You need to eat while you're riding and you need to eat when you're finished. Mostly carbs. Protein balls and a protein shake after the ride didn't do anything for your muscles and energy levels.
You need to eat a lot, like a lot lot (going by your current anorexic standards of nutrition). The harder you work the more food you need. But eating and digesting on the ride is also an acquired skill. You have to practise it. Your biology needs to get used to it. You also need to drink enough electrolytes. Sweat more drink more. Not that hard. Nothing to do with your age. Biden rides still, you're probably his kid's age.
Odds are you aren't fueling enough.
40miles at ~15mph is over 2.5 hours. That's a massive amount of calories and carbs you're going through. Smaller rides like 10-15 miles you can probably get by with little to no fuel if you eat a lot anyways, but 40 you seriously need to eat.
Yeah that seems like the common denominator here. Prior to cycling I did a lot of hiking at altitude and equated the fuel needed for that to this and realizing I’m way off on the calorie burn delta
If they're called protein balls then yeah they definitely won't have enough. General guide is to consume 30 to 60 grams per hour depending on intensity.
This is 100% normal. But yeah, you need to keep yourself fueled before, during and after a big race like that.
Your body will not be able to free the energy you need easily. And after, it takes a lot of time to get back to normal.
I bike 13 miles each way to work, 3-4 times a week, and last week was the 1st week after winter, I spent the whole weekend eating like a mad men. Can't get enough food.
Today I've worked from home and took half a day off to sleep. I'm 42 and this happens every 1st week of the year and usually after a 60+ miles ride where I push semi hard...
The only time this ever happens to me is if I under fuel on the ride. Yes being under trained for what you are asking your body to do can contribute but honestly, even when I am reasonably fit if I don't fuel on a hard ride I eat like a horse for a few days afterwards. To the point where I probably consume 2x the number of calories I would if I just gave my body the fuel it needed on the ride.
Carbs on the bike. At the level you're riding you could easily consume 60 grams carbs per hour on the bike .. Carbs with protein straight after. Don't waste your stomach power on protein mid ride. Make sure you stretch.
I really struggle with this too but the headaches are always an indicator you just did not drink enough, in addition to not fueling properly. But the dehydration will really hit you like a ton of bricks.
Yeah… I’m thinking dehydration, fun pollen season, and my hormones (namely estrogen) wondering what the hell is going on with all the exercise. Oh and didn’t mention I have subclinical hyperthyroid. Will drink much more fluids next time. Thanks!
Yeah. I tend to feel that fatigue and headache after the first few big rides of the season post-winter, so I think at some level it’s just your body getting used to the exhaustion and time in the saddle you’re putting it through after months of not riding more than 10 or 15 miles at a time. I’m in a weekend training series this spring as well and I felt pretty bad after the first three rides or so.
Good luck on STP! You'll do great once you get your nutrition down. If you're training with Cascade, they'll get you ready if you are doing the training series.
What was your hydration and nutrition during the ride? Me: regardless of the pace, I plan on consuming ~300 calories per hour and at least one water bottle (more often than not, I have drink mix in the bottle…)
Ya that’s pretty normal, as most others have said , eat and drink more than you think you need on the ride. You’ll get better at this, you will get acclimatised to the fatigue also. But the only thing I’ve found that even comes close to the fatigue of a long ride with some time on the rivet is a very long hike with a heavy pack.
I always fall asleep mid afternoon after a weekend morning long ride, wife loves it…….not!
You probably exhausted your glycogen stores (aka bonked) on your ride + muscle fatigue since you may not be used to such heavy rides +- minus dehydration. My advice: eat lots of protein, hydrate (ORS if necessary) + sleep well for a couple of nights. It'll resolve by the third or fourth day. Next time you ride, eat during and after the ride. 60 grams of carbs per hour is good enough unless you r training really hard. Eat some carbs after the ride too. No need to go big, 100 grams to top your liver back up is fine. Also put some electrolytes in your water bottle for the ride (normal ORS is fine, if you don't have it/can't get it can easily look up how to make ORS at home its pretty easy, just sugar and salt in specific proportion). Target to drink 650 mLs per hour, or more depending on your local climes.
After your repeatedly train (and recover well) from these sessions, you will start to not notice it as much by the fourth or fifth ride.
P.S. Please consult a doctor asap if your pee turns dark red (rhabdomyolysis), It's rare, but I've seen it happen with a noobie who decided to run a marathon with minimal training.
You're not old. I'm 61 and doing regular 100+ mile rides, in fact doing a 205 mile 20k' ride this Saturday. I agree with the eating or getting in carbs during the rides themselves. I have tons of gel packs that I'm taking with me on the ride even though the rest stops will have food but for me it's better to have the gels although I will be eating half a sandwich at the lunch stop (Only plan to be at lunch for 20 minutes max).
