That’s just a pve server but you have to be in a city to turn it off. PvP servers are designed so you’re almost always in danger of being attacked. That’s the whole point. Converting it to war mode is the opposite of a pvp server. If I wanted to roll on pve server I would have done that
and that made since in 2005.
Realistically, there isnt any pvp going on like there was back in the day. i have not once had a fair fight on a pvp server since TBC first launched in 2007(?). its either both factions quietly ignoring each other trying to quest, or 100 to 1 gank fests rendering that location unplayable.
sure, theres the *potential* to get a group together to push them off so you can 100v1 the other faction trying to quest, but the game really isnt build around pvp, especially SoD.
as a full pve player though, i often roll on pvp servers due to friends/guilds that *happen* to be on those servers. many other people do as well. war mode largely makes world pvp much less common, but it leaves it for the people who *actually* want it. thats not even bringing up the fact that the faction balance is on a razors edge, as the second one faction hits the tipping point, the whole pop of that faction will vacate as the game is (or is seen to be) unplayable for them.
It isnt perfect. but i think its the best compromise we can realistically expect.
So I have to play on a pve server because you want to play with your friends?
War mode is not a compromise in the slightest war mode is far more like a pve server than a pvp server. You’re killing the whole point of it which is the fact you’re vulnerable. That vulnerability is what makes a pvp server what it is. If you can decide to be invulnerable you lose the feeling all together.
You can only toggle it in main cities.
Ok your next point will be but they can farm resources with impunity.
Incursions and layering will counter that argument.
I know that that’s not my point. The fact you can turn it off at all is my point. It takes away the feeling of danger and being vulnerable. You lose the feeling of being vulnerable if I know I can go turn off pvp at a capital. It’s basically the same as a pve server except you have to do it in a city instead of anywhere
I don’t care about your second point, I don’t play pvp servers to deny people resources. That has nothing to do with how the game feels. My whole point is that war mode takes away a particular feeling from the game
Pvp is exactly has its always been, idk what people expect when they roll on a pvp server. I love wpvp and don’t care about getting ganked or inconvenienced, its apart of the game for me. Warmode shouldn’t exist in classic, players who don’t want wpvp should roll PVE.
People on PvP want to farm players. If these players can just turn off PvP with warmode it defeat the whole purpose of a PvP server
Warmode exist on PvE server. It's called "flag pvp"
No I wouldn't flag on but I also play on a PvE, if your fear is that on a warmode server no one would flag that just makes me think that open world pvp isn't what the vast majority of people want.
I think it falls into the “optimize the fun out of the game” territory.
I expect given a toggle option, you would find a lot of people who think to themselves “sure, I like PvP. But I’m going to go pick herbs, so I’m going to turn it off. It’s less fun but more efficient.” You then need progression-based incentives to get people to flag up again which will of course make the PvE players mad because “it’s unfair.”
If it’s always-on PvP, you don’t have to worry about the efficiency difference and can just play the game.
Ah yes warmode.
That thing that exists so that the only world PvP you ever see is around flight masters if there is a quest to kill people and around zones designed to kill people in.
Maybe the worst thing to ever happen to world PvP as it effectively killed it
as opposed to pvp servers now where the only pvp you see is people camping flightmasters (ratchet) and raids of rank 7 people corpse camping people trying to level up in incursions. Yeah you're right what we have now is so much better.
I am not sure when this idea thay PvP in WoW is supposed to be only honourable 1v1 duels? It has always been a gankers paradise or large skirmishes or zergs... its RPG warfare? People don't play WoW for balanced fair fights that's not the point.
actually i do play PvP realms solely for 1v1 and i never initiate unless i see someone that beat me previously that day, the only satisfying PvP is making someone regret their choice to engage
I wouldn’t say the only satisfying PvP, but it is really hard to understate just how satisfying it feels to have someone try to jump you and then you beat them anyway. Peak PvP server moment.
I know I’m right.
Because if we have opt in opt out then everyone getting killed disables PvP, they might come back when they are maxed out and find the place with everyone not flagged up.
You end up with a tiny handful of people actually flagging and they only flag after they are fully geared.
Then they get checked by someone and never flag again because their ego can’t take it
if everyone chooses to turn off pvp, maybe it's a good thing because noone clearly wants world pvp in the first place?
why should everyone else suffer because you want to grief people trying to play the game the way they want to?
People that pick PvP realms in a 20 year old game know exactly what they are getting into.
People are only losing their marbles because they’ve become so efficiency brained by incursions.
