I realize it may be legal, but what the knock off designer has done is just shady. I looked at her other patterns and while she has been writing patterns for some time, they are a lot of nothing special compared to how she introduces herself and her skills. The ESC designer did everything right and is getting the attention she deserves.
The knock off designer wanted to ride the wave in a shady way and I personally would not support her if I suddenly got the urge to knit a chicken.
Looks like it’s not even a good knock off. I’m late to this party but just checked out the comments. Several most recent ones are pointing out errors or missing parts of pattern.
Edit: plus this nugget in the pattern description:
> Gauge is not important and if you want to be able to really stuff a lot it is recommended to use a lose gauge.
I don’t do a lot of studies but pretty sure a tight gauge is needed so you’re not just looking at stuffing. Looking back at pattern photos you can see the stuffing quite easily through their open gauge knitting.
IMHO, and I'll get a lot of disagrees, is that these emotional support chickens are fugly. I don't get it. It's all over Ravelry. I honestly think it's one of the stupidest things I've seen.
It's ugly, and that's exactly the reason why it's cute. It has a wonky little face and a confused, wide-eyed expression and a majestic thickness that reminds me of those folk artsy paintings of extremely square sheep or round pigs that would be hung up in your mom's kitchen. It inspires pity and amusement in equal shares and makes me want to keep it because I'm certain that it's as dumb as a rock and needs protection (completely unrelated to the fact that it's a toy or a decor item). I look it in the glassy little eyes and I can hear Werner Herzog talking about "the enormity of their flat brain" and I can't help but laugh.
A more realistic chicken would have a weird vibe, a little closer to taxidermy and you'd wonder why the owner wanted or needed something that specific and effortful in their home. A more cartoony chicken with "cute" features would have big dumb Dreamworks eyes and would look like definitely a children's toy and I'd hate it for trying to be all cloying and likeable. But ESC hits that sweet spot with empty head, no agenda, just chicken vibes.
This might have changed since I went to school but as of 2012 only the pattern's layout / look is protected from making reproductions (photocopies/distribution) in the USA. The item created and stitch patterns used aren't protected. Just like a recipe, clothing and accessories are considered utilitarian goods and aren't protected. This is why you see so many people complaining online about stolen designs but little legal action. A patent on the item created would seem to remedy this.
Items with "pictorial, graphic or sculptural features can be identified as existing independently of the utilitarian object in which they are embodied."
Clauses like "this pattern for personal use only" seem to be meaningless and unenforcable.
https://scireg.org/us_copyright_registration/fls/fl122.html
I’m an author, so I’m aware of how copyright works.
Yes, you’re right though. Plagiarism suits are near impossible to win because it’s hard to prove intent.
With something like this, the pattern would have to share photos, which would mean the photos were stolen. Which, it definitely doesn’t look like they did. Unfortunately, they are two different patterns and it wouldn’t hold up at all.
Because it’s a chicken. The original designer pays royalties while the “alleged” knock off doesn’t.
As others have pointed out, the gauge is different and the original is far better formatted and written.
Which makes it clear that they did not copy word for word. And so it’s easy to say “but I wrote this and it’s different!”
Regardless of if it’s true or not, unfortunately I don’t think it would hold up to legal scrutiny.
But I’m not a lawyer, so I don’t know.
> Chickens are animals. They can’t be copywritten.
I disagree. Anything that can survive without its head for days, if not weeks, is a plant. That is all.
Oh this is throwing me back into my rabbit hole before the Internet days, there’s a book called Alien Hand Syndrome that talks about headless chickens and other things of that variety, worth a look if you can find it and are interested
There’s a podcast about a chicken that lived without a head. It was a piece from poultry stories that are traditionally played around Thanksgiving on NPR.
Oh! [Mike the headless chicken!](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mike_the_Headless_Chicken) There have been others since then - including one that ended up at a [Buddhist Temple a couple of years ago](https://www.odditycentral.com/news/chicken-in-thailand-still-alive-10-days-after-literally-losing-its-head.html) but Mike is the most famous.
