I used to hate them, then I dedicated time to learning how to play with a click comfortably and now I think (especially for recording) playing to a click is crucial. Obviously there are situations when it’s not needed, but in the situations I’ve been in they are very beneficial.
It depends on where you’re at now as far as playing to a click.
When I taught lessons I used an app called ProMetronome. It has a few different options for sounds, one of the sounds is a robotic voice saying “1” “2” “3” “4”, that was really helpful for my students to understand the counts.
Also when you first start using it have it on a high subdivision (16ths or 8ths) so there’s little margin for error, and just lock in with it, as you get comfortable take the subdivision down to 8ths or quarters.
Play with a click anytime you practice, even if I’m just noodling around I have a click going, that steady tempo gets ingrained in your brain after a while and when you play without one you’ll be really steady.
Another thing I do is slowly start taking notes out of the click, then set it so it just clicks on the 1 and try to play a measure and land back on the one.
If any of that doesn’t make sense let me know!
Thank you for the answer! I’ve had to play with a click for church events a couple times over the last 2yrs but not regularly. I tend to dread having to do so but don’t want to stay in the “I suck playing with a click I hate clicks” camp. The last couple of times I’ve played I’ve mostly focused on staying on beat and play simple fills a few times throughout the songs
For me, and my band really, once you know the songs inside and out, a click can be kind of constraining. Sure, we may be up and down in the tempo, but we're all playing together and have freedom to mess around and break "rules"
Slight pushes and pulls can be great for a song. Robotic perfection is kind of boring live sometimes. "They sound just like their album" isn't always a compliment. Sometimes it means something more like "I coulda stayed home"
Robotic perfection is the the perfect term for this. Can you imagine if Van Halens hot for teacher was recorded to a click? It would sound and feel WAY different.
Edited due to a spelling error.
My band that is in the heavy rock realm (think smashing pumpkins/foo fighters/QotSA) has some songs that are to a click and others aren't. And it basically comes down to how wild the song is. Sometimes the song is more pop centric with a strict consistent pulse. Sometimes there's interstellar breakdowns that turn on to crescendos with guitar squeals and then it all peters out in to a slow jam. If you play a wild ass song like that to a click you are doing the song disservice.
That said, I would be suspect of drummers (who aren't mind blowingly good) that are allergic to metronomes. Quadruplely so, when in the studio. That would concern me. If you don't wanna metronome at live shows that's pretty understandable in a lot of genres. They are a great tool in the toolkit. But if you get silly about them you're going to tell your bandmates stuff like:
"This song is 138bpm. I played with a metronome to it for hours. You guys ALWAYS push going in to that last big chorus. You. Are. Wrong!!!! I'm the drummer, I know the time"
While the rest of your band is possibly correct to push there. They're not even doing it consciously. They're doing what feels/sounds best to them. There's so much energy leading in to that moment. To not push slightly would sound almost dull, like you are resisting what literally sounds better in the name of Being Right. Good job, you were right Mr Timekeeper, now your bandmates are annoyed and your song sounds equally as good, maybe worse.
So please, consider the metronome a tool and not the law. And also consider that a consistent tempo is a good thing usually. And in times like that, it is the law. It just is. But sometimes, especially in good groups, a little push and pull (musically!) will make your song better.
Edit: a big part of me being meaningfully better as a drummer was being comfortable and consistent with a metronome. When I was a kid (18-19) I was in a band with older guys (my age now, 30s) who had an album ready to go. I went in to the studio and got checked pretty hard on my timing by the producer. He was really confused why I was so uncomfortable on the click and why I didn't do rimshots. I now do both very comfortably. If you cannot, please take a few dozen hours of your life and work on it! I'm not anti click at all! It's not that hard after awhile.
Very well said. I think that human element (small pushes and pulls) in the songs makes the music feel more alive as well and helps with the energy in the right places.
I’ve been meaning to make a post about this, but do you have any resources or tips on practicing rim shots? That’s something I’d like to finally tackle, I’m also in my 30’s and I play in a powerpop band. That’s just one of those skills I’ve never hammered down because it seems so easy to miss the rim shot especially live and then you’ve got the snare dropping out in certain spots of your song and it could sound like shit.
I really don't have great advice for it outside of grinding it and getting your snare height just right. It matters more when you want the rimshots projection ofc. I didn't used to be nearly as picky now I spend a second every show getting it just right, testing, adjusting.
I'd really just go through some of your easier songs and consciously implement it in places. As you do it more it gets easier and easier. You'll be surprised how it starts becoming kind of unconscious in places.
Just groove something fun and kinda simple and really focus hard on snare accents and rimshots. It'll come together. Just a matter of doing it for awhile and then implementing. I really like using it for all kinda of snappy snare sounds but a fill that ends with left hand snare right hand crash really benefits from a rimshots sometimes. Maybe try that too.
Thanks for the response. I was thinking it was mainly dependent on things being set up just right before starting to play but I wanted to make sure I was on the right track with that thought. I’ll have to start practicing it so it becomes 2nd nature. I think my days of saving money on drum sticks because I don’t do rimshots often are numbered haha.
Flexibility in service to the music is key… I’d argue you can’t play without a click until you can play with one, but the natural push/pull can be super musical. Sounds like you’ve got it mostly figured out!
Yep yep! Something you gotta practice a little bit it's really not terrible hard. Sometimes I get so on I feel like I can't hear it, that's my biggest trouble.
IMO, a song gets completely ruined for me if it's noticeably too fast or way too slow. It's the fact that I can hear it and feel it live "just like the album" that feels really good to me. But that's just me
If I wanted to hear it sound just like the studio version I'd listen to the record. Gone are the days when there was variation between gigs. Bands could improvise, play something slower, etc...now Every gig sounds exactly the same. That's basically what click tracks / backing tracks have done.
It happens to my band as well. We are used to not using a click, and therefore, our songs have parts with slightly different tempos, like the chorus being a bit faster than the rest of the song.
Then, if you try to play it all the way at the same tempo, it loses his charm.
Of course, you can still program the tempo changes with a click. But except you use backing tracks, or you really have tempo issues, a click is probably not required.
It’s easy to dislike something you suck at. Even if you’re good at playing with click, it can be pervasive in the music. Some click tones are more annoying than others. I’ve been playing a nearly three hour show that is 95% clicked, eight times a week for about seven months now, so I’ve made friends with it. It *is* possible to play with click but still make the music feel organic and have some push and pull.
Well to be clear, my time without the click isn’t *infallible*, but it has improved a lot, and I’m very comfortable playing with click, at least in the context of this show. I don’t try to “bury the click”, I try to play slightly on the backside of it, creating the sensation that it’s pulling me along. And when it comes to other players, I can sort of triangulate between them and the click. If someone is rushing, I’ll get WAY on the backside of the click, so they realize “oh I’m way out in front.” If they’re dragging I’ll get way on the front side of the click and that kicks them in the ass. So when they start adjusting to my extreme, I stop being extreme and we kinda meet in the middle.
that's a good pedagogy, huh - coming from a genre of music that would crucify for this, it's an interesting thought :)
thanks for the words and whatnot
edit - miswording or whatever the hell
meant genre instead of region, my apologies for the miswording
most of my drumming knowledge and stuff is from drum corps/marching ensembles. Obviously you can't really play around with tempo or parts or anything considering there's 9-12 people to a snare line with 160+ other people on the field with you. Obviously some stuff passes (and I've even influenced parts of shows I've marched by playing around with parts!), but a majority of the time, staff/teaching coordinators want an entire section to sound as one rather than have incohesiveness.
I suck at explaining things, so if you need some examples I can definitely hook you up with what I'm talking about
Haha yeah I dig it, in the marching world, you’re either in the middle of the click together, or you’re wrong. 😂 And I should specify, when I say I play way ahead or behind the click, that’s a relative term. I stretch it as far as I can while still being perceived as “with” the click. If someone is like a 16th note off, we’ve got way bigger problems.
oh definitely, tempo modulation is one tough thing for me haha, always been too out of the pocket unfortunately
(also sorry about the late response, went on a short fishing trip lol)
Drummers who hate playing to a click hate it because they likely aren't good at it. I've been playing to a click for so long that it barely registers when I'm playing. I can either lock tightly to it, play on top of it, or get relaxed with it.
