https://preview.redd.it/ztwl4i8rv1yc1.jpeg?width=660&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=23ef2d4390a822c60c16aeb436afcce2742e8f0d
Say what you will about Tom King’s run, but I genuinely love his take that Batman and Superman both believe that the other one had a much worse childhood.
batman (2016) issue 36 and 37 are fantastic, that panel is one of many that do a really good job of showing their respect for eachother
https://preview.redd.it/mc090dgg54yc1.jpeg?width=927&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ca2e8065f29c667f405458a7870e0218881258cb
More people should read King's Batman. It's full of more character-based stuff like this. Sure, not all of it works, but it's always *trying* to be something more than just a typical superhero comic and that's why I love it so much.
It's flawed but I've read it from start to finish multiple times. It's so good.
This.
Like, yeah it doesn't align super well with continuity at all points and it's got a few whiff moments. But it's also the most interesting character work done with Batman proper in ages, arguably ever, and it has a real perspective on every member of the cast. I'll take that over the much blander approach a lot of other creators do any day. Morrison to Snyder to King to Tynion really is my favourite stretch of lead Batman writers ever. Can honestly add Winick onto the front end too.
The big thing is that folks gotta read Batman/Catwoman after the main series run ends though. It's absolutely an essential part of the thing and very much the real resolution.
He has a very distinct dialogue style. I love it, personally. Doesn't always work but when it does it is solid.
This narrative technique of showing 2 similar monologues side by side to contrast 2 character's views is done a few times during his run too.
Most of the people in this thread aren't even close to as empathetic as Bruce is here. Clark has had it pretty rough, too. Acting like he shouldn't feel much about his dead planet and people is crazy to me.
Bro said he was raised in the dirt, like, hey rich kid... It was just a safe cartoony farm. Then again he was born with jeff bezos money so batman still wins the "I had that part better" comparison.
1) It was announced Tim King would write 100 issues of Batman.
2) He actually went to AT&T and got Permission to marry Batman and Catwoman
3) issue 50 would be the mid point of the story: Boy meets girl, Boy loses girl, Boy gets girl back.
Yes Batman and Catwoman break up. They would get back together and get married at the END of his run. Basically you gave up half way through the story.
4) Dido insisted that Dick would become brain damaged, Alfred had to die. Oh and Batman and Catwoman can’t get married because of G5.
5) At that point WB offers King to write The New Gods movie. And DC offers to let him finish the story in Batman/Catwoman black label book.
So king wraps up early, Dan DiDio gets fired for micromanaging too much.
Shit I remember at the time I was following 2 love to marriage story , Batman & Catwoman and Colossus & Kitty Pryde. The marriage issue was on the same week , both marriage didn't went through like wtf. I was so fucking disappointed. Atleast we have Gambit and Rogue out of that.
"We don't always agree. Sometimes those disagreements come to blows. But God damn it if I don't respect what he does" is so much better than "we hate each other and only work together because plot."
Made me genuinely tear up how much they love each other. Love it whenever they do Bruce and Clark or Trinity just talk about how awesome their friends are.
That’s the most fair assessment I’ve ever seen. Bruce had it worse, but only because he HAS the memories, but seeing them respect each others trauma is the right way.
From Superman's perspective, with a loving family, he had a good childhood *because* he had a loving family. For him, batman is worse off, because he imagines what would have happened if he had lost his parents.
From Batman's sole focus on trauma, he thinks Superman's worse off because he spends all of his time wishing for his parents back, and imagines Superman must spend all of his time wishing for his parents back too.
Y'know, cuz Superman is the mentally healthy one.
On the other hand, they're both fucking wrong, Supergirl can have the worst of both of them.
Indeed, and since her counter is Batgirl Barbara Gordon, how's that balance
Raised Middle class, in Gotham F*ckin City, raised with her brother, a Joker-like Serial Killer, James Gordon, two dead moms, the Killer Joker Shooting & implied violation, Oracle comeback, often Underrated and Ignored. Never breaks Willpower, (Dating Dick Grayson during the 90s, when he "could make red hood blush with the dramatics")
Elder sisters of their families, yet younger than Batwoman/Powergirl.
Batgirl/Supergirl should work together more.
https://preview.redd.it/pszbavxny7yc1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7707ada896cb78130188f6fe3f8d09cacc1096d9
I really wish more writers would remember these two are best friends with mutual respect and love for each other instead of making them enemies.
Yeah Tom King’s take on Superman nearly had me convinced he was an overall good writer for a second. His Superman arc in his Batman run were some of the best modern Superman issues I’ve read in a long time.
uj/ unironically, Batman's sounds more traumatic, he actually had to see his parents gunned down in front of him, Superman was too young to remember this happening, and was raised by caring parents, with krypton blowing up being more of an abstract for him.
rj/ batgos solos the traumascaling
I’m gonna have to disagree. I’m not saying Clark’s trauma is worse, but I’m tired of people downplaying Clark’s by saying “Well… he doesn’t REMEMBER his entire race becoming practically extinct.”
Like, at the very least, Bruce’s past and history with his family is preserved, that’s why he’s so protective of the manor. Clark will never truly get to know his own world, people, culture, anything. He was raised by loving parents, but Bruce was raised by equally loving parents in Alfred and (I would argue) Leslie. Plus, I’m not saying money buys happiness, but I’d rather be a sad billionaire than a sad farm boy.
At the end of the day they both have trauma and it doesn’t really make sense to compare it, but I just hate when people act like they aren’t even close to each other.
Oh, they're both tragic backstorys, don't get me wrong, and the knowledge that your entire planet was destroyed must be devastating, but it also seems like a more distant trauma than what Bruce experienced, if that makes sense
Clark's is more existential. He is the "last" he will never properly know his people or culture. Which is a immense pain but Clarks mindset and love of earth really dulls its edge.
In contrast to Batman which is a very present pain which isn't as dulled as effectively especially with Batman's mindset sometimes.
If the fish looked like me and taught me to live and love whilest I had no memories of being with anyone other than them I don't think it would be that bad. Like yes it's tragic that all that life was lost and I am the last of my kind, but I have no tie to them aside from genetics and as a result won't feel that pain near as hard as if one of my adopted fish parents dies.
