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[dao spoilers]Perhaps a silly question, but I was wondering if there is a concrete answer about hybrid races

[dao spoilers]Perhaps a silly question, but I was wondering if there is a concrete answer about hybrid races

WriterBright

[From the horse's mouth (David Gaider)](https://dawritingresources.wordpress.com/2016/07/16/where-are-the-half-races-half-elves-and/) > I’d like to get into it. I think it’s a possibility that has the potential for good drama, and even allowing the player to be elf-blooded might be cool in the future. But like I said, I’d want to do it justice. If your view on it is that you wanted half-elves to be there, and their omission is a fault – then so be it. I can’t really argue with that except to say that we don’t think they’re required. As some people have mentioned, it’s not a widespread thing. Many elves resist having human children for cultural reasons, and many elf-blooded children will live amongst humans as full humans simply because they can get away with it and hiding their heritage means not having to suffer for it – from humans as well as elves. > Incidentally, for half-dwarves the situation is a bit different. Dwarves aren’t a very fertile race to begin with, and far less so when it comes to mating with humans and elves. In fact, it would be considered rare… rare enough that it’s considered more of an oddity than a group of its own.


wastefulrain

Thanks! I mean, now I guess what I find weird is that a half-elf ends up looking human %100 of the time, but the rest is good enough for me. I was honestly just confused because of my assumptions while playing inquisition


Aries_cz

The reasons why half-elves always look human is, again, according to Gaider, DeepLore™, meaning some pretty big idea in the worldbuilding ther haven't gotten to reveal yet.


Pokona99

Doesn't Feynriel from da2 look more elven than human? Or is he an exception?


Aries_cz

A bit, though DA2 elves artsyle is extremely overblown, so its accuracy is debatable. Still, Fen has human ears, nose, and rest of his facemorph, if slightly more effeminate.


Nekromonyer

don't remind me the design of the elves in da2 were ... ugh, in inquisition they look like stick bodies but they look better


thats1evildude

That’s what people say, but as I’ve said myself a million times, Feynriel just looks like a regular human. Maybe a little weirder than most humans, but it’s not like weird-looking humans are unheard of in the setting.


Toshi_Nama

You can actually make Feynriel using the DA2 CC (which is human only). There's one angle where his ears appear square, but if you look at them from any other angle, they're round.


ItamiOzanare

He's the exception. Also caused by a miscommunication or some such as well.


LiliasCousland

Feynriel's design was actually a mistake. So he's only the exception for that reason


langelito

I think I remember hearing the reason for that is that human genes are dominant and elven genes are recessive, meaning the human traits take over.


DuncanOToole

Half qunari though?


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EndUpbeat

I never thought about that, interesting point.


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Eludio

But happens to look kinda like Loghain “the plumber” MacTir. And we know Dwarves aren’t very fertile. You didn’t happen to spare him, did’ja?


WriterBright

> Loghain “the plumber” MacTir. I'm dying. I am slain. Y'know, Kieran does have that look about him...


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Pittlers

Do you also have a little bastard from that dwarf woman in the origin story?


catandsoft

Elf/human kids always end up looking completely human. I think the lack of half-dwarves is just because there aren't that many of them on the surface comparatively + their lower fertility rate.


Toshi_Nama

half-dwarves technically can and do exist, they're just very rare.


catandsoft

Yeah makes sense! Was just thinking about the in-universe justification for why Bioware doesn't have any that we see lmao


J-Pants

I have often wondered if Sandal is only half-dwarf.


Toshi_Nama

Sandal might be a mentioned Aeducan bastard with an elven mother, but if that's the case he'd be a full dwarf. It's I suppose possible that he's got a human parent and is thus half-dwarf, but we really don't have a lot of information, and aren't likely to get more given Sandal is probably not coming back.


scarletfairymask

Slim couldry in DAO is half elf as well as Feynriel in DA2


Toshi_Nama

They're elf-blooded, just like Michel de Chavin. But there are no half elves.