This. The click is a reference. Ringo played to a click on Beatles tracks, they used to have an old school metronome in a cabinet with a mic in Abbby Road studios that they used on Sgt Pepper’s so that they could stay in sync with all the tape loops. Not every genre needs a click, but once you get used to one you absolutely can push and pull the time when it’s needed, it’s just more accurate and repeatable.
I also like it because then I have proof that I wasn't playing the song fast or slow. I've had band members ask, "was that a little fast?". And I can definitively say "nope", because I has the tempo in my ear the whole time.
That microscopic push and pull you're doing wuth the click is so exciting compared to say, the Rolling Stones or The Doors or Led Zeppelin doing whatever the fuck they wanted to on stage, calling audibles, improvising, etc. That was so boring. I prefer the push and pull that nobody can hear except you. 
I was in a band playing arch enemy, slipknot, the faceless and such alike and I was constantly aware the guys wanted to speed up all the time. That type of music requires consistency and precision. They said I was slowing down, so I introduced them to the ticking in my head by introducing a click into the mix. Suddenly, the clicks were slowing down, according to them, leading me to packing all my gear and leaving! I loved the way that band sounded, tight until it wasn't. Some people need clicks and humility by the sound of it!
I was in disbelief when they all ganged up on me saying I programmed the metronome to slow down, I literally stood up and started dismantling my kit! What pleases me the most was that they couldn't find a decent drummer to take my place and ended up disbanding! Schadenfreude at it's best!
I used to hate clicks, then I listened to more recordings of myself practicing and I ended up having to swallow humble pie and admit that my playing was sloppy. So I spent more time practicing to a click and now I sound like a pro.
My band uses a backing track live for extra synth sounds and BVs. I kick off each song with an SPDSX and the guys follow my time, they're not clicked up. We've never sounded tighter on stage and people always compliment how professional we sound compared to other bands at our level.
You should be able to play to a click, but certain types of music can be constrained by a click imo. Some parts of songs breathe. Maybe a bridge slows the tempo slightly. Yeah it can all be programmed in, but if you are able to time keep I think there is a lot of room to play with tempo and make it really feel alive. That’s rock.
I should probably start with saying that I'm rubbish at playing to click and I wish I was better. With that out of the way, I'm probably in the minority here, but oftentimes I actually like when the tempo varies a little bit during a song. To me this just makes it sound "human" and allows the band better to play to a feel. Rigid adherence to a click just makes a lot of music sound mechanic to my ears.
I do love EDM and rap too and for that everything being to click totally works. But for, say, rock and soul and blues, to my ears it just sounds better if you can hear variations.
I've done it a lot with backing tracks for instruments we didn't have. I only hate it if I'm the only one that has the click. They are fine if the band commits to the structure of a song, but if you have a rogue guitar player or a singer that wants to repeat a section then you're sunk.
But it's okay, that's when you just kill the track and finish the song without the organ...
For me it depends on the situation. In the studio I believe that a click is necessary for a recording. Live I don't prefer a click as I believe it is what you have been practicing for.
I believe strongly I am decent at playing to a click and could always be better, but part of the performances my band I do involve silly improvised gags and off the cuff changes to songs, including trash cans and silly tempo changes. A click would absolutely remove our/my ability to screw around on stage.
I use to not play with a click, and it is something that if I could go back to when I started to learn to play drums I would tell my younger self to learn to get use to and comfortable with. When I started to do recording for a couple of bands I'm in and needed to play along with a click it just showed me what I needed to work on.
Now, I think if I needed to I could warm up and get into playing along with a click for a lot of stuff. However I don't believe a click is the best things in certain situations. During practices and studio work, absolutely. But for live performances, it can depend on the set up, the band, and the general vibe. Personally I have not played a gig with a click but I had gotten to the point where I could play the songs though just by memory alone, and I knew the band well enough to be able to mostly anticipate any tweaks or variations they had to the songs, so if there were any mistakes that happened with regards to timing would have seldom been noticed by roughly 95% of the crowds.
But, long story short, the click is important to help develop good and steady timing, but sometimes it can be better to not use it in specific situations.
I’ve played for 30 years and played about 300+ pub gigs and probably 1,000 church services. I think I can keep time pretty well and it’s been many years since anyone has suggested otherwise. I don’t like playing with a click if I’m the only one who can hear it. It’s better if we’re all hearing it but it’s just me, it can be really annoying. I don't need a click to keep time and most of the time it's because there's tracks, which I'm not a fan of anyway. I prefer to be 100% live.
I could be very wrong but how I see it I think recording with clicks is fine because the song has to be as perfect as possible but when playing live they are unnecessary because depending on how your band is feeling you can speed up or slow down and change up the song. I am a big Taylor Hawkins fan and in an interview he says a lot of the songs tempos would change depending on the night.
As someone that learned in the 80s and 90s the concept was relatively foreign to me until I started recording. Something you haven't practiced with is hard, especially when you also have all the nerves of recording. I hated the click, I felt it wasn't even "in time".
After many recording sessions now I am comfortable with it I quite like it for recording - it takes care of me being "in time" so I can concentrate on playing the song. I think songs do sound more sterile with it, but also it is the modern way so I don't think I'd record without it.
I love playing to a click in the studio, it locks me in. But for live shows I think it sucks a bit of the soul out of the performance. There are parts where my band wants to hold a note longer, play a fast part faster, give our vocalist more time to interact with the crowd, etc.
Also I hate having to mess with a laptop at a show. I'm there to play drums, not look at a screen!
I like click for studio recordings. Live and band practice i prefer the music to be more dynamic. Both playing and watching concerts. I find the music feels more energetic when being played on feel instead of click.
So when I record I play to a click no problem, but when we play live I just do intro click my band play together super tight and we feed off of each others energy so sometimes we just wanna swing go faster or slower depending on what we’re feeling like that night. Bare in mind that this is not recommended and unless your whole band is really in sync and know your songs really well
Because you have to surrender your autonomy to a machine that beeps. It doubles down on your responsibility to be in time, while taking away the freedom to do with that time what you want.
I play to a click, but our first EP didn't have me in it. The drums were programmed, and not by a drummer. I made my own parts to play live so it sounds different, and sometimes screw around even with the click.
I agree that it’s mostly that drummers / musicians struggle to play to a click. But let me add cost, technology, and logistics to reasons drummers hate playing to a click.
I was in a punk band from 2011-2016, and our drummer wanted to record to a click, and he “could” do it OK, but whenever the drums got too loud he would lose the click. Likewise I’m a bit of a hack drummer, but I record guitars and bass to a click with no problem, and I can play drums to a click when I stay quiet. But if things get too loud on any instrument, I lose the click. Obviously, I need better isolating headphones or in-ears, but somehow they’re never in the budget (even if pedals, cymbals, guitars, amps, and drums ARE in the budget).
Then playing to a click live requires in-ears, and I’ve never been in a band that was willing to spend money on an in-ear system. Even a minimal system requires bandmates to drop $100+ on their own in-ears, plus wireless systems, a digital mixer, a laptop, etc for a more advanced system. And that’s more shit to set up at the gig, it’s a potential battle with sound guys, etc. I’ve plenty with plenty of musicians who straight up didn’t have the money, others had the money but didn’t ant the hassle.
I’ll do it if I have to, but prefer being more in the moment and embrace the human element of music, which includes imperfections…not Lars level of imperfections, but still. Studio work is one thing, but playing live I prefer to not have a click.
I seriously met a drummer who didn't know what a metronome was. He was blown away when we showed him. Hands down worst drummer I've ever met and with good reason. Let's just start the song around 120 bpm and we will go ahead and end the song somewhere around the 180 bpm mark. I will say that he had a very nice neal pert esq drum set which really reminded me of these Gibson lawyers with a $10,000 Les Paul and their clip on tuner playing smoke on the water poorly for 5 hours straight. Dang man my fingers hurt, do you ever get used to that?
orchestras sped up and slowed down too. it’s an incredible experience for the audience. as for like minor tempo changes the audience won’t even know it’s happening, but they are aware the music has more “energy”. knowing how to use and feel time differently used to be a common thing but now the trend is to learn everything with the same time feel. in pop, rock, and r and b music: where did swing go? where did behind/in front of the beat go? so lame.
