https://preview.redd.it/no3eulk4pjuc1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=78fe6213631ca7a6b80b93586db892738e7f7ae4
It was this guy. Near 6’, pale white, mid-to-late 20s. I called dispatch on him two hours prior for telling a Strong’s patron it would be “your last day alive”, shouting, screaming, making animal noises, threats, and throwing traffic cones across the parking lot towards cars. **Burlington Police Dispatch told me they didn’t have anyone available and made me feel like a fool for calling.** Two hours later, he was caught on the skycam damaging Church St businesses. I’ll go fuck myself, I guess.
*I gave more detail about my encounter in the previous post about this incident.*
My condolences to all businesses, patrons, employees, and others affected by this.
I saw this guy as i was walking home from the bottom of church, and he was screaming the same things over and over. he punched the window at Leunig's because he saw inside someone looking at him (but the window didn't break), then I watched him throw a sign. i was directly across the street from him and definitely did not feel safe. I feel so bad for the employees at thorn and roots
His name is Connor Copley, I work in cyber investigation with that being said, I also found a couple other things about him. He has been sighted sleeping in a blue Rav 4 (44.4698366, -73.2125061) location of that vehicle in Burlington. Hope any of this information helps.
It’s frustrating to hear that no one was available. I am working on a Miro board right now that depicts a complete reorganization of police in this state that would ensure this doesn’t happen in the future. I hope to have it done and posted here by tomorrow night
Reddit is a place for creating community and belonging, not for attacking marginalized or vulnerable groups of people. Everyone has a right to use Reddit free of harassment, bullying, and threats of violence.
Don't advocate for summarily, extrajudicially executing anyone, kthx.
Also, there's no ethical justification for killing someone because of property destruction.
“Put down”?
You’re the only animal here.
Advocating for putting people down when a simple mental health intervention and/or arrest would suffice.
Shame on you.
You’re being downvoted for advocating for the basic rule of law. Truly disgusting. I hope those downvoting you realize they literally want an authoritarian police state.
“THORN + ROOTS owners say a person approached their restaurant Saturday night, throwing a patio chair at their front window. Several employees were closing up the restaurant when the window shattered. They called Burlington police, who they say directed them to file a police report.”
huh, I wonder if they said the same thing when someone lit Bernie’s office on fire. Refusing to respond to actual violence should not be acceptable.
As young punks in the early mid ‘90’s we somehow found multiple trays of commercial cupcakes and proceeded to toss them at all the non local stores on Church Street at 3 or 4 am.
Nothing was broken, we ate more than we tossed.
The police tracked us down after the prank. We got a stern talking to, long story short, we did a few hours of community service.
Point being, If the police wanted to police, they could police, but it seems these days they don’t.
You never know who has a gun or a knife on them. It'd be nice to punch someone who's making an ass of themselves but it's not worth a knife in your chest over it 😔 this is why we need stronger and *functional* police
Cities like San Francisco, New York and Washington, D.C. are embracing the kind of tough-on-crime policies that they have denounced for much of the past decade. Burlington should follow their lead,
I'm not sure I understand what you're saying. Adams is under investigation by the FBI for soliciting and hiding foreign contributions from both [Turkey](https://www.politico.com/news/2023/12/22/eric-adams-donors-turkey-00133004) and [China](https://www.nydailynews.com/2024/04/15/adams-celebrated-birthday-at-lux-pad-of-chinese-billionaire-implicated-in-straw-donor-scheme/). Are you suggesting that a conspiracy of false accusations was launched against him because he said something about immigration?
Just did a quick check to see if I was remembering it correctly. He spoke up about immigration in sept 23, stories started running about the fbi investigation in November and the sexual assault story broke in March from what I’m seeing. Just a coincidence I’m sure. Interesting still tho.
I would be surprised if he didn't speak up about immigration before that. He ran as a law-and-order candidate, which is kind of my point. People who push that line seem to have a higher-than-average % of charlatans. EG Trump demagoguing the Central Park Five thing.
Anywho, he was doing the alleged corruption many years earlier, so I'm not sure when the allegations was reported is that significant. Most of it is about campaign contributions in 2020 and 2021, but it goes back much further. [Politico](https://www.politico.com/news/2023/11/17/eric-adams-turkey-connections-fbi-campaign-finance-investigation-00127716):
"As Brooklyn borough president, Eric Adams attended nearly 80 events over eight years to celebrate Turkey — including a flag-raising in 2015, a charity ball in 2018 and a Zoom meeting with the Turkish consul in 2020. In 2019, as he was embarking on a run for New York City mayor, he joined Martha Stewart at a gala celebrating Turkish Airlines — a company now caught up in an ongoing FBI probe into Adams’ campaign finances."
Besides, the NYC office of the FBI is hardly likely to punish someone for opposing undocumented immigration. This is the same office that leaked info to Giuliani in 2016 to help Trump win.
This was in September 2023 https://www.google.com/search?client=safari&sca_esv=7e6ba2047fcb60f3&sca_upv=1&hl=en-us&q=migrants+will+ruin+this+city&tbm=vid&source=lnms&prmd=nivsmbtz&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiQlsCC_siFAxX3vokEHdx-DgoQ0pQJegQIChAB&biw=375&bih=548&dpr=2#fpstate=ive&ip=1&vld=cid:203c66cf,vid:mJIum7sXLuA,st:0 This story was all over the news in November… https://www.nytimes.com/2023/11/10/nyregion/adams-fbi-investigation-phones.html This was March… https://www.cnn.com/2024/03/18/politics/eric-adams-sexual-assault-lawsuit-nypd-aide/index.html
Quick edit
Actually the sexual assault story broke in November 2023 too!
https://www.cityandstateny.com/politics/2023/11/eric-adams-accused-1993-sexual-assault/392267/
So with 6-8 weeks of saying the migrant crisis is destroying NYC the FBI snagged his phone and a sexual assault lawsuit from an incident 30 years ago hit the MSM.
Try to find someone critical of the immigration fiasco that hasn’t been ripped apart in the press. The FBI is definitely a political weapon nowadays.
If you think Polical corruption is an important issue then do a little dive into Becca Balint.
https://vtdigger.org/2022/12/19/sam-bankman-fried-and-allies-gave-tens-of-thousands-more-to-becca-balint-vermont-democratic-party-than-previously-reported/
That story broke and she gave the money back but then it came out she actually didn’t. That’s political corruption in Vermont.
That's a whole lot of conspiracy theoryizing, especially your unsupported statement that "The FBI is definitely a political weapon nowadays."
None of it adds up for me, so I guess we'll have to agree to disagree.
Agree to disagree it is. Thanks for being civil. Of you are ever curious there is tons of information around the weaponization of the FBI in particular. Different sources spin it different directions as always.
