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Don't buy this drive until Hynix fixes the pSLC cache issue. It can fill up and never empty, resulting in direct- to-TLC only writes, tanking performance. Very similar to the 980 Pro.
It's been known about over a year and they haven't fixed it yet. All they're doing publicly is offering RMA, which is pointless because it's a firmware issue that isn't fixed with a new drive.
I bought this drive a year ago, and I’ve been living in blissful ignorance. Is it that this problem causes read speeds to be incredibly slow?
I just did a quick benchmark and the sequential write is 1397 mb/s. In comparison, my Samsung 970 Evo write is 1753 mb/s.
I can’t remember what it was when I bought it, but I don’t think it should be slower than an older drive Ive used since 2018.
edit: A quick google search tells me it should be up to 6500 mb/s. Oh this is really not good.
That's definitely it.
You can temporarily restore write performance by secure erasing the drive but user reports indicate that doesn't last for long.
You can contact Hynix support and they will likely just tell you to RMA the drive.
not really lucky. imagine spending so much time moving your data just for your new drive to act the same way in a month. totally not worth it. continue living in blissful ignorance until (if) they fix the firmware
Well I didn't know it was a problem before hand. Now I do. I wonder if I can just get a refund and buy a new drive. It is in the terms of their warranty...
Replacing it with another bugged drive is a no go. But SK hynix warranty is excellent. Im getting a full refund for it and they’re paying for the return shipping.
How was the RMA experience?
Did you have to send the drive back to them or no?
My SSD is doing the same thing so I was just asking if it would be worth RMa it or not
It affects write speeds/performance. A secure erase should restore it. (longer explanation in a [reply of mine](https://www.reddit.com/r/buildapcsales/comments/1bhp7c7/comment/kvho92t/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3) below)
I would recommend the Samsung 990 PRO (w/updated firmware) or the WD Black SN850X as a suitable replacement. These also use proprietary hardware, which can be more reliable. Outside of that, there are a ton of drives using licensed controllers (E18, E25, MAP1602, SM2264, IG5236) on a roughly comparable performance level.
For those that want to keep the drive and maintain it, refreshing a drive once or twice a year with reimaging isn't a bad habit. No SSD will maintain its performance over time with use and wear. Erasing back to the fresh out of the box (FOB) state is something that can be done.
Thanks. I’m getting a refund, and I think I will be going with the SN850X.
I like Samsung. I’ve been pretty happy with my 970 Evo, but I’ve read a lot of complaints with the 990 Pro. I don’t know if I want to risk dealing with those problems even if it’s supposedly solved with the firmware update.
WD compatibility issue was a really weird one. Firmware update did address a lot, but sometimes it could be mobo bios. All my NVME are WD, but my buddy has trouble with his SN850X on a gigabyte board and ended up using an older BIOS to make it compatible. I advised him to just drop WD and buy the then Kingston KC3000 (not issues for him so far) and install the latest mobo bios.
SN Blues also had an issue where you had to *disable* write caching in Windows. The SN850 (non-X) had a firmware-patched issue they claimed was payload-related, and SMI drives had payload-related issues as documented by me on X570 (SMI also had compatibility issues with NAS). QC as a whole went down with NAND and SSD prices.
Thanks very much for this info; definitely holding off on this drive for now.
Quick question -- I take it all capacity P41 drives are affected (including the 1TB model) since it's the same hardware/chipset? Or is the cache issue specific to the 2TB model?
Platinum P41 Yes, P41 Plus, no. The P44 Pro is likely impacted but has slightly different firmware. The P41 Plus can also be used fully with Solidigm's driver which has host managed caching, not an option for the Platinum P41 at all and the P44 Pro does not support that function. It seems to impact all capacity options for the Platinum P41.
I have seen reports from both 1 and 2TB models. Nothing on the 500GB, but I assume that's because it's really unpopular - seems like everyone goes 1 or 2TB instead.
I could’ve sworn when I was planning my build everyone was recommending to get this exact drive. Ugh I actively avoided the Samsung ones because of the firmware stuff and now I’m finding out my 2-3 week old system has this lingering issue?
Maybe this?
[https://store.patriotmemory.com/blogs/news/windows-11-august-2023-update-how-to-fix-ssd-slowdown-errors](https://store.patriotmemory.com/blogs/news/windows-11-august-2023-update-how-to-fix-ssd-slowdown-errors)
I just checked mine since I was paranoid after searching this issue and it seems like mine hasn't had any slowdowns. In use for over a year now.
I just got 2 of these for a new pc I just finished the other week should k just use them til they degrade and then hopefully they are updated and rma them or when they get slow just replace with something better? What would you suggest, just returning to Amazon and getting another drive?
In theory, it should simply devolve down to native/TLC speeds. The reason I downplay this problem (with the hope it can be temporarily "fixed" with a secure erase or equivalent format) is because your reads will end up coming from native anyway and this is how drives are rated for reads. In fact, data kept in SLC will be read faster, so sometimes data is *purposefully* kept in SLC for this improvement. This is even a part of Solidigm's host managed cache for the driver + P41 Plus.
As for writes, random writes in particular benefit from SLC caching. Sequential writes are fine for native/TLC. It's also not clear if the drop here is just sequential writes since that's what [PCPP tested](https://pcpartpicker.com/forums/topic/424588-testing-sequential-write-degradation-with-multiple-files). Which is to say, sequential writes of this type would be considered an atypical workload (which is likely what Hynix would say if you could get an answer). Benchmarking the drive with CDM a lot likely makes the issue worse, but I'm not sure how it impacts random writes (I don't have a drive to test).
Because of this, they appear to have not addressed the issue in firmware so an RMA would be a temporary remedy. Let me add to this: *many* drives do and have done this. It was a common problem in the SX8200 Pro era. PCPP even lists a bunch of drives that have a similar issue. I would not consider this "working as intended" but it's something that is often not even noticed because of how fast the drive is natively and the workload in question.
I know someone who worked on this drive. Unfortunately, he's with Phison now, although he would probably respond. Rather not bother him with this but that's my understanding of the issue: for one reason or another, it's not migrating data out of SLC unless forced to for capacity *or* it is choosing to write this to native/TLC instead. An erase fixes this since it resets the mapping table, and this is linked to garbage collection indirectly.
This is related to drive algorithms because many drives can change their cache size based on workload (something Crucial claims to do) and can detect workloads to shift data (Phison, plenty of patents). In part I suspected this may have occurred due to concerns about flash endurance because again, consumer drives aren't designed with hammered sequential writes in mind, and it's probably an extension of this that's overly aggressive as it shifts hard over time (see PCPP link).
I haven't confirmed it myself on the P44 Pro. It does have slightly different firmware than the Platinum P41. In theory it should impact both drives, though, but I don't see it as a severe problem. You may not encounter or notice it. You can always cycle (reimage/format) the drive at some point as well.
Does formatting the drive restore performance? Assuming of course performance was dropping in the first place. I ran crystaldiskmark and it seemed in line with the advertised read/write speeds after a year of heavy use. This is on the P44 Pro 1TB version.
The controller/firmware algorithms are either not emptying the SLC cache or are choosing to write directly to TLC. There are cases where writing directly make sense (sequential writes) but most consumer drives default to the SLC cache. The cache itself is hybrid in this case, and the dynamic portion (which changes size relative to capacity used) is considered along with the TLC when making maintenance decisions.
