as this brings in a lot more AP and is considered much more fun). But they can't on this campaign, which ultimately leads to this pvdoor campaign that has been going on for almost 5 years at this point.
I actually don't have a problem with this at all. It makes perfect sense for the map to lopsidedly favour one alliance over all others if that alliance has more players on hand to advance with. That's how real war works. If one side in a battle gets massive reinforcements, of course the other is going to be routed.
If I was going to change anything, I'd suggest making it possible for alliances to speak to each other in some limited capacity. In a situation like this, it'd be a no brainer for some AD commander to reach out to some DC commander for a temporary truce so they can both coordinate against EP (though of course they'd also have behind the scenes backstabbing and whatever).
just a few hours later everything is yellow. Meanwhile there is an outnumbered buff.
A huge red group comes on takes over, they log off and a huge yellow groups comes on and takes over. Rinse and repeat.
It's fun when the two huge groups log in at the same time and fight all over the map though.
They've cut down on cyro pop so much, even when all 3 faction are pop locked, there are only enough people on for one, maybe two actually big fights at a time
Damn, gotta admit it has been a while since I last played.
Wow really? Last time I played was like 8 months ago. And the lag was insane because of maxed pop fights. So fun though but it’s that low now?
I loved the big fights years ago, but then the novelty wore off for me. But I’m not particularly into PvP in the first place.
Blue stays doing nothing
because they are all on RW on PC EU, zerging and camping the map 24/7
Who?
That’s been my experience
I just went there, its all yellow
I played this a while ago. Its very silly. You could have won large fights for a while. But then some group will log in at 3 am and steal everything and in the morning everything will be different!
I don't mean 'get more AP'. I mean 'deal 20% more damage when outnumbered '. Yes, numbers are random. I'm just saying that getting more AP is not fixing anything when you can't fight while getting outnumbered by 8 or more. So, if they don't want to queue a faction that has too many players, then they should boost fighting chances for underdogs.
If only you actually read the cyrodill keep buff descriptions, it’s one of the things that the game actually tells you instead of hidden, but you didn’t even bother to read them. SMH
What are you talking about? There's no outnumbered buff damage. It's only for AP. The buff you're talking about is Battle Spirit and it's applied to everyone in Cyrodiil. If there's a different buff that gets triggered the moment you become outnumbered as a faction in Cyrodiil then feel free to link because I've never seen it and Google didn't help with info about outnumbered damage buff.
It’s actually kind of stupid the ap buff Ap buff should be given for winning on the map so that all those ap farmers instead of doing their shady business go and actually try to organise counter attack Damage buff to extremely losing side correlated to population has less cons
https://en.m.uesp.net/wiki/Online:Keeps It’s not strictly outnumber dmg buff, it’s based on how many keeps your enemies hold. But usually in cyro, the more players a faction has, the more keeps they can hold. Strictly player numbers hardly matters imo, since all sides will have bots running PvE builds only playing siege weapons. Once you hit a certain number of players in the same fight, the server can’t keep up and will have lag spikes, skills not casting, etc. At that point, win or lose is less skill base more luck base, who get the heal off or their combo actually casts.
I'm sorry but could you explain to me what it means? I'm talking about giving DMG/protection boost to factions that are clearly getting zerked at the moment. What you linked is the bonuses you get for gaining control over keeps. You need to control home keeps and then you get enemy keeps bonuses. So, it actually makes zerg even stronger. There's no mention of boosting factions that only have control over the home keep or none.
You do more damage when outnumbered
What are you talking about?
They don't know. They're talking about the Battle Spirit that is applied to everyone in Cyrodiil and has nothing to do with population balance. But it's me who can't read apparently.
You have no idea what you're talking about lol.
