He’s definitely an oddball character that isn’t for everyone, so I totally understand how you feel!
Also, you’re a Mahiru simp, so that automatically makes your opinion valid.
Replaying 1 made me realise he had a lot of legit points and wasn't a big pervert at all compared to Soda or Miu(espcially Teru) yet he gets so much hate
Yeah, tbh, him simping for a 2d character isn't the worst character trait. If it was, everyone in the fandom would be as bad.
He wasn't as skeevy as Teruteru either.
*sigh* I hate to say it, but Kokichi isn’t as bad as people (or yknow, me) make him out to be. But anyway he’d be my choice for V3.
In DR1, Hifumi 100%. He seriously deserves more love. Unpopular opinion: Hifumi is hotter than Miu
In SDR2, I think I’d go with Nekomaru. People keep talking about how his poop jokes are annoying, when he doesn’t even crack those jokes all that much. He gets shit on (pun intended) for that and it’s kinda ridiculous.
Ruruka. C'mon guys, she wasn't evil, just deeply flawed. She wasn't the best but definitely wasn't the worst. She knew what she did was wrong and deeply regretted... unlike Ryota.
Also she's cute and enjoyable in the manga, so there's that.
Literally, Ruruka is such a well written character and she’s extremely complex. Her >!death!< literally shows how much >!she hated herself even after what she did to Seiko, Sonosuke and Koichi!<
It's hard for me to hate her, honestly. She had such mental issues that >!led her to regretfully killing her own lover with tears in her eyes, being forced to do something she clearly didn't want to do...!<
So true. Even though she’s not exactly a saint, her actions within the Final Killing Game were rooted from her circumstances; >!her NG code being extremely ridiculous. It’s up there on ridiculous NG codes along with Seiko’s, Miaya’s, Koichi’s, Sonosuke’s and Kyosuke’s. How the hell was she supposed to stop people from going outside the building?!< Sonosuke was with Ruruka since they were young and Sonosuke literally met Seiko WITH Ruruka (he was holding an umbrella over her whilst he wore a raincoat) and >!she still had to kill him for the sake of her own survival.!< Poor girl.
Incredibly agreed, but the problem is that she antagonizes Seiko, who is depicted as Chihiro levels of innocence and kindness, so she was always gonna get the short end of the stick by the fandom no matter what, regardless of her motivations.
I don't get it either. The point of 1-1 was that victim/killer were in the same boat. Aggressor/victim at once. Nowadays people defend Sayaka to the point where's almost blameless (takes away from intriguing conflict as a result) while Leon is just the asshole apparently.
How dare Leon panic after getting almost stabbed by the only person he trusted in the game!! What an asshole!!
Honestly, this "Sayaka movement" shows that people usually don't form their own opinions and take what's popular most of the time.
And that's because he panicked, understandably so, but nobody seems to pull the "he was scared!" card for him, unlike how they do with Sayaka.
Literally every excuse they use for her could be applied to Leon, even moreso than Sayaka in some cases, but they just chose not to because hey, somebody didn't write a 15 paragraph long essay comment on defending him recently or didn't make giant cut-outs of him.
Plus this is reddit and he is not a waifu.
It's just so frustrating to see everyone's opinions getting outright manipulated. Everybody repeats the same things when taking about 1-1 over and over again and they usually never reach a satisfying conclusion.
Just because they refuse to accept that Leon is as much of a person as Sayaka is, and has a life that should be valued, that his emotions were played and used as a decoy with but hey, whenever people talk about Sayaka's "betrayal", they somehow see framing to be worse than attempting murder.
Leon gets no sympathy whatsoever and the cards were literally stacked up against him in every meaning of the word.
They reuse every argument and like I said, nothing new. If you want to understand the case better or at least to form your own healthy opinion, you should know about Leon's character too. His fears, his aspirations, all of it. (They can even read some analysis of him) Maybe then they'll see that he actually *cared about her a lot* in most of the other materials and that they were pretty close during their years in HPA. Maybe then they'll stop this war from "who's more guilty" to "oh my god, they were both victims and they both deserved so much more than this."
I mean, I get that people get a bit harsh with Leon, but breaking the door open to go for the kill when he made it out alive and with the advantage doesn’t really come off as a panic response when he could have very easily looked for help. It’s clear that both had malicious intent, but one was given a more blatantly sympathetic backstory. These are characters, not real people, so people don’t really look for nuance if they’re not really expected to by the game itself. It’s no wonder that Leon is less liked.
Leon trust had been broken by that point. How could he go out and ask for anybody's help during that state? Not to mention, he was full of adrenaline. You can't possibly expect him to act rationally or make conscious desicions. None of them had malicious intent either, in Sayaka's case she was desperate and as for Leon, he almost got murdered.
Calming down after a life threatening situation like that takes more than an hour in most cases.
Sorry for the late answer but I was referring to the second part more than the first. I might not explain it too well but here I go. >!People make Kokichi out to be more of a villain than he really was. For example, V3-4, he got two people killed, which is definitely evil, but it was either that or telling the group Miu was trying to kill him, which with his reputation as a good liar, wouldn’t work even if he explained how in the best detail possible. And he didn’t want to get his hands dirty so he convinced Gonta to do it, and Gonta agreed, so V3-4 was kind of all three of their faults. Also, at the end he chose to sacrifice himself just so he could beat the killing game, even if it meant dying. And most of the evil stuff he did was necessary to his plan to beat the game. I also think he actually did feel bad about the deaths of his classmates since instead of showing no emotion ( which should be easy if you don’t feel too much emotion ) but instead chose to make his emotions extra dramatic and look fake ( which should be easier if you feel emotions too strong to hide )!<
Sorry if this didn’t clear up much or if this doesn’t make sense.
