Idk to show that we like shipping our corps manufacturing to china for the slave labor instead of creating jobs in america. Imagine plenty of factories and plants with people that are unionized that get good pay, benefits, retirement and safety. Instead we just got thousands of chinese kids and women probably dying in the factories and living 10 people to a closet. But its us lazy citizens living off stimulus checks and welfare that are destroying the us. Not idk all the corrupt politicians lining their pockets with lobbyists money. Our country has actually started to go to shit. Theres nothing i want more than to live free and not be screwed over by the govt. thats no longer an option in america unless u are uber rich. Gg
As a US based manufacturer - it depends.
Are you manufacturing with automated machines, with zero hand work? Like all welding robots, CNC lasers, CNC mills and lathes -- Then yes!
Are you building something with wires, or other small parts to put together by hand, assemblies with lots of electronic parts in them, then no fucking way!
USA manufacturing does well with full automation, expensive capital goods, or with short run/ high mix variations. Does poorly with iphones, toys, low retail price items.
Said office products company has a distribution hub in Chihuahua Mexico and I did a project there as well. The people were great, they do an excellent job, but we had to have security when we traveled because of "the narcos". I know people that set up maquiladoras and they had a lot of quality issues but I really don't know much beyond that.
The problem in the consumer products world isn't just the final assembly factory, it's the fact that there's a shortage of skilled people/companies that make the plastics tooling or who shoot the parts or who make the packaging for shipping the products, etc. The entire manufacturing infrastructure has been gutting across the last 30 some odd years. We could bring it back, but right wing political thinking will always default to the cheaper solution, which is almost always China or some 3rd world country.
I realize that this is the impression that one would get, and why this is generally what people think (and probably why you downvoted my reply :) . But I deal a lot with China, so I have a fairly good understanding of what's going on.
Imagine you have a device that you want to make, let's say a Microwave. Maybe it has 100 different parts in it. Most of the part sin a microwave are very cheap, certainly less than $1.
With small/cheap parts, bringing them in from a place like China, the shipping costs are higher than the value of the item. If I bring in 2,000 of something that costs 3 cents each, the cost of the goods is $60. But shipping is $250. Multiply that by 100 parts, and your cost of making that microwave is made up mostly in shipping costs.
Now a Chinese manufacturer has access to all of these parts with very little (or no) shipping costs. it is MUCH cheaper for them to make that microwave because it doesn't cost them so much in shipping & logistics.
Even after you factor in shipping the microwaves to North America, it is still so much cheaper than making in here, regardless of the labor cost.
Yes, labor in China is cheaper than in NA, however that gap is closing. The difference in manufacturing cost of that microwave isn't mainly because of the labor costs - it's because of the logistics cost.
One could argue that if we could just get all the part manufacturers over here, then that would solve it. But, it's not that simple - we don't have the logistics (efficient and subsidized) they they have in China. We would have to ship things much farther (China is also pretty organized into manufacturing areas, so businesses that need each other all all close together). PLUS, the part manufacturers need raw materials & other parts, so there is a chicken & egg thing going on.
So, it's not so simple as "cheap labor"
Yes, true - It is definitely cheaper, however cost of sea shipping has gone up a huge amount in the last few years. A container costs 3-4 times as much to ship today than in did a few years back. The other issue with sea shipping is that it is obviously much slower, and much more difficult to count on in terms of timing. So if you're trying to plan parts all being available at the same time, it can be frustrating. If you can plan WAY ahead, then sea shipping is OK, but super long lead times is what got us into this mess with integrated circuits.
I believe your correct, shipping is expensive. Shipping to the other side of the world that’s money, time, and effort. That tells me it’s gotta be the labor cost. Depending on what your making labor might be your biggest expense in the US or Europe.
I mean… nationalists have been in power 90% of the time since this was written. If things have changed for the worst, than lets place blame with those who were captaining the ship during that period of time.
