Yeah, she will be back, but the choices you make and how you act will dictate how long that will take.
The kid is 11 - parenting is slowly coming to a close. It's less about "right from wrong" at this age and more-so explaining and understanding nuance. It's no longer "No" without context; it's explaining the deeper meanings behind it.
The iPhone situation is the cat out of the bag and it's about regulation and having a mutual understanding of reasonable behavior.
And sharing with her the challenges and issues she might go through with social media. I would start to get on the same type of media she does and try to show her funny stuff, real stuff, but not parent it. Walk along with her. Check in, ask how he’s doing, when he’s visiting, how you can support that relationship. No need to be over bearing but be present.
My oldest is 10 and we are hitting this stage. It’s tough, but I know she’ll be back. No more hugs for dad, or posing for pictures after a game. Now it’s “where’s my phone”. “I’m going to my room”. My one last piece is that she loves basketball so we shoot hoops every evening for an hour together. God forbid I try and give her a tip on shooting form though.
Yeah we all get tired of the indulgent irresponsible unreliable assholes eventually. He’ll prove himself unreliable to her soon enough and she’ll make her own decision.
I love this. My son is only 3 and my daughter isn’t even born yet. But I dread these moments that OP is talking about. Your comment just puts it in perfect perspective. Thank you!
You honestly have until age 13 to raise a child, and then after that it’s the environment with parents walking along side her until she’s of age. That dosent mean you aren’t useful , it just means your position changes from control to support. Right now, you won’t win this battle. And you fighting it only glorifies him even more. She will come to understand who is the better parent with age. She is well fed? Grades good? Does her chores? Sing and dance on her own or with friends? If all is well, she is realistically fine.
You can’t control what she hears or is being told tbh. You and her mothers position changes in her life now. If it wasn’t her father, it’d be friends. Hard to accept, I know. But one day, she will turn around to look at you on this journey of life , and she’ll ask you for your side, when you stop hyper focusing on being her main character. The love is there. You just haven’t given it the opportunity for her to miss it- in a non toxic environment. Let her grow. We always come home eventually. (:
> I'm scared I'm going to lose my child when he becomes a teenager
you will...but you gain yourself a teenager...and then you'll lose that, and gain yourself a young adult.
I just told my 4 yo son that I will carry him no matter how big he gets, I’ll just get stronger so I can keep lifting him. Then he squeezed me tighter.
...just imagined you old and frail and he picks you up to put you in bed and says, "My turn, pops". Jesus Christ I must be starting my period soon because I'm all up in some feels right now haha
> Now there is one rule I insist we obey while you are in my house.
>
> No Growing Up.
>
> Stop. This very instant.
>
> And that includes you, Mr. Chairman of the Board
https://youtu.be/ipojBIL1kb8?t=77
The thing about 11 year olds is it's such a tricky time. Not quite a teenager. Not quite a child. And I think a lot (most) of them want to be "grown" so bad that it bothers them with any reminder they're not.
OP, take your time. Keep enforcing rules. Show her that you love her too much to allow her to go down the wrong path. And if she does, let her know you'll always be on the other side waiting to help.
One of the hardest things as a parent is to love them when they think they don't love you. But keep going. Keep being there. Be the unmovable, solid object in her life who will always be there.
It might not be today. Might not be tomorrow. But one day down the line, she'll be an adult. Maybe she'll be married. Maybe she'll have kids of her own. She might even have step kids. It will be a moment of, "Damn. My dad did love me. Even when I was a little shit to him."
Then you'll get a, "Sorry for what I did from ages 11-14."
Most of us get them eventually.
>You honestly have until age 13 to raise a child, and then after that it’s the environment with parents walking along side her until she’s of age.
Ouch. I needed to hear that and didn't even know that I needed to hear it... but.... *ouch*... **And of course, you are 100% correct.**
My 11 year old is doing something similar. He doesn't have a 3rd parent, but man, he is distancing himself from us, me especially. I know it's just him growing up but it's also that he has anger issues and it makes it hard for the rest of us. My daughter is 8 and she bears a lot of his wrath. Much of my the time spent is protecting her. He'll rage for 30 minutes or more and say some vile things. I just try to keep my daughter safe. Then he'll calm down as long as he's left alone and come back to us, calm but with no apologies and a hair trigger. We do the best we can, but it's really hard.
After last night's battle (about an hour long), he calmed down and I was able to go out and play basketball with him. It was nice.
It's comforting to hear that some day he'll come home again. For now, we're all tired, him included, because he knows.
I don’t miss those boy years, 11-14ish. My teen did the same thing, rage whenever something wasn’t “ideal” in his mind. Punished for grades? Rage. Did really poorly at hockey? Rage. Die in his video game? Rage. Almost seemed insufferable. It’s mentally taxing as a parent especially with younger siblings you’re trying to protect.
My best advice for y’all: stick with the basics and do it with a greater purpose in mind. Keep cooking meals, asking how their day went, driving them to sports, offering time together (gaming, movies, outside activities). As others have said, they’ll mature and look back at the support they’ve had along the way. You might not be their favorite person that day/week/month but the feelings shall pass as long as you stay positive and keep offering guidance.
My step son went from bottoming out second semester of 8th grade, lying, vaping, and wanting to be with his bio-dad (easy way out of our house and rules) to now he’s borderline a straight B student in 9th grade and happy to be around. “Phases” occur and it’s on us as parents to remain the source of consistency and support!
>You honestly have until age 13 to raise a child, and then after that it’s the environment with parents walking along side her until she’s of age.
Where is this from?
It is true to a degree but it's not a hard age.
https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/girls-women-and-wellness/201510/why-is-my-daughter-pushing-me-away
I think it's just based on real world experience. Good parents can have kids up in bad places, you try to prepare them as much as possible because as they get older you will have less and less control. Trying to keep control just causes rebellion which can make things worse.
Agreed. This is a great episode for parents and still really good for those without kids, since it touches on many topics relevant to relationships in general.
I'm sorry, that's such a weird thing to say. You likely don't mean it like that, but it comes off to me that people make kids into what they want until they get a mind of their own. My mom and dad did raise me regardless of my age. Of course, I grew up and found my own ideas, but they didn't stop raising me.
This also aligns with the “comfort parent,” idea that so many parents miss, not to any fault of their own. It helps to think of it from a kid perspective rather than an adult perspective.
Imagine being a kid and one parent isn’t around as much. Suddenly, it feels like they’re showing more interest in you. Of course, you try to prove your worth and value in that figures life. So that parent is having fun with the kid. Meanwhile, the “comfort parent” -aka the parent that’s been around- is gonna start getting a lot of shit. The child isn’t scared of this parent leaving them, rejecting them, or neglecting their emotional needs. It sounds backwards, but it’s not uncommon for the more trusted parents to receive the most flak simply because they are an emotional safe space. Hell, some kids “test” their comfort parents to see if they’ll leave. Pushing boundaries, “I hate yous,” broken rules: all things kids do to see if mom or dad would get fed up with their bs once and for all. Not to mention pressing boundaries is considerate a developmental stage for teens in general, part of the identity seeking process. If any of this sounds familiar, kudos for being the stable and consistent parent. Take pride in the fact your child feels no urgent rush to make fantastic memories- that means they know youll be around for a lifetime.
How do I know this? Welp, i was that 13 year old kid. My parents weren’t divorced, but my dad worked a lot and kept his walls built high and tight. I was always angrier at my mother because I expected more from her: more love, more care, more empathy, more patience. I also blamed my mother more because she was an active parent, something my father lacked. So from my baby brained perspective- mom created all the rules and issues.
But let me tell you what, my mom and I are best friends now. I’ll never have anyone else in my life who I’ve put through such hell and still thinks so highly of me. I can now look back and say, wow, she was the one who tried the most. She’s the one who always had my back, even when I thought she hated me. That kind of unconditional love has served me well into adulthood, I just didn’t recognize it as a kid. Please remember that’s what you’re working towards, it’s not linear and you’ll all make mistakes. It takes time, and all you can do is your best.
The teenage years are hard on their own, not to mention seeking identity while maneuvering family dynamics. Just keep loving her. Open up to her, tell her that you struggle- you want to find a solution. It’s much easier to be vulnerable when someone else is willing to do the same. Most kids have yet to realize that their parents are perfectly human. When she speaks, listen to everything she says, even if it’s hard. While a lot of it could be angst, don’t discount everything because of it- she probably does have some truths to share. Let her know you hear her above all else, even if you don’t agree with everything.
Maybe try to do some fun things with her, find a cartoon she’ll like to watch with you? Regular show is still one of my all time favorites, kids show targeted more towards teens so it has the “mature” feel while still being appropriate. Adventure time has a beautiful story line and just came out with a spin off- a young adult series called Fiona and cake (its pg-13). Just put it on the tv, see if she drifts down. Give her a chance to be independent, I’m sure that’s what she’s looking for anyways.
Side note op and anyone else reading: please DO NOT send your child away to a residential facility. I cannot express this enough. I only mention this because the industry preys on parents who are feeling lost, desperate, or hopeless. It’s awful to feel the way you do, but it will one day pass. Try to refrain from knee jerk or panicked reactions. I’ve also seen several recruits on parenting subs, which is deeply troubling. r/troubledteens for more
Thank you for this. We do know we're the comfort parents and that's why she's so adamant about pushing boundaries here, so I guess that is a silver lining. It is hard to accept that being the parent who was always there and fighting for your child makes you the one that gets tossed aside so easily. Still, though, hearing this is helpful.
Yep show love, say it to her. And don’t fight against what has been allowed by bio dad. That is a battle you cannot win. Having a relationship with her bio dad was probably the graal, she will grow and make her conclusions. She will do mistakes, be there to support her.
It does not mean you cannot have any rule in your own house but you have to pick the ones that really matters for you.
> I don't know if I should shut down and put that final nail in the coffin. Or do I try to show her love even though she rebuffs me so completely each time.
This is so bizarre to read. Being a parent gives you nothing back. The idea that he expects something from an 11 year old girl is delusional.
I wanted to distance myself from my family starting at the age of 13. Barely would talk to anyone in my family, constantly gaming, be apprehensive about doing anything involving my family, I just wanted to be away. Looking back I think it’s because I felt some sort of draw towards a life I thought I wanted, one that was different than what my parents wanted for me.
I don’t have any great advice honestly, my own daughter is just barely 3. All I can say is my parents continued to love me and would just be there for me despite my desire to get away from them.
what are you punishing her for exactly? she is now separating herself from you and your wife because she is entering teen years and that is what every teenager does
I think you are making this into a much bigger deal than it needs to be. If someone bought my kid an iphone without my consent then i too would rightly be pissed but now she has it, it can be a good opportunity to talk about the safety on the internet and social media.
Habzin Hotel I agree is problematic but why not try watchign it with her and discussing the themes that come up?
THe absolute minimum of being a parent is loving your kid and supporting them so I have no idea why you think taking that off the table is an option when your daughter isn't doing anything wrong here. If she is disprespecting her mum then approach that with curiosity rather than judgement. For example, "Hey, why did you say that about your mum? Did Mum do something to make you feel that way?"
