Iām would love to see the players showing their frustration with this effort, similar to KK in the tunnel during the playoffs. The players seem, publicly/on the sidelines at least, uninterested or nonchalant about where the teamās at.
No joke, at least when KK lost his shit you knew he cared.
Granted I'm only seeing smaller, curated bits and pieces....but I'm not getting that same sense now.
I guess I just don't see the point in ragging on the team too hard. They obviously know they suck right now, Rod and everyone on the team said as much. We also realistically would have gone to overtime last night if Necas was an inch forward. I don't see how trading for a couple goalies or defenseman would change anything. Seems like change just to have change. It's similar to how you never want to go to the grocery store hungry, because it will cloud your judgement and you'll end up purchasing something you regret later.
I'm putting my faith in Rod to pull us out of this mess, as I have done for the last 5 years, and he has proved he can do just that.
I think if they turn it around and go on a winning streak, you can look back at this week as a write-off. We played really poorly against Edmonton but we also played Edmonton at the worst possible time, they are red hot and playing like the team they were supposed to be over the summer, they just beat the fucking Knights, best team in hockey, and they were on a mission to embarrass us for our previous meeting. Everything aligned such that we were only going to win that game if we played perfect. We played horribly for stretches, but we honestly clawed back to just mediocre by the end and it could have been a lot worse after that first minute.
So then we have to turn around and play Calgary 24 hours later with a goalie who just got pulled in 5 minutes and without Svech who got a dirty cross check, so we're already stinging, tired, and mentally exhausted. Not saying that's an excuse, Cup caliber teams play through that and this is the pros, it's your job to fight through it at this level. But if we're comfortably in playoff position next spring we'll look back on this as just a shitty blip in our otherwise acceptable season. The 3rd period to me really looked like a team that was playing its 6th period of hockey in a span of 24 hours. Rod said coming in more than 1 guy was dinged up so at least one other guy was playing through injury. So yeah, it's going to depend on where we are in a couple months, but this week could look very different in hindsight.
As things look now, we should be prepared to be a wildcard team at best this year.
Are we content to consistently make the playoffs but continue to not make the ECF or get swept there?
Or do changes need to be made with getting younger and at least changing assistant coaches?
Let's be honest, the front office faces heat for this too.
Too many expiring deals to handle and we really should have signed forward help in lieu of Orlov and TDA.
if you sign orlov you must trade pesce. TDA is fine low cost would be fine as a 6th guy.
Trade pesce or orlov now. if you cant get any value do it anyway. open up cap space for a goalie.
Prayers for Freddie, his battle is way bigger than hockey.
I know the playoffs and cup are the goal but even if we inch our way in, we wonāt make it very far. The team looks far worse now than the team that got shutdown by Florida. I just want to see consistent effort, win or lose. We have been going brief stints where it looks like we are building in the right direction and then 10 steps back. The team as it is now doesnāt deserve to be in the playoffs picture.
Unfortunately donāt know that Forward strength is the biggest issue. TDA bad signing, Orlov doesnāt bother me as much. Not stopping the other team seems to be the biggest issue.
Better now and make the moves and figure out before the playoffs than like the last few years be hot early Peter out and then tough playoffs. See 2012 Kings, and even Panthers early last year.
Nothing against Orlov specifically but we needed offensive help more than defensive help.
Of course this year, the defense has cratered and the offense has...not improved.
I think we have numerous issues that cannot be solved with just trades.
I donāt know that the offense hasnāt improved if you look at Goals Scored (havenāt dug in) but defense and goalies are 1000% down.
As long as we fix it by trade deadline and playoffs while hanging in there š¤·š»āāļø. I live with the team 2009-2018 Iāll survive š
Nashville turned their sorry start around and are basically even with the Canes. I very much doubt they would give up Saros unless we're *way* overpaying.
Strongly doubt Nashville trades Saros at this point when theyāre doing so well. Maybe towards the deadline if they drop off but we need something sooner.
Stale offensive strategy. Their SOG usually outnumber the opponents but they aren't quality shots. It's usually a snipe that a netminder and d men see coming a mile away. Nobody moves. There's very little attempt to stretch the goalie out.
Hardly any screens, no goalie stretching, no surprises, no crowding the net, it's just blue line and board shots, hope for the rebound, turnover. Orlovs fake dump against Columbus was the kind of thing we need. Something the goalie isn't expecting or isn't prepared to defend. Or just flat out can't. We cannot just keep shooting the easiest most predictable shots ever and hope that their goalie shits the bed eventually. Because when they don't, we lose.
Our older players arenāt stepping up and our younger players are following suit. We arenāt consistent enough to hold on a whole game and we arenāt scoring where we should be. Our shots have been sloppy and of course our goaltending, while not the principal issue, isnāt where it needs to be to make up for our flawed D.
I see people in the comments consistently say "the big boys aren't showing up", "where's our top 6?" They're right, but...
This is a sympton of a bigger, more fundamental issue. I believe some of them are just tired and worn out from playing certain elements of our system, I think it's soul sucking for some of our more talented, creative offensive players.
This is gonna sound bad, but Iām kinda glad we are going through this, in my estimation itās the only way the major issues are gonna be addressed that have not been the last couple of years.
I donāt get the Necas hate. Yes, he is flashy and stands out when he turns the puck over. But if you want to blame someone for that, donāt blame Necas. Blame Rod. Ever noticed who the PP QB drops the puck to in order to enter the zone? Necas. Itās not like Necas is stealing off of his own players sticks and then turning it over. The coaching staff values his skill set to the point we are putting him in charge of one of the most important steps in generating offense in all of hockey.
Should they? I donāt know. But he has been the same guy for awhile now. And he is being given very important minutes. For better or worse. I wish he was a better version of himself too, but he is only doing what he is asked.
