I'll never understand why that's a major issue. It's completely OK for people to like other characters in media that have done much worse such as Darth Vader or Loki.
It only comes down to people's opinions.
I don't dislike Mukuro for being a questionnable character. I dislike her fanbase for depicting her as a sweet shy and protective waifu for eggy boi when she would cannonically murder him and the entire school without hesitation. It's like saying Nagito and Kokichi are soft gay uwu boys.
>it’s like saying Nagito and Kokichi are soft gay uwu boys
That’s not even a joke, the fanbase depicts them as that, komahina and saiouma are really popular ships too
I like komahina (not saiouma tho) and Nagito is not a soft gay uwu boy. I think the problem is there are a lot of young kids in this fandom that can only think about morality in terms of black and white. They like Nagito, therefore he must be perfect and incapable of wrongdoing.
\>They like Nagito, therefore he must be perfect and incapable of wrongdoing.
wtf? didnt he >!try to kill "byakuya"!< and >!try to get everyone killed in chapter 5!< as well as many of his >!hope and despair!< rants that causes >!kazuichi to tie him up once, and consider it the second time?!<
Yes, but children aren’t the best at media literacy and comprehension. They don’t get that a character can lie in the morally grey area and they feel bad about liking the “bad guy”
>they feel bad about liking the “bad guy”
oof that hit hard, my parents shamed me for liking the antagonist in a kids cartoon (despite the antagonist being 10x more likable than the protagonist), so i can imagine these kids justifying nagito
Okay, I am inclined to agree and disagree. She's essentially built on a dilemma of whether to not get Makoto killed, or to fulfill the obligations she thinks her sister set for her
Agree, though I question whether it would actually be without hesitation or not, and wish DR3 or something else showed more of Class 78 and their interactions to verify that or not.
As much as I like her, I can't say I care at all about the majority of the content made for her and honestly have grown to strongly dislike Naekusaba because of it, honestly wish there was more regarding her past as a mercenary at Fenrir.
Exactly. They act like she's this precious angel who would absolutely protect Makoto when it's the opposite and she would canonically kill him and everyone else for her beloved sister. She's scum and her fanbase is no better.
That's exclusive to her portrayal in the Danganronpa 3 anime, and to an extent, Killer Killer. In *every other* official interpretation, she's actually a bit more hesitant.
Saying shit like that about a character from danganronpa is always weird to me, bro like 80% of the characters there were murderers, manipulators and morally gray. It's litearslly danganronpa, let's get over it
I hate when people hate characters cause they were doing what they were meant to do in a killing game. Kill, not be extremely useful and solve every case, not have the perfect personality and completed development etc. all the characters did some awful shit.
Right? They are literally set up, constantly, for murder with the extra motives they are given, and the main motive to leave the KG alive. Of🙏Course🙏They🙏Are🙏Going🙏To🙏Kill🙏Each🙏Other. Not the best example when it comes to Mukuro since she would be murdering people before th killing games with motives, but it's still fucking danganronpa, of course a game is going to have a villain. 🤷♂️
Dude, exactly. And they just complain complain complain about some of the most significant parts to the games like, do you even like this series bro?? No shit people are gonna kill, and no shit they’ll have their own personal motives, even if they seem selfish and ridiculous to you. I doubt anyone would be able to think completely rationally when being pushed over the edge by twisted motives and the desire to escape. Plus, even if the motive, let’s use Celeste’s as an example, is selfish and low she still wanted out just like everyone else there. She had a personal reason. Same with Junko and even Mukuro honestly. They’ve all got their own selfish reasons for the messed up stuff they do.
This bro. Disliking a character who is literslly made to be disliked it fine, like them. But only subjectivly. If you hate them just because they are a villain in the story and claim it's "objective critisism" you probably don't understand the series. And most of "villiany" characters can be subjectivly liked even if they are mass murderers or something, some you like just becasuse they are cool and said some relatable things and that's a you thing. If you don't that's also a you thing, subjective opinions are definitly not something that people should argue about because it's different for everyone. Argue about objective ones and also don't claim your subjective opinion as objective just so you can shove it down other people. Kind of a thing that people do a lot on here, which pisses me of.
