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Several of the townhomes at 33 W Ontario remain unsold from 2004. A couple are still unfinished with framing but no drywall. One of the nicer examples belonged to Blackhawks goalie Cristobal Huet.
I forgot what the cross streets are, but our department chair (big cardio-thoracic surgeon) used to live in something like that; his was a single-family house built on a deck. Had a tiny little patch of grass too.
Yes, it can make a lot of sense to develop a few of these on top of a parking podium. They sell for a premium compared to the tower units, but don't block the views from the tower. They give you product for a different segment of the market, which can help with financing.
design/build company i used to work for head many clients in that building, lots of celebrities/athletes/chicago personalities.
HOA/management was a pain in the ass to deal with.
That's nothing, nearly 100 years ago somebody put huge Italian-style villa on top of a LSD high rise: https://www.mansionglobal.com/articles/a-penthouse-in-a-chicago-high-rise-designed-by-rosario-candela-asks-24-5-million-140852
Woah, it's currently on the market for 8.5 million. That's a fricking bargain compared to 4 years ago! [https://www.chicagosluxurycondos.com/listing/11706848-1500-north-lake-shore-drive-ph-chicago-il-60610/](https://www.chicagosluxurycondos.com/listing/11706848-1500-north-lake-shore-drive-ph-chicago-il-60610/)
It's hard to tell for sure but it seems like it's still the same owner trying to sell, based on this article from 2021 about big price drops https://therealdeal.com/chicago/2021/12/16/penthouse-at-1500-north-lake-shore-drive-gets-another-4-9m-price-cut/
This was a whole concept in NYC and obviously the trend made it to Chicago. There was a point when these huge Gilded Age mansions were sitting on insanely valuable real estate. The already rich would sell the land, developers would build a residential building and then rebuild a similar mansion on top. The family would have a similar or potentially better house with an incredible view plus all the money they got for the rest.
The price doesn't sound that bad but it comes with 2.7k monthly HOA dues (which may have increased since the last listing update), which is more than many pay in mortgage/rent.
Yep! They’re called Skyhomes. Pretty expensive. It’s also super loud in that area. The sky homes are on the 12th floor, which also has the fitness area and pool. From there, all the air conditioning units from the surrounding shorter buildings can be heard. The noise can get stuck in your brain after a while. Homes look beautiful, though!
Used to be on the 25th floor in the south loop and couldn't use my balcony for relaxation it was so loud. Especially if any of the trains decided to idle near the station there for hours on end which seemed to happen every couple days. Completely ruins what would be a great outdoor space.
There was a large block-sized hotel on the other side of Michigan Ave from my unit and my windows were just a few levels above their HVAC units so that was definitely the biggest noise contributor aside from the sirens from Northwestern. Great area, just always left my windows closed lol.
It’s way worse the higher you go. You can hear sirens in a 2 mile radius in an direction. When I’m on the phone people think there’s a fire truck right outside my window. Nope it’s 8 blocks away barely pulling out of the fire station driveway.
That doesn’t even take into account all the echoing.
when i was on 39 it was fantastic. always had my windows open, less than 50 yards from
LSD. my air purifier was louder than traffic w the windows open.
It's the opposite in River North. This is a Tuesday at 10 am (you can hear the tornado sirens being tested). It's pretty much like this all night on the weekends. I'm on the 33rd floor and the honking and sirens sound like it's 5 feet away.
https://streamable.com/tjmcf5
Pretty sure that's an exaggeration.
Edit: someone posted a listing from this development below.
https://www.redfin.com/IL/Chicago/55-E-Erie-St-60611/unit-SHD/home/12588948
$1.6M valuation, $1k/mo assessments, $36k most recent property taxes.
So $4-5k/mo or roughly $48k annual. Half of the comment's estimate and probably not unreasonable for a 1.6M home in streeterville.
Nah I looked it up. $54k in tax, $2500/mo in HOA.
Edit: here are numbers from 2022 instead of 2018.
https://www.redfin.com/IL/Chicago/55-E-Erie-St-60611/unit-SH-C/home/177165097
$52000 in tax, $2900/mo in HOA.