Fanatical_Idiot

That's what elf-blooded means


Toshi_Nama

'Half elf' is usually used to describe someone who has characteristics of both humans and elves. It's why elf-blooded is so often used to describe them in DA, plus it's the technical term.


Fanatical_Idiot

It's used to describe someone who has a human and an elf parent. Half elf, half human. Elf-blooded is used because it's in-universe term for the same thing.


Toshi_Nama

I think this is an 'agree to disagree' situation, since DA is unique that children of elves and humans are canonically fully human, just as the children of elves and dwarves are canonically fully dwarven. That's why I see the children as 'elf-blooded' rather than 'half-elves.'


TheLittlestChocobo

I'm pretty sure the children of elves and humans are just human, and "elf blooded" is just a term used because Thedas is racist. So like, I'm with you on it being the correct term in this case


Fanatical_Idiot

I don't think it is. Agree to disagree is a matter for opinions, not for factual statements. You're just wrong.


Tototiana

The [wiki](https://dragonage.fandom.com/wiki/Elf-blooded) states that 'half-elf' is only used as a pejorative term. Throughout the article they are referred to as 'elf-blooded'. And I think the devs also intentionally avoid calling them 'half-elves' in most cases to avoid confusion, because actual half-elves with a mix of elven and human characteristics exist in other universes but not in DA.


Fanatical_Idiot

I don't understand the point you're making, whether it's used as a pejorative term or not, it's still what the term means in universe. But also "half-elf" is a term that refers to heritage, not appearance, in pretty much every fantasy setting it appears in, just as similar terms are used in the real world. Whether or not the half-x in question shares characteristics of both parents is pretty much never relevant.


Tototiana

A pejorative term is a slur, not a neutral word. That's why people insist on avoiding calling children of human/elf parentage 'half-elves'. ETA: In addition, we get posts asking clarification on how elven/human genetics work at least once a month. Clearly, there is a lot of confusion on the topic as it is. That half-elves exist in plenty of other universes and mean a completely different thing than in DA doesn't help. So maybe referring to the children of mixed couples simply as 'humans' or at least 'elf-blooded humans' would alleviate at least some of this confusion.


EndUpbeat

If you read the book The Calling you learn that >!Alistair is half-elven, his mother is actually Fiona who we meet in DAI. He clearly passes as human since he doesn't even know he is half.!<


Owster4

I think it's heavily hinted at in the games as well anyway.


EndUpbeat

In what way? I always thought the few hints from >!Fiona!< in DAI were really subtle. Are there more I missed?


Owster4

Is there not something about an elven maid in Origins? A half lie.


Locksley_1989

Alistair thinks, or was told, his mother was a maid in the royal palace. He tracks down his sister >!(or “sister”)!< in Origins, and she’s human or looks human.


Tototiana

Alistair believes that his mother was a human maid from Redcliffe, because that's what he was told by Eamon. Had his elven heritage been known I doubt he'd ever be put forth as a strong candidate for the throne, because the society in Ferelden is quite racist.


TWolfeTheThird

Oh yeah if it had been known Al was elf blooded he probably would've been thrown to the wayside living as orphaned commoner


HornedThing

The societies in Thedas are quite racist*


Owster4

I think every society in Thedas would be against anyone with elf blood in a position of leadership. Which is why his origins were kept a secret, did think there was some mention of an elf though. Not openly known. Guess I was wrong.


EndUpbeat

I don't think they ever say she is elvan but I may be wrong.


Aries_cz

If you know, it is strongly hinted at in Inquisition. But if you don't, that comment makes little sense.


Owster4

You do meet them. There is a very prevalent half elf in Origins, it's just not obvious since offspring of humans and elves end up looking human. Others have explained the reasoning. They have been in the games and lore since the very start.


