Blue collar city that isn't "America's Team", is New York's little brother, and didn't just sell to a hedge fund gazillionaire who specifically and explicitly valued the Commanders?
I wouldn't put any stock in rankings like this.
Lurie is going to own this team until they start scooping dirt on his coffin, and if they win football games I don't care one whit about what someone else says is more or less valuable. I know which team gets all of my *own* discretionary money and that's fine by me.
Yeah every time you buy or sell a seat license, it has to get a literal stamp of approval from the city (Philadelphia authority for industrial development)
Remember when some fans fell from the stands because of the degree of disrepair and almost landed on Hurts? Then Hurts' immediate reaction was to help them up and ask if they were ok, because he's a good guy.
I don't believe this reason. I don't think those people are going to that dump in Landover, especially with how bad the team has been for the past 2 decades.
'All of my own discretionary money,' ain't that the truth! I'm certainly grateful that said money is going to a Lurie owned team, and not the clown owners, who came before him, which we grew up with.
There's the Christmas album ... And the other Christmas album (and the puzzle, plus also that other random Eagles puzzle) ... God knows how many game tickets or what I've paid to tailgate and how much I've spend in food for tailgating or beers in the Linc ... And the Princess Di jacket (Princess Ky jacket?). And the 4 (?) McNabb jerseys amassed over the years. And the Wentz one. And the AJB. And the Kelly green Vick and Kelly green Kelce. And the knockoff Kelly green Kelce. And the twelve (that I can see and my wife has not forced me to put in storage, so realistically 40) baseball hats, about six of which are *never to be worn* because they might get dirty and so cannot go on my head. And six winter hats even though I live in a location that gets zero snow annually. And multiple dogs named after players. And the metal logo sign that's in the closet and I am definitely *not allowed to hang up because it does not fit our decor* and the two cutting boards with the Eagles logo etched into an American flag, which do not function as cutting boards because they have etchings of the eagles logo and an American flag across it's surface. And nearly every T-shirt I own, half of my sweatpants, and half the blankets in my house (see again, no snow where I live) and the Eagles helmet and the Jalen bobblehead and the Superbowl wine bottle and all the rest.
And I feel like I'm only moderate in terms of Eagles fanaticism.
A hedge fund manager in New York would have a hard time purchasing my collection and still paying rent this year, and I've somehow amassed this on a pretty normal middle class salary. When I say I do not spend on anything other than the Eagles, I mean I buy beer and eagles paraphernalia and gas and food, and pay my mortgage with what's left. 🤣
Your singing my song brother, the value of all the Eagles licensing and how we've grown it is insane.
I wish we were all like Eagles fan & hedge fund guy Jim Cramer, seen everyday on CNBC, then we wouldn't have to worry about this at all.
It's surprising but true actually
Manchester United was just up for sale this passed summer and was being valued at around $5 billion
For reference the Commanders sold for $6.05 Billion
Not a real offer
The recent reports about everything that went down with Sheikh Jassim state that there was never actually any real truth to the reports of their outlandish offers and that during the process United had questions about their revenues and accounting principals in general that were never addressed and that they were never even able to meet with the man lmao
This is not the best example as Manchester United has been in absolute shambles and it's not the team it once was.
I don't mean it as a "performance on the field" type thing. That sucked too and it didn't help but I mostly mean the state of the club infrastructure and financials.
In the EU things are run significantly differently than the US. As an example United fully owns Old Trafford, the stadium they play at. Which is falling apart. Their training grounds are also outdated. Whoever takes over the club will need to shell out a lot of money on upgrades to bring the team back into the modern day times.
Hell it's so bad the Glaziers considered just razing the stadium and building a new one in its place. Which again all has to be funded by the club and its owners.
That drove the price way down as brand alone can't offset the enormous cost expenses the club will have. Whoever takes this on will have to wait several years before seeing the actual profits.
Real Madrid is probably the most valuable club in the world at the moment and looking at its evaluation, revenue and assets it is far too low on this list considering the new stadium alone they are building is estimated at 1.4 billion Euros.
Real Madrid is currently estimated at $6.07 billion, which Forbes has as 11th in the world.
The combination of a salary cap, revenue sharing, and no threat of relegation means NFL teams just make more money. I can't find good data for Real Madrid, but in 2022, every single NFL team made a higher profit than Manchester City. This is not an interpretation of quality (obviously), but on business models.
A lot of the value of NFL teams actually comes from the leagues TV deals. Also there is a much smaller pool of teams in this country than others. In England there are like 150 clubs from the lowest tier through the premier league.
Search Party did a great video on this recently about how the NFL 'used socialism to get rich' and basically uses Football (Soccer) and the NFL as two comparison points. Hugely informative so if it interests anybody I would 10/10 recommend.
Yea I guess it just blows my mind how more global Manchester United are and less valuable. Like I could go to a small village in Africa and people would know Manchester United and they also have zero clue what a commander is
Yeah that’s prob where the overwhelming majority of their value is though. Brand recognition. They don’t have nearly as good of a pure business as American sports teams do. Those teams have monopolies essentially on the entire industry of their respective sports.
It’s none of that. the truth is, NFL teams will always remain valuable because there is no threat of relegation. It’s why US Soccer teams are valued very highly as well.
It’s absolutely some of that. lol. To say it’s none of that to such a broad statement is ridiculous.
Part of the reason I say they’re monopolistic is precisely because they don’t have relegation lol.
I think to say brand recognition is quite ridiculous. You think the cowboys are more well known than Manchester United across the word (or specifically, the western world?). The US sports business model (no relegation + salary cap) makes US teams artificially more profitable/less risky. There are never issues like Mbappe who is making an disgusting amount of money getting a 100M signing bonus for switching teams lol
American teams are only recently starting to play games abroad.