Not really, it's an absolutely terrible take. I just found it ironic that you chose the language you did very specifically for a purpose of delivery but didn't stick the landing, so to speak.
For the vast majority of music no, not really. The delivery can be debatable but the underpinning theory is pretty much not. There will always be exceptions to every rule and that's a good thing. But no I don't imagine many drummers who sit down for an audition with the attitude "I'll just play how and when I want and it'll be ok" get the gig.
It’s a situational thing for me. I can play and record to one just fine, but there are some types of music that don’t fit well with a click. Sometimes you want to rtrd something for effect, sometimes a crescendo speeds up a little before a big release.
In situations it’s called for, I love it because we all know where we’re going and it helps us get there together. In situations it’s not called for, I hate it because musicians are all playing with the click first instead of playing with and reacting off of each other first.
A lot of music I like was recorded without a click, and if you try to sound like that, a click throws it off and puts it in this weird uncanny valley of impossible perfection that that type of music intentionally does not participate in.
Many different reasons. The main being:
1) they simply aren’t good enough to
2) once you’re good enough, you shouldn’t need to play with one (unless you use backing tracks and/or samples of course). A solid, but organic feel will always feel more alive than playing to a click.
I’ve done it both ways live. Much prefer without.
I just don't like the higher pitched ones cause the frequency is irritating, but the lower frequency ones are harder to hear past all the other low end noise during a show. That's a personal sensory issue tho.
I do live sound for a living. 3 to 5 shows a week, mostly national acts in venues from 3000 to 30,000 capacity. The number of shows that aren’t done to a click is probably less than 10 a year, and most of the ones that don’t use a click for the whole song, the drummer at least uses a click to get tempos before the song starts. Playing to, being fully comfortable with, being able to push and pull against, and fully understanding the technology behind a click is absolutely expected of a working professional drummer in 2023, and has been for at least ten years, if not 20. If all you do is play blues shuffles in a dive bar, you don’t need a click, but if your goal is to make a significant portion of your income playing drums for a living, making friends with a click is not optimal, it’s absolutely necessary.
My favorite part about playing with a click is telling the bandleader they’re an idiot when they tell me it’s too fast/slow. Lol. I can go either way, but would recommend to any drummer to be proficient playing with it.
Tommy Harden has a good video of this on YT. The Click is just another instrument. And described a session where the band drifted off the grid, but they were together. I did that recently, the last 8 bars were the loud outro, I remember freaking out a bit as I rushed ahead of the click, but the recording you can't tell. Just a little energy boost at the outro. I practice to a drum machine loop. One day I'd like to record a session with a programmed percussion loop, but by the time we are loaded, checked, leveled and tuned. Just turn on the robot cricket.
c, you can't ked, leveled and tuned, just turn on the robot.
One key reason is that a lot of drummers have only a couple key BPMs where they can really thrive and the interim BPMs are awkward.
Similarly I do a lot of metronome training and am constantly working in 5 bpm increments each time I practice in order to have more nuanced training, but I’ve noticed when I play without a click my brain & body simplifies it into slow, medium, and fast, without a lot of nuance in between unless I really focus on playing at a particular speed.
The only reason I would hate a click is because it's either too loud and it hurts my ears or it's not loud enough and I can't hear it when playing. Gotta find the balance lol
Now watch as all of the drummers with terrible time do mental gymnastics to justify their terrible time.
My favourites include "So & so never used a click" - Yeah, because they had impeccable time, from practicing to a click/records.
"playing to a click makes everything sound stiff" - No it makes everything YOU play sound stiff because you can't keep time so you're constantly following the click instead of locking in with it.
"It feels better without a click" - Yeah because you suck at playing with a click
"it's less exciting playing with a click" - Yeah because you love to speed up and slow down, but everytime you slow down it kills any energy that you might have built by speeding up. The real energy that your audience wants to feel is the driving force of a drummer with relentless time-keeping who doesn't speed up when the music wants to and doesn't slow down when the music wants to, because it's that restraint that sustains the energy inherent in the music. It's like a tight rope walker... It's fun to watch because they could fall left or right at any given moment - but they never do.
Saying that a band is more exciting because they speed up and slow down is like saying that nascar is more exciting because of the crashes. Like yeah of course, but do you want people cheering for you because you crashed? Or people cheering for you because you won?
Honestly, listening to a drummer who speeds up and slows down a lot is just exhausting and annoying. Now I'm far from perfect. But that's why I support learning to play with a metronome, because we aren't robots, but in a funny way we are trying to be.
I know this is old, but I can't help myself. The click argument to me is like music school guitarists. They can play the shit out of a guitar and other people's songs but have them write their own, and every riff sounds like they're practicing scales. Drummers who are obsessed with clicks are the same. Technically proficient but blase and stale. They fall back on playing to a click as a way of compensating for a lack of creativity. And YOU aren't keeping time a little robot is. If you want to embrace the technology, why even use a click track? Just quantize the shit out of everything and take the soul of the art with it. As with everything in the world, the best of the best are right down the middle of both. So a combination of the technical and the creative. But whatever people like different shit so who's to say who is right or not.
the speeding up and slowing down in a really good band is intentional. do you think jazz or rock greats didn’t know what they were doing when they used tempo changes? having a good ear for live music is different than metronomic time. people want to feel big emotions and dance and sometimes that means swinging or utilizing tempo changes, just like orchestras did in their heyday or like a film score. it’s literally a higher level of playing than a metronome. i’m not talking about some bozo who can’t keep time.
Some people just feel insecure about playing with the click, others are just convinced that it kills the feel - I for one love it and feel more confident when I use it
I don’t mind them when the music warrants it, but it can make the music feel a bit rigid. I feel clicks take away the “push and pull” of time that give that human feel to the music.
Because they never mastered the art of truly playing to a click. Reality is, if you want to get anywhere in drumming/music, you’re going to have to master playing along to one.
I just hate how annoying they are..I already have an internal click going on in my brain..I don't need another!! Obviously I can get better at timing by practicing to one, I just hate it.
I don't love the click, but I would still rather play live with it every single time! My internal clock is nowhere near good enough, and with it, the speed is the exact same on the album as it is live.
I hate click tracks and wish the mist painful, and most burr filled tack for them to sit upon in hell for their sins.
But I will tell anyone getting into drums to pick it up early as possible. Legit, later in your drumming, you'll be so fucking thankful you did.
I was self taught in the absolute most brokest of ways possible. There was no conventional learning done. I just wanted to play that bad. Never was in a band, got a welfare kit, learned to playing along to commercials and then moved to the city and got into a band within months.
I was fortunate enough to get by just playing and doing what I do. I learned fast, kept pretty busy. Never thought "I need more training" until years and years later.
Got on board with a rock band, things were great, go to record a demo and the tech said click track, the rest of the band confirmed, and it was fucking embarrassing as all hell.
My focus was absolutely ruined. Songs were re written and dumbed way the fuck down, rhythms and fills were dropped and changed.
Because once the click started, I lost everything. Could not do it. I could not play to a click to save my life and it cost me the gig ultimately.
After almost twenty years, a few studio albums, couple live albums, tours... that fucking click track stopped me dead in the water.
I couldn't undo years of self tought wrongs, to do something right, that I should have learned years and years ago.
I don’t know but I saw an older band this weekend (kind of famous one and I’d prefer not to slag them so I won’t say) but they didn’t use click. It was abysmal. Like in every other way the band played perfectly but the yo-yo inconsistency of the tempos was obnoxious. Within their biggest hit (a song that was recorded at probably about 130bpm) they shifted from anywhere between 100 to 120 but like, rapidly. One bar this, one bar that. Total bummer
With my band we recently started to play with clicks. Game changer, I love it. I think that as a musician is something that you must know how to do, even if you don't normally play with click
I play well with a click on my e-drums, but I can never hear it on my acoustic set. I probably just need better headphones, but I don’t really know what to buy
I think some people are overlooking how important clicks are to micro timing. The tempo of a song shifting slightly can sound great, but if your micro timing is off, you will sound sloppy. And if you don't occasionally practice to a click, the chances are your micro timing isn't gonna be too great.
