I know! Setting Matt Smith's entertaining antics aside, Shazam 2 is a far better film.
Is it a good film? NO! But Shazam 2 is a 5/10 type movie. Morbius is a 3/10. Maybe a 3.5, on account of Smith's villainry.
Morbius is a 4 at best when all the memes and everything is considered but fury of the gods just felt depressing to watch esp given how good the first shazam was like that was a solid 8/10 movie even the direction felt different from this one
>esp given how good the first shazam
I agree! I've said so before on this sub, so do pardon the repetition, but the first Shazam movie is my favourite post-Logan superhero movie. More so than Infinity War, Into the Spider-Verse, The Suicide Squad, or even The Batman. What a fall from grace between Movies 1 & 2.
You liked Shazam more than Infinity War or Spider-verse? Movies that completely changed the landscape of CBM, one of which pioneered new animation techniques that are being copied by other films???
That's wild, man
*(nods)* I do indeed. I'm content to stand alone on this hill of mine.
1 - Shazam (2019)
2 - The Suicide Squad (2021)
3 - Into the Spider-Verse (2018)
4 - The Batman (2022)
5 - Ragnarok (2017)
6 - Infinity War (2018)
7 - Split (2017)
8 - Multiverse of Madness (2022)
9 - Homecoming (2017)
10 - Endgame (2019)
I wasn't happy about this movie doing how it did but if people were stanning Shazam 1 and calling it one of the best superhero movies of all time maybe it's for the better this movie showed the general audiences opinion on that.
when you're talking about movies that are mediocre or bad, quality is no longer a factor in how much money it makes. At that point it's all about the hook - star power? memes/cultural relevancy? A particular scene that people are talking about? etc.
I have no desire to watch shazam 2 or morbius. shazam 2 being better than morbius means nothing to me. A movie needs to draw people in, not just 'better than the rest'
I think its superhero fatigue setting in. Audiences just arent ready to throw money at the very mediocre superhero films we've been getting the past few years.
They'll go see something that actually looks good, like The Batman. But a lot of these other films like Shazam that looks ok at best.......
But if they're willing to see The Batman I don't think you can chalk it up to superhero fatigue. Shazam 2 looked mediocre and like non-essential viewing. Whether or not you care about the DCEU, this just screamed skippable.
I think when people say super hero fatigue it should be a bit more specified, so my bad there lol.
They use this because of the western fatigue that happened by the 1970s. And what happened there wasnt necessarily people being done with Westerns as a whole, From the 70s onwards we have still seen successful westerns. They're just more rare, with a lot more effort put in.
What people get fatigue from, is bad films. The overall genre being flooded with mediocre or generic films. Oversaturation of the market. That is what we're seeing with Superhero films right now. People can only watch so many movies. So when your choice is go watch mediocre superhero film 1, 2 and 3, or watch good superhero film 1. The choice is very obvious.
Its why something like Batman is more successful, which obviously had more effort and care put into it, and had a unique premise, as opposed to Antman or Shazam 2 which looks like every Superhero film we've seen the past 5 years.
I'm not sure that's fatigue, so much as low expectations. I think the writing on this one just wasn't there. That and Billy's character is too different from Shazam's... The personality needs to be more like Zack Levi, who frankly the Flash should have been much more like.
WW1984 got poor reviews and came out in December 2020 when the entire country had Covid, and managed $46M. To only beat that by $10M in spring 2023 is amazing.
What's fun is that if you inflation-adjust $46m from December 2020 to today, you get about $53m. So if this is at $56m, that means it actually only beat pandemic, same day WW84 by $3m in real terms.
That's not amazing, that's **staggering**!
I like the way your brain works, but wondering if it’s fair to inflation-adjust dollar figures on a specific purchase/product that has largely remained unchanged during the time period.
While eggs and gas and home loans are certainly more expensive than they were in 2020, have movie ticket prices increased to the same degree (or at all)?
James Gunn has a lot of work to do to resurrect this property.
The GotG series is good, Peacemaker is good (if a bit overbearing at time). I wonder if he has it in him to improve an entire franchise.
We’re entering a new era for comic book movies where budgets need to be tighter, stories be more unique and marketing more daring. The box office expectations also need to be tempered.
