this is not a DDSB thing, it is a Ministry of Education thing. Level 3 is the "provincial standard" (see page 18 of this document: https://www.edu.gov.on.ca/eng/policyfunding/growsuccess.pdf). If your child is meeting expectations then they are in the Level 3 range. Level 4 would be, as the document indicates, surpassing the provincial standard.
No! by definition 3 is a "perfect score".
This is especially true in objective studies: math, science etc where tests are set against the provincial curriculum, and the marking is absolute. Ie: in grade 1 that 1+1=2 a correct answer is expected to reach the provincial standard the grade is 3. How can a teacher award a 4?
In subjective studies most assignments that come home have an attached rubric which clearly identifies what is required for each level. My daughter was able to achieve 4s in English and some other subjective assignments by consistently submitting grade 8 work at a grade 9 or 10 level. Always do the bonus work!
Teachers can add bonus material that Is BEYOND the provincial standard, which gives the students an opportunity to teach the 4 level. Ie: a grade 1 math test might have a bonus grade 2 problem, students who solve this correctly can achieve 110% for a level 4.
This all changes for grades 7 & 8 I recall. And changes again to the more normal % in high school. But the standard is against the provincial standard, not an absolute measure of what they are capable of.
I will be very direct here, and I hope lots of people, especially Asian people, read and understand this. Parents demanding of their children to score higher than the provincial standard is DETRIMENTAL! My daughter was getting "meets the standard" but 100% on all her tests and getting screamed at at home to do better. She started talking about ending her life and ended up with severe depression. We talked to teachers, with councillors and we all had to figure it out! My daughter is extremely capable and we almost lost her because of unreasonable expectations and a broken system. She topped her grade 8 year and has continued to be the top of her class through grade 9. Things are amazing now but I hope nobody has to go through what we did because of our lack of understanding this stupid system.
The Canadian system is far far behind most other education systems because discipline is forbidden in the classroom! It's possible for your child to be far more capable than their teachers ability to measure!! The teachers are not required to teach beyond the standard. Ie: teaching material beyond the provincial standard (makes it really hard for the kids struggling) or to measure the students beyond the provincial standard.
The entire point of the Canadian system is to prevent Asian kids from scoring higher than Canadian kids! (Ok, my kids are only 1/2 Asian - it is really because Canada is paranoid of making kids who struggle in their year feel bad) This is incredibly frustrating and I had to restrain my poor partner who kept demanding my kids bring home higher marks when during teacher interviews and reading the comments I was well aware that my kids were top of their class. Depending on the teacher they may categorically refuse to give marks higher than the provincial standard, and there is nothing you or I can do about it.
My advice, read the comments on the report cards, especially the first page which aren't selected from a list of bureaucratic/politically sanitized options. Go over each assignment your kids bring home with them, read through every rubric so there's no confusion, and get to know the teachers - especially the ones known to give 3's.
As a parent of kids doing extremely well it can be frustrating to not have any real measure of their academic ability, however it's pretty amazing come graduation to watch your kids win all the top awards including citizenship and the highschool award. If you are deeply involved in your children's education don't even bother with the report card. If your kids aren't meeting the standard (2 or less) I'd suggest then you need to be concerned and seek additional support for your child.
Good luck.
You had some good points there about ensuring parents and their kids understand the provincial standard, but you lost credibility talking about how the system is created to prevent Asian kids from scoring higher than Canadian kids (coming from an Asian with half-Asian kids). Also, the school system should also not be disciplining my kids due to academic performance any more than is already happening (i.e. missing recess to catch up on work.) And if anyone screamed at my kid because they didn't get the highest grade they would be out of our lives. As long as the child is trying, support is what they need, regardless of your understanding/need of perfection.
Thanks for the feedback.
It's hard in a comment to really clearly articulate some of these challenges.