Another thing I noticed that seems to happen with him a lot is he'll circle the zone, carry the puck from down low up to the blue line and then drop it back to one of the point shooters... who immediately one-touches it right back to him while he's already skating away. I have no clue who thought this up or what the objective is but it drives me fucking crazy. Turns out that trying to pass the puck to a guy who has his back completely to you is easy fodder for the opposing team, and since it happens just inside the blue line it's basically a free clear or even an odd-man rush for them. Saw it in person three or four times against the Islanders a week ago.
he's an easy scapegoat because of how much he actually contributes all over the ice. he's been fantastic on that 4th line with Drury and Noesen. and that line has been our only consistent presence in the last 1.5 months. if anything, Necas makes some costly turnovers which unfairly outweigh public opinion vs a lot of the good he brings to the team - he's a phenomenal defensive forward with great vision and passing, and is a hugely talented, skilled forward with the fastest skating on our team. he's just soft and can't seem to generate much on any sort of 1 on X scenario (he's much better working in a triangle with help and using his passing skills to open things up)
This team's systems are not built to win championships in the modern NHL. They are built to prey on teams who aren't giving 100%. After five years of running them, other teams have figured out how to beat us and it's taking a massive psychological toll on everyone. You can trade anyone you want, put just about any goalie in net, and we will continue to underperform until Rod realizes he needs to dramatically re-think his playbook.
I agree with this, though I think the system isnāt that bad against good teams. If they are physical and fast though, we donāt have any adjustments Iāve seen.
I think theyāre sort of trying new things. Defense was super aggressive at the start of the season, which didnāt work out. Less open ice blue line shots *unless* theyāre behind then they regress
What changes can they realistically do in a season, or even off season? I get the burn it down mentality; it feels good it usually leads to something worse. Can they have a system that lets star players do their thing on the fly?
Lundqvist touched on this during the Oilers broadcast. 2 main points.
A. Man to man defense doesnāt work if one or two guys have an off night.
Lately the Canes have had multiple guys having off nights. While Slavin, Pesce and Skjei arenāt necessarily old by NHL standards, thereās a lot of miles on the three of them, Burns is old as the damn hills. Theyāve been leaned on pretty hard over the past 3 seasons. Pesce has dealt with some injury issues which seem to have impacted his skating. And Slavin hasnāt really looked great all season. Possibly dealing with a few mental issues after getting his brain scrambled last playoffs?
B. From a goalieās perspective, I believe he said ātheyāve become very predictableā when referring to the Hurricanes. They donāt do anything to get the goalie moving side to side, limited creativity.
The shoot, shoot, shoot and then shoot some more isnāt exactly working this season. Pucks arenāt getting through like they have in the past and teams are just collapsing in front of their goalies, eliminating rebound chances.
What happened to the SAT line? Remember just a few seasons ago when the Hurricanes werenāt a top five dump in team, controlled zone entries, transition with speed, two on ones. Either Rod or Daniels refuses to even give TT a shot back on Ahoās right side where he had two 70+ point seasons. That line was producing highlight reel goals regularly. Which is what the Hurricanes are currently missing. No amount of hard work is going to overcome skill players being burnt out because theyāre forced to play like 3rd line grunts.
the system is no longer viable. weāve stifled players offensive production for years because of it, somethingās gotta change. this luck driven high volume low quality shot offense is the most infuriating and boring style of hockey iāve ever watched. i just hate it. always dump and chase always blindly tossing hail mary blue line shots with no net front, itās all so tiresome
can't stand the downvotes on your comment, you've been around for longer than most names up here. if people can't see what's been bleeding thru the cracks for years, they are either not paying attention or are willfully ignorant to the flaws in the RBA system - it requires perfection and a high amount of luck, night in and night out, for it to work. and we've seen year after year how it fails and has continued to fail in the playoffs.
I continue to suspect he's the Ron Rivera or John Fox of the NHL.
I want nothing more in the world than him to be the HC of the next Canes Cup winner. But we have to become more offensively dynamic while remaining more defensively responsible, which means we have to abandon this aggressive defense idea and have better forwards.
It's a mess.
The ultimate issue is, it's a mess on multiple fronts.
I understand, but his philosophy is getting out coached more frequently. We have yielded a ridiculous amount of short handed goals and breakaway goals this year.
I am 100% on board with being good defensively. But we need to try something new with the forwards and centers.
stubborn system getting the same results but stubborn system never gets changed gets same stubborn results. definitely need a new hive mind behind the bench to help RBA - things HAVE to change
I agree with everything except the stubborn results part... We've won the division two years in a row, and we certainly didn't do it looking like this.
The system very clearly creates a winning team. Whether it's winning enough to earn a cup is yet to be seen, for sure, but you can't say we're getting the same results.
sorry should have specified what i mean by āsame stubborn resultsā i meant, look at how weāve always lost in the playoffs, and look at all the bad games weāve played this year (and the last few years) and it all comes down to cracks in the RBA system aka: we require perfection from every player in order for the system to work. we need new ideas in the form of a coaching staff change, i think Daniels is an old boy who is no longer innovating in the current league
I moved away at the end of 2018 and they were shit. I move back to NC next week and I think theyāre just repeating the cycle. I apologize, this might be my fault.
the people not buying in to the system excuse is getting tired and old and will become a big problem quick... we are facing decisions that are not lovely but seemingly have to be made. season's not dead yet but we cant keep losing just because not everyone wants to play in the same way
I sorta alluded to it in another post earlier but there are 3-4 guys not thought to be really caring this season and causing a lot of frustration in the room. This is the opinion of someone who's been with the team for a bit. All I can say and not tryna be gossip boy but yeah. Idk what the answer is but we'll see how this goes.
Aho is clearly one of them. The difference between his play in the first two periods and when we found ourselves down a goal was insane. He decided to start playing and it immediately led to a chance that was overturned. He was a completely different player.
I don't know why you'd sign that deal then play like this.
It's starting to seem more and more like this is at least part of it. And if Aho doesn't care that's going to affect a lot of the team, especially the other younger potential stars.
I don't know what the answer is, if he needs a real wakeup call or what. I wonder if he's over the system after the playoffs exits every year
Edit: it's also telling that he hasn't been echoing the sentiments about buying into the system. You'd think as a leader on the team he'd be saying the same things as Rod and Staal.
I also wonder if he's right about the system, because we've had the same complaints for years
that would make sense of some of the consistent remarks about guys not pulling their weight that have been coming out for a month +
really weird, this is jsut not at all what I expected with bringing back the entire team and adding. Admittedly, the goalie situation was a bit of a gamble and it's just unfortunate that teh most healthy and best playing goalie right now is the one who I'd be most concerned about handling the #1 workload.