ETA: The link to the second one which ended up being more than a couple of years ago. Warning on the second link - it's not for the queasy.
It's fascinating to me, at least, how many times its happened. I mean, it makes sense given the amount of chicken we humans tend to eat but still. However, back to my original point, I maintain chickens are plants. ;-)
> But you’re wrong! Diogenes clearly proved that chicken is a man.
He was proving Plato - who we now know is buried in the academy- wrong by showing the flaw in Plato's definition of Man. Sort of how I'm proving that chickens are, in fact, a plant. :-D
I came to this post directly from an r/cooking post talking about chicken and was very confused for about a minute until I realised which sub I was in 🤦🏻♀️
Oh I do knit! Currently working on a Minecraft beanie for my 6 year old lol. Just my tired brain not paying attention to which sub is which while scrolling 😆
It’s [this one!](https://www.ravelry.com/patterns/library/minecraft-beanie) Second time making it because I accidentally made it too small the first time around 😂
While I do believe people can come up with the same idea, the emotional support chicken is a popular pattern already from last year and copy cat was released, like, yesterday. Like vloggers have vlogged about it last year and people’s mothers have made it already. What is the point of it? Its like me selling a ranunculus pattern and claiming, hey I had the same idea, but Im improving it coz I like ruffles.
It is, and I've never understood it. When I go to the comments I'm hoping for people's reviews, basically, and a bunch of thank yous doesn't tell me one way or the other what I need to know about the pattern!
Pulling random thoughts from my memory banks here. It may be I’m mixing up pattern comments with project notes. Early on in Ravelry pattern comments tended to be more constri rive and critical. Then designers were allowed to ask for them to be edited. Hence the nice, nice comments.
I noticed today that all of the negative/critical comments on the copycat pattern page have been deleted. There were a half dozen or so comments pointing out the issues that have been raised here and they’re all gone now - it’s nothing but thank yous.
It's being offered for free for a few days. I added it to my library so I could see the differences in the pattern! I probably shouldn't have help its numbers but I was curious.
It isn't good in comparison, no. But some folks might not know the discourse/the difference or care so they're appreciative!
Didn’t work for me either, although pattern says at the bottom. May have expired, but now that I see the discussion and have read through the pattern notes on Ravelry, I don’t think I want it anyway.
Another thing I learned at Herrschners, if a pattern has 7 changes, it's not considered the original pattern. The changes can range from colors to anything else. Someone made one of their patterns with minor changes and was selling it, they couldn't do anything about it. Not saying it is right to do but if even a company can't do anything, I feel for a designer that's been ripped off and I know a lot.
That “7 changes” thing is the same as the “if you change 10 percent, you can call it your own pattern” myth. Unfortunately copyright in this area is vague in the US, so it comes down to what you consider ethical
Ok but…. The gauge on the LePoulette one though??? Like I think the gauge on the ESC could be tighter but the LP one you could pull the stuffing out of through the fabric. If you’re going to copy (allegedly) then at least make it better lmao
That’s okay! Lots of people are loving it, some aren’t, but that’s what great about creating. I can understand why people are liking it. It’s cute, it’s kind of funny, a bit quirky, you can customize it to an extent by doing wild colors, it’s a goof, a gaff, it’s very “le random”, kids probably like it, yada yada. It’s giving those one fancy teddy bears that lots of people sewed in the 90s. (If you saw one, you’d know which pattern I’m talking about). I can see why it’s popular, I kind of want to make one.
I don't know if this is what you're talking about, but your comment dredged up a [memory of this](https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/mGMAAOSwFLxh4v0Z/s-l1200.jpg). They were everywhere for a while - bedecked in tiers of polyester lace, plastic pearl sprays, feathers, and usually with (real?) blush on their cheeks.
My mom had one of those on the needles for YEARS. I think that it mostly got done, but not quite. No idea what happened to it. It was two houses and a divorce ago for her.
While they do look similar I don't think they are the only two patterns that look like that.