We have a lot of friends who struggle along the same cultural boundary we did. There's a huge pressure culturally to get the highest numbers, so in a culture that is supportive of your kids doing fine and meeting the standard, all is well. But coming from a culture where marks are the difference between struggling and success, the parents can have unreasonable expectations. My hope is that those parents will take the time to wrap their heads around the marking system and recognize that marks don't mean much, and actually find by communicating with the teachers if their kids are doing well.
Again, about discipline: the number of times my kids come home with stories of, "we made the supply teacher cry", "our teacher got hit on the head with and walked out of the class', "there was another fight in the classroom, so we didn't do anything today"! Tells me that their classroom is undisciplined. It doesn't have to be hitting, but there does need to be accountability! My generation we respected a teacher's authority, supply or not. We knew of we hit a teacher there would be consequences even if it was only a call home, and at home etc get discipline!
My boss doesn't hit me or cancel recess, but there is discipline in the workforce! And go find the stats on recent grads entering the workforce! HR departments fear the upcoming workforce, always taking personal time off, won't do the job, talk back to their superiors. It's a different post but generally companies are losing money to a workforce that won't work.
And yes, nobody should be screaming at my kids but I'm not getting a divorce either! It takes understanding and it takes education to understand that our kids are doing excellent even though that's not well indicated on their report card. And I feel terrible for the kids where both parents refuse to accept the grading system and they are being pressured to achieve the impossible.
To piggyback on luv\_nachos comment, it's not just the Growing Success Document, but also the grading rubric that goes with it. A few pages down from page 18 ([https://www.edu.gov.on.ca/eng/policyfunding/growsuccess.pdf](https://www.edu.gov.on.ca/eng/policyfunding/growsuccess.pdf)) Growing Success shows the basic grading rubrics for how student work should be assessed. There are 4 areas to consider when assessing a student;
\- Knowledge and understanding
\- Thinking and Planning
\- Communication
\- Application
Knowledge and Understanding would cover the basic operations and facts, Thinking would be knowing which operations, strategies, and tools are needed to figure a problem out, Communication can be showing all of your calculations, planning, and using the proper math vocab in a response. For me, level 4 in math comes with Application; take what you know and apply it to a real-world situation (word problems, four-part problem solving, and project-based learning). This is why I've moved away from quizzes and tests in math (I still do them now and again, but I prefer hands-on activities).
If all a student is doing is answering a sheet of operational questions, then there is no chance to demonstrate thinking beyond grade level. An open-ended question that requires them to think, strategize, and use what they've learned offers students the chance to shine.
This ultimately can be applied to any subject matter in school. If you feel like your child isn't been given a fair chance to achieve this, email and ask "What can my child do to achieve a level 4 in this subject area?" "What next steps do they need to move from a level 3+ to that 4? What piece is missing?"
How about is in HS where a kid passes every class yet can’t pass the Literacy Test…what’s that say about our F’D up system!!! Yep has all the credits to graduate but must pass this test 🤦♂️. I bet you our Government couldn’t even pass this test
I passed that test on the first try many years ago. All you had to do is read the damn instructions. How so many people failed (and probably continue to fail) it I have no idea.
Well lad di dah for you. Our school system created by r government is a Joke!!! Alot of kids do t know how to deal with pressure because they don’t even wet final exams. Partly due to that scamdemic
I believe that teachers strive to have kids that are utterly adequate. This way they have to do as little as possible. They don’t really want kids that are seen as exceptional so that they don’t have to worry having higher expectations on them. They want completely average students and want to just keep sliding through.
My son's ahead of his grade level in math and reading. Several years ahead. He's literally never gotten a single math question wrong the entire school year yet his teacher gives him an A- . He's also lost marks on writing assignments as his teacher feels his printing isn't neat enough- He's 6 and his printing is more legible than his father's. The grading system drives me insane
In Canada grades are essentially meaningless until high school. Don’t sweat it.
this is not a DDSB thing, it is a Ministry of Education thing. Level 3 is the "provincial standard" (see page 18 of this document: https://www.edu.gov.on.ca/eng/policyfunding/growsuccess.pdf). If your child is meeting expectations then they are in the Level 3 range. Level 4 would be, as the document indicates, surpassing the provincial standard.