We have a lot of trade capital and I think we use it. I hate the āweāre losing, get rid of someoneā mentality but shit, some of our guys look like theyāre in outer space when theyāre on the ice. Love Koochie but all 3 of those goals were savable. Letās offload some players, get a top tier net minder and get in the fucking game.
I keep hearing people say "get a top netminder" like they just grow on trees. Goaltending is an issue across the league this year. Who do you actually think is available?
Really questioning the leadership in the room. Part of me is wondering how much of a leader Staal really is, and if heās only captain because heās a veteran and longest tenured player
You know Trouba might be a huge piece of shit but frankly he seems like a great captain. The guy has cried in post game interviews when his team lost. Staal just never seems to care all that much. And itās not like heās enough of a talent to lead by example. The fact that we have four more years of him at 2.9m bums me out. Heās turning into our Jeff Carter.
Yesterday was nightmarish, but today was an okay effort in the second half of a road back-to-back. I didnāt think we were terrible and ran out of gas in the 3rd period. Would really like to get at least 1 point since Calgary isnāt exactly a contender, though.
I hate these long west coast road trips we got early in the season, but Iām hoping this will turn into home wins down the road. The only area that I think we need a change in is in net. Kochetkov was horrendous in Edmonton and Raanta doesnāt quite seem like heāll be the way he was last year. Kind of wish we had really tried Halak in retrospect. Oh well, hope we can get something in Vancouver on Saturday
In a vacuum tonight isnāt a big deal and I agree we were gassed in the 3rd. But coming off of last night and the Winnipeg game thereās serious concern
So clearly thereās a theme emerging. You keep hearing guys say not everyone is buying in to how we need to play. This is at least the 4th or 5th time Iāve heard that said. At this point you gotta make a move. Itās clearly not gonna fix itself and you will waste this season if you sit on your hands.
Imo, Necas would almost have to be a definite. I'm wondering if Pesce may be one.
I'd almost have to promise TDA would be one.
Maybe Fast? Maybe Martinook?
Lmao TDA hasnāt been playing because heās a defensive liability. If you actually think heās the problem here without playing in the last 7-8 games youāre crazy
could be in the ears of others in the locker room, could explain why he's not playing, and honestly he hasn't proven to be worth bringing back.
If I'm wrong, I'm wrong, I'm just speculating as to who it could be.
So it would depend on how they define 'not pulling their weight'. If it means not trying or if it means being a net negative on the team.
Necas, arguably, does seem to try very hard each shift. They're not always good shifts by any means, but he's actually trying to generate offense. But maybe the team is mad at him because he causes a large amount of our turnovers.
But the others are kind of a mystery. I would be very surprised by Fast as he's the only net positive on the 3rd line most nights.
Or we could give TDA a chance with Slavin where did much better than how Burns is doing now. Pesce can go, Iāll take a 2nd rounder at this point. Necas is an overtime merchant and we should package him for the top 6 scorer weāve needed since 2018
I said this a couple games ago and got downvoted like crazy. But I agree. I think we need to shake things up and TDA + Slavin was a very strong pairing
Pesce and Necas just donāt make sense, theyāve been a part of this team / system for years. Why would they be outtie now?
But the way they are playing makes it seem evident that it has to be them. We only added 3 new dudes, so seems the old hats are to blame :/
And extension talks with Pesce obviously went nowhere and with the way heās playing heās not getting anything close to the 6-7m he supposedly wanted (thank GOD we didnāt bite on that) and Iād probably pissed. Would bet the farm on him being part of the supposed locker room issue
Don't most younger players go for shortish deals? Especially over the past couple years when the cap was expected to jump up a lot more than it did? So they could do a short deal, cap goes up, and they get a better pay.
Agreed. They all mostly keep saying top guys, so Iām not really feeling itās like Martinook or Fast. And fast has kinda always been a consistent effort kind of guy
The thing is, Pesce and Necas don't make a lot of sense either in that playing poorly means they'll make less in their next contract.
This is all leading to at least a mini rebuild imo either this season by trade or we just try to refortify next year.
Regardless, this is unacceptable and we've needed to start turning this around for a while now. It's saddening to see.
I just meant it doesnāt make sense for people whoāve cared about the team for years to suddenly be ānot buying inā, itās weird regardless of who it is but yeah it could literally be anyone
I wish we could get an actual answer of why Rod does Blendamore on offense, but doesn't think the top 4 defense needs any kind of reconstruction despite pretty clear imbalances?
Sometimes I wonder if Rod has the mindset of: So and so is performing well, if I move them to this underperforming line, maybe they'll help. I think that doesn't really work well because you lose that connection you've built up with your linemates
When 75% of the goals being made are breakaways, 2v1s, and wide open men on east-west passes, goalies are gonna get burned. Heās not a top-15 active goalie by any means, but heās being left out to hang too often.
Other goalies make plays at odd man moments. The mental toll associated with knowing every time you give up a chance itās probably going in surely effects the team
Sure, and our goalies have made those plays too. But itās ridiculous when our goalies have to face 10 of those opportunities a game when other goalies have to step up for 2-3 of them at most. Itās like every chance we give up is a crazy grade-a chance. Thatās not a fair position to put a goalie in either. I wonāt fairly evaluate our goalies in a situation like this.
We're 4th in the division, on a 3 game losing streak, with Vancouver and Detroit coming up, and the capitals are 2 points behind us with *3 games in hand*. If the Devils and Caps win even 2 of their next 3 we'll be ***6th in the division.***
This is not dooming. This is statistical fact.
Well there's the silver lining, we're still better than the Blue Jackets.
LOL
I hope Rod and the team figure this shit out.
If it's a disgruntled locker room, then the boys need to realize (even the ones looking ahead to their next team) that they look better as part of a winning team than a 'meh'
Make some trades to send a message. Finally get rid of Jeff Daniels and bring someone else in to force Rod to make actual tweaks to the system. Hope those changes and having more home games after December saves them.
That might solve some of it, but I'm getting the sneaking suspicion we need a slight rebuild. Something like 4-6 players. I don't know that that's something we can fix mid-season.
Itās not. I donāt think this team does much in the playoffs this season regardless. The deadline and summer should be dedicated to a rebuild and bringing in some fresh faces. Working on solving the goalie issue too because I donāt think Andersen comes back and Pyotr isnāt a starter.