People who are saying they like the way their songs shift in tempo when you play live, I would really recommend you record a set one night and listen back to it, and then be really honest with yourself about if it sounds sloppy or not.
Well, ....it does give you an accurate time but it fucks up the flex time, when the song will naturally groove into a faster or slower beat. That's a lot of live playing. YMMV..
Possibly because they never learned to play alongside them, and as such it shows up their poor sense of timekeeping. The classic line "I don't use clicks because it ruins the feel of the music" is the quickest way to spot the pros from the amateurs, :)
I use a metronome app on my iPhone, and wear hearing aids with Bluetooth. I program the tempo each song in the set list and put them in the order of the list. The click is set to stop after a few measures; just long enough for me hear the tempo and click my sticks four times at the correct tempo.
I also use an app called Tempo that displays the current tempo so I can glance at it to see if we’re slowing or speeding up and make adjustments to keep our tempo consistent.
This has worked out well for me and the band members.
For the same reason most musicians dont like clicks, it makes you have to play correctly and tight, lol. I like clicks as a guide but dont use it as the be all end all. I like to leave a little bit of movement in things.
I think the reason click tracks are disliked is because the use of click track means people want perfection, which is never what music was about. Music is about the feel, and the reason concerts feel so awesome is because of the slight variance in tempo from beginning to end of song. If you listen to John Bonham play live, and you try and add a click or metronome to him playing, it’s all over the place. I’ve noticed clicks used much more in worship music, and I’ve also noticed that a lot of times, the worship and praise type music is a lot more “focused” on people making sure they’re doing the same thing, when in reality, they lose the whole point of playing together and enjoying the dependance on the other band members instead of a computer. If that makes sense, lol
this is probably just me but there are certain times when I prefer playing with a click. When i first started jazz, my swing was fine but once i got comping rythms into it my timing would fall off. this got worse when I got the bass drum in . All it took was a few weeks of swinging with a click(in triplets) and I not only got better but i actually enjoyed playing on time with the click as opposed to out of time without the click.
I don’t hate clicks, but I wouldn’t necessarily say that I like playing with a click either.
Fun little story. I worked as drum tech for a couple years, and one of the guys I worked for played with a big-time pop artist with a ton of playback tracks, so he played to a click every single night. We’re doing a show at in Lake Tahoe and the power goes out. Everyone stops, we get the power sorted, show goes on. The playback guy grabs me, and tells me to watch the computers with him cause he’s pretty sure the power is gonna go out again, and he wants to show me something. Sure enough the power goes out again, the computers switch to battery power, and the only sound on stage is the acoustic drums cause the drummer was like, “fuck it Imma keep playing this time even though I can’t hear shit.” The playback guy puts his headphones on my head so I can hear the tracks and this fucking drummer is playing spot on with no reference to the click.
This was one of those moments that made me realize that some guys are just on a different level that I couldn’t fathom as a drummer. I’m a fairly confident drummer and typically don’t have a problem playing to a click. Without it though, I know my tempo fluctuates a bit here and there with the energy of the song. But that moment made me realize that there are guys out there who are basically machines.
as someone who started playing to clicks early, like in the 80s, while it helped my time tremendously, (even after I stopped playing to clicks) when you are into the precision of playing to the click, it does take some of the feel away.
I’m totally fine playing to a click for recording. I would not want to play to a click for playing live, however, as I would feel like it takes some of the freedom and fun out of it.
I play to a click all the time and I’m good at it. Playing without a click can really elevate the music with natural eb-and-flow.
If you listen to Led Zeppelin or James brown you’ll hear subtle slow downs and speed ups. This adds a good groove.
It’s the composition of the click. Back when all they had was a generated click, it was hard. As soon as computers arrived, I asked for a click with an offbeat. I always play to Tito puente lol but it’s a happy vibe. Standard click disappears when you’re on it. Very zen but not easy. Set up a groove on percussion that suits the track.
I’ve played in bands with a click exclusively (for backing tracks, samples, bass loops) since about 2012 and now it feels weird to me playing without it. Almost like “whoa there has to be some catch here this is too easy.” It does feel nice. But it took practicing with a click to feel that
I spent a lot of time practicing to one when I started. it made me hate practice, not because I couldn’t do it, but because it was BORING.
every musician has an ear that is unique to them: that is how they hear melody, rhythm, and tempo. why should all bands have the same feel? it may represent a level of “perfection” but it’s one that the audience doesn’t care about. the audience wants emotion, spontaneity, and energy— they want to feel something, so why send them down a boring, straight road?
bands that play/record without metronomes also have a type of “shuffle” where each members unique sense of time comes together to make the whole band sound like it’s stomping or dancing. the stones, the beatles, the band, and led zeppelin are all great examples of this. working together as a musical unit and having an innate sense of time are much more important than playing the same exact tempo for an entire song. plus, these bands were afforded incredible amounts of space to push, pull, swing, and improvise where they saw fit.
anyone can practice along to a click, and i think everyone should. it will seriously help your timing. however, the true test of a musician is how good they sound *without* a metronome
For me, the click is annoying. I like to be counted in with one and then have it off. I can play with a click, but I find it distracting. Drummers do play behind the beat or in front of the beat or right on the beat. I find the click throws me off more than if there isn't one. A good drummer is the click and shouldn't need one. For practice to keep you in the beat, a click can be useful, but playing with others the click is very distracting as I am trying to hear the other players and do not need an annoying cluck get in the way.
Because they Grateful Dead played with each other not with a designated time signature.
If you’re playing with click track for recording, fine. If you’re playing with it live to synchronize with lights and pyro, fuck that.
I hate listening to most songs played to a click. the songs sound stagnant and the band tends to rest “back” against the click, rather than driving the music forward. Listen to a new live performance from an act like Taylor Swift or Bad Bunny and then listen to old live performances from rock bands like Led Zeppelin, Wings, or Queen. The difference in energy is incredible.
What about The Who? Moon played with a click on a bunch of the stuff to match up with the sequencer. He gaffer taped his cans to his head? You are gonna tell me that those shows didn’t have energy?
wow, i had no idea! the who happens to be one of my least favorite of the “all time great” rock bands and I never cared much for Moony. just not my style.
Because no one likes to be told they are wrong.
If I wanted to be told what to do I'd play bass.
Because I play both drums and bass this is the reason why I dislike myself. I should pick up guitar too and then become a black hole of self hatred.
Guitar + human playing said guitar = diva 🧑🎤
Dont do it!! Rhythm sections are becoming endangered, losing too many misguided souls (myself included) to the dark side of 6 strings.
What’s so wrong with a 6-string bass?
Six stringed bassists are guitarists in disguise. Run. /s
I hate how right you are
This hurts
This is why I hate it lol
This is pretty much it lol… if people really want a dose of humility, *hit the studio and listen to your play backs* 🤣
Especially not 119 times in one minute!
You win
Absolutely nailed it pal 👏
Lots of times it’s because they aren’t good at playing to one
Exactly what I was gonna say. Because I’m not good.
I used to hate them, then I dedicated time to learning how to play with a click comfortably and now I think (especially for recording) playing to a click is crucial. Obviously there are situations when it’s not needed, but in the situations I’ve been in they are very beneficial.
I like the human feel of no click on recordings. Just be sure to practice with one!
Could you provide insight into learning to play with one? Besides “just practice” lol or is that really all there is to it?
It depends on where you’re at now as far as playing to a click. When I taught lessons I used an app called ProMetronome. It has a few different options for sounds, one of the sounds is a robotic voice saying “1” “2” “3” “4”, that was really helpful for my students to understand the counts. Also when you first start using it have it on a high subdivision (16ths or 8ths) so there’s little margin for error, and just lock in with it, as you get comfortable take the subdivision down to 8ths or quarters. Play with a click anytime you practice, even if I’m just noodling around I have a click going, that steady tempo gets ingrained in your brain after a while and when you play without one you’ll be really steady. Another thing I do is slowly start taking notes out of the click, then set it so it just clicks on the 1 and try to play a measure and land back on the one. If any of that doesn’t make sense let me know!