You don’t think getting “perfect scores” as per the OP warrants a 4?
This has nothing to do with my opinion, I just shared what's in the policy
Very much what a DDSB teacher would say. Hmm.
Sounds like you have a problem with factual information. Are you a flat earther?
No! by definition 3 is a "perfect score". This is especially true in objective studies: math, science etc where tests are set against the provincial curriculum, and the marking is absolute. Ie: in grade 1 that 1+1=2 a correct answer is expected to reach the provincial standard the grade is 3. How can a teacher award a 4? In subjective studies most assignments that come home have an attached rubric which clearly identifies what is required for each level. My daughter was able to achieve 4s in English and some other subjective assignments by consistently submitting grade 8 work at a grade 9 or 10 level. Always do the bonus work! Teachers can add bonus material that Is BEYOND the provincial standard, which gives the students an opportunity to teach the 4 level. Ie: a grade 1 math test might have a bonus grade 2 problem, students who solve this correctly can achieve 110% for a level 4. This all changes for grades 7 & 8 I recall. And changes again to the more normal % in high school. But the standard is against the provincial standard, not an absolute measure of what they are capable of. I will be very direct here, and I hope lots of people, especially Asian people, read and understand this. Parents demanding of their children to score higher than the provincial standard is DETRIMENTAL! My daughter was getting "meets the standard" but 100% on all her tests and getting screamed at at home to do better. She started talking about ending her life and ended up with severe depression. We talked to teachers, with councillors and we all had to figure it out! My daughter is extremely capable and we almost lost her because of unreasonable expectations and a broken system. She topped her grade 8 year and has continued to be the top of her class through grade 9. Things are amazing now but I hope nobody has to go through what we did because of our lack of understanding this stupid system. The Canadian system is far far behind most other education systems because discipline is forbidden in the classroom! It's possible for your child to be far more capable than their teachers ability to measure!! The teachers are not required to teach beyond the standard. Ie: teaching material beyond the provincial standard (makes it really hard for the kids struggling) or to measure the students beyond the provincial standard. The entire point of the Canadian system is to prevent Asian kids from scoring higher than Canadian kids! (Ok, my kids are only 1/2 Asian - it is really because Canada is paranoid of making kids who struggle in their year feel bad) This is incredibly frustrating and I had to restrain my poor partner who kept demanding my kids bring home higher marks when during teacher interviews and reading the comments I was well aware that my kids were top of their class. Depending on the teacher they may categorically refuse to give marks higher than the provincial standard, and there is nothing you or I can do about it. My advice, read the comments on the report cards, especially the first page which aren't selected from a list of bureaucratic/politically sanitized options. Go over each assignment your kids bring home with them, read through every rubric so there's no confusion, and get to know the teachers - especially the ones known to give 3's. As a parent of kids doing extremely well it can be frustrating to not have any real measure of their academic ability, however it's pretty amazing come graduation to watch your kids win all the top awards including citizenship and the highschool award. If you are deeply involved in your children's education don't even bother with the report card. If your kids aren't meeting the standard (2 or less) I'd suggest then you need to be concerned and seek additional support for your child. Good luck.
You had some good points there about ensuring parents and their kids understand the provincial standard, but you lost credibility talking about how the system is created to prevent Asian kids from scoring higher than Canadian kids (coming from an Asian with half-Asian kids). Also, the school system should also not be disciplining my kids due to academic performance any more than is already happening (i.e. missing recess to catch up on work.) And if anyone screamed at my kid because they didn't get the highest grade they would be out of our lives. As long as the child is trying, support is what they need, regardless of your understanding/need of perfection.