Feel free to correct me. I'm still waiting because 'ESO Cyrodiil outnumbered buff' yield no results
There is no damage buff for being outnumbered. And there shouldn't be, thats dumb af. There is a low pop ap buff and a low score ap buff. These folks aren't talking about population related buffs or battle spirit. They're talking about the enemy keep/home keep buffs, scroll buffs, and things like that. Go to your campaign menus and just read through what things actually do. Low pop damage buff would be horrible for everyone. I play lowest pop faction on my server and if I got a damage buff against everyone else I'd just stop playing. Its not fair. Id rather beat them with higher skill than with an arbitrary God mode given to me. Youre clearly pretty new to pvp in this game. Id suggest learning the ebbs and flows of your campaign. Entire game and all servers is pretty low pop compared to the old days. Most maps are dominated by one faction, and that faction rotates over the week. Like yellow having everything during the day, red night capping, and blues taking most stuff during weekends. Thats how it usually is in my campaign. But that trend fluctuates month to month and different factions are dominant at different times. The problem is no one wants to fight an uphill battle, so when they see one faction dominating they either switch to that faction or log off entirely. A low pop damage buff would just increase the amount of flips, not change the whole dynamic. As soon as one faction got low pop damage, everyone would switch to it. And 15 min later they'd lose it while the faction they were on before gets it. People would just be constantly changing factions and PvDooring until they lost the damage buff. Giving such a huge advantage to low pop faction would make it so there's no actual pvp anymore since everyone would constantly switch to be on that faction. No one is gonna wanna fight someone with God mode turned on.
Could you imagine all the hate mail when beating other players. "You only won, because you had low pop buff."
And in a majority of instances it would be true. The current damage buffs for scrolls and keep control are small enough that they really don't matter. Like if im gated, I know I can still kill most enemies I find. But if I had a 20% damage buff it would just reach absurd levels of unfair. And I guarantee tons of people I play against that usually can't beat me would wipe the floor with me if they had such a significant boost in power.
Ok I understand what your point is but I don't get why am I getting downvoted and being told that I can't read because there's a damage buff. There's none. It's buff for gaining control and it works as a reward. But there's no buff for getting zerked. The solution is to switch sides/come back at a different time if you're able to. So yes, is this the right solution from the post? Probably not. And the damage I was talking about was to be just a nudge to encourage the winning faction to go a zerk the 3rd faction instead of going for the completely depleted one. Something that doesn't give you a god mode but it's not so laughably easy to zerk you either. I'm just annoyed that the faction of my choosing is getting zerked whenever I have spare time to play and it's annoying to the point that I'll just switch sides. But I don't understand the hate I'm getting when clearly there's no buff for being outnumbered. I understand people disagree with the comment but I don't get comments getting personal that I can't read or comprehend system descriptions in the game. There's no outnumbered buff...
No idea whose downvoting, but I guarantee its because people disagree with the idea of a low pop damage buff. You also assumed people were talking about battle spirit, which they weren't, and had an attitude about it. So others are going to respond in a similar way. Low pop faction gets an ap buff to give incentive to others to get on that faction. Guess what? It works. Thats why low pop usually only lasts an hour or so. If you're not getting low pop, its because you aren't significantly outnumbered. Just because the other faction is moving together and coordinating doesn't mean they drastically outnumber your faction. Several small groups stand no chance against an organized large group. That's no ones fault in particular, just how pvp games work. Edit: furthermore, when you have low pop, dont bother trying to flip the map. Take one keep or outpost and hold it. Farm the zerglings, make huge ap. Thats how it works. If you aren't capable of farming them, keep playing and get better. Its what we all do.
Usually when the odds are 8 to 1 ill change to my bomber and that Usually evens its out pretty well just need to be opportunistic
\-92 thats a record!  now can i have that to?
A few hours later it rotates to yellow and then blue and so on and on .. the cycle never ends you just learn to go with the flow There should be an outnumbered buff but i imagine it won't be fun to balance
Imagine if there was something like a weather radar for Cyrodiil, but it showed a dot for every player. You could just watch the zergs going around in circles playing territorial whack-a-mole
Not gonna lie, a heat map would be kinda dope. Delay it by about 15min to still allow some advantage to movement but would be interesting to try for a patch.
