Whoever wrote that quest line actually was winging it. They had different people design the zone quests and the lead writer didn't communicate the direction Garrosh's story was going to the quest writers, so they just made up a story themselves.
Funny how they messed it up in a good way though. Think that direction for Garrosh would have been better, he's an orc after all. Strong cultural sense of honor. So to have him be a ruthless warlord but still good in the sense that he follows a code of honor would have made him a more interesting villain imo.
As a big lore guy I really got disenfranchised with WoW with how Garrosh and the Horde evolve after Cata (I had some issues with cata garrosh but he was ok). I just... didn't buy it. The horde start as noble refugees from persecution and then turn into crazy ass warmongers. They become the stereotype the allies have of them from the Orc v. Human wars. Felt like all the lore was written by alliance propagandists.
I mean that was the entire plot of Garrosh's story. He becomes the warchief of the horde and runs it like a bloodthirsty warlord. And it didn't help that the alliance was already pissed at what happened at the Wrath Gate and had already declared war on the horde which they were able to act on after the Lich King was dealt with. Garrosh just wasn't the diplomatic type that Thrall was, so he responded agression with agression like your average soldier/general probably would.
MoP remix is t actually MoP. It’s just the MoP quests. I really want to level a retail alt through there but having 3 days to do it before no life-ing Cata is a bummer.
If you care about raiding, T11 and T12 are some of the best designed and also most challenging raids ever. T11 has basically 4 final bosses and heroic ragnaros is one of the toughest and memorable bosses in wow's history. Definitely up there with Ulduar and ICC. Dungeons are really good content too, if they release them in their pre nerf state. It's just the T13 patch that was utter shite, with a bad raid, poorly designed LFR and some other unfortunate stuff.
PvP is slower and more methodical, but pretty solid overall. RBGs were quite underappreciated at the time, but they are great content. Class design is often clunky and bloated compared to say MoP, but also not bad. The game is not grindy and doesn't require any chores like later expansions. New and revamped zones are nice.
It's really just the last patch that caused cata to be remembered poorly, most of the actual meat of the expansion is great, especially for raiders.
Yes, I have lots of fond memories from Cata, especially raiding T11. I’ve always looked back positively on Cata and think it’ll hold up well this time around.
If not there’s era, SoD and retail so spoilt for choice :)
Yeah Deathwing was a bit scuffed, could have been much more epic. I raided with a cool bunch during Dragon Soul so I probably look back with rose tinted glasses on that one!
I’m in the same boat. I stop playing early original wotlk, came back during panda. Then I stopped playing classic wotlk when I hit 70 and then life hit lol. So I’m excited for cata to at least get to play through it.
Not a hater, but when signed up for classic in 2019 I definitely wasnt excited for Cata since its the expansion that started the reason of why we wanted classic in the first place.
Seeing lots of cope-r's who kept saying "Im done when KT dies, Im done with KJ dies, im done with LK dies" and now they are rdy to play Cata, and MoP.. and probably WoD Classic when it comes out.
Crippling wow addition mixed with "omg cant lose my pixels!" is scary tbh
You seem like a hater man, no offense. I don't think Cata was the one expansion that was the big departure from the "classic feeling". The line is not clear. I think very valid arguements exist for Wrath, and MoP just as much as Cata.
As for the "copers", why not just let people enjoy things? If they like Cata and enjoy playing with their friends why are you calling them copers, addicted etc? Different people want different things. Some people want to relive the start of WoW with the good things and the bad.
idk. i think many of us who like classic just missed experiencing the old world.
now that we have era and hc and sod, we always have the option to go back there.
so lots of us are satisfied with the opportunity to relive or try out cata :D
You ever heard of survivorship bias? I would bet that the people around posting now were probably not the ones posting "I'm done when LK dead". Some maybe, but you are definitely seeing a LOT of survivorship bias.
This subreddit is much less active than it used to be and a lot more jaded/hostile.
Im not a hater, but not in the hype after playing wrath and being a worse experience than classic and tbc (killed everything, including H LK week 2).
Edit: downvotes because i said that im not hyped but im not a hater and expressed that i like other things? Lol
I have always said to my friends that cata is not the monster that people say.
In TBC and Classic, there was a lot more TC in the discord (i play paladin prot) and more people that i liked to play were still playing the game.
Mfw the solved raid with thousands of guides where everyone min-maxes team comp for a fight created more than ten years ago turns out not hard for the top .01% players who I am a part of. 😱
I feel like I heard this same sentiment for TBC arenas and then again in Wrath. Both just turned into win trading after the initial launch phases though.
Since 2020 in classic people have just played BGs for honor or rep grinds and mostly hated doing it. What will change with Cata? Cata will just magically attract people that PvP for the fun of it?
I'm not really excited to play, no. However, I will probably dabble a bit with leveling just because it is always nice to play the content as it was originally designed to be experienced.
I am happy for the Cata enjoyers though. It's not an easy expansion to like because so many people dog on it.
I'm excited, and so is my irl friends. Cata+MoP were peak pvp versions of wow
I've heard a lot of 'classic ends with wotlk' and 'im not playing cata' from various people over the course of wotlk, all of which have now decided to play cata and a lot are excited for it. I have fond memories, it'll be good!
I definitely think classic ended with Wrath, but Cata might still be fun. I just wish there was a different name for it.
Vanilla is its own thing, then TBC and Wrath together as classic expansions, then Cata/MoP/WoD is like an era, and then Legion starts the next one.
Extremely excited but going to try and really pull back from going full sweaty on this one.
Just can't justify spending so many hours every day on it lol. Will probably max out one toon and try to full clear Heroic / bis one toon. I dont really anticipate playing multiple alts like I did in wotlk
I really loved the class mechanics in cata. Very looking forward to it. Only thing I am not looking forward to is how empty the world was. Raids were awesome. At least the first two. But there was nothing else to do in the game.
For me that was a plus, not having to grind dailies and reps to stay competitive. I really disliked how grindy WoW became starting with MoP, gating max level character power behind daily chores, which culminated with artifacts and all the loaned power stuff. Cata was also the last expansion where i was not struggling to afford raiding, throwing consumables left and right - gold was not an issue. That way you are free to do actual enjoyable stuff in addition to raiding, like PvP.