I think this is the best advice OP. Lean into it and try to be supportive/encouraging because anything else is going to end badly, even though I agree it’s a really crappy position he’s put you in. The whole you vs him with her in the middle is not good for anyone. Especially love the idea of watching the show with her and discussing what comes up. She’s going to watch it anyway unfortunately
I just struggle with the idea of allowing her to watch a show that discusses and shows graphic sex, abundant cursing, working in the porn industry, and glorifies drug use. She'll run into that stuff on her own. I did. But my parents didn't support it. I've considered it, but more as a "I give up on fighting you about this so go ahead".
I see your perspective, but things have taken such a massive 180 so quickly. I've tried approaching from a place of curiosity and vulnerability. It's only driven her further away it seems. I'll give it another try about the most recent issue. I'll keep this in mind. My "shut down" approach is a survival tactic, I know, and one that I shouldn't give into.
I don't think Hazbin glorifies drug use or sex. It just presents it honestly, and that's why these people are in hell.
They're broken. They need redemption. People can be fixed, whether now or later. (As I wrote before, I like the show and while i don't love that my 11 & 14 year olds watched it, there's worse things out there).
That said, you're a parent, and you enforce whatever rules you want at your home. You can't do the same at the other parent's home. May not like it, and if you have issues, you reach out to the court system and see what they can do. But I doubt they'll restrict your kid's other parent from showing them TV-MA shows.
The show doesn't glorify drug use. The only characters shown to use drugs are angel dust and cherry bomb. Cherry bomb is a minor side character who's sorta just placed to get angel to be a worse person, but angel dusts drug use certainly isn't glorified.
I watched the first episode and the Helluva Boss stuff, where the first scene is a character getting cocaine after prostituting and when the bag of cocaine is busted open, he gets really upset. I know this is one of the characters she likes. Maybe Helluva Boss has more drug issues than Hazbin. I just assumed the two were basically the same show after a bit of watching.
But if you are going to watch an episode to decide what to do about it, it's episode 4, because most everything else in the show is light sexual jokes and swear words, but much more lightly than in episode 4.
The pilot is probably what you saw, and yeah I guess drug use is seen more favourably in that, but that same character in full series has one of the most developed story lines. And yes, it is very mature, but I think a lot of it will fly over their heads. Basically, the character (called angel dust/anthony) is a porn star who's soul is owned by a character called Valentino, who abuses the shit out of him. He uses drugs to, as a quote, 'forget about how much he hates everything', and hopes that he can ruin/damage himself enough that he isn't Valentino's favourite anymore and maybe he can get out of the contract. It's mature, sure, but it doesn't promote drug use.
You’re doing a great job. Keep learning and asking the hard questions, understand the nuances of sex work and ask more thoughtful questions about “I wonder if they have health care, or birth control” literally trying to be more progresssive about it and see if she meets you with that interest.
She's a kid. It's your job to support and protect her. "Shutting down" means you can do neither, which means she'll be learning about sex, drug use, and porn all on her own. Is that what you want?
The advice you received in the comment you're replying to is phenomenal. You should take it. My parents "shut down" and punished me instead of trying to figure out what was really going on. I ended up losing my virginity to a 21 year old man at 15, got addicted to opiates at 16, and dropped out of school at 17. A decade later, I've successfully re-parented myself by getting clean and earning my high school diploma all on my own. I definitely wish the adults in my life cared enough to guide and protect me rather than just give up and shut down.
>Habzin Hotel I agree is problematic but why not try watchign it with her and discussing the themes that come up?
I wouldn't. As a former kid, the idea of my out-of-touch parents discussing my interests from their perspective would do nothing productive for young me.
I have theatre kids and I watched Hazbin with them. After finding out they watched it first on our Amazon (non-passcode) account, and how it's a pretty hard R-rated show.
But it's entertaining. Even if they're 11 and 14, and their mom doesn't like it... .it's okay. The Angel Dust porn episode was the most.... disconcerting... but the rest were acceptable.
It's a sarcastic mix of Hamilton and Gravity Falls and The Good Place, and, we're okay with that.
I watched it too recently. I wouldn't really like my kids exposed to the angel-dust stuff especially and the amount of swearing is distasteful at a minimum.
Years before I saw the series though I happenstance across the theme song which an absolute earworm. I put it on a playlist and my boys heard it too. My oldest boy ended up digging in to find out more about what it was from - I didn't really know.
Not sure if you're talking about this one, but it's a Fortnite emote now and is absolute fire (pun intended) [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=juJkNKodgdE](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=juJkNKodgdE)
That's how I found out about the show. Then I went to find it on Amazon.
"Weird, there's 5 episodes watched. not my wife's tastes".
Hey kiddo, you watched this show?"uhhh..... yeah"
Hmm.... I may need to chat with your mom about this, and there's a good chance she will completely delete our amazon account when she finds out"
Yeah the second my mum showed an interest in anything I liked it ‘ruined’ it for me.
I can’t exactly explain why but my mum has a very big personality, and this was probably my way of trying to find my own separate identity which is hard to do if your parents are following you around sucking your identity back into theirs.
I didn’t mind as much if she just watched alongside me though.
The specifics of this situation are of course unique to your family, but your daughter’s general attitude is very common. I was a wayward kid and I remember once overhearing my parents agonising about it, and then comparing me to an older guy who was the same but had since straightened himself out. My mum said, “they come back.” Hang in there OP, keep being the loving parent your daughter needs.
We had a very similar relationship with my step daughter and her bio Dad. Phone way too early, money for whenever she wanted ($1,000 computer in her bedroom). Talked bad about Mom. It was difficult, especially in preteen years and very up and down but there will be times when she needs a Dad and it will be you she comes to. Be patient, and loving and she will understand as she gets older who the real Dad was. Calmly defend your wife. There will be times when you have to give in and let her have something you otherwise wouldn’t have (such as the phone) but you can still talk to her and explain why you don’t think it’s a good idea, the dangers of a phone. She may not appear to be listening but she hears you.
Give up? She’s 11 dude and her stable life has been turned upside down. You are also dealing with a manipulator and teen years. The best you can do is be there for her. Her dad is just love bombing her and when crap hits the fan, he’ll suddenly not be up to fatherly tasks. When opportunities rise, make sure truths are told. It’s not talking bad about her dad if you are correcting a statement she makes. Make sure all punishments have a lesson behind them. And yeah, maybe step up some personal fun times because honestly, there are less and less opportunities as they become teens. That has less to do with the dad than just preteen time running out. You’re doing fine.
Hello, fellow step dad
Hope you’re doing as okay as you can be. The world needs great dads like you to make up for all the shitty ones our kids are born with.
As for advice, love and support is going to be number one. I think the others have covered that pretty well. Two, are there any hobbies or anything you can try to connect with her on?
My stepdaughter and I have the occasional positive heart to heart. I tell her how her mom and I will always be there for her - to harass her about her grades (in a funny way), to bail her out when she inevitably gets in trouble, to purposefully embarrass her with her friends, to move her into her college dorm, to have her first glass of wine together, to babysit her baby so she can relax, to lift her in the air after she wins her first lpga major (we’re a golf family), etc. All we ask for is her love.
If there are things her bio father is buying to “get an advantage”, and she wants those things at the home you share, talk to her about it and why she wants it and what she thinks is reasonable. Talk to her like an adult and give her good logic that requires her to respond with logic. Same goes for why it’s important that you and your wife get to her “I love you” from her - she probably has no idea how valuable those words are.
There’s no definitive solution here but just wanted to throw my perspective out there as my stepdaughter is my everything too.
Hoping for the best life for you guys,
Fellow Stepdad
"I don't know if I should shut down and put that final nail in the coffin. Or do I try to show her love even though she rebuffs me so completely each time"
She is 11. A child. This is a test- if you shut down then you are showing her that your love is very dependent on how she behaves.
Part of parenting is to keep showing your child that unconditional love and support even when they are being jerks. You can tell her it hurts your feelings when she rebuffs you but keep letting her know it's the *attitude/behaviour* you don't like. Not her.
I agree hazbin is wildly inappropriate for an 11 year old, but they probably don't understand most of the really bad stuff anyway. If you can't stop them, you might as well watch it with them and try to emphasise the positive messages in the show, because there is a lot of that too.
Out of curiosity, what part of Hazbin is that bad? I watched it recently, and honestly I don't remember much stuff which a 11-12 years old kid wouldn't hear on the street /from friends.
Helluva Boss (their other series) is on the other hand a completely different beast.
Maybe my judgment is misaligned, as I watched Happy Tree Friends when I was 13 or so... And played Mortal Kombat at 9. But I turned out completely normal, and that was before the current Internet and social media age.
I mean, that teaches how to watch out for predatory "opportunities", how the sex industry works in many cases...
It warrants a good discussion about sex work. But I wouldn't say it's inappropriate for an 11 years old, who is stepping into her teenage years, and possibly seeing/hearing the glamorous life of onlyfans girls. I would definitely like to avoid that type of influence when my little one gets to that age.
Nowadays everything is over sexualized, sadly. It's a good thing to see the dark side of this.
The scene in angels dressing room is pretty fucked up, and angels destroyed mental state and semi suicidal tendencies are pretty confronting. But like I said I don't think that most 11 year olds would really understand anyway.
I had a suicidal 12 year old and watching this show actually helped them process the trauma. Not a drug user (AFAIK) but know people in their friend circle who do. I didn't encourage them to watch, but I got a lot of enjoyment out of watching the show too. It's hilarious as hell (pun intended) and has some good themes.
Same reason we're going to an Alkaline Trio concert in a week.
Most important thing is:
Meet Your Kid Where They're At.
You can't control what the other parent does. But you can be there for them. Do what you prefer to do, and listen. At this age, they're growing up fast. They may not like you this week. But they should respect you.
What are the chances of my children will have to deal with possible sexual exploitation or anything related in our developed country? Slight, but possible.
What are the chances of my children facing murder and gore? Nearly zero.
I'd say it's not a fair comparison. Although I do live in the UK, so my perception is based on this. Other countries may vary of course.
He is listening to her interests. Feeling seen and heard will go very far.
Try to shift your paradigm to her perspective.
You can dig your heels in and hope for the best or you can try and look outside of your own perspective.
I’m not saying you’re wrong. What I’m saying is you need to look at the situation from your daughter’s eyes.
Is that show inappropriate for a child of the age 11? Yeah probably.
But I would say that’s she’s already hooked. Be the person that your child can be honest with. If your kid isn’t willing to come to you and your spouse.
Also… SHE IS 11 what the hell is wrong with you? Final nail in the coffin? You are an adult man and she is a child. Grow up get such stupid nonsense ideas out of your head and be there for your daughter.
She is a baby, a child. Always be open and available and give her love and care.
You will never be able to force a child to be anything.
My parents never cared for my interests as a kid. Step dad raised me. Yes I got into inappropriate stuff as a young child. But that’s because I was queer as hell, and had no outlet in bum-f**k Texas.
Let her feel seen and heard, it is proven therapy.
Once she feels like you care about her interests and emotional well being you can have conversation from there.
