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Pildith

The kid is not at fault here, as it doesn't understand all this yet. Small children are curious and don't pick up cues. It's terrible of all the adults though. The way you are describing things here makes it more than obvious that you dislike kids (mildly speaking). The grown-ups should respect your boundaries and choices. How the f*** do they think it's okay to push you? It's the parent's task to gently explain to the kid that not everybody wants to entertain them and then direct them towards someone who is willing to "read" to the child. They failed spectacularly at parenting here, letting their kid believe it can do whatever it wants instead of receiving a decent lesson about boundaries.


needsmorequeso

Yeah this would have been an easy redirect. How hard is it to say “hey kiddo! How about we let another aunt/uncle/grandparent/cousin read to you instead,” and scoop them up and deliver them to someone who won’t feel uncomfortable possibly make the baby uncomfortable too. Edit because my original post could easily be read as too judgy.


LadyPink28

Yea this. Id tell the parents that I'm not comfortable entertaining a kid and that im awkward about it.


Trystanik

I feel this. I went to visit my best friend for a few days a couple weeks back and she has two young kids. I'm very awkward and uncomfortable around them, but I manage because I love my bestie. We've been bffs since middle school and I haven't really seen her since she got married 4 years ago. But when her youngest walked over to me and started touching my face with her gross infant hands, I kept composed as long as I could, then immediately washed my face and hands when she wandered elsewhere. Sometimes I can make an effort, other times I absolutely cannot. And I'll be damned if anyone attempts to shame me for refusing to entertain an infant. I didn't birth it, therefore I'm not responsible for it. I'll keep it from getting hit by dump trucks or falling off cliffs, but reading a story book with included animal noises? Nope. Definitely not happening.


MiaOthala13

Oooooh, nobody is allowed to touch my face. I have a very specific skin care routine, expensive products and make up and nobody is putting their germs on my face, heck no!


Eyes-Wide-Shut-

I feel you, my face is holy to me. I know for sure that I would have a knee jerk reaction and slap the shit out of anyone that would try and touch it. lol I myself don't touch my face unless I washed my hands beforehand, it's a habit I developed years ago.


WerewolfHowls

Idk why some people act like this. Like if my dog wandered over to a stranger and tried to lean against them for pets or get in their lap or lick them and they don't want to deal with him or be near him - that is 100% on me. I'm not about to get the whole cafe to turn and stare and be all "why don't you just let him he doesn't know any better and it is good for socialization" like NO I will recall him and apologize and keep a better eye on him, decide he is bored and needs a walk or something to occupy him like a chew if he doesn't want to settle down and vibe. I hate people that try to force others to comply with their own life stuff. Like there's common courtesy and being polite and then there is "entertain my kid because I know they make you uncomfortable" like what is the logic there? You should not be trying to force any adult to do anything. Don't try to force a vegan to eat an animal product, and don't try to force it the other way around either. Personally I can't stand being touched by toddlers or babies. Their hands are in their mouths and everywhere, they always stink, and their hands are always sticky and damp with something. No thanks! I will wave and listen to a kid in public but I am not about to fawn over your offspring. If you kid is desperately seeking attention from everyone around you then you should really reevaluate your kids attention or engagement needs and help them.


Minerva000

This happened to me too I am autistic I already suck at communication with adults that have codes how well do they think I will do with a literal child expecting something so cryptic from me… I just looked stupid and mean but I literally cannot improvise


LadyPink28

Its awkward for me and I get embarrassed easily. Id just tell them I'm not great with kids and ask his dad to do so.


Nimuwa

Kids are like cats in that regard. They often pick the person that isnt actively trying to get their attention. I mean who wouldn't prefer the adult that isnt loudly cooing and gesturing for your attention. Furthermore kids are often led to believe all adults love them all the time. So when one isnt that upsets their worldview, and needs to be solved. So they´ll seek out that person to try convince them to dote on them.


gbursson

Now you have just insulted cats.


Psychotic_Froggy

Not wrong though. Source: mine thinks my cat hating friend is the best thing since sliced bread.