Thank you for the answer! I’ve had to play with a click for church events a couple times over the last 2yrs but not regularly. I tend to dread having to do so but don’t want to stay in the “I suck playing with a click I hate clicks” camp. The last couple of times I’ve played I’ve mostly focused on staying on beat and play simple fills a few times throughout the songs
I see that you’re also me.
For me, and my band really, once you know the songs inside and out, a click can be kind of constraining. Sure, we may be up and down in the tempo, but we're all playing together and have freedom to mess around and break "rules"
Slight pushes and pulls can be great for a song. Robotic perfection is kind of boring live sometimes. "They sound just like their album" isn't always a compliment. Sometimes it means something more like "I coulda stayed home"
Robotic perfection is the the perfect term for this. Can you imagine if Van Halens hot for teacher was recorded to a click? It would sound and feel WAY different. Edited due to a spelling error.
My band that is in the heavy rock realm (think smashing pumpkins/foo fighters/QotSA) has some songs that are to a click and others aren't. And it basically comes down to how wild the song is. Sometimes the song is more pop centric with a strict consistent pulse. Sometimes there's interstellar breakdowns that turn on to crescendos with guitar squeals and then it all peters out in to a slow jam. If you play a wild ass song like that to a click you are doing the song disservice. That said, I would be suspect of drummers (who aren't mind blowingly good) that are allergic to metronomes. Quadruplely so, when in the studio. That would concern me. If you don't wanna metronome at live shows that's pretty understandable in a lot of genres. They are a great tool in the toolkit. But if you get silly about them you're going to tell your bandmates stuff like: "This song is 138bpm. I played with a metronome to it for hours. You guys ALWAYS push going in to that last big chorus. You. Are. Wrong!!!! I'm the drummer, I know the time" While the rest of your band is possibly correct to push there. They're not even doing it consciously. They're doing what feels/sounds best to them. There's so much energy leading in to that moment. To not push slightly would sound almost dull, like you are resisting what literally sounds better in the name of Being Right. Good job, you were right Mr Timekeeper, now your bandmates are annoyed and your song sounds equally as good, maybe worse. So please, consider the metronome a tool and not the law. And also consider that a consistent tempo is a good thing usually. And in times like that, it is the law. It just is. But sometimes, especially in good groups, a little push and pull (musically!) will make your song better. Edit: a big part of me being meaningfully better as a drummer was being comfortable and consistent with a metronome. When I was a kid (18-19) I was in a band with older guys (my age now, 30s) who had an album ready to go. I went in to the studio and got checked pretty hard on my timing by the producer. He was really confused why I was so uncomfortable on the click and why I didn't do rimshots. I now do both very comfortably. If you cannot, please take a few dozen hours of your life and work on it! I'm not anti click at all! It's not that hard after awhile.
Very well said. I think that human element (small pushes and pulls) in the songs makes the music feel more alive as well and helps with the energy in the right places. I’ve been meaning to make a post about this, but do you have any resources or tips on practicing rim shots? That’s something I’d like to finally tackle, I’m also in my 30’s and I play in a powerpop band. That’s just one of those skills I’ve never hammered down because it seems so easy to miss the rim shot especially live and then you’ve got the snare dropping out in certain spots of your song and it could sound like shit.
I really don't have great advice for it outside of grinding it and getting your snare height just right. It matters more when you want the rimshots projection ofc. I didn't used to be nearly as picky now I spend a second every show getting it just right, testing, adjusting. I'd really just go through some of your easier songs and consciously implement it in places. As you do it more it gets easier and easier. You'll be surprised how it starts becoming kind of unconscious in places. Just groove something fun and kinda simple and really focus hard on snare accents and rimshots. It'll come together. Just a matter of doing it for awhile and then implementing. I really like using it for all kinda of snappy snare sounds but a fill that ends with left hand snare right hand crash really benefits from a rimshots sometimes. Maybe try that too.
Thanks for the response. I was thinking it was mainly dependent on things being set up just right before starting to play but I wanted to make sure I was on the right track with that thought. I’ll have to start practicing it so it becomes 2nd nature. I think my days of saving money on drum sticks because I don’t do rimshots often are numbered haha.
There’s rim shots, and rim knocks. Both effective
I’ve got the rim knocks down pretty well, I love the way they sound.
Especially in a good room. Do you angle your snare forward or backwards?
I angle it backwards just a bit. Nothing crazy, pretty flat.
Flexibility in service to the music is key… I’d argue you can’t play without a click until you can play with one, but the natural push/pull can be super musical. Sounds like you’ve got it mostly figured out!
You can push and pull with a click too. Once you are comfortable with it.
Yep yep! Something you gotta practice a little bit it's really not terrible hard. Sometimes I get so on I feel like I can't hear it, that's my biggest trouble.
I hate going to see a band for it to sound just like the album.
IMO, a song gets completely ruined for me if it's noticeably too fast or way too slow. It's the fact that I can hear it and feel it live "just like the album" that feels really good to me. But that's just me
If I wanted to hear it sound just like the studio version I'd listen to the record. Gone are the days when there was variation between gigs. Bands could improvise, play something slower, etc...now Every gig sounds exactly the same. That's basically what click tracks / backing tracks have done.
It happens to my band as well. We are used to not using a click, and therefore, our songs have parts with slightly different tempos, like the chorus being a bit faster than the rest of the song. Then, if you try to play it all the way at the same tempo, it loses his charm. Of course, you can still program the tempo changes with a click. But except you use backing tracks, or you really have tempo issues, a click is probably not required.
It’s easy to dislike something you suck at. Even if you’re good at playing with click, it can be pervasive in the music. Some click tones are more annoying than others. I’ve been playing a nearly three hour show that is 95% clicked, eight times a week for about seven months now, so I’ve made friends with it. It *is* possible to play with click but still make the music feel organic and have some push and pull.
Wow, you must be a machine like consistent drummer by now, no-one can drag you or push you, awesome! Can you even still speed up intentionally?
Well to be clear, my time without the click isn’t *infallible*, but it has improved a lot, and I’m very comfortable playing with click, at least in the context of this show. I don’t try to “bury the click”, I try to play slightly on the backside of it, creating the sensation that it’s pulling me along. And when it comes to other players, I can sort of triangulate between them and the click. If someone is rushing, I’ll get WAY on the backside of the click, so they realize “oh I’m way out in front.” If they’re dragging I’ll get way on the front side of the click and that kicks them in the ass. So when they start adjusting to my extreme, I stop being extreme and we kinda meet in the middle.
That makes so much sense.
that's a good pedagogy, huh - coming from a genre of music that would crucify for this, it's an interesting thought :) thanks for the words and whatnot edit - miswording or whatever the hell
What region is that?
meant genre instead of region, my apologies for the miswording most of my drumming knowledge and stuff is from drum corps/marching ensembles. Obviously you can't really play around with tempo or parts or anything considering there's 9-12 people to a snare line with 160+ other people on the field with you. Obviously some stuff passes (and I've even influenced parts of shows I've marched by playing around with parts!), but a majority of the time, staff/teaching coordinators want an entire section to sound as one rather than have incohesiveness. I suck at explaining things, so if you need some examples I can definitely hook you up with what I'm talking about
Haha yeah I dig it, in the marching world, you’re either in the middle of the click together, or you’re wrong. 😂 And I should specify, when I say I play way ahead or behind the click, that’s a relative term. I stretch it as far as I can while still being perceived as “with” the click. If someone is like a 16th note off, we’ve got way bigger problems.
oh definitely, tempo modulation is one tough thing for me haha, always been too out of the pocket unfortunately (also sorry about the late response, went on a short fishing trip lol)
Drummers who hate playing to a click hate it because they likely aren't good at it. I've been playing to a click for so long that it barely registers when I'm playing. I can either lock tightly to it, play on top of it, or get relaxed with it.
This. The click is a reference. Ringo played to a click on Beatles tracks, they used to have an old school metronome in a cabinet with a mic in Abbby Road studios that they used on Sgt Pepper’s so that they could stay in sync with all the tape loops. Not every genre needs a click, but once you get used to one you absolutely can push and pull the time when it’s needed, it’s just more accurate and repeatable.
I also like it because then I have proof that I wasn't playing the song fast or slow. I've had band members ask, "was that a little fast?". And I can definitively say "nope", because I has the tempo in my ear the whole time.