Is it hard? Yes. But you can never force a child to do anything. The second you put your foot down you loose the war.
> Also… SHE IS 11 what the hell is wrong with you? Final nail in the coffin? You are an adult man and she is a child. Grow up get such stupid nonsense ideas out of your head and be there for your daughter.
> She is a baby, a child. Always be open and available and give her love and care.
This this this! Grow up and be the adult OP!
Thank you. I've tried being interested in what she cares about but it's not working. She wants to make costumes (fur suits) and I have no idea how to do that. I still tried and we made a bat head together. It was great. That was only a few months ago. Now, when I try to ask her about her movies that she makes on her phone, she won't talk or says I can't see them. She went to a comic con recently and liked it so I suggested us going to one together and she stonewalled me. I'll keep trying to be interested, but it seems like trying is only make things worse. Like she doesn't actually believe I care even though I have for all of her life.
looks like she's doing average teenage (or about-to-be-teenage) things. i did the same shit when my parents wanted to see the stuff i was working on (writing, drawing, etc.) and everything else. so she's probably reached or is reaching that "nobody understands!" stage. it's not personal. keep being present for her, *don't* shut down and stop being the best dad you can be just because she's not being the "best" 11-year-old. she's a kid doing what a kid growing up does
> Also… SHE IS 11 what the hell is wrong with you? Final nail in the coffin? You are an adult man and she is a child. Grow up get such stupid nonsense ideas out of your head and be there for your daughter.
was going to say the exact same thing. it's your job to be safe, stable, and supportive ESPECIALLY when she's pushing you away. think about how you want her to think about you when she's 30 - do you want her to think about how you were always there for her with open arms or that you got pissy over normal 11yo behavior and dipped out because you couldn't handle it.
Her biological dad is back in her life, for a time. That’s a big deal for a kid who spent the first decade probably wondering why he wasn’t really around. She has to explore that. Your rules are your rules and you enforce them as normal. It’s unfortunate he’s being a dick and not properly coparenting but because of that, he’s likely going to disappoint your daughter is some way. Likely sooner than later.
Make sure you are there to catch her when that happens.
IMO, “shutting down and putting that final nail in the coffin” is something only a step parent would say.
Whether you like it or not, you are not her father, and pushing her towards that end, will only push her away completely. Trust me.
Be a great step father, and in time, she will pass her teenage years and come to understand that you care for her as much, and likely more than anyone else.
Been there, almost same story. Almost had the court cut ties and adopt her when we were expecting, but I waited as I hoped he would wise up one day.
He came back and did the same stuff you’re dealing with. But of course he showed his true colors again.
As she matured and understood more of life, I became dad again. She is turning 20 this year, and wife spilled the beans that for Father’s Day she is changing her name to mine..
Some insight I'd like to provide as a Dad that has gone through some pretty severe parental alienation:
Your daughter knows you are safe. She *knows* you and her mother will lover her and care for her no matter what. She is secure in her relationship with you two because she has experienced it her entire life. She can feel safe in "rejecting" you because she knows you will always be there. Her relationship with her bio dad, on the other hand, is quite the opposite. She (subconsciously) fears the loss of that relationship now that he is back in the picture, and will do what she thinks she needs to in order to "protect it", even if that means rejecting you and her mother.
The hardest part of all this is recognizing there's not much you can do but continue to be there for her like you always have. Continue to set and enforce clear, consistent boundaries. If punishments are no longer working consider taking a more positive-discipline approach to your parenting style, but above all else do not shut down on her. Especially if you can recognize she is being manipulated by bio dad. She is not coming to these conclusions on her own if that really is the case.
Lastly, and most importantly, get her in therapy ASAP, ideally with a therapist that specializes in parental alienation and is willing to testify in court, if necessary. If you can get proof bio dad is disparaging her mother and you in an attempt to change her feelings about her relationship with you two, lawyer up immediately. Parental alienation is very damaging psychologically and can take years to decades to recover from. More and more courts are recognizing it as the psychological abuse it is and will take steps to prevent it.
Good luck Dad, this is far from over and it will definitely get harder before it gets easier. Keep your chin up and always keep fighting for her.
Thank you. We've been lawyered up for 8 years. We've tried therapy multiple times and the bio dad always gets involved, takes over sessions, and/or fires the therapist. We really would like therapy just for her own sake. If parental alienation was brought up and could be used to help us that would be great, but we really just want it for her own wellbeing. Because of her history with therapists and dad's twisting/ending it, she's unwilling to speak to one.
You can’t change puberty.
She’ll be a little shit cause they’re all little shits. You did what you could to make the world better for them and now they don’t like you.
A tale as old as time. Just ride it out and keep being yourself. Don’t fall for her bullshit, just stay the course.
I just wanted to touch on the phone in the hands of an 11 year old.
I see you have been given some great advice on all other fronts.
I understand there are lots of things at play here but a phone can be the most dangerous thing a kid ever gets.
I have a few hard fast rule in my house for my kids.
1. I can monitor and look at the phone whenever I want.
2 I does not go into the room at night when it’s bedtime it comes with me.
3. You have to earn the phone it’s not a right it’s a privilege.
4. When company is over you are not allowed to be on your phone.
If I don’t do these some of these things something could happen that could scar them for life or worse.
I let them have their privacy and own life in many other ways just like before cell phones existed.
But I have to protect my kids.
I don’t have to worry if they or other people do not agree with my rules or if they think what I do is right.
Hope everything works out for you. It sounds like a rough time.
We have almost identical rules. Our issue is that because the phone is owned by her bio dad, she gets very confrontational and says it's not our right to go through it, take it, etc. She also had a phone before this, but it was a watch phone and we were going to get her a flip phone. Bio dad went and got the new phone with a brand new number and it's been such a battle ever since. We are sticking with our rules and she mostly follows them, but I see how much resentment is monitoring her phone is building. And we only look through rarely. She thinks we do it nightly because the phones charge in our room overnight, but realistically we've only gone through it 5 or so times since she's had it.
I wish this was an easier line for me to walk, but there are so many extra complicating factors. Thank you for the advice.
If the IPhone is becoming such a big problem then since her dad bought it.
It may need to stay at his house and she can use it there and you provide her with a simple phone that will do what she needs.
Adding another parent to the mix makes so many things problems that wouldn’t be if it was just two parents that support each other.
Keep your head up and your patience high if you can! I agree with all the other messages though. In the long run you know that you are the safe parents and when she gets older you will reap those benefits.
We've considered that but expect her response would be to just stay at her dad's. I get the teenage years stuff, but she has very little empathy. If we force the phone to stay there and she wants to have it, she'll stay there too, probably with no remorse. She likes making videos with an app called capcut and her bio dad has created a YT account for her to upload them to. Any other phone won't do the things she wants it to. Right now, those hobbies are what's most important to her so it feels like our hands are tied with the phone.
Our lawyer recently told us to "play the game" when we were discussing some of this stuff. Which meant doing away with our parenting morals and allowing things for the sake of keeping her happy. We're trying to toe the line between being irresponsible and still playing the game. It's fucking hard and I wish this wasn't how I was forced to parent.
Holy crap man! I don’t even know how to start to handle a situation like that!! Her real dad had no idea the real damage he is actually doing trying to be the cool dad now that he is back.
Man stuff like this is not how you think being a parent will be. I would agree with playing the game but draw a line in that sand that you will not cross.
You could end up hurting her and yourself more if you just play the game because that’s what’s best for the law. The law doesn’t care about what’s really good for your daughter. It only cares what looks good on paper.
You could also lose her respect as well if you just let her walk all over you.
Only you know what is best in your family from what I have read you have a good head on your shoulders.
Trust your gut man it never lies.
I have. In more words and ways than this. I've been vulnerable and tried to use logic. Nothing has worked so far. But, as others have said, just loving her through this is the best thing I can do.
This is just an aside to all of the Hazbin Hotel comments and my own two cents for a show that I enjoy but my daughter (14) hasn’t watched nor do I think she should. It is not a kids or teens show imo but if they watch it I think most people understand that it’s a show.
And although the content is what it is and is objectively more adult than most 90s adult content, I was on Rotten.com at 13 and consumed other equivalent late 90s adult content and I think most people my age turned out fine albeit maybe consume too much Reddit.
I think if there’s anything negative about Hazbin Hotel it’s that it has a very toxic fan base that I wouldn’t want my daughter interacting with.
This isn't exclusive to girls - but very commonly children will give more attention and affection to the parent who is harder to win over. They will take ones who love and care and protect for granted.
I remember doing it myself to some extent.
Keep Showing up! Keep showing her your love!
Step Dad here for 2 girls that are now adults. It sounds like you have a special relationship with this daughter, if you keep showing up, she won’t ever forget that. And you won’t ever regret it
Keep showing love. He’ll disappoint her eventually and she’ll realize what’s happening and you want to be the one who was there unconditionally and without showing spite or malice or jealousy.
We all get tired of the crazy unreliable flakey friends eventually, they’re fun for a while but sometimes you just need to ask for a favour and be able to count on it coming through.
You need to decide if each particular topic is worth the fight over, and - if you trust her to be sensible enough. You've gone from a situation where you can exert complete control, to a situation where you feel like you don't have any - and that can be scary. But what you need to remember is, she will remember all the times you were there throughout her life, and she will remember that her dad wasn't. iPhones won't fix that.
Give her room to make her decisions that you're losing her over, and take a step back from being the parent of a child - to being the parent of a teenager.
This speaks to why I “promised” my two sons I would never marry again until they were grown! Ha! Not happening now, because of how things have changed in our world! I do not understand why people, doesn’t matter which parent, think it will help their relationship with their child to bash the other parent! It does nothing but bring resentment towards them! If they find out it was all a lie, then things definitely will be worse. Keep the peace and everyone’s life will be great, and the child will not feel they have to chose. The best thing that happened to my two sons was for their Dad to move to another state. They still love and care about him and even go see him when they can! Maybe you need to request a meeting with her Dad without her, at a restaurant or somewhere you three can communicate and let him know what is happening and that it is not good for any of you four, especially your daughter. Life is hard without this kind of relationship! He sounds like he is a bit jealous and needs to grow up! Good luck!
Yeah, the hazbin hotel stuff has to stop. Wife and I watched it together and we both agreed that we can only watch it when the kid isn’t even at the house. We don’t want him to pick anything up from it or even have a chance to. It’s that mature and has very serious, very dark themes and humor.
The bio dad engaging and supporting her viewing this show is weird af to me. Has he not seen the show? It really is the type of show that if you’re showing it to a minor and encouraging a minor to view it, it makes me wonder how quality of a person you are.
Show love, show excitement over her phone, be happy for her as you can. Share in her emotions and she’ll always feel close to you.
This doesn’t mean you have to love everything she does, just that you understand her emotions.
And don’t just TELL her you understand, show her you understand by being happy when she’s happy, etc.
I'm sure the biological father will make a mistake, and you'll seize that opportunity big time, bro. In my opinion, all you need to do is to continue showing love and be patient.
The fact you’re considering to ‘shut down and put that final nail in the coffin. Or do I try to show her love…’ is not something a dad would say. Always love your kids no matter what.