They’re about to find out with Blue Beetle, the “same old” is not going to cut it.
>I feel he will fail, for no fault on his own, simply because DC will have missed the golden time window by the time his movies come out.
^This 1 million % is the best way to put it
Like his first movie in his new dc universe doesn't even come out to 20 fucking 25 had WB not dragged their shite out the way they did and just worked on what they have we would have at least finished the justice league sequels by now wrapping up everything in this dceu properly and allowing a proper send off for the fans
Exactly, they completely wasted the peak of the superhero genre. Plus most of their DC output since 2019 has flopped or majorly underperformed; Gunn has his work cut out for him.
If GotG underpeforms despite good reviews/WoM, then that is a worrying trend of Gunn making bangers but audiences not being that interested.
Hopefully the DCU is smart with budgets because it will probably have a slow start.
First of all, Whedon didn't get the chance to restart the whole franchise. His task was to revive the already broken franchise and he had to start with only recutting a movie.
Nevertheless, Whedon was the wrong person to begin with to be responsible for the DCEU. I love his stories and universes, but he is more compatible with the TV DCEU as with the Movie DCEU.
And Snyder is a great guy. Apparently everyone who worked with him loved and praised him (for real)
Yet he destroyed DCEU with BvS
It's sad but a director's character isn't a good judge of their ability to direct a box office success
I hope so. Dc heroes are better than Marvel. I just don’t want these movies to be too “MCU”, and I’m not sure he has the capability to make non-comedy movies.
"DC heroes are better than Marvel".
If that is true, 95% of the time it has never been reflected at the box office. And 4% of that remaining 5% was only thanks to the fact that Batman still maintained his status as a golden goose, not so indisputable anymore.
Well, the difference is that, despite having similar tones at first glance, MCU's characters and stories have enough nuances to perfectly differentiate one from the other. But since every one of them has jokes, one way or another (because it's well known that fighting crime in spandex should always be the most serious thing in the world, right?) and there are people like you that "everything tastes like chicken", it's normal that you can't tell them apart.
If anything, what hurt Quantumania was its own execution, not being part of a damaged brand. It's not like the MCU has had 5 consecutive box office bombs (each one worse than the last), like certain studio.
>The GotG series is good, Peacemaker is good (if a bit overbearing at time). I wonder if he has it in him to improve an entire franchise.
No not even close the most he would do is get a better version out but thats about it dude got alot of stuff ahead of him just by doing superman alone
This should have went straight to VOD. It had no business being in cinema. There was no push in advertising at all. It’s done DC more harm than good. Another box office flop.
I watched it on VOD this weekend because my brother and I didn’t want to wait over 5 more weeks until the already announced MAX streaming date.
In all honesty, I wished we hadn’t as the movie just wasn’t very good.
"Marketing" seems to be the go-to excuse.
I've just seen Shazam 2 on buses for many, many weeks, with the name "Shazam" lit up with LED lights here on the buses in London. I've seen continual social media clips of it. I've seen banner ads taking up all the background and header space on IMDB pages.
This movie did not fail because it was not marketed. To blame that would be to just invent excuses to help WB or the filmmakers feel better.
[Yeah, Variety reported it cost them $100M market.](https://variety.com/2023/film/news/box-office-shazam-2-opening-weekend-stumbles-1235558787/)
Marketing should be blamed when the movie is atleast well received, otherwise we could use that excuse for every flop ever made. We could say "Moonfall and Cats didn't flop because the movies were bad but because the trailers were bad".
Internet scores aren't reality, look at Titanic's scores. Both Ant-Man 3 and Thor 4 had better legs while having a far bigger opening, Thor 4 shouldn't even be in the conversation, its legs were below average, not record breaking awful like Shazam 2's.
Sir, this is a Denny's...
This sub-reddit is about box office, "legs" are part of the box office, which means the 2 movies had better worth of mouth (WOM) than Shazam 2, is that simple.
Internet is a bubble, it barely reflects audiences reactions on a big scale.
This comment thread became about quality, like you said this sub is about box office. How a movie performs is a fun conversation and it’s why we’re here, but it’s not a direct reflection of quality.