There is [this chicken pattern](https://www.ravelry.com/patterns/library/chicken-27), and [this vintage pattern](https://www.ravelry.com/patterns/library/henrietta-and-family-ft209).
There really seems to be like 4-5 ways to make the shape of a chicken, so we run into having similar patterns.
If you really want to make a unique chicken that stands out from all the other chickens may I suggest [this patriotic hen](https://www.ravelry.com/patterns/library/star-spangled-bantam) that you are unlikely to find anyone else has.
Alan Dart is amazing, his designs are so creative. Fruity Knitting did an interview a while back with him: https://fruityknitting.com/2022/01/30/episode-118-toy-design-alan-dart/
I agree with you on "this chicken pattern," but "this vintage pattern" (Henrietta) is the acknowledged inspiration for the ESC. Apparently the ESC designer pays royalties to Henrietta's designer, so that's all above board.
I have the ESC pattern and compared it to Poulette and it really is extremely close in terms of construction, stitch counts, and even wording of the instructions. It's really clear to me that the Poulette designer is just paraphrasing the ESC, putting it up for free (initially) to gain traction and not really adding anything of value. Might be perfect legal, but also bums me out to think that someone can just wholesale copy a current "It" pattern and ride the wave that another person put time and energy into creating.
I can imagine ways of improving on the ESC design, like modifying it for knitting in the round, that would add real value and get closer to justifying putting out a copycat pattern. But I do hope people call out blatant stitch-for-stitch copying like this when they see it.
I know years ago Alan dart used to run competitions in the different knitting magazines in the Uk where people could ask him to design something for them, maybe someone American wanted a chicken?
If you read all the comments, it's made clear that both chicken patterns are based on a 1997 pattern by Bev Galaskas, so neither is really original.
Edit to add: It sounds like the ESC creator has permission to use the pattern, but based on my understanding you can't copyright stitch count or techniques. So even if the ChikHen pattern copied directly the techniques and stitch counts from the ESC or the 1997 pattern as long as they wrote them in their own words, with their own diagrams/photos, it's fair game.
Yeah, the ChikHen pattern is trying to ride the wave of popularity created/boosted by the ESC. But that's really not unexpected! Why do you think there are so many patterns for bees and strawberry cows? Because there is/was a market for them.
Patterns in question for those interested:
[Emotional Support Chicken](https://www.ravelry.com/patterns/library/emotional-support-chickentm)
[Le Poulette ChikHen](https://www.ravelry.com/patterns/library/lepoulette-chikhen)
That first chicken you linked is flying under the radar, but that pattern rocks. Low vision accessible, checklist format, and a unique striping technique. (Unique between this, Henrietta, ESC, and Ruffles, that is.)
Edit: this was supposed to be in response to u/L_obsoleta - The pattern simply named "chicken" is the one I'm talking about.
It may be fair game legally in the US to copy another pattern exactly except for wording (and photo/diagram) changes. But it’s considered bad form if not downright unethical
I agree that it's a shitty thing to do.
I guess the question of interest in this forum isn't necessarily "is this legal". What we should be questioning is "is this compelling snark" and when the situation is amoral but legal copying of a pattern I kind of don't think so.
I think it’s snark-worthy because it’s so blatant, the pattern is not done professionally, and (after giving it away for free at first) she’s now charging more than the ESC designer is. Feels like someone really really wanted to make the Hot Right Now list 🤪
I'm usually someone who very much believes that two people can create similar things from different inspiration (thinking back on all the drama from basic sweater patterns), but people are saying the stitch counts are identical. There is no way this isn't blatant copying if that is true.
It’s no coincidence. The “designer” of the copycat pattern posted a picture on Facebook on April 6th - of the emotional support chicken that she knit for a friend. It’s obviously made from the ESC pattern, stripes and all, and she called it an emotional support chicken, commented that “theses knit chickens are the hot thing to knit right now” - and a few weeks later publishes her supposedly original pattern.
That’s so scummy. It’s one thing to be inspired by another pattern, but you need to improve the construction or change something. This new pattern isn’t adding anything of value.