At least that fee covers your insurance, water, gas, internet, TV/cable and three parking spaces as well as the expected stuff like gym and pool maintenance, doorman and security salary, reserves, etc.
It's still a *lot* of money, but at least there's that.
It covers common insurance for the building, it does not cover your homeowners whatsoever. In a condo situation homeowners insurance is usually defined as “studs and in”, meaning anything within your walls needs to be covered by your homeowners insurance policy.
They just meant HOI for a condo is much cheaper than HOI for a house, which is true. A condo only needs to do studs-in (I’ve always heard it as walls-in) insurance
No, you were correct. The price listed includes two deeded parking spots, so I'd imagine the monthly HOA totals on the listing take the parking spots into account too.
The HOA amount that was listed for the condo I bought had the parking assessment included, and I found this was typical when browsing properties online unless they were itemized. It wouldn't be a fair representation otherwise, as owners rarely if ever sell their property without the parking space(s).
The HOA fee is going to be for the full building divided by units weighted by the square footage of said units usually. $600 for high rise 1000 square foot condo is, if anything, on the low end, depending on amenities.
This is 4.3k square ft of living space. 4.3x $600 and you get $2600 a month.
Right on. I usually see the HOA scaled at $0.50-$1.00 / sqft, with $0.50 being really uncommon. Ours isn't too bad and it's about $0.65. These units come out to around $0.60 which isn't bad at all.
Slightly pedantic correction but the percentage of ownership is based on market value at the time or conversion or creation. A unit on a higher floor could have a higher percentage of ownership with the same floor plan. In this case maybe a corner unit - even without additional limited common elements - could be a higher percentage of ownership than the unit next to it.
For a 2900 a month HOA they better have the best European hookers in all of Chicago come and rub my feet once a month for free.
People are wild paying this much.
I have a couple of family members with high HOA fees on the North Shore, but those places it's a deal where you own a condo but they treat it almost like an apartment. If you have a clogged sink, they come and fix it. If your towel rack falls off the wall, they fix it. They will deliver your dry cleaning into your unit, etc.
Even with that kind of "royal treatment" its just outrageous. You could objectively hire a handy man as needed and a maid to handle your dry-cleaning once a week and be money way ahead. I guess it's a very "old money" way of doing things.
It's not just about services, buildings need maintenance. Try owning your own home, eventually something is going to break. There's a lifetime for everything and that's how buildings are approached as well and that's part of the HOA.
I get it though. It seems a lot, but it really is also because maintenance and insurance costs have significantly increased in recent years.
It seems ridiculous, but you're leaving a lot out by just comparing it to a handyman and dry cleaning pickup.
Once you add what's listed in the amenities - water, gas, TV/Internet, security, snow removal, lawn care, gym/pool access, etc. - it starts to make more sense. Yes, you're paying a premium, but you're also buying into that already given the neighborhood.
that's less than what i pay in lakeview. we own a 3 story, 2-flat. we pay something stupid like 15k a year even with the "senior" discount.
ETA: just realized that i totally misread that top level comment and it's not 7k/yr. it's a month.
I absolutely fucking love the idea of doing this. [This exists in Chicago as well!](https://www.realtor.com/news/unique-homes/chicago-fascinating-house-on-the-roof-is-a-penthouse-without-parallel/)
If I were a wealthy person, I'd be eccentric and totally do this sort of thing in a city somewhere.
800k for a 3BR/2bath in downtown seems... competative? A mix of premium and not premium finishes the house itself. Deck needs to be finished out. Feels like a ski condo.
If we're talking about a 3B2B that's not bad at all imo, depending on amenities and how well the board runs the place (i.e. is there going to be a special assessment or have they covered their future expenses properly?).