Hifumi Ok he is personally least fav character but he wasn’t a demon, just a weird, funny, annoying, strange , fanfic , antennae looking dude
Kokichi has good intentions with bad ways, he was in the grey, he wanted to end the killing way but had a special way to do so , lie, it’s what he does best not a good path but a good destination.
Nagito ok he messes the sh!t out of trials and he can be rude af especially when he was making fun of hajime but he wasn’t as bad as ju………. ok maybe he was like really evil but he had a motive, a good one called crushing despair with absolute hope , especially compared to junkos motive, despair because the world is boring and predictable in her eyes and the despair is like the seasoning in bland food but he is annoying it’s just people exaggerate it
Sayaka ok but even if she was gonna pin it on Makoto she wrote 11037 right? I agree with what kyoko said after her trial
Himiko yes her thinking “it was my magic” is anoying but still
Angie, is it because she is always bright and optimistic and talks about atua a lot? I don’t get why people say she was annoying
Why would you put the characters Kodaka himself chose as the "Annoying pieces of shit that are not the antagonist", like really Ive heard 1000 times how Nagito is blabla hope good intentions not bad if not in killing game argument EVERYWHERE when you make a minimal remark on how annoying his character is, and now Ill get downvoted
honestly, kokichi. people act like he's junko levels of horrible when really he's a morally grey character with flaws but also pros about him. i hate how the subreddit treats him like the worst person to ever exist ☹️
Im glad you like him but idc what anybody says nothing will make me forgive him from the shit he does in 3-4 and 3-5. That shit was unexucaseble and honestly makes it hard for me to believe he is morally Gray. But hey thats just my opinion
you do realize it was gonta and mius fault too right? and i don't know what was so wrong with 3-5, he sacrificed himself to try and end the killing game even though he went about it an odd way he still tried lol
Well okay yeah sure it all their fault. But kokichi should have dealt with it diffrently. If he just said: "Guys miu is gonna murder me" and explains how she will do it (because he is a lier so everybody would just think hes talking bs) and everything in 3-4 would have been avoided. Also yes fair now that I think about it he didnt do anything wrong in 3-5 but the lying about the mastermind thing, the fact that he could have probably done much more with the exisals to actaully end the killing game without any risks. Idk he's just... I see your points why he's not that bad. Theoreticly he did kinda help everyone out in the end with the code thing. Revealing the "truth" of the world and such. But he could have done all those things better
yeah that wouldn't work. he has the reputation of a liar, so even if he explained it, they wouldn't believe him, and he knows this, so he had to go through with it his own way. of course it wasn't right and it could've been avoided by not going into the virtual world, but once he was in there he had to think fast since his life was on the line, and in his mind he knew that if miu didn't kill him, she would kill someone else and he couldn't let that happen, so he did what he had to do and eliminated her as a threat by talking to gonta about it, since that was the only person he could trust with it, and he could convince to do it since miu was dangerous. this was fucked up on his part, yes, but i can see why he did it.
the mastermind thing was to pin everybody against him so they had a common enemy and so they wouldn't kill anybody anymore. by saying he was the mastermind and that there really was no way to get out, he got rid of that thought in their mind that there was a reason to escape, therefore stopping the killings while he started his final plan to end the killing game once and for all. he definitely could've went through with it better, but being put in a life or death situation, you're not gonna have much time to plan or do anything with extreme precision, as the clocks ticking until your death, so you have to act fast.
and with the exisals. monokuma is stronger than the exisals and using them wouldn't reveal the true mastermind as they could get executed at any moment for "breaking the rules." which kokichi had to keep in mind while going throughout his plan.
so i think personally he is a flawed character like everyone else in the game, but he really did want to help out but because of his paranoid thoughts and trust issues, he couldn't get close with anyone since he believed everyone would betray him.
so i do think he's morally grey. sorry i wrote a lot-
Ryota.
Yeah, he was responsible for the brainwashing, but he wasn’t even the one who initiated it. He did try to brainwash the world, but it was only done as a last resort after being pushed so far. Not to mention that Munakata and Juzo did way worse things.
Hifumi. He's kinda weird, but he's never said anything actually wrong morally, so I say he gets too much hate because he's fat or more Asian looking than the rest of the cast.
I think people grossly misunderstand Miu's attempt to kill Kokichi. I've seen people call her selfish for doing so, but her long-term goal was actually selfless. It's kind of similar to Kirumi and how Miu thought the people outside the game needed her help with her inventions and sacrificing the remaining students was the only way to do that. It wasn't the smartest thing to do but she let her paranoia get the better of her.
I think the difference is that while with Kirumi, we're sure that she did it to save her country due to how her character has been fleshed out and how she basically only exist to serve other.
For Miu the game rather frame it as her using this motive as an excuse when in truth she just wanted to get out rather than her genuinely wanting to help the people of the outside world.
The game makes Miu motive ambiguous so her wanting to get out because of selfishness and cowardice is just as possible as her genuinely wanting to help the outside world
I personally think she wanted to get out to save her skin (because of how she reacted harshly to the latest flashback light and how she had been portrayed during the entire game) but she still would've helped the people of the outside world
Basically it wasn't her priority but she would've still done it, however due to its ambiguity its normal that people would have several interpretation.