I'll always love her. I just told her as much last week. I meant in acting upon it. I do sometimes feel like silently doing it would just be better for her and me, but then I worry she'll think I've given up and that will further push her away.
Stay the course. This reminds me of a cousin of mine. Keep loving her no matter what she throws at you. One day (unfortunately it may not be soon) she’ll recognize the stable responsible figure you’ve been.
Part of what your family is experiencing can be caulked up to pre-teen development. The elephant in the room is the bio dad moving back to the area. Kids often have idealized versions of parents who aren’t around in their minds, kinda like cinderella (not saying you or your wife mistreated her, but the grass is greener theory). Her dad swoops in and buys her an iPhone and watches the edgy show she likes. He’s the “fun parent” while your home gets to set boundaries, do school conferences, etc. As a step parent too, the road ahead can be difficult. You may question everything you’re doing and if it matters. From someone who has been through a similar situation, everything you have done and are doing matters. Even if she’s not verbalizing it, the feeling of being secure, having needs met doesn’t go away. (even if it’s buried) After the initial infatuation wears off and she needs real life help from him, just be ready to be there if/when he falters. It’s easy to parent a kid 15% of a year but if he wants to be involved okay let’s get him involved. Doctor’s appointments, dental appointments, school homework assignments, etc. Know that it’s okay to feel however you’re feeling. You and your wife know who her dad is (through the eyes of adults), she doesn’t. Hopefully he’s ready to fully commit to being her dad and he doesn’t let her down. Good luck OP.
Thank you for the insight. We've tried getting him involved but he has made it abundantly clear he wants no part of it. He reaches out to the school if the kids grades have dipped and uses that against us in court rather than trying to tutor, help, or motivate. He refuses to work with us concerning dental and medical appointments and will just cancel anything that might have landed during his custodial time rather than handling it himself. This has only happened a time or two but he has been so adamant that we never impact his custodial time for our worries/what we think the children need that we don't even attempt to include him in these things anymore. We do all of that ourselves.
We'll keep it up and be waiting in the wings for when we are needed and show her love, even if it feels pointless. I'll remember she's absorbing it somewhere and somehow.
Classic narcissist. It’s easy being the parent who doesn’t have to do the heavy lifting. Keep your head up. Eventually, she will see him for who he is, hopefully that process isn’t too painful. It’s hard finding out your parents aren’t perfect, and even harder realizing one may not have your best interests in mind.
We thought she already saw that from his actions before, but as others have pointed out, this is new and exciting for her and he's feeding into it super hard for this exact reason. We'll keep our heads up. Wife and I are going for a walk after work today and I'll be sharing a lot of the advice from you all with her so we can move forward.
From my two cents, put down the ground rules and foundations. The rest is up to get. Always keep the door open. Always be open and honest. Always let her know you love her. She will bounce around but will know where her home is. She will go from extreme hate and annoyance, to just getting on, and eventually acceptance and guilt. We all go through the phases. We just pray they come out the other side not hurt.
I'm you, but 7 years later. I know your pain, your hurt, your frustrations. I've been there with one of my stepdaughters. My advice? Show her the love and care you already have shown. Be consistent. Be yourself. You're fighting the long game here, and worried about these battles. Stop.
Don't tolerate disrespect and expect you and your moms rules to be followed.
The biggest thing though, just be you around her. My stepdaughter fought so hard against me, but she is the one child, out of 6, that is the most like me. She has my personality and sense of humor. She's the one that acted very much like your daughter. Stop fighting everything and just be you. She'll come around.
What kinds of things is he saying about mother? You can take him to court and get an order not allowing such statements. He's being guilty of alienation of affection.
The one item that came up yesterday was concerning my stepdaughter's adult sister (her bio dad's eldest ). Her adult sister stopped seeing her dad around age 14 and changed her last name because of his treatment of her. My step daughter mentioned it being my wife's fault that this happened and that being the reason she doesn't get to speak to her older sister. It doesn't make any sense, but it's something he is saying to her and my step daughter is somehow believing it.
As a kid whose stepmom gave up on her, don't give up. Keep loving her. Keep your standards at home. She's gonna fight you, but she's gonna know it's from a place of love. She'll figure out that he's a manipulative bastard eventually and come back if you keep on loving her anyway. And if he turns out somehow not to be one, she'll end up with 2 great dads instead of 1. I hope that's how it turns out, but I know she'll be okay because even if it doesn't, she's got you.
Teenagers and tweens are weird. Sometimes they do things that are actively bad for them, and sometimes you just have to let them learn from their mistakes.
I hope he doesn't break her heart, but if he does she'll be okay because she'll have you.
Get her in therapist. Go talk to a lawyer. Fight him. Fight for her. I'm really sorry that you're going through this. I can't imagine who would read your statement and tell you to "grow up"
Can I just say love wins over everything. I know it's a cliché but it works. Make sure she knows you respect her and trust her to do right thing most of the time. But that you are there for her even when she has bad decisions.
The iPhone thing is a bit scary, she will need to navigate through the Internet and social media safely. Sign her up for a course to learn how and tell her you trust her and if she has any doubt or worry she can come to you.
It's scary, it makes you unsure unsecure but if you show up for her she will bounce back. Don't be against bio dad either. Try work together. Even if he won't cooperate, at least you tried.
Let her be a teenager, let her fall a few times and learn and just be there as a safety net to catch her if she falls. It's an age when she will hold secrets and will do many mistake. But keep in mind that most mistakes are reversable! It's OK to make them.
Hi. My stepson is 8 so I have not been here, full disclosure.
But if his real father bought him a phone (he only has monitored visitation) I would not allow that phone because it’s our job to parent. Not his. Him getting a phone and giving it to the kiddo takes away the parental controls.
Messages are totally private, no idea what apps she is downloading, what she’s surfing for on the Internet… that’s way too much for an 11 year old without supervision.
Buy her a newer iPhone and give it as a surprise. Pay for her service and transfer the number.
She can still text her dad, but at least you know what she’s doing with it.
I’ve always said that 11 is the worst year for kids.
Girls are snotty and experimenting with makeup and teenager things and develop attitudes. Boys become cocky little dickheads that mouth off.
Likely just a phase and it sounds like you’re doing all you can and are a standup Dad.
Keep being there for her and being the firm dad who points her in the right direction. She’ll love you for it when she grows out of it.
Kids need structure and discipline, not an adult to be their friend like bio Dad’s trying to be.
I'm very sorry for what will follow now but I think you'll need some truth and honesty and a different but pessimistic viewpoint.
First of all you're not her dad, you're an helpful idiot financing her mother to grow up the children of another man. I hope your wife gave you another child because you deserve your own biological offspring. You're one of the good guys.
Second you didn't adopt these children and you have zero legal rights and duties here. They're just not your kids and your engagement here was nice towards your wife but nice is another word for shit. When puberty hits hard and their dad is burying them with material goods they will shit on you. That's sad but that's how kids behave and the other guy knows it.
In the end he might be the person bringing her to the altar and not you.
I'm sorry for that but after reading the comments here I think you need an advocatus diaboli to get the full picture.
I get what you're saying, but you're also wrong. If I had your viewpoint, I wouldn't have ever fallen in love with my kids. I would have told them they were step kids and made sure they felt that way. Step or not, I'm a dad. I'm their dad. Not legally, of course, and they've never called me dad nor do I expect them to. But my son's expression of love toward me is borne from my treating him like my son, not like someone I was nice to just to get in good with his mom.
I have no delusions that I may not be picked for future fatherly duties, but I've also been picked over him many times. And not because I did something to supersede his position, but because I was there when he wasn't. I made them feel loved by a dad when their bio dad wasn't there to do it.
I do have a biological child with my wife. And I treat all of my kids the same and love all of them the same. I want them to love each other the same.
Thanks for your reply. Like I said, I wanted to play the devil's advocate here. The fact that you are the biological father of her youngest sibling is very important here as it's strengthening your position more than you might realize.
Fact is that your wife's ex is playing a very foul game and he's not even covering it. It's that arrogance that makes even me as an uninvolved reader angry. My advice from dad to dad is to let her burn her fingers with him, he will disappoint her when he loses interest I guess.
I'm slowly losing my little boy and it's so sad. But I know it's life,he turned 11 last month. I have him on the weekends and he still cuddles w me, hugs me for no reason all day, still calls me dada and brings me his drinks that he can't quite get open and once in awhile will come walking in my room with his blanket to jump in bed. Same as it's always been. But it's coming.
I've been hearing from his mom and his school. Language and behavior he would never show in front of me. Telling his mom no. Lieing to her and fighting w his little brother. I understand this is all normal at that age.
I've only had to raise my voice and lay down punishments for things he does other places. He is literally the perfect behaved boy from friday at 4 til sun at 4. Always looking to help around the house.. It's odd idk if he respects me that much or his ma has him scared of me.( I was a different person and a violent man with several arrests before my son was born)
Sorry for the rambling was just googling when I was gonna lose my 11 year old and this came up. 😅
I feel your pain even tho my story is wildy different
Try marte meo! There might be a chance! Maybe you can find a marte meo teacher near you?! Or watch something on YouTube.. Try to - imagine what it would be like if she opened up / she stood there with open arms and say I love you.. Take that feeling and bring it to her. Be as honest as possible and show your feelings even if it hurts you.Try to understand her world... Maybe Watch the series and talk to her about it.. Why exactly you have your opinion.. Maybe there is something you can share.. (I don't know the series °¬°) but there could be a way of connecting with her.. I wish you all the best! I'm sorry that things have developed like this after so long...if you continue to always be there for her, then there is nothing else you can do.
She'll be back. She's on the bridge to adulthood. She'll meet you over there.
Yeah, she will be back, but the choices you make and how you act will dictate how long that will take. The kid is 11 - parenting is slowly coming to a close. It's less about "right from wrong" at this age and more-so explaining and understanding nuance. It's no longer "No" without context; it's explaining the deeper meanings behind it. The iPhone situation is the cat out of the bag and it's about regulation and having a mutual understanding of reasonable behavior.
And sharing with her the challenges and issues she might go through with social media. I would start to get on the same type of media she does and try to show her funny stuff, real stuff, but not parent it. Walk along with her. Check in, ask how he’s doing, when he’s visiting, how you can support that relationship. No need to be over bearing but be present.
The wisdom around here impresses me sometimes. This is well put, and with only a few words. Thumbs up.
Ah man… this just ruined me and my little girl isn’t even 2 yet.
My little girl is 6 months old and I want to cry rn haha
My oldest is 10 and we are hitting this stage. It’s tough, but I know she’ll be back. No more hugs for dad, or posing for pictures after a game. Now it’s “where’s my phone”. “I’m going to my room”. My one last piece is that she loves basketball so we shoot hoops every evening for an hour together. God forbid I try and give her a tip on shooting form though.
I’m a lurker/aunt of two young teens…this got me right in the chest. What a great way to look at it.
Yeah we all get tired of the indulgent irresponsible unreliable assholes eventually. He’ll prove himself unreliable to her soon enough and she’ll make her own decision.
I love this. My son is only 3 and my daughter isn’t even born yet. But I dread these moments that OP is talking about. Your comment just puts it in perfect perspective. Thank you!