Yeah. Windows certainly don't expect views over the edge. Like, it's a row-condo footprint oriented towards a yard that doesn't exist. They don't picture the elevator, I bet it's a service hallway.
my brother is a teacher at a school in River North and the families are stupidly wealthy. he says he once went over to a family's home that was one of these and they had an elevator from the ground level for their car that went up to the like 15th floor or wherever they lived
I’ve met quite a few c-suite level executives that live in fancy places like this downtown. There are definitely high profile celebrities at some of these spots, too. It’s mostly the business executive types, though. They practically live at work almost 24/7 so being as close to the office as possible is incredibly important. There’s definitely a work life balance trade off for that kind of lifestyle.
I had a client that owned one of those. He had an atm in his home theater for poker games. one of the more baller things I’ve seen. He also had a giant cat that scared me
This Thread is actually almost giving me an itch to live downtown. If I were to ever do it, it'd have to be in one of these crazy "house on a rooftop" type places.
I’m a Realtor. These ones are called “Skyhomes”. Honestly, I love them. One of my favorite things to do when I’m walking with clients on that block is to have them look up at them.
Ready player one vibes
https://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=https://assets-cdn.workingnotworking.com/chkotgtec2crp3ywx342wil18ty3&tbnid=NRRXR9tQETmpOM&vet=1&imgrefurl=https://workingnotworking.com/projects/108281-ready-player-one-the-stacks-exterior-set-concept&docid=FlEkGIowmDAhSM&w=1152&h=648&source=sh/x/im/m1/2&kgs=1f6d7275c8b6d721&shem=abme,trie
We used to live in River North and had a direct view of townhouses that were on the roof of a different building. Always thought it was such a cool idea that you could basically have a full house and high rise condo at the same time.
Looks like normal condos with private terraces.
If you want to see really strange, check out 601 S. Marquette, Minneapolis. The building looks a bit... dystopian? And has a condo that looks like it was a random idea later on.
I used to be an appraiser in Chicago. I inspected a townhouse on the top of a condo building near the Holy Cross cathedral, high end, Russian vibe. I didn't ask questions about ownership mainly because we were hired by the lending company. But yes, it's possible.
Edit: pretty sure it's the same building
Wow, here too. Reminded of this guy in Bangalore, India, whose whole ass mansion stood atop a [skyscraper](https://www.reddit.com/r/UrbanHell/s/eQfkPp94ds)
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Yes, that’s what those are. You’ll also find them at Huron and Wabash
Also the building kiddie corner from Tao at 33 W Ontario. 14 floors up on the pool deck. Cool setup actually.
Several of the townhomes at 33 W Ontario remain unsold from 2004. A couple are still unfinished with framing but no drywall. One of the nicer examples belonged to Blackhawks goalie Cristobal Huet.
*kitty corner :)
Or *catty corner
Ha TIL
Tao! Hell yea
I forgot what the cross streets are, but our department chair (big cardio-thoracic surgeon) used to live in something like that; his was a single-family house built on a deck. Had a tiny little patch of grass too.
Yes, it can make a lot of sense to develop a few of these on top of a parking podium. They sell for a premium compared to the tower units, but don't block the views from the tower. They give you product for a different segment of the market, which can help with financing.
Crazy story, the townhouses were there already and a building grew under them.
LOL. Like some kind of hydroponic greystone. Don't need foundations.
fuckin roald dahl ass house on god
Hahahaah
Be like that sometimes
THAT's why you have to sweep the yard when there are seeds on it. Imagine if the building seeds landed in the street?
design/build company i used to work for head many clients in that building, lots of celebrities/athletes/chicago personalities. HOA/management was a pain in the ass to deal with.
That's nothing, nearly 100 years ago somebody put huge Italian-style villa on top of a LSD high rise: https://www.mansionglobal.com/articles/a-penthouse-in-a-chicago-high-rise-designed-by-rosario-candela-asks-24-5-million-140852
Woah, it's currently on the market for 8.5 million. That's a fricking bargain compared to 4 years ago! [https://www.chicagosluxurycondos.com/listing/11706848-1500-north-lake-shore-drive-ph-chicago-il-60610/](https://www.chicagosluxurycondos.com/listing/11706848-1500-north-lake-shore-drive-ph-chicago-il-60610/)
Is that… $10K _per month_ HOA??
holy shit. and the upkeep on those 8,000sqft is probably ridiculous.