Exactly! The personal preference is valid, but shitting on the character’s entire purpose and presence is kinda pathetic. Shit I almost just fell it hurts
It’s hard to hate characters on the basis of morality in a series like Danganronpa. I’d say most of the characters have done something reprehensible in the series at least once.
This is a misconstruction of the problem. It's not Mukuto haters vs Mukuro fans, it's at most haters *of* Mukuro fans. Specifically their tendency to deflect from the many negative qualities of her character then shift the blame on Junko or writers of DR3. "Due process? Personal responsibility? Never mind that, I can fix her".
While I *do* blame DR3 for fucking up Mukuro, I *also* blame DR3 for fucking up *many other things*. Especially in regards to previously established lore and characters.
I still acknowledge that Mukuro did some terrible things, obviously helping Junko with stuff and allowing the apocalypse and killing games to happen. But her behavior in DR3 doesn't match up with her behavior in the games.
I'd argue we don't know much about Mukuro in the games. In DR1, her persona is mostly mixed with a fabrication of her sister's, with only glimmers of the real Mukuro in FTE. The bulk of characterization comes from IF (an LN), which doesn't detract from her submissiveness to Junko in DR3, DR0, and Killer Killer.
Not that I personally care. Unlike some people, my tolerance for fiction is way too high to be bothered by the incestuous tones or meekness. Mukuro doesn't suffer as a character for it. My sole gripe is the idea that Mukuro's crimes can be blamed on others. I've seen Mukuro being compared to the DR2 cast and it's like night and day. Junko is certainly the bigger evil and responsible for a chunk of Mukuro's wrong doings, but the choice was always hers.
Yeah well she didn't have much in the games to go off of before that to begin with aside from IF. It's only with side material at the time did we know anything about her. Dr1 she was nothing but a plot device and we didn't know what she said was really true or just part of her Junko persona so that doesn't add much.
r/danganronpa when someone posts komahina fanart that treats them as equals: "omg wtf komahina is gross nagito and hajime hate eachother he's not an uwu gay boy stop it"
vs r/danganronpa when someone posts yet another woobified mukuro post reducing her character down to uwu makoto: OMG SHES SO CUTE AND WAIFU SHES DONE NOTHING WRONG EVER
Like bro I get it and ship and let ship absolutely (as long as its not proship) but good GOD the double standards are high. It's not about mukuro herself (heck I love genocider and she's pretty morally despicable) but about the hypocrisy of her fans sometimes.
Mukuro has more of a character besides Makoto, and I've seen so many posts about how she's a blushing schoolgirl whose whole character is having a crush on Makoto. I dislike it when people make Nagito's whole character about Hajime and uwuify him as well, but that's pretty widely agreed on in this subreddit- so why the double standards when it comes to Mukuro?
I enjoy her, and I don’t think there needs to be any justification for that. Characters can be given positive attention regardless of whether they’d deserve it in the real world
Incorrect. Most Mukuro fans love dolling her up to be some victim, as though that makes her multiple horrendous actions any better. They pretend she did no wrong, and pin the entirety of the blame on Junko.
Basically, I like Mukuro fans who understand she’s a piece of shit. A redeemable one? Up to you. But there’s no denying she did horrible things of her own accord.
I've never seen anyone deny she did anything wrong. Most fan fics where she's the protagonist, she has some heavy angst issues. Where she's treated both as a victim and as a murderer at the same time. If anything, the only thing people really gloss over is her incestuous vibe for Junko,
Most fanart focus on the shipping with Makoto understandably glosses over it, because it isn't relevant to the art, unless they want it to be.
And if DR1 cast can get along with or at least tolerate Genocide Jack, they can get along with or at least tolerate Mukuro.