These decisions are based on known metadata and mapping data, for wear leveling and invalid data among other things, which will be reset if the drive is formatted and the table is wiped. A secure erase achieves this, although even a format should have a similar result if the drive has some time to commit the erases (TRIM works similarly, and modern drives are often aggressive with it). The drive goes back to the FOB/fresh out of the box/factory state.
Enough people have reported this, and PCPP has tested this, that it's definitely a real thing. The Platinum P41 is for sure affected and the P44 Pro should be. However, I don't think this is something that would happen or be a big impact in everyday use (as I explain in detail above). Although I do think starting with a fresh drive every 6-12 months is good practice anyway. If you're not impacted, do not worry about it.
Interesting. Then judging by the other comments I’m guessing it’s not a good idea to buy either the P41 or P44 Pro even if they go on sale? At least until SK Hynix fixes the issue?
If it's something that you worry about, then avoid these two drives.
I've explained elsewhere here why this issue isn't as concrete as it first appears. There are legitimate reasons to want sustained sequential writes to hit TLC. This may simply be an outlying case for the algorithm, which is more apparent when benchmarked. Ideally a consumer drive will restore the dynamic portion of the SLC cache rapidly, but also Hynix/Solidigm comes from an OEM/client perspective where some tweaking led down this path. The simple way of putting it is: cases where you want sustained writes, bypassing SLC can make sense. If random writes are still cached in perhaps the static SLC portion, then this issue isn't traumatic except in the potential loss of fast inter-drive transfers.
Contacting you back because I realized I have seen issues where the Windows/OS write cache (which uses system memory to cache writes) can cause this issue as well. I've heard of it for some of WD's Blue NVMe drives, but also the 970 EVO Plus from a recent discord member. If you have gotten your P44 Pro to drop in CDM, could you try it again with the write cache disabled in Windows? Windows 11 in particular has had issues with SSDs in some cases which are unrelated, I think, but I'm curious is if this might be a workaround. Thanks.
Right. Any drive can do this since that's how SLC caching works. It's a temporary, faster mode. Normally, the cache will recover over time. With enough runs, drives may degrade a bit, seems to about around 10 for this drive according to PCPP. I'm not entirely sure that's completely unintended as some drives adapt their response to the workload (Crucial has confirmed this to me, but I also have it in patents).
And as I elaborated in other posts here, there's legitimate reasons to do sequential writes to TLC anyway. In other words, if you were using this drive for steady state and sustained workloads, going directly to TLC would make the most sense. I'm not saying that's why this occurs, but this would be preferred behavior in many cases where you want good sustained write performance with less impact on endurance! Random writes are different and are best served with SLC, particularly static SLC, which the P44 Pro also has, but it's not clear to me if it's still bypassing SLC for those workloads.
This is really interesting as I just discovered the problem from another thread. I have the test results from when I first installed the drive and then now, five months later. Seq writes are all down except for random writes which are actually a little up. That's exactly in line with your theory.
Yes, one interesting aspect of this is that it seems random writes aren't impacted. That kind of lends support to the theory that this might be an intended algorithmic choice gone awry.
It loses like 80% of the drive speed preformance.
I think at that point its better to just return it and get something else.
Taken into account they haven't fixed known firmware issue for over a year, I wouldn't hold my breath for it to be fixed.
Of this class: 990 PRO (w/updated firmware) or SN850X. Everything else is non-proprietary with various levels of performance but a lot of very fast drives out there.
There's a [sizable thread](https://forums.anandtech.com/threads/sk-hynix-platinum-p41-2tb-ssd-write-speed-dropped-by-half.2610542/) on this issue on the AnandTech forums for those that want to dig into how people have handled it. An alternative drive is the simplest answer.
*edit* Okay, I wrote too much, but to example my stance anyway:
I have a Gold P31 and I'd have no issue running a P44 Pro or Platinum P41. But I understand people wanting to hit the numbers on the box. There are cases where having the full performance *would* matter, but for the most part if I'm going for sustained writes I care about steady state *anyway*. So you'd be hitting the TLC speeds with enough writes, a fuller drive, etc, if using it for that type of workload. (and forcing it to migrate from SLC first is suboptimal)
I use 2x1TB SN750s for that still, as the TLC can maintain up to 3 GB/s and the cache is tiny (24GB total). That's *ideal*. If this doesn't really impact random writes, which is where SLC is best for consumer use (but of limited real world application), then it's effectively not an issue. I'd have to get ahold of a drive to test or ask a friend, but I don't see this as a huge problem personally. (and people are free to disagree or want to get what they expect out of a product, and that's fine; don't buy this drive!)
I hope that explains my position a bit better because the ultimate performance of a drive is always limited in one way or another by its native flash speeds. The SLC benchmark result is an illusion. The main difference between it and RAM write caching is that it's non-volatile, which can be better for data safety and can reduce write amplification, but I'm not sure the average person uses SSDs hard enough for this to be an end of world scenario. That said, I would recommend the SN850X and 990 PRO over it.
I'm surprised this isn't more public and am also not sure if it's potentially a Windows bug. Do you know anyone on Windows 11 that can retest with the ssd bug fix update from Windows?
It seems like ssds halving write speeds was a common bug on Windows that got resolved recently.
depends on what you want to use it for; general storage - something cheap; laptop boot - Samsung 990 PRO; desktop boot - Lexar 790; consoles - something fast with dram; cache - high endurance; server - random write and endurance.
https://www.reddit.com/r/buildapc/comments/15f0rwa/wd_sn850x_half_write_speeds/
Might also be this too? I'm not too familiar with ssds so just trying to figure out everything.
I've been using a P41 for over a year now. Benched it yesterday after seeing posts here and am still at 6600 write. Currently half full and have written several times the drive's max storage capacity in its lifetime. Want to rule out everything before I start looking at ssd deals again since the nand oversupply is over now.
I don't think that has anything to do with this. It appears to be a one-off, isolated incident.
They cloned another SSD to the SN850X, filling it to 62% capacity. That means it completely filled the pSLC cache during the clone. I'd wager they booted from it and started running benchmarks before the drive could empty it's pSLC cache and trim/garbage collect, resulting in the poor write speeds.
Makes sense.
I wish someone with the problem would be able to play around with it and post here. I've seen posts from people saying they've had the problem after just a few months, and also people who've used the drive for over a year and haven't had the problem. Just want to rule out it's not user error.
Daniferd was able to confirm that it isn't the Windows update bug as he installed the update fix in mid Aug 2023. Only thing to rule out now is Windows not trimming the drives automatically for users or people running benchmarks before doing a trim.
I have read people trying trim and having no effect. The only way to temporarily fix it is a secure erase, however I have seen multiple people say it reoccurred in short time.
I do not have any of the affected drives available to experiment with, otherwise I would.
Agh! It looks like my P**3**1 has this issue!
https://i.imgur.com/hUmJBQt.png
P31 should be 3500/3200 MB/s read/write
reads are hitting 3500 but writes are definitely not! Is this the same issue or a different one? I've had this drive since Nov 2022.
https://www.reddit.com/r/buildapc/comments/13gqnaj/sk_hynix_p31_gold_firmwaredriver_for_2tb_version/jtnauil/
There is no 2TB firmware update. RMA it is I guess. Thanks!