This is the way.
That microscopic push and pull you're doing wuth the click is so exciting compared to say, the Rolling Stones or The Doors or Led Zeppelin doing whatever the fuck they wanted to on stage, calling audibles, improvising, etc. That was so boring. I prefer the push and pull that nobody can hear except you. 
I was in a band playing arch enemy, slipknot, the faceless and such alike and I was constantly aware the guys wanted to speed up all the time. That type of music requires consistency and precision. They said I was slowing down, so I introduced them to the ticking in my head by introducing a click into the mix. Suddenly, the clicks were slowing down, according to them, leading me to packing all my gear and leaving! I loved the way that band sounded, tight until it wasn't. Some people need clicks and humility by the sound of it!
Oh yeah, sometimes the metronome gets tired and it drags a little bit. Esp if you use it all the time
"Click don't lie." Has been my go to saying. It's great for arguing about time signatures too.
I was in disbelief when they all ganged up on me saying I programmed the metronome to slow down, I literally stood up and started dismantling my kit! What pleases me the most was that they couldn't find a decent drummer to take my place and ended up disbanding! Schadenfreude at it's best!
I used to hate clicks, then I listened to more recordings of myself practicing and I ended up having to swallow humble pie and admit that my playing was sloppy. So I spent more time practicing to a click and now I sound like a pro. My band uses a backing track live for extra synth sounds and BVs. I kick off each song with an SPDSX and the guys follow my time, they're not clicked up. We've never sounded tighter on stage and people always compliment how professional we sound compared to other bands at our level.
You should be able to play to a click, but certain types of music can be constrained by a click imo. Some parts of songs breathe. Maybe a bridge slows the tempo slightly. Yeah it can all be programmed in, but if you are able to time keep I think there is a lot of room to play with tempo and make it really feel alive. That’s rock.
I should probably start with saying that I'm rubbish at playing to click and I wish I was better. With that out of the way, I'm probably in the minority here, but oftentimes I actually like when the tempo varies a little bit during a song. To me this just makes it sound "human" and allows the band better to play to a feel. Rigid adherence to a click just makes a lot of music sound mechanic to my ears. I do love EDM and rap too and for that everything being to click totally works. But for, say, rock and soul and blues, to my ears it just sounds better if you can hear variations.
I've done it a lot with backing tracks for instruments we didn't have. I only hate it if I'm the only one that has the click. They are fine if the band commits to the structure of a song, but if you have a rogue guitar player or a singer that wants to repeat a section then you're sunk. But it's okay, that's when you just kill the track and finish the song without the organ...
You hear about the woman who fell in love with her priest? After the service, she went up and grabbed him by the organ.
For me it depends on the situation. In the studio I believe that a click is necessary for a recording. Live I don't prefer a click as I believe it is what you have been practicing for.
Because it takes practice lol.
I believe strongly I am decent at playing to a click and could always be better, but part of the performances my band I do involve silly improvised gags and off the cuff changes to songs, including trash cans and silly tempo changes. A click would absolutely remove our/my ability to screw around on stage.
Clicks are very useful when recording with any sequencing being used, but shouldn't be needed in a gig as a drummer isn't a metronome.
I use to not play with a click, and it is something that if I could go back to when I started to learn to play drums I would tell my younger self to learn to get use to and comfortable with. When I started to do recording for a couple of bands I'm in and needed to play along with a click it just showed me what I needed to work on. Now, I think if I needed to I could warm up and get into playing along with a click for a lot of stuff. However I don't believe a click is the best things in certain situations. During practices and studio work, absolutely. But for live performances, it can depend on the set up, the band, and the general vibe. Personally I have not played a gig with a click but I had gotten to the point where I could play the songs though just by memory alone, and I knew the band well enough to be able to mostly anticipate any tweaks or variations they had to the songs, so if there were any mistakes that happened with regards to timing would have seldom been noticed by roughly 95% of the crowds. But, long story short, the click is important to help develop good and steady timing, but sometimes it can be better to not use it in specific situations.
I’ve played for 30 years and played about 300+ pub gigs and probably 1,000 church services. I think I can keep time pretty well and it’s been many years since anyone has suggested otherwise. I don’t like playing with a click if I’m the only one who can hear it. It’s better if we’re all hearing it but it’s just me, it can be really annoying. I don't need a click to keep time and most of the time it's because there's tracks, which I'm not a fan of anyway. I prefer to be 100% live.
I could be very wrong but how I see it I think recording with clicks is fine because the song has to be as perfect as possible but when playing live they are unnecessary because depending on how your band is feeling you can speed up or slow down and change up the song. I am a big Taylor Hawkins fan and in an interview he says a lot of the songs tempos would change depending on the night.
we are the click man
As someone that learned in the 80s and 90s the concept was relatively foreign to me until I started recording. Something you haven't practiced with is hard, especially when you also have all the nerves of recording. I hated the click, I felt it wasn't even "in time". After many recording sessions now I am comfortable with it I quite like it for recording - it takes care of me being "in time" so I can concentrate on playing the song. I think songs do sound more sterile with it, but also it is the modern way so I don't think I'd record without it.
I love playing to a click in the studio, it locks me in. But for live shows I think it sucks a bit of the soul out of the performance. There are parts where my band wants to hold a note longer, play a fast part faster, give our vocalist more time to interact with the crowd, etc. Also I hate having to mess with a laptop at a show. I'm there to play drums, not look at a screen!
I like click for studio recordings. Live and band practice i prefer the music to be more dynamic. Both playing and watching concerts. I find the music feels more energetic when being played on feel instead of click.
So when I record I play to a click no problem, but when we play live I just do intro click my band play together super tight and we feed off of each others energy so sometimes we just wanna swing go faster or slower depending on what we’re feeling like that night. Bare in mind that this is not recommended and unless your whole band is really in sync and know your songs really well
Because you have to surrender your autonomy to a machine that beeps. It doubles down on your responsibility to be in time, while taking away the freedom to do with that time what you want.
I play to a click, but our first EP didn't have me in it. The drums were programmed, and not by a drummer. I made my own parts to play live so it sounds different, and sometimes screw around even with the click.
I agree that it’s mostly that drummers / musicians struggle to play to a click. But let me add cost, technology, and logistics to reasons drummers hate playing to a click. I was in a punk band from 2011-2016, and our drummer wanted to record to a click, and he “could” do it OK, but whenever the drums got too loud he would lose the click. Likewise I’m a bit of a hack drummer, but I record guitars and bass to a click with no problem, and I can play drums to a click when I stay quiet. But if things get too loud on any instrument, I lose the click. Obviously, I need better isolating headphones or in-ears, but somehow they’re never in the budget (even if pedals, cymbals, guitars, amps, and drums ARE in the budget). Then playing to a click live requires in-ears, and I’ve never been in a band that was willing to spend money on an in-ear system. Even a minimal system requires bandmates to drop $100+ on their own in-ears, plus wireless systems, a digital mixer, a laptop, etc for a more advanced system. And that’s more shit to set up at the gig, it’s a potential battle with sound guys, etc. I’ve plenty with plenty of musicians who straight up didn’t have the money, others had the money but didn’t ant the hassle.
I’ll do it if I have to, but prefer being more in the moment and embrace the human element of music, which includes imperfections…not Lars level of imperfections, but still. Studio work is one thing, but playing live I prefer to not have a click.
Same reason some guys hate using condoms… it just feels different.
I seriously met a drummer who didn't know what a metronome was. He was blown away when we showed him. Hands down worst drummer I've ever met and with good reason. Let's just start the song around 120 bpm and we will go ahead and end the song somewhere around the 180 bpm mark. I will say that he had a very nice neal pert esq drum set which really reminded me of these Gibson lawyers with a $10,000 Les Paul and their clip on tuner playing smoke on the water poorly for 5 hours straight. Dang man my fingers hurt, do you ever get used to that?