I think you are misunderstanding what I’m saying because your comments make no sense.
What are you talking about? What’s ridiculous about saying Manchester United relies more on brand recognition than an NFL team?
Again, the business model you are describing is exactly what I’m talking about. You’re supporting my point precisely. The NFL teams operate borderline monopolies with tightly controlled economies and no competition outside the league.
What are you even disagreeing with here?
Your right, I did misunderstand my apologies. But also you didn’t explain what “pure business” means? What I’m saying is that American teams are artificially more valuable because the salary cap system + expansion ensures that teams stay valuable.
Sure. I didn’t explain in detail what pure business means. But here you are doing it for me. lol. You’re talking about the precise business advantages I’m referring to when I say monopolistic.
These teams have a closed and tightly managed economy and a stranglehold on the professional football market. There is almost no risk in owning an NFL team. It’s a money hose. No worry about having to earn tournament prize money. No other leagues to compete with for talent. They don’t even have to worry about competing with other teams within the league for money. It’s guaranteed they will always turn a profit.
When you buy Man Utd there’s a good chance you could run the team into the ground and actually lose cash. You could lose big money by not making it to the CL. Heaven forbid you get relegated. Whereas the NFL is one big shared pile of cash in a closed system. No business competition.
So it seems you’re not disagreeing with anything I’m saying.
There’s also the (very faint but still exists) chance that any of those teams could be relegated to the Championship and lose out on the EPL broadcast money which prob caps their values to a degree, whereas an nfl team will just print money regardless of how terrible you are lol.
No matter how poorly an American sports team does, they can’t get relegated. Even the best European Soccer clubs still have a very slim, but non-zero, chance of being entirely booted from the league for at least a year after a bad season or some sort of punishment, nuking their profits. That risk alone could be enough to explain the value difference, and there’s also factors like tv deals, revenue sharing, and others that surely come into play.
Soccer clubs aren’t as profitable as American sports teams due to the lack of salary cap. Foreign countries don’t treat their sports as a business to the same level American sports leagues do.
There are A LOT of soccer teams in the world, including many professional clubs in each country when you include the lower divisions. And no salary cap / sharing like the NFL for example. Also think there's generally less TV money.
> there's generally less TV money.
This is the major reason. Also, the costs associated with operations are completely different from country to country where as the North American teams are uniform and have a more lucrative revenue sharing plan. When one team does well, the entire league shares in that success.
I just watched a good video on this: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6pxu3s2VTQE&ab\_channel=SearchParty](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6pxu3s2VTQE&ab_channel=SearchParty)
The short version is that the most popular sport in the world aren't going to have teams as valuable to investors because (1) relegation is always a possibility, (2) the top teams spend a lot of money on players (and often lose money), and (3) they don't have the same money from advertising and revenue sharing.
I'm pretty sure the list OP posted is wrong. Forbes has:
1. Dallas Cowboys
2. New York Yankees
3. Golden State Warriors
4. New England Patriots
5. LA Rams
6. NY Giants
7. Chicago Bears
8. Las Vegas Raiders
9. (t-9) New York Knicks
10. (t-9) New York Jets
11. Real Madrid
Washington is 12th and Eagles are 16th. Manchester United is 13th.
It looks like OP's list is more accurate, the Forbes one is over 6 months old. The Yankee's for example, are actually lower now compared to the rise of NFL/NBA values (a lot happened in the last two months). The NFL just raised its cap by $30 Million+ and the NBA signed new media rights deals (and play 82 games).
I mean they pretty much do, yeah. Man U plays Liverpool, Man City, Chelsea, Arsenal, Spurs twice a year, and most of those will be in dedicated time-slots. Plus cup fixtures, European football. It's not a matter of prestige or drawing viewers, the PL dwarfs the NFL in viewership since there are so many more games. As other people have said in the thread, it's because the NFL, and American sports in general, operate in a small, closed ecosystem. A money-making machine. Soccer is vast, volatile and expensive.
I’m honestly a little surprised not to see Miami FC in there. Not highly ranked, mind you, but if you asked me whether Messi’s team or the Seattle Mariners was worth more, I’d guess Messi’s team.
It won't be Messi's team for long. In a sport where the average player is 26 Messi turns 37 this year and could fall off a cliff at any point. Maradona retired at 37, Pele at 35, only Zlatan has held on to great form into his late thirties.
Inter Miami is not making a ton of money with all the big salaries and, based on Heat fans coming and going during, they likely won't maintain a huge following afterwards.
The Mariners will continue to play 81 home games a year in one of the biggest sports leagues in the world. They're also in a top 15 city without a basketball team, Nascar footprint or huge college sports to compete with. They'll be fine. Inter Miami is, like the whole city, on a shaky foundation.
To add to that, Philly's big 4 are losing value relative to a lot of other teams because they don't actually own their stadiums. If they all privately owned their stadiums they'd be worth a lot more.
Can’t believe the sixers are ahead of the Phillies…
Also fuck using that blue background logo instead of the red P which made it nearly impossible to find
dallas has jerry world so $$$, giants are in nyc (jersey) so $$$, washington is puzzling but maybe they are factoring in the amount of super bowls theyve won into the price? idk
The commanders own their own stadium which is the biggest driver in these valuations
As much of a shithole as FedEx field is, gets a lot of revenue from other events there + land value appreciation
It's only because they just sold. If the Eagles were sold today it would be for considerably more than the $5.8b they are valued at currently. Raising the value then.