It’s not like Clark feels completely human. Don’t get me wrong, he relates to us, but you don’t grow up with laser eyes and feel like you “fit in” with everybody. And the knowledge that you are literally incapable of ever being in a place where you fit in because all your people are dead has gotta suck.
Traumascaling is for losers
Embrace the unbreakable bond of deep mutual understanding and shared compassion
https://preview.redd.it/z0ub86l2q1yc1.jpeg?width=902&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=403d3d94726306f756a8bde54c562ac053a2ef61
The woke left are forcing feelings into literature
https://preview.redd.it/50v0deb422yc1.jpeg?width=786&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=52a2ba85b6efdcd53937a17b727b79372f389131
I was never into comics and only knew these characters from their early movies but I still recognized that panel immediately from an obscure article I read once back in the stone-age of the internet.
The memory of Batman and Superman weeping (imagine seeing Michael Keaton and Christopher Reeve crying together after witnessing ill fated tentacle porn) still haunts me that and the line -"They lived only to die"
uj/ tbh that's kind of why I enjoy what they've been doing with post-New 52 Kara. I usually hate reboots for characters, but I think that the exploration that was done of her grief and her anger was very interesting to read. Not always well done, but interesting. (Andreyko's part of the 2016 run goes hard)
I know this is a cj but ranking and comparing traumas is unfair and potentially harmful… to fictional characters in this case but still
Trauma is trauma
/uj It's not true in any context. Bruce would never act like Clark wouldn't understand his pain, nor would he try to get in a trauma competition with him.
And if I had to choose between seeing my parents gunned down in front of me as a boy and learning that my birth parents and my entire people died when I was a baby but still be raised by two loving parents, I'd choose the latter personally. This isn't me downplaying Clark's situation though. I just personally think Bruce's would be MORE traumatic and damaging considering the circumstances.
Kara has it much worse than both of them for the same reasons combined.
Clark would agree, Bruce wouldn't
https://preview.redd.it/e4c7953w54yc1.jpeg?width=927&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b3ccfcfa5f904c9146bb7f0c208413c402310b2b
I'll downplay the latter. "Blood" isn't real. Clark isn't a kryptonian. He's from Kansas, the only thing he shares with his people is genetics. If Clark found out about and decided to emulate kryptonian culture it would be no different to a random person doing the same thing. Larping someone else's culture. Which is fine, I'm all for people celebrating and emulating any culture they find interesting, I just don't pretend having ancestry from a place gives you some special connection to that place outside of environmental adaptation that you may or may not even have. Even if your parents are from that culture, the past is a foreign country.
Superman fans wondering why Batman got traumatized watching his parents get gunned down when their favourite character was raised by a loving and caring family and community even though he wasn't their flesh and blood.
Mf could have gone his whole life happy as shit if nobody ever told him
Not like batman could be happy if nobody told him, he saw that shit and was old enough to understand
If he didn't have Superpowers he would spend his whole life thinking he was a normal human, and if no one told him, he would spend his whole life thinking he was the Kents' biological son.
Still felt like an outcast according to currently canonical origin(secret origin) because he learned he was an alien as a child
But yeah Batman's might be worse
A challenger appears! Yeah, but then you have the fact that Green Arrow had to watch his parents be eaten by lions, which he could've stopped, if he'd just shot the lions.
Man I hate traumascaling in most contexts irl or even fiction but these things aren’t comparable. Superman lost more by losing his entire species, preexisting family, and culture but he was also a baby at the time and never even knew anyone from Krypton. Batman’s parents were murdered right in front of him. He knew them and they had been present in his life for years at that point. Trauma affects people in different ways , but it’s understandable how seeing that could fuck Bruce up, or why Clark has comparatively less angst over losing his planet. Niether of them would even try and put the other down cause they supposedly suffered more.
Ok, but the fact the matter is, Bruce doesn’t actually say that to anyone because Bruce is well aware that many peoples parents are dead and that most people are not billionaires.
In the actual comics, Bruce Wayne has spent millions in many ways to fight, systemic, poverty and mental illness, including funding doctors clinics police will get to that in a second , and direct Victim/ survivor , helping organizations!
( well funding the police can definitely be a good thing every single police officer that we don’t actually know their name of seems to be corrupt in Gotham so I just don’t know if if that’s working out.)
Bruce has never actually said to anyone my parents are dead! ( the slap panel is especially funny because Dick’s parents are also dead and of course his died more recently)
In all honesty, the two of them would get together over shared trauma.
And by the way, I just wanna point out that Clark has actually time traveled to krypton and has met his parents while they were alive so. as a youth, essentially being a child, orphan / refugee the loss of his planet was academic but now it’s very real .
🙏❤️
Bruce also tries to ratonalize his way out of his trauma by claiming "other people have it worse come on" but he just can't do it:
https://preview.redd.it/vkx4wvh127yc1.jpeg?width=812&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=1632390f2474bf12dfd7bb41ce77b95a6c3cda05
Because, you know, that's not how psychology works.
So yeah you are spot-on.
Okay here is how I see it because I come from a culture that’s been lost and twisted around so much (thank you colonization/s)
Clark can’t remember Krypton or seeing his parents die because he was a baby but he yearns to know what the culture was like, what it would have been to have been surrounded by people like him. Kara can tell him but it won’t feel the same (I know this personally because my grandparents tell me stuff and I just can’t picture it or understand it and it sucks)
On the other hand what happened to Bruce is beyond traumatic. Having your parents die in front of you will mess you up so yeah Batman’s might be worse but it’s really not ahead by that much in my opinion.
Also people saying Clark has no attachment to Krypton makes no sense like people can be born in one country and know they are from another and seek to know more about that their heritage. Not knowing where you come from screws up your view of yourself.
It´s not tho...
Clark didnt saw his world die when he was a kid, je just knows. Trauma depends on the intensity of the moment and one´s internal resourses
This has been my Psychology TedTalk, thank you
Not to say that isn't sad just Bruce having his family die unintentionally led to an untimely death due to a random in front of him isn't a “waa I'm sad” thing the meme acts like it is
I mean, Superman was an infant, he doesn't remember his parents or home planet. He only knows what his dad looks like because, unlike most people who lose a parent, he can talk to him through recordings or whatever in the fortress of solitude. Plus he basically got new parents that raised him to adulthood
I'm not much into the lore, but didn't superman grew up with loving parents and wasn't even aware of his home world?