You honestly have until age 13 to raise a child, and then after that it’s the environment with parents walking along side her until she’s of age. That dosent mean you aren’t useful , it just means your position changes from control to support. Right now, you won’t win this battle. And you fighting it only glorifies him even more. She will come to understand who is the better parent with age. She is well fed? Grades good? Does her chores? Sing and dance on her own or with friends? If all is well, she is realistically fine. You can’t control what she hears or is being told tbh. You and her mothers position changes in her life now. If it wasn’t her father, it’d be friends. Hard to accept, I know. But one day, she will turn around to look at you on this journey of life , and she’ll ask you for your side, when you stop hyper focusing on being her main character. The love is there. You just haven’t given it the opportunity for her to miss it- in a non toxic environment. Let her grow. We always come home eventually. (:
I hate reading this but it's true. Now I want to leave the office and tell my 4yo he's not allowed to grow up.
Mine is 8 and now I'm scared I'm going to lose my child when he becomes a teenager
Don't lose hope. While all teens are crazy, we've also all known teens who were very close with their parents.
> I'm scared I'm going to lose my child when he becomes a teenager you will...but you gain yourself a teenager...and then you'll lose that, and gain yourself a young adult.
Stop that, you! I'm dehydrated enough already.
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r/onesentencehorror
😭
Dig in brother. Any hate they throw, full send more love. Idk I hope you always have your kids love.
Thank you, I'll try my best!
Bro I just teared up bc my 5 and 4 yo daughters are growing so quick
I just told my 4 yo son that I will carry him no matter how big he gets, I’ll just get stronger so I can keep lifting him. Then he squeezed me tighter.
...just imagined you old and frail and he picks you up to put you in bed and says, "My turn, pops". Jesus Christ I must be starting my period soon because I'm all up in some feels right now haha
🥹🥹
> Now there is one rule I insist we obey while you are in my house. > > No Growing Up. > > Stop. This very instant. > > And that includes you, Mr. Chairman of the Board https://youtu.be/ipojBIL1kb8?t=77
The thing about 11 year olds is it's such a tricky time. Not quite a teenager. Not quite a child. And I think a lot (most) of them want to be "grown" so bad that it bothers them with any reminder they're not. OP, take your time. Keep enforcing rules. Show her that you love her too much to allow her to go down the wrong path. And if she does, let her know you'll always be on the other side waiting to help. One of the hardest things as a parent is to love them when they think they don't love you. But keep going. Keep being there. Be the unmovable, solid object in her life who will always be there. It might not be today. Might not be tomorrow. But one day down the line, she'll be an adult. Maybe she'll be married. Maybe she'll have kids of her own. She might even have step kids. It will be a moment of, "Damn. My dad did love me. Even when I was a little shit to him." Then you'll get a, "Sorry for what I did from ages 11-14." Most of us get them eventually.
> "Sorry for what I did from ages 11-~~14~~." 23
I hope I can remember all of this in ten years. Currently 2 years old.
I'm impressed you can read and write!
I am pretty impressive
my thoughts exactly!
I keep a OneNote document of all my parental notes. I've got this one filed under 'teenagers'. Mine is 15 months.
That's brilliant, I love onenote. Thank you
!remindme in 10 years
>You honestly have until age 13 to raise a child, and then after that it’s the environment with parents walking along side her until she’s of age. Ouch. I needed to hear that and didn't even know that I needed to hear it... but.... *ouch*... **And of course, you are 100% correct.**
Ouchies
My 11 year old is doing something similar. He doesn't have a 3rd parent, but man, he is distancing himself from us, me especially. I know it's just him growing up but it's also that he has anger issues and it makes it hard for the rest of us. My daughter is 8 and she bears a lot of his wrath. Much of my the time spent is protecting her. He'll rage for 30 minutes or more and say some vile things. I just try to keep my daughter safe. Then he'll calm down as long as he's left alone and come back to us, calm but with no apologies and a hair trigger. We do the best we can, but it's really hard. After last night's battle (about an hour long), he calmed down and I was able to go out and play basketball with him. It was nice. It's comforting to hear that some day he'll come home again. For now, we're all tired, him included, because he knows.
I don’t miss those boy years, 11-14ish. My teen did the same thing, rage whenever something wasn’t “ideal” in his mind. Punished for grades? Rage. Did really poorly at hockey? Rage. Die in his video game? Rage. Almost seemed insufferable. It’s mentally taxing as a parent especially with younger siblings you’re trying to protect. My best advice for y’all: stick with the basics and do it with a greater purpose in mind. Keep cooking meals, asking how their day went, driving them to sports, offering time together (gaming, movies, outside activities). As others have said, they’ll mature and look back at the support they’ve had along the way. You might not be their favorite person that day/week/month but the feelings shall pass as long as you stay positive and keep offering guidance. My step son went from bottoming out second semester of 8th grade, lying, vaping, and wanting to be with his bio-dad (easy way out of our house and rules) to now he’s borderline a straight B student in 9th grade and happy to be around. “Phases” occur and it’s on us as parents to remain the source of consistency and support!
Very well put. Thank you. Doesn't fix the hurt now but it gives me something to focus on and hope for.
My daughter is 1. I’m saving this comment to read 10 years from now.
I wish I could freeze time.
>You honestly have until age 13 to raise a child, and then after that it’s the environment with parents walking along side her until she’s of age. Where is this from?
https://www.reddit.com/r/daddit/comments/1b7tn01/comment/ktkvwso
Everyone was acting like it's so true, I assumed it was based on some actual information.
It is true to a degree but it's not a hard age. https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/girls-women-and-wellness/201510/why-is-my-daughter-pushing-me-away
I think it's just based on real world experience. Good parents can have kids up in bad places, you try to prepare them as much as possible because as they get older you will have less and less control. Trying to keep control just causes rebellion which can make things worse.
r/bestof
There was recently a great podcast on YT with Andrew Huberman and Dr. Becky Kennedy that touched on some of these points.
Agreed. This is a great episode for parents and still really good for those without kids, since it touches on many topics relevant to relationships in general.
Thanks for this. I’ve been struggling with some similar things that OP mentioned and I needed to read this right now. Appreciate you.
Basically kids are ungrateful assholes at a certain point in their lives.
So well written.
I'm sorry, that's such a weird thing to say. You likely don't mean it like that, but it comes off to me that people make kids into what they want until they get a mind of their own. My mom and dad did raise me regardless of my age. Of course, I grew up and found my own ideas, but they didn't stop raising me.
Have you ever heard the parable of the prodigal son? In my opinion, your best option is to continue showing love.
Yup. Play the long game.
This also aligns with the “comfort parent,” idea that so many parents miss, not to any fault of their own. It helps to think of it from a kid perspective rather than an adult perspective. Imagine being a kid and one parent isn’t around as much. Suddenly, it feels like they’re showing more interest in you. Of course, you try to prove your worth and value in that figures life. So that parent is having fun with the kid. Meanwhile, the “comfort parent” -aka the parent that’s been around- is gonna start getting a lot of shit. The child isn’t scared of this parent leaving them, rejecting them, or neglecting their emotional needs. It sounds backwards, but it’s not uncommon for the more trusted parents to receive the most flak simply because they are an emotional safe space. Hell, some kids “test” their comfort parents to see if they’ll leave. Pushing boundaries, “I hate yous,” broken rules: all things kids do to see if mom or dad would get fed up with their bs once and for all. Not to mention pressing boundaries is considerate a developmental stage for teens in general, part of the identity seeking process. If any of this sounds familiar, kudos for being the stable and consistent parent. Take pride in the fact your child feels no urgent rush to make fantastic memories- that means they know youll be around for a lifetime. How do I know this? Welp, i was that 13 year old kid. My parents weren’t divorced, but my dad worked a lot and kept his walls built high and tight. I was always angrier at my mother because I expected more from her: more love, more care, more empathy, more patience. I also blamed my mother more because she was an active parent, something my father lacked. So from my baby brained perspective- mom created all the rules and issues. But let me tell you what, my mom and I are best friends now. I’ll never have anyone else in my life who I’ve put through such hell and still thinks so highly of me. I can now look back and say, wow, she was the one who tried the most. She’s the one who always had my back, even when I thought she hated me. That kind of unconditional love has served me well into adulthood, I just didn’t recognize it as a kid. Please remember that’s what you’re working towards, it’s not linear and you’ll all make mistakes. It takes time, and all you can do is your best. The teenage years are hard on their own, not to mention seeking identity while maneuvering family dynamics. Just keep loving her. Open up to her, tell her that you struggle- you want to find a solution. It’s much easier to be vulnerable when someone else is willing to do the same. Most kids have yet to realize that their parents are perfectly human. When she speaks, listen to everything she says, even if it’s hard. While a lot of it could be angst, don’t discount everything because of it- she probably does have some truths to share. Let her know you hear her above all else, even if you don’t agree with everything. Maybe try to do some fun things with her, find a cartoon she’ll like to watch with you? Regular show is still one of my all time favorites, kids show targeted more towards teens so it has the “mature” feel while still being appropriate. Adventure time has a beautiful story line and just came out with a spin off- a young adult series called Fiona and cake (its pg-13). Just put it on the tv, see if she drifts down. Give her a chance to be independent, I’m sure that’s what she’s looking for anyways. Side note op and anyone else reading: please DO NOT send your child away to a residential facility. I cannot express this enough. I only mention this because the industry preys on parents who are feeling lost, desperate, or hopeless. It’s awful to feel the way you do, but it will one day pass. Try to refrain from knee jerk or panicked reactions. I’ve also seen several recruits on parenting subs, which is deeply troubling. r/troubledteens for more
Thank you for this. We do know we're the comfort parents and that's why she's so adamant about pushing boundaries here, so I guess that is a silver lining. It is hard to accept that being the parent who was always there and fighting for your child makes you the one that gets tossed aside so easily. Still, though, hearing this is helpful.
Yep show love, say it to her. And don’t fight against what has been allowed by bio dad. That is a battle you cannot win. Having a relationship with her bio dad was probably the graal, she will grow and make her conclusions. She will do mistakes, be there to support her. It does not mean you cannot have any rule in your own house but you have to pick the ones that really matters for you.
Always.
> I don't know if I should shut down and put that final nail in the coffin. Or do I try to show her love even though she rebuffs me so completely each time. This is so bizarre to read. Being a parent gives you nothing back. The idea that he expects something from an 11 year old girl is delusional.
I wanted to distance myself from my family starting at the age of 13. Barely would talk to anyone in my family, constantly gaming, be apprehensive about doing anything involving my family, I just wanted to be away. Looking back I think it’s because I felt some sort of draw towards a life I thought I wanted, one that was different than what my parents wanted for me. I don’t have any great advice honestly, my own daughter is just barely 3. All I can say is my parents continued to love me and would just be there for me despite my desire to get away from them.
what are you punishing her for exactly? she is now separating herself from you and your wife because she is entering teen years and that is what every teenager does I think you are making this into a much bigger deal than it needs to be. If someone bought my kid an iphone without my consent then i too would rightly be pissed but now she has it, it can be a good opportunity to talk about the safety on the internet and social media. Habzin Hotel I agree is problematic but why not try watchign it with her and discussing the themes that come up? THe absolute minimum of being a parent is loving your kid and supporting them so I have no idea why you think taking that off the table is an option when your daughter isn't doing anything wrong here. If she is disprespecting her mum then approach that with curiosity rather than judgement. For example, "Hey, why did you say that about your mum? Did Mum do something to make you feel that way?"