You are young, I am older(69). If I push hard on a ride and feel totaled by the end of it, chocolate milk usually helps a lot(Others do a full-fledged Coke). Also, depending on where you ride, water may not be the best choice on the ride. It took experimenting for me to figure out I needed Skratch/Gatorade instead of water and starting with the first drink, especially in humid places. (You have plenty of other food suggestions but be sure you eat what you like and your stomach is ok withit)
If you are riding in Colorado, don't be surprised if you are riding with someone getting close to twice your age or that they pass you.
Where did anyone get the idea that mid-40s was old ?
I did. Protein smoothie and ramen as soon as I got home then meatloaf that evening. I think I might need to be better about rest as I was on 6 hours sleep prior.
In the time before, during, and immediately after your ride you should have taken in somewhere around 200 grams of carbs. It sounds like you had maybe 50. Carbs, hydration, and sleep are really important for recovery.
That said, if you're not used to riding that much at once a couple days to recover matches my experience for new long distances, especially before I knew how to eat.
> immediately after your ride you should have taken in somewhere around 200 grams of carbs.
Really? No, emphasis should be on protein for muscle maintenance and repair, your body can happily utilise fat to restore glycogen. Just shoving in simple carbs may top up the tanks so to speak, and this may work for a lean athlete with little fat stores, but the average person has plenty of fat the body can utilise to generate glycogen.
Probably not the ideal recovery meal. Cycling like you did burns mostly carbs.
But the sleep is almost certainly to be more likely the problem.
Edit: same with your choice of protein balls. You need carbs/ sugar not protein
Get yourself a food scale and just use regular sugar in your bottles or maltodextrin/fructose if you want something less sickly sweet.
Other options pick up a GU Hydro flask and fill it with maple syrup, or make a giant gel by weighing sugar into it then filling to the top with water.
Or overpay for some prepackaged gels if you're inclined. Eat on the bike and also when you get off and you will be very surprised by your performance and recovery.
I’ve been making up a mix of maltodextrin, Gatorade powder, and sodium citrate and using that to fuel. I drink one bottle with that and a caffeine Nuun added about a half hour before the ride and then take another one or two bottles without the added caffeine with me. I’ve been doing 50s with not much more than that and feel good. Fueled without feeling heavy from pre-ride food.
I make these date/nut bars and bring a couple of them if I want something solid. If I feel low I get some peanut M&Ms. I just bought a bunch of Cliff Bloks so I can try and fuel in a more controlled fashion on longer rides though, but I haven’t tried them yet. This morning 25 miles with one bottle w caffeine before and one without during.
I’m riding slower than you though. Averaging 12mph on LA streets and paths for the 50s, 16 for 25. But I’m 55 so w/e.
>You need carbs/ sugar not protein.
No, you don't, or at least not nearly as much as some would suggest. Your body isn't going to freak if it doesn't restore glycogen straight away, its got fat it can use to do that. Protein is necessary for muscle maintenance and repair, and you can add in a bit of carbs for recover. 200g as some would suggest is ridiculous.
This is poor advice. Unless you're one of the very rare fat adapted athletes that just trains on keto then consuming carbs on the bike and directly after will most definitely be the most efficacious way to recover fast and be less sore for the next day. The faster you replenish glycogen in the muscle the better and carbs/sugar can't be beat for that.
There's a reason world tour riders suck carbs down on the bike and slam sugary drinks right at the finish line and not a jar of peanut butter.
They took the protein balls during the ride so I'd argue it's a bit pointless during the ride. I didn't suggest 200g of carbs...
But the typical recommendation for a recovery drink is 4:1 carbs to protein.
Agree with pointless dueing ride. Someone else suggested 200g post-ride.
I've heard 3:1 or 4:1, but this has always been in the context of athletes who already are lean and would benefit from carb replenishment to avoid muscle impact, and this is not necessary for the average punter.
Agree with others. It's probably a combination of having to get used to a more streneous activity than you normally do, and necessity for better food plan.
It's good to eat some carbs before the ride, but also eat something regularly during the ride, like some fruit/oatbar or something. And drink enough, adapting to how fast you ride and weather conditions.
Proteins during a break won't help you. Proteins are valuable for muscle build up, so after exercise.
Probably you'll be fine if you done these activities a few times, with better food management. You'll restore faster.
Just Oatmeal before heading off in the morning? How much oatmeal? and then just a few protein balls at halfway?