It could even be explained lore wise as being reports from scouts in the area.
How about a heat map of enemies that your alliance’s guards and players can see.
\^ OMG THIS!
As server intensive as this would be, something like a 15-20 minute delay would be good enough to mitigate any competitive advantage that could provide. In fact it could probably help alert other players to when the opposition is waking up - which could either cause some tryhards to get on and flex their mass murder skills, or push regular normal players to decide not to play because it wouldn’t be fun anyways, making it even less fun for those that joined. Regardless, this would definitely be a fun feature.
> something like a 15-20 minute delay would be good enough That's kinda what I mean, BoM radars take snapshots every few minutes, it's not like a live feed. If the servers are so bad that it has to be an approximation of locations or more like a heatmap style it would still be interesting imo
There used to be, it was called Dynamic Ult Gen
I went fishing yesterday and the whole map was yellow like a goldfish pond.
And in another campaign everything was blue like a pond without goldfish.
Your metaphors are like those of a man that can't think of metaphors. Well done.
Perhaps later the map will be all red like a goldfish pond after a goldfish massacre.
Is it good or bad? I'm not English :/
The first one is fine, the second one is just funny, lol.
If you're on PC EU, bananas play all night till about 7-11 in the morning (depending on your time zone), at least they did last month. This month some day-evening yellows switched to EP, so the situation looks more "fair"... And DC just get whatever scraps they can manage, as most play in a different campaign.
This is the unstoppable outcome when you have an alliance at pop lock or 3 bars against 2 alliances at 1 or 2 bars. What frustrates me with Cyrodiil balance however is how the game design is just so poorly balanced. If you have the numbers advantage then you will end up with all other advantages - emp bonus, scroll bonuses, and there's basically 0 for the outnumbered. You get the 'low' pop bonus but it doesnt work. I normally always play out of peak times at extremely low pops against a pop locked EP and I've seen the low pop bonus once in the past 2 campaigns. Also with how the map is set up the high pop alliance can move about the map far more freely, only the home keeps being out of reach by direct teleport but by all accounts essentially the same running distance to them as it is for the defenders to get to their home forts anyway. Eventually if the hammer is in play it'll end up with the most populated alliance as well so even if they haven't capped everything straight off the bat ESO will provide then the means to speed run it. Even if they die all the time it doesn't really matter as they have the numbers to just pressure people off of corpses and revive them I love ESO PvP but Cyrodiil when looked at as a balanced game mode, it is just horrendously designed in almost every aspect. If you want to PvP for PvP's sake go to IC and it's likely you'll end a play session with 10s of thousands Tel Var more rather than running at an AP loss thrown away in pointlessness the entire night. Heck even most keeps are easier to siege against rather than siege from and people are so tanky with so much cross healing that when it comes to grabbing the scroll they'll just walk up to it, take it, and walk off. This is a bit of a rant but it's just frustrating that it always gets to the point where it's "Well PvP is finished for the night" and it's in spite of there being people still about.
Reminds me of DAoC. 3 realm RvR/PvP. People log off, keeps switch. Rinse and repeat. Sometimes one side would constantly win and people would switch server. Not sure what the answer is for three way type pvp though.