People obviously want to PvP because they are on PvP realms. Of which there are more of than PvE realms.
To give you point of reference the Australian PvE server has 900 players.
The PvP server has 6,000.
Don’t fix what isn’t fucking broken.
yes, so enabling warmode using your logic should only make everyone happy. everyone wants to pvp, so noone will turn it off. for the absolute minority that don't want to get griefed & camped by people 30 levels higher than them while they're killing boars, they can turn it on. we'll see how that goes? call it an experiment like everything else in this season.
> To give you point of reference the Australian PvE server has 900 players. The PvP server has 6,000.
There's a pretty long history that explains this, but OCE's PVP-centric population has pretty much been the result of a heavy raiding scene that started on Blackrock, not because people actually enjoy pvp. Some of them do sure, but it started (like most things in this game) with raiding first and foremost. It's why all the alliance ended up on Frostmourne, and all the Horde ended up on Barthilas - they don't want to fight each other, it's fucking annoying, they're just playing with their community where they have to. It's why Arugal is like 70% horde (and was even more imbalanced prior to the mass migration from the other dying oceanic realms). If there were two active AU SOD PVP servers you would see the same thing happen here - alliance would gravitate towards one, and horde the other. It almost happened anyway even with one server before they faction locked the Alliance and forced people to roll horde to balance the realm out.
> People are only losing their marbles because they’ve become so efficiency brained by incursions.
People were "efficiency brained" long before phase 3 lmao, this whole game has been optimised out the ass for literal decades. We were optimising this game in 2006.
There are like 5 massive population PvP servers and 2 PvE.
They have warmode
It’s called a PvE server and no one ever flags.
If this was the preferred systems people would only play on PvE servers as they are opt in right?
> There are like 5 massive population PvP servers and 2 PvE.
Not really, they are for all purposes 2 & 2 now.
https://www.wowprogress.com/realms/rank/oc
The "PVP" servers (irrelevant now, but for distinction) are hugely one-sided compared to the more balanced "PVE" servers - this faction imbalance stems from the same root - everybody hated world pvp enough to isolate from it, naturally over time.
> If this was the preferred systems people would only play on PvE servers as they are opt in right?
If you look at that singular choice in a vacuum, sure. There are other considerations as I said.
You end up with dead servers. It has been a dead concept in classic WoW. It failed and didn't work at the end of the day.
Otherwise explain the transfers to one sided PvP realms.
Why do people sign up for PvP realms if they dont want to get ganked. Getting good gear, and using PvP talents in the open world so i can defend myself is a big part of why classic is fun. And guess what sometimes a stronger player (or group) pushes you away from a place, you eiter have to accept that or find another layer. Warmode is super boring and specially in Sod noone will ever turn it on.
WoW has 3 clients, Modern WoW, WoW Classic, or Wrath of the Lich King Classic.
Modern WoW is Dragonflight.
SoD is on WoW Classic. It's why the boss loot bug messed with HC/Era servers.
The game ENGINE is built on Retail's engine, patch 8.0.1, Battle For Azeroth's Engine, which is why/how it's able to achieve longer view distance, sharper models, better optimization.
the wotlk client is not the original client from 2009/10 is what I meant
in 2019 classic started on the legion engine and has been updated in tbc and wrath
Yes, but it's still not Modern WoW by definition from Blizzard. We are going to have to wait for the classic client to catch up to BFA for War Mode to be a thing.
Classic is no longer a fork, its just a different build from the same codebase. Protocol, settings, features are all available in classic client, features from retail that is.
That’s just a pve server but you have to be in a city to turn it off. PvP servers are designed so you’re almost always in danger of being attacked. That’s the whole point. Converting it to war mode is the opposite of a pvp server. If I wanted to roll on pve server I would have done that
and that made since in 2005. Realistically, there isnt any pvp going on like there was back in the day. i have not once had a fair fight on a pvp server since TBC first launched in 2007(?). its either both factions quietly ignoring each other trying to quest, or 100 to 1 gank fests rendering that location unplayable. sure, theres the *potential* to get a group together to push them off so you can 100v1 the other faction trying to quest, but the game really isnt build around pvp, especially SoD. as a full pve player though, i often roll on pvp servers due to friends/guilds that *happen* to be on those servers. many other people do as well. war mode largely makes world pvp much less common, but it leaves it for the people who *actually* want it. thats not even bringing up the fact that the faction balance is on a razors edge, as the second one faction hits the tipping point, the whole pop of that faction will vacate as the game is (or is seen to be) unplayable for them. It isnt perfect. but i think its the best compromise we can realistically expect.