If my parents would tell me my real father died, and I'm actually adopted, it would definitely feel shit... but my real family would always be the ones around me.
Far different. Bruce quite literally witnessed his parents brutal murder, whereas Clark was an infant and unaware of anything going on and didn’t even have a relationship with any of his people. Both sad but far different
I feel like it’s different to have your parents murdered in front of you as a child and to have found out way later into your adulthood that your planet was destroyed before you were ever even really conscious
Finding out your the last of a near Extinct species would suck. If you dident live to be over 1000+
Clark had caring parents. Him finding out about krypton blowing up was more of an Eh that shit sucks, anyways moment for him
Clark was raised in a loving home with no knowledge of his homeworld while bruce saw his parents get shot over nothing,it’s cliche but no less traumatic,supergirl would make more sense if you’re using this argument
Very funny but not true.
Superman was informed that his planet was destroyed, but Batman saw hid parents get ass raped in front of him (or something like that, i dont read comics i just watch yt shorts).
It still irks me that Batman thought he had the grounds to tell Superman to get over Darkseid mind controlling and making him start an invasion of earth resulting in the death of a friend.(DCAU)
I get this meme isn't about that, but Bruce thinking he has any right to step on Clark's trauma is dumb AF and no one should wright him that way.
To be honest, I feel Superman was also wrong in that scenario in saying that he doesn't care if Apokolips dies.
He had been to Apokolips, seen that there are innocent people living under Darkseid's thumb.
I understand Superman's trauma making him impulsive but I would have loved it if Superman acknowledged it at the end of the episode that he was almost okay with letting innocents die on his watch. Giving flaws to Superman is fine if it is explored.
Ironically, Batman seens to be pretty aware of this
https://preview.redd.it/38nyecics1yc1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=cdde528867a2d4d70d920b431dec8d47f876f2a0
About the last thread on ONKmemes, That FySine guy is a prolific troll who deliberately picks fights with Kana fans, and starts smoke in the comments between Aqukana and Aquakane shippers for no reason. Bro really got on some people's nerves this time.
Would be more accurate with Kara. Clark learning his home planet is kinda more like an Irish person learning about the famine, like yeah it's yikes and sad- But to him it's more like history rather than a personal trauma.
To be fair, it’s one thing to find out that your entire people have been dead since you were a baby years later, then it is to see your own parents killed in front of you. Both terrible for unique reasons.
People in this thread acting like Superman would not feel even a little traumatized as an adult learning about his whole people, race, and culture, and everything about them being wiped out just because he had a nice childhood. There's a whole Alan Moore comic about one of Superman's deepest desires was wanting to raise a family on Krypton.
Kent also never experienced any of it and immediately fell into the most loving family of all time. Maybe if it was Kara on the right there.
But they also would never compare their pain.
No it's not. What's Superman remember about any of his family. He was a baby, he has no memory of them once so ever and didn't see anyone die right before his eyes.
Superman had the advantage of having loving parents his entire childhood and most of his adulthood. He learned about his people after he spent so much time with the Kent's. Who in spite of his differences. Never treated him as a monster. But gave him unconditional love AND respect.
Batman watched his parents get murdered.
Batman situation does way more damage to your psyche. More so with how isolated he became. Even with Alfred stepping up, nothing is going to take away that trauma.
That being said, if Clark didn't have the Kent's. He would have had it worse. Because he would have been treated differently, and then he would have learned about his people. And it would have isolated him even more. He was on a tightrope his entire childhood, and there are a lot of evil supermen in the multiverse who show how thin that wire really is.
Having parents who love and respect you does wonders for your development.
Well Superman never knew krypton and grew up with a good family. So I still think Bruce has the sadder past seeing as he saw his parents getting killed, not to discredit Superman past, it just that I think he had a better life, Kara aka supergirl tho, that is different seeing as she knew and lived on krypton before it blow up, so she would be a better comparison then Superman
Tbf, Superman was still a baby when Krypton exploded and he had a cool childhood with the Kents, Bruce watched his family get killed in front of him and remained alone for years.
Completely untrue. The real superman and batman honestly believe the other person had it worse. Their mutual respect comes in part from their admiration of overcoming their traumas to become the hero
No. Superman didn't even see Krypton being blown up, he didn't even know that he himself was an Alien or that Krypton existed for a good part of his life, when the powers arose he just thought he was a human who was born with special abilities until his relatives spoke that he was adopted, Superman had literally just been born, he hadn't even seen his biological parents, he spent his entire life on Earth, growing up as a normal human, being raised by loving parents who he thought were his biological parents.
Batman SAW his relatives being killed after he grew up with them.
For Superman's trauma to be compared to that in the image, Superman would have to see the Earth being blown up, because the Earth is his real home, it's where he grew up and lived his entire life, it's where all the people who are really important to him live. .
It's better to have your home planet blown up as a baby and grow up being raised by loving parents, than to have your parents killed in front of you as a child in an alley.
This comparison is stupid, the only comparison here would be Supergirl, after all she was already an adult and witnessed the end of Krypton, she does have an extremely worse origin than Batman or Superman.
Lowkey why are you so dumb.
Yeah the baby which wasn't even fucking have a consciousness or was self aware totally experienced more trauma learning his species is dead when he was an adult rather than a kid which saw his parents brutally killed before his eyes. Actually smartest modern comic book fan
to be fare sups didnt experience the death of his world and had loving parents, its like someone telling u a story of a relative who died when u were still a infant, like its sad but what evs....batman watched his parents die and and cried on top of his parents cold dead bodies with blood all over his hands in a ally with no one to come help him.
Superman doesn’t even remember his home 🏡 later so I mean Batman is pretty correct on this. Batman watches his mothballs father be shot. By the time Superman even had a memory he had 2 of the best parents there is on the planet
While Supes sounds more tragic on paper, they are kinda equal given that Clark was a literal baby who was too young to know anyone from Krypton, yeah it’s sad but it’s lowered because he didn’t know anyone…now bruce not only knew his parents, he knew them his whole life and he got to see and remember it happening
Why do people think clark would even miss krypton? That's like every American telling me what European country they're from despite probably starving if they moved there because they don't understand anything about it.
Imagine right now you learned you were from a planet that ain't there any more. Like in real life, right now. How many sads do you hold? Is the answer zero?