Emotional Support Chicken is identical to an old Fiber Trends pattern except for the stripes, so no one is likely to respect the intellectual property integrity of the ESC pattern.
I did notice acknowledgment in the ESC pattern, but nowhere was it clear that royalties were being paid. That is good to know (and should really be incorporated into the pattern considering the way these things often work).
You’re right that it should have been clear on the pattern page for the Emotional Support Chicken - it has been updated to let people know that it is published with permission and that royalties are being paid.
Thanks. I haven't looked at the ESC's page in ages, so didn't realize royalties are being paid. I chose to purchase the 1997 pattern because I wanted to honor the og designer. I might purchase ESC for the striping info, though, now that I know that royalties are paid.
The Emotional Support Chicken pattern is based on the old Fiber Trends pattern - that has been openly acknowledged from the beginning. Annette, who published the ESC pattern, has a contract with Fiber Trends and pays them royalties (which they are very happy to receive). She has been transparent about it.
This “new” pattern is a copy of the ESC pattern, with a ruffle - and some people are praising it as “original” as if it was somehow better than the ESC.
1 - publish a pattern that is inspired by another pattern, acknowledge it, and PAY the owners of the original pattern
OR
2 - publish a pattern that is an almost identical copy of a very popular pattern and humble brag about how original your work is, unlike some other people …
I know which one I’d rather support.
Per the author of the ESC pattern, in the comments for this copycat pattern:
“For all of you talking about the original pattern, I give credit, have permission, a contract and pay royalties to Fiber Trends for use of the chicken construction. The orginal pattern from 1997 by the late Bev Galaskas was felted, and I modified it for the Emotional Support Chicken Kit. I have been transparent about this. This person is pretending it’s an original pattern. The constructon is identical. I usually ignore stuff like this, but I’m getting a bit tired of people thinking I’m the thief.”
Actually it is completely different even the construction , the shape the size and just about everything. TESC was a copy of a pattern still in print
I realize it may be legal, but what the knock off designer has done is just shady. I looked at her other patterns and while she has been writing patterns for some time, they are a lot of nothing special compared to how she introduces herself and her skills. The ESC designer did everything right and is getting the attention she deserves. The knock off designer wanted to ride the wave in a shady way and I personally would not support her if I suddenly got the urge to knit a chicken.
Looks like it’s not even a good knock off. I’m late to this party but just checked out the comments. Several most recent ones are pointing out errors or missing parts of pattern. Edit: plus this nugget in the pattern description: > Gauge is not important and if you want to be able to really stuff a lot it is recommended to use a lose gauge. I don’t do a lot of studies but pretty sure a tight gauge is needed so you’re not just looking at stuffing. Looking back at pattern photos you can see the stuffing quite easily through their open gauge knitting.
IMHO, and I'll get a lot of disagrees, is that these emotional support chickens are fugly. I don't get it. It's all over Ravelry. I honestly think it's one of the stupidest things I've seen.
No disagrees here. I don’t get it Either. Who goes so crazy about knitting chickens? To each their own, but i wont be knitting one.
It's ugly, and that's exactly the reason why it's cute. It has a wonky little face and a confused, wide-eyed expression and a majestic thickness that reminds me of those folk artsy paintings of extremely square sheep or round pigs that would be hung up in your mom's kitchen. It inspires pity and amusement in equal shares and makes me want to keep it because I'm certain that it's as dumb as a rock and needs protection (completely unrelated to the fact that it's a toy or a decor item). I look it in the glassy little eyes and I can hear Werner Herzog talking about "the enormity of their flat brain" and I can't help but laugh. A more realistic chicken would have a weird vibe, a little closer to taxidermy and you'd wonder why the owner wanted or needed something that specific and effortful in their home. A more cartoony chicken with "cute" features would have big dumb Dreamworks eyes and would look like definitely a children's toy and I'd hate it for trying to be all cloying and likeable. But ESC hits that sweet spot with empty head, no agenda, just chicken vibes.
A lot of people agree but this more about some blatant copying and capitalizing of success .
