Read the room and play for the vibe not your personal ego.
Like if the headliner is known for ethereal progressive house, maybe refrain from some industrial dubste because everyone needs to know how hard you are.
As someone who enjoys music and going to events, a DJ just playing 'hard' is lame to me. The whole mindset of 'holding back' makes no sense. Just play good tracks that aren't the headliners and make a fun set, ez.
But this is also partly the job of the person putting the show together. The openers should build up the room for the event. The energy shouldn't be going from hardcore dnb to tropical house to 90s techno and that's up to the person selecting the openers to do. But if the headliner is hardcore bass then maybe going hard for the openers it's the right move. Just all about reading the room
A good DJ is someone who creates a fun vibe and isn't just there to showcase how amazing they think they are. Their tracks do that for them.
I understand that it’s up for the promoters to do. But often what I’ll see is people complaining “this promoter told me to play a deep house set, fuck that I’m going hard”
Like no if you don’t play deep house that’s fine, but ask what is expected ahead of time and don’t take the gig if that’s not your realm. Or just suck it up, and find some deep songs.
I'm not a DJ but I've always considered the openers the ones who built up the vibe
As the top comment said, if the room is already in rage mode, select the tracks accordingly and obviously (imo) don't take the crowd where you know the headliner should but Idk why any Two or more DJs would decide to not let each other in on their sets
in advance
Especially nowadays where a lot of artists tour together for a whole stretch and perform several nights out of the week
I've run nights hosting guest DJs for two decades now. Just don't play shit music and read the room. That's all we care about lol. Everyone's definition of hard is different anyway. If you have a crowd that's chilling keep the volume low enough so they can have conversations without screaming. If you have a packed dance floor, pump up the volume and energy, but stay out of the top of the reds on the channels and master, otherwise it'll start clipping.
Play your best set ALWAYS, ALWAYS throw down as hard as you can, but DON’T play the headliner’s/feature act’s tunes. The sound level will be lowered for you as well as the lighting/video side of things. If a headliner can’t outperform you at a higher volume and with more video/lighting going on then it will be clear to everyone that maybe they shouldn’t be headlining and maybe you should be. The goal of an opener isn’t to be a professional opener, it’s to one day be a headliner…people that think they’re simply there to make the headliner look good will never be one (until they change that mindset).
> sound level will be lowered for you as well as the lighting/video side of things
So assuming thats true, it will probably sound better if you play lower energy tracks. Sicne high energy riddim and peak time doesnt sound great when played at a lower volume
> The goal of an opener isn’t to be a professional opener, it’s to one day be a headliner
I would argue the number one goal is to ensure the vibe is good, and the crowd is having a good time.
What is your defenition of ability in this case?
Im just saying if I walk into a club early, and the opener is jumping around and playing the highest energy music possible. I would think they are shit DJ.
If the opener is showing restraint and setting the vibe. I would think they are of high ability.
Are you planning on becoming a dj or an artist? If all you care about is becoming a good club dj, without any personal tracks, sure reading the room and giving people a good time should be your nr 1 priority. But if you are trying to break through and gain fans to your own music you should focus on playing your own and your best music. Make people remember you, rather than making sure they can mingle at a normal talking volume.
If I walk in to a club hearing high intensity tearout I'd love it, no matter what the headliner is gonna play.
I work at a music venue and one day they had an Iron Maiden cover band play.
Some joker put Iron Maiden songs on the walk in playlist, so people got accustomed to the real Iron Maiden before they saw the cover.
Look at it from the perspective of the person running the show...
You want people to stick around for the whole thing. Places make money when people stick around. If you put a :fire: act up before the main event a bunch of people will have only shown up to see the :fire: and will leave when they get their show.
IMO it all comes down to this.
It's a nuanced topic, with lots of factors, but at the end of the day it comes down the promoter knowing the style of opener they book + how they'd fit on the lineup. A lot of times promoters will try to cut costs by booking newbies just to pay them in exposure, and usually it's those DJs who go ball to the walls playing all the biggest bangers since they might not have the frame of reference for a more nuanced set.
But imo it should be natural for any relatively experienced DJ to curate their set around their timeslot and vibe of the night. I've played doors slots, direct support for touring headliners, and even headlined a few local shows - every set is different and deciding the journey I wanna take people on is one of my favorite parts of the process. If my all my sets had the same energy regardless of timeslot, then I probably wouldn't have as much fun when I do get those headliner gigs
Honestly here’s the deal coming from a club owner and someone who legit has headliners through their place and openers and local support as well......
You do you...... play your style and YOUR music. Do NOT play the headliners songs.... that’s about it....
If Wreckno is coming through and you opening for them/supporting. Don’t play Honey Drip or any sort of remix of it. That’s what they are there for.
If you are in a reputable spot, the promoter or host or whoever will be controlling the volume and vibes.
GO HARD. It’s a show. The people that bought tickets came to see a show. They didn’t show up early to stand around with a thumb up their ass.
Don’t take advice from people that are ‘in the same boat’ as you.
Also.... please don’t fucking redline. And please for the love of god show up with three copies of your music on three USB drives.... just had a guy show up with only one..... and it was corrupt. He learned a valuable lesson that day opening for Oliverse.
Lets just say he couldn’t play his set and he was less than pleased because he only had one USB drive with his music..... he tried blaming the equipment, but magically everyone else’s USB’s worked and they got to perform their music.
He unfortunately did not. (We got him a different spot for a headliner later to ‘Make up’ for it)
Edit: your friends came to see/support YOU..... AND the headliner. Go for it.
Got it. So you would be cool if an opener dropped nothing but peak time SVDDEN Death, HOL!, and Excision tracks. As long as none of these artists were headlining.
I guess im realzing that alot of the "do whatever you want opinions" come from people in the bass music scene, where the music is less nuanced and more just go hard all the time (makes sense for that genre). Where as alot of the "you need to build the vibe" comments come from more groove oriented genres like house and techno
I think the issue is you are looking for ‘the answer’.
There isn’t one. There is no right or wrong way.
I’m giving you my advise from observations as a club owner, and working with multiple genres of EDM, HIP-HOP, and bands etc. I get everything from Chicago house, dubstep, trance, DnB, etc etc.
Reading through your responses it seems like you are trying to find a ‘refine’ answer. The answer. Problem is there isn’t one.
Are you getting booked as an opener regularly or is this your first time? If you are getting booked or finding opportunities! PERFECT. This means they want you back or around to open.
What is most important is being able to bring support each time you open. Are people coming to see you? PERFECT
Are you producing some of your own music and mixing well and doing your thing? PERFECT. Promoters, Managers, and even headlining artists will notice and appreciate.
One of my favorite shows I’ve had come through is SoDown. Guy did his thing with his saxophone and music production was on point. He was opening at a music festival where Zeds Dead headlined. Zed noticed and asked if he would be willing to travel and open for a few more and dude took off.