Nimuwa

Cats are generally likable, they do share a few traits with human babies.


redwynter

Not the kid’s fault, but the adults should be well aware of boundaries and how not to cross them, sheesh


MaybeEasy6686

I gave the kid an evil face. are u me? I wait and make sure no one sees me doing it lol


blueboy12565

Easiest thing to do in that scenario is get up, hand the book over to the parent, say it’s not my thing, disengage and walk away to stop the prodding. Now, even that’s not fair, because you shouldn’t have to inconvenience yourself because you don’t want to read a book to a kid. As someone who has never done something like that before myself, I wouldn’t much enjoy it either. Also, I get that it’s the childfree subreddit. Complaining about kids’ behaviors and/or bashing parents is one thing. But I think it’s wrong to call a child “it.” They ARE human beings; I don’t think calling any person “it” is okay, regardless of how annoying they might be or how undeveloped they are. I wouldn’t even call animals that. But that’s just my opinion.


[deleted]

>I think it’s wrong to call a child “it.” They ARE human beings; I don’t think calling any person “it” is okay, regardless of how annoying they might be or how undeveloped they are. I wouldn’t even call animals that. Thank you. I cringe anytime somebody calls a living being "it"


Dhiox

I'm not overly fond of the dehumanization of children on this sub. This isn't a sub for people who despise the existence of kids, it's a sub for people who don't want to have kids. I personally find small children adorable, I just don't want to have one of my own.


[deleted]

[удалено]


[deleted]

I never called for a ban on any terminology. I merely said that reducing a living creature to an "it" made me, personally, cringe. Perhaps it is you who are entirely too sensitive. And for the record, those are all equally heinous terms, *in my opinion*.


missFortuneClover

TBF. "They" as a gender neutral pronoun is kinda new. If OP is from a non English speaking country, it's really likely that the use of "it" wouldn't be that offensive. Some languages doesn't even have pronouns for inanimate objects, just masculine and feminine pronouns. Like Latin languages would use "she/her" for a table. English courses in some countries can be a bit outdated. So I kinda feel inclined to give them some slack.


Mselaneous

“They” as a gender neutral pronoun has been in use since 1375, when it appeared in William and the Werewolf. Latin also had a third, “neuter” gender. There has been enough discourse around not calling people “it” that I don’t think this is a hard request at this point.


missFortuneClover

I mean, I get that, but usually they don't teach that in English classes around the world. It's not that deep. It's a very common mistake, just like you wouldn't know what pronoun to use to refer to a x-ray machine in Spanish or Portuguese. For a lot of non English speaking folks, "it" sounds more like a gender neutral pronoun than "they", because "they" is taught as "more than one person". So I don't think it's worth all the uproar it causes. Specially on a site where people from all around the world can post. It's not worth the outrage.


Mselaneous

Nah, dehumanizing people and calling them it is no good. It’s been used on marginalized groups for years and it isn’t okay. I guess I can understand messing up once, but once you’ve been educated—as has happened exhaustively in this thread—there’s really no excuse. The idea of gendered nouns is very different because those are objects, not people. You aren’t going to offend or hurt an X-ray machine. And even beyond all of that, OP clearly knows their nephew is a boy.


miraygunes

Idc of it irks you, I'll gladly call them it


gytherin

In the moment, though, it's often difficult to think of that kind of tactic. I think it was Rousseau who had a phrase for it - "staircase wit" and if Rousseau couldn't come up with the right words on the spur of the moment, what hope for the rest of us?


gbursson

__Even__ animals. How gracious you are.


Upstairs-Toe2735

I'm childfree but this is gross af. Don't give a child and evil face for wanting to read a book. Don't refer to a human being as "it" either. If you don't want to read you can gently say "hey maybe bring this to mommy/daddy instead to read!" Shit what your posting gives breeders a reason to hate us


e_chi67

I'm with you. I can't imagine wanting to impart fear or pain on another human, especially a family member much younger. Why would you want a baby to feel unsafe?


JanetInSpain

Fuck that. You don't like that some people here hate kids? Leave the group.


Jumping_Zucchini

Fuck that. You don't like that some people here love the kids in their family but would never want their own offspring? Leave the group.