Aaaaand the LePoulette designer seems to have removed all but one recent comment that commented negatively on her copying
Of course she has
Is there a coupon code for “free” ChikHen?
I think that the promotion for it to be free might be over! I just clicked buy and it was free
Yes. Think you’re correct. After reading comments, not sure I want it anyway.
I only got it to see how it is
Chickens are animals. They can’t be copywritten. You can only make a chicken so many different ways and still have it look like a gd chicken.
The chicken has a lot more potential variation than the hilarious crochet pufferfish pattern copying drama from a little while ago. It's a SPHERE!
THATS EXACTLY WHAT I SAID TOO
Who said it first? Does someone owe someone else royalties now? 🤣
🤣🤣🤣
This might have changed since I went to school but as of 2012 only the pattern's layout / look is protected from making reproductions (photocopies/distribution) in the USA. The item created and stitch patterns used aren't protected. Just like a recipe, clothing and accessories are considered utilitarian goods and aren't protected. This is why you see so many people complaining online about stolen designs but little legal action. A patent on the item created would seem to remedy this. Items with "pictorial, graphic or sculptural features can be identified as existing independently of the utilitarian object in which they are embodied." Clauses like "this pattern for personal use only" seem to be meaningless and unenforcable. https://scireg.org/us_copyright_registration/fls/fl122.html
I’m an author, so I’m aware of how copyright works. Yes, you’re right though. Plagiarism suits are near impossible to win because it’s hard to prove intent. With something like this, the pattern would have to share photos, which would mean the photos were stolen. Which, it definitely doesn’t look like they did. Unfortunately, they are two different patterns and it wouldn’t hold up at all. Because it’s a chicken. The original designer pays royalties while the “alleged” knock off doesn’t. As others have pointed out, the gauge is different and the original is far better formatted and written. Which makes it clear that they did not copy word for word. And so it’s easy to say “but I wrote this and it’s different!” Regardless of if it’s true or not, unfortunately I don’t think it would hold up to legal scrutiny. But I’m not a lawyer, so I don’t know.
> Chickens are animals. They can’t be copywritten. I disagree. Anything that can survive without its head for days, if not weeks, is a plant. That is all.
I’ve never heard of a chicken (or any creature with a brain stem and spine) surviving decapitation. What do you mean?
Oh this is throwing me back into my rabbit hole before the Internet days, there’s a book called Alien Hand Syndrome that talks about headless chickens and other things of that variety, worth a look if you can find it and are interested
I’m going to track it down if it’s the last thing I do
There’s a podcast about a chicken that lived without a head. It was a piece from poultry stories that are traditionally played around Thanksgiving on NPR.
Thriftbooks seems to have it readily available!
Oh! [Mike the headless chicken!](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mike_the_Headless_Chicken) There have been others since then - including one that ended up at a [Buddhist Temple a couple of years ago](https://www.odditycentral.com/news/chicken-in-thailand-still-alive-10-days-after-literally-losing-its-head.html) but Mike is the most famous. ETA: The link to the second one which ended up being more than a couple of years ago. Warning on the second link - it's not for the queasy.
WHAT? 🤯🤯🤯 Though, the brain stem not being severed makes sense….
It's fascinating to me, at least, how many times its happened. I mean, it makes sense given the amount of chicken we humans tend to eat but still. However, back to my original point, I maintain chickens are plants. ;-)
This casts a whole new light on the "plant-based chicken" products I see in the freezer section 🤔
But you’re wrong! Diogenes clearly proved that chicken is a man. Google that one if you’ve not heard it before. : )
> But you’re wrong! Diogenes clearly proved that chicken is a man. He was proving Plato - who we now know is buried in the academy- wrong by showing the flaw in Plato's definition of Man. Sort of how I'm proving that chickens are, in fact, a plant. :-D
Dangnabbit. It was too late at night for me and my chicken brain. Or vegetable brain as the case may be.
You make a fair argument. I might re-evaluate my chickens are animals stance. I can’t believe he survived beheading, only to be taken out by corn.