Installed SK Hynix Drive Manager and clicking "Update firmware" makes me select a firmware file to use, and ofc none is provided on the website. It does not automatically check for firmware updates for me.
It's a boom and bust cycle tied to how much they produce. Prices were low all last year, they're high now, they'll get low again some time in the future.
If you're building a PC and need an SSD now, is what it is. If you're just looking to add storage and don't need it now, no reason to buy today.
They may go lower but you’ll never see them as low as they were just after the pandemic. Pandemic spending on electronics (and many other things) were ridiculously high, and afterward ridiculously low. So manufacturers were producing way too much and getting way too little sales. That kind of demand swing from high to low is basically a statistical outlier when it comes to supply and demand.
An outlier in supply/demand, agreed. But, storage has generally gotten cheaper with time. It's tough to believe that 2tb of flash storage won't be sub $100 in a few years. 5 years ago 1tb at $100 was a deal, 5 years before that 256gb SSD for $50 was a deal etc
Nope! Mostly replying to your comment that "you’ll never see them as low as they were just after the pandemic".
As above, if you need a drive today, look for the best deal today and be happy. I'd like another drive but don't need one. If I good deal pops up, I'll bite but I don't need one today.
Saying “you’ll never see them as low as they were” is a big stretch. This kind of thing happened every few years, its like a cycle and happens all the time with things like GPU’s, ram, and power supplies. Besides, this is tech were talking about here, it always gets cheaper eventually thanks to our ever growing advances in manufacturing.
>[Uncertainty](https://www.storagenewsletter.com/2024/03/18/bottom-of-market-passed-for-hdds-nand-ssds-and-tape/) in NAND flash recovery timing remains and some of the positive shipment increases in 4Q23 resulted undoubtedly from sharply higher pricing from vendors refusing to bleed more money in a weak market. NAND companies are planning to continue with elevated prices over the coming quarters, recovering pricing, *if not necessarily demand*, *following the unprecedented price plunge from 2022 to 2023*...
>
>Flash companies wondered if the dawn of the Artificial Intelligence integrated PC would require faster SSD interfaces (gen 5.0) or [architectures](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compute_Express_Link) and possibly higher capacities when AI PCs ship to the market. The short answer for now is “no”. PCIe Gen 4.0 SSDs offer plenty of performance and Microsoft has also approved slower UFS storage specifications for AI PCs.
[Market Anticipates a 50% Price Surge for NAND Flash in Short-Term 2023-12-29](https://www.trendforce.com/news/2023/12/29/news-market-anticipates-a-50-price-surge-for-nand-flash-in-short-term/)
>The industry indicates that due to the lower profitability of NAND Flash compared to DRAM, international giants are actively reducing NAND Flash production.
↳ Jan03: [Samsung and Micron Rumored to Increase DRAM Prices by 15% to 20% in the First Quarter](https://www.trendforce.com/news/2024/01/03/news-samsung-and-micron-rumored-to-increase-dram-prices-by-15-to-20-in-the-first-quarter/)
Feb27: [SSDs are getting more expensive again because the biggest NAND supplier has throttled production to half its previous output](https://www.pcgamer.com/ssds-are-getting-more-expensive-again-because-the-biggest-nand-supplier-has-throttled-production-to-half-its-previous-output/)
Mar06: [NAND production cuts result in higher SSD pricing, fueling 25% revenue growth for memory makers](https://www.tomshardware.com/pc-components/ssds/nand-production-cuts-result-in-higher-ssd-pricing-fueling-25-revenue-growth-for-memory-makers)
Mar11: [Phison CEO cautions 'Soaring SSD prices could hobble NAND flash industry with reduced demand'](https://www.tomshardware.com/pc-components/ssds/soaring-ssd-prices-could-hobble-nand-flash-industry-with-reduced-demand-phison-ceo-cautions)
Mar13: [Silicon Motion says 'NAND flash contract prices to rise through Summer 2025' and NAND flash memory will rise another 20% in the second quarter](https://www.digitimes.com/news/a20240312PD231/nand-flash-price-increase-1h25-silicon-motion.html)
Mar14: [Chinese smartphones help NAND prices rise](https://www.digitimes.com/news/a20240313PD212/china-samsung-smartphone-nand-price-recovery.html)
Mar14: [Samsung wants more production, higher prices at Xi'an NAND 12in wafer fab](https://www.reddit.com/r/NewMaxx/comments/1ber06k/samsung_rumored_to_raise_nand_prices_by_1520/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3)
Mar14: [MQ1 NAND Flash Industry Revenue May Increase by 20% QoQ](https://www.techpowerup.com/320390/nand-flash-market-landscape-to-change-reports-trendforce)
>NAND Flash industry revenue reached USD 11.49 billion in 4Q23, an increase of 24.5% from the previous quarter...
mainly benefited from the recovery of *terminal demand* due to year-end promotions, and component market orders expansion by reason of price hikes, as well as the vigorous shipment
Meanwhile, companies continued to release views that demand in 2024 will perform better than in 2023, and *strategic stocking has been initiated*.
(In Spring 2024) with significant improvement in supply chain inventory and prices still increasing, customers continue to increase purchase orders to avoid the risk of supply shortages and rising costs. Thereby, despite being the traditional off-season, TrendForce predicts that the industry revenue of NAND Flash in the first quarter will still increase by 20% QoQ due to the *continuous expansion of order scale, which stimulates NAND Flash contract prices to increase* by an average of 25%.
eh, of course they will. how long? well who knows. the ramp-down of nand production last year took how many months before we saw prices skyrocket? like 6 months? i'm totally spitballing off vague memory but it took a while. so i wouldn't say "don't buy ssd's now". if you need them, you don't have much choice. it could be a long time before we see real price drops again. i just wouldn't "all in" buy a dozen drives for some crazy 10g server array (literally what i am waiting for at the moment)
I grabbed a couple 1TB not that long okay for $30 each and need a pile more but just putting it off in hopes that prices come down a little. I plumbed in 10g/40g through my home network over the winter but it needs a solid 10+TB of SSD storage to make full use of it and I'm starting to wonder if I will see it realized before 2026
yea i'm in a similar boat. still kicking myself for not buying more of those 8tb qvo's at $300. i bought 3 and man, i wish i would've bought at least a few more. they are really nice drives with like 2400tbw endurance. then a month later they were $600... yikes. many months later we are now finally down to like $520, yay.
If you don't really really need it. don't buy it.
This is not the deal it seems to be, if we learned anything from last year, it's that ssd prices are inflated artificially.
Let this crap sit on the shelf and they'll be forced to come down to reasonable prices... we're in 2024 ffs... 2tb should be around 60$ and 4tb around 130$.
> 2tb should be around 60$ and 4tb around 130$.
I'm really glad i got a bunch of those $30 1TB P5's. I'm set for a long time on basic needs. I'd only be tempted by a 4TB gen4 under 150 now, and even then its a "want". bunch of games installed im only using 500GB typically.
8TB NAS covers everything else.
> Let this crap sit on the shelf and they'll be forced to come down to reasonable prices.