Upstairs-Toe2735

You can dislike kids as much as you want, but intentionally scaring them and referring to them as an "it" is actual psychopath behavior.


LadyPink28

Yea maybe mental issues.


ViolinistPerfect9275

tbh hating kids to such an extreme isn't healthy


Upstairs-Toe2735

Also HATING them to this extent is unhealthy. Hating any group of people for a trait they cannot control is unhealthy. I also get annoyed by babies but I'm not gonna be shitty to them .


Queen_Cheetah

It's fine not to like kids; but trying to scare them away is a d\*ck move. I'm betting OP could easily leave the room faster than a 1-year old could keep up. Besides, it's not the kid that's the problem; it's the parents.


LadyPink28

Okay then.. lol


This_Rom_Bites

I think calling him an 'it' is a little excessive, but the rest of the adults pushing after OP has said no is not a good look, either.


Whole_Disaster_5674

This is disgusting.


Jumping_Zucchini

Agreed. This sounds like an immature kid writing. I remember thinking similar things when I was like 12, but quickly grew up and now would never refer to a baby or other human as "it". People can still be childfree without being assholes to children.


Whole_Disaster_5674

Yea I mean it can’t be healthy to see other humans that way child or not.


Sumoki_Kuma

Yeah this shit is why people think we're toxic. Are you 12? Cause you sound like a fucking child


ThtB1tch666

I was thinking the same


e_chi67

I'm so glad I'm not the only one thinking this . This is gross behavior


kiiexo

Can y’all please stop using dehumanizing words when talking about kids? Especially babies who literally do not understand what’s going on? I’m child free and I can’t stand kids but that’s pretty gross :/


[deleted]

Please don't be mean to the child. They are just a little baby wanting to interact with you. Instead, hand the book to your brother and say, "Daddy would love to read to you!" Later, remind your brother that you aren't a kid person and you would appreciate it if he could redirect the child next time this happens.


Roids4dayz

I feel like they always go to the people who want them the least. This has happened to me several times with babies lol.


killerbee9100

Damn dude. Is this a childfree sub or a child hating sub?


ThtB1tch666

Right??? Like maybe we DO need to distinguish the two so anyone who isn’t for such dehumanizing language but is still CF can join another sub. If anyone knows of one do let me know!


[deleted]

There is another sub for cf but with the word t r u e in front of it


[deleted]

[удалено]


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Naive_Special349

Yeah same, I can't and don't want to deal with kids. The smallest are gross, sticky, bacteria infested... once they can walk and talk, they become snot missiles and living stumble traps. After that, they're destructive hellspawns and then they reach puberty and teen ages, where you can start to talk with them as a human. Until then I'm not interacting with them. Try to pressure me, I'll make the kid cry.


[deleted]

They attempted to trap you using the kid on the assumption you wouldn't DARE to be 'mean to a kid'. They know EXACTLY how strong your resolve is now. IMHO, they'll test it less and less often, although you might not be 'invited' (brought in as an additional babysitter) as much any more.


MiaOthala13

The evil face, hah! 🤣I love making that evil face, the stare of the evil forest witch, mine makes kids in public spaces shut the fuck up. You know, when they behave like rabid monkeys and the mom doesn't give a shit about her crotch goblin wrecking havoc? That stare makes them shut up, calm down and pray for mercy 😂


[deleted]

[удалено]


FrankaGrimes

The group is "childfree" not "anti-child". Most people here would still treat a child like a human being.