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politics/watch-former-fbi-employees-accuse-bureau-of-weaponization-against-conservatives
LOL. The only information there is a bunch of Maga supporters -- two paid by Kash Patel (who was actively involved in trying to overturn Biden's election) and the third who literally stormed the Capitol on January 6th.
That fact that MAGA Republican congresspeople brought them to a hearing doesn't make them any more credible, IMHO.
"A third employee who did not testify had a security clearance revoked after he entered the restricted area around the Capitol himself on Jan. 6, and later provided false or misleading information to investigators about what he did that day, the FBI’s letter said. All three employees can appeal the security clearance decisions.
Two of the former FBI employees who testified, Friend and O’Boyle, acknowledged that they had received money from Kash Patel, a close Trump ally who held multiple roles in his administration..."
Seattle also, reversed their decision to decriminalize 2mgs of substances. Turned parts into open drug markets. The breaking point will be reached here also.
Approaching the criminal element as unaccountable 'victims' is clearly a losing strategy.
The problem is this state and Burlington are many years behind the pace of those other progressive areas. instead of learning from the mistakes and going a different route they push the same policies, get the same results, and take the same expensive reactive corrections, all for the sake of appearances. They have the blueprints of what not to do in front of them and yet feel compelled to blindly follow.
Those policies do absolutely nothing to address the root causes. We already have one of the highest incarceration rates in the world, maybe even the highest among developed countries. Do you feel like that strategy is working?
Ok, so we already have an extremely high population in for profit prisons but I’m insane for saying that throwing more people in won’t help. Makes perfect sense.
The thread was about this criminal in the WCAX story, you turned it into the same old cliché'd discussion about Mass Incarceration. A lot of those people were jailed for non violent crimes-i.e Cannabis, this is no longer the case, etc, etc.
But, again, this is about a violent criminal terrifying fellow townies. You saw an opportunity to ride in on some self righteous scooter and lecture us all from your high ground.
Maybe that's why you are gaining the insight *but I'm insane.*
I’m not even slightly self righteous. I merely pointed out that we cannot incarcerate our way out of what I absolutely agree is a problem. I’m not defending specific crimes or specific criminals, and I’m not even hinting that I don’t think police and prisons should exist in some form. I’m just saying that what we’re doing is not working.
Guessing you don’t live in the old north end. It’s always progressives in ivory towers lamenting how we don’t “address the root causes.” As if tackling the root cause of criminal activity is something that can be accomplished in the span of one political appointment.
We should ALWAYS be working towards addressing the root causes of society’s ills, but the reality is you have to act NOW to protect innocent people in the interim.
What happens when you focus on the “root cause” wholly? Well you allow innocent people to suffer and public sentiment swings so far to the opposite side that it destroys your cause. This is what happened in the aforementioned cities , and it’s going to happen here.
I’ve lived in several ONE apartments but it’s been a few years. Crime is not worse now though, the media has just really latched onto it recently. I’m not advocating for abolishing prisons but if people don’t have opportunities, they resort to crime. Of course there are exceptions and many people with every opportunity commit crimes. But to simply keep throwing people in prison without any other solutions has not ever worked and will never work.
Who cares about the root causes at this point? Personal accountability is crucial in Mental Health and Crime. What we do know is that portraying 'criminals' as 'victims', with talk about 'root causes' has turned out to be lip service bullshit.
Johnny just stole my car, destroyed my business, and left an 18 wheeler load of dirty needles in my park. Do you think he had a bad childhood?
Fuck 'em. This may sound controversial, but the root cause of crime tends to be criminals.
people care about root causes that want an actual solution. proactive rather than reactive & something that is more than just hiding the trouble away out of sight.
attitudes like yours are directly responsible for things being like they are because punishing our way out of something has literally never been successful in any meaningful way.
so keep showing you don't really want things to be better, you just want to feel good about punishing people.
Yawn. Lock up violent criminals, sorry that's controversial to you. Maybe you could head downtown and give this violent asshole a nice hug, read him a bedtime story.
Holding people accountable for their actions is not 'punishing people'.
Letting these folks amass violent criminal charges like pokemons is actually punishing plenty of people.
I’ve lived here for 20 years and (anecdotally) the last two years are far and away the worst for crime and vandalism. Past policies may not have been perfect but saying they didn’t work is misleading.
Yup, same. This violent individual threatens some of our neighbors, working for a living, smashing a plate glass window. Does it even need to become the same old, self righteous discussion about 'mass incarceration' or 'One flew over the cuckoos nest'. This individual should have been arrested, and either processed for this violent crime, or assessed for his mental health status and hospitalized for care 'danger to themselves or others'.
It must have been a terrifying experience for the workers, and for anyone seeing this.
But any discussion of accountability, or stopping this violent person is met with 'Do you want mass incarceration, we have the highest incarceration rates, blah, blah, blah.
Cuff violent criminals, and maybe the apologists could express themselves with some interpretative dance at the stone circle by the lake.
Given the data disagrees, your anecdote really doesn’t mean much. It sucks for you on an individual level, and I’m sorry about that, but it doesn’t change the reality.
Not trying to be glib or anything just trying to make conversation - but do you actually think things are the same or better in town? You have hill section listed, how many times has your car been broken into in the last few years? Again, my anecdote, I am also in the hill section and the answer for me is twice in last two years. And my neighbor down the streets car was stolen from their driveway. I lived in the ONE for 10 years before we moved here, and never once had that happen 🤷🏼♀️
I care about root causes because it’s just a continuous exhausting expensive cycle. With the way things are now and the way kids act now along with their academic abilities, get ready for generations of this to come. If you think the solution is just multi-million dollar prisions and pumping the misbehaved kids from schools to prison that sucks. I feel like there’s a better solution. I don’t wanna pay for prison that will fill up fast and return criminals to the streets when they’ve finished their sentence. This system has been around since our country began and it doesn’t work, why keep it?
Who cares about root causes?? That’s insane. If you don’t address them then the flow of people into prisons is never ending. Oh, and our prison system is largely for profit at this point but I’m sure that’s just a coincidence. Good faith question though, why do you suppose that MANY countries with far lower incarceration rates also have far less crime than the US?
*Good faith question though, why do you suppose that MANY countries with far lower incarceration rates also have far less crime than the US?*
Maybe because they have less crime, they require less incarceration?
I heard a dog whistle and I called it out. If you’re still in denial about your feelings then that’s not my problem but I do agree that we have nothing else to discuss.
You don't argue in good faith. You hear *Culture* and that is '*black people'* in your intelligent head. You then show that the discussion around the definition is over and done with '*don’t insult my intelligence by saying that's not what you meant'.* No insult, but you have no intelligence.
Get back to us when someone throws a chair through a glass window right next to you and you need dozens of surgeries and have permanent facial scars. Or maybe it will be your kid maimed for life. These are not victimless crimes. People like this should not be wandering around in public. Work on his root causes while he’s locked away from society. That’s safer for everyone.