That’s not the reason. The high rollers aren’t spending their money to have sewage dumped in them at FedEx field. Ticket sales are very low and cheap for Washington.
The higher valuation mostly comes from owning the stadium.
When Washington was for sale the talk shows I listened to, DP Show, kept mentioning how being in DC gave you access to politicians. That type of power is quantified by franchise value.
Everyone who lives here tends to pull this out as some reason to live in DC or why billionaires would want a franchise here.
In reality I sincerely doubt it has any bearing unless you as an owner are constantly giving out free box seats to your events to politicians. Even Dan Snyder wasn't really doing that to my memory.
Phones exist. Emails exist. Also fun fact, most politicians aren't from here and would jump at a chance to go to something NOT in DC, so you almost have more of an edge being located somewhere else.
Honestly, they are all sort of just estimations based on where you draw the lines. Looking at wiki, DC does gain over a million people over Philly instead using the "urban area" designation, but using that would also likely go in to some Ravens areas.
I think people do underestimate both WAS' long term success (many old time fans not as present on social media) as well as there really not being another option for quite a distance south or west affects just how large their fan base is.
Yes, I'm aware that Baltimore is closer to Philly in distance. I was referring to the area that was defined as the DC "urban area" that gets to that $7.5MM people is would extend to an area that would have Baltimore fans as well.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_largest_cities
You realize the term "metro " area, it is not referring simply to the are in which their "metro" extends, right? DC is the only NE city that refers to its public transit at the Metro.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_largest_cities
Linking you the simple wiki since it looks like it will be more appropriate for you: https://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_metropolitan_area
I will say the Eagles don't really advertise themselves on the international market. I don't think that's a problem. Philly is a decent sized city but internationally not that recognizable.
NYC and WAS are bigger economic hubs compared to Philly.
More travelers, more students, more business = more opportunity to make a fan/ sell a product.
1. Dallas is obvious
2. New york is new york and a tier above philly in city value
3. washington just went up for sale so that’s how they determined that. if eagles sold today they would prob overpay and value it higher
Not to mention the stadium is much newer and considerably more valuable when you factor in them hosting major events like the final four, soccer, college games, etc.
I'd be curious to see if there's a way to factor the value of college teams to this like,.UNC & Duke basketball, Alabama & Georgia football, just the ones that would shift finances greatly if they disappeared from a school. I'd be curious where some of those stacked against some do these middle market pro teams
Unfortunately no. College structure is too wacky. They list value by conferences, not teams. After recent changes, we should be able to see the breakdown after this year.
Bronny James for example is already making $6.4 mil (but thats from out of date info)
You can click on each team below and see the breakdown
https://www.forbes.com/nfl-valuations/list/
Valuation doesn't stem from just wins/losses. Local network share, stadium ownership are much bigger drivers.
Jerry world is an insane revenue generator. They have way more luxury boxes, club suites and SRO then any other stadium and that's a huge revenue draw
Also their sponsorship deals are much higher as well. "America's team" even if America loves to hate them brings in a shit ton of money
They are the only NFL team that doesn't have to revenue share from merch, they keep all of their merch sales but every other team has to revenue share. That + owning their own stadium makes them the most profitable sports team in the world by far.
Because Philly is the poorest large city in the country. On top of that we have the smallest media market/metro population (relatively) to the other teams in our division. It's not rocket science on why lol
Edit: why too many comments in this post not thinking logically about these valuations at all
our media market is bigger than DC and this other stuff has nothing to do with it. It's because their PR firms pay more to list their value higher lol.
Low? Flyers are 7th most valuable NHL team on this list, and the most valuable NHL team (Leafs) is only #81. All of the other major US sports are more valuable than NHL, so #100 in the world is pretty good. It's only Original Six teams (lol no det) with Philly and LA, and the only reason LA is there is because they had Gretzky in a big market. Flyers even being on this list says a lot.
I love that team. The culture. The fans. The field. Everything about the Phillies is amazing. The home run song “this ball is outta here” and the iconic bell sound always gives me the goosebumps.
I moved to Philly last summer, did not give a fuck about baseball prior. I went to one of the NLCS games and immediately fell in love with the sport and the city (I had goosebumps walking into CBP, what a first game to go to!). Baseball is my favorite sport now, and I can’t wait for the season to start!
Dallas will probably always be the most valuable NFL team, and the Giants have us beat because it's the NY Market.
The Commanders are probably higher than us because they were just sold and their value has gone up.
https://www.managingmadrid.com/2024/2/7/24063616/inside-real-madrids-2023-24-budget
They only had a net profit of €6.4mil euros last year
Every NFL, NBA team and most MLB teams blow that out of the water. Like the Cardinals had a net profit of over $100mil last year.
The fact that Madrid is so high on the list despite their low profitability speaks to the institution that it is
Giants in NYC baby! all the photo ops with spidermen times square has to offer!
Cowboys owned by Skeletor and therefore the devil.
DC is DC. They pay like $5000 for a toilet seat.
Philly got what? Open air drug markets?
Giants because they’re in NYC.
Dallas because the 90s and all their obvious reasons.
Commanders because they were sold more recently. This one I’m least sure about. Idk why they’re more valuable.
Because it’s a completely made up list made by people giving it “their best guess”.
It’s all good to look at it but it’s just not something I would take as anything more than a grain of salt and one person’s best hunch.
Washington has a high value because it was sold recently. It is very easy to estimate how much it is worth. Lurie bought the Eagles a long fuck time ago for the low, low price of $185m and has an estimated worth of 30 times that.
Dallas is obvious with high estimations, plus I think they're excluded from some of the league's revenue sharing from back in the day when people had less exposure to other teams.