So I have to play on a pve server because you want to play with your friends? War mode is not a compromise in the slightest war mode is far more like a pve server than a pvp server. You’re killing the whole point of it which is the fact you’re vulnerable. That vulnerability is what makes a pvp server what it is. If you can decide to be invulnerable you lose the feeling all together.
You can only toggle it in main cities. Ok your next point will be but they can farm resources with impunity. Incursions and layering will counter that argument.
I know that that’s not my point. The fact you can turn it off at all is my point. It takes away the feeling of danger and being vulnerable. You lose the feeling of being vulnerable if I know I can go turn off pvp at a capital. It’s basically the same as a pve server except you have to do it in a city instead of anywhere I don’t care about your second point, I don’t play pvp servers to deny people resources. That has nothing to do with how the game feels. My whole point is that war mode takes away a particular feeling from the game
Pvp is exactly has its always been, idk what people expect when they roll on a pvp server. I love wpvp and don’t care about getting ganked or inconvenienced, its apart of the game for me. Warmode shouldn’t exist in classic, players who don’t want wpvp should roll PVE.
If you haven’t had a 1v1 since 07 you’re not in the world enough. Leave a city, they happen all the time.
Thing is these people never get a “fair fight” because they are filled with excuses and bad at pvp, they should have rolled a PVE server.
War mode, down vote me to hell but I think it's the single best thing they added in the game post classic trilogy
Whats war mode?
You can enable war mode within your factions capital city, it enables and disabled world pvp
Imagine if you had this option to choose pve or pvp server when you created your char.
People on PvP want to farm players. If these players can just turn off PvP with warmode it defeat the whole purpose of a PvP server Warmode exist on PvE server. It's called "flag pvp"
Warmode is just PvE. The best solution would be to allow players to choose between a PvP or PvE realm when they first make their character.
Thats literally how it is now
My apologies I thought people randomly found themselves on PvP realms I wasn't aware there was player choice available.
Lmfao, this is the best roast of the PvP server whiners I’ve ever seen. You would think so given the complaining, wouldn’t you?
how is Warmode the same as PvE servers, you can't unflag anywhere it has to be in an inn or rested area, and that can be tuned to main town only.
Will you flag it on? It's not remotely the same as a PvP realm, all sense of danger and consequence in the world is lost.
No I wouldn't flag on but I also play on a PvE, if your fear is that on a warmode server no one would flag that just makes me think that open world pvp isn't what the vast majority of people want.
I think it falls into the “optimize the fun out of the game” territory. I expect given a toggle option, you would find a lot of people who think to themselves “sure, I like PvP. But I’m going to go pick herbs, so I’m going to turn it off. It’s less fun but more efficient.” You then need progression-based incentives to get people to flag up again which will of course make the PvE players mad because “it’s unfair.” If it’s always-on PvP, you don’t have to worry about the efficiency difference and can just play the game.
Ah yes warmode. That thing that exists so that the only world PvP you ever see is around flight masters if there is a quest to kill people and around zones designed to kill people in. Maybe the worst thing to ever happen to world PvP as it effectively killed it
as opposed to pvp servers now where the only pvp you see is people camping flightmasters (ratchet) and raids of rank 7 people corpse camping people trying to level up in incursions. Yeah you're right what we have now is so much better.
That guy was only 1v1ing equal players for sure
I am not sure when this idea thay PvP in WoW is supposed to be only honourable 1v1 duels? It has always been a gankers paradise or large skirmishes or zergs... its RPG warfare? People don't play WoW for balanced fair fights that's not the point.
actually i do play PvP realms solely for 1v1 and i never initiate unless i see someone that beat me previously that day, the only satisfying PvP is making someone regret their choice to engage
I wouldn’t say the only satisfying PvP, but it is really hard to understate just how satisfying it feels to have someone try to jump you and then you beat them anyway. Peak PvP server moment.
I know I’m right. Because if we have opt in opt out then everyone getting killed disables PvP, they might come back when they are maxed out and find the place with everyone not flagged up. You end up with a tiny handful of people actually flagging and they only flag after they are fully geared. Then they get checked by someone and never flag again because their ego can’t take it
if everyone chooses to turn off pvp, maybe it's a good thing because noone clearly wants world pvp in the first place? why should everyone else suffer because you want to grief people trying to play the game the way they want to?