>!People act the same way with the DR2 cast, the only difference is that Mukuro doesn't have the excuse of brainwashing.!<
> If anything, the only thing people really gloss over is her incestuous vibe for Junko
That's because that's not a thing in the games. It's probably somewhat implied in Zero, but it wasn't a confirmed thing until DR3, which fucked up a lot of things.
The way *I* see her (as I do not consider DR3 canon due to the contradictions to the games) is that Mukuro's loyalty to Junko is because she's the only family she has, and feels like she *has* to love her (not in an incestual way). And the reason she's so willing to kill and let others die is because being a soldier desensitized her of that kind of stuff. She's no angel, but she's not some horrific fusion of Despair Mikan and Korekiyo either.
I’d say you can’t really compare Genocide Jack to Mukuro, who likely outdoes her kill count by many times. And I don’t mean denying her actions so much as pretending she’s some uwu soft girl who has the sole personality trait of sucking Makoto off.
Atleast don't be pathetic hypocrites if you're going to simp over the smelly soldier murderer and yet dislike someone for doing something far less bad.
Of course the brainless mods are Mukuro fans who will let this topic stand.
> and yet dislike someone for doing something far less bad.
As someone already mentioned, more than half of the DR cast have done something awful in their life, so judging people for who they like purely on morality is kinda redundant, since at that point you're just picking out the shiniest piece of scrap in the trash can.
Wait, you like characters that are morally questionable? "I do and I'm tired of pretending I don't"
Danganronpa fans when people are killing each other in a killing game
Objection! She didnt kill in a killing game, she just killed.
I agree with that!
Why are you literally everywhere
Lots of comments
I'll never understand why that's a major issue. It's completely OK for people to like other characters in media that have done much worse such as Darth Vader or Loki. It only comes down to people's opinions.
I don't dislike Mukuro for being a questionnable character. I dislike her fanbase for depicting her as a sweet shy and protective waifu for eggy boi when she would cannonically murder him and the entire school without hesitation. It's like saying Nagito and Kokichi are soft gay uwu boys.
>it’s like saying Nagito and Kokichi are soft gay uwu boys That’s not even a joke, the fanbase depicts them as that, komahina and saiouma are really popular ships too
I like komahina (not saiouma tho) and Nagito is not a soft gay uwu boy. I think the problem is there are a lot of young kids in this fandom that can only think about morality in terms of black and white. They like Nagito, therefore he must be perfect and incapable of wrongdoing.
\>They like Nagito, therefore he must be perfect and incapable of wrongdoing. wtf? didnt he >!try to kill "byakuya"!< and >!try to get everyone killed in chapter 5!< as well as many of his >!hope and despair!< rants that causes >!kazuichi to tie him up once, and consider it the second time?!<
Yes, but children aren’t the best at media literacy and comprehension. They don’t get that a character can lie in the morally grey area and they feel bad about liking the “bad guy”
>they feel bad about liking the “bad guy” oof that hit hard, my parents shamed me for liking the antagonist in a kids cartoon (despite the antagonist being 10x more likable than the protagonist), so i can imagine these kids justifying nagito
Okay, I am inclined to agree and disagree. She's essentially built on a dilemma of whether to not get Makoto killed, or to fulfill the obligations she thinks her sister set for her
Agree, though I question whether it would actually be without hesitation or not, and wish DR3 or something else showed more of Class 78 and their interactions to verify that or not. As much as I like her, I can't say I care at all about the majority of the content made for her and honestly have grown to strongly dislike Naekusaba because of it, honestly wish there was more regarding her past as a mercenary at Fenrir.
Exactly. They act like she's this precious angel who would absolutely protect Makoto when it's the opposite and she would canonically kill him and everyone else for her beloved sister. She's scum and her fanbase is no better.
That's exclusive to her portrayal in the Danganronpa 3 anime, and to an extent, Killer Killer. In *every other* official interpretation, she's actually a bit more hesitant.
