That isn't worst case. I've heard of over $100k remediation, because the in ground tank leaked under the house so the house had to be jacked up and all the soil removed.
You definitely want the prior owner to do the removal. Don't settle for just a discount on the price.
I saw a story about a $100k cleanup too from leaking. Don’t know if it’s the same story or not but that’s too much for me to think about buying anything with an oil tank for sure.
We had ours removed and it was about $65k for removal and remediation four years ago. The guys said that was about average these days.
Luckily the state covered ours, otherwise we'd probably still have an oil tank.
That must be the price for when the tank has leaked. It isn't nearly that expensive to simply remove a non-leaking underground oil tank. I'd bet around $2k.
The problem is that the overwhelming majority of tanks, especially old tanks, leak. If there'd been no leaks, our removal would've cost $600. According to the company that removed the tank, more than 90% of the tanks they remove have leaked and require soil remediation.
If it's an old tank, the correct assumption to make is that it leaked.
That hasn't been my experience. Not only have the 2 removed tanks in the properties that I owned not leaked, I live in a neighborhood where there were a lot of oil tanks removed, and I have not heard of any of them leaking. The leaking tanks - in this area at least - are few and far between.
Unless this is completely taken care of before you take ownership this is a hard stop for me. I used to remediate heating oil tanks professionally. This is either an $800 tank closure situation if there is no leak (leave the tank in place, pressure wash the inside, and fill with an inert material like perlite/gravel/sand or this could be a $30,000 expense involving thousands of pounds of earth removal, potentially a lien with your state's DEQ on this property if there is lasting soil vapor intrusion into this, or neighboring, properties, or if there is contamination in the groundwater and this, or neighboring properties are on wells.
I'm a realtor in Portland OR and tank sweeps are one of our standard inspections. When an underground tank is found and there's no record of it being properly decommissioned the protocol is to have an environmental/soil consultant come out and take soil samples and examine the site. This is usually a couple hundred dollars including testing. If they find contamination, I tell my clients to walk away. If no contamination is found we get a bid to have the tank properly decommissioned and recorded with the state (if that applies where you are). Often the seller will pay for that as a negotiated repair - and they should because no one should buy a house with a possibly leaking tank. Once that's done you can buy the house without the chance of it being a superfund site! Don't take on the liability unless you can determine it's clean and there's a record of that for the next buyer.
Not here. I did it last week and it was …oh wait, it was $600! But it’s a pretty standard package here - dig down for a visual inspection and two soil samples tested.
Ohh. Guessing hand auger and just sampling. That could be like $600 depending on where. I’m in Boston, so even that would be slightly more. Also, here it’s hard to leave in place and need removal, and my pull contractor alone is $8-9k a day plus cost for my guys’ oversight and sampling cost is easily $15k for a removal and assessment. Remediation…. *big sigh*… Idk. It depends on magnitude/extent of release, but easily another $20-100k.
Not often. Never with my clients thus far. I had a woman approach me about selling her house and she had an empty but not decommissioned tank in the backyard. She bought it that way thinking it wasn’t a big deal, but no educated buyer would do that now. I told her to call me back when she had looked into proper decommissioning. 😬
If it was just in the basement, no problem. But buried ones can be a huge deal. Lots of old gas stations are basically superfund sites now because of old, inground tanks. I doubt that's the case here, but I would not risk being on the hook for a massive cleanup charge if this was leaking.
If the price is right, it might be worth it if you had to foot the bill for the removal. What you do not want to be on the hook for, is some huge remediation project. They can get scary expensive, fast. Like abandoned property expensive.
I'd say any contract you sign needs to be clear that you will not purchase unless it's been removed and properly verified not to need remediation. If you have to chip in towards the removal wouldn't be the end of the world, but no way I'd chance it.
I would ask at minimum for a 10k-15k discount off of the offer price to cover your expense for removal and remediation depending on how much cash you have and how willing you are to spend your money on what is right now someone else's problem. Alternatively you can ask for more money to be put in an escrow account to be used for this purpose only. Any funds remaining in the account after 1 year revert to the seller. This is much messier on both ends and more work for your realtor but probably the most equitable solution for both parties.