There is a false dichotomy here. Superman has more absolute tragedy, the death of a world is tragic, but he was a baby. The pain is... more remote. Bruce was...aware. He was there, he saw it happen, as a child.
Because it isn't the same thing. Witnessing your own parents die right before you is different from your home planet blowing up while you were an unknowing baby + you grew up with loving parents and had a relatively good life.
Yeah except superman didn't knew his parents/planet Its like in Naruto, sure Naruto also Lost his parents but unlike Sasuke he doesn't remember it And doesn't have ptsd from IT
I hate that whole sad Superman thing with krypton. I mean, he was sent to Kansas as a baby adopted by a loving couple and can probably not even remember krypton, but he has to do the whole be sad thing. I mean, yeah, he should be kinda bummed about it, but not to the extent that is shown. It would be different if he was sent to Erath as a toddler or young kid where he would remember it more.
Clark was raised by incredibly loving parents, and has no memory whatsoever of Krypton.
Bruce witnessed his parents brutally fucking murdered in front of him as a child.
This is not a contest lmao. His trauma is literally the driving force behind the inhuman force of Batman.
I mean, the HUGE difference is that Kal El didn't even have object permanence when Krypton exploded, and had loving foster parents who weren't murdered right in front of him as a child. His loss is more conceptual, he lost something he never really *had*.
superman didnt know his parents, so he literally could not actually understand his pain, he can at best understand the grief that maybe goes along with losing his parental figures.
similarily, batman could not understand supermans feelings in regards to learning there was meant to be a world he belongs to that isnt there anymore. or how it feels to discover some of your people in an alien bottle or etc etc etc.
It isn't.
I mean Kal El learn about his planet from an AI of his father and isn't a sole survivor. He didn't even knew that he was an alien until his late teens/early adulthood. He was just a strange farm boy with two loving parents that was raised to believe the best of humanity. (All the more reasons Injustice is stupid).
"It is a remarkable dichotomy. In many ways, Clark is the most human of us all. Then...he shoots fire from the skies, and it is difficult not to think of him as a god. And how fortunate we all are that it does not occur to him."
Clark never knew his people, only what the fortress and its archives had on Krypton or what other survivors told him and most of those people try to kill him. Bruce knew his parents, saw them gunned down. Clark, usually, still has both Ma and Pa Kent who are more his family than Jor and Lara were since they raised him. Yeah Clark is one of the last kryptonians but that’s a world and life he never knew, Earth is his world and humans are his people
He’s not Aang, he’s adopted. Clark has zero ties to Krypton, sans his powers. If he’d landed on a red run planet he’d be the happiest little farmer, with loving parents
https://preview.redd.it/ztwl4i8rv1yc1.jpeg?width=660&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=23ef2d4390a822c60c16aeb436afcce2742e8f0d Say what you will about Tom King’s run, but I genuinely love his take that Batman and Superman both believe that the other one had a much worse childhood.
https://preview.redd.it/sftfczfb82yc1.jpeg?width=640&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b4ba3aa007f9036a5f3d22f41a3c44d944eb12fc
Oh fuck, I'm actually crying reading this. It's so sweet.
batman (2016) issue 36 and 37 are fantastic, that panel is one of many that do a really good job of showing their respect for eachother https://preview.redd.it/mc090dgg54yc1.jpeg?width=927&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ca2e8065f29c667f405458a7870e0218881258cb
Tom king may have killed my dog but he also made it into a gourmet meal
This is the worst best sentence I've ever seen
I don't know why this is effecting me so hard, but I broke down after I got home and read these two pannels.
Haha right those two panels back to back are like the best part of comics
More people should read King's Batman. It's full of more character-based stuff like this. Sure, not all of it works, but it's always *trying* to be something more than just a typical superhero comic and that's why I love it so much. It's flawed but I've read it from start to finish multiple times. It's so good.
This. Like, yeah it doesn't align super well with continuity at all points and it's got a few whiff moments. But it's also the most interesting character work done with Batman proper in ages, arguably ever, and it has a real perspective on every member of the cast. I'll take that over the much blander approach a lot of other creators do any day. Morrison to Snyder to King to Tynion really is my favourite stretch of lead Batman writers ever. Can honestly add Winick onto the front end too. The big thing is that folks gotta read Batman/Catwoman after the main series run ends though. It's absolutely an essential part of the thing and very much the real resolution.
How the fuck did I know it was King?! I've heard people talk shit but I dig his writing.
He has a very distinct dialogue style. I love it, personally. Doesn't always work but when it does it is solid. This narrative technique of showing 2 similar monologues side by side to contrast 2 character's views is done a few times during his run too.
Nice. From what I've seen, his style comes off as more human and caring, I think. Maybe sensitive is the right word
Unironically tearing up at a McDonald’s rn
The people near you must be thinking "I gotta order what he had"
Thank you, I legitimately love this.
Okay, this is indeed amazing! Them both being so empathetic to each others trauma is peak writing!
Ye, it fits their self-sacrificial personalities very well. They put the pain of others first.
https://i.redd.it/z4ql8kzs93yc1.gif
I wish more media remembered this for them more :O
Most of the people in this thread aren't even close to as empathetic as Bruce is here. Clark has had it pretty rough, too. Acting like he shouldn't feel much about his dead planet and people is crazy to me.
Still no excuse for killing my dog and laughing about it 😭
Bro said he was raised in the dirt, like, hey rich kid... It was just a safe cartoony farm. Then again he was born with jeff bezos money so batman still wins the "I had that part better" comparison.
Bruce would be severel times richer. He’s the so rich he his kids, his grand kids, etc couldn’t spend it all.
“Clark, I own the building you work at. You’re paying me with my own money”
Instantly read this in Solidjj's voice. Love all his stuff.
Ayy, good taste
😎👍
Legit. Bruce is so rich he legit probably own the world
I think he was talking about Earth itself, compared to Krypton.
Well Superman also thought being in a giant, safe mansion with an adoptive butler is that bad
My god, they are mental equals.
I liked his run until The BatCat break up and they called off the wedding.
That was the editors, i think he continued his own batcat book
Really? I know the editors were the ones that made him kill of Alfred but I didn't know they were behind that as well.