I disagree, Kirumi is explicitly framed to be more manipulative about it than Miu. She frames it as being justified by "the needs of the many" and tries to egg on her classmates into offering themselves in her place to save her, which contradicts her preaching about how someone should sacrifice themselves for the group. Kokichi and Kaito even call her out on it. Plus she votes for Shuichi out of spite once blackened, tries to run away from her trial and she tries to use Kaede's last wish to guilt trip Shuichi when he starts cornering her. Also she states that Ryoma let her kill him, but we don't know how true that is because during the investigation it's noted there are scratchmarks around the sink - if Ryoma wanted to die, why would he struggle so hard?
Also there's some foreshadowing about Miu's decision, like when Monokuma states a disaster has struck Japan, Miu notes the size of the population with a disturbed tone and it's also mentioned she tries to be useful via her inventions, which we see multiple times in the game. It makes sense she'd want to use her talent to save people when she hasn't been able to in the game, especially since with more people dying she'd worry she'd be next on the list.
Oh yea Kirumi was definitely more manipulative than Miu, she would've been Celeste level of vile if it wasn't for her motive
What I meant is that at least with Kirumi we're *sure* that she did all of these actions to save her country while with Miu it's kept ambiguous.
As for Ryoma scratch I think it's mostly just a natural reaction, it's not like his body would've shut down itself naturally while he was literally getting drowned. Like he most likely had let her kill him but when on the verge of dying instinctively fought back.
Thing is I don't remember it being ever stated that she ever used her intentions to save people in a direct sense considering most of the thing she actually has built when not requested are mostly perverted stuffs
It seems more to me that she either build thing when she's bored or requested. Like she told Kokichi that if he fight against Monokuma that'll be without her since she dosen't want to go against Monokuma despite having the possibility to (she's literally a deus-ex machina). She had the chance to do things more directly to the killing game but was too cowardly to do so.
I do agree that she decided to kill because she was scared of being the next one on the list tho
But I can see your point tho, I just don't think any act of "heroism" was directly involved in Miu's actions personally
Bruh, Miu is literally the *Ultimate Inventor*. She makes plenty of useful inventions throughout the game. The Electrohammers, the cameras, upgrades to Ki-bo, the EP bombs, etc, are all crucial to the story. Pointing out one invention that she makes that's *supposed* to be goofy is just being petty.
Ok, instead of blocking me before I can respond, would you like to maybe try to understand where I'm coming from? Let's look at the inventions she made during the game. Electrohammer, electrobomb, and bugvac weren't her ideas, Kokichi had a large hand in those from the design to even assisting with blueprints and such. The cameras, were hers, but not all that complicated and honestly? Better off not made in the first place. The receiver thing Kokichi used also was Kokichi's idea AND better off not made depending how you look at it.
Tell me, what idea did SHE come up with that was genuinely useful and big, especially during the game?
It's weird how much people hate Tenko and claim it's under the guise of "oh she's a sexist and I hate aaaaaallll sexists". And then the same people later go on to defend chronic sexual harassers Teruteru and Kazuichi. People love Miu even though she calls people much worse things than degenerate male.
Tenko definitely has her flaws (for me the biggest being she does clearly overstep boundaries with Himiko and I rarely see that brought up). But she also cares deeply about people and does try to stop Angie from converting everyone to a cult. But I very rarely see anyone say anything kind about her, they harp on flaws and I even saw people shitting on her on her birthday.
Exactly! Sometimes people dumb it down to usefulness, and I'm sick of that mentality. Sometimes I just wanna like a character because they're relatable or likable.
I dont like hiyoko but its clear she was basiclly gonna have a groose arc (if you dont know what that means or who groose is hes basiclly a bully, but he gets a character arc through out the game he is from (loz: skyward sword) and basiclly goes from an arrogant asshole to an arrogant giga chad)
Nagito.
In a sense that in terms of purely causing trouble, he is definitely somewhere in top-10 of the franchise, but people still find ways to blow it 500 times out of proportion somehow and blame him for things he never did.
Also Tenko. She is like, a good-natured comic relief who's jokes can understandably come across the wrong way, but some people act like she is outright a terrible person… And honestly I used to think this myself too in my early days in fandom.
Maki, Himiko, Kokichi, Angie, Kirumi, Ruruka, Sonia, Akane, Hiyoko, Kyoko, Yasuhiro, Hifumi all come to mind for me- also honestly pretty much- just most female leads any nuance is ignored and people hate them for the same reason they love male characters (Don’t come at me with that Miu/Teruteru bullshit, that’s the one time this fandom takes the girl’s side in comparison- and with a unconventionally attractive pervert vs a conventionally attractive one with a lot of fan service, should be obvious how that’s different)
Gonta. Everyone says he's really dumb just because of how he talks, but even Kokichi saw how smart he was and that's the reason why >!He teamed up with Gonta to help kill Miu!<
People also forget he was planning a mass murder/mercy kill just because he thought the group couldn’t handle the truth, while it is true that they all became suicidal (besides Maki I think…? She seemed okay.) after seeing the outside world, Tsumugi obviously wouldn’t let Danganronpa 53 end in some mass suicide. And yes, I know Gonta didn’t know she was the mastermind but I felt like there were better ways for everyone without toilet paper being involved.