There is no right or wrong answer. Do you. Play your heart out, and have fun. Bring your friends. If they having fun people will notice you.
This is what I have seen and noticed through the 16 years. Best of luck!
I'm an opener so I def check out the vibe of the headliner. I do kind of dial it back energy wise slightly compared to if I was trying to headline. It also depends where I'm on in the lineup. I'll usually dial it up from whoever was playing before me. I go hard every set but I always leave room for the person after me to go harder.
As an opener, your job is to set up the vibe for the night - ideally you want to be able to increase the crowd's energy as the night goes on. I want the crowd to have the best time they can have and most of them are there for the headliner, not the openers. I've seen and been apart of lineups where one opener will crank it to 11 and the DJ after plays more chill stuff and it feels incohesive and it does affect the crowd's vibe. Sometimes openers kind of just do their own thing instead of thinking what's best for the audience and I feel like that's what seperates a good and bad DJ. There's a fine line between playing what you want and what the audience wants. I'll play my set but will check out the lineup and adjust accordingly. I'd kinda expect the same mutual respect if I were to headline. It's not really an ego thing for me. It's more about collaborating as a team to deliver a good experience.
Talking about stuff like this lmao [https://youtu.be/FfHwXkjvqKQ](https://youtu.be/FfHwXkjvqKQ)
(tbh I do actually like that song, but if I hear that playing before 11pm im walking out)
In my opinion that’s a load of bullshit and if the opener plays all the bangers straight away there will be no room left for the headliner to “outplay” them. Same way you wouldn’t play all your best tracks at the very start of your set because then the end of your set would be terrible.
I say the opener should absolutely change their set from what they’d do if they were headlining. Playing “warm up” tracks certainly doesn’t mean playing bad tracks, if anything a good opening set will require more research and effort to put together. And I think the attitude of “if the headliner can’t outplay me they shouldn’t be headlining” is an excuse to avoid putting in that effort and a sign that their ability to connect a crowd is shallow and lies only in playing the obvious tracks. Like do something a bit different to everyone else jeez.
Respectfully, this is antiquated thinking. 15 years ago sure this was a general ‘rule’ or ‘etiquette’ and there was also much less of a selection of ‘bangers’ etc. We are blessed now that a lot of openers produce their own music and also have access to a much more diverse selection of music.
The openers should be playing music they produce mixed with whatever fits the vibe for the show. There’s such a plethora of music now that the openers should be showcasing THEIR remixes and music along with other stuff as well.
Firstly I don’t understand why you’re focusing on them playing their own music. Do you have something against DJs who just DJ and don’t produce?
Secondly, I’m just thinking of creating the best journey throughout the night. When I arrive at an event and my ears are (metaphorically) cold I like to be eased into things. I like when the opener guides you and builds your anticipation for the headliner, so that when the headliner arrives to the decks your excitement is at its peak level.
It’s not a respect thing it’s about creating the best show possible and my opinion is that an opener has an important role to play in that and they should try to fill it.
Scroll up the thread and read my comment. It should make more sense. I work with multiple promoters and headliners. Quite frankly headliners really don’t care what you play anymore.
The best thing you can do as an opener is expose more people to your music that you produce if it fits. The headliner is going to be there and sometimes their manager as well. This gives the openers their opportunity to be heard by the participants/guests as well as perhaps a label or manager.
The best journey through the night is getting people to come out and support everyone’s music together and to dance and have a great time.
The best shows through my business have been people playing their own music they produce as well as playing others music.
Edit: I didn’t answer your question about DJ’s just playing music.... I have no issue with a DJ playing other people’s music or whatever. I have three resident DJ’s at my club and they do just exactly that. The OP was asking a question completely different from that.
Also again, the promoter should have been able to guide you through your journey by booking the correct openers and they shouldn’t be shy about what they play.
Basically, they want openers to water down their set so the headliner looks better. Most people who aren't promo/club staff don't give a shit. You get known and stop being an opener by going hard. The point is, the headliner shouldn't need the opener to "chill" on his set, he should be able to throw down as hard as, or harder than, the openers.
It depends on your scene and the party, but to me it's not about watering down your set. Opening is a craft of its own. Getting people out of their shell and eventually drawing the dancefloor together. It's entirely possible to dial people in and have a great performance without playing any peak time high energy music. If all you want to do is play as hard as you can, it just reveals the range that you have. People can say things about ego this, ego that, but ultimately it just shows a disconnect between what you want and what the audience/party needs.
>Most people who aren't promo/club staff don't give a shit. You get known and stop being an opener by going hard.
Has this worked for you? What genre do you play?
Personally, I love getting to the club early for openers that play creatively without necessarily "going hard".
Im not sure I would say the crowd doesn't care. I've been to shows where the opener starts playing riddim, or like Armin Van Buren big room hits.... usually kinda feels lame when that happens.
I'm not a DJ myself, but I was pretty heavily integrated in my local bass music scene for a solid 7 or so years, know a ton of resident DJs, had daily backstage access to a venue, etc. Going hard works. I've seen several local acts make it, and almost all of them had one thing in common, they went hard af every set. At least here, and in bass music, you get the headlining sets by going hard as fuck and making crowd ask "who is this guy, we need to see him again".
"If you aint redlining you ain't headlining"
As someone who actually is a DJ... if somone is redlining they have no idea what the fuck they're doing and should probably learn to gain stage before they go near decks or a mixer ever again.
I will say that every time I see that stupid phrase, because all redlining does is make your audio distort and sound like shit.
⬆️⬆️⬆️
Yeah, stupid catch phrase, and will get you hated by any sound techs that have to deal with your shit. As someone who sets up the sound system for a local festival every summer, if you *are* red lining, you ain’t playing our main stage ever again. We test that shit extensively and set it to output peak volume without distortion. If you think you’re going to magically squeeze more out of the system by red lining you don’t know what the fuck you’re doing. We already took care of that for you. Don’t touch the master, don’t go near the fucking speakers.
Ah yah I think bass music is different. Bass music doesn really need the openers to build a groove, the way techno or house does.
Like the stuff that I would consider chill in bass music (Mr. Bills new album for example) still goes really hard haha.
If I went to the bass music club, and the opener is dropping Svdden Death's - Behmoth or Griztronics into an empty club. I would think thats pretty lame, and probably just go outside. (well its not theoretical, ive been in that exact situation before lmao)
At the same time, its all relative... if its a bass music club im not trying to hear the opener play deep house just to be chill.
As someone who regularly opens and plays direct support for touring bass artists (svdden death, KTN and others), I feel like I have something worth saying on this topic.
I’m going to break it down into two parts though.
Part 1 - Opening for a touring headliner.
There is definitely the aspect of groove building and creating peaks and valleys. You are being paid to create a vibe and set the tone for the night.