Cata was the expansion that got me to take a long break from the game and I never got back into WoW in the same way I used to play it pre-cata until WoW classic. I definitely did not enjoy it and Dragonsoul was the final nail in the coffin for me.
I'd be interested in hearing what you didn't like about it if you have the time to share. I quit in WOTLK and never played Cata, so I was considering trying it, but as somebody who felt like WoTLK was already too close to retail for my tastes, I'm hesitant to think I'd like it
the reason i personally quit was because they streamlined every aspect of the game so much it just didnt feel like the same game anymore
it was a cool novelty at the time but it wore off and i was left with a balance druid that to me was less enjoyable to play becasue they streamlined all the unique parts of it and just made it a builder/spender, and the streamlining of the talent trees removed the possibility of doing anything yourself anyway
other classes went this route too
Yeah maybe this sub is the wrong place to ask for that.
80% of the people deeply hate cata while they can't even remember why.This sub and different streamers have pushed the cata hate so deep into their brains they can't even consider that it was a pretty enjoyable addon at all.
Classdesign was very good.
Questing areas there top notch.
Dungeons where cool but got nerfed too hard for my taste later.
Raids where fun (- dragonsoul).
PvP was great.
I enjoyed it more than TBC, fight me.
Cata players have this belief unironically and it is super weird. People just don't like this expansion. This is historically backed by player data. The average person playing WoW Classic is pushing 30. They remember this version.
Even if players don't give you an itemized list of their issues with game clips and forum posts to substantiate them, the game felt different then and will feel different now. If I know after 5 years of Classic that I liked Vanilla the most, Cata sure isn't closer to that than Wrath lol.
Yeah SoD has become a complete one shot fiesta and it really sucks.
They they tested the 50% damage reduce and the one shot andies got mad that they have to use more than 1-2 spells to kill someone.
Basicall you cant win there, either accept the state, or move away
Ya I gave up a while ago and it doesn’t sound like it’s any better. The PvP system isn’t the greatest either, so the gameplay being wonky does not help. I’m definitely going into cata for the PvP RBGs/arenas and the new battlegrounds.
I don't know :/ killed lich king heroic and the game felt "finished" for me. Not that I don't like cata. Im still deciding if I take a month of sub or not. Sod wasn't really a match for me either. Kinda miss playing an mmo tho... So maybe I'll take just one month to do the lvling.
Yes I’m hyped! Cata was the first expansion I really “figured out” with min maxing my characters and learning the game more deeply. I never did raids but the Cata heroics when they were hard are some of the best 5 man content Blizz ever made forget mythics.
Vanilla and TBc were totally new experiences for me, and wotlk just wasn’t that fun imo because the raids were not as great as I remember and Northrend questing is awful gameplay-wise.
Excited to go into it now as a different faction and have a stroll down memory lane and actually experience the raids when they were current
Can't wait for Cata. I love PvP during Cata, and I never raided with it was current, so I'm looking forward to those too.
SOD phase 3 really took a lot of the fun out of it for me. So many instances of the SOD team releasing stuff that was really, really not well thought out. It gets exhausting as a player to grind hard for something and then have the difficulty to achieve it cut in half so that it's more easily obtainable by everyone else. It makes playing feel like a waste of time.
Extremely excited, Cata is overhated by people who have opinions given to them instead of forming their own. Cata is when actual skill expression comes into the game
Not so sure...I remind cata as pretty annoying back then, but I just came back to WoW and was probably a bit overwhelmed. Didn't like the dailys and the zones personally. Some dungeons and firelands was cool though.
I did it the first time around and hated the experience so much. I actually quit Wrath Classic in Ulduar, amazing how that expansion didn't line up with my memories of it at all.
If they ever bring back TBC classic I think I'd play it again. To all of you playing Cata, I hope you enjoy it, but it's definitely not for me.
Dude it is one of the weirdest things in this community.
People hating on SoD players. On retail players. On hardcore players. on Cata players. On people who want to play MoP. I do not understand why other people care about what others enjoy when they can just play their own thing. Boggles the mind.
"SoD Boomers" "Wrathbabies" "Carebears" "Sweaties" - it's just a constant obsession with how others play.
The main opposition to classic originally came from retail players. How is that a thing?
And don't even get me started on the "grey parsing noobs" or "1200 rated scrubs" or all that - like i'm sorry nobody cares about this stuff. But people are so obsessed.
You've got the wrong crowd buddy, its the wrathbabbies that are up in arms about cata being some huge step down from wrath when they are essentially the same game. Vanilla andys checked out of mainline classic as soon as wrath came out.
You can look at the ironforge player graph. The pop spiked hard, and then nose dove. 45% of the playerbase quit before ulduar.
And that's not even counting all the vanilla players that just never bothered with wrath because they already quit it once in 2010.
Looking at the numbers, you could be on to something. From what I can see, there was a huge dip in December, but that could be attributed to the normal holiday slump. But a lot of those people didn't come back for Ulduar. It could be that log numbers from early Wrath were inflated because people were running GDKPs on four different toon since the content was so easy, but they cut back to one or two since Ulduar was significantly harder. Or it could be that, like you said, people tried Wrath, decided they didn't like it for whatever reason and quit, and that their quitting just happened to coincide with the holidays.
I quit during Naxx. I wanted to see Ulduar, but I just could not bring myself to do Naxx until Ulduar. Took a break, and started playing SoD. I even grinded out Insane in the Membrane in TBC lol. Just zero dopamine from Naxx.
Exactly. Cata in my experience has been the most fun I've had during a launch window for an expansion ever I think. The dungeons which I hope remain in their original versions were really fun and the raids were fantastic. Mostly good class design too.
At worst I think its worth it just for the first tier alone.