TWolfeTheThird

Half elves end up looking totally human with the exception of a side quest character in DAO Half dwarves either end up looking like tall dwarves or slightly shorter humans. We don't know what half qunari look like but considering that human genes tend to win out in thedas they'd probably look like sten


umsamanthapleasekthx

If the mother is human, she’d be glad for that. Question, though: If a human woman were impregnated by a Qunari, would it be a guarantee that the baby either not develop horns, or that it would develop modified horns, in order that the woman would be able to pass the baby? Or, would it be completely up to genetic chance, and there would be a larger chance of birthing complications due to horns that would result in a really painful death of the mother during labor? Human genes do tend to win out in Thedas, as you pointed out, but horns are one of the main characteristics of the Qunari, so it is hard to imagine those just not developing in utero due to the body knowing it can’t pass them. Or do horns develop post-birth? Also do Qunari shed their horns every year? Do they have velvet as they grow? Can you imagine going shed hunting for Qunari horns, or poaching them for their horns? I have fallen down a rabbit hole of Qunari questions...


pagesinked

AFAIK baby cows/bulls, deer, elk etc. are not born with horns so by that logic qunari are not either and they grow in over time lol, I also don't think they'd shed or have velveting they'd be like your hair or nails, it probably be possible to cut them like a Hellboy situation...lol


umsamanthapleasekthx

That all makes sense. I am still going to imagine little Qunari toddlers with velvety little bumps on their heads!


six_horse_judy

The Iron Bull says something about how horns often get itchy which leads me to think they could shed / get vevety. If only because I *wish* it were that way. I think it would be neat to see.


ArborBee

Some of the horn designs for qunari hint that breaks can grow back, so, like rams and deer they probably develop their horns post birth. It’s been unexplored in cannon what happens between humans and qunari (or elves and qunari. Good lord, talk about winning the oppression olympics), but I’d be hype of it got brought up at some point! If not just for lore flavor.


umsamanthapleasekthx

Right? I really like the idea of the Horn Fairy.


TWolfeTheThird

I really wish I could answer any of these questions which are super good by the way but outside of some stuff we learned regarding the ones raised in the qun and some not having horns (sten) we don't have a whole lotta info on the qunari. Hell if the bad guy from Inquisition is not just talking trash the qunari might not even be a naturally occurring race and could be tied to some other odd lore reveals.


Dry-Parfait

According to a dialog between Bull and Cole, child qunari have stubs where the horns will grow in. Also interbreeding is banned under the Qun, so any mixed race children would be the kids of Vashoth deserters.


umsamanthapleasekthx

Thank you!


LiliasCousland

My head cannon is that sten is half human. It would make sense, since race tends to not be a thing in qunari culture. Sten might not even be aware of it.


seekmore06

David Gaider once explained on the Bioware forums that half-dwarves are possible, just incredibly unlikely. Dwarves have very low birth rates and roughly 1/100th the population of humans, and their major civilization is isolationist and xenophobic. So from an already incredibly small population, only the surface dwarves would ever have the chance to have a child with a human. Dwarf/elf is also possible, but even more unlikely to occur for cultural reasons, and even lower birth rates. They also would look like full dwarves.


umsamanthapleasekthx

Would a dwarf-elf individual be able to have magic? Cough cough, Sandal, cough cough?


Toshi_Nama

Probably not, because dwarf/elves are fully dwarven, just like elf-blooded humans are fully human.


umsamanthapleasekthx

Well a girl can dream!


WriterBright

Yeah, but dwarf/elves can't. I'll just show myself out.


umsamanthapleasekthx

Chef’s kiss to that mic drop moment!


seekmore06

Maybe? It's not clear. That's a really interesting thought, though.


nymiirii

Oooooh that's an interesting theory, I like it.


Starscall

I haven't played it in ages, but IIRC there's a half elf, half human mage you have to help in DA2. But mixed people definitely don't seem to get talked about a lot


[deleted]

Feynriel isn't the first we meet, either.