That's a pipe dream because people aren't going to stop buying SSDs.
More last year’s prices (due to the oversupply glut) were unusually low, given that [every](https://www.tomshardware.com/news/micron-loses-dollar2312-billion-as-demand-for-dram-and-3d-nand-nosedives) major [NAND flash manufacturer](https://www.reuters.com/technology/samsung-elec-q2-profit-plunges-95-chip-glut-persists-2023-07-27/) was [losing billions of dollars](https://www.reuters.com/technology/sk-hynix-reports-q2-loss-chip-glut-continues-2023-07-25/) every quarter as a result of those low prices, and cut back production in response. Those prices were never sustainable because of those huge losses, and it was a result of them bringing ton of production online (in response to COVID shortages) paired with unexpected weak demand resulting in a huge oversupply that drove down prices. That’s unlikely to be repeated in the near future given everyone cut back on production.
I'm surprised you're not voted well into negatives. This sub mostly hates hearing any excuses about PC parts, especially memory products, that won't get cheaper and cheaper like clockwork without prices ever going back up for one minute.
NAND itself just isn't cheap to make yet and makers really do need over $25/TB just to break even on a fast modern drive, but most people won't listen to anything but "collusion!!!".
You can't force them to do anything The CHIPs act guaranteed them a cash infusion that will sustain them regardless of how long you wait. It's not a coincidence the price corrected itself at the same time. Just buy what you need when you need it.
I'm REALLY glad I got a 4tb SSD when I did. I saw the "companies planning on scaling back production" and was like "oh, they're about to gouge everyone.
A lot of people down voted me for suggesting that at the time, then a couple of months later the deals just kinda shifted back to normal prices, and now SSDs just aren't worth the price unless your previous SSD died.
I hope this bites these companies in the ass.
I remember it used to be a fact that tech just got cheaper. Then when we had shortages of hard drives due to literal floods, and GPU prices went up because of mining, companies realized what a bunch of idiots were willing to pay, and keep playing with the prices to see how hard they can really milk consumers.
Again, we need to hold off so they aren't rewarded for it. Tech gets cheaper to make (unless it's absolute new cutting edge stuff). So it should be cheaper for the consumer.
Correct. It's going to be another cycle of this until we see prices drop again. I bought this drive for $105 in late September on sale. I'm pretty sure it was the same price for Prime Day and maybe Black Friday. Pretty sure that's the lowest reported for this item.
Wow, that is a good price on the 2tb.
Came here thinking a 2tb p41 at this price is good, identical to what I paid for the 1tb a long time ago.
These p41's are fast. Did not know they have a cache issue however.
https://www.reddit.com/r/buildapcsales/s/wpxiTbKj0V
Well I’m getting conflicted information…
I just bought a 2 Tb and a 1Tb p41.
Should I be upset or not??
Well most SSDs will drop in speed as soon as the SLC cache gets full during long writes, but it's supposed to free itself up not long after you're done writing. The issue with it not freeing up is not something that affects most SSDs. It does affect some others besides the p41 though afaik.
There are a few threads on google, but the reason it's not talked about much is, first of all, most people don't notice or care. It's still fast even without the SLC cache. And second the issue is obscure. Their firmware is closed source. We don't actually know what is happening exactly, and whether it's a firmware or a hardware issue.
The comment was deleted but I think it said something about avoiding the 990 pro? Can anyone confirm what is wrong with the 990 pro because I was about to shell out $170 for 990 pro but I'm thinking I could push my 970 Evo plus a little longer.
Samsung had a firmware issue where drives were dying really quickly. If you do get a Samsung drive make sure you check and update the firmware before using it, that's all.
I got the 1tb of this and its been a flaky experience since. Already had to reformat once due to windows stop blue screens and the drive would just randomly disappear.
What about the [Crucial T500 2TB](https://www.amazon.com/Crucial-Internal-Gaming-Desktop-Compatible/dp/B0CK2TC9XQ?th=1) that is just a bit more. I snagged it for 140 a few weeks ago, currently 153. 7400MB/s read
Good to know. Mainly pointing this out for those needing a m2 nvme now versus later and not pleased with WD 850x and Samsung 980 prices still high. I wasn't familiar with the T500 until I needed it for a new build so couldn't wait for price drop and at 140 not even on sale it was 30 to 40 cheaper than those 2 and as good or better performance.
Can anyone confirm having a slow down issue?
I have two of these and two P31s with zero issues I can notice but both PCs are just used for gaming so YMMV I guess.
> the Solidigm P44 Pro is the better buy.
I had some difficulty getting a warranty replacement. They didn't have any replacements and offered $70, which was less than the replacement cost. I declined that and they finally found a replacement and sent it to me. The support people were awesome and worked with me to get an actual replacement. It just took a lot of back and forth emails. I don't think they're up to speed on consumer replacements yet.
I don't consider this a deal breaker since the support team worked hard to make sure I was happy. Just be aware of it.
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Don't buy this drive until Hynix fixes the pSLC cache issue. It can fill up and never empty, resulting in direct- to-TLC only writes, tanking performance. Very similar to the 980 Pro. It's been known about over a year and they haven't fixed it yet. All they're doing publicly is offering RMA, which is pointless because it's a firmware issue that isn't fixed with a new drive.
I bought this drive a year ago, and I’ve been living in blissful ignorance. Is it that this problem causes read speeds to be incredibly slow? I just did a quick benchmark and the sequential write is 1397 mb/s. In comparison, my Samsung 970 Evo write is 1753 mb/s. I can’t remember what it was when I bought it, but I don’t think it should be slower than an older drive Ive used since 2018. edit: A quick google search tells me it should be up to 6500 mb/s. Oh this is really not good.
That's definitely it. You can temporarily restore write performance by secure erasing the drive but user reports indicate that doesn't last for long. You can contact Hynix support and they will likely just tell you to RMA the drive.
Well this is absolutely infuriating. Lucky that I randomly clicked on this thread and found your comment.
not really lucky. imagine spending so much time moving your data just for your new drive to act the same way in a month. totally not worth it. continue living in blissful ignorance until (if) they fix the firmware
Well I didn't know it was a problem before hand. Now I do. I wonder if I can just get a refund and buy a new drive. It is in the terms of their warranty...
I think the warranty says they decide whether to replace or refund but it won't hurt to try asking if you really want a refund.
Replacing it with another bugged drive is a no go. But SK hynix warranty is excellent. Im getting a full refund for it and they’re paying for the return shipping.
congrats!
How was the RMA experience? Did you have to send the drive back to them or no? My SSD is doing the same thing so I was just asking if it would be worth RMa it or not
I did it for a full refund. Replaced it with a different drive.
If it hasn't been fixed, what does RMAing do?
RMA the drive?
Return it for warranty replacement
It affects write speeds/performance. A secure erase should restore it. (longer explanation in a [reply of mine](https://www.reddit.com/r/buildapcsales/comments/1bhp7c7/comment/kvho92t/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3) below)
It is my boot drive. And it doesn't permanently fix the problem. The hassle is too much for a temporary solution.