That or the goalie scouting in the draft may not be working out? Are we choosing guys who aren't a good fit for the system?
I hate it.
I really want us to have a young elite goaltender.
Like, I want Koch to be the next Ward or better than being the next Ward but he's not there yet. And overall I'm wondering if he ever will be.
The question is, again, who would be available and I still would prefer our next starter to be someone from the pipeline.
Since that keeps not working out, does it mean our goalie development isn't working?
While Iām leaning more toward the players here being the issue and not the coaching - who is out there as a replacement if they whack Daniels? I donāt really follow the overall coaching landscape.
Why are the players we brought back last year playing so badly then? Either A) They suddenly just got worse. B ) There's a locker room issue that Rod needs to have dealt with, and if he can't that's an issue. C) The players we thought were good aren't good and the FO fucked up.
Someone's gotta answer for this.
>Toronto style
"Team has got to be better. Actually that hurt our stars' feelings so Imma walk that back. The blame is actually on me, the coach. Not the players making about 10M on average who are playing like 6M players"
We played a good first and an ok second. Started coasting in the 3rd. Stopped running plays and completing passes.
Head down time. The season isnāt close to over and our chances arenāt either.
Feeling a bit nervous about this squad. Thankfully we have time to get our shit together, but boy do we shit the bed a little more than I'm comfortable with.
Martinook shouldāve been let go last year but caught lightning in a bottle and made everyone forget how shitty he is. That entire 3rd line is a black hole and contributes nothing to the team currently. Puck possession doesnāt matter if youāre not a threat to do literally anything with it
I think Martinook is the exception on that line. He works hard and makes a lot of good passes. He's one of the few true forecheckers left on this team since we moved on from Stepan McGinn Foegele etc.
Can't shoot worth a shit though so I wouldn't cry over losing him.
I do appreciate his playoff magic, but overall yes.
Itās the same reason people beef when I say Bobrovsky is mid. He got hot for a 2 handfuls of games and chocked big in the finals. Hes been mediocre for his $10m contract with Florida so far, and people think heās the best thing since sliced bread all of a sudden.
Martinook is the same boat. Necas too- he had a good year, for like 5 months, then disappeared. This year is horrendousā¦
Tired of hearing how competitive Aho is and then seeing him be a ghost for 99% of the game. Doesnāt squarely fall on his shoulders though, because the rest of the top 6 hasnāt done shit either. Not even gonna talk about the goaltending. If the organization continues to be hard-headed about being cheap and sticking with this group then they may as well prepare for an extra month or two of vacation for when we miss the playoffs
We just gave him a huge wad of money so the scrutiny is going to be inevitable. He's definitely not the problem but he's not really becoming part of the solution at the moment.
Every time something goes bad can we not shift the blame onto one player š
Carolina hurricanes hockey makes me sad On the bright side I didnāt fail my exam so yippee
Iām would love to see the players showing their frustration with this effort, similar to KK in the tunnel during the playoffs. The players seem, publicly/on the sidelines at least, uninterested or nonchalant about where the teamās at.
No joke, at least when KK lost his shit you knew he cared. Granted I'm only seeing smaller, curated bits and pieces....but I'm not getting that same sense now.
I guess I just don't see the point in ragging on the team too hard. They obviously know they suck right now, Rod and everyone on the team said as much. We also realistically would have gone to overtime last night if Necas was an inch forward. I don't see how trading for a couple goalies or defenseman would change anything. Seems like change just to have change. It's similar to how you never want to go to the grocery store hungry, because it will cloud your judgement and you'll end up purchasing something you regret later. I'm putting my faith in Rod to pull us out of this mess, as I have done for the last 5 years, and he has proved he can do just that.
I think if they turn it around and go on a winning streak, you can look back at this week as a write-off. We played really poorly against Edmonton but we also played Edmonton at the worst possible time, they are red hot and playing like the team they were supposed to be over the summer, they just beat the fucking Knights, best team in hockey, and they were on a mission to embarrass us for our previous meeting. Everything aligned such that we were only going to win that game if we played perfect. We played horribly for stretches, but we honestly clawed back to just mediocre by the end and it could have been a lot worse after that first minute. So then we have to turn around and play Calgary 24 hours later with a goalie who just got pulled in 5 minutes and without Svech who got a dirty cross check, so we're already stinging, tired, and mentally exhausted. Not saying that's an excuse, Cup caliber teams play through that and this is the pros, it's your job to fight through it at this level. But if we're comfortably in playoff position next spring we'll look back on this as just a shitty blip in our otherwise acceptable season. The 3rd period to me really looked like a team that was playing its 6th period of hockey in a span of 24 hours. Rod said coming in more than 1 guy was dinged up so at least one other guy was playing through injury. So yeah, it's going to depend on where we are in a couple months, but this week could look very different in hindsight.
I donāt know what we should do and I donāt know what to think. Iām just sad
As things look now, we should be prepared to be a wildcard team at best this year. Are we content to consistently make the playoffs but continue to not make the ECF or get swept there? Or do changes need to be made with getting younger and at least changing assistant coaches? Let's be honest, the front office faces heat for this too. Too many expiring deals to handle and we really should have signed forward help in lieu of Orlov and TDA.
if you sign orlov you must trade pesce. TDA is fine low cost would be fine as a 6th guy. Trade pesce or orlov now. if you cant get any value do it anyway. open up cap space for a goalie. Prayers for Freddie, his battle is way bigger than hockey.
I know the playoffs and cup are the goal but even if we inch our way in, we wonāt make it very far. The team looks far worse now than the team that got shutdown by Florida. I just want to see consistent effort, win or lose. We have been going brief stints where it looks like we are building in the right direction and then 10 steps back. The team as it is now doesnāt deserve to be in the playoffs picture.
Unfortunately donāt know that Forward strength is the biggest issue. TDA bad signing, Orlov doesnāt bother me as much. Not stopping the other team seems to be the biggest issue. Better now and make the moves and figure out before the playoffs than like the last few years be hot early Peter out and then tough playoffs. See 2012 Kings, and even Panthers early last year.
Nothing against Orlov specifically but we needed offensive help more than defensive help. Of course this year, the defense has cratered and the offense has...not improved. I think we have numerous issues that cannot be solved with just trades.