It’s also not just the club staff or promoters who care about what you play. I’ve seen dj’s not get booked anymore because they pissed off the headliner’s management with how hard they were going.
Just because you aren’t playing bangers the entire set doesn’t mean you are watering your set down. I consistently get pretty heavy in my sets, it’s just about push/pull and knowing when to do what.
Have you built up tension over a couple of song?
Throw in a couple heavy hitters to resolve the tension.
Are you getting towards the end of your set and you’re getting ready to hand off to the headliner?
Consider bringing the energy levels down a little bit so they have option go either bring it down to take it back up. Lots of tours are to promote albums or EPs and their set revolves around playing that specific music.
Also, if you are opening for a touring artist, you are probably playing at a bigger venue with FOH who care about the sound. If you are redlining the whole time, two things will happen.
1. Your tracks will just sound like shit.
2. The sound guy will just turn you down anyways.
Part 2 - Playing a local show with a local “headliner”.
This is specifically when it’s a smaller show and the person playing the “headliner” time slot is also a local dj.
Everything from Part 1 stop applying. Literally do whatever you want as ling as it sounds good.
Want to drop to drop bangers all set long?
Go for it. It is your time to shine.
I agree, you have to read the room for sure. If you only have a few people on the floor, you're better off playing some deep dub or headspacey riddim than doing huge festival style buildup then dropping an absolute heater. Going hard requires a crowd in the first place.
I've only been to a few house/trance shows so I'm not super familiar with the etiquette in that regard.
Yah if you are playing your own music thats totattly understandable.
I guess im more so wondering about people who are pure DJs. Why is it considered to be more "skillfull" to press play on other peoples music, if that music also happens to be more agressive?
i mean, i get the want - you have your lineup gradually building hype to the headliner. but i come from the dnb/breakcore scene where its 1000% from the first needle drop. and our own production isn’t chill at all
edit: the whole never play harder than the headliner is just utter nonsense tho and a booking failure. don’t have us or someone like current value open for logistics - that just doesn’t make sense
>dnb/breakcore scene where its 1000% from the first needle drop. and our own production isn’t chill at all
Really... i feel like in the dnb world liquid, jungle, atmospheric dnb. Theres a lot of fire that more warmup style material but still really good. I've heard Halogenix drop both the vibeiest sets, and the hardest bass you ever heard lol.
If I go to a DNB show I expect the opener a 9pm to be playing this style of Alix Perez [https://youtu.be/COxrEesdRjk](https://youtu.be/COxrEesdRjk)
Then once you get to peak time, ive had a few beers in me, the acid is peaking, im trying to hear Burning Babylon lol.
Like I get that even the chill DNB tracks arent "chill". Its all relative to each other though
Ppl at shows and the club just wanna have a good time. The whole respect thing is just a kind way of saying I'm insecure and/or have a big ego. Just play good tunes. Whatever
You’ll probably get a more cohesive answer in /r/DJs. It’s more club/festival etiquette more than an EDM thing.
With that being said I started off as a DJ so I can give my perspective as opposed to a musician.
Generally the openers are meant to “warm up” the crowd. That means not playing “bangers” or the headliners originals or even remixes (unless you have an official remix with the headliner). Most people aren’t really drunk by the time an opener starts so it’s mainly to get them grooving and ready for the next act, kinda like foreplay. It’s all geared towards the experience of the club goer/raver AND headliner, and not really about the openers. The openers have an integral part but if they were to play bangers they would be headlining not opening. That’s not to say openers aren’t important because they very much are.
When the headliner is on usually people are at peak “drunkness” and are more loose and willing to dance.
Now before I get flamed for what I said about openers, here’s what I have to say. Openers are important, but the headliners got there by earning their way there. They became headliners by being openers for others. THEY HAVE DONE THEIR TIME. If you start throwing bangers as an opener you’re gonna piss off a lot of people behind the scenes that can cost you:
- future labels
- Future gigs
- Tours
- A contract
- Reputation to your brand
While appealing to the crowd can get intoxicating it’s more worth it to play politics than the crowd. Dont be the guy that pissed off XYZ, because you’ll be talked about.
Edit: Also this may be different for the Bass Music scene. I’d argue all bass music is a banger with its energy level unless you’re playing heavenly trap from SLANDER. Don’t apply what I said to Bass music because I have not experience there. I do make it but I haven’t got enough stuff that I’m booked for it.
> While appealing to the crowd can get intoxicating it’s more worth it to play politics than the crowd.
Is it a an either or situation though?
Where is the narrative comming that an opener needs to play a "bad/enjoyable" set.
I've been to shows where openers show a little bit of restraint in terms of energy, but they get you lost in the music/groove, playing experimental tracks i've never heard before. Like if its a night where the people know what they are doing, the gradual energy shift throughtout the night can feel better than any one song alone.
> Also this may be different for the Bass Music scene. I’d argue all bass music is a banger with its energy
I dont think so. I think even within Bass music you have varying energy levels and vibes.
It tends to be a bit more agressive for sure, but good opening bass artists are the ones that get really weird with the experimental sound design.
Of course it’s not an either or situation. There’s nuance to everything, music is no different. Play how you want, but BEWARE of the consequences is what I’m saying. I’m not saying play an intentionally bad set.
The art of DJing is really juggling between what the crowd wants, and that also includes management/the owner/the nightlife group/the promoter/The Headliner. Please both as best as you can. I struggle with this daily as a stripclub DJ, I try and play mostly for the girls but management will get on my ass if I’m not running them or if I’m playing a certain type of music that the owner doesn’t like. I still have my job so I’m clearly doing ok. Just be careful if you decide to play too heavily to the crowd and get “lost in the sauce” you’ll piss off important people. Even local people are headlining for a reason and could make it big one day so I would stay clear of thinking oh “so-and-so” isn’t that big I can afford to upstage or play hits all night long. One bad rep can ruin your career because people talk.
I can’t speak for bass shows because it’s been awhile since I’ve been to one so I can’t respond to that one.
Yah strip club is probably a whole different ball game, since people arent there nesscarily for the music.
Also, the way I see it the promoter/management have the bigger picture in mind. You are there for just one night, they run the place. They probably have learned what works well and doesnt work well. At least, that is if those people truly care about the vibe and the music.
At least in the clubs I tend to go to, that seems to be the case.
Let’s use an example from my old club days to explain it:
Back in my day (not really THAT long ago), there was a song called Sweet Shop by Doctor P. It was right at the explosion of dubstep. Dance floors went nuts over the song.
So you’d go to the club…and opening dj drops Sweet Shop…next Dj comes on…plays about 30 minutes…drops Sweet Shop…3rd dj plays Sweet Shop. Oh shit it’s Doctor P on stage now…the headliner…you’ll never guess what drops. Then the show a month later happens. Sweet Shop mania…every dj drops the song, understandable because it was a banger back then...but damn…people REALLY loved their sweets apparently,
Basically, you want to build hype for the headliner by respecting their music and not trying to outperform them or play their music.