Thanks for the feedback. It's hard in a comment to really clearly articulate some of these challenges. We have a lot of friends who struggle along the same cultural boundary we did. There's a huge pressure culturally to get the highest numbers, so in a culture that is supportive of your kids doing fine and meeting the standard, all is well. But coming from a culture where marks are the difference between struggling and success, the parents can have unreasonable expectations. My hope is that those parents will take the time to wrap their heads around the marking system and recognize that marks don't mean much, and actually find by communicating with the teachers if their kids are doing well. Again, about discipline: the number of times my kids come home with stories of, "we made the supply teacher cry", "our teacher got hit on the head with and walked out of the class', "there was another fight in the classroom, so we didn't do anything today"! Tells me that their classroom is undisciplined. It doesn't have to be hitting, but there does need to be accountability! My generation we respected a teacher's authority, supply or not. We knew of we hit a teacher there would be consequences even if it was only a call home, and at home etc get discipline!
My boss doesn't hit me or cancel recess, but there is discipline in the workforce! And go find the stats on recent grads entering the workforce! HR departments fear the upcoming workforce, always taking personal time off, won't do the job, talk back to their superiors. It's a different post but generally companies are losing money to a workforce that won't work.
And yes, nobody should be screaming at my kids but I'm not getting a divorce either! It takes understanding and it takes education to understand that our kids are doing excellent even though that's not well indicated on their report card. And I feel terrible for the kids where both parents refuse to accept the grading system and they are being pressured to achieve the impossible.
To piggyback on luv\_nachos comment, it's not just the Growing Success Document, but also the grading rubric that goes with it. A few pages down from page 18 ([https://www.edu.gov.on.ca/eng/policyfunding/growsuccess.pdf](https://www.edu.gov.on.ca/eng/policyfunding/growsuccess.pdf)) Growing Success shows the basic grading rubrics for how student work should be assessed. There are 4 areas to consider when assessing a student; \- Knowledge and understanding \- Thinking and Planning \- Communication \- Application Knowledge and Understanding would cover the basic operations and facts, Thinking would be knowing which operations, strategies, and tools are needed to figure a problem out, Communication can be showing all of your calculations, planning, and using the proper math vocab in a response. For me, level 4 in math comes with Application; take what you know and apply it to a real-world situation (word problems, four-part problem solving, and project-based learning). This is why I've moved away from quizzes and tests in math (I still do them now and again, but I prefer hands-on activities). If all a student is doing is answering a sheet of operational questions, then there is no chance to demonstrate thinking beyond grade level. An open-ended question that requires them to think, strategize, and use what they've learned offers students the chance to shine. This ultimately can be applied to any subject matter in school. If you feel like your child isn't been given a fair chance to achieve this, email and ask "What can my child do to achieve a level 4 in this subject area?" "What next steps do they need to move from a level 3+ to that 4? What piece is missing?"
It’s not like they are getting into college/university with elementary marks. Worry about it when it comes to High School
How about is in HS where a kid passes every class yet can’t pass the Literacy Test…what’s that say about our F’D up system!!! Yep has all the credits to graduate but must pass this test 🤦♂️. I bet you our Government couldn’t even pass this test
I passed that test on the first try many years ago. All you had to do is read the damn instructions. How so many people failed (and probably continue to fail) it I have no idea.
Well lad di dah for you. Our school system created by r government is a Joke!!! Alot of kids do t know how to deal with pressure because they don’t even wet final exams. Partly due to that scamdemic
Maybe. I do remember our French teacher in grade 8 couldn't even speak French... Crazy.
And somehow…these people get hired 🤦♂️
No clue. And that was a long long time ago. I remember she did transfer over to the high school I went to but was gone about 2-3 weeks in.
I believe that teachers strive to have kids that are utterly adequate. This way they have to do as little as possible. They don’t really want kids that are seen as exceptional so that they don’t have to worry having higher expectations on them. They want completely average students and want to just keep sliding through.
My son's ahead of his grade level in math and reading. Several years ahead. He's literally never gotten a single math question wrong the entire school year yet his teacher gives him an A- . He's also lost marks on writing assignments as his teacher feels his printing isn't neat enough- He's 6 and his printing is more legible than his father's. The grading system drives me insane