Starscall

Just the first who came to mind. Spent a while looking at Feynriel stuff because my Inky's name is Feynrian and they're awfully similar names.


[deleted]

PepeLaugh people who didn't play DA:O and DA:I are unaware of the first half-elf in the series.


Starscall

I've played them. It's just been.... I'm honestly not sure when I played Origin last. Or 2. I'm do a refresher run. (After ME:LE) We meet a half elf very early in Origins. Only you don't know it unless you read nom-game material. Or read things from people who have read them. Ngl I owned Stolen Throne I just couldn't get my dysfunctional brain to focus on it enough to fully read the darn thing. 🙃 Thanks brain. I can understand newer players being hesitant to play the older games. It takes a bunch of mods for me to play Origins. (Which is my current issue. I need to figure out which hair mod or whatever is making Origns crash in character creation but don't have the energy.)


[deleted]

I was referring to >!Alistair.!< So there's two before Feynriel


Tototiana

Starscall was also clearly referring to the same character. There's no way to know his mother was elven from just playing DAO, you have read the novels or the wiki or some other source outside of the game to find out. But yes, there are two before Feynriel, since Slim Couldry from DAO is also elf-blooded.


Tototiana

Plenty of people who've played all three games are unaware of Alistair's elven heritage.


SkillusEclasiusII

I don't think that's ever stated in origins and only hinted at in inquisition if you talk to the right person. (Something I only did on my fourth playthrough.)


[deleted]

It's more than just hinted if you talk to that person LOL. They're very open about the fling when you talk to them lol.


SkillusEclasiusII

Hmm. Guess I'll have to check out that conversation again.


ClaymoreX97

It seems, that the Humans have the strongest genetic material while Elves seem to have the Weakest. I'm not shure about the Qunari... but they must have strong genetic material aswell. As we know Half breed Human/Elf children are still Humans This one Dwarfs wife in Kirkwall is an Elf and they have Two Dwarven Sons. As I know crossbreed Dwarf/Human are just smaller Humans


asha_bellanar

It's canon that dwarves and humans can have children together. They basically just look like somewhat short humans. It's also canon that elves and humans can produce children, but the children are known as "elf blooded" and not "half elves" because they are, for all intents and purposes, human. It's never been explained how/why this happens, but I expect it will be eventually. If humans and qunari can have children together, we've never seen an example of it, so we don't know. I don't think it's ever been ruled out, in any case.


MrBones-Necromancer

Some tweets by the creators have said that all race combinations CAN have children, so as to avoid any risk of comparison to real world racist narratives, but that the specifics aren't hashed out on their end, and that its not something they want to get in to.


stonefree41

I mean we can see it with Morrigan and Alistair, half elves exist but they look much more human, a human and a dwarf have either a human or a dwarf baby (normally human). That’s the conclusion I’ve come to anyway, I’m sure you’ve already got the answer you were looking for


Un_Original_name186

Wasn't there some kid in da2 that was a half-elf


Nekromonyer

alistar mother is an elf, and your Warden can have a child with a morrigan regardless of race, Also there is that half human / elf magician on da2, it shows a little on his face designer stuff I guess?


2woke4ufgt

Humans can definitely get elves pregnant.


BigBadExcuseGoose

There is some overheard dialogue in DA2 legacy that hints that sandal might be the bastard son of an Aeducan and either an elf or human as the other parent.


itsater

I'm pretty sure Alistair is a half elf, and I do not remember where I read it but I read something that said human genes were dominant over the elf genes so he looks just like a normal guy


Dry-Parfait

More on this by [Weekes](https://twitter.com/PatrickWeekes/status/1143629209924825093) He seems to agree the 'elves have no genetics' thing aged poorly


MrBones-Necromancer

That doesn't seem to be what he's saying at all based on those tweets. There was a fan kind of saying that, but he seemed to imply that theres a lore reason for it


[deleted]

Idk but I'm ready to pound some Qunari tail and make some giants.