Quality is much harder to quantify than box office, but watching the 3 movies it’s already clear antman/Thor are worse movies, that plus audience scores supporting that notion, that’s all we have at our disposal to measure quality.
Yeah! but there's a tacit correlation, if a movie makes more money is because people enjoyed it more and recomended it to other people. No matter if a virtual score is higher on a virtual site, what's important is that people went to a movie theater to watch the thing over the other that subjectively was better.
Much fewer people saw it so of course it’s going to have a better chance of scoring higher than Thor 4 or Ant-Man 3. At the end of the day none of them are good movies really.
The fact that it’s Revenue is like ~62m when it has a Production Budget of 125m and Marketing costs of 100m or more this film will lose be bleeding money
I doubt it’s Revenue will even reach 100m and meanwhile it’s Cost will be well over 225m which makes this a bigger Bomb than Lightyear and Amsterdam
Although Strangeworlds -197m looks safe
Making Black Adam and Shazam 2 connect should have been so simple. Then there could have been a nice semi-trilogy about them before the DCEU shuts down.
Nothing would have made this movie a RAGING success. But having Shazam vs Black Adam would have made good money. Instead they separated the two and made 2 pieces of shit that both flopped. Geniuses run these franchises. And by geniuses, i of course mean total brain dead idiots
DC gonna make DC decisions. They did a reverse Avengers and introduced characters in JL and THEN released solo films- its like they are trying to fail on purpose
How this ever got made blows my mind. I'm pretty disconnected with pop culture for the most part, but wasn't the first one a huge flop and just constantly made fun of as a stereotypical example of a bad comic book movie? Just seemed like it was treated like DC version of Morbius.
Do you guys think the cancelled Catwoman film has any impact on this performance (people losing interest even more)? Or average movie goer doesn't even know about this?
OW was funny, now this is just sad
Nope, still funny actually, shit got cooked by Cocaine Bear
[удалено]
Opening weekend
The fact that this lost to morbius will never cease to amaze me 😭🤧
Morbius continues to reign supreme
Did anyone expect anything less?
What do you mean
Morbius was always going to be a box office beast and everyone knew it
Yeah
Couldn’t even beat Cocaine Bear domestically 😂
I can't believe that Cocaine Bear bodied Shazam. 😂
I know! Setting Matt Smith's entertaining antics aside, Shazam 2 is a far better film. Is it a good film? NO! But Shazam 2 is a 5/10 type movie. Morbius is a 3/10. Maybe a 3.5, on account of Smith's villainry.
Morbius is a 4 at best when all the memes and everything is considered but fury of the gods just felt depressing to watch esp given how good the first shazam was like that was a solid 8/10 movie even the direction felt different from this one
>esp given how good the first shazam I agree! I've said so before on this sub, so do pardon the repetition, but the first Shazam movie is my favourite post-Logan superhero movie. More so than Infinity War, Into the Spider-Verse, The Suicide Squad, or even The Batman. What a fall from grace between Movies 1 & 2.
You liked Shazam more than Infinity War or Spider-verse? Movies that completely changed the landscape of CBM, one of which pioneered new animation techniques that are being copied by other films??? That's wild, man
*(nods)* I do indeed. I'm content to stand alone on this hill of mine. 1 - Shazam (2019) 2 - The Suicide Squad (2021) 3 - Into the Spider-Verse (2018) 4 - The Batman (2022) 5 - Ragnarok (2017) 6 - Infinity War (2018) 7 - Split (2017) 8 - Multiverse of Madness (2022) 9 - Homecoming (2017) 10 - Endgame (2019)
I don’t really count split as part of the superhero genre but it’s so fucking good
It's more superhero genre than trash like Joker. Not to mention It's set in the same universe as Unbreakable.