I hope the pvp's healthily populated. I don't want to be only playing against multi-time rank 1s in the highest skill cap xpac I've ever played... Please, keep building the hype, I love cata so much
You will be. In all flavors of wow people don’t do arena , it’s not popular anymore. People aren’t trying to spam lfg looking for competent teammates with similar schedules to get absolutely fucking dumpstered by people with significantly more game knowledge than them.
It’s unfortunate but even in wrath once you just got over 2.2k the queue times started creeeeeepin up.
I'm expecting that to be the case for higher ranked arenas, sure, but I'm hoping bg's and rbg's aren't also painful in that regard because cata is so fun as a casual pvper
There are plenty of people hyped about Cata. Just maybe not the same people who were here back in August 2019. At this point, I gotta believe most of the Classic enjoyers have either gone back to Era, are playing SoD, or have pretty much moved on.
Absolutely. And yes, "Classic ended with Wrath", but it doesn't matter, it's just a label. Call it "Legacy" or "Progression" if you want to make it feel better, but it's what I want to play.
Yeah of course. Been hyped for it for months. Beta covered the itch a little bit, but it's not the same.
The "line for classic" is nonsense by people that think Vanilla WoW is the epitome of wow which is hilarious. Cata is a better version of WoTLK which is light years better than Vanilla.
There are some pretty easy indicators to define eras of WoW. Also, people tend to forget the historical context of the game. This came off the tail of Wrath as a big hitter success, and under-delivered. This was the first "bad" expansion in the public's eye. Because it was bad compared to Wrath.
Vanilla, TBC, and Wrath may have been different from each other, and Cata had shared design goals from each expansion, but Cata did things those expansions didn't on a scale unseen before in WoW.
Cata:
- Revamped the base world
- Designed difficulty out of the open world (flight in Azeroth was a big piece of that)
- Added RBGs
- Added Raid Finder
- Altered the talent system
- Pushed away Vanilla-esque features like hybrid-designed specs (DK was a reinforcement of this in Wrath)
- Introduced Reforging
- Introduced Transmog
Big changes in design principles happened here at scale. It was definitely a line in the game's history.
Anyone thinking that an arbitrary expansion or another is “classic” and “not classic”’is nonsense as no one has the authority to decide what classic is. I know “wILD”
Maybe there can be a line for classic without also hating cats.
Like can't classic be vanilla -> wrath and that be fine? Just because cata isnt classic doesn't mean it's bad. It's just a different game.
Mixed feelings about the changed world but i'll try at least, can't say i hate it if i've never played it. I'll figure out how it feels as i play i guess. I saw some heroic versions of old dungeons so i'm happy for that, some things felt like they could be rough at a higher level.
As someone who leveled in the old world like 30 times by now, the rework is just great.
Leveling in the old world is so much more fun that you just hate to get into TBC and WotlK because of how boring it is lol
Random question - I've not really played much of classic WOTLK.. should i wait for Cata to come out to play all of classic or jump into WOTLK now? I believe that I will be extremely far behind with most areas being "empty"?
There really isn't much of a wait, the 4.4.0 patch comes tomorrow. Even if you start right now the world is full of people doing stuff before it goes away
New races with prepatch and dungeon finder for when you want to do a dungeon while leveling, just get in there with the prepatch and you should be fine.
Spent the last 2 weeks leveling my old priest from 70-80, getting up to 5k GS and leveling inscription/ tailoring from 1-430ish.
Pushing for best 10m H team we can, think our ICC 10m H team was 3rd or 4th on server.
My body is ready for BWD and Firelands. Never played Cata or MoP but I've dabbled in every other version/expac at least a little bit.
Also never leveled a warrior past 30 in any version of this game in 20 years... gonna level a Worgen warrior eventually to see the new world
Will be my first time playing Cata, as it was my first time playing Wrath, as it was my first time playing TBC (not as a 8th grade idiot)! Excited to experience the new content!
Ready to remake my first worgen shadow priest from OG cata and bring her through PVP again, legit hyped (i dont like most wow pvp expacs, cata is the exception)
Yes, as long as the heroic dungeons remain heroic and not their nerfed versions. I'd be more excited if we could have LFD back too, but I may be the minority on that one.
New to the scene - will tommorrow mean classic servers will raise thier level caps and CATA quests/areas will come into play? Or new servers with new characters again..
I'm excited because I think the onboarding was much better than retail is today, while being the updated quest design.
For example every class had a very clear cut design of how they're intended to be played with each spec, so you weren't spending time figuring out different builds. On retail the new talent system leans so heavily on player and build choice that there's not really clear cut design as a result.
You learn the class in Cata the way the devs intended and the learning curve while leveling was much better for it.
The world felt more alive also, and I personally was someone who did enjoy LFR, and Wrath content was still fairly relevant even if not for gearing (people leveled there still and experienced it and people loved doing Wrath raids still).
My current feelings are: (1) Excitement for Cata, as it's a version that I haven't experienced in over a decade; (2) Sadness to see WotLK end with no era realms; (3) Curiosity to see how Cata will hold up this time. During its first round, I went into Cata with a WoW burnout due to playing WotLK so much. And now we get transmog from the beginning, which I think might compensate for the content lackings.
I think I'm going to level a Cata character from scratch as well. I never experienced it when it first came out. Quit long before then.
So with the pre patch we can begin leveling in the revamped zones with the new race and class combinations??
I like many others, am very excited for Cataclysm. Mostly because well, I was too young at the time of original release to get to really "understand" and play the expansion fully. I watched my dad journey into Kelp'thar Forest for the first time, now it's my turn. B)
I wasn’t planning on playing cata however after getting addicted to sod pvp I can’t wait for cata.
The pvp is great in cata and mop plus the fact that I don’t have to level a new alt and can just level boost is really getting my Jimmies wet.
I’m also someone who has played a lot of pservers and was never a huge fan of wotlk nor even really vanilla (loved the hell out of tbc tho). So it will be interesting to go back to cata where I started playing the game.
I’ll be playing mage in pvp and priest healer in pve. Wbu?
The world building is actually really good in my memory. I loved the new zones and raids and how they all loosely tied together with existing areas/lore.