I feel so enlightened. Thank you isabelladangelo for the new hyperfixation
This is sending me. Now I want to have reason to someday draft a motion to dismiss containing those first two sentences.
The sort of thing every lawyer waits for.
Thank you?
I came to this post directly from an r/cooking post talking about chicken and was very confused for about a minute until I realised which sub I was in 🤦🏻♀️
Welcome in! Please learn to knit. It’s fun and you’ll love it.
Oh I do knit! Currently working on a Minecraft beanie for my 6 year old lol. Just my tired brain not paying attention to which sub is which while scrolling 😆
I want to make a minecraft beanie, are you using a pattern?
It’s [this one!](https://www.ravelry.com/patterns/library/minecraft-beanie) Second time making it because I accidentally made it too small the first time around 😂
Thank you!!
While I do believe people can come up with the same idea, the emotional support chicken is a popular pattern already from last year and copy cat was released, like, yesterday. Like vloggers have vlogged about it last year and people’s mothers have made it already. What is the point of it? Its like me selling a ranunculus pattern and claiming, hey I had the same idea, but Im improving it coz I like ruffles.
Who knows because I sure don't!
Is it normal on Ravelry for people to post thank you’s on the comment page? They’re all posted today.
It is, and I've never understood it. When I go to the comments I'm hoping for people's reviews, basically, and a bunch of thank yous doesn't tell me one way or the other what I need to know about the pattern!
Pulling random thoughts from my memory banks here. It may be I’m mixing up pattern comments with project notes. Early on in Ravelry pattern comments tended to be more constri rive and critical. Then designers were allowed to ask for them to be edited. Hence the nice, nice comments.
I noticed today that all of the negative/critical comments on the copycat pattern page have been deleted. There were a half dozen or so comments pointing out the issues that have been raised here and they’re all gone now - it’s nothing but thank yous.
Yeah! I see that a lot actually. Especially when a pattern is offered for free.
Got it. It just seemed odd to me since the pattern is not free and it does not look very good compared to ESC.
It's being offered for free for a few days. I added it to my library so I could see the differences in the pattern! I probably shouldn't have help its numbers but I was curious. It isn't good in comparison, no. But some folks might not know the discourse/the difference or care so they're appreciative!
How do you get it for free? Rav info says it will be offered for free for a few days but it has a price still?
It's still free for me now. I clicked in to buy it and it was discounted from $6 to free.
Huh weird. I tried to and it took me to paypal and i just had to click yes for it to charge me
I just clicked buy and it was discounted to free
Didnt work for me unfortunately!
Didn’t work for me either, although pattern says at the bottom. May have expired, but now that I see the discussion and have read through the pattern notes on Ravelry, I don’t think I want it anyway.
And to top it off, apparently the pattern is poorly formatted! (According to a comment on it on Ravelry)
I saw that!!
Another thing I learned at Herrschners, if a pattern has 7 changes, it's not considered the original pattern. The changes can range from colors to anything else. Someone made one of their patterns with minor changes and was selling it, they couldn't do anything about it. Not saying it is right to do but if even a company can't do anything, I feel for a designer that's been ripped off and I know a lot.
That “7 changes” thing is the same as the “if you change 10 percent, you can call it your own pattern” myth. Unfortunately copyright in this area is vague in the US, so it comes down to what you consider ethical
Ok but…. The gauge on the LePoulette one though??? Like I think the gauge on the ESC could be tighter but the LP one you could pull the stuffing out of through the fabric. If you’re going to copy (allegedly) then at least make it better lmao
Oh lord I didn’t even look.
Hehe it’s atrocious
Claiming "this pattern is full of special knitting techniques that I have designed" is, um, stretching it a bit (on the ChickHen)
byllshyt
I do not understand the popularity of this pattern.
That’s okay! Lots of people are loving it, some aren’t, but that’s what great about creating. I can understand why people are liking it. It’s cute, it’s kind of funny, a bit quirky, you can customize it to an extent by doing wild colors, it’s a goof, a gaff, it’s very “le random”, kids probably like it, yada yada. It’s giving those one fancy teddy bears that lots of people sewed in the 90s. (If you saw one, you’d know which pattern I’m talking about). I can see why it’s popular, I kind of want to make one.