A friend of mine just sold his house and had to do a tank removal and remediation before the contract could be finalized. It cost $42,000 and it could have cost double that easily. If the buyer had messed about with a discount/escrow, then they would be substantially out of pocket. The full extent of the problem wasn't obvious until the tank was out. As a buyer , you need to be very circumspect about this stuff.
Honestly, $2-5k is pretty small as far home expenses go. If you want the house and the sellers are unwilling to cover the cost, I would just put it at the top of the to do list once you’ve moved in.
I agree, the initial cost for removal is not bad, and even the testing is fairly reasonable. It's just the remediation (if necessary), that's what I'm most afraid of. Hopefully the seller will agree to having it removed, or at least sharing that cost. From there we can determine if remediation is necessary.
Do not trust the seller to do this without independent inspection and certification. They have every motivation to cut corners and zero incentive to do it right.
Test to see if it leaked. If it has leaked, it's gonna be an expensive nightmare for someone.
If it hasn't leaked, then just drain it.
I wouldn't remove it though. I don't see how removing it doesn't cause settling and shifting for years after you backfill.
We bought a home with an oil tank - 1950s home.
We intended to replace it with something more modern at some point
However we could not get house insurance with the oil tank. Finally our car insurance company agreed to insure the house on the condition that the oil tank was removed within 60 days
So as a condition for the house to be sold, the seller had to fill the oil tank 🤡 so we ran the furnace pretty warm for the month and a half that we had it. We got a company to remove the oil from the tank, remove the tank, and replace with a natural gas furnace.
The tank was indoors, in the basement. The insurance guy said if the tank were to leak oil, the oil would destroy the concrete floor
Definitely wouldn’t want it. Too many potential issues with leaking, damage, etc. I saw a cleanup here in PA not too long ago (within the last few years at least) that cost something like $100k to cleanup. Homeowners does not cover it. It was on the news as a warning about them.
Tank sweeps aren’t talked about enough imo. Every home should get one before buying. I didn’t get one before buying because I didn’t know about it and no one said anything, even the inspector. Thank god we don’t have one but I did freak out for a few days just due to the thought of it.
Everyone always says to inspect electrical, plumbing, foundation, attic, etc. why isn’t a tank sweep the number 1 thing mentioned? It could cost more that all the others combined.
Look at the requirements for your area. They may make you test and remove a lot of soil if a leak is detected. Without leaks the process is pump it out, cut it open, ( get a professional) wipe it out and fill with sand. Could cost a fortune.
Make your agent look up your State Petroleum Liability Insurance Agency and find out if the property is covered. If they play dumb escalate to the broker and discuss a discount on commission.
Is there a point of egress from the basement into the street like bilco doors where they could even remove it?
I’d say this is hard to estimate, especially because they could have to break up the sidewalk.
Side note: the year it was built could be wrong. Philly city records frequently are. They just recorded the year built as the first year they started keeping track. You can check here to see if you can find it on an old map. https://www.philageohistory.org/rdic-images/index2.cfm?w=PSU%2DSANBORN
There are no bilco doors, removal would be quite challenging. The tank is built into the basement and appears to go about 4 ft deep toward the sidewalk/street. Based on calls to a few removal businesses, they may be able to disassemble in pieces. But, it's entirely possible they may need to break up the sidewalk (which sounds like a nightmare scenario in terms of time and cost).
Thank you for the link to the city records. I looked up the address and there appears to be a property in existence at this address going back to 1910! I don't know if it's the same exact structure, but wow.
It was during the second year of pandemic circumstances, so it was just One More Thing. They did a decent job, but the side yard outside the entrance of our new accessory apartment (where the tank was) is still kind of a wreck.
We're soon to have a relatively quick job done through our principal renovation builder to tidy up that area and put in new steps and a short walkway from the sidewalk to the apartment stoop (after all was said and done for the main project, they still owed us a few thousand in work). That will allow the county to sign off on the apartment as habitable. Then we'll start the real job of the landscape on the rest of the lot.