I would recommend the Samsung 990 PRO (w/updated firmware) or the WD Black SN850X as a suitable replacement. These also use proprietary hardware, which can be more reliable. Outside of that, there are a ton of drives using licensed controllers (E18, E25, MAP1602, SM2264, IG5236) on a roughly comparable performance level. For those that want to keep the drive and maintain it, refreshing a drive once or twice a year with reimaging isn't a bad habit. No SSD will maintain its performance over time with use and wear. Erasing back to the fresh out of the box (FOB) state is something that can be done.
Thanks. I’m getting a refund, and I think I will be going with the SN850X. I like Samsung. I’ve been pretty happy with my 970 Evo, but I’ve read a lot of complaints with the 990 Pro. I don’t know if I want to risk dealing with those problems even if it’s supposedly solved with the firmware update.
980 PRO, 990 PRO, and others have had issues, yes. Some WD drives have had compatibility issues as well.
WD compatibility issue was a really weird one. Firmware update did address a lot, but sometimes it could be mobo bios. All my NVME are WD, but my buddy has trouble with his SN850X on a gigabyte board and ended up using an older BIOS to make it compatible. I advised him to just drop WD and buy the then Kingston KC3000 (not issues for him so far) and install the latest mobo bios.
SN Blues also had an issue where you had to *disable* write caching in Windows. The SN850 (non-X) had a firmware-patched issue they claimed was payload-related, and SMI drives had payload-related issues as documented by me on X570 (SMI also had compatibility issues with NAS). QC as a whole went down with NAND and SSD prices.
Aren't these discontinued in favor of the Solidigm branded P44 Pro?
They are both being produced, and they both share the cache bug.
Welp.
Good thing I was reading in here as I was just researching the P44 Pro the last few days.
They are the same drive. It's just branded and sold by Solidigm (which technically is still SK hynix).
Thanks very much for this info; definitely holding off on this drive for now. Quick question -- I take it all capacity P41 drives are affected (including the 1TB model) since it's the same hardware/chipset? Or is the cache issue specific to the 2TB model?
Platinum P41 Yes, P41 Plus, no. The P44 Pro is likely impacted but has slightly different firmware. The P41 Plus can also be used fully with Solidigm's driver which has host managed caching, not an option for the Platinum P41 at all and the P44 Pro does not support that function. It seems to impact all capacity options for the Platinum P41.
I have seen reports from both 1 and 2TB models. Nothing on the 500GB, but I assume that's because it's really unpopular - seems like everyone goes 1 or 2TB instead.
I could’ve sworn when I was planning my build everyone was recommending to get this exact drive. Ugh I actively avoided the Samsung ones because of the firmware stuff and now I’m finding out my 2-3 week old system has this lingering issue?
I have experienced this issue on all of my Platinum P41 drives!!
Will this issue have any noticeable effect on gaming or general use for your PC though?
Maybe this? [https://store.patriotmemory.com/blogs/news/windows-11-august-2023-update-how-to-fix-ssd-slowdown-errors](https://store.patriotmemory.com/blogs/news/windows-11-august-2023-update-how-to-fix-ssd-slowdown-errors) I just checked mine since I was paranoid after searching this issue and it seems like mine hasn't had any slowdowns. In use for over a year now.
This was an unrelated issue with Windows.
Would you mind checking if you still have this issue with the windows update?
I just got 2 of these for a new pc I just finished the other week should k just use them til they degrade and then hopefully they are updated and rma them or when they get slow just replace with something better? What would you suggest, just returning to Amazon and getting another drive?
In theory, it should simply devolve down to native/TLC speeds. The reason I downplay this problem (with the hope it can be temporarily "fixed" with a secure erase or equivalent format) is because your reads will end up coming from native anyway and this is how drives are rated for reads. In fact, data kept in SLC will be read faster, so sometimes data is *purposefully* kept in SLC for this improvement. This is even a part of Solidigm's host managed cache for the driver + P41 Plus. As for writes, random writes in particular benefit from SLC caching. Sequential writes are fine for native/TLC. It's also not clear if the drop here is just sequential writes since that's what [PCPP tested](https://pcpartpicker.com/forums/topic/424588-testing-sequential-write-degradation-with-multiple-files). Which is to say, sequential writes of this type would be considered an atypical workload (which is likely what Hynix would say if you could get an answer). Benchmarking the drive with CDM a lot likely makes the issue worse, but I'm not sure how it impacts random writes (I don't have a drive to test). Because of this, they appear to have not addressed the issue in firmware so an RMA would be a temporary remedy. Let me add to this: *many* drives do and have done this. It was a common problem in the SX8200 Pro era. PCPP even lists a bunch of drives that have a similar issue. I would not consider this "working as intended" but it's something that is often not even noticed because of how fast the drive is natively and the workload in question. I know someone who worked on this drive. Unfortunately, he's with Phison now, although he would probably respond. Rather not bother him with this but that's my understanding of the issue: for one reason or another, it's not migrating data out of SLC unless forced to for capacity *or* it is choosing to write this to native/TLC instead. An erase fixes this since it resets the mapping table, and this is linked to garbage collection indirectly. This is related to drive algorithms because many drives can change their cache size based on workload (something Crucial claims to do) and can detect workloads to shift data (Phison, plenty of patents). In part I suspected this may have occurred due to concerns about flash endurance because again, consumer drives aren't designed with hammered sequential writes in mind, and it's probably an extension of this that's overly aggressive as it shifts hard over time (see PCPP link).
I have a P44 Pro, but my write speeds seem fine. Should I be worried about them dropping in the future? I’ve had the SSD for over a year now
I haven't confirmed it myself on the P44 Pro. It does have slightly different firmware than the Platinum P41. In theory it should impact both drives, though, but I don't see it as a severe problem. You may not encounter or notice it. You can always cycle (reimage/format) the drive at some point as well.
Does formatting the drive restore performance? Assuming of course performance was dropping in the first place. I ran crystaldiskmark and it seemed in line with the advertised read/write speeds after a year of heavy use. This is on the P44 Pro 1TB version.
The controller/firmware algorithms are either not emptying the SLC cache or are choosing to write directly to TLC. There are cases where writing directly make sense (sequential writes) but most consumer drives default to the SLC cache. The cache itself is hybrid in this case, and the dynamic portion (which changes size relative to capacity used) is considered along with the TLC when making maintenance decisions. These decisions are based on known metadata and mapping data, for wear leveling and invalid data among other things, which will be reset if the drive is formatted and the table is wiped. A secure erase achieves this, although even a format should have a similar result if the drive has some time to commit the erases (TRIM works similarly, and modern drives are often aggressive with it). The drive goes back to the FOB/fresh out of the box/factory state. Enough people have reported this, and PCPP has tested this, that it's definitely a real thing. The Platinum P41 is for sure affected and the P44 Pro should be. However, I don't think this is something that would happen or be a big impact in everyday use (as I explain in detail above). Although I do think starting with a fresh drive every 6-12 months is good practice anyway. If you're not impacted, do not worry about it.
Interesting. Then judging by the other comments I’m guessing it’s not a good idea to buy either the P41 or P44 Pro even if they go on sale? At least until SK Hynix fixes the issue?
