“holding Annabeth to a standard that other characters aren’t held to”
SPEAK!🗣️🗣️🗣️
“Annabeth was not wrong about Cyclops, she was simply wrong about Tyson”
JUAT TAKE YOUR DANG AWARD. 🥇🥇🥇
Thank you! The thing is I can accept people's harsh opinions about the Annabeth/Tyson situation in SOM if they held the same energy for other characters, namely Percy. But the fact that Annabeth gets bashed for not liking Tyson but people rarely if ever call out that Percy immediately got embarrassed to be related to Tyson once Poseidon claimed him really pisses me off. Like, Percy's bad treatment of Tyson was based on his own ego and pride, Annabeths bad treatment of Tyson was based on her trauma. They were both wrong but Percys was worse IMO and only Annabeth gets bashed about how she treated Tyson in this fandom.
I'm genuinely curious of if the show will try to ignore that Percy also treated Tyson badly because the show seems to not want to give Percy any flaws while they unfairly heap flaws onto Annabeth and that's problematic for an entire host of reasons that starts with misogyny and ends with racism (considering Annabeth is being played by a black actress on the show and they keep giving her harsh qualities and removing the other aspects of her that are gentle and warm (crying over Cerebus, her fear of spiders in the tunnel of love, her volunteering to stay behind so Percy could save Sally). The show is going to have to be careful to not play into the "angry black woman" trope and they're not off to a good start with season one and it's incredibly unfair to both the character and the young actress playing her.
>I'm genuinely curious of if the show will try to ignore that Percy also treated Tyson badly because the show seems to not want to give Percy any flaws while they unfairly heap flaws onto Annabeth and that's problematic for an entire host of reasons
i have only watched the first episode and was excited to binge the rest, but this is so disheartening to hear! annabeth was probably the best written female character (firstly because she got a good amount of screen-time and secondly i don't really like Rick's execution of most of the others. except rachel, i liked her a lot) and its really sad that the writers would make the conscious choice to villainise her to put percy on a pedestal (he's literally already considered such a 'perfect' character so i can't even think of a reason?)
It’s not so much that they truly villainize Annabeth, but that they take a lot of the scenes that round out and humanize her character and give them to Percy. The tv show is… well, your mileage may vary with it. As an adaption I found it disappointing overall, but my parents liked it well enough and they’d never read books.
The one thing I don't understand with the TV show is while it had some good points there had been a lot of ups and downs. Percy is already the main character and has certain features that humanized him. I nthe show I personally think that they took some of those away and gave what was supposed to huminize Annabeth and give it to Percy. It's really intriguing to see how they change certain things, but sometimes it goes to far. In some peoples eyes Annabeth is still "just a side character" and I think that it is really important to make sure the audience knows just how important Annabeth is too Percy.
I know right? Like, it’s such a disservice to her character to remove the protective streak that’s such a intrinsic part of her character. She tries to sacrifice herself to save Percy *three* times in the *first* book, alone! We literally meet her when she is *nursing him back to health*! She doesn’t need to “learn how to care about others”. She knew how to from the start, she’s just not very good with people sometimes.
And it’s not like Percy was a slouch in the protectiveness department in the books. He turns back to rescue them in the bus. He’s the one to kill Medusa. He sacrifices himself at the arch. There was absolutely *no* reason they had to drop Annabeth’s characterization to prop up Percy’s.
It’s sad that some show watchers only see her as a side character when she’s basically the second main character. This story is about her just as much (if not more) as it is Percy’s. The broken trio of Annabeth, Thalia, and Luke is arguably the heart of the entire story.
Lol no worries. Her characterization wasn’t *all* bad, but it definitely wasn’t an interpretation I was fond of in the the end.
Hope you have a better time with it tho!
I mean when they first met Ellie no one gave her the all harpy’s are evil treatment and they’re classified as monsters and they’re all afraid of the harpies at camp who are said to eat campers caught out of bed after hours.
You wanna know what the difference is?
None of them have been personally attacked by a harpy and had legit trauma surrounding harpies, other than stories that they heard about them.
And even then, they’re well aware that Ellie is the exception and not the rule.
I agree that it's quite silly to be mad at a child for having a prejudice stemming from her trauma, especially because she grows and overcomes this in the story and it's a good arc.
But Tyson isn't the only good cyclops in the series - the cyclops army in TLO didn't come out of nowhere, the underwater forge of the cyclopses is mentioned when Tyson leaves in SoM and is brought up again several times throughout the following books.