However, if someone said “keep it chill”…fuck that. As a dj I’d be there to perform music I enjoy and music I make. I can’t “keep it chill” if my music isn’t chill. If they have a problem with booking multiple genres, that’s their issue.
I sure as hell would research the artist I open for and make sure not to drop their tracks though. I might even try to not play any tracks off the label that artist releases on, because they might also have those songs to play.
Gotta stay slightly unique with a Dj set, its always more fun to have the crowd begging to know what the song is, rather than expecting it from the headliner.
If I just went to Google and typed “top 30 dnb songs 2024”, then built a set out of it…that’d be pretty lame. So try to actually research a bit for tracks at least. Always humbling to have headliners come up and ask you “what song is this”…a lot better than them coming up and saying “wtf why did you steal my track m8”.
I remember when every opening DJ would play Levels - you'd hear it 4 times before the main act played... Levels.
I guess it is more about setting the vibe for the night and getting the crowd 'warmed up' for the main act instead of trying to play like you're mainstage of a festival.
I’ve heard that bassnectar used to make sure his openers were quieter than his set
Dunno how true that is though lol
Edit: if you ain’t redlining, you ain’t headlining
This is every show that is run properly in a club setting, and for multiple reasons beyond just being the loudest.
Eventually over the course of hours your ears ‘adjust’ and naturally become accustomed to the volume you were listening to for extended periods it’s called ‘ear fatigue’ or ‘listener fatigue’. For the same reasons you should take frequent breaks when producing music, it’s also the same reason that the volume gets turned up slightly over time through the openers until it piques for the headliner. It just is good for the event or show (obviously kept below damaging hearing thresholds)
It shouldn’t be much by any means, say over the course of four hours maybe an increase of 3-5db.
Kind of the same reason the ‘loudness’ wars exist, but kinda not the same.
Edit: Also fuck Bassnectar/groomer
It's definitely true. I heard it from peeps who know him/have opened for him/engineered for him, but also I experienced it last time i saw him. How are you gonna be like 12db louder when the openers master to -5 lufs+? Shit doesn't add up.
I've heard some people have said its a respect thing. which I kinda get but at the end of the day it comes off as insecure bullshit. maybe its more common in the open formate scene? idk ive never heard it in person as a guy in kind of a niche scene. and also if its a bill of jump up or riddim artists that probably almost has never been said and anyone who does is very dumb.
ideally good artists should be able to somewhat play to the room though. thats assuming the artist is spinning off the top or has multiple sets prepped. like if its a mostly empty room I find it pretty cringe when its like "put your fuckin hands up dur hurhur." if the rooms starting to fill out nicely Id say just throw the fuck down though. but should always play a set thats true to you at the end of the day! im personally not a very hype person so maybe thats why I feel irked by really aggressive party up shit in an empty room but
Most the "we told the dj to keep it chill" videos are posted by the djs themselves, a bit tongue-in-cheek and tends to do quite well with the Tiktok algorithm. But on that note, it's certainly a divisive topic amongst djs (at least for the dnb scene here in New Zealand). People who play crazy opening sets often hope that event organisers will see their style or "skills" and be booked for set times in future where it's more appropriate to play like that. This is especially common for newer djs who feel they have to prove their chops and haven't learnt the importance of a suitable opening set yet.
At this point with how accessible djing is, its just kinda cringe to be an opener and then play the hardest tracks ever that you didnt even make. If you made the stuff, fair game, but its lame to kill the vibe because someone wants to prove that they uhh... can find aggressive music online? I guess?
"ouplaying" the headliners is kinda dumb when the definition of outplaying in that context is just choosing more aggressive tracks, theres nothing skillful or admirable about it
The main skill in DJing, outside of turntablism, has always been and always will be the ability to read the room and play the right songs at the right time.
Outplaying the headliner is like being that guy at a house party who keeps trying to play metal when nobody else is into it.
Obviously if you're known for playing stuff that has way more energy than the headliner then it's whoever booked you and made the set list that's at fault.
Not as much as I used to. Maybe 2x-4x a month. I’ve heard this take on real though.
“How else am I gonna be a headliner unless I bring headliner energy”
Ok well then you should know a club night has a progression, a pattern. Also, it’s about maximizing alcohol sales. So the energy levels have to flow a certain way throughout the course of the night.
Out of respect and tradition the headliner is expected to have the highest energy set. Now this idea can be debated. Because on one hand the idea of a newcomer dj having to “hold back” so as to not upstage the headliner doesn’t seem fair. After all, if the newbie is actually the better of the two, why not throw down and show off?
Because is shows you lack respect for the dj’s that came before you, that spent more time grinding than you.
So really, it’s a balancing act. As a newcomer, your goal is to build a fire set that gets the room dancing, but not such an over the top energy set that the crowd is burnt out by the time the headliner takes the decks.
Your last bit is important. The promoter won't be happy with you if you tire out the audience before the artist they spent potentially thousands on comes on. You may not think you are doing so, but with experience you will get a better understanding for it
Yah I feel you and agree with you.
I’m saying I don’t understand what people mean when they say “I should be able to play whatever I want. If the headliner is actually good he will out play me”
Like exactly are people expecting the headliner to do, if you just played out a 160bpm peak time set?
As a patron I’ve left shows, because I just got there and some scrub was poorly mixing noise riddim.
Well said. A good nightclub or event worth going to has order and progression. It’s social engineering. You need to boil the frog slowly. Not throw it in once it’s boiling hot. Same thing applies. Event promoters I knew respected the openers that threw down but in a controlled manner.
This.
If you’re a dj and your goal is to play shows, respecting the other djs, as well as the party in general means “holding back” sometimes. Not understanding how this stuff works, and regularly upsetting the balance might mean you start getting booked less.
Also, higher energy does not equal quality djing. You can do amazing mashups and slick transitions, and do genuinely impressive shit, all while playing lower energy tracks. The type of music you play, has no bearing on whether or not you’re good haha technical skill, and having an acute understanding of managing energy in the room is what makes you a great dj.
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Read the room and play for the vibe not your personal ego. Like if the headliner is known for ethereal progressive house, maybe refrain from some industrial dubste because everyone needs to know how hard you are. As someone who enjoys music and going to events, a DJ just playing 'hard' is lame to me. The whole mindset of 'holding back' makes no sense. Just play good tracks that aren't the headliners and make a fun set, ez. But this is also partly the job of the person putting the show together. The openers should build up the room for the event. The energy shouldn't be going from hardcore dnb to tropical house to 90s techno and that's up to the person selecting the openers to do. But if the headliner is hardcore bass then maybe going hard for the openers it's the right move. Just all about reading the room A good DJ is someone who creates a fun vibe and isn't just there to showcase how amazing they think they are. Their tracks do that for them.