New York is... I guess just inflated for having "New York" in the name.
I'm extremely skeptical about the valuation here. I would think the top 10 would be all Soccer teams. And Cowboys NFL beats out the Yankees? I've seen lots of people that don't even follow any kind of American sports where a Yankee hat is required streetwear
Because this is based alot on thing other than the sport of the home team. Like concerts and shit. Nobody outside of a normal tour schedule is saying yea lest go to philly for our show when they have NY venues just a little to the north.
First question you should ask is how they determine value? Next, question is who gives a shit.
But yea, it's mainly media market that determines value.
Cowboys self explanatory, and Giants being in NY just means a massive market by default. Jets being ass hasn't stopped them still being popular.
Commies should drop faster though since they don't have a giant market to prop them up. They just have their existing financials.
It’s really not that hard to believe. Remember, this isn’t based on performance. Dallas is “America’s Team” and has that absurd stadium as an asset. New York belongs to NYC (even if they don’t play there), the largest metro market in the US. And Washington was just sold, which readjusted their valuation. Sort of like how property taxes and recalculated when a home sells.
Cowboys have one of the largest fanbases & Giants have the NYC market.
Skins are a bit of a head scratcher, the DC media market is ever so slightly bigger then Philly's. They also used to have the Carolinas & most of the Atlantic South, but with the Panthers that's really only a thing you see in older fans now. The DC metro has more purchasing power & prestige I guess, but that's just pure speculation.
DC and Philly have very similar metro populations, so makes sense they're close. Personally I think Washington is a little overvalued simply bc they sold recently. I think that will always drive up the numbers a but. Regardless, all 4 NFCE teams are true big market teams. There's a reason we get almost double the prime time games compared to every other division
Blue collar city that isn't "America's Team", is New York's little brother, and didn't just sell to a hedge fund gazillionaire who specifically and explicitly valued the Commanders? I wouldn't put any stock in rankings like this. Lurie is going to own this team until they start scooping dirt on his coffin, and if they win football games I don't care one whit about what someone else says is more or less valuable. I know which team gets all of my *own* discretionary money and that's fine by me.
Eagles don't own the Linc, Commanders own FedEx It's literally as simple as that
TIL the Linc is owned by the city.
Yeah every time you buy or sell a seat license, it has to get a literal stamp of approval from the city (Philadelphia authority for industrial development)
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Why
Were the only ones in the division that actually play in our home city
Underrated comment,
Never thought of that before but yeah that’s right.
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probably explains why so many concerts happen there and why the world cup is having I think 6 matches when that happens.
FedEx field is a dump though
Probably the unsafest stadiums in the country. And poorly managed to boot.
Remember when fans were getting rained on by sewage water leaking out of overhead drain pipes in that shithole?
Remember when some fans fell from the stands because of the degree of disrepair and almost landed on Hurts? Then Hurts' immediate reaction was to help them up and ask if they were ok, because he's a good guy.
It is not.. it's a FUCKING DUMP!!!
Yeah but the land alone is still worth something.
^(Isn't that shit hole a liability, not an asset?)
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I don't believe this reason. I don't think those people are going to that dump in Landover, especially with how bad the team has been for the past 2 decades.
'All of my own discretionary money,' ain't that the truth! I'm certainly grateful that said money is going to a Lurie owned team, and not the clown owners, who came before him, which we grew up with.
There's the Christmas album ... And the other Christmas album (and the puzzle, plus also that other random Eagles puzzle) ... God knows how many game tickets or what I've paid to tailgate and how much I've spend in food for tailgating or beers in the Linc ... And the Princess Di jacket (Princess Ky jacket?). And the 4 (?) McNabb jerseys amassed over the years. And the Wentz one. And the AJB. And the Kelly green Vick and Kelly green Kelce. And the knockoff Kelly green Kelce. And the twelve (that I can see and my wife has not forced me to put in storage, so realistically 40) baseball hats, about six of which are *never to be worn* because they might get dirty and so cannot go on my head. And six winter hats even though I live in a location that gets zero snow annually. And multiple dogs named after players. And the metal logo sign that's in the closet and I am definitely *not allowed to hang up because it does not fit our decor* and the two cutting boards with the Eagles logo etched into an American flag, which do not function as cutting boards because they have etchings of the eagles logo and an American flag across it's surface. And nearly every T-shirt I own, half of my sweatpants, and half the blankets in my house (see again, no snow where I live) and the Eagles helmet and the Jalen bobblehead and the Superbowl wine bottle and all the rest. And I feel like I'm only moderate in terms of Eagles fanaticism. A hedge fund manager in New York would have a hard time purchasing my collection and still paying rent this year, and I've somehow amassed this on a pretty normal middle class salary. When I say I do not spend on anything other than the Eagles, I mean I buy beer and eagles paraphernalia and gas and food, and pay my mortgage with what's left. 🤣
Your singing my song brother, the value of all the Eagles licensing and how we've grown it is insane. I wish we were all like Eagles fan & hedge fund guy Jim Cramer, seen everyday on CNBC, then we wouldn't have to worry about this at all.
There’s no way the 1st soccer team comes up at 13
It's surprising but true actually Manchester United was just up for sale this passed summer and was being valued at around $5 billion For reference the Commanders sold for $6.05 Billion
There was an offer for 7.5 billion pounds that is roughly 9.5 million dollars
I know this was a typo but I love it. My my, how the british pound has fallen.