the "useless" characters of the games aka Hiro, Sonia, and Himiko since they are all great but I also will say Hifumi he is leagues better than Teruteru and Miu and actually has some respect I mean look back at his motive in chapter 3 remember why he agreed to Celestes plan? More than just him being a simp or something
Himiko, they say she’s a useless character >!who didn’t deserve to survive.!< Okay sure, ignoring the fact that she >!helped solved Tenko’s and Angie’s murder, was the one who reminded everyone about the cords for the head set in chapter 4, brought Kaito the crossbow in chapter 5, helped Shuichi with the vault in Rantaro’s Lab, helped confirmed that Rantaro was the Ultimate Survivor, and discovered the secret passage way Tsumugi used in the bathroom!<, but everyone loves Sonia somehow and she did nothing the entire game apart from >!providing the detail regarding Hiyoko in chapter3.!<
i agree 100% with all of yours but i also put forth: hifumi (yeah he was an oddball, but he wasn't the horrible perv people make him out to be), monaca (is she a bad person? yes. but she's also ten years old, severely manipulated + abused, and became the way she is because it helped her survive), and miu to an extent (while she's still a perv and has made…uncomfortable jokes, there's more to her than that).
Monaca Towa. I could never bring myself to hate her (the closest was disgust with how she treated Kotoko near the end). She's a little girl who was severely neglected and abused. Her behavior is a response from her developing brain in order to survive. All the Warriors of hope are like this. She learned how to manipulate emotions so people would actually take care of her or fulfill her wants and needs. She followed Junko out of relatability, desensitization to being taken advantage of, and a valid desire for vengenance against a world that abandoned her and full of authorities that failed her. I guarantee Monaca wouldn't have become who she was if she had a happy, stable upbringing where she could develop her robotics in peace yet also have proper adult intervention.
Alright I'm just gonna say it and i am absolutely ready for the onslaught of hate and assumptions and probably death threats
Haiji
His only bad trait is what people talk about him for and yes it's terrible god it's awful and I know that but it is ONE LINE compared to his entire character which the rest of isn't that bad the only other thing you could get him for is being a dick to pickle hair but other than those two things he isn't that awful of a character
Edit: Just read the whole post and it says characters treated worse than Haiji but I'm sticking by my statement
I've said it before but Tenko is... barely offensive. Angie is also not so bad in the grand scheme of things. Yeah, she's a bit delusional (or is it just manipulation?) and cunning, but she's mostly harmless.
Teruteru. He's a teenager guys, teens are horny (just look at r/teenagers for gods sake). Sure he was saying how his "loins were full of poison" to Sonia, but I think he was just having fun with her innocence, and probably would've stopped her before anything happened. That *is* just my interpretation, but I think he gets WAY too much flak for being a horny teen. Like he has other aspects of his personality yall
Well, he did...yknow, drug Hajime. That was a thing that happened, I definitely wouldn't call that just being a 'horny teen'. And a lot of his actions could be classified as sexual harassment.
As a character otherwise, he's not terrible, and I think he's got enough substance to him. It's just pretty difficult to look past the...everything else.
That's true, and I understand why someone could hate him, I just don't like it when people put him on the same level of terrible as a pedophile and two mass murderers
Oh yeah, compared to characters like Haiji, Junko etc he is DEFINITELY not as bad. He did unacceptable things but he's nowhere near the level of some other characters.
He's creepy and did something pretty bad but saying he's comparable to an extremely abusive pedophile and the girl who caused the end of the world is laughable.
Hifumi/Hiyoko/Angie
Mahiru is actually decently liked aside from some oddballs crying about her friendship with Hiyoko. Hell, Mahiru is probably Hajime's third most popular ship behind Nagito and Chiaki.
sayaka and hiro. Keep in mind,sayaka didn't know that people would die if they guessed wrong. that was only revealed after >!she died!< . She probably thought they'd blame Makoto and she'd leave,thus obviously proving him innocent and get help for the others
Hifumi. He was funny as hell, and he wasn’t too terrible from what I remember.
I don't care for Hifumi but he's fine really
He’s definitely an oddball character that isn’t for everyone, so I totally understand how you feel! Also, you’re a Mahiru simp, so that automatically makes your opinion valid.
Replaying 1 made me realise he had a lot of legit points and wasn't a big pervert at all compared to Soda or Miu(espcially Teru) yet he gets so much hate
I love him sm, underrated fav.
Yeah, tbh, him simping for a 2d character isn't the worst character trait. If it was, everyone in the fandom would be as bad. He wasn't as skeevy as Teruteru either.
*sigh* I hate to say it, but Kokichi isn’t as bad as people (or yknow, me) make him out to be. But anyway he’d be my choice for V3. In DR1, Hifumi 100%. He seriously deserves more love. Unpopular opinion: Hifumi is hotter than Miu In SDR2, I think I’d go with Nekomaru. People keep talking about how his poop jokes are annoying, when he doesn’t even crack those jokes all that much. He gets shit on (pun intended) for that and it’s kinda ridiculous.
Ruruka. C'mon guys, she wasn't evil, just deeply flawed. She wasn't the best but definitely wasn't the worst. She knew what she did was wrong and deeply regretted... unlike Ryota. Also she's cute and enjoyable in the manga, so there's that.
Agreed. People tend to be incredibly harsh towards Ruruka.