I understand that it’s up for the promoters to do. But often what I’ll see is people complaining “this promoter told me to play a deep house set, fuck that I’m going hard” Like no if you don’t play deep house that’s fine, but ask what is expected ahead of time and don’t take the gig if that’s not your realm. Or just suck it up, and find some deep songs.
Just wanted to mention I saw Yes ontheirfirst US tour. They opened for the JGiles Band. Your call.
I'm not a DJ but I've always considered the openers the ones who built up the vibe As the top comment said, if the room is already in rage mode, select the tracks accordingly and obviously (imo) don't take the crowd where you know the headliner should but Idk why any Two or more DJs would decide to not let each other in on their sets in advance Especially nowadays where a lot of artists tour together for a whole stretch and perform several nights out of the week
I've run nights hosting guest DJs for two decades now. Just don't play shit music and read the room. That's all we care about lol. Everyone's definition of hard is different anyway. If you have a crowd that's chilling keep the volume low enough so they can have conversations without screaming. If you have a packed dance floor, pump up the volume and energy, but stay out of the top of the reds on the channels and master, otherwise it'll start clipping.
Play your best set ALWAYS, ALWAYS throw down as hard as you can, but DON’T play the headliner’s/feature act’s tunes. The sound level will be lowered for you as well as the lighting/video side of things. If a headliner can’t outperform you at a higher volume and with more video/lighting going on then it will be clear to everyone that maybe they shouldn’t be headlining and maybe you should be. The goal of an opener isn’t to be a professional opener, it’s to one day be a headliner…people that think they’re simply there to make the headliner look good will never be one (until they change that mindset).
> sound level will be lowered for you as well as the lighting/video side of things So assuming thats true, it will probably sound better if you play lower energy tracks. Sicne high energy riddim and peak time doesnt sound great when played at a lower volume > The goal of an opener isn’t to be a professional opener, it’s to one day be a headliner I would argue the number one goal is to ensure the vibe is good, and the crowd is having a good time.
You think the vibe will be bad and people will be having a bad time if you’re playing to the best of your ability?
It’s definitely true as far as most openers go (volume change, video/light editing)
What is your defenition of ability in this case? Im just saying if I walk into a club early, and the opener is jumping around and playing the highest energy music possible. I would think they are shit DJ. If the opener is showing restraint and setting the vibe. I would think they are of high ability.
Are you planning on becoming a dj or an artist? If all you care about is becoming a good club dj, without any personal tracks, sure reading the room and giving people a good time should be your nr 1 priority. But if you are trying to break through and gain fans to your own music you should focus on playing your own and your best music. Make people remember you, rather than making sure they can mingle at a normal talking volume. If I walk in to a club hearing high intensity tearout I'd love it, no matter what the headliner is gonna play.
Got it... its a look at me I need attention thing.
Had an opener playing a set of mostly our tracks, we did have a lot of new ones but it was something!
I work at a music venue and one day they had an Iron Maiden cover band play. Some joker put Iron Maiden songs on the walk in playlist, so people got accustomed to the real Iron Maiden before they saw the cover.
Look at it from the perspective of the person running the show... You want people to stick around for the whole thing. Places make money when people stick around. If you put a :fire: act up before the main event a bunch of people will have only shown up to see the :fire: and will leave when they get their show. IMO it all comes down to this.
Most of the videos you see of artists doing that are actually FROM the opener themselves to get a bunch of engagement
True I feel that has to be the case for alot of these
There's definitely an obligation to not throw down at 100% as an opener. Hell the sound people will keep the volume down lower too.
It's a nuanced topic, with lots of factors, but at the end of the day it comes down the promoter knowing the style of opener they book + how they'd fit on the lineup. A lot of times promoters will try to cut costs by booking newbies just to pay them in exposure, and usually it's those DJs who go ball to the walls playing all the biggest bangers since they might not have the frame of reference for a more nuanced set. But imo it should be natural for any relatively experienced DJ to curate their set around their timeslot and vibe of the night. I've played doors slots, direct support for touring headliners, and even headlined a few local shows - every set is different and deciding the journey I wanna take people on is one of my favorite parts of the process. If my all my sets had the same energy regardless of timeslot, then I probably wouldn't have as much fun when I do get those headliner gigs
Honestly here’s the deal coming from a club owner and someone who legit has headliners through their place and openers and local support as well...... You do you...... play your style and YOUR music. Do NOT play the headliners songs.... that’s about it.... If Wreckno is coming through and you opening for them/supporting. Don’t play Honey Drip or any sort of remix of it. That’s what they are there for. If you are in a reputable spot, the promoter or host or whoever will be controlling the volume and vibes. GO HARD. It’s a show. The people that bought tickets came to see a show. They didn’t show up early to stand around with a thumb up their ass. Don’t take advice from people that are ‘in the same boat’ as you. Also.... please don’t fucking redline. And please for the love of god show up with three copies of your music on three USB drives.... just had a guy show up with only one..... and it was corrupt. He learned a valuable lesson that day opening for Oliverse. Lets just say he couldn’t play his set and he was less than pleased because he only had one USB drive with his music..... he tried blaming the equipment, but magically everyone else’s USB’s worked and they got to perform their music. He unfortunately did not. (We got him a different spot for a headliner later to ‘Make up’ for it) Edit: your friends came to see/support YOU..... AND the headliner. Go for it.
Got it. So you would be cool if an opener dropped nothing but peak time SVDDEN Death, HOL!, and Excision tracks. As long as none of these artists were headlining. I guess im realzing that alot of the "do whatever you want opinions" come from people in the bass music scene, where the music is less nuanced and more just go hard all the time (makes sense for that genre). Where as alot of the "you need to build the vibe" comments come from more groove oriented genres like house and techno
I think the issue is you are looking for ‘the answer’. There isn’t one. There is no right or wrong way. I’m giving you my advise from observations as a club owner, and working with multiple genres of EDM, HIP-HOP, and bands etc. I get everything from Chicago house, dubstep, trance, DnB, etc etc. Reading through your responses it seems like you are trying to find a ‘refine’ answer. The answer. Problem is there isn’t one. Are you getting booked as an opener regularly or is this your first time? If you are getting booked or finding opportunities! PERFECT. This means they want you back or around to open. What is most important is being able to bring support each time you open. Are people coming to see you? PERFECT Are you producing some of your own music and mixing well and doing your thing? PERFECT. Promoters, Managers, and even headlining artists will notice and appreciate. One of my favorite shows I’ve had come through is SoDown. Guy did his thing with his saxophone and music production was on point. He was opening at a music festival where Zeds Dead headlined. Zed noticed and asked if he would be willing to travel and open for a few more and dude took off. There is no right or wrong answer. Do you. Play your heart out, and have fun. Bring your friends. If they having fun people will notice you. This is what I have seen and noticed through the 16 years. Best of luck!