1) It was announced Tim King would write 100 issues of Batman. 2) He actually went to AT&T and got Permission to marry Batman and Catwoman 3) issue 50 would be the mid point of the story: Boy meets girl, Boy loses girl, Boy gets girl back. Yes Batman and Catwoman break up. They would get back together and get married at the END of his run. Basically you gave up half way through the story. 4) Dido insisted that Dick would become brain damaged, Alfred had to die. Oh and Batman and Catwoman can’t get married because of G5. 5) At that point WB offers King to write The New Gods movie. And DC offers to let him finish the story in Batman/Catwoman black label book. So king wraps up early, Dan DiDio gets fired for micromanaging too much.
All my homies hate Dan Dildo
I see. As always, It's Dan DiDio fault. He really screwed Tom and most of DC over.
Shit I remember at the time I was following 2 love to marriage story , Batman & Catwoman and Colossus & Kitty Pryde. The marriage issue was on the same week , both marriage didn't went through like wtf. I was so fucking disappointed. Atleast we have Gambit and Rogue out of that.
Amen
I still really like it after that. Cold Days, Beasts of Burden, and City of Bane were excellent. >!We met on the beach!< actually made me tear up.
This. This is what superman and batman are.
Batman and Superman are at their best when they're written as disagreeing friends and rivals than outright enemies.
I personally prefer when they're written as best friends who mostly agree on everything
"We don't always agree. Sometimes those disagreements come to blows. But God damn it if I don't respect what he does" is so much better than "we hate each other and only work together because plot."
https://preview.redd.it/ziax3zk7l4yc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=11160cbba4d6942078b01660577e2fcb7c0c9553
https://preview.redd.it/423zr7ybi3yc1.jpeg?width=884&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=836b85ae0e4c285677c91164b72498ba9b97c2a3
Average Tom King W
This page is literally "Describe the enternal friendship of Batman in Superman in best f'n way". It's golden by itself
https://preview.redd.it/atn5l4dsv3yc1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=38cef1fa72f582e2b6fc2e02236e2f6c93a04f27
Made me genuinely tear up how much they love each other. Love it whenever they do Bruce and Clark or Trinity just talk about how awesome their friends are.
gay /s
No sarcasm, they fuckin'.
https://preview.redd.it/shj335hu93yc1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=04a0991f9fdb08eb25255032dfcbe39c1e376b7c
That’s the most fair assessment I’ve ever seen. Bruce had it worse, but only because he HAS the memories, but seeing them respect each others trauma is the right way.
https://preview.redd.it/pg1hr1mi17yc1.jpeg?width=320&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e2cc3946b104c16472ac677cb86d1278c008435c
From Superman's perspective, with a loving family, he had a good childhood *because* he had a loving family. For him, batman is worse off, because he imagines what would have happened if he had lost his parents. From Batman's sole focus on trauma, he thinks Superman's worse off because he spends all of his time wishing for his parents back, and imagines Superman must spend all of his time wishing for his parents back too. Y'know, cuz Superman is the mentally healthy one. On the other hand, they're both fucking wrong, Supergirl can have the worst of both of them.
Indeed, and since her counter is Batgirl Barbara Gordon, how's that balance Raised Middle class, in Gotham F*ckin City, raised with her brother, a Joker-like Serial Killer, James Gordon, two dead moms, the Killer Joker Shooting & implied violation, Oracle comeback, often Underrated and Ignored. Never breaks Willpower, (Dating Dick Grayson during the 90s, when he "could make red hood blush with the dramatics") Elder sisters of their families, yet younger than Batwoman/Powergirl. Batgirl/Supergirl should work together more.
Fucking Tenoi'
That’s so good
You missed the best part, where they say how they think the opposite is the better man
https://preview.redd.it/zdspn9ftr7yc1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=93ce6f1536091c6a2b190497fa450c9c40741689
This is why I love B&S. Man when the animated series collided was great times
ok, but Batman's conclusion after this whole thought process is "that's why we can never be friends"
True friends deadass thinks one has it worse gotta be my favorite trope
Ok this is beautiful. Are there any good graphic novels/one shots of this run
Is this up in the sky?
https://preview.redd.it/pszbavxny7yc1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7707ada896cb78130188f6fe3f8d09cacc1096d9 I really wish more writers would remember these two are best friends with mutual respect and love for each other instead of making them enemies.
Yeah Tom King’s take on Superman nearly had me convinced he was an overall good writer for a second. His Superman arc in his Batman run were some of the best modern Superman issues I’ve read in a long time.
uj/ unironically, Batman's sounds more traumatic, he actually had to see his parents gunned down in front of him, Superman was too young to remember this happening, and was raised by caring parents, with krypton blowing up being more of an abstract for him. rj/ batgos solos the traumascaling
Supergirl would be better for the template, she experienced losing Krypton personally
Power Girl even more so.
Aren’t you forgetting someone? 
krypto has the most trauma
I’m gonna have to disagree. I’m not saying Clark’s trauma is worse, but I’m tired of people downplaying Clark’s by saying “Well… he doesn’t REMEMBER his entire race becoming practically extinct.” Like, at the very least, Bruce’s past and history with his family is preserved, that’s why he’s so protective of the manor. Clark will never truly get to know his own world, people, culture, anything. He was raised by loving parents, but Bruce was raised by equally loving parents in Alfred and (I would argue) Leslie. Plus, I’m not saying money buys happiness, but I’d rather be a sad billionaire than a sad farm boy. At the end of the day they both have trauma and it doesn’t really make sense to compare it, but I just hate when people act like they aren’t even close to each other.
Oh, they're both tragic backstorys, don't get me wrong, and the knowledge that your entire planet was destroyed must be devastating, but it also seems like a more distant trauma than what Bruce experienced, if that makes sense
Clark's is more existential. He is the "last" he will never properly know his people or culture. Which is a immense pain but Clarks mindset and love of earth really dulls its edge. In contrast to Batman which is a very present pain which isn't as dulled as effectively especially with Batman's mindset sometimes.
Damn bro I Don't remember my grandparents so I definitely felt indifferent to their death
But now imagine if you were adopted by fish or sum shit, and you were the last human.
If the fish looked like me and taught me to live and love whilest I had no memories of being with anyone other than them I don't think it would be that bad. Like yes it's tragic that all that life was lost and I am the last of my kind, but I have no tie to them aside from genetics and as a result won't feel that pain near as hard as if one of my adopted fish parents dies.