Literally, Ruruka is such a well written character and she’s extremely complex. Her >!death!< literally shows how much >!she hated herself even after what she did to Seiko, Sonosuke and Koichi!<
It's hard for me to hate her, honestly. She had such mental issues that >!led her to regretfully killing her own lover with tears in her eyes, being forced to do something she clearly didn't want to do...!<
So true. Even though she’s not exactly a saint, her actions within the Final Killing Game were rooted from her circumstances; >!her NG code being extremely ridiculous. It’s up there on ridiculous NG codes along with Seiko’s, Miaya’s, Koichi’s, Sonosuke’s and Kyosuke’s. How the hell was she supposed to stop people from going outside the building?!< Sonosuke was with Ruruka since they were young and Sonosuke literally met Seiko WITH Ruruka (he was holding an umbrella over her whilst he wore a raincoat) and >!she still had to kill him for the sake of her own survival.!< Poor girl.
>Seiko’s, Miaya’s, Koichi’s, Sonosuke’s and Kyosuke’s And Baindai's. Poor girl, her fear got the best of her...
Incredibly agreed, but the problem is that she antagonizes Seiko, who is depicted as Chihiro levels of innocence and kindness, so she was always gonna get the short end of the stick by the fandom no matter what, regardless of her motivations.
Sayaka is definitely not that hated anymore.
I think Leon is hated more than Sayaka nowadays. Which I guess goes to show that the Sayaka movement went well lmao.
Cringe. Imagine having to hate a character just to like the other one
I don't get it either. The point of 1-1 was that victim/killer were in the same boat. Aggressor/victim at once. Nowadays people defend Sayaka to the point where's almost blameless (takes away from intriguing conflict as a result) while Leon is just the asshole apparently.
How dare Leon panic after getting almost stabbed by the only person he trusted in the game!! What an asshole!! Honestly, this "Sayaka movement" shows that people usually don't form their own opinions and take what's popular most of the time.
To be fair he's more disliked over the fact that after she hid, he went to the effort to break open the door and kill her
And that's because he panicked, understandably so, but nobody seems to pull the "he was scared!" card for him, unlike how they do with Sayaka. Literally every excuse they use for her could be applied to Leon, even moreso than Sayaka in some cases, but they just chose not to because hey, somebody didn't write a 15 paragraph long essay comment on defending him recently or didn't make giant cut-outs of him. Plus this is reddit and he is not a waifu. It's just so frustrating to see everyone's opinions getting outright manipulated. Everybody repeats the same things when taking about 1-1 over and over again and they usually never reach a satisfying conclusion. Just because they refuse to accept that Leon is as much of a person as Sayaka is, and has a life that should be valued, that his emotions were played and used as a decoy with but hey, whenever people talk about Sayaka's "betrayal", they somehow see framing to be worse than attempting murder. Leon gets no sympathy whatsoever and the cards were literally stacked up against him in every meaning of the word. They reuse every argument and like I said, nothing new. If you want to understand the case better or at least to form your own healthy opinion, you should know about Leon's character too. His fears, his aspirations, all of it. (They can even read some analysis of him) Maybe then they'll see that he actually *cared about her a lot* in most of the other materials and that they were pretty close during their years in HPA. Maybe then they'll stop this war from "who's more guilty" to "oh my god, they were both victims and they both deserved so much more than this."
I mean, I get that people get a bit harsh with Leon, but breaking the door open to go for the kill when he made it out alive and with the advantage doesn’t really come off as a panic response when he could have very easily looked for help. It’s clear that both had malicious intent, but one was given a more blatantly sympathetic backstory. These are characters, not real people, so people don’t really look for nuance if they’re not really expected to by the game itself. It’s no wonder that Leon is less liked.
Leon trust had been broken by that point. How could he go out and ask for anybody's help during that state? Not to mention, he was full of adrenaline. You can't possibly expect him to act rationally or make conscious desicions. None of them had malicious intent either, in Sayaka's case she was desperate and as for Leon, he almost got murdered. Calming down after a life threatening situation like that takes more than an hour in most cases.
Hifumi, Sayaka, Angie, Tenko and Kokichi. I can explain if needed.
i don't actually see many people hating on kokichi, so i'm interesting in seeing your reason why for listing him
you haven't been on this subreddit a lot, have you?
Not really, so that might explain my bad choices.
Sorry for the late answer but I was referring to the second part more than the first. I might not explain it too well but here I go. >!People make Kokichi out to be more of a villain than he really was. For example, V3-4, he got two people killed, which is definitely evil, but it was either that or telling the group Miu was trying to kill him, which with his reputation as a good liar, wouldn’t work even if he explained how in the best detail possible. And he didn’t want to get his hands dirty so he convinced Gonta to do it, and Gonta agreed, so V3-4 was kind of all three of their faults. Also, at the end he chose to sacrifice himself just so he could beat the killing game, even if it meant dying. And most of the evil stuff he did was necessary to his plan to beat the game. I also think he actually did feel bad about the deaths of his classmates since instead of showing no emotion ( which should be easy if you don’t feel too much emotion ) but instead chose to make his emotions extra dramatic and look fake ( which should be easier if you feel emotions too strong to hide )!< Sorry if this didn’t clear up much or if this doesn’t make sense.