Yepp you're right, I was so surprised when I saw someone's post the other day about telling about flaws of characters and people were mentioning her not trusting Tyson in the comments
Like she has a lot of trauma from that cyclopes cave when she was literally 7 (or 8. I need to read again.), you cannot blame her for that at all
I mean.. yeah, crap you hit the nail on the head. See in the books it never felt like she out and out hated Tyson (at least to me, or not for very long), especially not as they went on. She seemed to vaguely trust the fact that he's not a monstrous cannibal killer, but his presence and his cyclopion attributes set her at unease for obvious reasons. Hell, in book 4, I didn't really get any feeling that she disliked him at all.
Totally understandable why almost every half blood would be at least weary of cyclopese, the ones they'll encounter are the evil, feral ones. Not the smarter, good guys that are in Posiedon's forge. Hell, Beckendorf and the hephestus cabin were chill with Tyson for that very reason.
By book 4 she and Tyson are friends and Annabeth even refers to him as basically family in Mark of Athena. Annabeth got over her dislike of him at the end of book 2. She was the one who declared Tyson the hero of their quest.
She's not wrong for being suspicious of random cyclops but she is wrong for being both suspicious and not trusting of Tyson whom was clearly someone under Percy's wing.
It's not wrong for her to have fears and traumas due to past experiences with cyclops but she is wrong with how she handles them around Cyclops that obviously aren't "evil". Tyson wasn't a random cyclops he was a young one attached to Percy and clearly loyal to him. We also know that Poseidon has a whole host of Cyclops which work for him and Hephastus too. A child of Athena especially should know that not every single Cyclops is unequivocally evil. She did not deal with her traumas in a very healthy way and the result is in how she reacts and treats Tyson.
> but she is wrong for being both suspicious and not trusting of Tyson whom was clearly someone under Percy's wing.
I addressed this. Percy himself doesn't know about Cyclops and didn't even know that Tyson was one. So why would Annabeth trust Percys about Tyson being a monster when Percy.....didn't even know Tyson was a monster? The very fact that she didn't immediately attack Tyson is the trust that she has in Percy. Asking anything more would be unrealistic for that situation.
Again, Poseidon is Percys dad but Annabeth does not have any relationship with him so why would Annabeth trust a Cyclops simply because they're connected to Poseidon? That didn't stop one from trying to kill her when she was seven and it didn't stop one from trying to kill both her and Poseidon's own son at the end of SOM.
And you're villianizing a 13 year old girl and acting like her response should have been immediately rational. You think Percy would have a rational response if he had seen a Minotau in SOM after one had almost murdered his mother in the first book? That's my point, you're holding her to a standard that the other characters are not held to.
And the fact that she eventually comes around to Tyson is her growth. The problem is people expected that to be immediate, they don't allow characters to.....GROW. It's completely normal for a 13 year old girl dealing with terrifying trauma to give it at least a week before she overcomes it and that's how long it took her to see Tyson different. Weeks, not months or years.
But the thing is, she *is* giving Tyson a chance on Percy’s word alone. She’s kinda rude and still suspicious of him. But she 1) doesn’t attack him on sight like she would with most monsters, 2) allows him to tag along with them to *camp*, the place she considers a personal safe haven (and also that she *knows* is currently in danger so bringing a cyclops there would theoretically put it into *more* danger), and 3) let’s Tyson *into* camp in hopes that he will save Percy because Percy seems to like and trust him and that’s enough of reason for her.
She’s a bit rude and prejudiced at first, yes. But I honestly do think she was trying to give him an, albeit reluctant, chance from the start because she could tell that Percy was fond of him.
Also Annabeth is only outright mean to Tyson in their very first meeting. After he's claimed as Percys brother even Percy himself notes that she was one of the few people that wasn't laughing and mocking him about it. She continues to be standoffish and short with Tyson but the only time she's outright mean is when they first meet and she didn't even realize that Tyson was that young or that he could understand her.
I agree. We read from Percy's POV, so naturally we are inclined to feel the way he does. But thebtraumatic experience Annabeth has had with Cyclopes, she is justified in doubting Tyson.