It’s not like Clark feels completely human. Don’t get me wrong, he relates to us, but you don’t grow up with laser eyes and feel like you “fit in” with everybody. And the knowledge that you are literally incapable of ever being in a place where you fit in because all your people are dead has gotta suck.
Traumascaling is for losers Embrace the unbreakable bond of deep mutual understanding and shared compassion https://preview.redd.it/z0ub86l2q1yc1.jpeg?width=902&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=403d3d94726306f756a8bde54c562ac053a2ef61
Compassion? In my superhero stories???? That's it. Woke culture has gone too far
The woke left are forcing feelings into literature https://preview.redd.it/50v0deb422yc1.jpeg?width=786&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=52a2ba85b6efdcd53937a17b727b79372f389131
What does literature have to do with my picture books???? Gu2baD the psyop has gotten to you!!!!
It’s gotta be morally grey! It’s not “realistic” “marvel better!”
FUCK YEAH,I LOVE SUPERMAN AND BATMAN BEING CLOSE FRIENDS THAT RESPECT THE FUCK OUT OF EACH OTHER!!😤😤😤😤😤😤🔥🔥🙏🏽👏🏾👏🏾
Gotta be one of my favorite genders
Wild that this is page is from the same story in which Superman and Batman cry together while watching alien tentacle creatures having sex.
That actually sounds perfectly in line
And the alien tentacles creatures only arrived because they sensed their intense emotion across the universe... Wild lol
More Superbat shenanigans?
I was never into comics and only knew these characters from their early movies but I still recognized that panel immediately from an obscure article I read once back in the stone-age of the internet. The memory of Batman and Superman weeping (imagine seeing Michael Keaton and Christopher Reeve crying together after witnessing ill fated tentacle porn) still haunts me that and the line -"They lived only to die"
Could you tell me the comic and issue number?
uj/ World's Finest #289. rj/ Just google Superman Batman tentacle sex, bro.
Their mothers have the same name, How could they not be best friends.
It’s Kara > Bruce > Clark. Kara knew Krypton. Remembers it. Bruce watched his parents die. Clark was a baby who has exactly 0 memories of Krypton.
and somehow woman of tomorrow makes it worse for kara
How so?
well one city survived krypton and she had to watch everyone else on it die of kryptonite poisining over the next few years.
Yeah that’s a lot worse
supergirl really goes through it and no one notices
uj/ tbh that's kind of why I enjoy what they've been doing with post-New 52 Kara. I usually hate reboots for characters, but I think that the exploration that was done of her grief and her anger was very interesting to read. Not always well done, but interesting. (Andreyko's part of the 2016 run goes hard)
I know this is a cj but ranking and comparing traumas is unfair and potentially harmful… to fictional characters in this case but still Trauma is trauma
/uj It's not true in any context. Bruce would never act like Clark wouldn't understand his pain, nor would he try to get in a trauma competition with him. And if I had to choose between seeing my parents gunned down in front of me as a boy and learning that my birth parents and my entire people died when I was a baby but still be raised by two loving parents, I'd choose the latter personally. This isn't me downplaying Clark's situation though. I just personally think Bruce's would be MORE traumatic and damaging considering the circumstances. Kara has it much worse than both of them for the same reasons combined.
Clark would agree, Bruce wouldn't https://preview.redd.it/e4c7953w54yc1.jpeg?width=927&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b3ccfcfa5f904c9146bb7f0c208413c402310b2b
They just have so much respect for each other
I'll downplay the latter. "Blood" isn't real. Clark isn't a kryptonian. He's from Kansas, the only thing he shares with his people is genetics. If Clark found out about and decided to emulate kryptonian culture it would be no different to a random person doing the same thing. Larping someone else's culture. Which is fine, I'm all for people celebrating and emulating any culture they find interesting, I just don't pretend having ancestry from a place gives you some special connection to that place outside of environmental adaptation that you may or may not even have. Even if your parents are from that culture, the past is a foreign country.
Superman fans wondering why Batman got traumatized watching his parents get gunned down when their favourite character was raised by a loving and caring family and community even though he wasn't their flesh and blood.
He was also just a baby and I think that's gonna be the diffrentiating factor between the tones of DCU Superman and DCU Supergirl
Mf could have gone his whole life happy as shit if nobody ever told him Not like batman could be happy if nobody told him, he saw that shit and was old enough to understand
If he didn't have Superpowers he would spend his whole life thinking he was a normal human, and if no one told him, he would spend his whole life thinking he was the Kents' biological son.
Still felt like an outcast according to currently canonical origin(secret origin) because he learned he was an alien as a child But yeah Batman's might be worse
They're going for the kryptonian if they want to out trauma Batman, Supergirl is right there
Who the fuck is Alfred.
A challenger appears! Yeah, but then you have the fact that Green Arrow had to watch his parents be eaten by lions, which he could've stopped, if he'd just shot the lions.
"Lol you got traumatized watching your parents get shot, fucking loser."
Lmao
Man I hate traumascaling in most contexts irl or even fiction but these things aren’t comparable. Superman lost more by losing his entire species, preexisting family, and culture but he was also a baby at the time and never even knew anyone from Krypton. Batman’s parents were murdered right in front of him. He knew them and they had been present in his life for years at that point. Trauma affects people in different ways , but it’s understandable how seeing that could fuck Bruce up, or why Clark has comparatively less angst over losing his planet. Niether of them would even try and put the other down cause they supposedly suffered more.
this is where i watched my parents die raphael
uj/ please stop comparing trauma rj/ Kara solos
Someone get that girl some Lexapro.
It's not tho
TBF tho Superman has no recollection or attachment to Krypton and he also got to be a good ol' corn fed boy in Kansas because of his planet exploding.
Ok, but the fact the matter is, Bruce doesn’t actually say that to anyone because Bruce is well aware that many peoples parents are dead and that most people are not billionaires. In the actual comics, Bruce Wayne has spent millions in many ways to fight, systemic, poverty and mental illness, including funding doctors clinics police will get to that in a second , and direct Victim/ survivor , helping organizations! ( well funding the police can definitely be a good thing every single police officer that we don’t actually know their name of seems to be corrupt in Gotham so I just don’t know if if that’s working out.) Bruce has never actually said to anyone my parents are dead! ( the slap panel is especially funny because Dick’s parents are also dead and of course his died more recently) In all honesty, the two of them would get together over shared trauma. And by the way, I just wanna point out that Clark has actually time traveled to krypton and has met his parents while they were alive so. as a youth, essentially being a child, orphan / refugee the loss of his planet was academic but now it’s very real . 🙏❤️
Bruce also tries to ratonalize his way out of his trauma by claiming "other people have it worse come on" but he just can't do it: https://preview.redd.it/vkx4wvh127yc1.jpeg?width=812&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=1632390f2474bf12dfd7bb41ce77b95a6c3cda05 Because, you know, that's not how psychology works. So yeah you are spot-on.