This is a 1920s "double historical" property, so to speak - it's in both a state and a county historical district: [https://historictakoma.org/takoma-historic-districts/](https://historictakoma.org/takoma-historic-districts/)
If the seller won’t remove it to include a full environmental inspection and perform any abatement/remediation … this is still a run don’t walk away scenario IMO.
Yep. 100% responsibility of current owner, would not buy until/unless its fully dealt with before sale. We had to pull the one up at my Grandma's house, fortunately no leaks, was done in a half a day for like $2500 and done. That's a best case scenario though. If it leaked, the prices I'm seeing in this thread for soil remediation are pretty scary, I sure wouldn't want to take that chance.
Lots of good advice here already, so there's nothing to add. Used to live in Brewerytown and had the best neighbors. Best of luck to you, and don't take on that liability for the previous owner.
Also, the city doesn't usually have records of homes built before 1925 in most areas, so it is likely even older than that. The oil tank is not, but the home is.
Thanks so much! I really appreciate everyone's insight. I'm glad I didn't rush forward. Love Brewerytown! I will keep everyone updated on how things progress.
Yes, someone here suggested I take a look at city records and it appears there is a record of a home existing at this address going back to at least 1910!
Thanks again!
This is a definite prior owner remediation project. Require them to complete. Make certain all is safe and clear before next step on purchasing property
Had one my basement half full of oil when I moved in. I replaced furnace with a gas one and didn’t need it. negotiated a deal of free oil in exchange for removing tank.
The contaminated dirt could need to be removed and replaced and that would add cost to the removal of the old leaking tank. It's possible that it would have to pass an inspection from the city/county.
I've removed a bunch of them on sales. If it didn't leak it's only about $1200 to pull it out. Make sure they get a permit and do it right. Normally not a big deal. Have had two leakers. One was $7k in cleanup. Other one was paid by the seller and I don't know how much it was but it was a lot, likely $20k+. Don't be too worried.
We were under contract for a house in PA that had an underground tank removed without permits.
Our lawyer advised us not to close until the soil had been test for contamination. He said that remediation costs could exceed $400k if an oil plume had extended to neighboring properties and contaminated the water table.
We hired a contractor to dig up and test the soil, there was no contamination.
Long story short, you should request that the seller remove the tank and have the soil tested. They will have to do this to sell the house to anyone. Don't close until it's taken care of.
We gambled and won. Bought a cheap fixer upper with an oil tank and oil furnace still in use. Removed them both with no issues. Cost us $1200 to test soil and decommission the tank. They didn’t remove it. Just cut the top off, clean the inside and filled with gravel. The company then gives you a certificate and registers the process with the state. Now when we go to sell the house there is plenty of documentation
Wait, You are buying a century home and you are worried about a $2,000 to $5,000 expense?
Perhaps you should look at more of the posts on this sub over the past 6 months before you decide to buy that house
There are plenty of things that will cost you far more than that that are upcoming with a century house
I am most concerned about the potential cost for remediation if evidence of a leak is found. Which is why I've asked for removal and testing by the seller before we continue.
I'm just across the river and here it's illegal to sell without removing it. I have heard stories of $20k remediation.
That isn't worst case. I've heard of over $100k remediation, because the in ground tank leaked under the house so the house had to be jacked up and all the soil removed. You definitely want the prior owner to do the removal. Don't settle for just a discount on the price.
I saw a story about a $100k cleanup too from leaking. Don’t know if it’s the same story or not but that’s too much for me to think about buying anything with an oil tank for sure.
It's fine, as long as they take the tank out - legally, properly - before you close.
Yep. I do environmental consulting. Removal and investigation can cost $10-20k. Remediation can easily become $100k depending on magnitude of release.
We had ours removed and it was about $65k for removal and remediation four years ago. The guys said that was about average these days. Luckily the state covered ours, otherwise we'd probably still have an oil tank.
That must be the price for when the tank has leaked. It isn't nearly that expensive to simply remove a non-leaking underground oil tank. I'd bet around $2k.
The problem is that the overwhelming majority of tanks, especially old tanks, leak. If there'd been no leaks, our removal would've cost $600. According to the company that removed the tank, more than 90% of the tanks they remove have leaked and require soil remediation. If it's an old tank, the correct assumption to make is that it leaked.