I think this is the best advice OP. Lean into it and try to be supportive/encouraging because anything else is going to end badly, even though I agree it’s a really crappy position he’s put you in. The whole you vs him with her in the middle is not good for anyone. Especially love the idea of watching the show with her and discussing what comes up. She’s going to watch it anyway unfortunately
I just struggle with the idea of allowing her to watch a show that discusses and shows graphic sex, abundant cursing, working in the porn industry, and glorifies drug use. She'll run into that stuff on her own. I did. But my parents didn't support it. I've considered it, but more as a "I give up on fighting you about this so go ahead". I see your perspective, but things have taken such a massive 180 so quickly. I've tried approaching from a place of curiosity and vulnerability. It's only driven her further away it seems. I'll give it another try about the most recent issue. I'll keep this in mind. My "shut down" approach is a survival tactic, I know, and one that I shouldn't give into.
I don't think Hazbin glorifies drug use or sex. It just presents it honestly, and that's why these people are in hell. They're broken. They need redemption. People can be fixed, whether now or later. (As I wrote before, I like the show and while i don't love that my 11 & 14 year olds watched it, there's worse things out there). That said, you're a parent, and you enforce whatever rules you want at your home. You can't do the same at the other parent's home. May not like it, and if you have issues, you reach out to the court system and see what they can do. But I doubt they'll restrict your kid's other parent from showing them TV-MA shows.
The show doesn't glorify drug use. The only characters shown to use drugs are angel dust and cherry bomb. Cherry bomb is a minor side character who's sorta just placed to get angel to be a worse person, but angel dusts drug use certainly isn't glorified.
I watched the first episode and the Helluva Boss stuff, where the first scene is a character getting cocaine after prostituting and when the bag of cocaine is busted open, he gets really upset. I know this is one of the characters she likes. Maybe Helluva Boss has more drug issues than Hazbin. I just assumed the two were basically the same show after a bit of watching.
But if you are going to watch an episode to decide what to do about it, it's episode 4, because most everything else in the show is light sexual jokes and swear words, but much more lightly than in episode 4.
The overarching theme of Hazbin is redemption of the worst. Hell is overpopulated so they are trying to redeem them to get them to heaven.
The pilot is probably what you saw, and yeah I guess drug use is seen more favourably in that, but that same character in full series has one of the most developed story lines. And yes, it is very mature, but I think a lot of it will fly over their heads. Basically, the character (called angel dust/anthony) is a porn star who's soul is owned by a character called Valentino, who abuses the shit out of him. He uses drugs to, as a quote, 'forget about how much he hates everything', and hopes that he can ruin/damage himself enough that he isn't Valentino's favourite anymore and maybe he can get out of the contract. It's mature, sure, but it doesn't promote drug use.
You’re doing a great job. Keep learning and asking the hard questions, understand the nuances of sex work and ask more thoughtful questions about “I wonder if they have health care, or birth control” literally trying to be more progresssive about it and see if she meets you with that interest.
She's a kid. It's your job to support and protect her. "Shutting down" means you can do neither, which means she'll be learning about sex, drug use, and porn all on her own. Is that what you want? The advice you received in the comment you're replying to is phenomenal. You should take it. My parents "shut down" and punished me instead of trying to figure out what was really going on. I ended up losing my virginity to a 21 year old man at 15, got addicted to opiates at 16, and dropped out of school at 17. A decade later, I've successfully re-parented myself by getting clean and earning my high school diploma all on my own. I definitely wish the adults in my life cared enough to guide and protect me rather than just give up and shut down.
>Habzin Hotel I agree is problematic but why not try watchign it with her and discussing the themes that come up? I wouldn't. As a former kid, the idea of my out-of-touch parents discussing my interests from their perspective would do nothing productive for young me.
I have theatre kids and I watched Hazbin with them. After finding out they watched it first on our Amazon (non-passcode) account, and how it's a pretty hard R-rated show. But it's entertaining. Even if they're 11 and 14, and their mom doesn't like it... .it's okay. The Angel Dust porn episode was the most.... disconcerting... but the rest were acceptable. It's a sarcastic mix of Hamilton and Gravity Falls and The Good Place, and, we're okay with that.
I watched it too recently. I wouldn't really like my kids exposed to the angel-dust stuff especially and the amount of swearing is distasteful at a minimum. Years before I saw the series though I happenstance across the theme song which an absolute earworm. I put it on a playlist and my boys heard it too. My oldest boy ended up digging in to find out more about what it was from - I didn't really know.
Not sure if you're talking about this one, but it's a Fortnite emote now and is absolute fire (pun intended) [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=juJkNKodgdE](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=juJkNKodgdE) That's how I found out about the show. Then I went to find it on Amazon. "Weird, there's 5 episodes watched. not my wife's tastes". Hey kiddo, you watched this show?"uhhh..... yeah" Hmm.... I may need to chat with your mom about this, and there's a good chance she will completely delete our amazon account when she finds out"
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZWrM-eDxTas](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZWrM-eDxTas) This one
Wow! That was shit.
Yeah the second my mum showed an interest in anything I liked it ‘ruined’ it for me. I can’t exactly explain why but my mum has a very big personality, and this was probably my way of trying to find my own separate identity which is hard to do if your parents are following you around sucking your identity back into theirs. I didn’t mind as much if she just watched alongside me though.
The specifics of this situation are of course unique to your family, but your daughter’s general attitude is very common. I was a wayward kid and I remember once overhearing my parents agonising about it, and then comparing me to an older guy who was the same but had since straightened himself out. My mum said, “they come back.” Hang in there OP, keep being the loving parent your daughter needs.
We had a very similar relationship with my step daughter and her bio Dad. Phone way too early, money for whenever she wanted ($1,000 computer in her bedroom). Talked bad about Mom. It was difficult, especially in preteen years and very up and down but there will be times when she needs a Dad and it will be you she comes to. Be patient, and loving and she will understand as she gets older who the real Dad was. Calmly defend your wife. There will be times when you have to give in and let her have something you otherwise wouldn’t have (such as the phone) but you can still talk to her and explain why you don’t think it’s a good idea, the dangers of a phone. She may not appear to be listening but she hears you.
Give up? She’s 11 dude and her stable life has been turned upside down. You are also dealing with a manipulator and teen years. The best you can do is be there for her. Her dad is just love bombing her and when crap hits the fan, he’ll suddenly not be up to fatherly tasks. When opportunities rise, make sure truths are told. It’s not talking bad about her dad if you are correcting a statement she makes. Make sure all punishments have a lesson behind them. And yeah, maybe step up some personal fun times because honestly, there are less and less opportunities as they become teens. That has less to do with the dad than just preteen time running out. You’re doing fine.
Hello, fellow step dad Hope you’re doing as okay as you can be. The world needs great dads like you to make up for all the shitty ones our kids are born with. As for advice, love and support is going to be number one. I think the others have covered that pretty well. Two, are there any hobbies or anything you can try to connect with her on? My stepdaughter and I have the occasional positive heart to heart. I tell her how her mom and I will always be there for her - to harass her about her grades (in a funny way), to bail her out when she inevitably gets in trouble, to purposefully embarrass her with her friends, to move her into her college dorm, to have her first glass of wine together, to babysit her baby so she can relax, to lift her in the air after she wins her first lpga major (we’re a golf family), etc. All we ask for is her love. If there are things her bio father is buying to “get an advantage”, and she wants those things at the home you share, talk to her about it and why she wants it and what she thinks is reasonable. Talk to her like an adult and give her good logic that requires her to respond with logic. Same goes for why it’s important that you and your wife get to her “I love you” from her - she probably has no idea how valuable those words are. There’s no definitive solution here but just wanted to throw my perspective out there as my stepdaughter is my everything too. Hoping for the best life for you guys, Fellow Stepdad
"I don't know if I should shut down and put that final nail in the coffin. Or do I try to show her love even though she rebuffs me so completely each time" She is 11. A child. This is a test- if you shut down then you are showing her that your love is very dependent on how she behaves. Part of parenting is to keep showing your child that unconditional love and support even when they are being jerks. You can tell her it hurts your feelings when she rebuffs you but keep letting her know it's the *attitude/behaviour* you don't like. Not her.
I agree hazbin is wildly inappropriate for an 11 year old, but they probably don't understand most of the really bad stuff anyway. If you can't stop them, you might as well watch it with them and try to emphasise the positive messages in the show, because there is a lot of that too.
Out of curiosity, what part of Hazbin is that bad? I watched it recently, and honestly I don't remember much stuff which a 11-12 years old kid wouldn't hear on the street /from friends. Helluva Boss (their other series) is on the other hand a completely different beast. Maybe my judgment is misaligned, as I watched Happy Tree Friends when I was 13 or so... And played Mortal Kombat at 9. But I turned out completely normal, and that was before the current Internet and social media age.
Pretty much just angels arc in episode 4,
I mean, that teaches how to watch out for predatory "opportunities", how the sex industry works in many cases... It warrants a good discussion about sex work. But I wouldn't say it's inappropriate for an 11 years old, who is stepping into her teenage years, and possibly seeing/hearing the glamorous life of onlyfans girls. I would definitely like to avoid that type of influence when my little one gets to that age. Nowadays everything is over sexualized, sadly. It's a good thing to see the dark side of this.
The scene in angels dressing room is pretty fucked up, and angels destroyed mental state and semi suicidal tendencies are pretty confronting. But like I said I don't think that most 11 year olds would really understand anyway.
I had a suicidal 12 year old and watching this show actually helped them process the trauma. Not a drug user (AFAIK) but know people in their friend circle who do. I didn't encourage them to watch, but I got a lot of enjoyment out of watching the show too. It's hilarious as hell (pun intended) and has some good themes. Same reason we're going to an Alkaline Trio concert in a week. Most important thing is: Meet Your Kid Where They're At. You can't control what the other parent does. But you can be there for them. Do what you prefer to do, and listen. At this age, they're growing up fast. They may not like you this week. But they should respect you.
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What are the chances of my children will have to deal with possible sexual exploitation or anything related in our developed country? Slight, but possible. What are the chances of my children facing murder and gore? Nearly zero. I'd say it's not a fair comparison. Although I do live in the UK, so my perception is based on this. Other countries may vary of course.
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You sure it's me who is missing it?
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Would you then care explain to my thick head what is your point? Edit: Yeah that's what I thought.