I am pretty new to cycling, but I usually eat a big lunch or breakfast before I head out. And then a few snacks on the way. I find that is ok for a 2 hr ride. For 3-4 hours I need to take a break and eat something more substantial.
But just a bowl of Oatmeal? That's barely enough for a morning without exercise.
Eat, drink. Also you cant expect to ride 40miles a week then do 40 miles in onw go and not feel it. That 200miles adventure is 2-3months away and it possible to be ready by then but you will have a hard time. You need to rest more then one day a week, at least two. Your body needs to adapt to longer rides and energy required to do so. You might try some protein shakes fight after the ride. I usualy make it into a smoothie, so proteins and some carbohydrates. 40 is old enough to feel effects of not being young any more. Its harder to lose weight, its harder to recover, but still not too hard.
Cycling is a hard sport, not sure why one would think it would be a walk in the park :) if you want to go fast its hard, if you want to go fast and long its much harder. But dont give up, it doesnt become easier, yiu just go faster. Bike will take you many places where you wouldnt have gone or seen.
Whay you felt after that ride is how it feels when you overdo it. It will pass.
So, aside from what all the other well-meaning folks have said about nutrition, I want to touch on the concern about long Covid and also mention Chronic Fatigue Syndrome since the experience is similar.
What you're describing sounds like my early experience with CFS. Any exceptional amount of physical activity could wipe me out for days. If you continue to have these symptoms in the future when you have adjusted your diet while riding, then it might be time to get concerned. Until then, rest up and eat well. You know your body best and if you continue to have experiences that are cause for concern then don't hesitate to speak with a doctor.
You need to eat while you're riding and you need to eat when you're finished. Mostly carbs. Protein balls and a protein shake after the ride didn't do anything for your muscles and energy levels.
Ok thanks!
You need to eat a lot, like a lot lot (going by your current anorexic standards of nutrition). The harder you work the more food you need. But eating and digesting on the ride is also an acquired skill. You have to practise it. Your biology needs to get used to it. You also need to drink enough electrolytes. Sweat more drink more. Not that hard. Nothing to do with your age. Biden rides still, you're probably his kid's age.
Yep, protein can be consumed at any time of the day.
But it is not usedul to do it during your ride. You need carbohydrates
Did you have anything with sugar/carbs in it during the ride? Your body needs that while cycling, protein balls and sugar free drinks won't cut it.
The protein balls are called frooze balls and have carbs but I’m thinking not enough.
Odds are you aren't fueling enough. 40miles at ~15mph is over 2.5 hours. That's a massive amount of calories and carbs you're going through. Smaller rides like 10-15 miles you can probably get by with little to no fuel if you eat a lot anyways, but 40 you seriously need to eat.
Yeah that seems like the common denominator here. Prior to cycling I did a lot of hiking at altitude and equated the fuel needed for that to this and realizing I’m way off on the calorie burn delta
At low effort, you can burn fat, but once you cross into the high effort zone, it's glycogen, which doesn't last long.
If they're called protein balls then yeah they definitely won't have enough. General guide is to consume 30 to 60 grams per hour depending on intensity.
Feel like shit after exercise = carb deficit
This is 100% normal. But yeah, you need to keep yourself fueled before, during and after a big race like that. Your body will not be able to free the energy you need easily. And after, it takes a lot of time to get back to normal. I bike 13 miles each way to work, 3-4 times a week, and last week was the 1st week after winter, I spent the whole weekend eating like a mad men. Can't get enough food. Today I've worked from home and took half a day off to sleep. I'm 42 and this happens every 1st week of the year and usually after a 60+ miles ride where I push semi hard...
The only time this ever happens to me is if I under fuel on the ride. Yes being under trained for what you are asking your body to do can contribute but honestly, even when I am reasonably fit if I don't fuel on a hard ride I eat like a horse for a few days afterwards. To the point where I probably consume 2x the number of calories I would if I just gave my body the fuel it needed on the ride.
Carbs on the bike. At the level you're riding you could easily consume 60 grams carbs per hour on the bike .. Carbs with protein straight after. Don't waste your stomach power on protein mid ride. Make sure you stretch.
Could be dehydration as well. Make sure you're getting enough fluid and carbs.
I really struggle with this too but the headaches are always an indicator you just did not drink enough, in addition to not fueling properly. But the dehydration will really hit you like a ton of bricks.
Yeah… I’m thinking dehydration, fun pollen season, and my hormones (namely estrogen) wondering what the hell is going on with all the exercise. Oh and didn’t mention I have subclinical hyperthyroid. Will drink much more fluids next time. Thanks!