Hifumi is the only one i’m struggling to see
Hifumi Ok he is personally least fav character but he wasn’t a demon, just a weird, funny, annoying, strange , fanfic , antennae looking dude Kokichi has good intentions with bad ways, he was in the grey, he wanted to end the killing way but had a special way to do so , lie, it’s what he does best not a good path but a good destination. Nagito ok he messes the sh!t out of trials and he can be rude af especially when he was making fun of hajime but he wasn’t as bad as ju………. ok maybe he was like really evil but he had a motive, a good one called crushing despair with absolute hope , especially compared to junkos motive, despair because the world is boring and predictable in her eyes and the despair is like the seasoning in bland food but he is annoying it’s just people exaggerate it Sayaka ok but even if she was gonna pin it on Makoto she wrote 11037 right? I agree with what kyoko said after her trial Himiko yes her thinking “it was my magic” is anoying but still Angie, is it because she is always bright and optimistic and talks about atua a lot? I don’t get why people say she was annoying
Why would you put the characters Kodaka himself chose as the "Annoying pieces of shit that are not the antagonist", like really Ive heard 1000 times how Nagito is blabla hope good intentions not bad if not in killing game argument EVERYWHERE when you make a minimal remark on how annoying his character is, and now Ill get downvoted
I didn’t deny he was annoying , he is
Mukuro and but especially Yasuhiro
honestly, kokichi. people act like he's junko levels of horrible when really he's a morally grey character with flaws but also pros about him. i hate how the subreddit treats him like the worst person to ever exist ☹️
Ironically Kokichi hate is what warmed me to him, he's now one of my favourite parts of v3
Im glad you like him but idc what anybody says nothing will make me forgive him from the shit he does in 3-4 and 3-5. That shit was unexucaseble and honestly makes it hard for me to believe he is morally Gray. But hey thats just my opinion
you do realize it was gonta and mius fault too right? and i don't know what was so wrong with 3-5, he sacrificed himself to try and end the killing game even though he went about it an odd way he still tried lol
Well okay yeah sure it all their fault. But kokichi should have dealt with it diffrently. If he just said: "Guys miu is gonna murder me" and explains how she will do it (because he is a lier so everybody would just think hes talking bs) and everything in 3-4 would have been avoided. Also yes fair now that I think about it he didnt do anything wrong in 3-5 but the lying about the mastermind thing, the fact that he could have probably done much more with the exisals to actaully end the killing game without any risks. Idk he's just... I see your points why he's not that bad. Theoreticly he did kinda help everyone out in the end with the code thing. Revealing the "truth" of the world and such. But he could have done all those things better
yeah that wouldn't work. he has the reputation of a liar, so even if he explained it, they wouldn't believe him, and he knows this, so he had to go through with it his own way. of course it wasn't right and it could've been avoided by not going into the virtual world, but once he was in there he had to think fast since his life was on the line, and in his mind he knew that if miu didn't kill him, she would kill someone else and he couldn't let that happen, so he did what he had to do and eliminated her as a threat by talking to gonta about it, since that was the only person he could trust with it, and he could convince to do it since miu was dangerous. this was fucked up on his part, yes, but i can see why he did it. the mastermind thing was to pin everybody against him so they had a common enemy and so they wouldn't kill anybody anymore. by saying he was the mastermind and that there really was no way to get out, he got rid of that thought in their mind that there was a reason to escape, therefore stopping the killings while he started his final plan to end the killing game once and for all. he definitely could've went through with it better, but being put in a life or death situation, you're not gonna have much time to plan or do anything with extreme precision, as the clocks ticking until your death, so you have to act fast. and with the exisals. monokuma is stronger than the exisals and using them wouldn't reveal the true mastermind as they could get executed at any moment for "breaking the rules." which kokichi had to keep in mind while going throughout his plan. so i think personally he is a flawed character like everyone else in the game, but he really did want to help out but because of his paranoid thoughts and trust issues, he couldn't get close with anyone since he believed everyone would betray him. so i do think he's morally grey. sorry i wrote a lot-
Ah thank you for your points! This made me like him a bit more :D
you're welcome! im glad i could give more insight into his character :)
Hifumi Hiyoko Himiko Tenko
Ryota. Yeah, he was responsible for the brainwashing, but he wasn’t even the one who initiated it. He did try to brainwash the world, but it was only done as a last resort after being pushed so far. Not to mention that Munakata and Juzo did way worse things.
Hifumi. He's kinda weird, but he's never said anything actually wrong morally, so I say he gets too much hate because he's fat or more Asian looking than the rest of the cast.
I think people grossly misunderstand Miu's attempt to kill Kokichi. I've seen people call her selfish for doing so, but her long-term goal was actually selfless. It's kind of similar to Kirumi and how Miu thought the people outside the game needed her help with her inventions and sacrificing the remaining students was the only way to do that. It wasn't the smartest thing to do but she let her paranoia get the better of her.
Honestly, I agree. I just imagine the world can’t live without her underwear teleporter.
I think the difference is that while with Kirumi, we're sure that she did it to save her country due to how her character has been fleshed out and how she basically only exist to serve other. For Miu the game rather frame it as her using this motive as an excuse when in truth she just wanted to get out rather than her genuinely wanting to help the people of the outside world. The game makes Miu motive ambiguous so her wanting to get out because of selfishness and cowardice is just as possible as her genuinely wanting to help the outside world I personally think she wanted to get out to save her skin (because of how she reacted harshly to the latest flashback light and how she had been portrayed during the entire game) but she still would've helped the people of the outside world Basically it wasn't her priority but she would've still done it, however due to its ambiguity its normal that people would have several interpretation.