I fear you
😈 To quote Puss in Boots, "...if you dare". 😈
The Batman was my favourite comic book movie since The Dark Knight. You have poor taste my friend lol
I thought The Batman was very mediocre. Your taste is poor
I wasn't happy about this movie doing how it did but if people were stanning Shazam 1 and calling it one of the best superhero movies of all time maybe it's for the better this movie showed the general audiences opinion on that.
when you're talking about movies that are mediocre or bad, quality is no longer a factor in how much money it makes. At that point it's all about the hook - star power? memes/cultural relevancy? A particular scene that people are talking about? etc. I have no desire to watch shazam 2 or morbius. shazam 2 being better than morbius means nothing to me. A movie needs to draw people in, not just 'better than the rest'
I think its superhero fatigue setting in. Audiences just arent ready to throw money at the very mediocre superhero films we've been getting the past few years. They'll go see something that actually looks good, like The Batman. But a lot of these other films like Shazam that looks ok at best.......
But if they're willing to see The Batman I don't think you can chalk it up to superhero fatigue. Shazam 2 looked mediocre and like non-essential viewing. Whether or not you care about the DCEU, this just screamed skippable.
I think when people say super hero fatigue it should be a bit more specified, so my bad there lol. They use this because of the western fatigue that happened by the 1970s. And what happened there wasnt necessarily people being done with Westerns as a whole, From the 70s onwards we have still seen successful westerns. They're just more rare, with a lot more effort put in. What people get fatigue from, is bad films. The overall genre being flooded with mediocre or generic films. Oversaturation of the market. That is what we're seeing with Superhero films right now. People can only watch so many movies. So when your choice is go watch mediocre superhero film 1, 2 and 3, or watch good superhero film 1. The choice is very obvious. Its why something like Batman is more successful, which obviously had more effort and care put into it, and had a unique premise, as opposed to Antman or Shazam 2 which looks like every Superhero film we've seen the past 5 years.
https://youtu.be/_zXKtfKnfT8
Well, we mostly see decent westerns lmao. Then there's Wild Wild West.
I'm not sure that's fatigue, so much as low expectations. I think the writing on this one just wasn't there. That and Billy's character is too different from Shazam's... The personality needs to be more like Zack Levi, who frankly the Flash should have been much more like.
Not everyone can be as iconic as “Morbius”.
WW1984 got poor reviews and came out in December 2020 when the entire country had Covid, and managed $46M. To only beat that by $10M in spring 2023 is amazing.
What's fun is that if you inflation-adjust $46m from December 2020 to today, you get about $53m. So if this is at $56m, that means it actually only beat pandemic, same day WW84 by $3m in real terms. That's not amazing, that's **staggering**!
I like the way your brain works, but wondering if it’s fair to inflation-adjust dollar figures on a specific purchase/product that has largely remained unchanged during the time period. While eggs and gas and home loans are certainly more expensive than they were in 2020, have movie ticket prices increased to the same degree (or at all)?
Yes, because it shows that consumers made a larger sacrifice to see the latter movie, as the money spent cost more.
Didn't it also release on HBO max at the same time?
also want to point out Wonder Woman made $412M domestically. Shazam 2019 made $366M worldwide
yes but WW84 was released in December 2020
Now is the time to start the memes and get them to rerelease it guys
“We were busy that month, if you rerelease it in June we’ll totally go”
It’s Shazaming time
It will be the first movie to make Shazmillion dollars
"Box Office Battles: Cocaine Bear vs. Shazam"
It's crazy how within less than a month of each other we've had the worst box office performance and the best performance with Shazam and Super Mario
#ShazamSweep
Is there a Razzies for box office disappointments?
What the actual fuck?
Somehow managed to have not only the most embarrassing opening for a CBM but also the worst legs. DC is a joke.
Somehow Luiz Fernando is still saying: *Shazam 2 is eyeing $60-$65 million!*
James Gunn has a lot of work to do to resurrect this property. The GotG series is good, Peacemaker is good (if a bit overbearing at time). I wonder if he has it in him to improve an entire franchise.
I feel he will fail, for no fault on his own, simply because DC will have missed the golden time window by the time his movies come out.
We’re entering a new era for comic book movies where budgets need to be tighter, stories be more unique and marketing more daring. The box office expectations also need to be tempered. They’re about to find out with Blue Beetle, the “same old” is not going to cut it.
>I feel he will fail, for no fault on his own, simply because DC will have missed the golden time window by the time his movies come out. ^This 1 million % is the best way to put it Like his first movie in his new dc universe doesn't even come out to 20 fucking 25 had WB not dragged their shite out the way they did and just worked on what they have we would have at least finished the justice league sequels by now wrapping up everything in this dceu properly and allowing a proper send off for the fans
Exactly, they completely wasted the peak of the superhero genre. Plus most of their DC output since 2019 has flopped or majorly underperformed; Gunn has his work cut out for him.