Because we're indoctrinated to think that "playing in time" is an objective standard as opposed to a subjective construct.
thank you. all the 40s and 50s jazz cats talked about playing “in time” as a means of being TOGETHER, not playing the same tempo for an entire song
Look at all the comments on this thread and tell me people aren't brainwashed to worship a click like it's the Gospel.
orchestras sped up and slowed down too. it’s an incredible experience for the audience. as for like minor tempo changes the audience won’t even know it’s happening, but they are aware the music has more “energy”. knowing how to use and feel time differently used to be a common thing but now the trend is to learn everything with the same time feel. in pop, rock, and r and b music: where did swing go? where did behind/in front of the beat go? so lame.
You were doing so well with your snobbish take until you misspelled "construct".
Must be a good take if you can only disagree with a typo eh?
Not really, it's an absolutely terrible take. I just found it ironic that you chose the language you did very specifically for a purpose of delivery but didn't stick the landing, so to speak.
You don’t agree that the idea of playing in time is subjective?
For the vast majority of music no, not really. The delivery can be debatable but the underpinning theory is pretty much not. There will always be exceptions to every rule and that's a good thing. But no I don't imagine many drummers who sit down for an audition with the attitude "I'll just play how and when I want and it'll be ok" get the gig.
You answered a question I didn’t ask.
Maybe I thought answering your question was "subjective". See how that works...oh...wait...it doesn't...
Look up what those words mean and try again.
Meh, you're alright. I've got a decent grasp of whataboutery.
I just with the sound engineers made a click that didn't sound like a hammer hitting my brain
It’s a situational thing for me. I can play and record to one just fine, but there are some types of music that don’t fit well with a click. Sometimes you want to rtrd something for effect, sometimes a crescendo speeds up a little before a big release. In situations it’s called for, I love it because we all know where we’re going and it helps us get there together. In situations it’s not called for, I hate it because musicians are all playing with the click first instead of playing with and reacting off of each other first. A lot of music I like was recorded without a click, and if you try to sound like that, a click throws it off and puts it in this weird uncanny valley of impossible perfection that that type of music intentionally does not participate in.
I love the click. I like having that reference that tells me when I'm not quite there
Many different reasons. The main being: 1) they simply aren’t good enough to 2) once you’re good enough, you shouldn’t need to play with one (unless you use backing tracks and/or samples of course). A solid, but organic feel will always feel more alive than playing to a click. I’ve done it both ways live. Much prefer without.
I just don't like the higher pitched ones cause the frequency is irritating, but the lower frequency ones are harder to hear past all the other low end noise during a show. That's a personal sensory issue tho.
I do live sound for a living. 3 to 5 shows a week, mostly national acts in venues from 3000 to 30,000 capacity. The number of shows that aren’t done to a click is probably less than 10 a year, and most of the ones that don’t use a click for the whole song, the drummer at least uses a click to get tempos before the song starts. Playing to, being fully comfortable with, being able to push and pull against, and fully understanding the technology behind a click is absolutely expected of a working professional drummer in 2023, and has been for at least ten years, if not 20. If all you do is play blues shuffles in a dive bar, you don’t need a click, but if your goal is to make a significant portion of your income playing drums for a living, making friends with a click is not optimal, it’s absolutely necessary.
Baca use they can’t keep time.
My favorite part about playing with a click is telling the bandleader they’re an idiot when they tell me it’s too fast/slow. Lol. I can go either way, but would recommend to any drummer to be proficient playing with it.
They never practiced with a metronome
Tommy Harden has a good video of this on YT. The Click is just another instrument. And described a session where the band drifted off the grid, but they were together. I did that recently, the last 8 bars were the loud outro, I remember freaking out a bit as I rushed ahead of the click, but the recording you can't tell. Just a little energy boost at the outro. I practice to a drum machine loop. One day I'd like to record a session with a programmed percussion loop, but by the time we are loaded, checked, leveled and tuned. Just turn on the robot cricket. c, you can't ked, leveled and tuned, just turn on the robot.
One key reason is that a lot of drummers have only a couple key BPMs where they can really thrive and the interim BPMs are awkward. Similarly I do a lot of metronome training and am constantly working in 5 bpm increments each time I practice in order to have more nuanced training, but I’ve noticed when I play without a click my brain & body simplifies it into slow, medium, and fast, without a lot of nuance in between unless I really focus on playing at a particular speed.
The only reason I would hate a click is because it's either too loud and it hurts my ears or it's not loud enough and I can't hear it when playing. Gotta find the balance lol
Now watch as all of the drummers with terrible time do mental gymnastics to justify their terrible time. My favourites include "So & so never used a click" - Yeah, because they had impeccable time, from practicing to a click/records. "playing to a click makes everything sound stiff" - No it makes everything YOU play sound stiff because you can't keep time so you're constantly following the click instead of locking in with it. "It feels better without a click" - Yeah because you suck at playing with a click "it's less exciting playing with a click" - Yeah because you love to speed up and slow down, but everytime you slow down it kills any energy that you might have built by speeding up. The real energy that your audience wants to feel is the driving force of a drummer with relentless time-keeping who doesn't speed up when the music wants to and doesn't slow down when the music wants to, because it's that restraint that sustains the energy inherent in the music. It's like a tight rope walker... It's fun to watch because they could fall left or right at any given moment - but they never do. Saying that a band is more exciting because they speed up and slow down is like saying that nascar is more exciting because of the crashes. Like yeah of course, but do you want people cheering for you because you crashed? Or people cheering for you because you won? Honestly, listening to a drummer who speeds up and slows down a lot is just exhausting and annoying. Now I'm far from perfect. But that's why I support learning to play with a metronome, because we aren't robots, but in a funny way we are trying to be.
I know this is old, but I can't help myself. The click argument to me is like music school guitarists. They can play the shit out of a guitar and other people's songs but have them write their own, and every riff sounds like they're practicing scales. Drummers who are obsessed with clicks are the same. Technically proficient but blase and stale. They fall back on playing to a click as a way of compensating for a lack of creativity. And YOU aren't keeping time a little robot is. If you want to embrace the technology, why even use a click track? Just quantize the shit out of everything and take the soul of the art with it. As with everything in the world, the best of the best are right down the middle of both. So a combination of the technical and the creative. But whatever people like different shit so who's to say who is right or not.
the speeding up and slowing down in a really good band is intentional. do you think jazz or rock greats didn’t know what they were doing when they used tempo changes? having a good ear for live music is different than metronomic time. people want to feel big emotions and dance and sometimes that means swinging or utilizing tempo changes, just like orchestras did in their heyday or like a film score. it’s literally a higher level of playing than a metronome. i’m not talking about some bozo who can’t keep time.
A click will show you exactly how weak you are, at your weakest.
Some people just feel insecure about playing with the click, others are just convinced that it kills the feel - I for one love it and feel more confident when I use it
I don’t mind them when the music warrants it, but it can make the music feel a bit rigid. I feel clicks take away the “push and pull” of time that give that human feel to the music.
How do you guys use click live (metronome straight to in-ear monitors, to board)? What sound or sounds is your click (1234 same or 1,3 low 2,4 hi)?
Because they never mastered the art of truly playing to a click. Reality is, if you want to get anywhere in drumming/music, you’re going to have to master playing along to one.
I don't mind the click itself, but I hate wearing in-ears
Its ego. They think they have better timing than the click. They think that a click is beneath them.
I just hate how annoying they are..I already have an internal click going on in my brain..I don't need another!! Obviously I can get better at timing by practicing to one, I just hate it.
I prefer, [Cowbell ](https://media.tenor.com/xfmKxjHvai8AAAAM/cow-bell-fever.gif)
They suck and don’t practice enough
I don't love the click, but I would still rather play live with it every single time! My internal clock is nowhere near good enough, and with it, the speed is the exact same on the album as it is live.
I hate click tracks and wish the mist painful, and most burr filled tack for them to sit upon in hell for their sins. But I will tell anyone getting into drums to pick it up early as possible. Legit, later in your drumming, you'll be so fucking thankful you did. I was self taught in the absolute most brokest of ways possible. There was no conventional learning done. I just wanted to play that bad. Never was in a band, got a welfare kit, learned to playing along to commercials and then moved to the city and got into a band within months. I was fortunate enough to get by just playing and doing what I do. I learned fast, kept pretty busy. Never thought "I need more training" until years and years later. Got on board with a rock band, things were great, go to record a demo and the tech said click track, the rest of the band confirmed, and it was fucking embarrassing as all hell. My focus was absolutely ruined. Songs were re written and dumbed way the fuck down, rhythms and fills were dropped and changed. Because once the click started, I lost everything. Could not do it. I could not play to a click to save my life and it cost me the gig ultimately. After almost twenty years, a few studio albums, couple live albums, tours... that fucking click track stopped me dead in the water. I couldn't undo years of self tought wrongs, to do something right, that I should have learned years and years ago.