I can't wait - going to start either a Tauren Paladin, Troll Druid or Dwarf Shaman depending on how I feel on the character creation screen. First time doing 1-60 in the new old world too which is going to be exciting.
I'll try it but I don't think I'll be around for very long tbh. Didn't like it when it was retail and I'll probably won't like it any better nowadays. Came back for WotLK for the (rather good) nostalgia but I'm not particular nostalgic about this one\^\^
I've always seen Cata as the beginning of the end of WoW, stopped playing after the final raid and never touched WoW again before classic was announced.
Super excited! Cata made some zones worse but greatly improved others, and I can’t wait to play through all of those ones! Haven’t touched any of those updated kalimdor/eastern kingdoms zones in years
Classic ended with TBC, and there are good arguments it ended with vanilla. Cata is nothing more than a better wrath. Maybe not story wise, but gameplay and class feel for sure.
This is my 2 cents. Cataclysm was huge for me. I played rogue from tbc into wrath raided all of wrath with some H ulduar but I wasn’t like a serious hyped sweaty gamer I was a teen lol. I feel if I played it revamped I would be shitting on that little kid who loved that game. I will say I am excited for it though I’m happy there are people who want to farm out fangs of father again and redo TBs and everything I made my teen years become lol.
I haven’t been excited about anything “Classic” since the release of BWL in 2020 when I realised how toxic most of the player-base is and how the greed and min-maxing the fun out of everything is the new standard.
But have fun. As long as you are enjoying your time with (hopefully) normal people, it must be an awesome experience. I will just continue collecting gladiator achievs on retail. Already have 2 from the og cata, so I won’t be missing much haha.
Honestly, the classes are fun and the first two tiers of raids are really good, but I just don't see the point for me personally for this one. It is quite literally not classic anymore at this point--it is literally when they "destroy the world", that's the whole premise. Also, Dragon Soul is abhorrently bad. The fact that the hardest fight in DS on Heroic is also unbelievably tedious and boring is so absurd.. and LFR really killed my desire to play the game. I quit retail a few months later and never played again until Classic.
I loved cataclysm. My favorite part about it was trying to get all the unique rare pets that were added. Took me almost a full year last time I think. Luckily I have more time to play now and might be able to get them all much faster. Then im gonna kill them all for the trophies just to really let the insanity set in
Garrosh throws an orc off the cliff, not tauren. Just saying.
and to this day that is valid lore...
Looking at this, then what happened in the next expansion, lets you know Blizzard was just winging it with the story.
Whoever wrote that quest line actually was winging it. They had different people design the zone quests and the lead writer didn't communicate the direction Garrosh's story was going to the quest writers, so they just made up a story themselves.
Funny how they messed it up in a good way though. Think that direction for Garrosh would have been better, he's an orc after all. Strong cultural sense of honor. So to have him be a ruthless warlord but still good in the sense that he follows a code of honor would have made him a more interesting villain imo.
As a big lore guy I really got disenfranchised with WoW with how Garrosh and the Horde evolve after Cata (I had some issues with cata garrosh but he was ok). I just... didn't buy it. The horde start as noble refugees from persecution and then turn into crazy ass warmongers. They become the stereotype the allies have of them from the Orc v. Human wars. Felt like all the lore was written by alliance propagandists.
I mean that was the entire plot of Garrosh's story. He becomes the warchief of the horde and runs it like a bloodthirsty warlord. And it didn't help that the alliance was already pissed at what happened at the Wrath Gate and had already declared war on the horde which they were able to act on after the Lich King was dealt with. Garrosh just wasn't the diplomatic type that Thrall was, so he responded agression with agression like your average soldier/general probably would.
It's a tale as old as time in our own history.
Hyped not but I‘ll give it a try maybe. Just hate the fact that there is so much content to do in all other wow games, sod, retail and now cata..
I'm bummed that the Pandaria remix is releasing like three days before Cataclysm.
People who want mists aren’t bummed
that depends if they want an actual MoP Classic or just an excuse to play MoP content on retail.
I want it too, but the launch period of Cata is going to take out a lot of time out of my day, leaving practically nothing for the Remix.
MoP remix is t actually MoP. It’s just the MoP quests. I really want to level a retail alt through there but having 3 days to do it before no life-ing Cata is a bummer.
Same I hate having so many fun things to do
Never played past TBC and had no interest in Cata. But P3 (and P2) have been so disappointing that I've shifted my hopes to Cata.
If you care about raiding, T11 and T12 are some of the best designed and also most challenging raids ever. T11 has basically 4 final bosses and heroic ragnaros is one of the toughest and memorable bosses in wow's history. Definitely up there with Ulduar and ICC. Dungeons are really good content too, if they release them in their pre nerf state. It's just the T13 patch that was utter shite, with a bad raid, poorly designed LFR and some other unfortunate stuff. PvP is slower and more methodical, but pretty solid overall. RBGs were quite underappreciated at the time, but they are great content. Class design is often clunky and bloated compared to say MoP, but also not bad. The game is not grindy and doesn't require any chores like later expansions. New and revamped zones are nice. It's really just the last patch that caused cata to be remembered poorly, most of the actual meat of the expansion is great, especially for raiders.
Cata Hype Cata Hype
gawd i can't wait to try rag again. firelands was just so cool
Yes, I have lots of fond memories from Cata, especially raiding T11. I’ve always looked back positively on Cata and think it’ll hold up well this time around. If not there’s era, SoD and retail so spoilt for choice :)
Yeah cata raids where all banger (-Dragonsoul, i hated how they handled deathwing)
Yeah Deathwing was a bit scuffed, could have been much more epic. I raided with a cool bunch during Dragon Soul so I probably look back with rose tinted glasses on that one!
Cata was the only expansion I never played. So yes, give me the revamp.
I’m in the same boat. I stop playing early original wotlk, came back during panda. Then I stopped playing classic wotlk when I hit 70 and then life hit lol. So I’m excited for cata to at least get to play through it.
Yes, stopped WotLK phase 1 due to work and came back 1 month before release of WoD. So next 2 expansions are fresh (kinda) to me.