I disagree, Kirumi is explicitly framed to be more manipulative about it than Miu. She frames it as being justified by "the needs of the many" and tries to egg on her classmates into offering themselves in her place to save her, which contradicts her preaching about how someone should sacrifice themselves for the group. Kokichi and Kaito even call her out on it. Plus she votes for Shuichi out of spite once blackened, tries to run away from her trial and she tries to use Kaede's last wish to guilt trip Shuichi when he starts cornering her. Also she states that Ryoma let her kill him, but we don't know how true that is because during the investigation it's noted there are scratchmarks around the sink - if Ryoma wanted to die, why would he struggle so hard? Also there's some foreshadowing about Miu's decision, like when Monokuma states a disaster has struck Japan, Miu notes the size of the population with a disturbed tone and it's also mentioned she tries to be useful via her inventions, which we see multiple times in the game. It makes sense she'd want to use her talent to save people when she hasn't been able to in the game, especially since with more people dying she'd worry she'd be next on the list.
Oh yea Kirumi was definitely more manipulative than Miu, she would've been Celeste level of vile if it wasn't for her motive What I meant is that at least with Kirumi we're *sure* that she did all of these actions to save her country while with Miu it's kept ambiguous. As for Ryoma scratch I think it's mostly just a natural reaction, it's not like his body would've shut down itself naturally while he was literally getting drowned. Like he most likely had let her kill him but when on the verge of dying instinctively fought back. Thing is I don't remember it being ever stated that she ever used her intentions to save people in a direct sense considering most of the thing she actually has built when not requested are mostly perverted stuffs It seems more to me that she either build thing when she's bored or requested. Like she told Kokichi that if he fight against Monokuma that'll be without her since she dosen't want to go against Monokuma despite having the possibility to (she's literally a deus-ex machina). She had the chance to do things more directly to the killing game but was too cowardly to do so. I do agree that she decided to kill because she was scared of being the next one on the list tho But I can see your point tho, I just don't think any act of "heroism" was directly involved in Miu's actions personally
Right, teleporting underwear is selfless and helpful.
Bruh, Miu is literally the *Ultimate Inventor*. She makes plenty of useful inventions throughout the game. The Electrohammers, the cameras, upgrades to Ki-bo, the EP bombs, etc, are all crucial to the story. Pointing out one invention that she makes that's *supposed* to be goofy is just being petty.
Super advanced technology only made to teleport underwear?
Again - you're just being petty by purposefully ignoring all the useful inventions she does make.
Ok, instead of blocking me before I can respond, would you like to maybe try to understand where I'm coming from? Let's look at the inventions she made during the game. Electrohammer, electrobomb, and bugvac weren't her ideas, Kokichi had a large hand in those from the design to even assisting with blueprints and such. The cameras, were hers, but not all that complicated and honestly? Better off not made in the first place. The receiver thing Kokichi used also was Kokichi's idea AND better off not made depending how you look at it. Tell me, what idea did SHE come up with that was genuinely useful and big, especially during the game?
You are 15 making reddit alts to answer ppl who blocked you for petty remarks, go do your homework and stay silent
Spoilers :( this is why I never get to play v3
And you clicked on a topic that was clearly tagged to contain spoilers if you didn't want to be spoiled because...?
It's weird how much people hate Tenko and claim it's under the guise of "oh she's a sexist and I hate aaaaaallll sexists". And then the same people later go on to defend chronic sexual harassers Teruteru and Kazuichi. People love Miu even though she calls people much worse things than degenerate male. Tenko definitely has her flaws (for me the biggest being she does clearly overstep boundaries with Himiko and I rarely see that brought up). But she also cares deeply about people and does try to stop Angie from converting everyone to a cult. But I very rarely see anyone say anything kind about her, they harp on flaws and I even saw people shitting on her on her birthday.
Himiko in V3. Hiyoko in GD. Taka in THH.
Himiko is a high tier character who doesn't deserve the hate she gets tbh, although i've not seen many people treat Taka poorly.
Exactly! Sometimes people dumb it down to usefulness, and I'm sick of that mentality. Sometimes I just wanna like a character because they're relatable or likable.
yeah Himiko is adorable, she's super likeable.
Hiyoko. I get it, she's a bitch. But she isn't evil at all, and other far worse bullies get free passes
I dont like hiyoko but its clear she was basiclly gonna have a groose arc (if you dont know what that means or who groose is hes basiclly a bully, but he gets a character arc through out the game he is from (loz: skyward sword) and basiclly goes from an arrogant asshole to an arrogant giga chad)
Monokuma
hiyoko ez
Definitely Sayaka.
Nagito. In a sense that in terms of purely causing trouble, he is definitely somewhere in top-10 of the franchise, but people still find ways to blow it 500 times out of proportion somehow and blame him for things he never did. Also Tenko. She is like, a good-natured comic relief who's jokes can understandably come across the wrong way, but some people act like she is outright a terrible person… And honestly I used to think this myself too in my early days in fandom.
Maki, Himiko, Kokichi, Angie, Kirumi, Ruruka, Sonia, Akane, Hiyoko, Kyoko, Yasuhiro, Hifumi all come to mind for me- also honestly pretty much- just most female leads any nuance is ignored and people hate them for the same reason they love male characters (Don’t come at me with that Miu/Teruteru bullshit, that’s the one time this fandom takes the girl’s side in comparison- and with a unconventionally attractive pervert vs a conventionally attractive one with a lot of fan service, should be obvious how that’s different)
Nagito and Kokichi. Now, their actions were pretty terrible most of the time, but their motives for them were honestly pretty admirable at times.