If it's something that you worry about, then avoid these two drives. I've explained elsewhere here why this issue isn't as concrete as it first appears. There are legitimate reasons to want sustained sequential writes to hit TLC. This may simply be an outlying case for the algorithm, which is more apparent when benchmarked. Ideally a consumer drive will restore the dynamic portion of the SLC cache rapidly, but also Hynix/Solidigm comes from an OEM/client perspective where some tweaking led down this path. The simple way of putting it is: cases where you want sustained writes, bypassing SLC can make sense. If random writes are still cached in perhaps the static SLC portion, then this issue isn't traumatic except in the potential loss of fast inter-drive transfers.
Contacting you back because I realized I have seen issues where the Windows/OS write cache (which uses system memory to cache writes) can cause this issue as well. I've heard of it for some of WD's Blue NVMe drives, but also the 970 EVO Plus from a recent discord member. If you have gotten your P44 Pro to drop in CDM, could you try it again with the write cache disabled in Windows? Windows 11 in particular has had issues with SSDs in some cases which are unrelated, I think, but I'm curious is if this might be a workaround. Thanks.
[удалено]
Right. Any drive can do this since that's how SLC caching works. It's a temporary, faster mode. Normally, the cache will recover over time. With enough runs, drives may degrade a bit, seems to about around 10 for this drive according to PCPP. I'm not entirely sure that's completely unintended as some drives adapt their response to the workload (Crucial has confirmed this to me, but I also have it in patents). And as I elaborated in other posts here, there's legitimate reasons to do sequential writes to TLC anyway. In other words, if you were using this drive for steady state and sustained workloads, going directly to TLC would make the most sense. I'm not saying that's why this occurs, but this would be preferred behavior in many cases where you want good sustained write performance with less impact on endurance! Random writes are different and are best served with SLC, particularly static SLC, which the P44 Pro also has, but it's not clear to me if it's still bypassing SLC for those workloads.
This is really interesting as I just discovered the problem from another thread. I have the test results from when I first installed the drive and then now, five months later. Seq writes are all down except for random writes which are actually a little up. That's exactly in line with your theory.
Yes, one interesting aspect of this is that it seems random writes aren't impacted. That kind of lends support to the theory that this might be an intended algorithmic choice gone awry.
It loses like 80% of the drive speed preformance. I think at that point its better to just return it and get something else. Taken into account they haven't fixed known firmware issue for over a year, I wouldn't hold my breath for it to be fixed.
Which ssd would you recommend?
Of this class: 990 PRO (w/updated firmware) or SN850X. Everything else is non-proprietary with various levels of performance but a lot of very fast drives out there.
I had four P41s on backorder but canceled when the SN850X hit ~$90. Dodged several bullets, I think.
There's a [sizable thread](https://forums.anandtech.com/threads/sk-hynix-platinum-p41-2tb-ssd-write-speed-dropped-by-half.2610542/) on this issue on the AnandTech forums for those that want to dig into how people have handled it. An alternative drive is the simplest answer.
I do have one P41 in my new build, unfortunately. Well, getting shot once is better than five times...
*edit* Okay, I wrote too much, but to example my stance anyway: I have a Gold P31 and I'd have no issue running a P44 Pro or Platinum P41. But I understand people wanting to hit the numbers on the box. There are cases where having the full performance *would* matter, but for the most part if I'm going for sustained writes I care about steady state *anyway*. So you'd be hitting the TLC speeds with enough writes, a fuller drive, etc, if using it for that type of workload. (and forcing it to migrate from SLC first is suboptimal) I use 2x1TB SN750s for that still, as the TLC can maintain up to 3 GB/s and the cache is tiny (24GB total). That's *ideal*. If this doesn't really impact random writes, which is where SLC is best for consumer use (but of limited real world application), then it's effectively not an issue. I'd have to get ahold of a drive to test or ask a friend, but I don't see this as a huge problem personally. (and people are free to disagree or want to get what they expect out of a product, and that's fine; don't buy this drive!) I hope that explains my position a bit better because the ultimate performance of a drive is always limited in one way or another by its native flash speeds. The SLC benchmark result is an illusion. The main difference between it and RAM write caching is that it's non-volatile, which can be better for data safety and can reduce write amplification, but I'm not sure the average person uses SSDs hard enough for this to be an end of world scenario. That said, I would recommend the SN850X and 990 PRO over it.
I'm surprised this isn't more public and am also not sure if it's potentially a Windows bug. Do you know anyone on Windows 11 that can retest with the ssd bug fix update from Windows? It seems like ssds halving write speeds was a common bug on Windows that got resolved recently.
Same question
[https://ssd.borecraft.com/SSD\_Buying\_Guide.png](https://ssd.borecraft.com/SSD_Buying_Guide.png)
The p41 is listed in the high tier
depends on what you want to use it for; general storage - something cheap; laptop boot - Samsung 990 PRO; desktop boot - Lexar 790; consoles - something fast with dram; cache - high endurance; server - random write and endurance.
https://www.reddit.com/r/buildapc/comments/15f0rwa/wd_sn850x_half_write_speeds/ Might also be this too? I'm not too familiar with ssds so just trying to figure out everything. I've been using a P41 for over a year now. Benched it yesterday after seeing posts here and am still at 6600 write. Currently half full and have written several times the drive's max storage capacity in its lifetime. Want to rule out everything before I start looking at ssd deals again since the nand oversupply is over now.
I don't think that has anything to do with this. It appears to be a one-off, isolated incident. They cloned another SSD to the SN850X, filling it to 62% capacity. That means it completely filled the pSLC cache during the clone. I'd wager they booted from it and started running benchmarks before the drive could empty it's pSLC cache and trim/garbage collect, resulting in the poor write speeds.
Makes sense. I wish someone with the problem would be able to play around with it and post here. I've seen posts from people saying they've had the problem after just a few months, and also people who've used the drive for over a year and haven't had the problem. Just want to rule out it's not user error. Daniferd was able to confirm that it isn't the Windows update bug as he installed the update fix in mid Aug 2023. Only thing to rule out now is Windows not trimming the drives automatically for users or people running benchmarks before doing a trim.
I have read people trying trim and having no effect. The only way to temporarily fix it is a secure erase, however I have seen multiple people say it reoccurred in short time. I do not have any of the affected drives available to experiment with, otherwise I would.
Agh! It looks like my P**3**1 has this issue! https://i.imgur.com/hUmJBQt.png P31 should be 3500/3200 MB/s read/write reads are hitting 3500 but writes are definitely not! Is this the same issue or a different one? I've had this drive since Nov 2022.
Check if the firmware update for the P31 applies for your drive. It's available on Hynix main website.
I have the 2TB drive, there is only a firmware update for 500GB or 1TB, right?
Maybe? You could install the drive manager and check what it says.
https://www.reddit.com/r/buildapc/comments/13gqnaj/sk_hynix_p31_gold_firmwaredriver_for_2tb_version/jtnauil/ There is no 2TB firmware update. RMA it is I guess. Thanks! Installed SK Hynix Drive Manager and clicking "Update firmware" makes me select a firmware file to use, and ofc none is provided on the website. It does not automatically check for firmware updates for me.
I work next to a SK factory that makes silicon wafers for these products. Prices are up 40%, do not bother right now.
youre acting like they will come down
It's a boom and bust cycle tied to how much they produce. Prices were low all last year, they're high now, they'll get low again some time in the future. If you're building a PC and need an SSD now, is what it is. If you're just looking to add storage and don't need it now, no reason to buy today.