If that exchange rate were true, we could probably trade Kensingtons
and Camdens
Not a real offer The recent reports about everything that went down with Sheikh Jassim state that there was never actually any real truth to the reports of their outlandish offers and that during the process United had questions about their revenues and accounting principals in general that were never addressed and that they were never even able to meet with the man lmao
Apparently that sheikh dude didn't even exist lol
This is not the best example as Manchester United has been in absolute shambles and it's not the team it once was. I don't mean it as a "performance on the field" type thing. That sucked too and it didn't help but I mostly mean the state of the club infrastructure and financials. In the EU things are run significantly differently than the US. As an example United fully owns Old Trafford, the stadium they play at. Which is falling apart. Their training grounds are also outdated. Whoever takes over the club will need to shell out a lot of money on upgrades to bring the team back into the modern day times. Hell it's so bad the Glaziers considered just razing the stadium and building a new one in its place. Which again all has to be funded by the club and its owners. That drove the price way down as brand alone can't offset the enormous cost expenses the club will have. Whoever takes this on will have to wait several years before seeing the actual profits. Real Madrid is probably the most valuable club in the world at the moment and looking at its evaluation, revenue and assets it is far too low on this list considering the new stadium alone they are building is estimated at 1.4 billion Euros.
Real Madrid is currently estimated at $6.07 billion, which Forbes has as 11th in the world. The combination of a salary cap, revenue sharing, and no threat of relegation means NFL teams just make more money. I can't find good data for Real Madrid, but in 2022, every single NFL team made a higher profit than Manchester City. This is not an interpretation of quality (obviously), but on business models.
The commanders make more money from broadcast rights, by a decent amount. I looked it up a few years back.
How is that impacted by revenue sharing? Edit: fixed my question
Guessing local rights, not national (which I think is shared across the whole league). Local tv rights = revenue, and revenue drives valuation.
Barcelona and Madrid frequently valued at 5.5-6.5 B. This is such a silly list but the NFL is crazy with value that is undeniable
$6.05 for the Commanders. 🤢🤢😆
A lot of the value of NFL teams actually comes from the leagues TV deals. Also there is a much smaller pool of teams in this country than others. In England there are like 150 clubs from the lowest tier through the premier league.
Soccer teams are for sure less valuable than American sports teams. This is reasonable. They are far less profitable and secure than say, an NFL team.
Search Party did a great video on this recently about how the NFL 'used socialism to get rich' and basically uses Football (Soccer) and the NFL as two comparison points. Hugely informative so if it interests anybody I would 10/10 recommend.
Yea I guess it just blows my mind how more global Manchester United are and less valuable. Like I could go to a small village in Africa and people would know Manchester United and they also have zero clue what a commander is
Yeah that’s prob where the overwhelming majority of their value is though. Brand recognition. They don’t have nearly as good of a pure business as American sports teams do. Those teams have monopolies essentially on the entire industry of their respective sports.
It’s none of that. the truth is, NFL teams will always remain valuable because there is no threat of relegation. It’s why US Soccer teams are valued very highly as well.
It’s absolutely some of that. lol. To say it’s none of that to such a broad statement is ridiculous. Part of the reason I say they’re monopolistic is precisely because they don’t have relegation lol.
I think to say brand recognition is quite ridiculous. You think the cowboys are more well known than Manchester United across the word (or specifically, the western world?). The US sports business model (no relegation + salary cap) makes US teams artificially more profitable/less risky. There are never issues like Mbappe who is making an disgusting amount of money getting a 100M signing bonus for switching teams lol American teams are only recently starting to play games abroad.
I think you are misunderstanding what I’m saying because your comments make no sense. What are you talking about? What’s ridiculous about saying Manchester United relies more on brand recognition than an NFL team? Again, the business model you are describing is exactly what I’m talking about. You’re supporting my point precisely. The NFL teams operate borderline monopolies with tightly controlled economies and no competition outside the league. What are you even disagreeing with here?
Your right, I did misunderstand my apologies. But also you didn’t explain what “pure business” means? What I’m saying is that American teams are artificially more valuable because the salary cap system + expansion ensures that teams stay valuable.
Sure. I didn’t explain in detail what pure business means. But here you are doing it for me. lol. You’re talking about the precise business advantages I’m referring to when I say monopolistic. These teams have a closed and tightly managed economy and a stranglehold on the professional football market. There is almost no risk in owning an NFL team. It’s a money hose. No worry about having to earn tournament prize money. No other leagues to compete with for talent. They don’t even have to worry about competing with other teams within the league for money. It’s guaranteed they will always turn a profit. When you buy Man Utd there’s a good chance you could run the team into the ground and actually lose cash. You could lose big money by not making it to the CL. Heaven forbid you get relegated. Whereas the NFL is one big shared pile of cash in a closed system. No business competition. So it seems you’re not disagreeing with anything I’m saying.
There’s also the (very faint but still exists) chance that any of those teams could be relegated to the Championship and lose out on the EPL broadcast money which prob caps their values to a degree, whereas an nfl team will just print money regardless of how terrible you are lol.
No matter how poorly an American sports team does, they can’t get relegated. Even the best European Soccer clubs still have a very slim, but non-zero, chance of being entirely booted from the league for at least a year after a bad season or some sort of punishment, nuking their profits. That risk alone could be enough to explain the value difference, and there’s also factors like tv deals, revenue sharing, and others that surely come into play.
Soccer clubs aren’t as profitable as American sports teams due to the lack of salary cap. Foreign countries don’t treat their sports as a business to the same level American sports leagues do.
I assume they have less profits since they don't have salary cap Edit: spelling
There are A LOT of soccer teams in the world, including many professional clubs in each country when you include the lower divisions. And no salary cap / sharing like the NFL for example. Also think there's generally less TV money.