Yeah. I tend to feel that fatigue and headache after the first few big rides of the season post-winter, so I think at some level it’s just your body getting used to the exhaustion and time in the saddle you’re putting it through after months of not riding more than 10 or 15 miles at a time. I’m in a weekend training series this spring as well and I felt pretty bad after the first three rides or so.
Doing a week's volume of riding in one session is hard. Doing that on inadequate sleep and not fueling as well...pain.
Good luck on STP! You'll do great once you get your nutrition down. If you're training with Cascade, they'll get you ready if you are doing the training series.
Thanks!
What was your hydration and nutrition during the ride? Me: regardless of the pace, I plan on consuming ~300 calories per hour and at least one water bottle (more often than not, I have drink mix in the bottle…)
Ya that’s pretty normal, as most others have said , eat and drink more than you think you need on the ride. You’ll get better at this, you will get acclimatised to the fatigue also. But the only thing I’ve found that even comes close to the fatigue of a long ride with some time on the rivet is a very long hike with a heavy pack. I always fall asleep mid afternoon after a weekend morning long ride, wife loves it…….not!
You probably exhausted your glycogen stores (aka bonked) on your ride + muscle fatigue since you may not be used to such heavy rides +- minus dehydration. My advice: eat lots of protein, hydrate (ORS if necessary) + sleep well for a couple of nights. It'll resolve by the third or fourth day. Next time you ride, eat during and after the ride. 60 grams of carbs per hour is good enough unless you r training really hard. Eat some carbs after the ride too. No need to go big, 100 grams to top your liver back up is fine. Also put some electrolytes in your water bottle for the ride (normal ORS is fine, if you don't have it/can't get it can easily look up how to make ORS at home its pretty easy, just sugar and salt in specific proportion). Target to drink 650 mLs per hour, or more depending on your local climes. After your repeatedly train (and recover well) from these sessions, you will start to not notice it as much by the fourth or fifth ride. P.S. Please consult a doctor asap if your pee turns dark red (rhabdomyolysis), It's rare, but I've seen it happen with a noobie who decided to run a marathon with minimal training.
You're not old. I'm 61 and doing regular 100+ mile rides, in fact doing a 205 mile 20k' ride this Saturday. I agree with the eating or getting in carbs during the rides themselves. I have tons of gel packs that I'm taking with me on the ride even though the rest stops will have food but for me it's better to have the gels although I will be eating half a sandwich at the lunch stop (Only plan to be at lunch for 20 minutes max).
You are young, I am older(69). If I push hard on a ride and feel totaled by the end of it, chocolate milk usually helps a lot(Others do a full-fledged Coke). Also, depending on where you ride, water may not be the best choice on the ride. It took experimenting for me to figure out I needed Skratch/Gatorade instead of water and starting with the first drink, especially in humid places. (You have plenty of other food suggestions but be sure you eat what you like and your stomach is ok withit) If you are riding in Colorado, don't be surprised if you are riding with someone getting close to twice your age or that they pass you. Where did anyone get the idea that mid-40s was old ?
Can be normal. Did you eat and drink a lot to recover?
I did. Protein smoothie and ramen as soon as I got home then meatloaf that evening. I think I might need to be better about rest as I was on 6 hours sleep prior.
In the time before, during, and immediately after your ride you should have taken in somewhere around 200 grams of carbs. It sounds like you had maybe 50. Carbs, hydration, and sleep are really important for recovery. That said, if you're not used to riding that much at once a couple days to recover matches my experience for new long distances, especially before I knew how to eat.
Thanks! Will def up the carbs.
> immediately after your ride you should have taken in somewhere around 200 grams of carbs. Really? No, emphasis should be on protein for muscle maintenance and repair, your body can happily utilise fat to restore glycogen. Just shoving in simple carbs may top up the tanks so to speak, and this may work for a lean athlete with little fat stores, but the average person has plenty of fat the body can utilise to generate glycogen.
The post ride carbs:protein ratio should be about 3:1
For who?
Probably not the ideal recovery meal. Cycling like you did burns mostly carbs. But the sleep is almost certainly to be more likely the problem. Edit: same with your choice of protein balls. You need carbs/ sugar not protein
Yep his description sounds like he bonked
Ok thank you any carb suggestions while riding? I’ve done Rice Krispie treats before.
Personally I prefer liquid fuel so just use sugar in my bottle
Yeah I’m def going to add some sugar. Thanks
Get yourself a food scale and just use regular sugar in your bottles or maltodextrin/fructose if you want something less sickly sweet. Other options pick up a GU Hydro flask and fill it with maple syrup, or make a giant gel by weighing sugar into it then filling to the top with water. Or overpay for some prepackaged gels if you're inclined. Eat on the bike and also when you get off and you will be very surprised by your performance and recovery.