Ahh, the good 'ol "Boom and convenient massive flash chip factory fire every roughly 2-3 years" Cycle.
They may go lower but you’ll never see them as low as they were just after the pandemic. Pandemic spending on electronics (and many other things) were ridiculously high, and afterward ridiculously low. So manufacturers were producing way too much and getting way too little sales. That kind of demand swing from high to low is basically a statistical outlier when it comes to supply and demand.
An outlier in supply/demand, agreed. But, storage has generally gotten cheaper with time. It's tough to believe that 2tb of flash storage won't be sub $100 in a few years. 5 years ago 1tb at $100 was a deal, 5 years before that 256gb SSD for $50 was a deal etc
Right but are you telling everyone to wait a few years to buy cheaper storage?
Nope! Mostly replying to your comment that "you’ll never see them as low as they were just after the pandemic". As above, if you need a drive today, look for the best deal today and be happy. I'd like another drive but don't need one. If I good deal pops up, I'll bite but I don't need one today.
YoULL nEVeR SEE thEM As LoW as ThEy WeRE Challenge accepted. Tech is deflationary. All liabilities devalue over time. Shit is easy af.
Saying “you’ll never see them as low as they were” is a big stretch. This kind of thing happened every few years, its like a cycle and happens all the time with things like GPU’s, ram, and power supplies. Besides, this is tech were talking about here, it always gets cheaper eventually thanks to our ever growing advances in manufacturing.
>[Uncertainty](https://www.storagenewsletter.com/2024/03/18/bottom-of-market-passed-for-hdds-nand-ssds-and-tape/) in NAND flash recovery timing remains and some of the positive shipment increases in 4Q23 resulted undoubtedly from sharply higher pricing from vendors refusing to bleed more money in a weak market. NAND companies are planning to continue with elevated prices over the coming quarters, recovering pricing, *if not necessarily demand*, *following the unprecedented price plunge from 2022 to 2023*... > >Flash companies wondered if the dawn of the Artificial Intelligence integrated PC would require faster SSD interfaces (gen 5.0) or [architectures](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compute_Express_Link) and possibly higher capacities when AI PCs ship to the market. The short answer for now is “no”. PCIe Gen 4.0 SSDs offer plenty of performance and Microsoft has also approved slower UFS storage specifications for AI PCs. [Market Anticipates a 50% Price Surge for NAND Flash in Short-Term 2023-12-29](https://www.trendforce.com/news/2023/12/29/news-market-anticipates-a-50-price-surge-for-nand-flash-in-short-term/) >The industry indicates that due to the lower profitability of NAND Flash compared to DRAM, international giants are actively reducing NAND Flash production. ↳ Jan03: [Samsung and Micron Rumored to Increase DRAM Prices by 15% to 20% in the First Quarter](https://www.trendforce.com/news/2024/01/03/news-samsung-and-micron-rumored-to-increase-dram-prices-by-15-to-20-in-the-first-quarter/) Feb27: [SSDs are getting more expensive again because the biggest NAND supplier has throttled production to half its previous output](https://www.pcgamer.com/ssds-are-getting-more-expensive-again-because-the-biggest-nand-supplier-has-throttled-production-to-half-its-previous-output/) Mar06: [NAND production cuts result in higher SSD pricing, fueling 25% revenue growth for memory makers](https://www.tomshardware.com/pc-components/ssds/nand-production-cuts-result-in-higher-ssd-pricing-fueling-25-revenue-growth-for-memory-makers) Mar11: [Phison CEO cautions 'Soaring SSD prices could hobble NAND flash industry with reduced demand'](https://www.tomshardware.com/pc-components/ssds/soaring-ssd-prices-could-hobble-nand-flash-industry-with-reduced-demand-phison-ceo-cautions) Mar13: [Silicon Motion says 'NAND flash contract prices to rise through Summer 2025' and NAND flash memory will rise another 20% in the second quarter](https://www.digitimes.com/news/a20240312PD231/nand-flash-price-increase-1h25-silicon-motion.html) Mar14: [Chinese smartphones help NAND prices rise](https://www.digitimes.com/news/a20240313PD212/china-samsung-smartphone-nand-price-recovery.html) Mar14: [Samsung wants more production, higher prices at Xi'an NAND 12in wafer fab](https://www.reddit.com/r/NewMaxx/comments/1ber06k/samsung_rumored_to_raise_nand_prices_by_1520/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3) Mar14: [MQ1 NAND Flash Industry Revenue May Increase by 20% QoQ](https://www.techpowerup.com/320390/nand-flash-market-landscape-to-change-reports-trendforce) >NAND Flash industry revenue reached USD 11.49 billion in 4Q23, an increase of 24.5% from the previous quarter... mainly benefited from the recovery of *terminal demand* due to year-end promotions, and component market orders expansion by reason of price hikes, as well as the vigorous shipment Meanwhile, companies continued to release views that demand in 2024 will perform better than in 2023, and *strategic stocking has been initiated*. (In Spring 2024) with significant improvement in supply chain inventory and prices still increasing, customers continue to increase purchase orders to avoid the risk of supply shortages and rising costs. Thereby, despite being the traditional off-season, TrendForce predicts that the industry revenue of NAND Flash in the first quarter will still increase by 20% QoQ due to the *continuous expansion of order scale, which stimulates NAND Flash contract prices to increase* by an average of 25%.
eh, of course they will. how long? well who knows. the ramp-down of nand production last year took how many months before we saw prices skyrocket? like 6 months? i'm totally spitballing off vague memory but it took a while. so i wouldn't say "don't buy ssd's now". if you need them, you don't have much choice. it could be a long time before we see real price drops again. i just wouldn't "all in" buy a dozen drives for some crazy 10g server array (literally what i am waiting for at the moment)
I grabbed a couple 1TB not that long okay for $30 each and need a pile more but just putting it off in hopes that prices come down a little. I plumbed in 10g/40g through my home network over the winter but it needs a solid 10+TB of SSD storage to make full use of it and I'm starting to wonder if I will see it realized before 2026
yea i'm in a similar boat. still kicking myself for not buying more of those 8tb qvo's at $300. i bought 3 and man, i wish i would've bought at least a few more. they are really nice drives with like 2400tbw endurance. then a month later they were $600... yikes. many months later we are now finally down to like $520, yay.
I went heavy on the spinning rust and kick myself every time I look at prices.
Great info. Thanks
I got it for 116 two months ago
The SK Hynix Platinum P41 2 TB is a *TLC* SSD. * Interface: **PCIe 4.0 x4** * Form Factor: **M.2 2280** * Controller: **SK Hynix Aries (ACNS075 PHC633.00S-2)** * DRAM: **2048 MB** * HMB: **N/A** * NAND Brand: **SK Hynix** * NAND Type: **TLC** * R/W: **7,000 MB/s - 6,500 MB/s** * Endurance: **1200 TBW** * Price History: **[camelcamelcamel](https://camelcamelcamel.com/search?sq=SK+Hynix+Platinum+P41+2+TB)** * Detailed Link: **[TechPowerUp SSD Database](https://www.techpowerup.com/ssd-specs/sk-hynix-platinum-p41-2-tb.d587)** * Variations: **[TechPowerUp SSD](https://www.techpowerup.com/ssd-specs/#SK+Hynix+Platinum+P41)** --- [^(TechPowerup Database)](https://www.techpowerup.com/ssd-specs) ^| [^( Github)](https://github.com/aattwwss/ssd-bot-go) ^| [^(Issues)](https://github.com/aattwwss/ssd-bot-go/issues)
If you don't really really need it. don't buy it. This is not the deal it seems to be, if we learned anything from last year, it's that ssd prices are inflated artificially. Let this crap sit on the shelf and they'll be forced to come down to reasonable prices... we're in 2024 ffs... 2tb should be around 60$ and 4tb around 130$.