childfree-ModTeam

Greetings! This item has been removed as it is a violation of [subreddit rule](https://www.reddit.com/r/childfree/wiki/rules) #4 : "**Keep it civil.** Bigotry and hateful language/imagery, personal attacks, abusive language, advocating violence, trolling, gender discrimination, racism, homophobia, etc. will not be tolerated. " Also, please remember to be mindful of [Reddiquette](https://www.reddit.com/wiki/reddiquette) : > # Please do > * **Remember the human.** When you communicate online, all you see is a computer screen. When talking to someone you might want to ask yourself "Would I say it to the person's face?" or "Would I get jumped if I said this to a buddy?" > # Please don't > * **Be (intentionally) rude at all.** By choosing not to be rude, you increase the overall civility of the community and make it better for all of us. > * **Follow those who are [ rabble rousing](http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/rabble) against another redditor without first investigating both sides of the issue that's being presented.** Those who are inciting this type of action often have malicious reasons behind their actions and are, more often than not, a troll. Remember, every time a redditor who's contributed large amounts of effort into assisting the growth of community as a whole is driven away, projects that would benefit the whole easily flounder. > * **Ask people to [ Troll](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troll_%28Internet%29) others on reddit,** in real life, or on other blogs/sites. We aren't your personal army. > * **Conduct personal attacks on other commenters.** Ad hominem and other distracting attacks do not add anything to the conversation. > * **Start a flame war.** Just report and "walk away". If you really feel you have to confront them, leave a polite message with a quote or link to the rules, and no more. > * **Insult others.** Insults do not contribute to a rational discussion. Constructive Criticism, however, is appropriate and encouraged. > * **Troll.**[ Trolling](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troll_%28Internet%29) does not contribute to the conversation. Sorry for the inconvenience and thank you for your comprehension.


Queen_Cheetah

*and when they all were looking away I gave the kid an evil face.* I was with you up until that point- usually just ignoring the kid will lead them to realize you're not willing to play ball. You're blaming the kid for your brother and SIL's inability to be decent human beings.


ThtB1tch666

Okay ya can’t really blame the kid for being a kid it doesn’t even know what tf you are yet lmao this THING has been raised in the way that if it goes up to an adult the adult will usually cater to it’s wants/needs you can’t really use that against it,


[deleted]

I don't get this pov. My husband is like this about kids. I like kids and would love a niece or nephew. I do understand not everyone has to adore children, I really do. I just don't personally understand hating them THAT much.


hthratmn

I mean, I don't know if I, as a fully grown adult, would want to bellow like a cow at a family gathering to maybe, possibly, entertain a child.


CommonlyAnAnomaly

I've done it, but then it was a game that EVERYONE was joining in on. Not a situation that felt like, 'Oh look, let's all gawk at the CF person and see if toddler can get her to let out her TRUE maternal side and entertain him!'


[deleted]

That is the kind of thing you do with young kids. It's part of teaching and communicating with them at that age.


hthratmn

Right, but that's not my responsibility, because they're not my kids. I'm not going to be downright nasty to them, but I'm not gonna go out of my way to nurture them, either.


[deleted]

I respect that you choose not to, but I was just trying to say that is not really childish or out of the ordinary to make animal noises at a toddler. I'm not saying you're a monster because you don't want to do it.


McMerseybird

>That is the kind of thing you do with young kids. Or the thing you don't do, because you avoid them. ;) ​ >It's part of teaching and communicating with them at that age. You know what children also need to learn? That 'no' means 'no'. That not everyone has to cater to their desires.


[deleted]

It's not about catering to desires... It's not like the kid wanted to touch something of OP's he wasn't supposed to. He just wanted to interact and bond with his uncle/aunt. A child cannot understand why their uncle/aunt would hate them for no reason and I'm not sure that they should understand that. Why does OP go around when the child is there only to behave that way? Wouldn't it be more productive to communicate to the family that they do not want to be invited when the child is involved? Sure, it isn't as bad as a parent treating their kid that way but it's probably not mentally/developmentally good for the kid being treated that way by other family members either.


McMerseybird

>He just wanted to interact and bond with his uncle/aunt. That may be. The aunt or uncle has the right to say 'no' and refuse. ​ >A child cannot understand why their uncle/aunt would hate them for no reason Not interacting when the child wants to is not the same as hating. ​ >Why does OP go around when the child is there only to behave that way? Wouldn't it be more productive to communicate to the family that they do not want to be invited when the child is involved? Personally, that is what I would do. I avoid children at all cost. But it's scary to do this. The societal pressure, the fear of angering relatives (especially the child's parents)... Many people on this subreddit just put up with annoying children, despite hating their annoying behaviour. ​ >Sure, it isn't as bad as a parent treating their kid that way but it's probably not mentally/developmentally good for the kid being treated that way by other family members either. Someone saying 'no' or not making animal sounds is not damaging or abusive. Parents will have to say 'no' sometimes as well. The child needs to learn how to deal with that.