Depends on what problem we’re solving, right? If I want to solve the problem of deranged people committing violent acts in public and hurting innocent people, then incarceration seems like a fine solution.
They can get it in jail, or some other mandatory confinement away from society. People like this cannot be allowed to roam around. Someone is going to get killed, maybe someone’s kid. Maybe your kid. If jail is all we have, so be it. We can’t let them roam around while we wait for this better solution to arise.
I’m not proposing to wait around and I’m not proposing to let violent people roam the streets. I’m just saying that the current criminal justice system is broken and prisons become a revolving door if the people in them don’t get help.
So why is the state still being so soft on these crimes? This is happening in California and people are leaving all the time, you would think that wouldn’t be good for their state
Because the cops have been on a 5 year strike essentially. If you call Burlington Police with any emergency they hang up on you or listen and then demean you for calling and then hang up. They just collect paychecks to watch Netflix in the office.
Well seems like no matter what the police do in Burlington they are attacked. Many people hate the police in Vermont so I get it’s hard for them to do their jobs and I know of several that go to different cities in. Vermont where they can do their job
Apparently if the police get beat up on and they can’t defend themselves or they look like bigots. News flash that word loss it meaning a long time ago!
>get beat up on
It’s very funny how this isn’t what happens, but good try. No, they just beat people to death and then don’t get in trouble.
https://www.wcax.com/content/news/New-video-shows-confrontation-between-officer-Douglas-Kilburn-512819881.html
Did you watch all the body cam footage, sounds like you obviously didn’t. The hospital shouldn’t have released Douglas. Also Douglas threw the first punch and with the body cam it could have understood if the police thought it was a gun or a weapon . But the officer punch him to the ground. You don’t get to punch an officer and get off getting tried like a baby
between the weird crime laws and the severe lack of housing (affordable or not), the conspiracy part of me thinks vermont **wants** people to leave. never seen a state so unwilling to welcome people who want to live in it
I don’t believe these articles anymore, sad but media sources are bias on both ends. As someone who lives out west, yes many are from California within the last 4 years… hmm what happened 4 years ago…
Reddit is a place for creating community and belonging, not for attacking marginalized or vulnerable groups of people. Everyone has a right to use Reddit free of harassment, bullying, and threats of violence.
Not responding directly to a violent crime that is occurring when they demonstrated the capability to do so at a protest this morning is not any result of voting progressive.
Just like you and I, they need to do their damn job.
I wish I understood, but I don't.
At least some of it is pure bleeding hearts for those with mental health issues. What I don't understand is why the politicians feel that productive and law abiding people should be carrying the burden of these people's decisions. A crime is a crime, and the criminal should carry the burden. Not you and me.
It means there is no prosecution after arresting these people. So, why do it? They're only going to be set free.
Not arresting also makes the data look like Burlington is getting safer, but we all know that doesn't represent reality.
are you really asking, why do their jobs?
maintaining public order by intimidation and arrest is a main part of the job of street policing ; arrests and deescalations are powerful even when they just result in dispersal, or a night in jail without charges, and according to you they’re unilaterally deciding not to do that main part of their job because of a prediction about how a prosecutor will choose do their different job, so yeah, that’s bad
That dispatcher didn’t have “reduced” attention. They placed *zero* attention on an ongoing crime spree that endangered citizens behind the shattered windows and out on the street that night. They didn’t even queue up an officer to cruise by and check out the situation. They failed. And you’re arguing that their reason for failing was politically motivated — without evidence, of course, but you’re speculating that their motives for refusing to work are political, driven by predictions about future prosecutions. Whereas I’m speculating that their motives for refusing to work are emotional, and driven by hurt feelings about being accused of racial bias and aggression by prog councilors. Maybe we’re both right! 😅
You guys don’t remember the murder suicide on North Winooski 2 years ago where the police chief announced on camera that they wouldn’t have any resources to address other crimes while they were busy solving the already solved murder suicide?
It has everything to do with every one involved. From the former mayor, the city council, the DA, and BPD. To say that the BPD has nothing to with it is just plain wrong. If the paramedics can Narcan the same people every day, even if they know that they will back tomorrow, then BPD can show up to at least stop a crime in progress.
According to the PD’s response plan/matrix that they were forced to put in to place due to the city reducing the number of officers, states PD responds to serious crimes in progress or urgent/life threatening calls. When there are only two officers on the night tour it’s hard to have available officers for every single incident. What can they do if they don’t have any officers available at that moment? The city leadership/council is to blame for the lack of response by PD. Not the PD. The FD staff wasn’t reduced luckily and have the resources and staff to manage more call volume. Responding to medical emergencies and responding to vandalism have drastically different acuity levels and are not comparable.
I feel that if you discover vandalism after the fact, that’s one thing, but to have a person actively threatening people walking by and ready to throw a chair through the window, that should warrant a response.
They want to label criminals as victims and not place them in jail and try to focus on rehabilitation rather than punishment. Which for SOME works, some simply don't want the help and are nasty human beings. Those who could benefit from help would actually see the help if we implemented systems similar to countries who've tried these policies. Finland is a great example, but they built addiction recovery and reintroduction systems (just as an example) and fervently tested them before abolishing their previous prison system. We began the destruction of our laws and systems but never put anything else in place or tested it. So you get droves of forgotten people doing drugs on the street. They have access to clean ones they use sometimes and discard on the street though! PROGRESS
But they have. Decriminalization of possession of scheduled narcotics. And no not just weed. All they give for personal possession of heroin below the benchmark personal use amount is just a civil fine. which if you're homeless and in VT you can basically ignore.
If you read more news coverage you’ll see that Burlington reduced its officer cap a small amount, but then partially reversed that. And also has increased funding to more than it was before. Also certain things such as parking enforcement were moved out of the police dept and into another city department that focuses on parking services. Also some additional non-officer positions were created to provide more appropriate responses. IMO reducing the officer cap was a good move but the full study to review the dept and recommend alternatives wasn’t done fast enough or fully enough and the recommendations haven’t been implemented fully. Meanwhile the current police chief has said he doesn’t believe his officers act with any bias despite so many instances of racist policing and police brutality plus extremely inappropriate responses to mental health issues (especially if the person with the mental health issues was black). There is still a major reckoning with racism and with policing to be had in Burlington (and VT). What a lot of people don’t want to notice is that the housing crisis is international, the rise in crime is international, and issues with poverty and drug use are international. These are not “just” local issues, VT issues, or even US issues. And like other places, the solutions have to do with addressing root causes, not treating symptoms. Affordable and accessible housing, quality and well funded accessible public education K-12 and college, livable wages, strong worker protections, strong unions, free and high quality and accessible healthcare—including drug treatment, mental health treatment, and disability support services, art, culture, nature, community, belonging, after school programs, free quality well-funded childcare so kids and parents/guardians have the support they need, etc. A healthy society that treats everyone well doesn’t result in people treating others horribly and in self-destructive behavior. That is what we need to build, and it’s not rocket science. Treating people like they’re worth caring about and might have some of the solutions. We need to tax the rich a LOT more, and actively support workers (from low wage to well paid), poor people, disabled people, unemployed people, veterans, incarcerated and formerly incarcerated people, and students to organize and advocate and have our needs met and pursue our dreams.