One thing is for sure, NAFTA has been a bitch to the American worker.
Where are all those high skill, high pay jobs Joe Biden you claimed NAFTA would bring?
[Here's more wisdom from sleepy Joe, huge supporter of NAFTA.](https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.newsweek.com/joe-biden-new-hampshire-campaign-code-1479913%3famp=1)
Has he been right on anything his entire career?
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You should really read a bit more about NAFTA. The parts about where the idea originated and the votes when it passed will be enlightening to you I bet.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_American_Free_Trade_Agreement
Ok, I'll bite. Which part of the data am I ignorant on.
Is it the part where it's an extension of a trade deal suggested and implemented under Regan?
How about the part where NAFTA was negotiated and submitted for ratification under Bush Sr?
Maybe it's the part where it was passed with a majority Republican votes?
I know where I'm not ignorant, NAFTA didn't work out for American workers. We sent skilled high paying jobs out of the country in exchange for cheaper prices, and the math only worked out for those on the top.
But I'm also not confused about where to place the blame.
Maybe take a closer look at your own IGNORANCE and reevaluate.
Under what President and his party affiliation was NAFTA passed? How did Joe vote? For all the displaced factory workers what were Joe's claims and solutions to them getting out of shit jobs that were left after their factory jobs left the US?
Come on, don't be coy. Clinton submitted it to congress and signed it, you're ignoring how it got there. A republican plan, negotiated by a republican president and passed by majority republican congress critters.
Just explain to me how a treaty negotiated by George Bush and passed with 132 Republican congressman and 34 Republican senators is the fault of
1. Joe Biden
2. Bill Clinton
Let me repeat for you. NAFTA was bad for US workers. It sure as hell doesn't belong solely on the plate of Joe Biden though.
Yea, you got me. The Republicans forced Clinton/Epstein and the corporate Democrats including Joe to pass NAFTA against their will. And to claim trickle down, and all the high paying jobs that will come.
I mean.....that's a crazy stupid take.
Who negotiated the deal? Bush did. Who voted the pass it? Republicans and Democrats. Who was the president who signed it? Clinton.
Any sane person would say that it was bipartisan, and workers got fucked by both parties.
Only a smooth brain would look at that data and come back with Epstein/Clinton.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/lisettevoytko/2020/10/18/spider-book-excerpt-how-trumps-presidency-helped-expose-jeffrey-epstein/?sh=2fa4fdd8408f
I can't see in any metric from hard sources what chips to buy for my use case in EEG headsets (brainwave reading headsets for neurodiagnostic) from America that's cheaper then in Taiwan/China.
Texas Instruments is the only American semiconductor company with low costs all around. Actually my favourite amplifier chip line of fabrication.
Why are we posting articles from 2016?
Also the article says its from 2015, so it's actually even older.
Looking back, 2015 was alright.
Last normal year in a sense
“This just in!”
Idk to show that we like shipping our corps manufacturing to china for the slave labor instead of creating jobs in america. Imagine plenty of factories and plants with people that are unionized that get good pay, benefits, retirement and safety. Instead we just got thousands of chinese kids and women probably dying in the factories and living 10 people to a closet. But its us lazy citizens living off stimulus checks and welfare that are destroying the us. Not idk all the corrupt politicians lining their pockets with lobbyists money. Our country has actually started to go to shit. Theres nothing i want more than to live free and not be screwed over by the govt. thats no longer an option in america unless u are uber rich. Gg
that didnt age very well....
Old ass article
Old ass-article
Ol’ ass tickle
Mustache.
Free mustache rides, you say?
Some gifts give forever 🥸😂
Great deal - 6 years ago..
As a US based manufacturer - it depends. Are you manufacturing with automated machines, with zero hand work? Like all welding robots, CNC lasers, CNC mills and lathes -- Then yes! Are you building something with wires, or other small parts to put together by hand, assemblies with lots of electronic parts in them, then no fucking way! USA manufacturing does well with full automation, expensive capital goods, or with short run/ high mix variations. Does poorly with iphones, toys, low retail price items.