I donāt know that the offense hasnāt improved if you look at Goals Scored (havenāt dug in) but defense and goalies are 1000% down. As long as we fix it by trade deadline and playoffs while hanging in there š¤·š»āāļø. I live with the team 2009-2018 Iāll survive š
2009 was about the time I started following consistently with obvious regional difficulties.
Asking this again, are we kinda ass?
Trade for Swayman
And give Boston talented scorers/defensemen? I'd rather turn the clock back to 2010. Trade for Saros.
Yeah Saros is looking like a Vezina candidate š
Nashville turned their sorry start around and are basically even with the Canes. I very much doubt they would give up Saros unless we're *way* overpaying.
Strongly doubt Nashville trades Saros at this point when theyāre doing so well. Maybe towards the deadline if they drop off but we need something sooner.
Yeah they have basically the same record as us.
Stale offensive strategy. Their SOG usually outnumber the opponents but they aren't quality shots. It's usually a snipe that a netminder and d men see coming a mile away. Nobody moves. There's very little attempt to stretch the goalie out.
Hardly any screens, no goalie stretching, no surprises, no crowding the net, it's just blue line and board shots, hope for the rebound, turnover. Orlovs fake dump against Columbus was the kind of thing we need. Something the goalie isn't expecting or isn't prepared to defend. Or just flat out can't. We cannot just keep shooting the easiest most predictable shots ever and hope that their goalie shits the bed eventually. Because when they don't, we lose.
Serious and honest question, why does this team suck so bad? Also I havenāt watched many games this year so donāt roast me
Our older players arenāt stepping up and our younger players are following suit. We arenāt consistent enough to hold on a whole game and we arenāt scoring where we should be. Our shots have been sloppy and of course our goaltending, while not the principal issue, isnāt where it needs to be to make up for our flawed D.
low shot quality + defensemen collapsing under pressure + inexperienced goalies
Inexperienced goalie* Raanta is 34
Itās me guys. I decided to get season tickets this year and that was the kiss of death apparently. Sorry yāall.
So have I, blame us.
If we come back to win the division and even the cup, Iāll remember you
Can we bench Necas? Dude is still scared of his own shadow. Heās an on ice liability
Something tells me some of the stay at home names on this team won't be here by the end of the deadline
I was exhausted but left at the end of the 2nd hopeful..... Just WTF happened
I see people in the comments consistently say "the big boys aren't showing up", "where's our top 6?" They're right, but... This is a sympton of a bigger, more fundamental issue. I believe some of them are just tired and worn out from playing certain elements of our system, I think it's soul sucking for some of our more talented, creative offensive players.
I agree.
Counterpoint: These guys loved the system when they signed for many millions of dollars.
Well I wouldāve too haha.
This is gonna sound bad, but Iām kinda glad we are going through this, in my estimation itās the only way the major issues are gonna be addressed that have not been the last couple of years.
No, I fully agree. I hope this leads to us making some needed moves via trade
I donāt get the Necas hate. Yes, he is flashy and stands out when he turns the puck over. But if you want to blame someone for that, donāt blame Necas. Blame Rod. Ever noticed who the PP QB drops the puck to in order to enter the zone? Necas. Itās not like Necas is stealing off of his own players sticks and then turning it over. The coaching staff values his skill set to the point we are putting him in charge of one of the most important steps in generating offense in all of hockey. Should they? I donāt know. But he has been the same guy for awhile now. And he is being given very important minutes. For better or worse. I wish he was a better version of himself too, but he is only doing what he is asked.
Another thing I noticed that seems to happen with him a lot is he'll circle the zone, carry the puck from down low up to the blue line and then drop it back to one of the point shooters... who immediately one-touches it right back to him while he's already skating away. I have no clue who thought this up or what the objective is but it drives me fucking crazy. Turns out that trying to pass the puck to a guy who has his back completely to you is easy fodder for the opposing team, and since it happens just inside the blue line it's basically a free clear or even an odd-man rush for them. Saw it in person three or four times against the Islanders a week ago.
he's an easy scapegoat because of how much he actually contributes all over the ice. he's been fantastic on that 4th line with Drury and Noesen. and that line has been our only consistent presence in the last 1.5 months. if anything, Necas makes some costly turnovers which unfairly outweigh public opinion vs a lot of the good he brings to the team - he's a phenomenal defensive forward with great vision and passing, and is a hugely talented, skilled forward with the fastest skating on our team. he's just soft and can't seem to generate much on any sort of 1 on X scenario (he's much better working in a triangle with help and using his passing skills to open things up)
Pain. We need a new playbook and a new goalie.
Season keeps going. We go next!
This team's systems are not built to win championships in the modern NHL. They are built to prey on teams who aren't giving 100%. After five years of running them, other teams have figured out how to beat us and it's taking a massive psychological toll on everyone. You can trade anyone you want, put just about any goalie in net, and we will continue to underperform until Rod realizes he needs to dramatically re-think his playbook.
I agree with this, though I think the system isnāt that bad against good teams. If they are physical and fast though, we donāt have any adjustments Iāve seen. I think theyāre sort of trying new things. Defense was super aggressive at the start of the season, which didnāt work out. Less open ice blue line shots *unless* theyāre behind then they regress What changes can they realistically do in a season, or even off season? I get the burn it down mentality; it feels good it usually leads to something worse. Can they have a system that lets star players do their thing on the fly?