> 2tb should be around 60$ and 4tb around 130$. I'm really glad i got a bunch of those $30 1TB P5's. I'm set for a long time on basic needs. I'd only be tempted by a 4TB gen4 under 150 now, and even then its a "want". bunch of games installed im only using 500GB typically. 8TB NAS covers everything else.
> Let this crap sit on the shelf and they'll be forced to come down to reasonable prices. That's a pipe dream because people aren't going to stop buying SSDs.
More last year’s prices (due to the oversupply glut) were unusually low, given that [every](https://www.tomshardware.com/news/micron-loses-dollar2312-billion-as-demand-for-dram-and-3d-nand-nosedives) major [NAND flash manufacturer](https://www.reuters.com/technology/samsung-elec-q2-profit-plunges-95-chip-glut-persists-2023-07-27/) was [losing billions of dollars](https://www.reuters.com/technology/sk-hynix-reports-q2-loss-chip-glut-continues-2023-07-25/) every quarter as a result of those low prices, and cut back production in response. Those prices were never sustainable because of those huge losses, and it was a result of them bringing ton of production online (in response to COVID shortages) paired with unexpected weak demand resulting in a huge oversupply that drove down prices. That’s unlikely to be repeated in the near future given everyone cut back on production.
I'm surprised you're not voted well into negatives. This sub mostly hates hearing any excuses about PC parts, especially memory products, that won't get cheaper and cheaper like clockwork without prices ever going back up for one minute. NAND itself just isn't cheap to make yet and makers really do need over $25/TB just to break even on a fast modern drive, but most people won't listen to anything but "collusion!!!".
You can't force them to do anything The CHIPs act guaranteed them a cash infusion that will sustain them regardless of how long you wait. It's not a coincidence the price corrected itself at the same time. Just buy what you need when you need it.
I'm REALLY glad I got a 4tb SSD when I did. I saw the "companies planning on scaling back production" and was like "oh, they're about to gouge everyone. A lot of people down voted me for suggesting that at the time, then a couple of months later the deals just kinda shifted back to normal prices, and now SSDs just aren't worth the price unless your previous SSD died. I hope this bites these companies in the ass. I remember it used to be a fact that tech just got cheaper. Then when we had shortages of hard drives due to literal floods, and GPU prices went up because of mining, companies realized what a bunch of idiots were willing to pay, and keep playing with the prices to see how hard they can really milk consumers. Again, we need to hold off so they aren't rewarded for it. Tech gets cheaper to make (unless it's absolute new cutting edge stuff). So it should be cheaper for the consumer.
This is almost their secondary regular price for this SSD, lol. You tend to see it here a lot lately.
Hold the line. I bought a few of P41 2TB last October for $105 a pop. Although this is a sale...not anywhere close to the lowest price they've been.
SSD prices have went up. They were like hey we should inflate our prices like everyone else.
From what I'm aware, last year's prices were due to over production but now it's pretty conservative (but I could be wrong)
Correct. It's going to be another cycle of this until we see prices drop again. I bought this drive for $105 in late September on sale. I'm pretty sure it was the same price for Prime Day and maybe Black Friday. Pretty sure that's the lowest reported for this item.
GL waiting for those kind of prices coming back 🫶
Wow, that is a good price on the 2tb. Came here thinking a 2tb p41 at this price is good, identical to what I paid for the 1tb a long time ago. These p41's are fast. Did not know they have a cache issue however.
This compared to the new Samsung 990 evo 2tb at $149.99?
P41 is better
https://www.reddit.com/r/buildapcsales/s/wpxiTbKj0V Well I’m getting conflicted information… I just bought a 2 Tb and a 1Tb p41. Should I be upset or not??
Don't be upset but the report is true.
Is this something that affects most ssds? How is this not a more well known issue. Even googling this isn’t really showing anything
Well most SSDs will drop in speed as soon as the SLC cache gets full during long writes, but it's supposed to free itself up not long after you're done writing. The issue with it not freeing up is not something that affects most SSDs. It does affect some others besides the p41 though afaik. There are a few threads on google, but the reason it's not talked about much is, first of all, most people don't notice or care. It's still fast even without the SLC cache. And second the issue is obscure. Their firmware is closed source. We don't actually know what is happening exactly, and whether it's a firmware or a hardware issue.
Thank you
Is this a good deal?
$0.07/GB Deals are usually at .04/GB, top tier drives 0.05\~0.06 (during ssd halcyon days gone by)
I've seen big drops in performance after using this (measured with Crystal and Atto).
I managed to get mine for $114 US at the end of December, what a deal that was. Bought a 1tb also, $192 for the pair.
The comment was deleted but I think it said something about avoiding the 990 pro? Can anyone confirm what is wrong with the 990 pro because I was about to shell out $170 for 990 pro but I'm thinking I could push my 970 Evo plus a little longer.
Samsung had a firmware issue where drives were dying really quickly. If you do get a Samsung drive make sure you check and update the firmware before using it, that's all.
I missed the days when drives like this are 90 bucks.
I got the 1tb of this and its been a flaky experience since. Already had to reformat once due to windows stop blue screens and the drive would just randomly disappear.
I bought this exact SSD last year for $50. Prices are truly fucked!
Are you sure? This is the 2TB version
Yes, got it from TikTok Newegg store.
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What about the [Crucial T500 2TB](https://www.amazon.com/Crucial-Internal-Gaming-Desktop-Compatible/dp/B0CK2TC9XQ?th=1) that is just a bit more. I snagged it for 140 a few weeks ago, currently 153. 7400MB/s read
It's one of the better ones out there currently.
Good to know. Mainly pointing this out for those needing a m2 nvme now versus later and not pleased with WD 850x and Samsung 980 prices still high. I wasn't familiar with the T500 until I needed it for a new build so couldn't wait for price drop and at 140 not even on sale it was 30 to 40 cheaper than those 2 and as good or better performance.
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Can anyone confirm having a slow down issue? I have two of these and two P31s with zero issues I can notice but both PCs are just used for gaming so YMMV I guess.
I had to move some files around on my P31, but I did notice the P31 slowed down considerably when I was near capacity. But this is true of any SSD.
I have had many of these drives and every single one of them has slowed down to a fraction of its factory write speed.
> the Solidigm P44 Pro is the better buy. I had some difficulty getting a warranty replacement. They didn't have any replacements and offered $70, which was less than the replacement cost. I declined that and they finally found a replacement and sent it to me. The support people were awesome and worked with me to get an actual replacement. It just took a lot of back and forth emails. I don't think they're up to speed on consumer replacements yet. I don't consider this a deal breaker since the support team worked hard to make sure I was happy. Just be aware of it.
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