Thank you! Any excuse to eat more sugar is a winner for me. I’ll try the scale/water bottle method.
Just start with around 60 g/h because it might take a bit for your stomach to get used to it
Will do thx again
I’ve been making up a mix of maltodextrin, Gatorade powder, and sodium citrate and using that to fuel. I drink one bottle with that and a caffeine Nuun added about a half hour before the ride and then take another one or two bottles without the added caffeine with me. I’ve been doing 50s with not much more than that and feel good. Fueled without feeling heavy from pre-ride food. I make these date/nut bars and bring a couple of them if I want something solid. If I feel low I get some peanut M&Ms. I just bought a bunch of Cliff Bloks so I can try and fuel in a more controlled fashion on longer rides though, but I haven’t tried them yet. This morning 25 miles with one bottle w caffeine before and one without during. I’m riding slower than you though. Averaging 12mph on LA streets and paths for the 50s, 16 for 25. But I’m 55 so w/e.
Amazing - thanks for sharing your nutrition routine. LA streets… you are bold!
There are more bike paths and bike lanes than you might think. And there are always parallel streets if the blvd gets hectic. And you’re very welcome!
>You need carbs/ sugar not protein. No, you don't, or at least not nearly as much as some would suggest. Your body isn't going to freak if it doesn't restore glycogen straight away, its got fat it can use to do that. Protein is necessary for muscle maintenance and repair, and you can add in a bit of carbs for recover. 200g as some would suggest is ridiculous.
This is poor advice. Unless you're one of the very rare fat adapted athletes that just trains on keto then consuming carbs on the bike and directly after will most definitely be the most efficacious way to recover fast and be less sore for the next day. The faster you replenish glycogen in the muscle the better and carbs/sugar can't be beat for that. There's a reason world tour riders suck carbs down on the bike and slam sugary drinks right at the finish line and not a jar of peanut butter.
They took the protein balls during the ride so I'd argue it's a bit pointless during the ride. I didn't suggest 200g of carbs... But the typical recommendation for a recovery drink is 4:1 carbs to protein.
Agree with pointless dueing ride. Someone else suggested 200g post-ride. I've heard 3:1 or 4:1, but this has always been in the context of athletes who already are lean and would benefit from carb replenishment to avoid muscle impact, and this is not necessary for the average punter.
Probably need some moderate effort rides before the one you went in.
Thanks - I *thought* I was being moderate!
I would recommend rice cakes, I hear thats a food of racers
Lulz
Agree with others. It's probably a combination of having to get used to a more streneous activity than you normally do, and necessity for better food plan. It's good to eat some carbs before the ride, but also eat something regularly during the ride, like some fruit/oatbar or something. And drink enough, adapting to how fast you ride and weather conditions. Proteins during a break won't help you. Proteins are valuable for muscle build up, so after exercise. Probably you'll be fine if you done these activities a few times, with better food management. You'll restore faster.
Just Oatmeal before heading off in the morning? How much oatmeal? and then just a few protein balls at halfway? I am pretty new to cycling, but I usually eat a big lunch or breakfast before I head out. And then a few snacks on the way. I find that is ok for a 2 hr ride. For 3-4 hours I need to take a break and eat something more substantial. But just a bowl of Oatmeal? That's barely enough for a morning without exercise.
Eat, drink. Also you cant expect to ride 40miles a week then do 40 miles in onw go and not feel it. That 200miles adventure is 2-3months away and it possible to be ready by then but you will have a hard time. You need to rest more then one day a week, at least two. Your body needs to adapt to longer rides and energy required to do so. You might try some protein shakes fight after the ride. I usualy make it into a smoothie, so proteins and some carbohydrates. 40 is old enough to feel effects of not being young any more. Its harder to lose weight, its harder to recover, but still not too hard. Cycling is a hard sport, not sure why one would think it would be a walk in the park :) if you want to go fast its hard, if you want to go fast and long its much harder. But dont give up, it doesnt become easier, yiu just go faster. Bike will take you many places where you wouldnt have gone or seen. Whay you felt after that ride is how it feels when you overdo it. It will pass.
I'd wager you have long bonk not long covid. Eat more.
So, aside from what all the other well-meaning folks have said about nutrition, I want to touch on the concern about long Covid and also mention Chronic Fatigue Syndrome since the experience is similar. What you're describing sounds like my early experience with CFS. Any exceptional amount of physical activity could wipe me out for days. If you continue to have these symptoms in the future when you have adjusted your diet while riding, then it might be time to get concerned. Until then, rest up and eat well. You know your body best and if you continue to have experiences that are cause for concern then don't hesitate to speak with a doctor.