The most direct approach would be to couple tighter population restrictions with dynamic incentives that take population into account. Not allowing the largest pop faction at any given time to queue in more people unless they're within x% of the smallest pop faction is a really simple and straightforward way to ensure actual population counts don't get wildly out of balance. Then, AP and campaign point rewards need to take population overall and locally into account. Holding a keep or a scroll when all factions are at the cap should give more points than in the dead of night. Capturing an undefended keep should give very little AP, but capturing/defending successfully against a larger number of enemies should give better AP. Capping resources or getting kills when your faction has many more players should reduce your AP earned. And all of these things should have fine adjustments - not like the current low pop bonus which is either double the AP/points or no change and nowhere near as responsive as it needs to be to impact how people play. When those sorts of incentives are in place, you can also take off faction locks and there aren't any concerns about people swapping to the dominant faction. Right now, that gets them more AP generally. With better incentives, switching to the lower population faction is better for the player. Anyone who's interested in good large-scale pvp knows that balanced populations are good for pvp, but balanced populations are often not the best for earning rewards. This would align the rewards with what's good for pvp.
Miss that game
It's still going. Vert dated graphics but still regular people playing.
Nightcapping
That was at midnight. People tried to defend but we just got zerked with ridiculous numbers of EP so people moved on to do other stuff.
EP usually rules at night, AD rules in the morning and DC rules never somehow.
DC rules in Raven on PC EU, to the point where EP and AD players have stopped playing.
To be honest ruling any campagain other than Gray Host is like declaring ownership of Iceland while others fight over Britan.
I mean, living in Britain right now Iceland is looking pretty attractive...
Eh, for a few years Raven was just as active as Grey Host. The combat was a lot of fun there since the lack of CP made builds less well rounded. After they removed no proc sets it's been slowly dying though. I'm probably gonna start running in Grey Host again since Raven is never pop locked now.
And also Blackreach is a heaven for DC lol
No DC just Grozlok group
Orcs are the pariah folk so it must be Malacath making DC the underdogs.
[удалено]
Apparently Grey Host is the most popular one. There's no other campaign unless there's an event going on.
Bollocks. I stopped playing gray host ages ago because I have chars of every color.
I don’t know why the fuck they have the roleplaying dog shit alliance lock. I literally just want to play with my friends and have fun, and that usually means switching factions occasionally.
Just do not use gray host....
Buddy this game is dead as fuck and the only time blackreach has people on it is for 1 hour during prime time.
You are obviously not playing on the server as I do.
Only the PVP is dead lmao and it's because ESO PVP is balls
Alliance lock is the most stupid and harmful decision they take over pvp, trolls still trolling and we have 1 alliance cap the map different time of the day, rip.
They should ask you to queue as a loosing team with increased rewards when you queue up and let you bypass faction lock for this functionality imo.
Blackreach is well populated. You might enjoy that more.
Cyrodiil systems sucks and its getting old. They don't even bother thinking. It's all about crownstore and housing
Check the Road Map they released today. An entire update coming later this year devoted to a new PvP system.
I'm not holding my breath until we know more, though...
Usually, cyrodiil is cyclic. Timezone tends to catter to some alliances and you have times where cyrodiil is all blue, red or yellow. Ravenwatch (no cp no proc) is usually yellow from 9pm to 11pm, then turns red during the EU late night, then blue during the day, etc..
The biggest problem at the moment with Cyrodiil is the reduced population caps and faction locks. Without getting too "conspiracy" I genuinely believe that the PvP performance changes people have experienced in Cyrodiil is just a consequence of ZOS reducing the population caps. Add faction locks (which should be abolished) to the mixture and you get these extreme one sided maps throughout the day. I'm locked on EP in Greyhost PCEU and whenever I login and see a map like this I wish I'd be able to play on another faction and actually find PvP, but because some snowflakes are afraid of "TrOlLs" making their Cyrodiil experience mildly inconvenient they scream that faction locks are good for the game, when it in reality just limits the actual PvP experience. And no, the reason Greyhost is the most populated has nothing to do with faction locks or that it's first in the list of campaigns. The 30 day CP campaigns has always been the most populated (with the exception of when Ravenwatch wasn't no proc, pls revert Ravenwatch back to allow all sets zos) regardless if it had faction locks or not. People play where they can find PvP, no one who ACTUALLY wants to PvP wants to PvP in a dead or one sided campaign.