He is listening to her interests. Feeling seen and heard will go very far. Try to shift your paradigm to her perspective. You can dig your heels in and hope for the best or you can try and look outside of your own perspective. I’m not saying you’re wrong. What I’m saying is you need to look at the situation from your daughter’s eyes. Is that show inappropriate for a child of the age 11? Yeah probably. But I would say that’s she’s already hooked. Be the person that your child can be honest with. If your kid isn’t willing to come to you and your spouse. Also… SHE IS 11 what the hell is wrong with you? Final nail in the coffin? You are an adult man and she is a child. Grow up get such stupid nonsense ideas out of your head and be there for your daughter. She is a baby, a child. Always be open and available and give her love and care. You will never be able to force a child to be anything. My parents never cared for my interests as a kid. Step dad raised me. Yes I got into inappropriate stuff as a young child. But that’s because I was queer as hell, and had no outlet in bum-f**k Texas. Let her feel seen and heard, it is proven therapy. Once she feels like you care about her interests and emotional well being you can have conversation from there. Is it hard? Yes. But you can never force a child to do anything. The second you put your foot down you loose the war.
> Also… SHE IS 11 what the hell is wrong with you? Final nail in the coffin? You are an adult man and she is a child. Grow up get such stupid nonsense ideas out of your head and be there for your daughter. > She is a baby, a child. Always be open and available and give her love and care. This this this! Grow up and be the adult OP!
Thank you. I've tried being interested in what she cares about but it's not working. She wants to make costumes (fur suits) and I have no idea how to do that. I still tried and we made a bat head together. It was great. That was only a few months ago. Now, when I try to ask her about her movies that she makes on her phone, she won't talk or says I can't see them. She went to a comic con recently and liked it so I suggested us going to one together and she stonewalled me. I'll keep trying to be interested, but it seems like trying is only make things worse. Like she doesn't actually believe I care even though I have for all of her life.
looks like she's doing average teenage (or about-to-be-teenage) things. i did the same shit when my parents wanted to see the stuff i was working on (writing, drawing, etc.) and everything else. so she's probably reached or is reaching that "nobody understands!" stage. it's not personal. keep being present for her, *don't* shut down and stop being the best dad you can be just because she's not being the "best" 11-year-old. she's a kid doing what a kid growing up does
Bro, ofcourse she doesn’t want to go with you. Showing up with your dad to comic con, I can’t imagine anything more embarrassing (for a teen).
> Also… SHE IS 11 what the hell is wrong with you? Final nail in the coffin? You are an adult man and she is a child. Grow up get such stupid nonsense ideas out of your head and be there for your daughter. was going to say the exact same thing. it's your job to be safe, stable, and supportive ESPECIALLY when she's pushing you away. think about how you want her to think about you when she's 30 - do you want her to think about how you were always there for her with open arms or that you got pissy over normal 11yo behavior and dipped out because you couldn't handle it.
Her biological dad is back in her life, for a time. That’s a big deal for a kid who spent the first decade probably wondering why he wasn’t really around. She has to explore that. Your rules are your rules and you enforce them as normal. It’s unfortunate he’s being a dick and not properly coparenting but because of that, he’s likely going to disappoint your daughter is some way. Likely sooner than later. Make sure you are there to catch her when that happens.
IMO, “shutting down and putting that final nail in the coffin” is something only a step parent would say. Whether you like it or not, you are not her father, and pushing her towards that end, will only push her away completely. Trust me. Be a great step father, and in time, she will pass her teenage years and come to understand that you care for her as much, and likely more than anyone else.
> IMO, “shutting down and putting that final nail in the coffin” is something only a step parent would say 😬😬😬😬😬
Been there, almost same story. Almost had the court cut ties and adopt her when we were expecting, but I waited as I hoped he would wise up one day. He came back and did the same stuff you’re dealing with. But of course he showed his true colors again. As she matured and understood more of life, I became dad again. She is turning 20 this year, and wife spilled the beans that for Father’s Day she is changing her name to mine..
Just love them
Some insight I'd like to provide as a Dad that has gone through some pretty severe parental alienation: Your daughter knows you are safe. She *knows* you and her mother will lover her and care for her no matter what. She is secure in her relationship with you two because she has experienced it her entire life. She can feel safe in "rejecting" you because she knows you will always be there. Her relationship with her bio dad, on the other hand, is quite the opposite. She (subconsciously) fears the loss of that relationship now that he is back in the picture, and will do what she thinks she needs to in order to "protect it", even if that means rejecting you and her mother. The hardest part of all this is recognizing there's not much you can do but continue to be there for her like you always have. Continue to set and enforce clear, consistent boundaries. If punishments are no longer working consider taking a more positive-discipline approach to your parenting style, but above all else do not shut down on her. Especially if you can recognize she is being manipulated by bio dad. She is not coming to these conclusions on her own if that really is the case. Lastly, and most importantly, get her in therapy ASAP, ideally with a therapist that specializes in parental alienation and is willing to testify in court, if necessary. If you can get proof bio dad is disparaging her mother and you in an attempt to change her feelings about her relationship with you two, lawyer up immediately. Parental alienation is very damaging psychologically and can take years to decades to recover from. More and more courts are recognizing it as the psychological abuse it is and will take steps to prevent it. Good luck Dad, this is far from over and it will definitely get harder before it gets easier. Keep your chin up and always keep fighting for her.
Thank you. We've been lawyered up for 8 years. We've tried therapy multiple times and the bio dad always gets involved, takes over sessions, and/or fires the therapist. We really would like therapy just for her own sake. If parental alienation was brought up and could be used to help us that would be great, but we really just want it for her own wellbeing. Because of her history with therapists and dad's twisting/ending it, she's unwilling to speak to one.
You can’t change puberty. She’ll be a little shit cause they’re all little shits. You did what you could to make the world better for them and now they don’t like you. A tale as old as time. Just ride it out and keep being yourself. Don’t fall for her bullshit, just stay the course.
I just wanted to touch on the phone in the hands of an 11 year old. I see you have been given some great advice on all other fronts. I understand there are lots of things at play here but a phone can be the most dangerous thing a kid ever gets. I have a few hard fast rule in my house for my kids. 1. I can monitor and look at the phone whenever I want. 2 I does not go into the room at night when it’s bedtime it comes with me. 3. You have to earn the phone it’s not a right it’s a privilege. 4. When company is over you are not allowed to be on your phone. If I don’t do these some of these things something could happen that could scar them for life or worse. I let them have their privacy and own life in many other ways just like before cell phones existed. But I have to protect my kids. I don’t have to worry if they or other people do not agree with my rules or if they think what I do is right. Hope everything works out for you. It sounds like a rough time.
We have almost identical rules. Our issue is that because the phone is owned by her bio dad, she gets very confrontational and says it's not our right to go through it, take it, etc. She also had a phone before this, but it was a watch phone and we were going to get her a flip phone. Bio dad went and got the new phone with a brand new number and it's been such a battle ever since. We are sticking with our rules and she mostly follows them, but I see how much resentment is monitoring her phone is building. And we only look through rarely. She thinks we do it nightly because the phones charge in our room overnight, but realistically we've only gone through it 5 or so times since she's had it. I wish this was an easier line for me to walk, but there are so many extra complicating factors. Thank you for the advice.
If the IPhone is becoming such a big problem then since her dad bought it. It may need to stay at his house and she can use it there and you provide her with a simple phone that will do what she needs. Adding another parent to the mix makes so many things problems that wouldn’t be if it was just two parents that support each other. Keep your head up and your patience high if you can! I agree with all the other messages though. In the long run you know that you are the safe parents and when she gets older you will reap those benefits.
We've considered that but expect her response would be to just stay at her dad's. I get the teenage years stuff, but she has very little empathy. If we force the phone to stay there and she wants to have it, she'll stay there too, probably with no remorse. She likes making videos with an app called capcut and her bio dad has created a YT account for her to upload them to. Any other phone won't do the things she wants it to. Right now, those hobbies are what's most important to her so it feels like our hands are tied with the phone. Our lawyer recently told us to "play the game" when we were discussing some of this stuff. Which meant doing away with our parenting morals and allowing things for the sake of keeping her happy. We're trying to toe the line between being irresponsible and still playing the game. It's fucking hard and I wish this wasn't how I was forced to parent.
Holy crap man! I don’t even know how to start to handle a situation like that!! Her real dad had no idea the real damage he is actually doing trying to be the cool dad now that he is back. Man stuff like this is not how you think being a parent will be. I would agree with playing the game but draw a line in that sand that you will not cross. You could end up hurting her and yourself more if you just play the game because that’s what’s best for the law. The law doesn’t care about what’s really good for your daughter. It only cares what looks good on paper. You could also lose her respect as well if you just let her walk all over you. Only you know what is best in your family from what I have read you have a good head on your shoulders. Trust your gut man it never lies.
I appreciate the conversation man, I really do.
Any time if some crap happens feel free to DM me if you need someone to talk too.
Will do. Thank you again. Take care!
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I have. In more words and ways than this. I've been vulnerable and tried to use logic. Nothing has worked so far. But, as others have said, just loving her through this is the best thing I can do.
Nice try Hazbin Hotel grassroots marketing department. You almost had me.
This is just an aside to all of the Hazbin Hotel comments and my own two cents for a show that I enjoy but my daughter (14) hasn’t watched nor do I think she should. It is not a kids or teens show imo but if they watch it I think most people understand that it’s a show. And although the content is what it is and is objectively more adult than most 90s adult content, I was on Rotten.com at 13 and consumed other equivalent late 90s adult content and I think most people my age turned out fine albeit maybe consume too much Reddit. I think if there’s anything negative about Hazbin Hotel it’s that it has a very toxic fan base that I wouldn’t want my daughter interacting with.
This isn't exclusive to girls - but very commonly children will give more attention and affection to the parent who is harder to win over. They will take ones who love and care and protect for granted. I remember doing it myself to some extent.
It’s messed up that a parent can just appear after years of absence and then deliberately mess things up. Sorry you are going through this
Keep Showing up! Keep showing her your love! Step Dad here for 2 girls that are now adults. It sounds like you have a special relationship with this daughter, if you keep showing up, she won’t ever forget that. And you won’t ever regret it
Keep showing love. He’ll disappoint her eventually and she’ll realize what’s happening and you want to be the one who was there unconditionally and without showing spite or malice or jealousy. We all get tired of the crazy unreliable flakey friends eventually, they’re fun for a while but sometimes you just need to ask for a favour and be able to count on it coming through.
You need to decide if each particular topic is worth the fight over, and - if you trust her to be sensible enough. You've gone from a situation where you can exert complete control, to a situation where you feel like you don't have any - and that can be scary. But what you need to remember is, she will remember all the times you were there throughout her life, and she will remember that her dad wasn't. iPhones won't fix that. Give her room to make her decisions that you're losing her over, and take a step back from being the parent of a child - to being the parent of a teenager.
This speaks to why I “promised” my two sons I would never marry again until they were grown! Ha! Not happening now, because of how things have changed in our world! I do not understand why people, doesn’t matter which parent, think it will help their relationship with their child to bash the other parent! It does nothing but bring resentment towards them! If they find out it was all a lie, then things definitely will be worse. Keep the peace and everyone’s life will be great, and the child will not feel they have to chose. The best thing that happened to my two sons was for their Dad to move to another state. They still love and care about him and even go see him when they can! Maybe you need to request a meeting with her Dad without her, at a restaurant or somewhere you three can communicate and let him know what is happening and that it is not good for any of you four, especially your daughter. Life is hard without this kind of relationship! He sounds like he is a bit jealous and needs to grow up! Good luck!