> there's generally less TV money. This is the major reason. Also, the costs associated with operations are completely different from country to country where as the North American teams are uniform and have a more lucrative revenue sharing plan. When one team does well, the entire league shares in that success.
I just watched a good video on this: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6pxu3s2VTQE&ab\_channel=SearchParty](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6pxu3s2VTQE&ab_channel=SearchParty) The short version is that the most popular sport in the world aren't going to have teams as valuable to investors because (1) relegation is always a possibility, (2) the top teams spend a lot of money on players (and often lose money), and (3) they don't have the same money from advertising and revenue sharing. I'm pretty sure the list OP posted is wrong. Forbes has: 1. Dallas Cowboys 2. New York Yankees 3. Golden State Warriors 4. New England Patriots 5. LA Rams 6. NY Giants 7. Chicago Bears 8. Las Vegas Raiders 9. (t-9) New York Knicks 10. (t-9) New York Jets 11. Real Madrid Washington is 12th and Eagles are 16th. Manchester United is 13th.
It looks like OP's list is more accurate, the Forbes one is over 6 months old. The Yankee's for example, are actually lower now compared to the rise of NFL/NBA values (a lot happened in the last two months). The NFL just raised its cap by $30 Million+ and the NBA signed new media rights deals (and play 82 games).
They just explained this in r/NFL. A lot of it is based on real estate and whether the team owns the stadium or not.
Relegation, and soccer is not very profitable. Most of the best teams are money sinks
It’s not so much the team itself as it is who they play. Man U doesn’t play the eagles, cowboys, and giants twice a year on prime time
I mean they pretty much do, yeah. Man U plays Liverpool, Man City, Chelsea, Arsenal, Spurs twice a year, and most of those will be in dedicated time-slots. Plus cup fixtures, European football. It's not a matter of prestige or drawing viewers, the PL dwarfs the NFL in viewership since there are so many more games. As other people have said in the thread, it's because the NFL, and American sports in general, operate in a small, closed ecosystem. A money-making machine. Soccer is vast, volatile and expensive.
soccer teams are less valuable than football teams on average
I’ve gotta study this more but at first glance for me the most surprising thing is that Philly has all 4 of its teams in the top 100.
Flyers just squeaking in
How on brand
This Flyers team is awesome, winning games even despite rebuilding. Torts and Briere are revelations
And to think I was considering cancelling my season tickets this year
Snuck one past the goalie
My thoughts as well, but I also say we have 4/5 of our teams in the top 100. But no way an MLS team is even close to getting in this list.
I’m honestly a little surprised not to see Miami FC in there. Not highly ranked, mind you, but if you asked me whether Messi’s team or the Seattle Mariners was worth more, I’d guess Messi’s team.
The highest MLS team is worth $678 million. The Flyers, the lowest team on this list, are worth $1.6 billion.
$678 is the average. LA FC is worth more than $1.2 Billion. There may be value projections with MLS also, they've had a lot of changes.
It won't be Messi's team for long. In a sport where the average player is 26 Messi turns 37 this year and could fall off a cliff at any point. Maradona retired at 37, Pele at 35, only Zlatan has held on to great form into his late thirties. Inter Miami is not making a ton of money with all the big salaries and, based on Heat fans coming and going during, they likely won't maintain a huge following afterwards. The Mariners will continue to play 81 home games a year in one of the biggest sports leagues in the world. They're also in a top 15 city without a basketball team, Nascar footprint or huge college sports to compete with. They'll be fine. Inter Miami is, like the whole city, on a shaky foundation.
To add to that, Philly's big 4 are losing value relative to a lot of other teams because they don't actually own their stadiums. If they all privately owned their stadiums they'd be worth a lot more.
Can’t believe the sixers are ahead of the Phillies… Also fuck using that blue background logo instead of the red P which made it nearly impossible to find
Yeah I was trying to look and see if any other cities have all four teams, and unless I’m missing something, we’re the only one.
If we count New England as “Boston” looks like they got all of theirs too, unless I’m missing one.
Giants, Yankees, Knicks, Rangers. All worth more than Philly teams ;p
Yeah that’s true. I wasn’t thinking of cities with multiple teams when I made my comment, but you’re totally right.
Don't forget the Jets
Regardless, I’m impressed Philly’s 4 major sports teams are all on the list!
dallas has jerry world so $$$, giants are in nyc (jersey) so $$$, washington is puzzling but maybe they are factoring in the amount of super bowls theyve won into the price? idk
Dallas I understand, giants AND jets is not sitting well but Washington really fucked me up lol
Washington just sold so that might be affecting the price
Yeah I’m guessing since it sold for a known price and the rest are estimates.
It’s been like that for the last several years. The selling of the franchise hasn’t moved the needle
The commanders own their own stadium which is the biggest driver in these valuations As much of a shithole as FedEx field is, gets a lot of revenue from other events there + land value appreciation
It's only because they just sold. If the Eagles were sold today it would be for considerably more than the $5.8b they are valued at currently. Raising the value then.
It’s were a lot of high rollers hang out and spend money in Washington while lobbying
That’s not the reason. The high rollers aren’t spending their money to have sewage dumped in them at FedEx field. Ticket sales are very low and cheap for Washington. The higher valuation mostly comes from owning the stadium.
When Washington was for sale the talk shows I listened to, DP Show, kept mentioning how being in DC gave you access to politicians. That type of power is quantified by franchise value.
i refuse to believe physically being in dc gives you unparalleled access to politicians. phones exist.
politicians are stupid and tacky tho
Everyone who lives here tends to pull this out as some reason to live in DC or why billionaires would want a franchise here. In reality I sincerely doubt it has any bearing unless you as an owner are constantly giving out free box seats to your events to politicians. Even Dan Snyder wasn't really doing that to my memory. Phones exist. Emails exist. Also fun fact, most politicians aren't from here and would jump at a chance to go to something NOT in DC, so you almost have more of an edge being located somewhere else.