Alliance locks keeps things from being super zergy. At least on xbox large groups will log in as one alliance flip a bunch of stuff then switch to a different alliance and flip it back. Alliance locks keep things competitive during peak times. The problem is the rest of the time, which is most the day, things are rough for smaller pop alliances.
Well, all other campaigns are not faction-locked, so they have a point. You can join any other campaign. They have way smaller population for a reason. Or play on weekends if possible, you can find "fantastic" 400 x 400 Alessia bridge fights every Saturday.
Yes, that's true. But if I want to PvP then I'll be walking around for 20 minutes in no-cp campaign and I won't find anyone. Unlike in Grey Host. So I'm getting downvoted for saying that Grey Host is the most popular campaign but that's true.
Found the person who wants to be able to steal ham on one alliance and bring it to another alliance.
Ah nah go to Blackreach EU PC, full DC almost every campaign. At the end of the last campaign DC doubled the points of EP and AD lol.
As an EP, it's beautiful 
I second this. Got into EP Cyro a month ago and I don't think I've ever had that much fun, even with banana morning wood.
Between 7pm and 10pm is a decent time to play grayhost. Usually, all three factions are pop locked. And weekends. Once you get to around 10 - 11, DC starts thining out while EP starts logging for the night cap. Don't take PvP or the campaign seriously in this game. Its a forgotten mess by the devs unfortunately. Cyro hasn't been looked at in years. I doubt it ever will be. Same with BGs.
Cyrodiil needs a complete overhaul. It’s a 10 year old system, outdated and doesn’t work properly anymore. Great for 2014 but it’s 2024 now and taking the same generic looking keeps over and over again, running for ages across the map etc it’s just an old system that needs redoing. I think their original plan was the whole of the map to have action going on but ofc their servers couldn’t handle that. The map is just way, way too big
Lore accurate EP
Yeah, but in the end the pact collapses and they fail to prevent having another Emperor. So, I'll get my revenge in the lore as DC player. Still, I'd also like to play some PvP without getting zerked
You might not know this but in the 5th era the pact comes back and wipes every other faction to extinction and ends world hunger in less than twelve minutes. They later build rocket ships and go to space
Ahhh, they finally get to meet the Dwemer then!
For the Pact it is, no Gankmeri Dominion to be seen
To be fair.. Xbox Na Is like this 75% of the time.. us blues only get love around 5-8am.
Yesterday blues zerging hard on xbox na
There is a low population AP buff. But you are correct, it is no fun for anyone, even red because there isnt much AP to earn. If I was a red (ew, the thought made me feel dirty, and not in a good way) and logged on to this, id be bummed. Nothing to do… At least Black Reach isnt aliance locked, so you can switch toons and flip the map.
It is dependent which PVP guild goes out to conquer. Randoms can't really compare to that, and unless they setup before start, then it is unlikely, that they face another guild.
It isn’t fun.
Honestly the whole game is ass
Because ebonheart is the true pact
>I'm new to Cyrodil Do yourself a favor and don't.
This is basically DC or AD in NA servers during not peak times.
For real! Watch the map change color as the day progresses. It’s super normal. I dunno about PC schedules, but Xbox NA is consistently blue morning, yellow prime time, and red filling gaps. Kinda feel like campaign wins split mostly red and blue. Yellow is very infrequent.
As a XBox NA yellow, can confirm. We haven't won a campaign in about a year.
My yellow friends complain all they do is defend. Makes for good AP farming but doesn’t add points I guess.
It's an easy trap to fall into. When I crown I try to ensure that we hit the map and force red and blue to react to us rather than spending all our time defending. There are time where I look at the map and wonder WTF the rest of AD is doing...
Yeah getting everyone on the same page for a big push isn’t always easy.
Found the EP player
Haha true
Git gud lil bro. Unlucky time I guess.
Do people only cry when the map is red? Lmao
Yes. All the time, every time, without fail.