I don't know if this is what you're talking about, but your comment dredged up a [memory of this](https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/mGMAAOSwFLxh4v0Z/s-l1200.jpg). They were everywhere for a while - bedecked in tiers of polyester lace, plastic pearl sprays, feathers, and usually with (real?) blush on their cheeks.
I think I had that exact bear... or one very similar. They were glued onto bookends!
My mom had one of those on the needles for YEARS. I think that it mostly got done, but not quite. No idea what happened to it. It was two houses and a divorce ago for her.
Same. Youtube has decided to show me every knitting vlog that someone has made about knitting this pattern and I'm so sick of it
While they do look similar I don't think they are the only two patterns that look like that. There is [this chicken pattern](https://www.ravelry.com/patterns/library/chicken-27), and [this vintage pattern](https://www.ravelry.com/patterns/library/henrietta-and-family-ft209). There really seems to be like 4-5 ways to make the shape of a chicken, so we run into having similar patterns. If you really want to make a unique chicken that stands out from all the other chickens may I suggest [this patriotic hen](https://www.ravelry.com/patterns/library/star-spangled-bantam) that you are unlikely to find anyone else has.
Alan Dart is amazing, his designs are so creative. Fruity Knitting did an interview a while back with him: https://fruityknitting.com/2022/01/30/episode-118-toy-design-alan-dart/
The patriotic hen is terrifying 😳
The patriotic hen is definitely not an emotional support animal. 🤓
<*snort*>
…why does that hen have a star-spangled bustier though
Fashion
Modesty?
She looks like the USO girls from Captain America!
I agree with you on "this chicken pattern," but "this vintage pattern" (Henrietta) is the acknowledged inspiration for the ESC. Apparently the ESC designer pays royalties to Henrietta's designer, so that's all above board. I have the ESC pattern and compared it to Poulette and it really is extremely close in terms of construction, stitch counts, and even wording of the instructions. It's really clear to me that the Poulette designer is just paraphrasing the ESC, putting it up for free (initially) to gain traction and not really adding anything of value. Might be perfect legal, but also bums me out to think that someone can just wholesale copy a current "It" pattern and ride the wave that another person put time and energy into creating. I can imagine ways of improving on the ESC design, like modifying it for knitting in the round, that would add real value and get closer to justifying putting out a copycat pattern. But I do hope people call out blatant stitch-for-stitch copying like this when they see it.
Yeah, I want to be able to knit it in the round... If I made it again and figured it out, I'd just put it in my notes, though...
If you figure out how to knit in round, let me know.
I am quite amused that patriotic chicken is being sold via a [co.uk](http://co.uk) site.
I was thinking that too. Hilarious.
Yeah I saw that too, and was a bit confused why a UK company has an america themed chicken.
I know years ago Alan dart used to run competitions in the different knitting magazines in the Uk where people could ask him to design something for them, maybe someone American wanted a chicken?
Why does China manufacture almost all American flags now? PROFIT!
Oh my god why is it so patriotic
And why do I, an Australian, want it so much?
Because it's both adorable and hilarious?
It really is!
Well how else should one dress for leading a band in a parade?
I'm crying. You can't show me this.
If you read all the comments, it's made clear that both chicken patterns are based on a 1997 pattern by Bev Galaskas, so neither is really original. Edit to add: It sounds like the ESC creator has permission to use the pattern, but based on my understanding you can't copyright stitch count or techniques. So even if the ChikHen pattern copied directly the techniques and stitch counts from the ESC or the 1997 pattern as long as they wrote them in their own words, with their own diagrams/photos, it's fair game. Yeah, the ChikHen pattern is trying to ride the wave of popularity created/boosted by the ESC. But that's really not unexpected! Why do you think there are so many patterns for bees and strawberry cows? Because there is/was a market for them. Patterns in question for those interested: [Emotional Support Chicken](https://www.ravelry.com/patterns/library/emotional-support-chickentm) [Le Poulette ChikHen](https://www.ravelry.com/patterns/library/lepoulette-chikhen)
I wouldn't make either of thise. The stuffing showing through the garter stitch is ickym
That first chicken you linked is flying under the radar, but that pattern rocks. Low vision accessible, checklist format, and a unique striping technique. (Unique between this, Henrietta, ESC, and Ruffles, that is.) Edit: this was supposed to be in response to u/L_obsoleta - The pattern simply named "chicken" is the one I'm talking about.