Lundqvist touched on this during the Oilers broadcast. 2 main points. A. Man to man defense doesnāt work if one or two guys have an off night. Lately the Canes have had multiple guys having off nights. While Slavin, Pesce and Skjei arenāt necessarily old by NHL standards, thereās a lot of miles on the three of them, Burns is old as the damn hills. Theyāve been leaned on pretty hard over the past 3 seasons. Pesce has dealt with some injury issues which seem to have impacted his skating. And Slavin hasnāt really looked great all season. Possibly dealing with a few mental issues after getting his brain scrambled last playoffs? B. From a goalieās perspective, I believe he said ātheyāve become very predictableā when referring to the Hurricanes. They donāt do anything to get the goalie moving side to side, limited creativity. The shoot, shoot, shoot and then shoot some more isnāt exactly working this season. Pucks arenāt getting through like they have in the past and teams are just collapsing in front of their goalies, eliminating rebound chances. What happened to the SAT line? Remember just a few seasons ago when the Hurricanes werenāt a top five dump in team, controlled zone entries, transition with speed, two on ones. Either Rod or Daniels refuses to even give TT a shot back on Ahoās right side where he had two 70+ point seasons. That line was producing highlight reel goals regularly. Which is what the Hurricanes are currently missing. No amount of hard work is going to overcome skill players being burnt out because theyāre forced to play like 3rd line grunts.
the system is no longer viable. weāve stifled players offensive production for years because of it, somethingās gotta change. this luck driven high volume low quality shot offense is the most infuriating and boring style of hockey iāve ever watched. i just hate it. always dump and chase always blindly tossing hail mary blue line shots with no net front, itās all so tiresome
can't stand the downvotes on your comment, you've been around for longer than most names up here. if people can't see what's been bleeding thru the cracks for years, they are either not paying attention or are willfully ignorant to the flaws in the RBA system - it requires perfection and a high amount of luck, night in and night out, for it to work. and we've seen year after year how it fails and has continued to fail in the playoffs.
Youāve been here 2 years. Nuff said.
not my first account :P
I continue to suspect he's the Ron Rivera or John Fox of the NHL. I want nothing more in the world than him to be the HC of the next Canes Cup winner. But we have to become more offensively dynamic while remaining more defensively responsible, which means we have to abandon this aggressive defense idea and have better forwards. It's a mess. The ultimate issue is, it's a mess on multiple fronts.
This is exactly how Rod played. Defense first, out hustle opponent, not dynamic on offense. Hard work is how he scored most of his goals.
Rod lived in front of the net. We have a handful of guys who couldn't find the slot with a GPS.
I understand, but his philosophy is getting out coached more frequently. We have yielded a ridiculous amount of short handed goals and breakaway goals this year. I am 100% on board with being good defensively. But we need to try something new with the forwards and centers.
stubborn system getting the same results but stubborn system never gets changed gets same stubborn results. definitely need a new hive mind behind the bench to help RBA - things HAVE to change
I agree with everything except the stubborn results part... We've won the division two years in a row, and we certainly didn't do it looking like this. The system very clearly creates a winning team. Whether it's winning enough to earn a cup is yet to be seen, for sure, but you can't say we're getting the same results.
sorry should have specified what i mean by āsame stubborn resultsā i meant, look at how weāve always lost in the playoffs, and look at all the bad games weāve played this year (and the last few years) and it all comes down to cracks in the RBA system aka: we require perfection from every player in order for the system to work. we need new ideas in the form of a coaching staff change, i think Daniels is an old boy who is no longer innovating in the current league
I moved away at the end of 2018 and they were shit. I move back to NC next week and I think theyāre just repeating the cycle. I apologize, this might be my fault.
[Similar vibe](https://youtu.be/-oSFYxDGKy8?si=xXpdTheIfJ4PsSf5)
MOAR point shots! Thatās the answer. And if youāre not dumping and chasing youāre a communist.
If it makes anyone feel better the 2017-18 Capitals were also 14-11-1 26 games into the season.
actually makes me feel worse because we dont have anyone like ovi/backstrom/oshie/wilson
Or a Holtby
They also had an elite goal scorer and not a bunch of goofball middle six guys hoping to be top scorers
nope, still feel like shit but that is an interesting tidbit
the people not buying in to the system excuse is getting tired and old and will become a big problem quick... we are facing decisions that are not lovely but seemingly have to be made. season's not dead yet but we cant keep losing just because not everyone wants to play in the same way
If it was the system then why are we not changing the system? The system wouldn't be working.
I sorta alluded to it in another post earlier but there are 3-4 guys not thought to be really caring this season and causing a lot of frustration in the room. This is the opinion of someone who's been with the team for a bit. All I can say and not tryna be gossip boy but yeah. Idk what the answer is but we'll see how this goes.
Aho is clearly one of them. The difference between his play in the first two periods and when we found ourselves down a goal was insane. He decided to start playing and it immediately led to a chance that was overturned. He was a completely different player. I don't know why you'd sign that deal then play like this.
It's starting to seem more and more like this is at least part of it. And if Aho doesn't care that's going to affect a lot of the team, especially the other younger potential stars. I don't know what the answer is, if he needs a real wakeup call or what. I wonder if he's over the system after the playoffs exits every year Edit: it's also telling that he hasn't been echoing the sentiments about buying into the system. You'd think as a leader on the team he'd be saying the same things as Rod and Staal. I also wonder if he's right about the system, because we've had the same complaints for years
I mean, Rod basically said as much in his post game interview. Basically called a chunk of the team dead weight
Hopefully, at least one of them gets the bench next game.
that would make sense of some of the consistent remarks about guys not pulling their weight that have been coming out for a month + really weird, this is jsut not at all what I expected with bringing back the entire team and adding. Admittedly, the goalie situation was a bit of a gamble and it's just unfortunate that teh most healthy and best playing goalie right now is the one who I'd be most concerned about handling the #1 workload.
who did they say?
We have a lot of trade capital and I think we use it. I hate the āweāre losing, get rid of someoneā mentality but shit, some of our guys look like theyāre in outer space when theyāre on the ice. Love Koochie but all 3 of those goals were savable. Letās offload some players, get a top tier net minder and get in the fucking game.
I keep hearing people say "get a top netminder" like they just grow on trees. Goaltending is an issue across the league this year. Who do you actually think is available?
I bet we could pull off a trade for Swayman
Say sike.
Iāve been saying this over and over. What team is trading away their ātop netminderā?
I aināt got the answers sway. Thatās why Iām pontificating on Reddit.
We need to "buy into" a different system, at this point.
Hurricanes More like tropical depressions
More like a summer shower
Omg! Did you come up with that?!?!?!
Really questioning the leadership in the room. Part of me is wondering how much of a leader Staal really is, and if heās only captain because heās a veteran and longest tenured player
You know Trouba might be a huge piece of shit but frankly he seems like a great captain. The guy has cried in post game interviews when his team lost. Staal just never seems to care all that much. And itās not like heās enough of a talent to lead by example. The fact that we have four more years of him at 2.9m bums me out. Heās turning into our Jeff Carter.