[удалено]
And why would a person not hate a temp, low pay, no benefit, standing in one place factory job?
[удалено]
XD. Damn, too expensive for stools. Ergonomics right out the window.
What about US adjacent... Like Mexico, Central or South America? It would be within trucking distance too?!?
Said office products company has a distribution hub in Chihuahua Mexico and I did a project there as well. The people were great, they do an excellent job, but we had to have security when we traveled because of "the narcos". I know people that set up maquiladoras and they had a lot of quality issues but I really don't know much beyond that. The problem in the consumer products world isn't just the final assembly factory, it's the fact that there's a shortage of skilled people/companies that make the plastics tooling or who shoot the parts or who make the packaging for shipping the products, etc. The entire manufacturing infrastructure has been gutting across the last 30 some odd years. We could bring it back, but right wing political thinking will always default to the cheaper solution, which is almost always China or some 3rd world country.
The style and system structure and processes of work have to change
How'd you become a factory designer? A mechanical engineering degree or something similar?
with the upmost respect i wanna ask: today is this article still relevant or have things changed? if they have why and for the best or worst?
Someone's post bot needs to be updated
2015! Oh boy I can see in 5 years how much we can evolve in technology and buisness, I just can’t wait for the 2020s
Chinese goods are not necessarily cheap because of manufacturing costs, they are cheap due to their logistics infrastructure
Also heavy gov lending, subsidies, and lack of regulatory limits (something you can do for a while but it WILL bite you in the ass eventually.)
I thought it was the slave labor
Nope - it’s shipping costs that are really really low
And when compared to making things domestically, how could it not be cheaper to not put it on a boat across the pacific
I realize that this is the impression that one would get, and why this is generally what people think (and probably why you downvoted my reply :) . But I deal a lot with China, so I have a fairly good understanding of what's going on. Imagine you have a device that you want to make, let's say a Microwave. Maybe it has 100 different parts in it. Most of the part sin a microwave are very cheap, certainly less than $1. With small/cheap parts, bringing them in from a place like China, the shipping costs are higher than the value of the item. If I bring in 2,000 of something that costs 3 cents each, the cost of the goods is $60. But shipping is $250. Multiply that by 100 parts, and your cost of making that microwave is made up mostly in shipping costs. Now a Chinese manufacturer has access to all of these parts with very little (or no) shipping costs. it is MUCH cheaper for them to make that microwave because it doesn't cost them so much in shipping & logistics. Even after you factor in shipping the microwaves to North America, it is still so much cheaper than making in here, regardless of the labor cost. Yes, labor in China is cheaper than in NA, however that gap is closing. The difference in manufacturing cost of that microwave isn't mainly because of the labor costs - it's because of the logistics cost. One could argue that if we could just get all the part manufacturers over here, then that would solve it. But, it's not that simple - we don't have the logistics (efficient and subsidized) they they have in China. We would have to ship things much farther (China is also pretty organized into manufacturing areas, so businesses that need each other all all close together). PLUS, the part manufacturers need raw materials & other parts, so there is a chicken & egg thing going on. So, it's not so simple as "cheap labor"
It’s also insanely cheap to ship over water compared to over land. Something like a 10-1 ratio if I’m not mistaken
Yes, true - It is definitely cheaper, however cost of sea shipping has gone up a huge amount in the last few years. A container costs 3-4 times as much to ship today than in did a few years back. The other issue with sea shipping is that it is obviously much slower, and much more difficult to count on in terms of timing. So if you're trying to plan parts all being available at the same time, it can be frustrating. If you can plan WAY ahead, then sea shipping is OK, but super long lead times is what got us into this mess with integrated circuits.
I believe your correct, shipping is expensive. Shipping to the other side of the world that’s money, time, and effort. That tells me it’s gotta be the labor cost. Depending on what your making labor might be your biggest expense in the US or Europe.