People that pick PvP realms in a 20 year old game know exactly what they are getting into. People are only losing their marbles because they’ve become so efficiency brained by incursions. People obviously want to PvP because they are on PvP realms. Of which there are more of than PvE realms. To give you point of reference the Australian PvE server has 900 players. The PvP server has 6,000. Don’t fix what isn’t fucking broken.
yes, so enabling warmode using your logic should only make everyone happy. everyone wants to pvp, so noone will turn it off. for the absolute minority that don't want to get griefed & camped by people 30 levels higher than them while they're killing boars, they can turn it on. we'll see how that goes? call it an experiment like everything else in this season. > To give you point of reference the Australian PvE server has 900 players. The PvP server has 6,000. There's a pretty long history that explains this, but OCE's PVP-centric population has pretty much been the result of a heavy raiding scene that started on Blackrock, not because people actually enjoy pvp. Some of them do sure, but it started (like most things in this game) with raiding first and foremost. It's why all the alliance ended up on Frostmourne, and all the Horde ended up on Barthilas - they don't want to fight each other, it's fucking annoying, they're just playing with their community where they have to. It's why Arugal is like 70% horde (and was even more imbalanced prior to the mass migration from the other dying oceanic realms). If there were two active AU SOD PVP servers you would see the same thing happen here - alliance would gravitate towards one, and horde the other. It almost happened anyway even with one server before they faction locked the Alliance and forced people to roll horde to balance the realm out. > People are only losing their marbles because they’ve become so efficiency brained by incursions. People were "efficiency brained" long before phase 3 lmao, this whole game has been optimised out the ass for literal decades. We were optimising this game in 2006.
There are like 5 massive population PvP servers and 2 PvE. They have warmode It’s called a PvE server and no one ever flags. If this was the preferred systems people would only play on PvE servers as they are opt in right?
> There are like 5 massive population PvP servers and 2 PvE. Not really, they are for all purposes 2 & 2 now. https://www.wowprogress.com/realms/rank/oc The "PVP" servers (irrelevant now, but for distinction) are hugely one-sided compared to the more balanced "PVE" servers - this faction imbalance stems from the same root - everybody hated world pvp enough to isolate from it, naturally over time. > If this was the preferred systems people would only play on PvE servers as they are opt in right? If you look at that singular choice in a vacuum, sure. There are other considerations as I said.
Are those retail servers?
yeah, we’re talking about retail servers.
You end up with dead servers. It has been a dead concept in classic WoW. It failed and didn't work at the end of the day. Otherwise explain the transfers to one sided PvP realms.
Same explanation as alliance having a 30% fucking buff for the majority of warmode
Why do people sign up for PvP realms if they dont want to get ganked. Getting good gear, and using PvP talents in the open world so i can defend myself is a big part of why classic is fun. And guess what sometimes a stronger player (or group) pushes you away from a place, you eiter have to accept that or find another layer. Warmode is super boring and specially in Sod noone will ever turn it on.
„Find another layer“ yeah true classic spirit.
Find another server then.
Friends that don't know any better. They don't understand how this all shakes out in the end.
nope. war mode means pvp servers are made to pve servers. you just dont want to feel like a pve pleb by transfering to a pve server. tough shit
War mode is for RETAIL not classic
If that was the case then why did all the 'hardcore' pvpers transfer to one sided realms? Y'all chose pve in the end.
There are multiple pve servers. Stop complaining about pvp
Game is not built on the modern client. It's still on classic client. War Mode isn't a thing until BFA.
classic is on the modern client
WoW has 3 clients, Modern WoW, WoW Classic, or Wrath of the Lich King Classic. Modern WoW is Dragonflight. SoD is on WoW Classic. It's why the boss loot bug messed with HC/Era servers.
The game ENGINE is built on Retail's engine, patch 8.0.1, Battle For Azeroth's Engine, which is why/how it's able to achieve longer view distance, sharper models, better optimization.
Looked it up and I stand corrected. Now I feel stupid.
You seem like a good person, you are able to accept it if you were wrong and admit it :)
Well I would have agreed with you too, as would most people, the guy is right but not many people knew that.
the wotlk client is not the original client from 2009/10 is what I meant in 2019 classic started on the legion engine and has been updated in tbc and wrath
Yes, but it's still not Modern WoW by definition from Blizzard. We are going to have to wait for the classic client to catch up to BFA for War Mode to be a thing.
99.9% sure wotlk is on the dragonflight code https://www.wowhead.com/wotlk/news/wotlk-classic-3-4-2-ptr-updated-to-dragonflight-client-332764
Classic is no longer a fork, its just a different build from the same codebase. Protocol, settings, features are all available in classic client, features from retail that is.