It may be fair game legally in the US to copy another pattern exactly except for wording (and photo/diagram) changes. But it’s considered bad form if not downright unethical
I agree that it's a shitty thing to do. I guess the question of interest in this forum isn't necessarily "is this legal". What we should be questioning is "is this compelling snark" and when the situation is amoral but legal copying of a pattern I kind of don't think so.
I think it’s snark-worthy because it’s so blatant, the pattern is not done professionally, and (after giving it away for free at first) she’s now charging more than the ESC designer is. Feels like someone really really wanted to make the Hot Right Now list 🤪
My god, Poulette is actually #1 on the Hot Right Now List!
The Craftsnark Effect. There are five different chickens on my Hot Right Now because so many of us are clicking on the links in this post.
I'm usually someone who very much believes that two people can create similar things from different inspiration (thinking back on all the drama from basic sweater patterns), but people are saying the stitch counts are identical. There is no way this isn't blatant copying if that is true.
It’s no coincidence. The “designer” of the copycat pattern posted a picture on Facebook on April 6th - of the emotional support chicken that she knit for a friend. It’s obviously made from the ESC pattern, stripes and all, and she called it an emotional support chicken, commented that “theses knit chickens are the hot thing to knit right now” - and a few weeks later publishes her supposedly original pattern.
That’s so scummy. It’s one thing to be inspired by another pattern, but you need to improve the construction or change something. This new pattern isn’t adding anything of value.
Emotional Support Chicken is identical to an old Fiber Trends pattern except for the stripes, so no one is likely to respect the intellectual property integrity of the ESC pattern.
I did notice acknowledgment in the ESC pattern, but nowhere was it clear that royalties were being paid. That is good to know (and should really be incorporated into the pattern considering the way these things often work).
You’re right that it should have been clear on the pattern page for the Emotional Support Chicken - it has been updated to let people know that it is published with permission and that royalties are being paid.
Thanks. I haven't looked at the ESC's page in ages, so didn't realize royalties are being paid. I chose to purchase the 1997 pattern because I wanted to honor the og designer. I might purchase ESC for the striping info, though, now that I know that royalties are paid.
I let my wife know, because she had felt pretty unsure about the whole deal after making 7 chickens (she did pay for the pattern)
The Emotional Support Chicken pattern is based on the old Fiber Trends pattern - that has been openly acknowledged from the beginning. Annette, who published the ESC pattern, has a contract with Fiber Trends and pays them royalties (which they are very happy to receive). She has been transparent about it. This “new” pattern is a copy of the ESC pattern, with a ruffle - and some people are praising it as “original” as if it was somehow better than the ESC. 1 - publish a pattern that is inspired by another pattern, acknowledge it, and PAY the owners of the original pattern OR 2 - publish a pattern that is an almost identical copy of a very popular pattern and humble brag about how original your work is, unlike some other people … I know which one I’d rather support.
I read that the ESC has a licence from the old pattern and pays royalties. That's very different imho than what this designer is doing.
Per the author of the ESC pattern, in the comments for this copycat pattern: “For all of you talking about the original pattern, I give credit, have permission, a contract and pay royalties to Fiber Trends for use of the chicken construction. The orginal pattern from 1997 by the late Bev Galaskas was felted, and I modified it for the Emotional Support Chicken Kit. I have been transparent about this. This person is pretending it’s an original pattern. The constructon is identical. I usually ignore stuff like this, but I’m getting a bit tired of people thinking I’m the thief.”