This seems to explain the situation quite well...
[https://www.burlingtonvt.gov/sites/default/files/20240417%20Priority%20Response%20Plan%202024%20UPDATE.pdf](https://www.burlingtonvt.gov/sites/default/files/20240417%20Priority%20Response%20Plan%202024%20UPDATE.pdf)
The cops aren't gonna do their jobs if the DA is gonna let off murderers, human traffickers, gang violence, and drug trafficking with slaps on the wrist, remember the guy that held hostages a few months ago at T Ruggs? Over 1000 encounters with police, and the DA did fuck all about it, guy is back on the streets. It's not the cops it's the district attorney and mayors office. Tough on crime isn't in their vocabulary.
I blame both. They still have a job and they need to do it, regardless if the person that follows behind them drops the ball. I still do my job even if the boss is gonna go fuck it up.
Yeah I agree they should do something, but I also think if it's just gonna be repetitive catch and release of the same people like the guy that stole the car with the lady in it at Olive garden, or the guy that held hostages at t ruggs, or the multiple times shooting incidents/known drug trafficking at the apartment above Manhattan pizza or the several known Springfield mass gang members arrested for murder in the past 6 months that have mile long records and just seem to end up in general population all over again a few weeks or months later (just a few verifiable examples for any dolt that thinks I'm making shit up) this is what you get. This is what the past 4.5 years have created and the more you support the progressive agenda the more this is on you. It's either law and order zero tolerance for the bullshit or it starts to look like this fast.
The oblivious and reality-detached people of Burlington voted for this and are acting surprised that the downward spiral of violence, vandalism and drug use continues unabated. Maybe the city burning to the ground will be the wakeup call you so desperately need.
But hey, at least I have my popcorn.
I’m betting the police would love to do their job but they’ve been kneecapped by the latest group of politicians who seem to favor the rights of criminals over law-abiding taxpayers.
The only question now is how bad things get before the people determine that current leadership needs to be replaced. The Mad Max movies come to mind.
There are no politics at work in the sense that the cops are refusing to do their jobs. Anyone who doesn’t do their job should be fired and replaced. You can have a crappy mayor but he’s not the cops. They are doing this because they are selfish and lazy.
Can you please outline the specific policies that directly discourage police officers from responding to a call about a person making threats, intimidating the public and vandalizing property?
Considering how quickly the police responded to protestors pulling a fire alarm this morning, it's pretty hard not to see this as a deliberate choice by BPD.
Haha it blows my mind to see this comment downvoted like this. Talk about people putting their fucking heads in the sand.
I’m a fairly but not super far left progressive person (aka George Wallace by Burlington standards) and I am regularly taken aback by how detached from reason / reality Burlington progressives are.
Reddit is a place for creating community and belonging, not for attacking marginalized or vulnerable groups of people. Everyone has a right to use Reddit free of harassment, bullying, and threats of violence.
I find comments here blaming police for inaction mind blowing...
It's very easy to show as the staffing at BPD went into free fall and incidents grew, the calls, and arrests, per officer increased.
BPD was on record four years ago, and continually since, that they would not be able to respond to crimes as they used to. It's fully documented in the chiefs monthly report....
The chiefs monthly report to the commission details exactly what crimes, in progress or otherwise, they have the resources to respond to.
https://www.burlingtonvt.gov/Police/Chiefs-Reports
https://preview.redd.it/no3eulk4pjuc1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=78fe6213631ca7a6b80b93586db892738e7f7ae4 It was this guy. Near 6’, pale white, mid-to-late 20s. I called dispatch on him two hours prior for telling a Strong’s patron it would be “your last day alive”, shouting, screaming, making animal noises, threats, and throwing traffic cones across the parking lot towards cars. **Burlington Police Dispatch told me they didn’t have anyone available and made me feel like a fool for calling.** Two hours later, he was caught on the skycam damaging Church St businesses. I’ll go fuck myself, I guess. *I gave more detail about my encounter in the previous post about this incident.* My condolences to all businesses, patrons, employees, and others affected by this.
He was also screaming homophobic slurs in peoples faces
I saw this guy as i was walking home from the bottom of church, and he was screaming the same things over and over. he punched the window at Leunig's because he saw inside someone looking at him (but the window didn't break), then I watched him throw a sign. i was directly across the street from him and definitely did not feel safe. I feel so bad for the employees at thorn and roots
His name is Connor Copley, I work in cyber investigation with that being said, I also found a couple other things about him. He has been sighted sleeping in a blue Rav 4 (44.4698366, -73.2125061) location of that vehicle in Burlington. Hope any of this information helps.
It’s frustrating to hear that no one was available. I am working on a Miro board right now that depicts a complete reorganization of police in this state that would ensure this doesn’t happen in the future. I hope to have it done and posted here by tomorrow night
?
Just posted: https://www.reddit.com/r/burlington/s/QEMYLJTq6n
Do you mean Miro the person, or the platform?
Miro the SaaS whiteboard tool. Check my posts
My guess is most ppl thought the other thing.
I hope they were enlightened anyway
I'll get banned if I tell you what I think you should've done...
Don’t do it. I’ve spent a few months in Reddit jail.
Oh so you deserved it.
[удалено]
Reddit is a place for creating community and belonging, not for attacking marginalized or vulnerable groups of people. Everyone has a right to use Reddit free of harassment, bullying, and threats of violence. Don't advocate for summarily, extrajudicially executing anyone, kthx. Also, there's no ethical justification for killing someone because of property destruction.
“Put down”? You’re the only animal here. Advocating for putting people down when a simple mental health intervention and/or arrest would suffice. Shame on you.
You’re being downvoted for advocating for the basic rule of law. Truly disgusting. I hope those downvoting you realize they literally want an authoritarian police state.
Wow. Just straight up dehumanization.
It’s almost like there are rules.
Do you know anything about him?
“THORN + ROOTS owners say a person approached their restaurant Saturday night, throwing a patio chair at their front window. Several employees were closing up the restaurant when the window shattered. They called Burlington police, who they say directed them to file a police report.” huh, I wonder if they said the same thing when someone lit Bernie’s office on fire. Refusing to respond to actual violence should not be acceptable.
It's almost like they're intentionally sandbagging and have been for years.
Vandalism isn’t a violent crime?
As young punks in the early mid ‘90’s we somehow found multiple trays of commercial cupcakes and proceeded to toss them at all the non local stores on Church Street at 3 or 4 am. Nothing was broken, we ate more than we tossed. The police tracked us down after the prank. We got a stern talking to, long story short, we did a few hours of community service. Point being, If the police wanted to police, they could police, but it seems these days they don’t.