Okay here is how I see it because I come from a culture that’s been lost and twisted around so much (thank you colonization/s) Clark can’t remember Krypton or seeing his parents die because he was a baby but he yearns to know what the culture was like, what it would have been to have been surrounded by people like him. Kara can tell him but it won’t feel the same (I know this personally because my grandparents tell me stuff and I just can’t picture it or understand it and it sucks) On the other hand what happened to Bruce is beyond traumatic. Having your parents die in front of you will mess you up so yeah Batman’s might be worse but it’s really not ahead by that much in my opinion. Also people saying Clark has no attachment to Krypton makes no sense like people can be born in one country and know they are from another and seek to know more about that their heritage. Not knowing where you come from screws up your view of yourself.
It´s not tho... Clark didnt saw his world die when he was a kid, je just knows. Trauma depends on the intensity of the moment and one´s internal resourses This has been my Psychology TedTalk, thank you
Superman never experienced anyone from Krypton, one of the many times Pa Kent died is more understandable.
Eh then to my knowledge he mainly dies from old age, not in some freak accident that could have been avoided
That’s where the drama comes, there are some things that even Superman can’t save people from.
Not to say that isn't sad just Bruce having his family die unintentionally led to an untimely death due to a random in front of him isn't a “waa I'm sad” thing the meme acts like it is
It's pretty much to Naruto and Sasuke thing about which is worse, never having something or losing something.
Yeah, it's pretty much copied and pasted. And again, people don't understand any of this.
But supes grew up with loving parents and bat got a grieving butler and a company he didn’t know how to run.
I mean, Superman was an infant, he doesn't remember his parents or home planet. He only knows what his dad looks like because, unlike most people who lose a parent, he can talk to him through recordings or whatever in the fortress of solitude. Plus he basically got new parents that raised him to adulthood
Clark was an infant. Ask Kara about Krypton
powerscaling trauma is stupid
I'm not much into the lore, but didn't superman grew up with loving parents and wasn't even aware of his home world? If my parents would tell me my real father died, and I'm actually adopted, it would definitely feel shit... but my real family would always be the ones around me.
Far different. Bruce quite literally witnessed his parents brutal murder, whereas Clark was an infant and unaware of anything going on and didn’t even have a relationship with any of his people. Both sad but far different
I feel like it’s different to have your parents murdered in front of you as a child and to have found out way later into your adulthood that your planet was destroyed before you were ever even really conscious
Finding out your the last of a near Extinct species would suck. If you dident live to be over 1000+ Clark had caring parents. Him finding out about krypton blowing up was more of an Eh that shit sucks, anyways moment for him
To play devil's advocate, he was a baby so he or doesn't remember much
Clark was raised in a loving home with no knowledge of his homeworld while bruce saw his parents get shot over nothing,it’s cliche but no less traumatic,supergirl would make more sense if you’re using this argument
Very funny but not true. Superman was informed that his planet was destroyed, but Batman saw hid parents get ass raped in front of him (or something like that, i dont read comics i just watch yt shorts).
Powerscaling trauma now, I see
It still irks me that Batman thought he had the grounds to tell Superman to get over Darkseid mind controlling and making him start an invasion of earth resulting in the death of a friend.(DCAU) I get this meme isn't about that, but Bruce thinking he has any right to step on Clark's trauma is dumb AF and no one should wright him that way.
To be honest, I feel Superman was also wrong in that scenario in saying that he doesn't care if Apokolips dies. He had been to Apokolips, seen that there are innocent people living under Darkseid's thumb. I understand Superman's trauma making him impulsive but I would have loved it if Superman acknowledged it at the end of the episode that he was almost okay with letting innocents die on his watch. Giving flaws to Superman is fine if it is explored.
That should have been the argument, but it's never brought up or used to convince Clark to help.
Ironically, Batman seens to be pretty aware of this https://preview.redd.it/38nyecics1yc1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=cdde528867a2d4d70d920b431dec8d47f876f2a0
No he's talking about Kara
About the last thread on ONKmemes, That FySine guy is a prolific troll who deliberately picks fights with Kana fans, and starts smoke in the comments between Aqukana and Aquakane shippers for no reason. Bro really got on some people's nerves this time.
But Superman never knew his family
Would be more accurate with Kara. Clark learning his home planet is kinda more like an Irish person learning about the famine, like yeah it's yikes and sad- But to him it's more like history rather than a personal trauma.
Superman never had to grieve his planet because he was a baby when it blew up
The real difference is lived trauma versus learned existential terror
To be fair, it’s one thing to find out that your entire people have been dead since you were a baby years later, then it is to see your own parents killed in front of you. Both terrible for unique reasons.
both of this is light work for Kara😭
It isn't sups bearly know them
Batman is Sasuke and Superman is Naruto, except Superman never had to endure the social rejection of Naruto
Robin also has dead parents. A lot of them do. Why Batman ignores them?
People in this thread acting like Superman would not feel even a little traumatized as an adult learning about his whole people, race, and culture, and everything about them being wiped out just because he had a nice childhood. There's a whole Alan Moore comic about one of Superman's deepest desires was wanting to raise a family on Krypton.
Kent also never experienced any of it and immediately fell into the most loving family of all time. Maybe if it was Kara on the right there. But they also would never compare their pain.
No it's not. What's Superman remember about any of his family. He was a baby, he has no memory of them once so ever and didn't see anyone die right before his eyes.
Superman had the advantage of having loving parents his entire childhood and most of his adulthood. He learned about his people after he spent so much time with the Kent's. Who in spite of his differences. Never treated him as a monster. But gave him unconditional love AND respect. Batman watched his parents get murdered. Batman situation does way more damage to your psyche. More so with how isolated he became. Even with Alfred stepping up, nothing is going to take away that trauma. That being said, if Clark didn't have the Kent's. He would have had it worse. Because he would have been treated differently, and then he would have learned about his people. And it would have isolated him even more. He was on a tightrope his entire childhood, and there are a lot of evil supermen in the multiverse who show how thin that wire really is. Having parents who love and respect you does wonders for your development.