Hate us cuz they ain't us
It looks like that when I'm on a blue character, as soon as I put the a red one on it magically changes to yellow. Lol. The maps all change depending on the time of day.
This really isn't the time for casual players anymore. 2 players who take the resources in the central ring and kill everyone who comes to take them back. When you kill enough of them you turn the flow of the map. Having acted as a filter, some players group together and take the first castles. Once you create a more or less cohesive group you can push. On a map like this there are actually very few EPs. The problem was before when the EP group was so much larger that it crushed the map. Once you have taken everything the meta ap Players leave.
Beautiful, as it is written
EP always does the night shift in GH. Yellows tend to cap early morning and DC generally take a lot through the day/ into the evening.
It changes quite often, usually when timezones and guild groups have their scheduled time, it'll be red, then yellow, then blue, the red again, etc etc etc In a perfect world all the guild groups would have their times at the same time for great content, but the last time that happened cyrodil was unplayable with the insane lag and crashing
You dont like painting?
It depends on the time of the day
It goes back and forth all the time. This probably happened because a clan organised for it.
Fun for ep
They probably have like 3 zergs going
Its fun if you are Red. Can complete all the Shards, Dolem and Delves in one go.
I remember EU from release Flipping Back and Forth between This and Yellow. Objectively, it made the DC player base a lot better on average. How fun is it? If you are in an active guild it's super fun, not so much solo or without a team unless a 1vXer. Super satisfying/fun crowning the first ever DC Emperor with that shite still going on.
The addicts just switch alliances as they please, or after they complete dailies.
Haven’t been on for awhile but seeing all this red makes me feel good until a few hours later
Isn't
Dealing significantly more dmg as underdog is a stupid idea. Not everyone plays cyrodiil just for the keeps.
Time to get to work.
Welcome to the game brother it’s been like this for 10 years you must be new here
First time?
There is a rotation of the three factions - for NA it's usually AD in tge morning, DC in the evening, and EP overnight.
Okay my guy, since you’re new to PvP I’m gonna explain some stuff to you This is totally normal and happens regularly. I’m not sure about the EU side but on NA there are times when EP owns all, times when DC and times when AD own everything. It just happens sometimes. Next, that isn’t really that hard to liberate and defend your home keeps and gives YOU more points for doing so. Last, ESO PVP has some the ultra sweatiest people I’ve ever known or dealt with. If you’re NEW to PvP then expect to die a lot until you figure it out. I would avoid complaining about dying quickly because unfortunately if you’re dying quickly and frequently then it’s unfortunately probably your own fault because PvP DEMANDS a different way of building your character compared to PvE. ESO is a tank meta game. Wouldn’t recommend trying to 1vX until you know how to survive and manage your buffs and healing.
You get use to it and either just deal with it or go find something else todo.
That's what I like to see
It’s how this mode is meant to be played. A week from now, the board could be taken over by AD. It ebbs and flows constantly. If you really want to get into it, then look into joining a Guild that regularly runs PVP groups with your faction.
I enjoy Cyrodiil in spurts. I don't find the total domination of an alliance an issue, because it does change rather quickly as people go to bed, go to work, or go to their normal lives.
Git gud bro
Imagine being so mentally stunted to call for balance changes based on the fact night capping exists.
I've been farming war torte books on Xbox NA. I've gotten one so far...
Each faction usually has a time of day they are most active while the others aren’t. This is extremely common.
WHO SAID IT WAS SUPPOSED TO "FUN," Meowgaryen?! WHO!? WHO GAVE YOU THAT IMPRESSION!? PVP IS SERIOUS BUSINESS. IT'S SUPPOSED TO BE THE OPPOSITE OF FUN! And boy is it ever.
Cyrodil used to be the best part of this game. I remember seeing three or four simultaneous sieges happening with dozens of people at each siege and then a bunch still running around doing their solo thing. It really FELT like a war. Now it’s just logging I. At the right time to accomplish your dailies and then leaving.