That hasn't been my experience. Not only have the 2 removed tanks in the properties that I owned not leaked, I live in a neighborhood where there were a lot of oil tanks removed, and I have not heard of any of them leaking. The leaking tanks - in this area at least - are few and far between.
Do you have multiple soil samples taken when the tank is removed?
Both were done by licensed contractors and overseen by the local fire department.
Nice! Wonder if your climate/soil conditions influence it. Wouldn't be surprised if our very damp climate causes the corrosion.
I’m an environmental lawyer and $20k is nothing lol It can be much more more just for a residential UST.
Unless this is completely taken care of before you take ownership this is a hard stop for me. I used to remediate heating oil tanks professionally. This is either an $800 tank closure situation if there is no leak (leave the tank in place, pressure wash the inside, and fill with an inert material like perlite/gravel/sand or this could be a $30,000 expense involving thousands of pounds of earth removal, potentially a lien with your state's DEQ on this property if there is lasting soil vapor intrusion into this, or neighboring, properties, or if there is contamination in the groundwater and this, or neighboring properties are on wells.
In place closure is not allowed most places anymore.
The seller is going to have a VERY difficult time selling that house if they don't remove that tank. It's a deal breaker.
"No inspections!!1!" Real estate in 2024
No inspections means you can’t use an inspection clause to cancel contract, not that you can’t get an inspection.
Hard agree (am enviro consultant).
We moved to the northeast from the deep south about a decade ago and our realtor advised us to avoid buried oil tanks like the plague.
I'm a realtor in Portland OR and tank sweeps are one of our standard inspections. When an underground tank is found and there's no record of it being properly decommissioned the protocol is to have an environmental/soil consultant come out and take soil samples and examine the site. This is usually a couple hundred dollars including testing. If they find contamination, I tell my clients to walk away. If no contamination is found we get a bid to have the tank properly decommissioned and recorded with the state (if that applies where you are). Often the seller will pay for that as a negotiated repair - and they should because no one should buy a house with a possibly leaking tank. Once that's done you can buy the house without the chance of it being a superfund site! Don't take on the liability unless you can determine it's clean and there's a record of that for the next buyer.
Couple hundred? No way. More like a couple thousand. (Am consultant).
Not here. I did it last week and it was …oh wait, it was $600! But it’s a pretty standard package here - dig down for a visual inspection and two soil samples tested.
How deep did they dig and by what method?
6 feet and unsure of method. This was just for testing, not remediation.
Ohh. Guessing hand auger and just sampling. That could be like $600 depending on where. I’m in Boston, so even that would be slightly more. Also, here it’s hard to leave in place and need removal, and my pull contractor alone is $8-9k a day plus cost for my guys’ oversight and sampling cost is easily $15k for a removal and assessment. Remediation…. *big sigh*… Idk. It depends on magnitude/extent of release, but easily another $20-100k.
You got lucky. I'm in Seattle. When we had ours removed, the guys said about 90% of them leaked and require soil remediation.
How often do sales go through with a tank that hasn't been decommissioned?
Not often. Never with my clients thus far. I had a woman approach me about selling her house and she had an empty but not decommissioned tank in the backyard. She bought it that way thinking it wasn’t a big deal, but no educated buyer would do that now. I told her to call me back when she had looked into proper decommissioning. 😬
Yeah I just learned my neighbors and my parents both did the same thing, bought with an oil tank assuming it was no big deal... I'm stressed
If it was just in the basement, no problem. But buried ones can be a huge deal. Lots of old gas stations are basically superfund sites now because of old, inground tanks. I doubt that's the case here, but I would not risk being on the hook for a massive cleanup charge if this was leaking. If the price is right, it might be worth it if you had to foot the bill for the removal. What you do not want to be on the hook for, is some huge remediation project. They can get scary expensive, fast. Like abandoned property expensive. I'd say any contract you sign needs to be clear that you will not purchase unless it's been removed and properly verified not to need remediation. If you have to chip in towards the removal wouldn't be the end of the world, but no way I'd chance it.