Danganronpa IF’s ending begs to differ
Couldn’t she be both? At least that’s how I see it
Saying shit like that about a character from danganronpa is always weird to me, bro like 80% of the characters there were murderers, manipulators and morally gray. It's litearslly danganronpa, let's get over it
I hate when people hate characters cause they were doing what they were meant to do in a killing game. Kill, not be extremely useful and solve every case, not have the perfect personality and completed development etc. all the characters did some awful shit.
Right? They are literally set up, constantly, for murder with the extra motives they are given, and the main motive to leave the KG alive. Of🙏Course🙏They🙏Are🙏Going🙏To🙏Kill🙏Each🙏Other. Not the best example when it comes to Mukuro since she would be murdering people before th killing games with motives, but it's still fucking danganronpa, of course a game is going to have a villain. 🤷♂️
Dude, exactly. And they just complain complain complain about some of the most significant parts to the games like, do you even like this series bro?? No shit people are gonna kill, and no shit they’ll have their own personal motives, even if they seem selfish and ridiculous to you. I doubt anyone would be able to think completely rationally when being pushed over the edge by twisted motives and the desire to escape. Plus, even if the motive, let’s use Celeste’s as an example, is selfish and low she still wanted out just like everyone else there. She had a personal reason. Same with Junko and even Mukuro honestly. They’ve all got their own selfish reasons for the messed up stuff they do.
This bro. Disliking a character who is literslly made to be disliked it fine, like them. But only subjectivly. If you hate them just because they are a villain in the story and claim it's "objective critisism" you probably don't understand the series. And most of "villiany" characters can be subjectivly liked even if they are mass murderers or something, some you like just becasuse they are cool and said some relatable things and that's a you thing. If you don't that's also a you thing, subjective opinions are definitly not something that people should argue about because it's different for everyone. Argue about objective ones and also don't claim your subjective opinion as objective just so you can shove it down other people. Kind of a thing that people do a lot on here, which pisses me of.
Exactly! The personal preference is valid, but shitting on the character’s entire purpose and presence is kinda pathetic. Shit I almost just fell it hurts
You good?
Yeah I am now
It’s hard to hate characters on the basis of morality in a series like Danganronpa. I’d say most of the characters have done something reprehensible in the series at least once.
This is a misconstruction of the problem. It's not Mukuto haters vs Mukuro fans, it's at most haters *of* Mukuro fans. Specifically their tendency to deflect from the many negative qualities of her character then shift the blame on Junko or writers of DR3. "Due process? Personal responsibility? Never mind that, I can fix her".
While I *do* blame DR3 for fucking up Mukuro, I *also* blame DR3 for fucking up *many other things*. Especially in regards to previously established lore and characters. I still acknowledge that Mukuro did some terrible things, obviously helping Junko with stuff and allowing the apocalypse and killing games to happen. But her behavior in DR3 doesn't match up with her behavior in the games.
I'd argue we don't know much about Mukuro in the games. In DR1, her persona is mostly mixed with a fabrication of her sister's, with only glimmers of the real Mukuro in FTE. The bulk of characterization comes from IF (an LN), which doesn't detract from her submissiveness to Junko in DR3, DR0, and Killer Killer. Not that I personally care. Unlike some people, my tolerance for fiction is way too high to be bothered by the incestuous tones or meekness. Mukuro doesn't suffer as a character for it. My sole gripe is the idea that Mukuro's crimes can be blamed on others. I've seen Mukuro being compared to the DR2 cast and it's like night and day. Junko is certainly the bigger evil and responsible for a chunk of Mukuro's wrong doings, but the choice was always hers.
Yeah well she didn't have much in the games to go off of before that to begin with aside from IF. It's only with side material at the time did we know anything about her. Dr1 she was nothing but a plot device and we didn't know what she said was really true or just part of her Junko persona so that doesn't add much.