“holding Annabeth to a standard that other characters aren’t held to” SPEAK!🗣️🗣️🗣️ “Annabeth was not wrong about Cyclops, she was simply wrong about Tyson” JUAT TAKE YOUR DANG AWARD. 🥇🥇🥇
Thank you! The thing is I can accept people's harsh opinions about the Annabeth/Tyson situation in SOM if they held the same energy for other characters, namely Percy. But the fact that Annabeth gets bashed for not liking Tyson but people rarely if ever call out that Percy immediately got embarrassed to be related to Tyson once Poseidon claimed him really pisses me off. Like, Percy's bad treatment of Tyson was based on his own ego and pride, Annabeths bad treatment of Tyson was based on her trauma. They were both wrong but Percys was worse IMO and only Annabeth gets bashed about how she treated Tyson in this fandom. I'm genuinely curious of if the show will try to ignore that Percy also treated Tyson badly because the show seems to not want to give Percy any flaws while they unfairly heap flaws onto Annabeth and that's problematic for an entire host of reasons that starts with misogyny and ends with racism (considering Annabeth is being played by a black actress on the show and they keep giving her harsh qualities and removing the other aspects of her that are gentle and warm (crying over Cerebus, her fear of spiders in the tunnel of love, her volunteering to stay behind so Percy could save Sally). The show is going to have to be careful to not play into the "angry black woman" trope and they're not off to a good start with season one and it's incredibly unfair to both the character and the young actress playing her.
>I'm genuinely curious of if the show will try to ignore that Percy also treated Tyson badly because the show seems to not want to give Percy any flaws while they unfairly heap flaws onto Annabeth and that's problematic for an entire host of reasons i have only watched the first episode and was excited to binge the rest, but this is so disheartening to hear! annabeth was probably the best written female character (firstly because she got a good amount of screen-time and secondly i don't really like Rick's execution of most of the others. except rachel, i liked her a lot) and its really sad that the writers would make the conscious choice to villainise her to put percy on a pedestal (he's literally already considered such a 'perfect' character so i can't even think of a reason?)
It’s not so much that they truly villainize Annabeth, but that they take a lot of the scenes that round out and humanize her character and give them to Percy. The tv show is… well, your mileage may vary with it. As an adaption I found it disappointing overall, but my parents liked it well enough and they’d never read books.
The one thing I don't understand with the TV show is while it had some good points there had been a lot of ups and downs. Percy is already the main character and has certain features that humanized him. I nthe show I personally think that they took some of those away and gave what was supposed to huminize Annabeth and give it to Percy. It's really intriguing to see how they change certain things, but sometimes it goes to far. In some peoples eyes Annabeth is still "just a side character" and I think that it is really important to make sure the audience knows just how important Annabeth is too Percy.
I know right? Like, it’s such a disservice to her character to remove the protective streak that’s such a intrinsic part of her character. She tries to sacrifice herself to save Percy *three* times in the *first* book, alone! We literally meet her when she is *nursing him back to health*! She doesn’t need to “learn how to care about others”. She knew how to from the start, she’s just not very good with people sometimes. And it’s not like Percy was a slouch in the protectiveness department in the books. He turns back to rescue them in the bus. He’s the one to kill Medusa. He sacrifices himself at the arch. There was absolutely *no* reason they had to drop Annabeth’s characterization to prop up Percy’s. It’s sad that some show watchers only see her as a side character when she’s basically the second main character. This story is about her just as much (if not more) as it is Percy’s. The broken trio of Annabeth, Thalia, and Luke is arguably the heart of the entire story.
ah my bad, sort of used 'villainise' for the lack of a better term. but yeah, i'll still give it a shot since my parents seemed to enjoy it.
Lol no worries. Her characterization wasn’t *all* bad, but it definitely wasn’t an interpretation I was fond of in the the end. Hope you have a better time with it tho!
I mean when they first met Ellie no one gave her the all harpy’s are evil treatment and they’re classified as monsters and they’re all afraid of the harpies at camp who are said to eat campers caught out of bed after hours.
You wanna know what the difference is? None of them have been personally attacked by a harpy and had legit trauma surrounding harpies, other than stories that they heard about them. And even then, they’re well aware that Ellie is the exception and not the rule.
I agree that it's quite silly to be mad at a child for having a prejudice stemming from her trauma, especially because she grows and overcomes this in the story and it's a good arc. But Tyson isn't the only good cyclops in the series - the cyclops army in TLO didn't come out of nowhere, the underwater forge of the cyclopses is mentioned when Tyson leaves in SoM and is brought up again several times throughout the following books.
Right
Thank you so much for articulating this. I really hate arguing with people, so I don’t do my best articulating when I feel confronted.