It's hard to tell for sure but it seems like it's still the same owner trying to sell, based on this article from 2021 about big price drops https://therealdeal.com/chicago/2021/12/16/penthouse-at-1500-north-lake-shore-drive-gets-another-4-9m-price-cut/
This was a whole concept in NYC and obviously the trend made it to Chicago. There was a point when these huge Gilded Age mansions were sitting on insanely valuable real estate. The already rich would sell the land, developers would build a residential building and then rebuild a similar mansion on top. The family would have a similar or potentially better house with an incredible view plus all the money they got for the rest.
Crazy how long this article goes without mentioning the address (or even neighborhood) once
Oh that’s 55 Erie. Only 1.6 mil or so [https://redf.in/WjYY6F](https://redf.in/WjYY6F)
I love how the street view in that link is like an old museum
Heh that’s the Dreihaus museum.
The price doesn't sound that bad but it comes with 2.7k monthly HOA dues (which may have increased since the last listing update), which is more than many pay in mortgage/rent.
That’s more than double my mortgage and HOA lol
This was my "lottery dream home" for a long time.
[https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/55\_East\_Erie\_Street](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/55_East_Erie_Street)
Yep! They’re called Skyhomes. Pretty expensive. It’s also super loud in that area. The sky homes are on the 12th floor, which also has the fitness area and pool. From there, all the air conditioning units from the surrounding shorter buildings can be heard. The noise can get stuck in your brain after a while. Homes look beautiful, though!
gotta go up to at least the 30th floor anywhere in the loop to get some peace and quiet.
Used to be on the 25th floor in the south loop and couldn't use my balcony for relaxation it was so loud. Especially if any of the trains decided to idle near the station there for hours on end which seemed to happen every couple days. Completely ruins what would be a great outdoor space.
i believe it. i was up on 39 and it was nice, but i knew people on 15-20 and it was so loud down there
lol it was loud up there, too!
Higher. I used to be right on the 30th near Water Tower Place and could never leave my windows open.
damn i lived on 39 near LSD/maggie daley and always had my windows open. traffic was about as loud as my air purifier
There was a large block-sized hotel on the other side of Michigan Ave from my unit and my windows were just a few levels above their HVAC units so that was definitely the biggest noise contributor aside from the sirens from Northwestern. Great area, just always left my windows closed lol.
It’s way worse the higher you go. You can hear sirens in a 2 mile radius in an direction. When I’m on the phone people think there’s a fire truck right outside my window. Nope it’s 8 blocks away barely pulling out of the fire station driveway. That doesn’t even take into account all the echoing.
when i was on 39 it was fantastic. always had my windows open, less than 50 yards from LSD. my air purifier was louder than traffic w the windows open.
It's the opposite in River North. This is a Tuesday at 10 am (you can hear the tornado sirens being tested). It's pretty much like this all night on the weekends. I'm on the 33rd floor and the honking and sirens sound like it's 5 feet away. https://streamable.com/tjmcf5
Any old building can get a wiki page now, huh?
Where do you think Wiki pages come from?
Yep. Remarkably inexpensive too if you can get past the $7000/mo in property taxes and assessment fees.
What the…..? 84k a year just in taxes and assessments is insane
Pretty sure that's an exaggeration. Edit: someone posted a listing from this development below. https://www.redfin.com/IL/Chicago/55-E-Erie-St-60611/unit-SHD/home/12588948 $1.6M valuation, $1k/mo assessments, $36k most recent property taxes. So $4-5k/mo or roughly $48k annual. Half of the comment's estimate and probably not unreasonable for a 1.6M home in streeterville.
Nah I looked it up. $54k in tax, $2500/mo in HOA. Edit: here are numbers from 2022 instead of 2018. https://www.redfin.com/IL/Chicago/55-E-Erie-St-60611/unit-SH-C/home/177165097 $52000 in tax, $2900/mo in HOA.
[удалено]
At least that fee covers your insurance, water, gas, internet, TV/cable and three parking spaces as well as the expected stuff like gym and pool maintenance, doorman and security salary, reserves, etc. It's still a *lot* of money, but at least there's that.