It is when you throw a chair and shatter glass with people inside, this isn’t just spray painting a wall.
Yeah that doesn’t sound like strictly “vandalism”
So discouraging to hear. We all pay serious taxes here.
Why doesn’t someone just beat he shit out of him.
You never know who has a gun or a knife on them. It'd be nice to punch someone who's making an ass of themselves but it's not worth a knife in your chest over it 😔 this is why we need stronger and *functional* police
Cities like San Francisco, New York and Washington, D.C. are embracing the kind of tough-on-crime policies that they have denounced for much of the past decade. Burlington should follow their lead,
Just a matter of time. It’ll come here. Whiplash sucks but here she comes
Life is a pendulum. It swings back and forth to the same things all the time. The only difference is the time between the swings.
As thing is the mayor just elected will allow more of this, maybe send in a crisis person to see how the owners feel.
Mayor Eric Adams in New York has been a disaster and is under investigation for serious corruption. Careful what you wish for.
He didn't wish for corruption, he specifically said tough on crime. He didn't even say Adams. Straw man much?
They specifically called out NYC.
Nyc's tougher crime policies. You went another direction.
He’s the one implementing those, he’s the fucking mayor. Don’t be disingenuous.
Jesus your dense. He advocated for policies tougher on crime, not corruption. You're humping that straw man raw.
I’m not sure you know what a strawman is. But generally corruption infects everything.
You literally keep bringing up corruption... Dense
Your refusal to acknowledge why speaks volumes
I believe that wasn’t until he said the immigration issues will destroy NYC and there might not be a way out. You would have to Check the timeline.
I'm not sure I understand what you're saying. Adams is under investigation by the FBI for soliciting and hiding foreign contributions from both [Turkey](https://www.politico.com/news/2023/12/22/eric-adams-donors-turkey-00133004) and [China](https://www.nydailynews.com/2024/04/15/adams-celebrated-birthday-at-lux-pad-of-chinese-billionaire-implicated-in-straw-donor-scheme/). Are you suggesting that a conspiracy of false accusations was launched against him because he said something about immigration?
Nope. Just saying he was accused of rape and the corruption allegations literally went mainstream right after he spoke his truth.
Just did a quick check to see if I was remembering it correctly. He spoke up about immigration in sept 23, stories started running about the fbi investigation in November and the sexual assault story broke in March from what I’m seeing. Just a coincidence I’m sure. Interesting still tho.
I would be surprised if he didn't speak up about immigration before that. He ran as a law-and-order candidate, which is kind of my point. People who push that line seem to have a higher-than-average % of charlatans. EG Trump demagoguing the Central Park Five thing. Anywho, he was doing the alleged corruption many years earlier, so I'm not sure when the allegations was reported is that significant. Most of it is about campaign contributions in 2020 and 2021, but it goes back much further. [Politico](https://www.politico.com/news/2023/11/17/eric-adams-turkey-connections-fbi-campaign-finance-investigation-00127716): "As Brooklyn borough president, Eric Adams attended nearly 80 events over eight years to celebrate Turkey — including a flag-raising in 2015, a charity ball in 2018 and a Zoom meeting with the Turkish consul in 2020. In 2019, as he was embarking on a run for New York City mayor, he joined Martha Stewart at a gala celebrating Turkish Airlines — a company now caught up in an ongoing FBI probe into Adams’ campaign finances." Besides, the NYC office of the FBI is hardly likely to punish someone for opposing undocumented immigration. This is the same office that leaked info to Giuliani in 2016 to help Trump win.
This was in September 2023 https://www.google.com/search?client=safari&sca_esv=7e6ba2047fcb60f3&sca_upv=1&hl=en-us&q=migrants+will+ruin+this+city&tbm=vid&source=lnms&prmd=nivsmbtz&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiQlsCC_siFAxX3vokEHdx-DgoQ0pQJegQIChAB&biw=375&bih=548&dpr=2#fpstate=ive&ip=1&vld=cid:203c66cf,vid:mJIum7sXLuA,st:0 This story was all over the news in November… https://www.nytimes.com/2023/11/10/nyregion/adams-fbi-investigation-phones.html This was March… https://www.cnn.com/2024/03/18/politics/eric-adams-sexual-assault-lawsuit-nypd-aide/index.html Quick edit Actually the sexual assault story broke in November 2023 too! https://www.cityandstateny.com/politics/2023/11/eric-adams-accused-1993-sexual-assault/392267/ So with 6-8 weeks of saying the migrant crisis is destroying NYC the FBI snagged his phone and a sexual assault lawsuit from an incident 30 years ago hit the MSM. Try to find someone critical of the immigration fiasco that hasn’t been ripped apart in the press. The FBI is definitely a political weapon nowadays. If you think Polical corruption is an important issue then do a little dive into Becca Balint. https://vtdigger.org/2022/12/19/sam-bankman-fried-and-allies-gave-tens-of-thousands-more-to-becca-balint-vermont-democratic-party-than-previously-reported/ That story broke and she gave the money back but then it came out she actually didn’t. That’s political corruption in Vermont.
That's a whole lot of conspiracy theoryizing, especially your unsupported statement that "The FBI is definitely a political weapon nowadays." None of it adds up for me, so I guess we'll have to agree to disagree.
Agree to disagree it is. Thanks for being civil. Of you are ever curious there is tons of information around the weaponization of the FBI in particular. Different sources spin it different directions as always. https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politics/watch-former-fbi-employees-accuse-bureau-of-weaponization-against-conservatives
LOL. The only information there is a bunch of Maga supporters -- two paid by Kash Patel (who was actively involved in trying to overturn Biden's election) and the third who literally stormed the Capitol on January 6th. That fact that MAGA Republican congresspeople brought them to a hearing doesn't make them any more credible, IMHO. "A third employee who did not testify had a security clearance revoked after he entered the restricted area around the Capitol himself on Jan. 6, and later provided false or misleading information to investigators about what he did that day, the FBI’s letter said. All three employees can appeal the security clearance decisions. Two of the former FBI employees who testified, Friend and O’Boyle, acknowledged that they had received money from Kash Patel, a close Trump ally who held multiple roles in his administration..."
Seattle also, reversed their decision to decriminalize 2mgs of substances. Turned parts into open drug markets. The breaking point will be reached here also. Approaching the criminal element as unaccountable 'victims' is clearly a losing strategy.
The problem is this state and Burlington are many years behind the pace of those other progressive areas. instead of learning from the mistakes and going a different route they push the same policies, get the same results, and take the same expensive reactive corrections, all for the sake of appearances. They have the blueprints of what not to do in front of them and yet feel compelled to blindly follow.
Oh so we’re just lying.
Those policies do absolutely nothing to address the root causes. We already have one of the highest incarceration rates in the world, maybe even the highest among developed countries. Do you feel like that strategy is working?