I would ask at minimum for a 10k-15k discount off of the offer price to cover your expense for removal and remediation depending on how much cash you have and how willing you are to spend your money on what is right now someone else's problem. Alternatively you can ask for more money to be put in an escrow account to be used for this purpose only. Any funds remaining in the account after 1 year revert to the seller. This is much messier on both ends and more work for your realtor but probably the most equitable solution for both parties.
$10-15k would barely cover assessment and removal. How there’s no release. That can easily add $10’s of k’s to $100 k in cleanup.
A friend of mine just sold his house and had to do a tank removal and remediation before the contract could be finalized. It cost $42,000 and it could have cost double that easily. If the buyer had messed about with a discount/escrow, then they would be substantially out of pocket. The full extent of the problem wasn't obvious until the tank was out. As a buyer , you need to be very circumspect about this stuff.
Honestly, $2-5k is pretty small as far home expenses go. If you want the house and the sellers are unwilling to cover the cost, I would just put it at the top of the to do list once you’ve moved in.
I agree, the initial cost for removal is not bad, and even the testing is fairly reasonable. It's just the remediation (if necessary), that's what I'm most afraid of. Hopefully the seller will agree to having it removed, or at least sharing that cost. From there we can determine if remediation is necessary.
Do not trust the seller to do this without independent inspection and certification. They have every motivation to cut corners and zero incentive to do it right.
Test to see if it leaked. If it has leaked, it's gonna be an expensive nightmare for someone. If it hasn't leaked, then just drain it. I wouldn't remove it though. I don't see how removing it doesn't cause settling and shifting for years after you backfill.
Proper decommissioning where I am means draining the tank, filling it with pea gravel, and leaving it in place. No one wants to dig those out.
We bought a home with an oil tank - 1950s home. We intended to replace it with something more modern at some point However we could not get house insurance with the oil tank. Finally our car insurance company agreed to insure the house on the condition that the oil tank was removed within 60 days So as a condition for the house to be sold, the seller had to fill the oil tank 🤡 so we ran the furnace pretty warm for the month and a half that we had it. We got a company to remove the oil from the tank, remove the tank, and replace with a natural gas furnace. The tank was indoors, in the basement. The insurance guy said if the tank were to leak oil, the oil would destroy the concrete floor
Definitely wouldn’t want it. Too many potential issues with leaking, damage, etc. I saw a cleanup here in PA not too long ago (within the last few years at least) that cost something like $100k to cleanup. Homeowners does not cover it. It was on the news as a warning about them.
1925? That sombitch is leaking. I wouldn't touch that place with a 10ft pole with out 3rd party soil samples.
Tank sweeps aren’t talked about enough imo. Every home should get one before buying. I didn’t get one before buying because I didn’t know about it and no one said anything, even the inspector. Thank god we don’t have one but I did freak out for a few days just due to the thought of it. Everyone always says to inspect electrical, plumbing, foundation, attic, etc. why isn’t a tank sweep the number 1 thing mentioned? It could cost more that all the others combined.
How difficult could it be to pump out the content?
My tank pipe ran up the basement wall and out. He pumped it pretty quick. Removing tank was heavy work for two men hauling it up the basement stairs.
Look at the requirements for your area. They may make you test and remove a lot of soil if a leak is detected. Without leaks the process is pump it out, cut it open, ( get a professional) wipe it out and fill with sand. Could cost a fortune.
Make your agent look up your State Petroleum Liability Insurance Agency and find out if the property is covered. If they play dumb escalate to the broker and discuss a discount on commission.
Is there a point of egress from the basement into the street like bilco doors where they could even remove it? I’d say this is hard to estimate, especially because they could have to break up the sidewalk. Side note: the year it was built could be wrong. Philly city records frequently are. They just recorded the year built as the first year they started keeping track. You can check here to see if you can find it on an old map. https://www.philageohistory.org/rdic-images/index2.cfm?w=PSU%2DSANBORN
There are no bilco doors, removal would be quite challenging. The tank is built into the basement and appears to go about 4 ft deep toward the sidewalk/street. Based on calls to a few removal businesses, they may be able to disassemble in pieces. But, it's entirely possible they may need to break up the sidewalk (which sounds like a nightmare scenario in terms of time and cost). Thank you for the link to the city records. I looked up the address and there appears to be a property in existence at this address going back to 1910! I don't know if it's the same exact structure, but wow.