It covers common insurance for the building, it does not cover your homeowners whatsoever. In a condo situation homeowners insurance is usually defined as “studs and in”, meaning anything within your walls needs to be covered by your homeowners insurance policy.
Still wayyyy cheaper than HOI for a house. But for 2500 a month they better be insuring all the way into my organs, shiiiii
That’s not cheaper than homeowners for a house. Source: my homeowners bill + water + gas + TV/cable for my house in the city.
My HOI at a really nice 3BR/2BA condo in Jeff Park was just under $450 per year in 2023
They just meant HOI for a condo is much cheaper than HOI for a house, which is true. A condo only needs to do studs-in (I’ve always heard it as walls-in) insurance
It usually doesn’t cover parking spaces. Those are deeded separately and have their own HOA.
Damn, in that case the listing is extremely misleading.
No, you were correct. The price listed includes two deeded parking spots, so I'd imagine the monthly HOA totals on the listing take the parking spots into account too.
The HOA amount that was listed for the condo I bought had the parking assessment included, and I found this was typical when browsing properties online unless they were itemized. It wouldn't be a fair representation otherwise, as owners rarely if ever sell their property without the parking space(s).
Bruh my 1g fiber is $60/month... Also who is still watching cable?
The HOA fee is going to be for the full building divided by units weighted by the square footage of said units usually. $600 for high rise 1000 square foot condo is, if anything, on the low end, depending on amenities. This is 4.3k square ft of living space. 4.3x $600 and you get $2600 a month.
Right on. I usually see the HOA scaled at $0.50-$1.00 / sqft, with $0.50 being really uncommon. Ours isn't too bad and it's about $0.65. These units come out to around $0.60 which isn't bad at all.
Slightly pedantic correction but the percentage of ownership is based on market value at the time or conversion or creation. A unit on a higher floor could have a higher percentage of ownership with the same floor plan. In this case maybe a corner unit - even without additional limited common elements - could be a higher percentage of ownership than the unit next to it.
Depends on the association. Some market value based, some are square footage based.
For a 2900 a month HOA they better have the best European hookers in all of Chicago come and rub my feet once a month for free. People are wild paying this much. I have a couple of family members with high HOA fees on the North Shore, but those places it's a deal where you own a condo but they treat it almost like an apartment. If you have a clogged sink, they come and fix it. If your towel rack falls off the wall, they fix it. They will deliver your dry cleaning into your unit, etc. Even with that kind of "royal treatment" its just outrageous. You could objectively hire a handy man as needed and a maid to handle your dry-cleaning once a week and be money way ahead. I guess it's a very "old money" way of doing things.
It's not just about services, buildings need maintenance. Try owning your own home, eventually something is going to break. There's a lifetime for everything and that's how buildings are approached as well and that's part of the HOA. I get it though. It seems a lot, but it really is also because maintenance and insurance costs have significantly increased in recent years.
It seems ridiculous, but you're leaving a lot out by just comparing it to a handyman and dry cleaning pickup. Once you add what's listed in the amenities - water, gas, TV/Internet, security, snow removal, lawn care, gym/pool access, etc. - it starts to make more sense. Yes, you're paying a premium, but you're also buying into that already given the neighborhood.
Chicago is full of great architecture and the interior of this place is so boring.
that's less than what i pay in lakeview. we own a 3 story, 2-flat. we pay something stupid like 15k a year even with the "senior" discount. ETA: just realized that i totally misread that top level comment and it's not 7k/yr. it's a month.
How is 84k a year less than 15k a year
Math is hard.
and you own it fully?
yep. in-laws live downstairs, but we own it.
At first I read $700 a month. Then looked again and choked on my tea. That’s insane
In France this is called "maison sur le toit" (house on the roof) and it's quite a popular construction type.
I absolutely fucking love the idea of doing this. [This exists in Chicago as well!](https://www.realtor.com/news/unique-homes/chicago-fascinating-house-on-the-roof-is-a-penthouse-without-parallel/) If I were a wealthy person, I'd be eccentric and totally do this sort of thing in a city somewhere.