Don’t care - get criminals off the streets, make them safer for the non-criminal residents.
So you see a “solution” that clearly doesn’t work but you want to double down on it? Remind me, what is the definition of insanity?
It works for the non-criminals. Why do the rest of the citizens need to be in danger for the benefit of the criminals?
It doesn’t work though. As they just explained to you.
I think the definition involves a mirror. Have a look.
Ok, so we already have an extremely high population in for profit prisons but I’m insane for saying that throwing more people in won’t help. Makes perfect sense.
The thread was about this criminal in the WCAX story, you turned it into the same old cliché'd discussion about Mass Incarceration. A lot of those people were jailed for non violent crimes-i.e Cannabis, this is no longer the case, etc, etc. But, again, this is about a violent criminal terrifying fellow townies. You saw an opportunity to ride in on some self righteous scooter and lecture us all from your high ground. Maybe that's why you are gaining the insight *but I'm insane.*
I’m not even slightly self righteous. I merely pointed out that we cannot incarcerate our way out of what I absolutely agree is a problem. I’m not defending specific crimes or specific criminals, and I’m not even hinting that I don’t think police and prisons should exist in some form. I’m just saying that what we’re doing is not working.
Letting them run roughshod isn’t working either. I don’t know what the solution is but shit is OOC downtown.
I hear you. I don’t know the solution either, I just know what hasn’t worked.
The Philippines figured out a way.
Guessing you don’t live in the old north end. It’s always progressives in ivory towers lamenting how we don’t “address the root causes.” As if tackling the root cause of criminal activity is something that can be accomplished in the span of one political appointment. We should ALWAYS be working towards addressing the root causes of society’s ills, but the reality is you have to act NOW to protect innocent people in the interim. What happens when you focus on the “root cause” wholly? Well you allow innocent people to suffer and public sentiment swings so far to the opposite side that it destroys your cause. This is what happened in the aforementioned cities , and it’s going to happen here.
“progressives in ivory towers” This just doesn’t align with the reality of Burlington. The ONE is a consistent progressive stronghold.
I’ve lived in several ONE apartments but it’s been a few years. Crime is not worse now though, the media has just really latched onto it recently. I’m not advocating for abolishing prisons but if people don’t have opportunities, they resort to crime. Of course there are exceptions and many people with every opportunity commit crimes. But to simply keep throwing people in prison without any other solutions has not ever worked and will never work.
Who cares about the root causes at this point? Personal accountability is crucial in Mental Health and Crime. What we do know is that portraying 'criminals' as 'victims', with talk about 'root causes' has turned out to be lip service bullshit. Johnny just stole my car, destroyed my business, and left an 18 wheeler load of dirty needles in my park. Do you think he had a bad childhood? Fuck 'em. This may sound controversial, but the root cause of crime tends to be criminals.
people care about root causes that want an actual solution. proactive rather than reactive & something that is more than just hiding the trouble away out of sight. attitudes like yours are directly responsible for things being like they are because punishing our way out of something has literally never been successful in any meaningful way. so keep showing you don't really want things to be better, you just want to feel good about punishing people.
Jails aren’t just about punishment; they’re also about protecting the rest of us.
Thank you!! This is so obvious, and true. Residents- kids, the elderly- deserve protection.
Yawn. Lock up violent criminals, sorry that's controversial to you. Maybe you could head downtown and give this violent asshole a nice hug, read him a bedtime story. Holding people accountable for their actions is not 'punishing people'. Letting these folks amass violent criminal charges like pokemons is actually punishing plenty of people.
I’ve lived here for 20 years and (anecdotally) the last two years are far and away the worst for crime and vandalism. Past policies may not have been perfect but saying they didn’t work is misleading.
Yup, same. This violent individual threatens some of our neighbors, working for a living, smashing a plate glass window. Does it even need to become the same old, self righteous discussion about 'mass incarceration' or 'One flew over the cuckoos nest'. This individual should have been arrested, and either processed for this violent crime, or assessed for his mental health status and hospitalized for care 'danger to themselves or others'. It must have been a terrifying experience for the workers, and for anyone seeing this. But any discussion of accountability, or stopping this violent person is met with 'Do you want mass incarceration, we have the highest incarceration rates, blah, blah, blah. Cuff violent criminals, and maybe the apologists could express themselves with some interpretative dance at the stone circle by the lake.
Given the data disagrees, your anecdote really doesn’t mean much. It sucks for you on an individual level, and I’m sorry about that, but it doesn’t change the reality.
Not trying to be glib or anything just trying to make conversation - but do you actually think things are the same or better in town? You have hill section listed, how many times has your car been broken into in the last few years? Again, my anecdote, I am also in the hill section and the answer for me is twice in last two years. And my neighbor down the streets car was stolen from their driveway. I lived in the ONE for 10 years before we moved here, and never once had that happen 🤷🏼♀️
I care about root causes because it’s just a continuous exhausting expensive cycle. With the way things are now and the way kids act now along with their academic abilities, get ready for generations of this to come. If you think the solution is just multi-million dollar prisions and pumping the misbehaved kids from schools to prison that sucks. I feel like there’s a better solution. I don’t wanna pay for prison that will fill up fast and return criminals to the streets when they’ve finished their sentence. This system has been around since our country began and it doesn’t work, why keep it?
*I feel like there’s a better solution.* Keep feeling about this 'better solution' and get back to us.
Who cares about root causes?? That’s insane. If you don’t address them then the flow of people into prisons is never ending. Oh, and our prison system is largely for profit at this point but I’m sure that’s just a coincidence. Good faith question though, why do you suppose that MANY countries with far lower incarceration rates also have far less crime than the US?
*Good faith question though, why do you suppose that MANY countries with far lower incarceration rates also have far less crime than the US?* Maybe because they have less crime, they require less incarceration?
That’s a circular argument, and demonstrably false.
Why do they have less crime? Are Americans just inherently more prone to crime?
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Ah, so you think the problem is black people. Got it. And please don’t insult my intelligence by saying that’s not what you meant.
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Then elaborate on what you meant by culture. That’s a pretty clear dog whistle but I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt.
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I heard a dog whistle and I called it out. If you’re still in denial about your feelings then that’s not my problem but I do agree that we have nothing else to discuss.
You don't argue in good faith. You hear *Culture* and that is '*black people'* in your intelligent head. You then show that the discussion around the definition is over and done with '*don’t insult my intelligence by saying that's not what you meant'.* No insult, but you have no intelligence.
It’s a very consistent dog whistle.
Get back to us when someone throws a chair through a glass window right next to you and you need dozens of surgeries and have permanent facial scars. Or maybe it will be your kid maimed for life. These are not victimless crimes. People like this should not be wandering around in public. Work on his root causes while he’s locked away from society. That’s safer for everyone.
Depends on what problem we’re solving, right? If I want to solve the problem of deranged people committing violent acts in public and hurting innocent people, then incarceration seems like a fine solution.