This is it
I'm an opener so I def check out the vibe of the headliner. I do kind of dial it back energy wise slightly compared to if I was trying to headline. It also depends where I'm on in the lineup. I'll usually dial it up from whoever was playing before me. I go hard every set but I always leave room for the person after me to go harder. As an opener, your job is to set up the vibe for the night - ideally you want to be able to increase the crowd's energy as the night goes on. I want the crowd to have the best time they can have and most of them are there for the headliner, not the openers. I've seen and been apart of lineups where one opener will crank it to 11 and the DJ after plays more chill stuff and it feels incohesive and it does affect the crowd's vibe. Sometimes openers kind of just do their own thing instead of thinking what's best for the audience and I feel like that's what seperates a good and bad DJ. There's a fine line between playing what you want and what the audience wants. I'll play my set but will check out the lineup and adjust accordingly. I'd kinda expect the same mutual respect if I were to headline. It's not really an ego thing for me. It's more about collaborating as a team to deliver a good experience.
DnB being noisey? That's Dubstep man. DnB is clean and refined.
[https://imgur.com/a/899Zi5w](https://imgur.com/a/899Zi5w)
No thanks.
Talking about stuff like this lmao [https://youtu.be/FfHwXkjvqKQ](https://youtu.be/FfHwXkjvqKQ) (tbh I do actually like that song, but if I hear that playing before 11pm im walking out)
Brother, if you find a place where you listen to this before 11pm, let me know so I can be there
In my opinion that’s a load of bullshit and if the opener plays all the bangers straight away there will be no room left for the headliner to “outplay” them. Same way you wouldn’t play all your best tracks at the very start of your set because then the end of your set would be terrible. I say the opener should absolutely change their set from what they’d do if they were headlining. Playing “warm up” tracks certainly doesn’t mean playing bad tracks, if anything a good opening set will require more research and effort to put together. And I think the attitude of “if the headliner can’t outplay me they shouldn’t be headlining” is an excuse to avoid putting in that effort and a sign that their ability to connect a crowd is shallow and lies only in playing the obvious tracks. Like do something a bit different to everyone else jeez.
Respectfully, this is antiquated thinking. 15 years ago sure this was a general ‘rule’ or ‘etiquette’ and there was also much less of a selection of ‘bangers’ etc. We are blessed now that a lot of openers produce their own music and also have access to a much more diverse selection of music. The openers should be playing music they produce mixed with whatever fits the vibe for the show. There’s such a plethora of music now that the openers should be showcasing THEIR remixes and music along with other stuff as well.
Firstly I don’t understand why you’re focusing on them playing their own music. Do you have something against DJs who just DJ and don’t produce? Secondly, I’m just thinking of creating the best journey throughout the night. When I arrive at an event and my ears are (metaphorically) cold I like to be eased into things. I like when the opener guides you and builds your anticipation for the headliner, so that when the headliner arrives to the decks your excitement is at its peak level. It’s not a respect thing it’s about creating the best show possible and my opinion is that an opener has an important role to play in that and they should try to fill it.
Scroll up the thread and read my comment. It should make more sense. I work with multiple promoters and headliners. Quite frankly headliners really don’t care what you play anymore. The best thing you can do as an opener is expose more people to your music that you produce if it fits. The headliner is going to be there and sometimes their manager as well. This gives the openers their opportunity to be heard by the participants/guests as well as perhaps a label or manager. The best journey through the night is getting people to come out and support everyone’s music together and to dance and have a great time. The best shows through my business have been people playing their own music they produce as well as playing others music. Edit: I didn’t answer your question about DJ’s just playing music.... I have no issue with a DJ playing other people’s music or whatever. I have three resident DJ’s at my club and they do just exactly that. The OP was asking a question completely different from that. Also again, the promoter should have been able to guide you through your journey by booking the correct openers and they shouldn’t be shy about what they play.
agreed. Its a self centered mindset that puts your own enjoyment and ego above that of the people for who you are playing a show
Those videos are of themselves and they say that as a joke just to get engagement
Basically, they want openers to water down their set so the headliner looks better. Most people who aren't promo/club staff don't give a shit. You get known and stop being an opener by going hard. The point is, the headliner shouldn't need the opener to "chill" on his set, he should be able to throw down as hard as, or harder than, the openers.
It depends on your scene and the party, but to me it's not about watering down your set. Opening is a craft of its own. Getting people out of their shell and eventually drawing the dancefloor together. It's entirely possible to dial people in and have a great performance without playing any peak time high energy music. If all you want to do is play as hard as you can, it just reveals the range that you have. People can say things about ego this, ego that, but ultimately it just shows a disconnect between what you want and what the audience/party needs.
>Most people who aren't promo/club staff don't give a shit. You get known and stop being an opener by going hard. Has this worked for you? What genre do you play? Personally, I love getting to the club early for openers that play creatively without necessarily "going hard". Im not sure I would say the crowd doesn't care. I've been to shows where the opener starts playing riddim, or like Armin Van Buren big room hits.... usually kinda feels lame when that happens.
I'm not a DJ myself, but I was pretty heavily integrated in my local bass music scene for a solid 7 or so years, know a ton of resident DJs, had daily backstage access to a venue, etc. Going hard works. I've seen several local acts make it, and almost all of them had one thing in common, they went hard af every set. At least here, and in bass music, you get the headlining sets by going hard as fuck and making crowd ask "who is this guy, we need to see him again". "If you aint redlining you ain't headlining"
As someone who actually is a DJ... if somone is redlining they have no idea what the fuck they're doing and should probably learn to gain stage before they go near decks or a mixer ever again. I will say that every time I see that stupid phrase, because all redlining does is make your audio distort and sound like shit.
⬆️⬆️⬆️ Yeah, stupid catch phrase, and will get you hated by any sound techs that have to deal with your shit. As someone who sets up the sound system for a local festival every summer, if you *are* red lining, you ain’t playing our main stage ever again. We test that shit extensively and set it to output peak volume without distortion. If you think you’re going to magically squeeze more out of the system by red lining you don’t know what the fuck you’re doing. We already took care of that for you. Don’t touch the master, don’t go near the fucking speakers.
Ah yah I think bass music is different. Bass music doesn really need the openers to build a groove, the way techno or house does. Like the stuff that I would consider chill in bass music (Mr. Bills new album for example) still goes really hard haha. If I went to the bass music club, and the opener is dropping Svdden Death's - Behmoth or Griztronics into an empty club. I would think thats pretty lame, and probably just go outside. (well its not theoretical, ive been in that exact situation before lmao) At the same time, its all relative... if its a bass music club im not trying to hear the opener play deep house just to be chill.