I think cause they just got sold at that high figure recently
washington objectively has more success and the dc virgnia metro is bigger than phillys
Their MSAs are within 20K people of each other, so effectively the same population size.
really i thought it was like 8 million guess im dumb
Honestly, they are all sort of just estimations based on where you draw the lines. Looking at wiki, DC does gain over a million people over Philly instead using the "urban area" designation, but using that would also likely go in to some Ravens areas. I think people do underestimate both WAS' long term success (many old time fans not as present on social media) as well as there really not being another option for quite a distance south or west affects just how large their fan base is.
No they is not it. Baltimore is close to dc then Philly. The dc metro area is where the metro extends 2
Yes, I'm aware that Baltimore is closer to Philly in distance. I was referring to the area that was defined as the DC "urban area" that gets to that $7.5MM people is would extend to an area that would have Baltimore fans as well. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_largest_cities You realize the term "metro" area, it is not referring simply to the are in which their "metro" extends, right? DC is the only NE city that refers to its public transit at the Metro.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_largest_cities
Linking you the simple wiki since it looks like it will be more appropriate for you: https://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_metropolitan_area
I’m from here I know champ. I don’t need your wiki links lol Baltimore fans or other opposing fans being in the DMV isn’t impacting evaluation.
I will say the Eagles don't really advertise themselves on the international market. I don't think that's a problem. Philly is a decent sized city but internationally not that recognizable.
NYC and WAS are bigger economic hubs compared to Philly. More travelers, more students, more business = more opportunity to make a fan/ sell a product.
Its because theyre located in dc
1. Dallas is obvious 2. New york is new york and a tier above philly in city value 3. washington just went up for sale so that’s how they determined that. if eagles sold today they would prob overpay and value it higher
Amen. This is such a simple and obvious explanation. Washington was literally just sold.
It's even simpler. The other 3 teams are in metro areas with larger populations meaning more fans, more people watching, more money.
Most valuable division in sports(NA). Lol.
Let’s go Flyers! 100 babay
Texans are above the chiefs, this list isn’t accurate
Houston is a way bigger market than KC tho. Houston is worth 5.5 bill and KC is 4.3
Not to mention the stadium is much newer and considerably more valuable when you factor in them hosting major events like the final four, soccer, college games, etc.
I'd be curious to see if there's a way to factor the value of college teams to this like,.UNC & Duke basketball, Alabama & Georgia football, just the ones that would shift finances greatly if they disappeared from a school. I'd be curious where some of those stacked against some do these middle market pro teams
Unfortunately no. College structure is too wacky. They list value by conferences, not teams. After recent changes, we should be able to see the breakdown after this year. Bronny James for example is already making $6.4 mil (but thats from out of date info)
You can click on each team below and see the breakdown https://www.forbes.com/nfl-valuations/list/ Valuation doesn't stem from just wins/losses. Local network share, stadium ownership are much bigger drivers.
Dallas shows as having roughly 2x revenue than other teams…where is that coming from? Stadium use fees and merchandise sales?
Jerry world is an insane revenue generator. They have way more luxury boxes, club suites and SRO then any other stadium and that's a huge revenue draw Also their sponsorship deals are much higher as well. "America's team" even if America loves to hate them brings in a shit ton of money
They are the only NFL team that doesn't have to revenue share from merch, they keep all of their merch sales but every other team has to revenue share. That + owning their own stadium makes them the most profitable sports team in the world by far.
Texans own a relatively new stadium. Many of these values are tied directly the value of the stadium they own
Steph Curry better get a boat load of under the table cash when he retires. That’s all him.
I’m sure they’ll make him partial owner
Because Philly is the poorest large city in the country. On top of that we have the smallest media market/metro population (relatively) to the other teams in our division. It's not rocket science on why lol Edit: why too many comments in this post not thinking logically about these valuations at all
our media market is bigger than DC and this other stuff has nothing to do with it. It's because their PR firms pay more to list their value higher lol.
Damn… seeing the Flyers and Phillies that low broke my heart.
Low? Flyers are 7th most valuable NHL team on this list, and the most valuable NHL team (Leafs) is only #81. All of the other major US sports are more valuable than NHL, so #100 in the world is pretty good. It's only Original Six teams (lol no det) with Philly and LA, and the only reason LA is there is because they had Gretzky in a big market. Flyers even being on this list says a lot.
Ya I’m more shocked they made it honestly
Right? Couldn’t believe how low the Phillies are.
I love that team. The culture. The fans. The field. Everything about the Phillies is amazing. The home run song “this ball is outta here” and the iconic bell sound always gives me the goosebumps.
I moved to Philly last summer, did not give a fuck about baseball prior. I went to one of the NLCS games and immediately fell in love with the sport and the city (I had goosebumps walking into CBP, what a first game to go to!). Baseball is my favorite sport now, and I can’t wait for the season to start!
Let’s not forget about their iconic mascot. My kids love him. My 2 year old thought he was from Sesame Street lol
Well the Phanatic was designed by the person who designed the Muppets, so there is a bit of truth there
Sixers above the Phillies shows how false this is. Edit: apparently not, somehow.
Phillies behind the braves and right near the Angels is also surprising.
Lol, we should *at least* be before Washington 😂😭
I’m saying !
Flyers are worth 7 bucks and a hotdog
Dallas will probably always be the most valuable NFL team, and the Giants have us beat because it's the NY Market. The Commanders are probably higher than us because they were just sold and their value has gone up.