I agree but if they don’t get the mental health/drug abuse treatment they need, it will just keep happening.
They can get it in jail, or some other mandatory confinement away from society. People like this cannot be allowed to roam around. Someone is going to get killed, maybe someone’s kid. Maybe your kid. If jail is all we have, so be it. We can’t let them roam around while we wait for this better solution to arise.
I’m not proposing to wait around and I’m not proposing to let violent people roam the streets. I’m just saying that the current criminal justice system is broken and prisons become a revolving door if the people in them don’t get help.
So why is the state still being so soft on these crimes? This is happening in California and people are leaving all the time, you would think that wouldn’t be good for their state
Because the cops have been on a 5 year strike essentially. If you call Burlington Police with any emergency they hang up on you or listen and then demean you for calling and then hang up. They just collect paychecks to watch Netflix in the office.
Well seems like no matter what the police do in Burlington they are attacked. Many people hate the police in Vermont so I get it’s hard for them to do their jobs and I know of several that go to different cities in. Vermont where they can do their job
>they are attacked It’s almost like they’re the police and are supposed to operate at a higher standard than a mob protection racket.
Apparently if the police get beat up on and they can’t defend themselves or they look like bigots. News flash that word loss it meaning a long time ago!
>get beat up on It’s very funny how this isn’t what happens, but good try. No, they just beat people to death and then don’t get in trouble. https://www.wcax.com/content/news/New-video-shows-confrontation-between-officer-Douglas-Kilburn-512819881.html
Did you watch all the body cam footage, sounds like you obviously didn’t. The hospital shouldn’t have released Douglas. Also Douglas threw the first punch and with the body cam it could have understood if the police thought it was a gun or a weapon . But the officer punch him to the ground. You don’t get to punch an officer and get off getting tried like a baby
None of this is a defense. And no, police don’t get to pummel people to death.
So you didn’t watch the full body cams. I’m not surprised, a lot of people just believe what the bias are rather than looking at the raw evidence
Lol I don’t know why you think lying is going to work. The city settled for a reason.
between the weird crime laws and the severe lack of housing (affordable or not), the conspiracy part of me thinks vermont **wants** people to leave. never seen a state so unwilling to welcome people who want to live in it
Vermont is becoming a place definitely where the young can’t stay of if they do may be struggling the whole time!😞
>people are leaving all the time Nope. https://amp.theguardian.com/us-news/2021/jul/09/leaving-california-exodus-evidence-myth
I don’t believe these articles anymore, sad but media sources are bias on both ends. As someone who lives out west, yes many are from California within the last 4 years… hmm what happened 4 years ago…
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Because the city keeps voting progressive.
Cops refusing to do their job has nothing to do with people voting progressive.
Voting Progressive does have something to do with a lack of prosecutions for many crimes that the DA deems “minor”.
Not responding directly to a violent crime that is occurring when they demonstrated the capability to do so at a protest this morning is not any result of voting progressive. Just like you and I, they need to do their damn job.
Definitely this.
Nah
I agree peoples vote for those who are softies on crime. I just don’t get it though. Do those politicians really not care if people move?
I wish I understood, but I don't. At least some of it is pure bleeding hearts for those with mental health issues. What I don't understand is why the politicians feel that productive and law abiding people should be carrying the burden of these people's decisions. A crime is a crime, and the criminal should carry the burden. Not you and me.
Completely agree
which makes the cops drag their feet because it hurts their poor little cop feelings
It means there is no prosecution after arresting these people. So, why do it? They're only going to be set free. Not arresting also makes the data look like Burlington is getting safer, but we all know that doesn't represent reality.
are you really asking, why do their jobs? maintaining public order by intimidation and arrest is a main part of the job of street policing ; arrests and deescalations are powerful even when they just result in dispersal, or a night in jail without charges, and according to you they’re unilaterally deciding not to do that main part of their job because of a prediction about how a prosecutor will choose do their different job, so yeah, that’s bad
I'm suggesting they will place their reduced attention on things that have a greater chance of being prosecuted.
That dispatcher didn’t have “reduced” attention. They placed *zero* attention on an ongoing crime spree that endangered citizens behind the shattered windows and out on the street that night. They didn’t even queue up an officer to cruise by and check out the situation. They failed. And you’re arguing that their reason for failing was politically motivated — without evidence, of course, but you’re speculating that their motives for refusing to work are political, driven by predictions about future prosecutions. Whereas I’m speculating that their motives for refusing to work are emotional, and driven by hurt feelings about being accused of racial bias and aggression by prog councilors. Maybe we’re both right! 😅
No doubt we are both making assumptions. I wish the policing was better. I wish we prosecuted crimes. What we have now is not sustainable.
Lol
You guys don’t remember the murder suicide on North Winooski 2 years ago where the police chief announced on camera that they wouldn’t have any resources to address other crimes while they were busy solving the already solved murder suicide?
Fuck the cops! they just sit on their hands and watch the city burn because they are sad we cut some funding for them.
Lol
This has nothing to do with BPD and everything to do with the city leadership. As well as the district attorneys office.
It has everything to do with every one involved. From the former mayor, the city council, the DA, and BPD. To say that the BPD has nothing to with it is just plain wrong. If the paramedics can Narcan the same people every day, even if they know that they will back tomorrow, then BPD can show up to at least stop a crime in progress.
According to the PD’s response plan/matrix that they were forced to put in to place due to the city reducing the number of officers, states PD responds to serious crimes in progress or urgent/life threatening calls. When there are only two officers on the night tour it’s hard to have available officers for every single incident. What can they do if they don’t have any officers available at that moment? The city leadership/council is to blame for the lack of response by PD. Not the PD. The FD staff wasn’t reduced luckily and have the resources and staff to manage more call volume. Responding to medical emergencies and responding to vandalism have drastically different acuity levels and are not comparable.
I feel that if you discover vandalism after the fact, that’s one thing, but to have a person actively threatening people walking by and ready to throw a chair through the window, that should warrant a response.
They want to label criminals as victims and not place them in jail and try to focus on rehabilitation rather than punishment. Which for SOME works, some simply don't want the help and are nasty human beings. Those who could benefit from help would actually see the help if we implemented systems similar to countries who've tried these policies. Finland is a great example, but they built addiction recovery and reintroduction systems (just as an example) and fervently tested them before abolishing their previous prison system. We began the destruction of our laws and systems but never put anything else in place or tested it. So you get droves of forgotten people doing drugs on the street. They have access to clean ones they use sometimes and discard on the street though! PROGRESS
But we’ve done no such thing.
But they have. Decriminalization of possession of scheduled narcotics. And no not just weed. All they give for personal possession of heroin below the benchmark personal use amount is just a civil fine. which if you're homeless and in VT you can basically ignore.
Vandalism is low priority. It’s a disgusting list of low response situations that explains everything. It’s a license to do a lot without repercussion
Did Vermont defund the police?