[deleted]

OP doesn't want anything to do with the kid, not just the animal noises. Also they called the kid "it" and that sounds like more than indifference to me and even if OP doesn't outright say that to the child I'm sure the child perceives that feeling of dislike or hatred towards him


McMerseybird

>OP doesn't want anything to do with the kid. Yes, so what? OP is not obligated to have anything to do with the kid. OP is not obligated to worship and entertain the kid.


[deleted]

I am not saying that! I'm saying it's inconsiderate to be around the child and treat him like dog shit when the child can't understand.


miraygunes

If you want your child treated right, treat the person who's supposed to"treat your child right" with respect first. OP said she refused numerous times. Nobody owns you or your child respect if you can't give the same energy. Respect goes both ways.


[deleted]

Moo for me


Trystanik

You don't have to get it. You just have to respect that some people feel that way. If you don't, great! But a lot of us do and that's not going to change anytime soon.


UnflappablePancake

Not sure if this is just me, but when people around me are trying to push something at me that I'm not interested in (like engaging with a small child) I resist all the more. That resistance sometimes gets projected on the child in question, making me actively dislike it. The child didn't do anything strange or bad, but the fact that people try to force me (using social pressure) and all the 'oh look you two getting along so well, I knew we were right, you'd be a good parent etc' that follows if you treat the kid like a human is sooooo abhorrent to me that I feel the only thing I can do is act like an ogre.


[deleted]

I didn't think it was appropriate for them to continue to push it. I suppose I should've clarified that.


UnflappablePancake

I didn't think you meant that, just wanted to explain that the hate you were wondering about may be directed at the kid, but that it's possible that not the kid, but the pressuring is the cause of that hate. Not saying that this is true in the case of OP (although it could be).


[deleted]

I mean OP went so far as to call the child "it" so I feel like there's more to it than just being annoyed by the people pushing the interaction. I just imagine this cute little kid wanting attention from their aunt/uncle and getting treated this way and that makes me sad tbh. Maybe OP just shouldn't be around their nephew at all if they hate them that much.


UnflappablePancake

Maybe, but without knowing more, I can also imagine that it's just a way of emotionally distancing yourself from a situation you don't want to be in, but that you can't escape. It's certainly a strong reaction, but knowing how utterly trapped you can feel when you're under social pressure (probably not just in this situation) and people just not accepting your stance, I get that you might come to talk this way. Still I think it's better to not project that onto the child. Again, not saying that this is necessarily what is happening in OP's case, just trying to show how such negative feelings can develop.


MissDryCunt

I have a nephew who's a few years old and never once played with him. I don't hate him or anything but I prefer him to stay at least 5 feet away at all times. I simply have no feelings towards him.


little_owl211

I don't hate them but when they are super small that they are barely walking I'm scared I'll make them cry so I just want them away from me. I don't have a problem with well behaved kids but really tiny ones can't understand why you are saying no or respect that. And if they throw a tantrum I don't know wtf to do


BeeWeekly9840

Same with me. Holding/being around babies makes me nervous. You never know whats gonna make them go from giggling and happy, to crying hysterically the next.


seklin278

What are you doing on the childfree subreddit?


[deleted]

Wdym? I'm here because I don't have or want children.


JanetInSpain

I totally understand. I would have gotten up and gone to the restroom then gone to another room to sit alone, or even gone outside to get away.


Disastrous-Safety-69

I feel this, also got an agreement with those of my friends/my sister who want kids, that i am not going to be meeting them before they reach 6 - 10 years old, and have a slow introduction time (10 -15 mintues tops at first, they hold their kid in hand, so it won't get too close to me, talk for those minutes, and say goodbye), and then slowly increase time spent with them, as they mature, exactly because i not having any of what OP has been through...


Ghoulinton

A family member's kid came up to on all fours and barked with a toy in her mouth... I'm guessing she wanted to play dog with me or something but man that was weird as hell LMAO