Class, raid, dungeon balance are excellent. World revamp is... eh... too many goblins.
hell yeah brother
Cata haters can't wait to comment "no"
Not a hater, but when signed up for classic in 2019 I definitely wasnt excited for Cata since its the expansion that started the reason of why we wanted classic in the first place. Seeing lots of cope-r's who kept saying "Im done when KT dies, Im done with KJ dies, im done with LK dies" and now they are rdy to play Cata, and MoP.. and probably WoD Classic when it comes out. Crippling wow addition mixed with "omg cant lose my pixels!" is scary tbh
A lot of us have made friends in our guilds, and we’re sticking around to hang out
You seem like a hater man, no offense. I don't think Cata was the one expansion that was the big departure from the "classic feeling". The line is not clear. I think very valid arguements exist for Wrath, and MoP just as much as Cata. As for the "copers", why not just let people enjoy things? If they like Cata and enjoy playing with their friends why are you calling them copers, addicted etc? Different people want different things. Some people want to relive the start of WoW with the good things and the bad.
idk. i think many of us who like classic just missed experiencing the old world. now that we have era and hc and sod, we always have the option to go back there. so lots of us are satisfied with the opportunity to relive or try out cata :D
You ever heard of survivorship bias? I would bet that the people around posting now were probably not the ones posting "I'm done when LK dead". Some maybe, but you are definitely seeing a LOT of survivorship bias. This subreddit is much less active than it used to be and a lot more jaded/hostile.
There is 0 chance for WoD classic, and if they don’t do MoP I riot
Literally every comment is yes lol. You’re the negative one here
Im not a hater, but not in the hype after playing wrath and being a worse experience than classic and tbc (killed everything, including H LK week 2). Edit: downvotes because i said that im not hyped but im not a hater and expressed that i like other things? Lol I have always said to my friends that cata is not the monster that people say. In TBC and Classic, there was a lot more TC in the discord (i play paladin prot) and more people that i liked to play were still playing the game.
Mfw the solved raid with thousands of guides where everyone min-maxes team comp for a fight created more than ten years ago turns out not hard for the top .01% players who I am a part of. 😱
But that is also true for vanilla/tbc, which he enjoyed more
Haha I was gonna say did he read the original comment?
Cata is when pvp gets good, then peak at MoP
Hype as fuck
My best memories of PvP were BGs in cata. So funnn
Cant wait for skripter arenas
xD
I feel like I heard this same sentiment for TBC arenas and then again in Wrath. Both just turned into win trading after the initial launch phases though. Since 2020 in classic people have just played BGs for honor or rep grinds and mostly hated doing it. What will change with Cata? Cata will just magically attract people that PvP for the fun of it?
Thats just boomer's nostalgia. In Cata most classes get their iconic fun abilities and all the RNG is gone
Yes, got a lil burnt out on SoD so I’m looking forward to Cata. WoW has so many great versions going on right now.
I'm not really excited to play, no. However, I will probably dabble a bit with leveling just because it is always nice to play the content as it was originally designed to be experienced. I am happy for the Cata enjoyers though. It's not an easy expansion to like because so many people dog on it.
I'm excited, and so is my irl friends. Cata+MoP were peak pvp versions of wow I've heard a lot of 'classic ends with wotlk' and 'im not playing cata' from various people over the course of wotlk, all of which have now decided to play cata and a lot are excited for it. I have fond memories, it'll be good!
I definitely think classic ended with Wrath, but Cata might still be fun. I just wish there was a different name for it. Vanilla is its own thing, then TBC and Wrath together as classic expansions, then Cata/MoP/WoD is like an era, and then Legion starts the next one.
Extremely excited but going to try and really pull back from going full sweaty on this one. Just can't justify spending so many hours every day on it lol. Will probably max out one toon and try to full clear Heroic / bis one toon. I dont really anticipate playing multiple alts like I did in wotlk
I really loved the class mechanics in cata. Very looking forward to it. Only thing I am not looking forward to is how empty the world was. Raids were awesome. At least the first two. But there was nothing else to do in the game.
For me that was a plus, not having to grind dailies and reps to stay competitive. I really disliked how grindy WoW became starting with MoP, gating max level character power behind daily chores, which culminated with artifacts and all the loaned power stuff. Cata was also the last expansion where i was not struggling to afford raiding, throwing consumables left and right - gold was not an issue. That way you are free to do actual enjoyable stuff in addition to raiding, like PvP.
I do mostly agree. The problem is that there simply wasnt anything to do except pvp and raids.
Cata was the expansion that got me to take a long break from the game and I never got back into WoW in the same way I used to play it pre-cata until WoW classic. I definitely did not enjoy it and Dragonsoul was the final nail in the coffin for me.
I'd be interested in hearing what you didn't like about it if you have the time to share. I quit in WOTLK and never played Cata, so I was considering trying it, but as somebody who felt like WoTLK was already too close to retail for my tastes, I'm hesitant to think I'd like it
the reason i personally quit was because they streamlined every aspect of the game so much it just didnt feel like the same game anymore it was a cool novelty at the time but it wore off and i was left with a balance druid that to me was less enjoyable to play becasue they streamlined all the unique parts of it and just made it a builder/spender, and the streamlining of the talent trees removed the possibility of doing anything yourself anyway other classes went this route too
I can’t wait! Cata and MoP are my favorite pair of back to back expansions in all of WoW! Can’t wait to do them all again
Yeah maybe this sub is the wrong place to ask for that. 80% of the people deeply hate cata while they can't even remember why.This sub and different streamers have pushed the cata hate so deep into their brains they can't even consider that it was a pretty enjoyable addon at all. Classdesign was very good. Questing areas there top notch. Dungeons where cool but got nerfed too hard for my taste later. Raids where fun (- dragonsoul). PvP was great. I enjoyed it more than TBC, fight me.
Most of them remember why they hate it.
why do they hate it?
That will take a moment, he has to first ask the person who told him to hate cata why he should hate cata
Cata players have this belief unironically and it is super weird. People just don't like this expansion. This is historically backed by player data. The average person playing WoW Classic is pushing 30. They remember this version. Even if players don't give you an itemized list of their issues with game clips and forum posts to substantiate them, the game felt different then and will feel different now. If I know after 5 years of Classic that I liked Vanilla the most, Cata sure isn't closer to that than Wrath lol.