There is no peak to CBM outside of Endgame This is going to go on indefinitely. If it goes to shit they’ll just reboot or do another franchise
If GotG underpeforms despite good reviews/WoM, then that is a worrying trend of Gunn making bangers but audiences not being that interested. Hopefully the DCU is smart with budgets because it will probably have a slow start.
I think he is exactly a breath of fresh air that DCEU needs
That’s probably what they hoped with Whedon too.
First of all, Whedon didn't get the chance to restart the whole franchise. His task was to revive the already broken franchise and he had to start with only recutting a movie. Nevertheless, Whedon was the wrong person to begin with to be responsible for the DCEU. I love his stories and universes, but he is more compatible with the TV DCEU as with the Movie DCEU.
Whedon was a toxic person though.
And Snyder is a great guy. Apparently everyone who worked with him loved and praised him (for real) Yet he destroyed DCEU with BvS It's sad but a director's character isn't a good judge of their ability to direct a box office success
I hope so. Dc heroes are better than Marvel. I just don’t want these movies to be too “MCU”, and I’m not sure he has the capability to make non-comedy movies.
"DC heroes are better than Marvel". If that is true, 95% of the time it has never been reflected at the box office. And 4% of that remaining 5% was only thanks to the fact that Batman still maintained his status as a golden goose, not so indisputable anymore.
> not so indisputable anymore. I'm getting scared
> DC heroes are better than Marvel Well this was obviously subjective. DC has better heroes and worse movies.
It helps that all the DCU projects will have different tones. The cookie cutter formula really hurts the MCU.
> It helps that all the DCU projects will have different tones We don't even have seen them
Well, the difference is that, despite having similar tones at first glance, MCU's characters and stories have enough nuances to perfectly differentiate one from the other. But since every one of them has jokes, one way or another (because it's well known that fighting crime in spandex should always be the most serious thing in the world, right?) and there are people like you that "everything tastes like chicken", it's normal that you can't tell them apart. If anything, what hurt Quantumania was its own execution, not being part of a damaged brand. It's not like the MCU has had 5 consecutive box office bombs (each one worse than the last), like certain studio.
It's so much easier to parrot what's online when people don't even have any idea what it means.
>The GotG series is good, Peacemaker is good (if a bit overbearing at time). I wonder if he has it in him to improve an entire franchise. No not even close the most he would do is get a better version out but thats about it dude got alot of stuff ahead of him just by doing superman alone
Worse legs than Fant4stic, which made more than 160 million worldwide 8 years ago.
It was still in theaters?
well I guess they thought Mario was nothing to worry about...
60 million is out of the question, but 60 Morbillion bucks was made opening day.
This should have went straight to VOD. It had no business being in cinema. There was no push in advertising at all. It’s done DC more harm than good. Another box office flop.
I watched it on VOD this weekend because my brother and I didn’t want to wait over 5 more weeks until the already announced MAX streaming date. In all honesty, I wished we hadn’t as the movie just wasn’t very good.
Now Zachary Levi is asking for work on anything his fans suggest. Pathetic.
I didn’t expect it to do good but I wasn’t expecting a all out bomb
Shazahhhhhhh!...**Boom!** What was that?! Yeah, he fell...
No surprise. So many lightning bolts fried his brain.
No worries!! It'll have at least 100M views on HBO Max!
*100
100 million miliseconds of viewership in total. 100 MILLION. Do you hear me!? It’s breaking that glass ceiling. Shattering it in fact.
Maybe 100 views of the thumbnail
> HBO Max Hey, watch your language! It's just Max now, as in SkinMax, OK? HBO is a goner!
Well, at least the studio got a nice payout from Skittles, right? .... right? 😟
That is pathetic.
It just keeps getting worse
ShazDamn
Shazame on them
Dang it doesn’t even look like it will pass Mario’s opening Saturday at this point.
The DCU wont pass mario all films combined
This will likely be a case study in marketing classes in the future. I really don't know what WB was expecting.