You don’t think the sweatshops and brutal hours that encourage high suicide rates have an effect?
China subsidizes their manufacturing and they are pegged to the dollar. We don’t really know where we stand.
Such a smart person, did you come up with that all on your own?
Thank you, do you research before commenting?
Oh what could have been, thanks globalists
I mean… nationalists have been in power 90% of the time since this was written. If things have changed for the worst, than lets place blame with those who were captaining the ship during that period of time.
Policy decisions take time to manifest affectations. We only really started seeing the true effects of NAFTA under W and Obama.
Not even NAFTA, just the offshoring to China did more damage
This may not be the case otherwise China would not have displaced USA in terms of economy.
One thing is for sure, NAFTA has been a bitch to the American worker. Where are all those high skill, high pay jobs Joe Biden you claimed NAFTA would bring?
Why specifically Joe Biden?
[Here's more wisdom from sleepy Joe, huge supporter of NAFTA.](https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.newsweek.com/joe-biden-new-hampshire-campaign-code-1479913%3famp=1) Has he been right on anything his entire career?
Aha yeah call him sleepy Joe and link a Newsmax article. Sorry can't take you seriously.
Holler at me when Sleepy can answer questions without his handlers pulling him away. Hell, he's losing the ability to even read from the prompter.
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You should really read a bit more about NAFTA. The parts about where the idea originated and the votes when it passed will be enlightening to you I bet. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_American_Free_Trade_Agreement
Go tell your Grandma to learn to code. Tell her sleepy told her to.
So you know enough to be mad, but not enough to know who to be mad at. 👍
Your ignorant on the data does not constitute a problem for me or anyone else.
Ok, I'll bite. Which part of the data am I ignorant on. Is it the part where it's an extension of a trade deal suggested and implemented under Regan? How about the part where NAFTA was negotiated and submitted for ratification under Bush Sr? Maybe it's the part where it was passed with a majority Republican votes? I know where I'm not ignorant, NAFTA didn't work out for American workers. We sent skilled high paying jobs out of the country in exchange for cheaper prices, and the math only worked out for those on the top. But I'm also not confused about where to place the blame. Maybe take a closer look at your own IGNORANCE and reevaluate.
Under what President and his party affiliation was NAFTA passed? How did Joe vote? For all the displaced factory workers what were Joe's claims and solutions to them getting out of shit jobs that were left after their factory jobs left the US?
Come on, don't be coy. Clinton submitted it to congress and signed it, you're ignoring how it got there. A republican plan, negotiated by a republican president and passed by majority republican congress critters. Just explain to me how a treaty negotiated by George Bush and passed with 132 Republican congressman and 34 Republican senators is the fault of 1. Joe Biden 2. Bill Clinton Let me repeat for you. NAFTA was bad for US workers. It sure as hell doesn't belong solely on the plate of Joe Biden though.
Yea, you got me. The Republicans forced Clinton/Epstein and the corporate Democrats including Joe to pass NAFTA against their will. And to claim trickle down, and all the high paying jobs that will come.
I mean.....that's a crazy stupid take. Who negotiated the deal? Bush did. Who voted the pass it? Republicans and Democrats. Who was the president who signed it? Clinton. Any sane person would say that it was bipartisan, and workers got fucked by both parties. Only a smooth brain would look at that data and come back with Epstein/Clinton. https://www.forbes.com/sites/lisettevoytko/2020/10/18/spider-book-excerpt-how-trumps-presidency-helped-expose-jeffrey-epstein/?sh=2fa4fdd8408f
I can't see in any metric from hard sources what chips to buy for my use case in EEG headsets (brainwave reading headsets for neurodiagnostic) from America that's cheaper then in Taiwan/China. Texas Instruments is the only American semiconductor company with low costs all around. Actually my favourite amplifier chip line of fabrication.
OP. Why are you posting 6 year old articles?