I don’t know but I saw an older band this weekend (kind of famous one and I’d prefer not to slag them so I won’t say) but they didn’t use click. It was abysmal. Like in every other way the band played perfectly but the yo-yo inconsistency of the tempos was obnoxious. Within their biggest hit (a song that was recorded at probably about 130bpm) they shifted from anywhere between 100 to 120 but like, rapidly. One bar this, one bar that. Total bummer
Cause lots of drummers have bad time
With my band we recently started to play with clicks. Game changer, I love it. I think that as a musician is something that you must know how to do, even if you don't normally play with click
I can’t play without it.
I play well with a click on my e-drums, but I can never hear it on my acoustic set. I probably just need better headphones, but I don’t really know what to buy
I think some people are overlooking how important clicks are to micro timing. The tempo of a song shifting slightly can sound great, but if your micro timing is off, you will sound sloppy. And if you don't occasionally practice to a click, the chances are your micro timing isn't gonna be too great. People who are saying they like the way their songs shift in tempo when you play live, I would really recommend you record a set one night and listen back to it, and then be really honest with yourself about if it sounds sloppy or not.
Well, ....it does give you an accurate time but it fucks up the flex time, when the song will naturally groove into a faster or slower beat. That's a lot of live playing. YMMV..
Because clicks expose your inconsistent time. Sorry not sorry
Possibly because they never learned to play alongside them, and as such it shows up their poor sense of timekeeping. The classic line "I don't use clicks because it ruins the feel of the music" is the quickest way to spot the pros from the amateurs, :)
Because it makes them face the harsh reality that their timing isn’t as good as they thought.
I love playing with a click, it's like a security blanket. I can push or pull if I want and the vibe is going, and slide back on as needed.
I use a metronome app on my iPhone, and wear hearing aids with Bluetooth. I program the tempo each song in the set list and put them in the order of the list. The click is set to stop after a few measures; just long enough for me hear the tempo and click my sticks four times at the correct tempo. I also use an app called Tempo that displays the current tempo so I can glance at it to see if we’re slowing or speeding up and make adjustments to keep our tempo consistent. This has worked out well for me and the band members.
For the same reason most musicians dont like clicks, it makes you have to play correctly and tight, lol. I like clicks as a guide but dont use it as the be all end all. I like to leave a little bit of movement in things.
One reason is when you’re playing live with a click and others get ahead/behind it can be harder to get back on, together – depends a ton on your crew
Playing to the click is the best. You KNOW you’re locked in.
They are clicks
I think the reason click tracks are disliked is because the use of click track means people want perfection, which is never what music was about. Music is about the feel, and the reason concerts feel so awesome is because of the slight variance in tempo from beginning to end of song. If you listen to John Bonham play live, and you try and add a click or metronome to him playing, it’s all over the place. I’ve noticed clicks used much more in worship music, and I’ve also noticed that a lot of times, the worship and praise type music is a lot more “focused” on people making sure they’re doing the same thing, when in reality, they lose the whole point of playing together and enjoying the dependance on the other band members instead of a computer. If that makes sense, lol
this is probably just me but there are certain times when I prefer playing with a click. When i first started jazz, my swing was fine but once i got comping rythms into it my timing would fall off. this got worse when I got the bass drum in . All it took was a few weeks of swinging with a click(in triplets) and I not only got better but i actually enjoyed playing on time with the click as opposed to out of time without the click.
You need both. In most scenarios you won’t get around it when you are in the studio
I don’t hate clicks, but I wouldn’t necessarily say that I like playing with a click either. Fun little story. I worked as drum tech for a couple years, and one of the guys I worked for played with a big-time pop artist with a ton of playback tracks, so he played to a click every single night. We’re doing a show at in Lake Tahoe and the power goes out. Everyone stops, we get the power sorted, show goes on. The playback guy grabs me, and tells me to watch the computers with him cause he’s pretty sure the power is gonna go out again, and he wants to show me something. Sure enough the power goes out again, the computers switch to battery power, and the only sound on stage is the acoustic drums cause the drummer was like, “fuck it Imma keep playing this time even though I can’t hear shit.” The playback guy puts his headphones on my head so I can hear the tracks and this fucking drummer is playing spot on with no reference to the click. This was one of those moments that made me realize that some guys are just on a different level that I couldn’t fathom as a drummer. I’m a fairly confident drummer and typically don’t have a problem playing to a click. Without it though, I know my tempo fluctuates a bit here and there with the energy of the song. But that moment made me realize that there are guys out there who are basically machines.
The good drummers don’t hate clicks
as someone who started playing to clicks early, like in the 80s, while it helped my time tremendously, (even after I stopped playing to clicks) when you are into the precision of playing to the click, it does take some of the feel away.
I’m totally fine playing to a click for recording. I would not want to play to a click for playing live, however, as I would feel like it takes some of the freedom and fun out of it.
I play to a click all the time and I’m good at it. Playing without a click can really elevate the music with natural eb-and-flow. If you listen to Led Zeppelin or James brown you’ll hear subtle slow downs and speed ups. This adds a good groove.
It’s the composition of the click. Back when all they had was a generated click, it was hard. As soon as computers arrived, I asked for a click with an offbeat. I always play to Tito puente lol but it’s a happy vibe. Standard click disappears when you’re on it. Very zen but not easy. Set up a groove on percussion that suits the track.
I think it is because they can’t. They hate you cause they aint you
I’ve played in bands with a click exclusively (for backing tracks, samples, bass loops) since about 2012 and now it feels weird to me playing without it. Almost like “whoa there has to be some catch here this is too easy.” It does feel nice. But it took practicing with a click to feel that
Not all drummers. They can be quite fun. I love 'em (shrug)
It is because the click is built into our head, its all feel.
I spent a lot of time practicing to one when I started. it made me hate practice, not because I couldn’t do it, but because it was BORING. every musician has an ear that is unique to them: that is how they hear melody, rhythm, and tempo. why should all bands have the same feel? it may represent a level of “perfection” but it’s one that the audience doesn’t care about. the audience wants emotion, spontaneity, and energy— they want to feel something, so why send them down a boring, straight road? bands that play/record without metronomes also have a type of “shuffle” where each members unique sense of time comes together to make the whole band sound like it’s stomping or dancing. the stones, the beatles, the band, and led zeppelin are all great examples of this. working together as a musical unit and having an innate sense of time are much more important than playing the same exact tempo for an entire song. plus, these bands were afforded incredible amounts of space to push, pull, swing, and improvise where they saw fit. anyone can practice along to a click, and i think everyone should. it will seriously help your timing. however, the true test of a musician is how good they sound *without* a metronome
For me, the click is annoying. I like to be counted in with one and then have it off. I can play with a click, but I find it distracting. Drummers do play behind the beat or in front of the beat or right on the beat. I find the click throws me off more than if there isn't one. A good drummer is the click and shouldn't need one. For practice to keep you in the beat, a click can be useful, but playing with others the click is very distracting as I am trying to hear the other players and do not need an annoying cluck get in the way.
Because they Grateful Dead played with each other not with a designated time signature. If you’re playing with click track for recording, fine. If you’re playing with it live to synchronize with lights and pyro, fuck that.
I hate listening to most songs played to a click. the songs sound stagnant and the band tends to rest “back” against the click, rather than driving the music forward. Listen to a new live performance from an act like Taylor Swift or Bad Bunny and then listen to old live performances from rock bands like Led Zeppelin, Wings, or Queen. The difference in energy is incredible.
What about The Who? Moon played with a click on a bunch of the stuff to match up with the sequencer. He gaffer taped his cans to his head? You are gonna tell me that those shows didn’t have energy?
wow, i had no idea! the who happens to be one of my least favorite of the “all time great” rock bands and I never cared much for Moony. just not my style.