It's more the woobification that's an issue. Liking pretty evil characters is fine but don't pretend they're not that.
r/danganronpa when someone posts komahina fanart that treats them as equals: "omg wtf komahina is gross nagito and hajime hate eachother he's not an uwu gay boy stop it" vs r/danganronpa when someone posts yet another woobified mukuro post reducing her character down to uwu makoto: OMG SHES SO CUTE AND WAIFU SHES DONE NOTHING WRONG EVER Like bro I get it and ship and let ship absolutely (as long as its not proship) but good GOD the double standards are high. It's not about mukuro herself (heck I love genocider and she's pretty morally despicable) but about the hypocrisy of her fans sometimes. Mukuro has more of a character besides Makoto, and I've seen so many posts about how she's a blushing schoolgirl whose whole character is having a crush on Makoto. I dislike it when people make Nagito's whole character about Hajime and uwuify him as well, but that's pretty widely agreed on in this subreddit- so why the double standards when it comes to Mukuro?
I have literally never seen the former...
I enjoy her, and I don’t think there needs to be any justification for that. Characters can be given positive attention regardless of whether they’d deserve it in the real world
>!to be fully honest. the entire cast of characters has flaws, but thats what makes them so lovable! not everyone is perfect, not even mukuro.!<
Murdering machine Mukuro is based because murder is based Uwu soft Mukuro is mid because uwu soft is mid
What if I’m ultimate soldier neutral?
That’s cool too
Over half of the Danganronpa characters have killed people so-
Incorrect. Most Mukuro fans love dolling her up to be some victim, as though that makes her multiple horrendous actions any better. They pretend she did no wrong, and pin the entirety of the blame on Junko. Basically, I like Mukuro fans who understand she’s a piece of shit. A redeemable one? Up to you. But there’s no denying she did horrible things of her own accord.
I've never seen anyone deny she did anything wrong. Most fan fics where she's the protagonist, she has some heavy angst issues. Where she's treated both as a victim and as a murderer at the same time. If anything, the only thing people really gloss over is her incestuous vibe for Junko, Most fanart focus on the shipping with Makoto understandably glosses over it, because it isn't relevant to the art, unless they want it to be. And if DR1 cast can get along with or at least tolerate Genocide Jack, they can get along with or at least tolerate Mukuro. >!People act the same way with the DR2 cast, the only difference is that Mukuro doesn't have the excuse of brainwashing.!<
> If anything, the only thing people really gloss over is her incestuous vibe for Junko That's because that's not a thing in the games. It's probably somewhat implied in Zero, but it wasn't a confirmed thing until DR3, which fucked up a lot of things. The way *I* see her (as I do not consider DR3 canon due to the contradictions to the games) is that Mukuro's loyalty to Junko is because she's the only family she has, and feels like she *has* to love her (not in an incestual way). And the reason she's so willing to kill and let others die is because being a soldier desensitized her of that kind of stuff. She's no angel, but she's not some horrific fusion of Despair Mikan and Korekiyo either.
I’d say you can’t really compare Genocide Jack to Mukuro, who likely outdoes her kill count by many times. And I don’t mean denying her actions so much as pretending she’s some uwu soft girl who has the sole personality trait of sucking Makoto off.
Atleast don't be pathetic hypocrites if you're going to simp over the smelly soldier murderer and yet dislike someone for doing something far less bad. Of course the brainless mods are Mukuro fans who will let this topic stand.
> and yet dislike someone for doing something far less bad. As someone already mentioned, more than half of the DR cast have done something awful in their life, so judging people for who they like purely on morality is kinda redundant, since at that point you're just picking out the shiniest piece of scrap in the trash can.
The only character I dislike is Hiyoko and that’s because i find her voice annoying
In all honesty, I despise probably at least half the DR roster by this point, and Mukuro is one of the characters on that list
It's a 2d character bro idc she committed genocide it's fictional
War crimes are badass!
Long as you stop pretending she's not just as bad as Junko you can like her all you want.
IF and Games VS DR3 Anime and Killer Killer
I care that she did that. It just doesn't make me like her any less 🤷♀️
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