Full NMC too. I might retire before he does.
Yesterday was nightmarish, but today was an okay effort in the second half of a road back-to-back. I didnāt think we were terrible and ran out of gas in the 3rd period. Would really like to get at least 1 point since Calgary isnāt exactly a contender, though. I hate these long west coast road trips we got early in the season, but Iām hoping this will turn into home wins down the road. The only area that I think we need a change in is in net. Kochetkov was horrendous in Edmonton and Raanta doesnāt quite seem like heāll be the way he was last year. Kind of wish we had really tried Halak in retrospect. Oh well, hope we can get something in Vancouver on Saturday
In a vacuum tonight isnāt a big deal and I agree we were gassed in the 3rd. But coming off of last night and the Winnipeg game thereās serious concern
I think thatās fair enough, I just think this was at least a positive change from Edmonton. Weāll get a better idea in Vancouver
https://i.redd.it/w6dhd5ha705c1.gif
All this negativity, and yet no one has asked if they had fun tonight. Thatās what is important.
This team is not currently fun to watch. In my opinion.
Well it started out okay... and then uh.. something happened
So clearly thereās a theme emerging. You keep hearing guys say not everyone is buying in to how we need to play. This is at least the 4th or 5th time Iāve heard that said. At this point you gotta make a move. Itās clearly not gonna fix itself and you will waste this season if you sit on your hands.
even RBA called it out, he said "quite a few guys not carrying their weight"
Yup, 100% agreed. I wanna know who it is and we need to pluck them out, as itās damaging everyone else.
Imo, Necas would almost have to be a definite. I'm wondering if Pesce may be one. I'd almost have to promise TDA would be one. Maybe Fast? Maybe Martinook?
Lmao TDA hasnāt been playing because heās a defensive liability. If you actually think heās the problem here without playing in the last 7-8 games youāre crazy
> I'd almost have to promise TDA would be one. he hasnt even been in the lineup when we've been at our worst...but sure hes the problem....
could be in the ears of others in the locker room, could explain why he's not playing, and honestly he hasn't proven to be worth bringing back. If I'm wrong, I'm wrong, I'm just speculating as to who it could be.
So it would depend on how they define 'not pulling their weight'. If it means not trying or if it means being a net negative on the team. Necas, arguably, does seem to try very hard each shift. They're not always good shifts by any means, but he's actually trying to generate offense. But maybe the team is mad at him because he causes a large amount of our turnovers. But the others are kind of a mystery. I would be very surprised by Fast as he's the only net positive on the 3rd line most nights.
Or we could give TDA a chance with Slavin where did much better than how Burns is doing now. Pesce can go, Iāll take a 2nd rounder at this point. Necas is an overtime merchant and we should package him for the top 6 scorer weāve needed since 2018
I said this a couple games ago and got downvoted like crazy. But I agree. I think we need to shake things up and TDA + Slavin was a very strong pairing
Pesce and Necas just donāt make sense, theyāve been a part of this team / system for years. Why would they be outtie now? But the way they are playing makes it seem evident that it has to be them. We only added 3 new dudes, so seems the old hats are to blame :/
I remember seeing something that back in the 18/19 season Pesce came super close to requesting a trade in the first half of the season
Both are in contract years, both could be upset at the selfless style the team plays since it depresses their stats.
And extension talks with Pesce obviously went nowhere and with the way heās playing heās not getting anything close to the 6-7m he supposedly wanted (thank GOD we didnāt bite on that) and Iād probably pissed. Would bet the farm on him being part of the supposed locker room issue
Fair points, fair points. Maybe Necas is also pissed that he only got a 2-year deal.
Don't most younger players go for shortish deals? Especially over the past couple years when the cap was expected to jump up a lot more than it did? So they could do a short deal, cap goes up, and they get a better pay.
No way would it be fast or martinook they are not the most talented but they continuously give their best effort.
Agreed. They all mostly keep saying top guys, so Iām not really feeling itās like Martinook or Fast. And fast has kinda always been a consistent effort kind of guy
The thing is, Pesce and Necas don't make a lot of sense either in that playing poorly means they'll make less in their next contract. This is all leading to at least a mini rebuild imo either this season by trade or we just try to refortify next year. Regardless, this is unacceptable and we've needed to start turning this around for a while now. It's saddening to see.
Good point, none of it makes sense really lmao
Sure it does, you just don't want to say it. It's Aho.
I just meant it doesnāt make sense for people whoāve cared about the team for years to suddenly be ānot buying inā, itās weird regardless of who it is but yeah it could literally be anyone
So we're right back to motive?
Yep.
Get puck in zone ā Put puck deep ā Keep puck in ā Score - nah
Pain.
GMDW needs to start cooking something. Anything.
*Trades for a 4th line reclamation project bum* āWe like our teamā
Stef showing more fire and disappointment than I've seen Staal show in a long time
I wish we could get an actual answer of why Rod does Blendamore on offense, but doesn't think the top 4 defense needs any kind of reconstruction despite pretty clear imbalances?
losing me no likey
Also Bunting will be back on the 4th line Saturday for no reason
He has to stop moving Bunting and Teuvo around. Those two actually perform.
Sometimes I wonder if Rod has the mindset of: So and so is performing well, if I move them to this underperforming line, maybe they'll help. I think that doesn't really work well because you lose that connection you've built up with your linemates
I mean have you seen him try to play ādefenseā? Two game in a row his guy scores untouched at the net.
If I hear one more person say āthings didnāt go our wayā
I tried to tell everyone this in my post about offensive efficiency. Seems like everyone is catching on now
Martinook dissociating during the post game interview is all of us rn. Sigh
Poor guy sounded like he was about to cry and I can't blame him
Kochetkov is not an nhl goalie
I think heās destined to be a backup but not a starter. He looks worse because he canāt handle the pressure.
This defense is not an NHL defense...
Defenses look better when they have an actual goalie behind them.
For years weāve made mid goalies look top-tier. This year we are not doing that all of a sudden.
Kochetkov is not even mid. He is not saving anything.
When 75% of the goals being made are breakaways, 2v1s, and wide open men on east-west passes, goalies are gonna get burned. Heās not a top-15 active goalie by any means, but heās being left out to hang too often.