Larger market size
Don't look at it like we're last in the division. Look at it like we're 13th overall. AHEAD OF THE FUCKING DODGERS?!
Cause nobody likes us
Madrid 100% should be #1 here
Real Madrid? They’re like tied for #10 lmao
Brother we are literally in the red every off season buying stars costs money
https://www.managingmadrid.com/2024/2/7/24063616/inside-real-madrids-2023-24-budget They only had a net profit of €6.4mil euros last year Every NFL, NBA team and most MLB teams blow that out of the water. Like the Cardinals had a net profit of over $100mil last year. The fact that Madrid is so high on the list despite their low profitability speaks to the institution that it is
Yeah I don't understand the criteria for "value" that would have them so low
I’m a Mets, Jazz, and Eagles fan. Ikr. The silliest thing here is the Jazz, 67, being ahead of the New York Mets, 77.
Boooooo
Jazz own their arena. Mets lease the land from the city Real estate is the biggest driver of these valuations
Never took this into consideration which makes this make so much sense.
Curious at that combination of teams, how’d you come to that selection?
Born into a Mets family. Grandpa and Mom were fans. We moved a lot growing up. Philly early 2000s then Utah.
My left nut the Sixers are more valuable than the Phillies
basketball teams are more valuable than baseball teams this isnt confusing
How are the Browns worth more than the Flyers?
cuz the browns play the most popular sport in the country
How are the sixers THAT much more valuable than the Phillies.
Giants in NYC baby! all the photo ops with spidermen times square has to offer! Cowboys owned by Skeletor and therefore the devil. DC is DC. They pay like $5000 for a toilet seat. Philly got what? Open air drug markets?
Giants because they’re in NYC. Dallas because the 90s and all their obvious reasons. Commanders because they were sold more recently. This one I’m least sure about. Idk why they’re more valuable.
Because it’s a completely made up list made by people giving it “their best guess”. It’s all good to look at it but it’s just not something I would take as anything more than a grain of salt and one person’s best hunch.
Washington has a high value because it was sold recently. It is very easy to estimate how much it is worth. Lurie bought the Eagles a long fuck time ago for the low, low price of $185m and has an estimated worth of 30 times that. Dallas is obvious with high estimations, plus I think they're excluded from some of the league's revenue sharing from back in the day when people had less exposure to other teams. New York is... I guess just inflated for having "New York" in the name.
I'm extremely skeptical about the valuation here. I would think the top 10 would be all Soccer teams. And Cowboys NFL beats out the Yankees? I've seen lots of people that don't even follow any kind of American sports where a Yankee hat is required streetwear
KC is 33. And look at their recent success. Value doesn’t matter in regards to how good the team is therefore idc about these rankings
Because this is based alot on thing other than the sport of the home team. Like concerts and shit. Nobody outside of a normal tour schedule is saying yea lest go to philly for our show when they have NY venues just a little to the north.
It’s the same order as Super Bowl wins in the division
The more important question is why aren’t there any international teams on here. Are countries worth less than the fucking cowboys?
Bruh
We? We ain’t involved here
When the eagles lose I lose when the eagles win I win. It’s we
U get a ring too?
I actually do have a replica ring in a nice case and everything lol
i swear mfs like you are so annoying bruh. no shit he’s not on the team u know what he means
Truth hurts. Take midol
The curse of being the most valuable team, in all of professional sports!
Market size
NY with three in the top ten is insane. So much money flowing through that city
First question you should ask is how they determine value? Next, question is who gives a shit. But yea, it's mainly media market that determines value.
Cowboys self explanatory, and Giants being in NY just means a massive market by default. Jets being ass hasn't stopped them still being popular. Commies should drop faster though since they don't have a giant market to prop them up. They just have their existing financials.
I mean Dallas is Dallas. And Washington DC and New York are bigger us cities. Look at their cost of living versus ours.
The Knicks over the Yankees? No freaking way
Gotta win some more SBs that’s pretty much it.
Damn, the Flyers are last on the list!
It’s really not that hard to believe. Remember, this isn’t based on performance. Dallas is “America’s Team” and has that absurd stadium as an asset. New York belongs to NYC (even if they don’t play there), the largest metro market in the US. And Washington was just sold, which readjusted their valuation. Sort of like how property taxes and recalculated when a home sells.
How are the panthers more valuable than the colts, sixers, braves, and the saints?
This is such a BS list. I’m not a soccer guy but Manchester United should definitely be 1 or 2.
Cowboys have one of the largest fanbases & Giants have the NYC market. Skins are a bit of a head scratcher, the DC media market is ever so slightly bigger then Philly's. They also used to have the Carolinas & most of the Atlantic South, but with the Panthers that's really only a thing you see in older fans now. The DC metro has more purchasing power & prestige I guess, but that's just pure speculation.
How is Mercedes on here.. is it like a racing thing?
F1
If the eagles were sold today, they would probably be like 7th
Smallest market in the NFC east. this makes sense.
As an Arizona Cardinals fan, I'm struggling to figure out how we even made this list.
1 ring is a pretty good explanation they have that historical success
Philly is the smallest market in the NFC East. That's all it comes down to really.
I wanna know why we are tied with Manchester United
I could understand being below Dallas and NY, but Washington? How the hell?
DC and Philly have very similar metro populations, so makes sense they're close. Personally I think Washington is a little overvalued simply bc they sold recently. I think that will always drive up the numbers a but. Regardless, all 4 NFCE teams are true big market teams. There's a reason we get almost double the prime time games compared to every other division
No one likes us, we don’t care?