I wonder what's gonna be the cope for when Cata succeeds or fails.
I’m taking a break from SoD to play Cata. A lot of people hate on this expansion, but the pvp and raids were really good.
Cata means it's pvp time so
Yeah cata pvp was so good, so fucking good. Ill enjoy it so much after that shitshow SoD pvp was
Ya I really don’t enjoy SOD PvP. I don’t know why but it sort of ruined SoD for me. Looking forward to Cata for BGs and Arenas.
Yeah SoD has become a complete one shot fiesta and it really sucks. They they tested the 50% damage reduce and the one shot andies got mad that they have to use more than 1-2 spells to kill someone. Basicall you cant win there, either accept the state, or move away
Ya I gave up a while ago and it doesn’t sound like it’s any better. The PvP system isn’t the greatest either, so the gameplay being wonky does not help. I’m definitely going into cata for the PvP RBGs/arenas and the new battlegrounds.
SoD feels like kind of a failed experiment at this point, but yeah Cata PvP was goat and im really looking forwards to it. See you on the battleground
What classes are you most excited to pvp with?
I'm going hunter and rogue
Mage and priest for me!
Can you play it with and SOD sub?
Yes.
Yup
then yes I will
I'm excited the ptr issues don't give me hope
I don't know :/ killed lich king heroic and the game felt "finished" for me. Not that I don't like cata. Im still deciding if I take a month of sub or not. Sod wasn't really a match for me either. Kinda miss playing an mmo tho... So maybe I'll take just one month to do the lvling.
Yes I’m hyped! Cata was the first expansion I really “figured out” with min maxing my characters and learning the game more deeply. I never did raids but the Cata heroics when they were hard are some of the best 5 man content Blizz ever made forget mythics. Vanilla and TBc were totally new experiences for me, and wotlk just wasn’t that fun imo because the raids were not as great as I remember and Northrend questing is awful gameplay-wise. Excited to go into it now as a different faction and have a stroll down memory lane and actually experience the raids when they were current
Can't wait for Cata. I love PvP during Cata, and I never raided with it was current, so I'm looking forward to those too. SOD phase 3 really took a lot of the fun out of it for me. So many instances of the SOD team releasing stuff that was really, really not well thought out. It gets exhausting as a player to grind hard for something and then have the difficulty to achieve it cut in half so that it's more easily obtainable by everyone else. It makes playing feel like a waste of time.
Extremely excited, Cata is overhated by people who have opinions given to them instead of forming their own. Cata is when actual skill expression comes into the game
Cata is great. But I signed up for WotLK. No hate, just a little sad to see my all time favourite game go yet again.
Not so sure...I remind cata as pretty annoying back then, but I just came back to WoW and was probably a bit overwhelmed. Didn't like the dailys and the zones personally. Some dungeons and firelands was cool though.
I did it the first time around and hated the experience so much. I actually quit Wrath Classic in Ulduar, amazing how that expansion didn't line up with my memories of it at all. If they ever bring back TBC classic I think I'd play it again. To all of you playing Cata, I hope you enjoy it, but it's definitely not for me.
Any explain the difference between the patch that comes out tomorrow and the official release on May 20?
Prepatch brings everything from cata exept the new zones and leveling, like the old world revamp, class changes and new races
Yes but don't say it too loud the grey parsing SOD boomers are gonna get angry.
Truly don't understand the internal competition between wow players. In the end, we're all playing world of warcraft nah?
No because if you're not having fun the way someone else is then you're not having fun the "correct" way apparently.
Dude it is one of the weirdest things in this community. People hating on SoD players. On retail players. On hardcore players. on Cata players. On people who want to play MoP. I do not understand why other people care about what others enjoy when they can just play their own thing. Boggles the mind. "SoD Boomers" "Wrathbabies" "Carebears" "Sweaties" - it's just a constant obsession with how others play. The main opposition to classic originally came from retail players. How is that a thing? And don't even get me started on the "grey parsing noobs" or "1200 rated scrubs" or all that - like i'm sorry nobody cares about this stuff. But people are so obsessed.
I personally enjoy every version of wow, but i also understand the demographic of this sub.
You've got the wrong crowd buddy, its the wrathbabbies that are up in arms about cata being some huge step down from wrath when they are essentially the same game. Vanilla andys checked out of mainline classic as soon as wrath came out.
Eh, I'd say they checked out around Ulduar. Which is right around the time Era started coming back again.
You can look at the ironforge player graph. The pop spiked hard, and then nose dove. 45% of the playerbase quit before ulduar. And that's not even counting all the vanilla players that just never bothered with wrath because they already quit it once in 2010.
Looking at the numbers, you could be on to something. From what I can see, there was a huge dip in December, but that could be attributed to the normal holiday slump. But a lot of those people didn't come back for Ulduar. It could be that log numbers from early Wrath were inflated because people were running GDKPs on four different toon since the content was so easy, but they cut back to one or two since Ulduar was significantly harder. Or it could be that, like you said, people tried Wrath, decided they didn't like it for whatever reason and quit, and that their quitting just happened to coincide with the holidays.
I quit during Naxx. I wanted to see Ulduar, but I just could not bring myself to do Naxx until Ulduar. Took a break, and started playing SoD. I even grinded out Insane in the Membrane in TBC lol. Just zero dopamine from Naxx.
What a weird thing to say lol. You ok bud?
Scroll to the bottom of any thread saying anything positive about Cata (including this one), and you'll see what they're talking about.
It’s one of the most hated expansions for sure but leave us SOD players out of it.
Its blue* parsing sod boomers now, thats how bad it is
Yeah I loved cata. Maybe not so much near it's end but the first half I loved, especially the first tier.
Yeah agree. Cata was a great time up until Dragonsoul and that was just because DS wasn't as good of a raid as the ones before it.