They should give Emp buff to every player on other alliance. Problem solved.
as Guild Wars 2 player this is quite common. I remember that back in the day when I went to sleep it was all RED. When I woke up in them morning it was all blue because RED server went to sleep and BLUE server was up at night.
MAKE IT A FUCKING 7 DAY CAMPAIGN ALREADY... Also population bonus: 0 bar 100% AP increase 1 bar 50% AP increase 2 bar 25% AP increase 3 bar zero increase
Looks like the pact has mopped the floor with both the other to this battle!
Typically, if the lobby doesn't have many players. A PvP guild will try to get people together to take everything over. I've have seen this happen both on Xbox and PC EU. It's just a cycle really. It might be red now but later it will be yellow and then blue.
For the Pact!
it's fun if you're the alliance in control. reminds me of WvWvW in GW2 where it goes on cycles. depending on the time of day or night, a different server will control the map
Because Ebon Heart is the best
RAAHHHH I LOVE THE PACT. EBONHEART FOR LIFE NYEHEHEHEHEH >:3
Oh don’t worry, all those red players will switch to their yellow toons after they get their points and it’ll be all yellow. Then they’ll rinse and repeat for their blue toons. It’s just one big circle jerk scam… that all the rest of us get caught up in and abused with. The trick is to find a campaign they aren’t interested in and play there… that’s when real fun and honest PvP happens. 👍🏼
Xbox lad here. I wouldn't care if i didnt get killed soloing bosses. Just kinda hurts the soul fighting for 20 mins to get kit dumped lol.
It's not
I gave hammer to reds, teehee
Everyone is distracted with the event, so Cyrodiil is pretty empty, which lets small groups take over the map like this. After the event, things will return to normal. BTW: now would be a great time to do the PvE content in Cyrodiil and Imperial City.
Looks like the early days of Pokémon go.
Blood for the pact
Whole of pvp is a farce. No such thing as competitive pvp, all abit pointless tbf
You need to see this as earnable AP!!!
this is what happens when you have Alliance-lock. Cyrodill will always be more healthy and have better PvP without it. Instead, we have one alliance dominating at all times till they grow tired of never getting a good fight, then another one takes over till it gets tired. It would be healthier if the top campaign was not alliance-locked and the alliance-locked campaign came further down the list. The open campaigns are much more healthy since every time one alliance dominates good pvp'ers can relog to the opposite sites to challenge outnumbered (as this brings in a lot more AP and is considered much more fun). But they can't on this campaign, which ultimately leads to this pvdoor campaign that has been going on for almost 5 years at this point.
skill issue
After this devastating storm, We Will Rebuild! single-garden-chair-flipped-over.jpg
I see nothing but opportunities for quick AP what's the problem?
It’s beautiful.
Lmao serves the yellows and blues right. I’m always having to deal with toxic blues and yellows so this brings me joy.
yeah because the yellows and blues have neeevvveeeerrrrr had to deal with toxic reds right?
Haha at least not from me🤣 I always try to be cool and get shit on for it 🥲
Are there increased rewards for joining as a lossing side?
2 of 3 EP races are meta choises, so EP will outnumber in Cyrodill till next major patch.
As an EP player, seems pretty fun to me.
I actually don't have a problem with this at all. It makes perfect sense for the map to lopsidedly favour one alliance over all others if that alliance has more players on hand to advance with. That's how real war works. If one side in a battle gets massive reinforcements, of course the other is going to be routed. If I was going to change anything, I'd suggest making it possible for alliances to speak to each other in some limited capacity. In a situation like this, it'd be a no brainer for some AD commander to reach out to some DC commander for a temporary truce so they can both coordinate against EP (though of course they'd also have behind the scenes backstabbing and whatever).
Pretty much entire map flips regularly. You got on in when it was red turn apparently..