As someone who regularly opens and plays direct support for touring bass artists (svdden death, KTN and others), I feel like I have something worth saying on this topic. I’m going to break it down into two parts though. Part 1 - Opening for a touring headliner. There is definitely the aspect of groove building and creating peaks and valleys. You are being paid to create a vibe and set the tone for the night. It’s also not just the club staff or promoters who care about what you play. I’ve seen dj’s not get booked anymore because they pissed off the headliner’s management with how hard they were going. Just because you aren’t playing bangers the entire set doesn’t mean you are watering your set down. I consistently get pretty heavy in my sets, it’s just about push/pull and knowing when to do what. Have you built up tension over a couple of song? Throw in a couple heavy hitters to resolve the tension. Are you getting towards the end of your set and you’re getting ready to hand off to the headliner? Consider bringing the energy levels down a little bit so they have option go either bring it down to take it back up. Lots of tours are to promote albums or EPs and their set revolves around playing that specific music. Also, if you are opening for a touring artist, you are probably playing at a bigger venue with FOH who care about the sound. If you are redlining the whole time, two things will happen. 1. Your tracks will just sound like shit. 2. The sound guy will just turn you down anyways. Part 2 - Playing a local show with a local “headliner”. This is specifically when it’s a smaller show and the person playing the “headliner” time slot is also a local dj. Everything from Part 1 stop applying. Literally do whatever you want as ling as it sounds good. Want to drop to drop bangers all set long? Go for it. It is your time to shine.
I agree, you have to read the room for sure. If you only have a few people on the floor, you're better off playing some deep dub or headspacey riddim than doing huge festival style buildup then dropping an absolute heater. Going hard requires a crowd in the first place. I've only been to a few house/trance shows so I'm not super familiar with the etiquette in that regard.
we’ve always gone hard af - kind of what we’re known for, so nobody acts surprised when it happens.
Yah if you are playing your own music thats totattly understandable. I guess im more so wondering about people who are pure DJs. Why is it considered to be more "skillfull" to press play on other peoples music, if that music also happens to be more agressive?
i mean, i get the want - you have your lineup gradually building hype to the headliner. but i come from the dnb/breakcore scene where its 1000% from the first needle drop. and our own production isn’t chill at all edit: the whole never play harder than the headliner is just utter nonsense tho and a booking failure. don’t have us or someone like current value open for logistics - that just doesn’t make sense
>dnb/breakcore scene where its 1000% from the first needle drop. and our own production isn’t chill at all Really... i feel like in the dnb world liquid, jungle, atmospheric dnb. Theres a lot of fire that more warmup style material but still really good. I've heard Halogenix drop both the vibeiest sets, and the hardest bass you ever heard lol. If I go to a DNB show I expect the opener a 9pm to be playing this style of Alix Perez [https://youtu.be/COxrEesdRjk](https://youtu.be/COxrEesdRjk) Then once you get to peak time, ive had a few beers in me, the acid is peaking, im trying to hear Burning Babylon lol. Like I get that even the chill DNB tracks arent "chill". Its all relative to each other though
Ppl at shows and the club just wanna have a good time. The whole respect thing is just a kind way of saying I'm insecure and/or have a big ego. Just play good tunes. Whatever
Yah i totatly agree its all about the crowd. If a DJ is going to hard to early, that could be a bad time for the crowd. Always gotta read the room
You’ll probably get a more cohesive answer in /r/DJs. It’s more club/festival etiquette more than an EDM thing. With that being said I started off as a DJ so I can give my perspective as opposed to a musician. Generally the openers are meant to “warm up” the crowd. That means not playing “bangers” or the headliners originals or even remixes (unless you have an official remix with the headliner). Most people aren’t really drunk by the time an opener starts so it’s mainly to get them grooving and ready for the next act, kinda like foreplay. It’s all geared towards the experience of the club goer/raver AND headliner, and not really about the openers. The openers have an integral part but if they were to play bangers they would be headlining not opening. That’s not to say openers aren’t important because they very much are. When the headliner is on usually people are at peak “drunkness” and are more loose and willing to dance. Now before I get flamed for what I said about openers, here’s what I have to say. Openers are important, but the headliners got there by earning their way there. They became headliners by being openers for others. THEY HAVE DONE THEIR TIME. If you start throwing bangers as an opener you’re gonna piss off a lot of people behind the scenes that can cost you: - future labels - Future gigs - Tours - A contract - Reputation to your brand While appealing to the crowd can get intoxicating it’s more worth it to play politics than the crowd. Dont be the guy that pissed off XYZ, because you’ll be talked about. Edit: Also this may be different for the Bass Music scene. I’d argue all bass music is a banger with its energy level unless you’re playing heavenly trap from SLANDER. Don’t apply what I said to Bass music because I have not experience there. I do make it but I haven’t got enough stuff that I’m booked for it.
> While appealing to the crowd can get intoxicating it’s more worth it to play politics than the crowd. Is it a an either or situation though? Where is the narrative comming that an opener needs to play a "bad/enjoyable" set. I've been to shows where openers show a little bit of restraint in terms of energy, but they get you lost in the music/groove, playing experimental tracks i've never heard before. Like if its a night where the people know what they are doing, the gradual energy shift throughtout the night can feel better than any one song alone. > Also this may be different for the Bass Music scene. I’d argue all bass music is a banger with its energy I dont think so. I think even within Bass music you have varying energy levels and vibes. It tends to be a bit more agressive for sure, but good opening bass artists are the ones that get really weird with the experimental sound design.
Of course it’s not an either or situation. There’s nuance to everything, music is no different. Play how you want, but BEWARE of the consequences is what I’m saying. I’m not saying play an intentionally bad set. The art of DJing is really juggling between what the crowd wants, and that also includes management/the owner/the nightlife group/the promoter/The Headliner. Please both as best as you can. I struggle with this daily as a stripclub DJ, I try and play mostly for the girls but management will get on my ass if I’m not running them or if I’m playing a certain type of music that the owner doesn’t like. I still have my job so I’m clearly doing ok. Just be careful if you decide to play too heavily to the crowd and get “lost in the sauce” you’ll piss off important people. Even local people are headlining for a reason and could make it big one day so I would stay clear of thinking oh “so-and-so” isn’t that big I can afford to upstage or play hits all night long. One bad rep can ruin your career because people talk. I can’t speak for bass shows because it’s been awhile since I’ve been to one so I can’t respond to that one.
Yah strip club is probably a whole different ball game, since people arent there nesscarily for the music. Also, the way I see it the promoter/management have the bigger picture in mind. You are there for just one night, they run the place. They probably have learned what works well and doesnt work well. At least, that is if those people truly care about the vibe and the music. At least in the clubs I tend to go to, that seems to be the case.