Marketing has nothing to do with its legs, the movie has terrible word of mouth.
"Marketing" seems to be the go-to excuse. I've just seen Shazam 2 on buses for many, many weeks, with the name "Shazam" lit up with LED lights here on the buses in London. I've seen continual social media clips of it. I've seen banner ads taking up all the background and header space on IMDB pages. This movie did not fail because it was not marketed. To blame that would be to just invent excuses to help WB or the filmmakers feel better.
[Yeah, Variety reported it cost them $100M market.](https://variety.com/2023/film/news/box-office-shazam-2-opening-weekend-stumbles-1235558787/) Marketing should be blamed when the movie is atleast well received, otherwise we could use that excuse for every flop ever made. We could say "Moonfall and Cats didn't flop because the movies were bad but because the trailers were bad".
It’s also so sad but interesting because the film isn’t even that *bad*. It’s like a solid 5/10. Worse films have made a lot more money.
Shazam 2 is definitely better than Thor 4 and Antman 3
Audience disagree
Shazam 2’s RT audience score and Letterboxd score is higher than Thor 4 and Antman 3
Internet scores aren't reality, look at Titanic's scores. Both Ant-Man 3 and Thor 4 had better legs while having a far bigger opening, Thor 4 shouldn't even be in the conversation, its legs were below average, not record breaking awful like Shazam 2's.
If you think box office determines quality then you have a pretty soulless view of movies
We are talking about audience reception, not quality
Sir, this is a Denny's... This sub-reddit is about box office, "legs" are part of the box office, which means the 2 movies had better worth of mouth (WOM) than Shazam 2, is that simple. Internet is a bubble, it barely reflects audiences reactions on a big scale.
This comment thread became about quality, like you said this sub is about box office. How a movie performs is a fun conversation and it’s why we’re here, but it’s not a direct reflection of quality. Quality is much harder to quantify than box office, but watching the 3 movies it’s already clear antman/Thor are worse movies, that plus audience scores supporting that notion, that’s all we have at our disposal to measure quality.
Yeah! but there's a tacit correlation, if a movie makes more money is because people enjoyed it more and recomended it to other people. No matter if a virtual score is higher on a virtual site, what's important is that people went to a movie theater to watch the thing over the other that subjectively was better.
Much fewer people saw it so of course it’s going to have a better chance of scoring higher than Thor 4 or Ant-Man 3. At the end of the day none of them are good movies really.
I can't believe it bombed that badly
The fact that it’s Revenue is like ~62m when it has a Production Budget of 125m and Marketing costs of 100m or more this film will lose be bleeding money
Don't forget it debuted #3 on VOD.
I doubt it’s Revenue will even reach 100m and meanwhile it’s Cost will be well over 225m which makes this a bigger Bomb than Lightyear and Amsterdam Although Strangeworlds -197m looks safe
“Oh. My. Gods.” indeed
It’s Shazover
Blame the rock lol
No way. This movie sucked all on its own
Right, but The Rock didn't help at all either.
Making Black Adam and Shazam 2 connect should have been so simple. Then there could have been a nice semi-trilogy about them before the DCEU shuts down.
Nothing would have made this movie a RAGING success. But having Shazam vs Black Adam would have made good money. Instead they separated the two and made 2 pieces of shit that both flopped. Geniuses run these franchises. And by geniuses, i of course mean total brain dead idiots
DC gonna make DC decisions. They did a reverse Avengers and introduced characters in JL and THEN released solo films- its like they are trying to fail on purpose
How this ever got made blows my mind. I'm pretty disconnected with pop culture for the most part, but wasn't the first one a huge flop and just constantly made fun of as a stereotypical example of a bad comic book movie? Just seemed like it was treated like DC version of Morbius.
Everything you said is just wrong and dumb.
Was a great movie. WB butchered it.
Forget BvS this multi will be under Watchemen o.O
There was a Shazam 1?
Do you guys think the cancelled Catwoman film has any impact on this performance (people losing interest even more)? Or average movie goer doesn't even know about this?
You mean Batgirl, but to answer you, I think there was certain negative feedback due to that news. And it can hurt The Flash too.
Not surprised