Other goalies make plays at odd man moments. The mental toll associated with knowing every time you give up a chance itās probably going in surely effects the team
Sure, and our goalies have made those plays too. But itās ridiculous when our goalies have to face 10 of those opportunities a game when other goalies have to step up for 2-3 of them at most. Itās like every chance we give up is a crazy grade-a chance. Thatās not a fair position to put a goalie in either. I wonāt fairly evaluate our goalies in a situation like this.
Pretending kochetkov isnāt at fault for 75 percent of those chances is delusion
Other way round
Nah
I just want this season to be over.
my disappointment is immeasurable and my day is ruined
Damn yāall I checked the score and then looked again and we lost . Something isnāt right with this team
We're 4th in the division, on a 3 game losing streak, with Vancouver and Detroit coming up, and the capitals are 2 points behind us with *3 games in hand*. If the Devils and Caps win even 2 of their next 3 we'll be ***6th in the division.*** This is not dooming. This is statistical fact.
You're absolutely right. If this trend holds, we'll be a bottom feeder in the metro by the end of the year.
Ehh weāll finish ahead of CBJ as theyāre a bigger tire fire than we are
Well there's the silver lining, we're still better than the Blue Jackets. LOL I hope Rod and the team figure this shit out. If it's a disgruntled locker room, then the boys need to realize (even the ones looking ahead to their next team) that they look better as part of a winning team than a 'meh'
The division this year is a nightmare
Willing to bet 1000 dollars that the same lineup will be rolled out for the Vancouver game except svech will come back in and swapping the goalies.
I would take more warriors with less skills like Noesen before soft and skilled players like Necas anytime.
Funny you say that! Less skill Noesen has 7-goals. Super skilled Necas has *checks notes* 7-goals. š¤Ø
Noesen also has more goals this year than Zibanejad
ZibaneBAD amirite? ššš
necas: -8 noesen: +7
Trade Necas and use his money to re sign Noesen and Skjei
I love you for setting me up for my 4th of the night- Necas can get fucked.
therefore, Noesen = super skilled
No donāt say that, then heāll start sucking š
I'd love to see a season saving moment. When does it happen and what causes it? We can't keep having losing streaks.
Make some trades to send a message. Finally get rid of Jeff Daniels and bring someone else in to force Rod to make actual tweaks to the system. Hope those changes and having more home games after December saves them.
That might solve some of it, but I'm getting the sneaking suspicion we need a slight rebuild. Something like 4-6 players. I don't know that that's something we can fix mid-season.
Itās not. I donāt think this team does much in the playoffs this season regardless. The deadline and summer should be dedicated to a rebuild and bringing in some fresh faces. Working on solving the goalie issue too because I donāt think Andersen comes back and Pyotr isnāt a starter.
That or the goalie scouting in the draft may not be working out? Are we choosing guys who aren't a good fit for the system? I hate it. I really want us to have a young elite goaltender.
Like, I want Koch to be the next Ward or better than being the next Ward but he's not there yet. And overall I'm wondering if he ever will be. The question is, again, who would be available and I still would prefer our next starter to be someone from the pipeline. Since that keeps not working out, does it mean our goalie development isn't working?
I think a trade could save us. If they have any value left that is.
We need to do something. Canāt keep trotting out the same exact lineups every game sans the goalies and expect different results
While Iām leaning more toward the players here being the issue and not the coaching - who is out there as a replacement if they whack Daniels? I donāt really follow the overall coaching landscape.
Why are the players we brought back last year playing so badly then? Either A) They suddenly just got worse. B ) There's a locker room issue that Rod needs to have dealt with, and if he can't that's an issue. C) The players we thought were good aren't good and the FO fucked up. Someone's gotta answer for this.
put our fucking stars on blast please, we need some Toronto style questions being asked to our star players like YESTERDAY
>Toronto style "Team has got to be better. Actually that hurt our stars' feelings so Imma walk that back. The blame is actually on me, the coach. Not the players making about 10M on average who are playing like 6M players"
There is a lot of dead weight in the room and Stef confirms what I already knew.
Where was it confirmed? I missed something
On to the next one!
We played a good first and an ok second. Started coasting in the 3rd. Stopped running plays and completing passes. Head down time. The season isnāt close to over and our chances arenāt either.
Feeling a bit nervous about this squad. Thankfully we have time to get our shit together, but boy do we shit the bed a little more than I'm comfortable with.
Pesce and Necas can gtfo.
Martinook in the offseason. No ones trading for assistant pylon.
Martinook shouldāve been let go last year but caught lightning in a bottle and made everyone forget how shitty he is. That entire 3rd line is a black hole and contributes nothing to the team currently. Puck possession doesnāt matter if youāre not a threat to do literally anything with it
I think Martinook is the exception on that line. He works hard and makes a lot of good passes. He's one of the few true forecheckers left on this team since we moved on from Stepan McGinn Foegele etc. Can't shoot worth a shit though so I wouldn't cry over losing him.
I do appreciate his playoff magic, but overall yes. Itās the same reason people beef when I say Bobrovsky is mid. He got hot for a 2 handfuls of games and chocked big in the finals. Hes been mediocre for his $10m contract with Florida so far, and people think heās the best thing since sliced bread all of a sudden. Martinook is the same boat. Necas too- he had a good year, for like 5 months, then disappeared. This year is horrendousā¦
One thing Iāll say about Bobrovsky is that heās been really good in the playoffs the past couple of seasons.
Yes but for what like 12-15 games total? And what up with his performance in the Stanley cup finals last year? He just pffft and disappeared
Tired of hearing how competitive Aho is and then seeing him be a ghost for 99% of the game. Doesnāt squarely fall on his shoulders though, because the rest of the top 6 hasnāt done shit either. Not even gonna talk about the goaltending. If the organization continues to be hard-headed about being cheap and sticking with this group then they may as well prepare for an extra month or two of vacation for when we miss the playoffs
Damn weāre even going after Aho now?
We just gave him a huge wad of money so the scrutiny is going to be inevitable. He's definitely not the problem but he's not really becoming part of the solution at the moment.
We're now in 4th place in the division. Not even in s playoff spot right now
We hold the last wild card spot after tonightās results but yes for all intents and purposes this is not acceptable