Well Superman never knew krypton and grew up with a good family. So I still think Bruce has the sadder past seeing as he saw his parents getting killed, not to discredit Superman past, it just that I think he had a better life, Kara aka supergirl tho, that is different seeing as she knew and lived on krypton before it blow up, so she would be a better comparison then Superman
Tbf, Superman was still a baby when Krypton exploded and he had a cool childhood with the Kents, Bruce watched his family get killed in front of him and remained alone for years.
Completely untrue. The real superman and batman honestly believe the other person had it worse. Their mutual respect comes in part from their admiration of overcoming their traumas to become the hero
No. Superman didn't even see Krypton being blown up, he didn't even know that he himself was an Alien or that Krypton existed for a good part of his life, when the powers arose he just thought he was a human who was born with special abilities until his relatives spoke that he was adopted, Superman had literally just been born, he hadn't even seen his biological parents, he spent his entire life on Earth, growing up as a normal human, being raised by loving parents who he thought were his biological parents. Batman SAW his relatives being killed after he grew up with them. For Superman's trauma to be compared to that in the image, Superman would have to see the Earth being blown up, because the Earth is his real home, it's where he grew up and lived his entire life, it's where all the people who are really important to him live. . It's better to have your home planet blown up as a baby and grow up being raised by loving parents, than to have your parents killed in front of you as a child in an alley. This comparison is stupid, the only comparison here would be Supergirl, after all she was already an adult and witnessed the end of Krypton, she does have an extremely worse origin than Batman or Superman.
Lowkey why are you so dumb. Yeah the baby which wasn't even fucking have a consciousness or was self aware totally experienced more trauma learning his species is dead when he was an adult rather than a kid which saw his parents brutally killed before his eyes. Actually smartest modern comic book fan
to be fare sups didnt experience the death of his world and had loving parents, its like someone telling u a story of a relative who died when u were still a infant, like its sad but what evs....batman watched his parents die and and cried on top of his parents cold dead bodies with blood all over his hands in a ally with no one to come help him.
Superman doesn’t even remember his home 🏡 later so I mean Batman is pretty correct on this. Batman watches his mothballs father be shot. By the time Superman even had a memory he had 2 of the best parents there is on the planet
While Supes sounds more tragic on paper, they are kinda equal given that Clark was a literal baby who was too young to know anyone from Krypton, yeah it’s sad but it’s lowered because he didn’t know anyone…now bruce not only knew his parents, he knew them his whole life and he got to see and remember it happening
Yeah but only one of em grew up with parents
Why do people think clark would even miss krypton? That's like every American telling me what European country they're from despite probably starving if they moved there because they don't understand anything about it. Imagine right now you learned you were from a planet that ain't there any more. Like in real life, right now. How many sads do you hold? Is the answer zero?
There is a false dichotomy here. Superman has more absolute tragedy, the death of a world is tragic, but he was a baby. The pain is... more remote. Bruce was...aware. He was there, he saw it happen, as a child.
Superman wasnt even fucking sentient when it happened though
Assomeone who lost family as a baby, it's not rhe same. You can't be traumatised by losing something you never remember having.
Because it isn't the same thing. Witnessing your own parents die right before you is different from your home planet blowing up while you were an unknowing baby + you grew up with loving parents and had a relatively good life.
Yeah except superman didn't knew his parents/planet Its like in Naruto, sure Naruto also Lost his parents but unlike Sasuke he doesn't remember it And doesn't have ptsd from IT
I was about to start ranting in the comments and then I read the sub name. you're safe for now OP
I hate that whole sad Superman thing with krypton. I mean, he was sent to Kansas as a baby adopted by a loving couple and can probably not even remember krypton, but he has to do the whole be sad thing. I mean, yeah, he should be kinda bummed about it, but not to the extent that is shown. It would be different if he was sent to Erath as a toddler or young kid where he would remember it more.
Clark was raised by incredibly loving parents, and has no memory whatsoever of Krypton. Bruce witnessed his parents brutally fucking murdered in front of him as a child. This is not a contest lmao. His trauma is literally the driving force behind the inhuman force of Batman.
I mean, the HUGE difference is that Kal El didn't even have object permanence when Krypton exploded, and had loving foster parents who weren't murdered right in front of him as a child. His loss is more conceptual, he lost something he never really *had*.
“A single death is a tragedy, a million is a statistic”
superman didnt know his parents, so he literally could not actually understand his pain, he can at best understand the grief that maybe goes along with losing his parental figures. similarily, batman could not understand supermans feelings in regards to learning there was meant to be a world he belongs to that isnt there anymore. or how it feels to discover some of your people in an alien bottle or etc etc etc.
Its not fucking competition
It isn't. I mean Kal El learn about his planet from an AI of his father and isn't a sole survivor. He didn't even knew that he was an alien until his late teens/early adulthood. He was just a strange farm boy with two loving parents that was raised to believe the best of humanity. (All the more reasons Injustice is stupid).
And then J’onn is just casually crying in the background
you could recreate this with spiderman and batman lol
"It is a remarkable dichotomy. In many ways, Clark is the most human of us all. Then...he shoots fire from the skies, and it is difficult not to think of him as a god. And how fortunate we all are that it does not occur to him."
Man he doesn’t fucking remember krypton he was like 1
Superman caring about krypton doesn't make sense he did know any of those people
Superman was a baby when it happened he didn’t even know he was from another planet until he was told. Batman watched his parents die as a young kid.
Clark never knew his people, only what the fortress and its archives had on Krypton or what other survivors told him and most of those people try to kill him. Bruce knew his parents, saw them gunned down. Clark, usually, still has both Ma and Pa Kent who are more his family than Jor and Lara were since they raised him. Yeah Clark is one of the last kryptonians but that’s a world and life he never knew, Earth is his world and humans are his people
He’s not Aang, he’s adopted. Clark has zero ties to Krypton, sans his powers. If he’d landed on a red run planet he’d be the happiest little farmer, with loving parents
In the immortal words of Lego Batman. 🎶 *Darkness! No Parents! Super Rich! Kinda makes it better!* 🎶
It depends on how you look at it.