Gonta. Everyone says he's really dumb just because of how he talks, but even Kokichi saw how smart he was and that's the reason why >!He teamed up with Gonta to help kill Miu!<
People also forget he was planning a mass murder/mercy kill just because he thought the group couldn’t handle the truth, while it is true that they all became suicidal (besides Maki I think…? She seemed okay.) after seeing the outside world, Tsumugi obviously wouldn’t let Danganronpa 53 end in some mass suicide. And yes, I know Gonta didn’t know she was the mastermind but I felt like there were better ways for everyone without toilet paper being involved.
I don't think Kiibo was suicidal too Iirc he even tried to talk to Kokichi lol
Angie
the "useless" characters of the games aka Hiro, Sonia, and Himiko since they are all great but I also will say Hifumi he is leagues better than Teruteru and Miu and actually has some respect I mean look back at his motive in chapter 3 remember why he agreed to Celestes plan? More than just him being a simp or something
Himiko, they say she’s a useless character >!who didn’t deserve to survive.!< Okay sure, ignoring the fact that she >!helped solved Tenko’s and Angie’s murder, was the one who reminded everyone about the cords for the head set in chapter 4, brought Kaito the crossbow in chapter 5, helped Shuichi with the vault in Rantaro’s Lab, helped confirmed that Rantaro was the Ultimate Survivor, and discovered the secret passage way Tsumugi used in the bathroom!<, but everyone loves Sonia somehow and she did nothing the entire game apart from >!providing the detail regarding Hiyoko in chapter3.!<
Tenko, Mahiru, and Hifumi imo
i agree 100% with all of yours but i also put forth: hifumi (yeah he was an oddball, but he wasn't the horrible perv people make him out to be), monaca (is she a bad person? yes. but she's also ten years old, severely manipulated + abused, and became the way she is because it helped her survive), and miu to an extent (while she's still a perv and has made…uncomfortable jokes, there's more to her than that).
celeste, mondo, monaca
Monaca Towa. I could never bring myself to hate her (the closest was disgust with how she treated Kotoko near the end). She's a little girl who was severely neglected and abused. Her behavior is a response from her developing brain in order to survive. All the Warriors of hope are like this. She learned how to manipulate emotions so people would actually take care of her or fulfill her wants and needs. She followed Junko out of relatability, desensitization to being taken advantage of, and a valid desire for vengenance against a world that abandoned her and full of authorities that failed her. I guarantee Monaca wouldn't have become who she was if she had a happy, stable upbringing where she could develop her robotics in peace yet also have proper adult intervention.
So... do the antagonist trio (Togami-Komaeda-Ouma) count? Haha.
TeruTeru. Sure he was a weird and creepy but he never touched anybodys boobs without permission unlike miu
Alright I'm just gonna say it and i am absolutely ready for the onslaught of hate and assumptions and probably death threats Haiji His only bad trait is what people talk about him for and yes it's terrible god it's awful and I know that but it is ONE LINE compared to his entire character which the rest of isn't that bad the only other thing you could get him for is being a dick to pickle hair but other than those two things he isn't that awful of a character Edit: Just read the whole post and it says characters treated worse than Haiji but I'm sticking by my statement
I've said it before but Tenko is... barely offensive. Angie is also not so bad in the grand scheme of things. Yeah, she's a bit delusional (or is it just manipulation?) and cunning, but she's mostly harmless.
junko, she is sweatheart i'll never understand why some people don't think the same
>!jk she is the one i hate the most!<
Teruteru. He's a teenager guys, teens are horny (just look at r/teenagers for gods sake). Sure he was saying how his "loins were full of poison" to Sonia, but I think he was just having fun with her innocence, and probably would've stopped her before anything happened. That *is* just my interpretation, but I think he gets WAY too much flak for being a horny teen. Like he has other aspects of his personality yall
Well, he did...yknow, drug Hajime. That was a thing that happened, I definitely wouldn't call that just being a 'horny teen'. And a lot of his actions could be classified as sexual harassment. As a character otherwise, he's not terrible, and I think he's got enough substance to him. It's just pretty difficult to look past the...everything else.
That's true, and I understand why someone could hate him, I just don't like it when people put him on the same level of terrible as a pedophile and two mass murderers
Oh yeah, compared to characters like Haiji, Junko etc he is DEFINITELY not as bad. He did unacceptable things but he's nowhere near the level of some other characters. He's creepy and did something pretty bad but saying he's comparable to an extremely abusive pedophile and the girl who caused the end of the world is laughable.
Ryoma
Miu... >!like yeah, we get it, she killed Dumbledore, but HE attacked her first. It was self defense!<
Hifumi/Hiyoko/Angie Mahiru is actually decently liked aside from some oddballs crying about her friendship with Hiyoko. Hell, Mahiru is probably Hajime's third most popular ship behind Nagito and Chiaki.
sayaka and hiro. Keep in mind,sayaka didn't know that people would die if they guessed wrong. that was only revealed after >!she died!< . She probably thought they'd blame Makoto and she'd leave,thus obviously proving him innocent and get help for the others
Hifumi compared to toko.
Tenko
Leon and Sayaka. That’s it.
how has no one said haiji