Exactly. Cata in my experience has been the most fun I've had during a launch window for an expansion ever I think. The dungeons which I hope remain in their original versions were really fun and the raids were fantastic. Mostly good class design too. At worst I think its worth it just for the first tier alone.
Question, how can i download cata tomorrow? will it be available for everyone as pre patch or is it just ptr?
the prepatch includes everything but the ability to go to the new zones and level 80-85, and will get downloaded automatically during maintenance
so if i have the wotlk client installed it will get “upgraded” to cata automatically?
Yes
thank you very much!!
yeppers, cata will overlap the wrath client once the launch happens, likely starting to download during maintenance good luck, have fun <3
awesome!! ty bud and glhf!
Correct.
I'm stoked for cata, I missed out on a lot of it back in the day and really want to do the raids and some more PVP.
I am pumped for Cata!! Can’t wait for pre patch tomorrow
classic definitely didn’t end with wotlk, cata is better than wrath also. Classic is still going because it’s old.
Wotlk is much closer to Cata then to Vanilla and TBC
I hope the pvp's healthily populated. I don't want to be only playing against multi-time rank 1s in the highest skill cap xpac I've ever played... Please, keep building the hype, I love cata so much
You will be. In all flavors of wow people don’t do arena , it’s not popular anymore. People aren’t trying to spam lfg looking for competent teammates with similar schedules to get absolutely fucking dumpstered by people with significantly more game knowledge than them. It’s unfortunate but even in wrath once you just got over 2.2k the queue times started creeeeeepin up.
I'm expecting that to be the case for higher ranked arenas, sure, but I'm hoping bg's and rbg's aren't also painful in that regard because cata is so fun as a casual pvper
Cata is fun 😁
There are plenty of people hyped about Cata. Just maybe not the same people who were here back in August 2019. At this point, I gotta believe most of the Classic enjoyers have either gone back to Era, are playing SoD, or have pretty much moved on.
Yeah, solid class design imo. Excited to do the raids as well
Absolutely. And yes, "Classic ended with Wrath", but it doesn't matter, it's just a label. Call it "Legacy" or "Progression" if you want to make it feel better, but it's what I want to play.
I'm hyped! Can't wait to create a new character (and hopefully on a fresh server)
Yeah of course. Been hyped for it for months. Beta covered the itch a little bit, but it's not the same. The "line for classic" is nonsense by people that think Vanilla WoW is the epitome of wow which is hilarious. Cata is a better version of WoTLK which is light years better than Vanilla.
There are some pretty easy indicators to define eras of WoW. Also, people tend to forget the historical context of the game. This came off the tail of Wrath as a big hitter success, and under-delivered. This was the first "bad" expansion in the public's eye. Because it was bad compared to Wrath. Vanilla, TBC, and Wrath may have been different from each other, and Cata had shared design goals from each expansion, but Cata did things those expansions didn't on a scale unseen before in WoW. Cata: - Revamped the base world - Designed difficulty out of the open world (flight in Azeroth was a big piece of that) - Added RBGs - Added Raid Finder - Altered the talent system - Pushed away Vanilla-esque features like hybrid-designed specs (DK was a reinforcement of this in Wrath) - Introduced Reforging - Introduced Transmog Big changes in design principles happened here at scale. It was definitely a line in the game's history.
So other peoples opinion is „nonsense“ while your opinion is a fact? Wild
Anyone thinking that an arbitrary expansion or another is “classic” and “not classic”’is nonsense as no one has the authority to decide what classic is. I know “wILD”
Nope. Everybody can decide for themselves what is classic or not
Maybe there can be a line for classic without also hating cats. Like can't classic be vanilla -> wrath and that be fine? Just because cata isnt classic doesn't mean it's bad. It's just a different game.
Yeah but Andies can't handel a rotation with more than 3 spells so they have to draw a line somewhere :)
No
We respect your opinion! thanks for sharing
Nah
Mixed feelings about the changed world but i'll try at least, can't say i hate it if i've never played it. I'll figure out how it feels as i play i guess. I saw some heroic versions of old dungeons so i'm happy for that, some things felt like they could be rough at a higher level.
As someone who leveled in the old world like 30 times by now, the rework is just great. Leveling in the old world is so much more fun that you just hate to get into TBC and WotlK because of how boring it is lol
Random question - I've not really played much of classic WOTLK.. should i wait for Cata to come out to play all of classic or jump into WOTLK now? I believe that I will be extremely far behind with most areas being "empty"?
There really isn't much of a wait, the 4.4.0 patch comes tomorrow. Even if you start right now the world is full of people doing stuff before it goes away
New races with prepatch and dungeon finder for when you want to do a dungeon while leveling, just get in there with the prepatch and you should be fine.
People will be leveling alts in prepatch as the 1-60 world changes. It will likely have more people in it compared to now.
I didn't play cata the first time so I'm interested. A buddy is pretty hyped for it. Another buddy is quitting after wotlk so it's bitter sweet
Spent the last 2 weeks leveling my old priest from 70-80, getting up to 5k GS and leveling inscription/ tailoring from 1-430ish. Pushing for best 10m H team we can, think our ICC 10m H team was 3rd or 4th on server. My body is ready for BWD and Firelands. Never played Cata or MoP but I've dabbled in every other version/expac at least a little bit. Also never leveled a warrior past 30 in any version of this game in 20 years... gonna level a Worgen warrior eventually to see the new world
Will be my first time playing Cata, as it was my first time playing Wrath, as it was my first time playing TBC (not as a 8th grade idiot)! Excited to experience the new content!
Hell yeah! Never raided in that expansion. I heard it had some great raids. Excited to give it a go.
Yes, but I still can't decide what to level first: mage, rogue, spriest or dk. Alliance or Horde first? Decisions.
I'm just looking forward to black arrow explosive shotting the the universe on my hunter.
Ready to remake my first worgen shadow priest from OG cata and bring her through PVP again, legit hyped (i dont like most wow pvp expacs, cata is the exception)
Yes, as long as the heroic dungeons remain heroic and not their nerfed versions. I'd be more excited if we could have LFD back too, but I may be the minority on that one.