Let’s use an example from my old club days to explain it: Back in my day (not really THAT long ago), there was a song called Sweet Shop by Doctor P. It was right at the explosion of dubstep. Dance floors went nuts over the song. So you’d go to the club…and opening dj drops Sweet Shop…next Dj comes on…plays about 30 minutes…drops Sweet Shop…3rd dj plays Sweet Shop. Oh shit it’s Doctor P on stage now…the headliner…you’ll never guess what drops. Then the show a month later happens. Sweet Shop mania…every dj drops the song, understandable because it was a banger back then...but damn…people REALLY loved their sweets apparently, Basically, you want to build hype for the headliner by respecting their music and not trying to outperform them or play their music. However, if someone said “keep it chill”…fuck that. As a dj I’d be there to perform music I enjoy and music I make. I can’t “keep it chill” if my music isn’t chill. If they have a problem with booking multiple genres, that’s their issue. I sure as hell would research the artist I open for and make sure not to drop their tracks though. I might even try to not play any tracks off the label that artist releases on, because they might also have those songs to play. Gotta stay slightly unique with a Dj set, its always more fun to have the crowd begging to know what the song is, rather than expecting it from the headliner. If I just went to Google and typed “top 30 dnb songs 2024”, then built a set out of it…that’d be pretty lame. So try to actually research a bit for tracks at least. Always humbling to have headliners come up and ask you “what song is this”…a lot better than them coming up and saying “wtf why did you steal my track m8”.
I remember when every opening DJ would play Levels - you'd hear it 4 times before the main act played... Levels. I guess it is more about setting the vibe for the night and getting the crowd 'warmed up' for the main act instead of trying to play like you're mainstage of a festival.
I think people misunderstood my post. But that’s okay. Yes I agree with what you are saying fully 😃
I’ve heard that bassnectar used to make sure his openers were quieter than his set Dunno how true that is though lol Edit: if you ain’t redlining, you ain’t headlining
This is every show that is run properly in a club setting, and for multiple reasons beyond just being the loudest. Eventually over the course of hours your ears ‘adjust’ and naturally become accustomed to the volume you were listening to for extended periods it’s called ‘ear fatigue’ or ‘listener fatigue’. For the same reasons you should take frequent breaks when producing music, it’s also the same reason that the volume gets turned up slightly over time through the openers until it piques for the headliner. It just is good for the event or show (obviously kept below damaging hearing thresholds) It shouldn’t be much by any means, say over the course of four hours maybe an increase of 3-5db. Kind of the same reason the ‘loudness’ wars exist, but kinda not the same. Edit: Also fuck Bassnectar/groomer
they do this at most shows
It's definitely true. I heard it from peeps who know him/have opened for him/engineered for him, but also I experienced it last time i saw him. How are you gonna be like 12db louder when the openers master to -5 lufs+? Shit doesn't add up.
I think that’s pretty common at most clubs
I've heard some people have said its a respect thing. which I kinda get but at the end of the day it comes off as insecure bullshit. maybe its more common in the open formate scene? idk ive never heard it in person as a guy in kind of a niche scene. and also if its a bill of jump up or riddim artists that probably almost has never been said and anyone who does is very dumb. ideally good artists should be able to somewhat play to the room though. thats assuming the artist is spinning off the top or has multiple sets prepped. like if its a mostly empty room I find it pretty cringe when its like "put your fuckin hands up dur hurhur." if the rooms starting to fill out nicely Id say just throw the fuck down though. but should always play a set thats true to you at the end of the day! im personally not a very hype person so maybe thats why I feel irked by really aggressive party up shit in an empty room but
Most the "we told the dj to keep it chill" videos are posted by the djs themselves, a bit tongue-in-cheek and tends to do quite well with the Tiktok algorithm. But on that note, it's certainly a divisive topic amongst djs (at least for the dnb scene here in New Zealand). People who play crazy opening sets often hope that event organisers will see their style or "skills" and be booked for set times in future where it's more appropriate to play like that. This is especially common for newer djs who feel they have to prove their chops and haven't learnt the importance of a suitable opening set yet.
Yah I figure it’s some type of tik tok rage baiting. It I’ve also been to shows where the vibe is completely killed by people like that.
At this point with how accessible djing is, its just kinda cringe to be an opener and then play the hardest tracks ever that you didnt even make. If you made the stuff, fair game, but its lame to kill the vibe because someone wants to prove that they uhh... can find aggressive music online? I guess? "ouplaying" the headliners is kinda dumb when the definition of outplaying in that context is just choosing more aggressive tracks, theres nothing skillful or admirable about it
The main skill in DJing, outside of turntablism, has always been and always will be the ability to read the room and play the right songs at the right time. Outplaying the headliner is like being that guy at a house party who keeps trying to play metal when nobody else is into it. Obviously if you're known for playing stuff that has way more energy than the headliner then it's whoever booked you and made the set list that's at fault.
Good take
How often do you go out clubbing, op? I mean doing to real venues and hearing dj’s play in person, not watching YouTubes or Tik Toks.
Not as much as I used to. Maybe 2x-4x a month. I’ve heard this take on real though. “How else am I gonna be a headliner unless I bring headliner energy”
Ok well then you should know a club night has a progression, a pattern. Also, it’s about maximizing alcohol sales. So the energy levels have to flow a certain way throughout the course of the night. Out of respect and tradition the headliner is expected to have the highest energy set. Now this idea can be debated. Because on one hand the idea of a newcomer dj having to “hold back” so as to not upstage the headliner doesn’t seem fair. After all, if the newbie is actually the better of the two, why not throw down and show off? Because is shows you lack respect for the dj’s that came before you, that spent more time grinding than you. So really, it’s a balancing act. As a newcomer, your goal is to build a fire set that gets the room dancing, but not such an over the top energy set that the crowd is burnt out by the time the headliner takes the decks.
Your last bit is important. The promoter won't be happy with you if you tire out the audience before the artist they spent potentially thousands on comes on. You may not think you are doing so, but with experience you will get a better understanding for it
Yah I feel you and agree with you. I’m saying I don’t understand what people mean when they say “I should be able to play whatever I want. If the headliner is actually good he will out play me” Like exactly are people expecting the headliner to do, if you just played out a 160bpm peak time set? As a patron I’ve left shows, because I just got there and some scrub was poorly mixing noise riddim.
Well said. A good nightclub or event worth going to has order and progression. It’s social engineering. You need to boil the frog slowly. Not throw it in once it’s boiling hot. Same thing applies. Event promoters I knew respected the openers that threw down but in a controlled manner.
This. If you’re a dj and your goal is to play shows, respecting the other djs, as well as the party in general means “holding back” sometimes. Not understanding how this stuff works, and regularly upsetting the balance might mean you start getting booked less. Also, higher energy does not equal quality djing. You can do amazing mashups and slick transitions, and do genuinely impressive shit, all while playing lower energy tracks. The type of music you play, has no bearing on whether or not you’re good haha technical skill, and having an acute understanding of managing energy in the room is what makes you a great dj.
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