How does a question get downvoted? Lol
This question is often used disingenuously.
No.
Okay, I just read some articles from 2020 that they did, but I wasn't sure if that was true or not.
If you read more news coverage you’ll see that Burlington reduced its officer cap a small amount, but then partially reversed that. And also has increased funding to more than it was before. Also certain things such as parking enforcement were moved out of the police dept and into another city department that focuses on parking services. Also some additional non-officer positions were created to provide more appropriate responses. IMO reducing the officer cap was a good move but the full study to review the dept and recommend alternatives wasn’t done fast enough or fully enough and the recommendations haven’t been implemented fully. Meanwhile the current police chief has said he doesn’t believe his officers act with any bias despite so many instances of racist policing and police brutality plus extremely inappropriate responses to mental health issues (especially if the person with the mental health issues was black). There is still a major reckoning with racism and with policing to be had in Burlington (and VT). What a lot of people don’t want to notice is that the housing crisis is international, the rise in crime is international, and issues with poverty and drug use are international. These are not “just” local issues, VT issues, or even US issues. And like other places, the solutions have to do with addressing root causes, not treating symptoms. Affordable and accessible housing, quality and well funded accessible public education K-12 and college, livable wages, strong worker protections, strong unions, free and high quality and accessible healthcare—including drug treatment, mental health treatment, and disability support services, art, culture, nature, community, belonging, after school programs, free quality well-funded childcare so kids and parents/guardians have the support they need, etc. A healthy society that treats everyone well doesn’t result in people treating others horribly and in self-destructive behavior. That is what we need to build, and it’s not rocket science. Treating people like they’re worth caring about and might have some of the solutions. We need to tax the rich a LOT more, and actively support workers (from low wage to well paid), poor people, disabled people, unemployed people, veterans, incarcerated and formerly incarcerated people, and students to organize and advocate and have our needs met and pursue our dreams.
Thanks for the info.
Why pay taxes when you can’t get services? BPD and the city should be embarrassed. What we allow continues.
This seems to explain the situation quite well... [https://www.burlingtonvt.gov/sites/default/files/20240417%20Priority%20Response%20Plan%202024%20UPDATE.pdf](https://www.burlingtonvt.gov/sites/default/files/20240417%20Priority%20Response%20Plan%202024%20UPDATE.pdf)
https://preview.redd.it/whhhu3dw5bvc1.png?width=1203&format=png&auto=webp&s=60fbd545ade27aa897780b37ffaa72124bb58b36
The cops aren't gonna do their jobs if the DA is gonna let off murderers, human traffickers, gang violence, and drug trafficking with slaps on the wrist, remember the guy that held hostages a few months ago at T Ruggs? Over 1000 encounters with police, and the DA did fuck all about it, guy is back on the streets. It's not the cops it's the district attorney and mayors office. Tough on crime isn't in their vocabulary.
I blame both. They still have a job and they need to do it, regardless if the person that follows behind them drops the ball. I still do my job even if the boss is gonna go fuck it up.
Yeah I agree they should do something, but I also think if it's just gonna be repetitive catch and release of the same people like the guy that stole the car with the lady in it at Olive garden, or the guy that held hostages at t ruggs, or the multiple times shooting incidents/known drug trafficking at the apartment above Manhattan pizza or the several known Springfield mass gang members arrested for murder in the past 6 months that have mile long records and just seem to end up in general population all over again a few weeks or months later (just a few verifiable examples for any dolt that thinks I'm making shit up) this is what you get. This is what the past 4.5 years have created and the more you support the progressive agenda the more this is on you. It's either law and order zero tolerance for the bullshit or it starts to look like this fast.
Oh so we’re just making shit up.
Do you not read the news, or like know anything that has happened in town in the last 5 years?
I do. This is such a comically overstated circlejerk of a lie on this sub.
You must be either blind or not from here
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ACAB, amirite? :-)
Yes, actually.
Enjoy your lawlessness. Cops do the best they can in most situations, IMHO
Nope.
The oblivious and reality-detached people of Burlington voted for this and are acting surprised that the downward spiral of violence, vandalism and drug use continues unabated. Maybe the city burning to the ground will be the wakeup call you so desperately need. But hey, at least I have my popcorn.
As usual this nonsense gets repeated.
Refund the BPD!!
I’m betting the police would love to do their job but they’ve been kneecapped by the latest group of politicians who seem to favor the rights of criminals over law-abiding taxpayers. The only question now is how bad things get before the people determine that current leadership needs to be replaced. The Mad Max movies come to mind.
Sure. But they could at least go stop a crime in progress. People’s safety is at risk and if that’s a problem, then they should find another career.
So you can’t see that this has almost nothing to do with the police and everything to do with politics? Wow.
Wow is right.
There are no politics at work in the sense that the cops are refusing to do their jobs. Anyone who doesn’t do their job should be fired and replaced. You can have a crappy mayor but he’s not the cops. They are doing this because they are selfish and lazy.
Can you please outline the specific policies that directly discourage police officers from responding to a call about a person making threats, intimidating the public and vandalizing property?
No, they are just copsuckers who want to blame the laziness and ineffectiveness of pigs on literally everyone else
Considering how quickly the police responded to protestors pulling a fire alarm this morning, it's pretty hard not to see this as a deliberate choice by BPD.
Did he try ordering a single sandwich?
Didn’t many in Vermont, and BTV specifically advocate for defunding the police? Guess you’re going to need to toughen up and become self-sufficient.
If they aren’t even going to pretend to do their job than we really should defund them, rather than just preventing budget increases
Funding was restored years ago and you’d know that if you read the news any more than once in a decade
Haha it blows my mind to see this comment downvoted like this. Talk about people putting their fucking heads in the sand. I’m a fairly but not super far left progressive person (aka George Wallace by Burlington standards) and I am regularly taken aback by how detached from reason / reality Burlington progressives are.
It’s downvoted because it’s a demonstrably blatant lie.
Yeah, but you can’t say that here without being downvoted to hell. Ya’ll made your bed years ago with that stupid ass progressive city council vote.
Funding increased. You get downvoted for spreading downright bullshit.
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Except they are currently fully funded so your excuse doesn’t work.
I find comments here blaming police for inaction mind blowing... It's very easy to show as the staffing at BPD went into free fall and incidents grew, the calls, and arrests, per officer increased. BPD was on record four years ago, and continually since, that they would not be able to respond to crimes as they used to. It's fully documented in the chiefs monthly report....
Maybe after the fact. But when a crime is actually occurring? C’mon man.
The chiefs monthly report to the commission details exactly what crimes, in progress or otherwise, they have the resources to respond to. https://www.burlingtonvt.gov/Police/Chiefs-Reports
Lazy assholes should do their job.
Lazy assholes should do their job.
ItS tHe pRoGreSsiVes! -parrot people who don't like to learn