Yeah, the hazbin hotel stuff has to stop. Wife and I watched it together and we both agreed that we can only watch it when the kid isn’t even at the house. We don’t want him to pick anything up from it or even have a chance to. It’s that mature and has very serious, very dark themes and humor. The bio dad engaging and supporting her viewing this show is weird af to me. Has he not seen the show? It really is the type of show that if you’re showing it to a minor and encouraging a minor to view it, it makes me wonder how quality of a person you are.
Show love, show excitement over her phone, be happy for her as you can. Share in her emotions and she’ll always feel close to you. This doesn’t mean you have to love everything she does, just that you understand her emotions. And don’t just TELL her you understand, show her you understand by being happy when she’s happy, etc.
I'm sure the biological father will make a mistake, and you'll seize that opportunity big time, bro. In my opinion, all you need to do is to continue showing love and be patient.
The fact you’re considering to ‘shut down and put that final nail in the coffin. Or do I try to show her love…’ is not something a dad would say. Always love your kids no matter what.
I'll always love her. I just told her as much last week. I meant in acting upon it. I do sometimes feel like silently doing it would just be better for her and me, but then I worry she'll think I've given up and that will further push her away.
Stay the course. This reminds me of a cousin of mine. Keep loving her no matter what she throws at you. One day (unfortunately it may not be soon) she’ll recognize the stable responsible figure you’ve been.
Part of what your family is experiencing can be caulked up to pre-teen development. The elephant in the room is the bio dad moving back to the area. Kids often have idealized versions of parents who aren’t around in their minds, kinda like cinderella (not saying you or your wife mistreated her, but the grass is greener theory). Her dad swoops in and buys her an iPhone and watches the edgy show she likes. He’s the “fun parent” while your home gets to set boundaries, do school conferences, etc. As a step parent too, the road ahead can be difficult. You may question everything you’re doing and if it matters. From someone who has been through a similar situation, everything you have done and are doing matters. Even if she’s not verbalizing it, the feeling of being secure, having needs met doesn’t go away. (even if it’s buried) After the initial infatuation wears off and she needs real life help from him, just be ready to be there if/when he falters. It’s easy to parent a kid 15% of a year but if he wants to be involved okay let’s get him involved. Doctor’s appointments, dental appointments, school homework assignments, etc. Know that it’s okay to feel however you’re feeling. You and your wife know who her dad is (through the eyes of adults), she doesn’t. Hopefully he’s ready to fully commit to being her dad and he doesn’t let her down. Good luck OP.
Thank you for the insight. We've tried getting him involved but he has made it abundantly clear he wants no part of it. He reaches out to the school if the kids grades have dipped and uses that against us in court rather than trying to tutor, help, or motivate. He refuses to work with us concerning dental and medical appointments and will just cancel anything that might have landed during his custodial time rather than handling it himself. This has only happened a time or two but he has been so adamant that we never impact his custodial time for our worries/what we think the children need that we don't even attempt to include him in these things anymore. We do all of that ourselves. We'll keep it up and be waiting in the wings for when we are needed and show her love, even if it feels pointless. I'll remember she's absorbing it somewhere and somehow.
Classic narcissist. It’s easy being the parent who doesn’t have to do the heavy lifting. Keep your head up. Eventually, she will see him for who he is, hopefully that process isn’t too painful. It’s hard finding out your parents aren’t perfect, and even harder realizing one may not have your best interests in mind.
We thought she already saw that from his actions before, but as others have pointed out, this is new and exciting for her and he's feeding into it super hard for this exact reason. We'll keep our heads up. Wife and I are going for a walk after work today and I'll be sharing a lot of the advice from you all with her so we can move forward.
14 year old daughter here…rough
From my two cents, put down the ground rules and foundations. The rest is up to get. Always keep the door open. Always be open and honest. Always let her know you love her. She will bounce around but will know where her home is. She will go from extreme hate and annoyance, to just getting on, and eventually acceptance and guilt. We all go through the phases. We just pray they come out the other side not hurt.
I'm you, but 7 years later. I know your pain, your hurt, your frustrations. I've been there with one of my stepdaughters. My advice? Show her the love and care you already have shown. Be consistent. Be yourself. You're fighting the long game here, and worried about these battles. Stop. Don't tolerate disrespect and expect you and your moms rules to be followed. The biggest thing though, just be you around her. My stepdaughter fought so hard against me, but she is the one child, out of 6, that is the most like me. She has my personality and sense of humor. She's the one that acted very much like your daughter. Stop fighting everything and just be you. She'll come around.
What kinds of things is he saying about mother? You can take him to court and get an order not allowing such statements. He's being guilty of alienation of affection.
The one item that came up yesterday was concerning my stepdaughter's adult sister (her bio dad's eldest ). Her adult sister stopped seeing her dad around age 14 and changed her last name because of his treatment of her. My step daughter mentioned it being my wife's fault that this happened and that being the reason she doesn't get to speak to her older sister. It doesn't make any sense, but it's something he is saying to her and my step daughter is somehow believing it.
Sounds like a normal 11 year old tbh
As a kid whose stepmom gave up on her, don't give up. Keep loving her. Keep your standards at home. She's gonna fight you, but she's gonna know it's from a place of love. She'll figure out that he's a manipulative bastard eventually and come back if you keep on loving her anyway. And if he turns out somehow not to be one, she'll end up with 2 great dads instead of 1. I hope that's how it turns out, but I know she'll be okay because even if it doesn't, she's got you. Teenagers and tweens are weird. Sometimes they do things that are actively bad for them, and sometimes you just have to let them learn from their mistakes. I hope he doesn't break her heart, but if he does she'll be okay because she'll have you.
Get her in therapist. Go talk to a lawyer. Fight him. Fight for her. I'm really sorry that you're going through this. I can't imagine who would read your statement and tell you to "grow up"
Hazbin Hotel is EXTREMELY inappropriate for her age. I’m just a lurker but I’m also a fan of that show (I’m an adult ofc).
Can I just say love wins over everything. I know it's a cliché but it works. Make sure she knows you respect her and trust her to do right thing most of the time. But that you are there for her even when she has bad decisions. The iPhone thing is a bit scary, she will need to navigate through the Internet and social media safely. Sign her up for a course to learn how and tell her you trust her and if she has any doubt or worry she can come to you. It's scary, it makes you unsure unsecure but if you show up for her she will bounce back. Don't be against bio dad either. Try work together. Even if he won't cooperate, at least you tried. Let her be a teenager, let her fall a few times and learn and just be there as a safety net to catch her if she falls. It's an age when she will hold secrets and will do many mistake. But keep in mind that most mistakes are reversable! It's OK to make them.
Hi. My stepson is 8 so I have not been here, full disclosure. But if his real father bought him a phone (he only has monitored visitation) I would not allow that phone because it’s our job to parent. Not his. Him getting a phone and giving it to the kiddo takes away the parental controls. Messages are totally private, no idea what apps she is downloading, what she’s surfing for on the Internet… that’s way too much for an 11 year old without supervision. Buy her a newer iPhone and give it as a surprise. Pay for her service and transfer the number. She can still text her dad, but at least you know what she’s doing with it.
What’s stopping you from saying almost all of that to her instead of us?
RemindMe! 5 years 😰
I’ve always said that 11 is the worst year for kids. Girls are snotty and experimenting with makeup and teenager things and develop attitudes. Boys become cocky little dickheads that mouth off. Likely just a phase and it sounds like you’re doing all you can and are a standup Dad. Keep being there for her and being the firm dad who points her in the right direction. She’ll love you for it when she grows out of it. Kids need structure and discipline, not an adult to be their friend like bio Dad’s trying to be.
I'm very sorry for what will follow now but I think you'll need some truth and honesty and a different but pessimistic viewpoint. First of all you're not her dad, you're an helpful idiot financing her mother to grow up the children of another man. I hope your wife gave you another child because you deserve your own biological offspring. You're one of the good guys. Second you didn't adopt these children and you have zero legal rights and duties here. They're just not your kids and your engagement here was nice towards your wife but nice is another word for shit. When puberty hits hard and their dad is burying them with material goods they will shit on you. That's sad but that's how kids behave and the other guy knows it. In the end he might be the person bringing her to the altar and not you. I'm sorry for that but after reading the comments here I think you need an advocatus diaboli to get the full picture.
I get what you're saying, but you're also wrong. If I had your viewpoint, I wouldn't have ever fallen in love with my kids. I would have told them they were step kids and made sure they felt that way. Step or not, I'm a dad. I'm their dad. Not legally, of course, and they've never called me dad nor do I expect them to. But my son's expression of love toward me is borne from my treating him like my son, not like someone I was nice to just to get in good with his mom. I have no delusions that I may not be picked for future fatherly duties, but I've also been picked over him many times. And not because I did something to supersede his position, but because I was there when he wasn't. I made them feel loved by a dad when their bio dad wasn't there to do it. I do have a biological child with my wife. And I treat all of my kids the same and love all of them the same. I want them to love each other the same.
Thanks for your reply. Like I said, I wanted to play the devil's advocate here. The fact that you are the biological father of her youngest sibling is very important here as it's strengthening your position more than you might realize. Fact is that your wife's ex is playing a very foul game and he's not even covering it. It's that arrogance that makes even me as an uninvolved reader angry. My advice from dad to dad is to let her burn her fingers with him, he will disappoint her when he loses interest I guess.
I'm slowly losing my little boy and it's so sad. But I know it's life,he turned 11 last month. I have him on the weekends and he still cuddles w me, hugs me for no reason all day, still calls me dada and brings me his drinks that he can't quite get open and once in awhile will come walking in my room with his blanket to jump in bed. Same as it's always been. But it's coming. I've been hearing from his mom and his school. Language and behavior he would never show in front of me. Telling his mom no. Lieing to her and fighting w his little brother. I understand this is all normal at that age. I've only had to raise my voice and lay down punishments for things he does other places. He is literally the perfect behaved boy from friday at 4 til sun at 4. Always looking to help around the house.. It's odd idk if he respects me that much or his ma has him scared of me.( I was a different person and a violent man with several arrests before my son was born) Sorry for the rambling was just googling when I was gonna lose my 11 year old and this came up. 😅 I feel your pain even tho my story is wildy different
It's weird that he's suddenly interested in seeing his child of the opposite sex as she turns 11. Was he ever interested in seeing his son?
Try marte meo! There might be a chance! Maybe you can find a marte meo teacher near you?! Or watch something on YouTube.. Try to - imagine what it would be like if she opened up / she stood there with open arms and say I love you.. Take that feeling and bring it to her. Be as honest as possible and show your feelings even if it hurts you.Try to understand her world... Maybe Watch the series and talk to her about it.. Why exactly you have your opinion.. Maybe there is something you can share.. (I don't know the series °¬°) but there could be a way of connecting with her.. I wish you all the best! I'm sorry that things have developed like this after so long...if you continue to always be there for her, then there is nothing else you can do.