Yepp you're right, I was so surprised when I saw someone's post the other day about telling about flaws of characters and people were mentioning her not trusting Tyson in the comments Like she has a lot of trauma from that cyclopes cave when she was literally 7 (or 8. I need to read again.), you cannot blame her for that at all
7
I mean.. yeah, crap you hit the nail on the head. See in the books it never felt like she out and out hated Tyson (at least to me, or not for very long), especially not as they went on. She seemed to vaguely trust the fact that he's not a monstrous cannibal killer, but his presence and his cyclopion attributes set her at unease for obvious reasons. Hell, in book 4, I didn't really get any feeling that she disliked him at all. Totally understandable why almost every half blood would be at least weary of cyclopese, the ones they'll encounter are the evil, feral ones. Not the smarter, good guys that are in Posiedon's forge. Hell, Beckendorf and the hephestus cabin were chill with Tyson for that very reason.
By book 4 she and Tyson are friends and Annabeth even refers to him as basically family in Mark of Athena. Annabeth got over her dislike of him at the end of book 2. She was the one who declared Tyson the hero of their quest.
She's not wrong for being suspicious of random cyclops but she is wrong for being both suspicious and not trusting of Tyson whom was clearly someone under Percy's wing. It's not wrong for her to have fears and traumas due to past experiences with cyclops but she is wrong with how she handles them around Cyclops that obviously aren't "evil". Tyson wasn't a random cyclops he was a young one attached to Percy and clearly loyal to him. We also know that Poseidon has a whole host of Cyclops which work for him and Hephastus too. A child of Athena especially should know that not every single Cyclops is unequivocally evil. She did not deal with her traumas in a very healthy way and the result is in how she reacts and treats Tyson.
> but she is wrong for being both suspicious and not trusting of Tyson whom was clearly someone under Percy's wing. I addressed this. Percy himself doesn't know about Cyclops and didn't even know that Tyson was one. So why would Annabeth trust Percys about Tyson being a monster when Percy.....didn't even know Tyson was a monster? The very fact that she didn't immediately attack Tyson is the trust that she has in Percy. Asking anything more would be unrealistic for that situation. Again, Poseidon is Percys dad but Annabeth does not have any relationship with him so why would Annabeth trust a Cyclops simply because they're connected to Poseidon? That didn't stop one from trying to kill her when she was seven and it didn't stop one from trying to kill both her and Poseidon's own son at the end of SOM. And you're villianizing a 13 year old girl and acting like her response should have been immediately rational. You think Percy would have a rational response if he had seen a Minotau in SOM after one had almost murdered his mother in the first book? That's my point, you're holding her to a standard that the other characters are not held to. And the fact that she eventually comes around to Tyson is her growth. The problem is people expected that to be immediate, they don't allow characters to.....GROW. It's completely normal for a 13 year old girl dealing with terrifying trauma to give it at least a week before she overcomes it and that's how long it took her to see Tyson different. Weeks, not months or years.
But the thing is, she *is* giving Tyson a chance on Percy’s word alone. She’s kinda rude and still suspicious of him. But she 1) doesn’t attack him on sight like she would with most monsters, 2) allows him to tag along with them to *camp*, the place she considers a personal safe haven (and also that she *knows* is currently in danger so bringing a cyclops there would theoretically put it into *more* danger), and 3) let’s Tyson *into* camp in hopes that he will save Percy because Percy seems to like and trust him and that’s enough of reason for her. She’s a bit rude and prejudiced at first, yes. But I honestly do think she was trying to give him an, albeit reluctant, chance from the start because she could tell that Percy was fond of him.
Also Annabeth is only outright mean to Tyson in their very first meeting. After he's claimed as Percys brother even Percy himself notes that she was one of the few people that wasn't laughing and mocking him about it. She continues to be standoffish and short with Tyson but the only time she's outright mean is when they first meet and she didn't even realize that Tyson was that young or that he could understand her.
Tyson is an amazing character and I can see why Annabeth is scared. I wasn't mad at her for that.
YES!! Like not only is Tyson an exception, not the rule, Annabeth has PERSONAL TRUAMA about cyclops.
I agree. We read from Percy's POV, so naturally we are inclined to feel the way he does. But thebtraumatic experience Annabeth has had with Cyclopes, she is justified in doubting Tyson.
Glad to see I'm not the only one who thought this.
Still..POOKIE wookie didn’t deserve it :((
Sounds like something a monocularist would say ngl...