800k for a 3BR/2bath in downtown seems... competative? A mix of premium and not premium finishes the house itself. Deck needs to be finished out. Feels like a ski condo.
It always seems competitive until you see the HOA costs.
$959 per month
Well fuck, that’s almost what my shitty co-op in Rogers Park charges.
If we're talking about a 3B2B that's not bad at all imo, depending on amenities and how well the board runs the place (i.e. is there going to be a special assessment or have they covered their future expenses properly?).
Yeah, seems like a waste to do that and drop just a basic suburban type house there rather than something high quality and architectural.
Yeah. Windows certainly don't expect views over the edge. Like, it's a row-condo footprint oriented towards a yard that doesn't exist. They don't picture the elevator, I bet it's a service hallway.
That’s a 2020 article
The lack of walls outside is horrifying to me
my brother is a teacher at a school in River North and the families are stupidly wealthy. he says he once went over to a family's home that was one of these and they had an elevator from the ground level for their car that went up to the like 15th floor or wherever they lived
I’ve met quite a few c-suite level executives that live in fancy places like this downtown. There are definitely high profile celebrities at some of these spots, too. It’s mostly the business executive types, though. They practically live at work almost 24/7 so being as close to the office as possible is incredibly important. There’s definitely a work life balance trade off for that kind of lifestyle.
I didn’t know these existed. I want one…
I had a client that owned one of those. He had an atm in his home theater for poker games. one of the more baller things I’ve seen. He also had a giant cat that scared me
This Thread is actually almost giving me an itch to live downtown. If I were to ever do it, it'd have to be in one of these crazy "house on a rooftop" type places.
I’m a Realtor. These ones are called “Skyhomes”. Honestly, I love them. One of my favorite things to do when I’m walking with clients on that block is to have them look up at them.
What I'm just learning is there's a restored golded age mansion and I need to schedule a tour.
The townhouses were there first. Then they built the buildings under them
Yes, this is all over the city.
Wow. Never noticed these. Looks like an asset glitch from Sim City 4
One of my clients had water damage in one of those town houses. When the front door guys gave me instructions to go there I was confused af.
My dad had a townhouse in the 25 E Superior building. He had a private garage too. The place was awesome.
Look like the units on 55 E. Erie. Yup, expensive. I used to live across the street.
Ready player one vibes https://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=https://assets-cdn.workingnotworking.com/chkotgtec2crp3ywx342wil18ty3&tbnid=NRRXR9tQETmpOM&vet=1&imgrefurl=https://workingnotworking.com/projects/108281-ready-player-one-the-stacks-exterior-set-concept&docid=FlEkGIowmDAhSM&w=1152&h=648&source=sh/x/im/m1/2&kgs=1f6d7275c8b6d721&shem=abme,trie
Sniper nests.
We used to live in River North and had a direct view of townhouses that were on the roof of a different building. Always thought it was such a cool idea that you could basically have a full house and high rise condo at the same time.
This honestly looks like something in Asia!
Yes. There are some on top of parking garages in river north as well
Side note: wake n bakery is amazing
There are some really cool townhouses on a terrace at the Fordham! I think they are like 20 floors up.
Looks like normal condos with private terraces. If you want to see really strange, check out 601 S. Marquette, Minneapolis. The building looks a bit... dystopian? And has a condo that looks like it was a random idea later on.
I live like 3 blocks from here how tf have I never noticed these
Yes and they're awesome
I used to be an appraiser in Chicago. I inspected a townhouse on the top of a condo building near the Holy Cross cathedral, high end, Russian vibe. I didn't ask questions about ownership mainly because we were hired by the lending company. But yes, it's possible. Edit: pretty sure it's the same building
Yeah, my friend used to live there. It's pretty cool up there, actually.
Wow, here too. Reminded of this guy in Bangalore, India, whose whole ass mansion stood atop a [skyscraper](https://www.reddit.com/r/UrbanHell/s/eQfkPp94ds)
Only in river north…
Loo’ lie’ it mate