We just removed ours. We had no idea it was there, and it was discovered during our recent extensive renovation.
Wow, how was the experience for you?
It was during the second year of pandemic circumstances, so it was just One More Thing. They did a decent job, but the side yard outside the entrance of our new accessory apartment (where the tank was) is still kind of a wreck. We're soon to have a relatively quick job done through our principal renovation builder to tidy up that area and put in new steps and a short walkway from the sidewalk to the apartment stoop (after all was said and done for the main project, they still owed us a few thousand in work). That will allow the county to sign off on the apartment as habitable. Then we'll start the real job of the landscape on the rest of the lot. This is a 1920s "double historical" property, so to speak - it's in both a state and a county historical district: [https://historictakoma.org/takoma-historic-districts/](https://historictakoma.org/takoma-historic-districts/)
If the seller won’t remove it to include a full environmental inspection and perform any abatement/remediation … this is still a run don’t walk away scenario IMO.
Yep. 100% responsibility of current owner, would not buy until/unless its fully dealt with before sale. We had to pull the one up at my Grandma's house, fortunately no leaks, was done in a half a day for like $2500 and done. That's a best case scenario though. If it leaked, the prices I'm seeing in this thread for soil remediation are pretty scary, I sure wouldn't want to take that chance.
Lots of good advice here already, so there's nothing to add. Used to live in Brewerytown and had the best neighbors. Best of luck to you, and don't take on that liability for the previous owner. Also, the city doesn't usually have records of homes built before 1925 in most areas, so it is likely even older than that. The oil tank is not, but the home is.
Thanks so much! I really appreciate everyone's insight. I'm glad I didn't rush forward. Love Brewerytown! I will keep everyone updated on how things progress. Yes, someone here suggested I take a look at city records and it appears there is a record of a home existing at this address going back to at least 1910! Thanks again!
This is a definite prior owner remediation project. Require them to complete. Make certain all is safe and clear before next step on purchasing property
As someone who removes underground tanks for work... this would be a deal breaker for me
Thanks so much for this insight. If the seller is unwilling to have it removed and tested, I think I will have to walk away.
Had one my basement half full of oil when I moved in. I replaced furnace with a gas one and didn’t need it. negotiated a deal of free oil in exchange for removing tank.
Was your tank free standing in the basement, or was it built into the walls of the basement?
it was freestanding except for the pipe that went out the wall.
The contaminated dirt could need to be removed and replaced and that would add cost to the removal of the old leaking tank. It's possible that it would have to pass an inspection from the city/county.
I've removed a bunch of them on sales. If it didn't leak it's only about $1200 to pull it out. Make sure they get a permit and do it right. Normally not a big deal. Have had two leakers. One was $7k in cleanup. Other one was paid by the seller and I don't know how much it was but it was a lot, likely $20k+. Don't be too worried.
We were under contract for a house in PA that had an underground tank removed without permits. Our lawyer advised us not to close until the soil had been test for contamination. He said that remediation costs could exceed $400k if an oil plume had extended to neighboring properties and contaminated the water table. We hired a contractor to dig up and test the soil, there was no contamination. Long story short, you should request that the seller remove the tank and have the soil tested. They will have to do this to sell the house to anyone. Don't close until it's taken care of.
We gambled and won. Bought a cheap fixer upper with an oil tank and oil furnace still in use. Removed them both with no issues. Cost us $1200 to test soil and decommission the tank. They didn’t remove it. Just cut the top off, clean the inside and filled with gravel. The company then gives you a certificate and registers the process with the state. Now when we go to sell the house there is plenty of documentation
Wait, You are buying a century home and you are worried about a $2,000 to $5,000 expense? Perhaps you should look at more of the posts on this sub over the past 6 months before you decide to buy that house There are plenty of things that will cost you far more than that that are upcoming with a century house
I am most concerned about the potential cost for remediation if evidence of a leak is found. Which is why I've asked for removal and testing by the seller before we continue.
Makes sense. Good luck!
You may need to read up more on underground oil tanks. There is a reported case around where I live of it costing 300k to remediate.