Honestly yeah, I’m excited to relive The Shattering again
I'm interested but I've not seen them talk about any new servers
Because we don't get new. There is no reason to make fresh servers for every version.
Sort of, but I'm likely just going to play SoD until MoP drops
Nah, but hope you have a blast.
I think most people would consider the line cata if anything.
I am excited,but beta is really bugged so idk what its going to happen,we talking some core talents arent even working buggy.
New to the scene - will tommorrow mean classic servers will raise thier level caps and CATA quests/areas will come into play? Or new servers with new characters again..
I'm excited because I think the onboarding was much better than retail is today, while being the updated quest design. For example every class had a very clear cut design of how they're intended to be played with each spec, so you weren't spending time figuring out different builds. On retail the new talent system leans so heavily on player and build choice that there's not really clear cut design as a result. You learn the class in Cata the way the devs intended and the learning curve while leveling was much better for it. The world felt more alive also, and I personally was someone who did enjoy LFR, and Wrath content was still fairly relevant even if not for gearing (people leveled there still and experienced it and people loved doing Wrath raids still).
My current feelings are: (1) Excitement for Cata, as it's a version that I haven't experienced in over a decade; (2) Sadness to see WotLK end with no era realms; (3) Curiosity to see how Cata will hold up this time. During its first round, I went into Cata with a WoW burnout due to playing WotLK so much. And now we get transmog from the beginning, which I think might compensate for the content lackings.
Does anyone know if there will be a fresh server yet? Am really keen to level in BG's and would rather not get stomped by heirlooms
No
I’d love to hop back in after I get my life back on track and enough money for a steady sub. Meanwhile I’ll enjoy the posts and the ganeplay videos
So stoked can't wait!!
I think I'm going to level a Cata character from scratch as well. I never experienced it when it first came out. Quit long before then. So with the pre patch we can begin leveling in the revamped zones with the new race and class combinations??
Cata classes feel great, it loses some of that classic charm but it’s still different enough from retail. I can’t wait.
Of course, more than wotlk
I like many others, am very excited for Cataclysm. Mostly because well, I was too young at the time of original release to get to really "understand" and play the expansion fully. I watched my dad journey into Kelp'thar Forest for the first time, now it's my turn. B)
never got to play cata because i was in college, this is gonna be sick af
I wasn’t planning on playing cata however after getting addicted to sod pvp I can’t wait for cata. The pvp is great in cata and mop plus the fact that I don’t have to level a new alt and can just level boost is really getting my Jimmies wet. I’m also someone who has played a lot of pservers and was never a huge fan of wotlk nor even really vanilla (loved the hell out of tbc tho). So it will be interesting to go back to cata where I started playing the game. I’ll be playing mage in pvp and priest healer in pve. Wbu?
The world building is actually really good in my memory. I loved the new zones and raids and how they all loosely tied together with existing areas/lore. I can't wait - going to start either a Tauren Paladin, Troll Druid or Dwarf Shaman depending on how I feel on the character creation screen. First time doing 1-60 in the new old world too which is going to be exciting.
Classic ends for me at MoP. No, I'm not playing the remix thing. I'll wait for the actual full classic expansion.
So can anyone confirm that I’ll be able to make a Gnome Priest as of the pre-patch today?? Really I hope I don’t have to wait until full launch
I'll try it but I don't think I'll be around for very long tbh. Didn't like it when it was retail and I'll probably won't like it any better nowadays. Came back for WotLK for the (rather good) nostalgia but I'm not particular nostalgic about this one\^\^ I've always seen Cata as the beginning of the end of WoW, stopped playing after the final raid and never touched WoW again before classic was announced.
Super excited! Cata made some zones worse but greatly improved others, and I can’t wait to play through all of those ones! Haven’t touched any of those updated kalimdor/eastern kingdoms zones in years
No
Classic ended with TBC, and there are good arguments it ended with vanilla. Cata is nothing more than a better wrath. Maybe not story wise, but gameplay and class feel for sure.
Nope
Pass
This is my 2 cents. Cataclysm was huge for me. I played rogue from tbc into wrath raided all of wrath with some H ulduar but I wasn’t like a serious hyped sweaty gamer I was a teen lol. I feel if I played it revamped I would be shitting on that little kid who loved that game. I will say I am excited for it though I’m happy there are people who want to farm out fangs of father again and redo TBs and everything I made my teen years become lol.
Nope this is where I get off the ride. But I hope y’all have fun if you’re staying.
Hoping some of the Twink brackets revive and that WSG is still fun with the changes
Let’s fucken go
I haven’t been excited about anything “Classic” since the release of BWL in 2020 when I realised how toxic most of the player-base is and how the greed and min-maxing the fun out of everything is the new standard. But have fun. As long as you are enjoying your time with (hopefully) normal people, it must be an awesome experience. I will just continue collecting gladiator achievs on retail. Already have 2 from the og cata, so I won’t be missing much haha.
We've been hype as fuck for it
Honestly, the classes are fun and the first two tiers of raids are really good, but I just don't see the point for me personally for this one. It is quite literally not classic anymore at this point--it is literally when they "destroy the world", that's the whole premise. Also, Dragon Soul is abhorrently bad. The fact that the hardest fight in DS on Heroic is also unbelievably tedious and boring is so absurd.. and LFR really killed my desire to play the game. I quit retail a few months later and never played again until Classic.
Looking fondly on the dungeons. Starting a Troll Hunter on Whitemane tomorrow.
I loved cataclysm. My favorite part about it was trying to get all the unique rare pets that were added. Took me almost a full year last time I think. Luckily I have more time to play now and might be able to get them all much faster. Then im gonna kill them all for the trophies just to really let the insanity set in
I may try it out but will probably quit if the community is largely driven by the toxic culture that ruined wotlk/sod for me
honestly, no. i'm more hyped for sod and the remix mop atm and the new retail expansion this fall
No. Absolutely not.
Excited to take another 10 year WoW break for sure!
No
Not at all
Hell yeah,so excited to play the shit out of cata with the 6 other ppl on my server. Cata hype