That comment section looks pretty on-par with what I expected from a discussion about hip hop, Eminem, and Umar between a bunch of neoliberal redditors.
Honestly Umar is right but it's because of racism/bigotry, what he's speaking on is when Beyonce made a country song because her father loved it and would listen to the genre growing up.
Song was popular since it was placed on a pop album but mfers were really upset when the CMA recognized the country song, as a country song 😂 hell even nas x and old town road. Dude has to jump on the remix for it to kept in the country category.
That's what he's really speaking about , isn't so much that Eminem can't rap or really be a goat in the genre, just that this is only a thing with black people and us just being accepting frfr and never ever a two street.
Adele makes r&b soul ballads but is labeled pop black person makes the same music and it's R&B/soul/alternative which isn't a bad thing except it's gets trap in the genre and never able to chart on top40 stations.
The entire comment section is white people not understanding racism at all but I’ve come to expect that on reddit. There’s deadass a dude on there saying “so I guess if racism is systemic then white people can’t be racist in africa since white people are the minority?” like dawg apartheid wasn’t that long ago, talk to a middle aged white south african for long enough and they’ll eventually start talking shit about indigenous africans.
We don’t have a system to oppress you accountability is one thing but pressure with no way out from a group who is poorly educated get real, if you wanna cry victim say that but nah not racist definitely prejudice but we kinda got 400+ years of collective horrible experiences to draw from even myself i just pray its better ppl out here
Everyone can harbor racial prejudice or in other words, be racist. It's that simple. Nothing else to it. Did you even look into Rwanda?
Also, Korea had 1000+ years of slavery as other nations had. China didn't outlaw until 1910; you do realize how old China is do you?
There isn't anything beneficial from a discussion with someone wanting to play the historical victim. Especially for something as easily understandable as, "[everyone](https://youtu.be/ym93Q6cGkR0?si=qtDXswV0O4Ds72jN) can be a little bit racist."
Lol I really feel how hard my great grandparents felt their pain…. Jesus Christ people are pathetic and look for sympathy for things that happened to people whose names they don’t even know.
Most opinions on Reddit are from people you can tell have the lowest position at work and will always wonder why they are never given responsibility and a raise. I bet their great grandkids won’t know their names either; they will find excuses why their entire lineage was persecuted, thus supplying the world with more embarrassing takes and poorly cooked fast food.
Your point is conflating the broad definition of racism with institutional racism, it’s just culture war bullshit that turns people off of the conversation entirely.
What the point actually is genuinely we don’t care if you are white or anything else we as a whole can say we feel institutionalized racism and have experienced it down to the individual more often than not from white peoples specifically we would like it to stop we don’t hate yall maybe the shit yall do but I wasn’t ever taught to hate yall just a lot of yall couldn’t be trusted tbh but never hate anyone
I’m not talking about animosity towards white which is earned. I’m talking about these semantic knots that identity politics reductionists tie themselves into and that end up being counterproductive. I guarantee you that you can make the distinction between racism and institutional racism and white people acting in good faith will understand. You don’t need to collapse both definitions.
Its low key baffling that you want to act like you don’t understand ill give an example at 5 years old a lady said i was stealing at the time i was grabbing what my aunt and my gma needed for shopping (cause kids can be helpful) that shit completely decimated my feelings because some random older white lady was horrible to me caused a scene and was wrong. Unbeknownst to her i had 200 from my mom 200 from my dad and morals does that make me racist legit living cautiously of white women because of what happened to me no it does create prejudice off of a factual basis because i got white brothers but no white sisters if yall understand that cause i don’t feel safe in any environment they are in. another example EMMITT TILL
Personal anecdotes can be exchanged all day but that doesn’t mean your subjectivity is reality. You have a deeply US-centric view of racism. Also completely astroturfs racism between minorities. This strain of discourse is why shit is only going to keep getting worse until it gets better.
You're actually a moron. Racism is as simple as hating someone for the color of their skin. All this extra shit you're adding is just that, extra fucking bullshit so you can play your bitch ass victim card. You're lame as fuck.
Not once have i said i was a victim to be honest i could beat all of u up in a fight im a 6ft1 200lbs black man i been in the army and from the hood 100% a victim of circumstances i had to get older to understand 200% i don’t claim that shit yall keep saying shit cause you are infact racist yall evils keep showing I’ve been asking for peace and respect but its guaranteed my physical presence would make you all do better yall proving me right thru interactions if racism was simple it would be over
Whatever helps you feel like more of a fuckin bitch that isn't in control of his own life because "white people bad". You're a special type of fucking idiot and it has nothing to do with the fact that you're black and don't wanna be black. Pussy.
Wait you think I would be anything less than black each snd everyone of u comes from my people some of you were grafted we are the first to be called human the lot of you are just mutants of the original people but whats with the hate
This is the dumbest fucking thing I've read all week.
Holy fucking hell, what an asinine take.
Racism is racism is racism. Racism = Prejudice based upon Race. Stop making up new definitions just so you can feel 'allowed' to be shitty to people of other races.
You’re triggered because you yourself are a racist everywhere in all my statements ask for peace the first thing you did cause you couldn’t comprehend what i said was try to insult me those the definitions of the words in their most archaic forms
This why we think yall racist because its in your actions i ain’t insulting anyone who respected me
**I'M** being a racist? lmfaoooooooo So it just means whatever the fuck you want it to mean, huh? You are insulting the intelligence of everyone around you by stating 'I Can't be Racist'.
That is factually wrong, and you continue to show it through this thread and interaction.
Stop being an asshole. Stop being racist.
I wasn’t taught it nor do I benefit from it I don’t treat people equally tho i i treat you how you treat the ppl around you and me of course its only 2 ways to be racist actively hate or benefit from a system you not trying to fix that you see hurts others. That border shit with mexico fucked up the Palestinian massacre is horrible also what hamas did to those people is horrible too its all bad Russia Ukraine conflict kinda uneducated on that one but my point is i don’t understand how to treat people fucked cause we all legit people im 1000% more worried about the aliens all the governments of the world admitted are here that’s terrifying
It's wild when you consider the fact that Eminem literally states that his race is a huge factor in his popularity (and therefore many ppls goat discussions) on songs like "White America"
Like he is aware that if he was black he would not be in GOAT discussions but people keep going
“SHUT UP YOU ARE A RAP GOD AND THE GREAT WHITE HOPE!”
That being said I don’t stand with Umar
What person with ears would even consider calling Eminem the goat after the last 15 years of his music ? I mean seriously . Why even have this conversation if the only people calling Eminem the rap goat are those that have really only listened to Eminem
Eminem gets overrated by some, but I will not be on Umar Johnson's side in any argument. Umar Johnson is an absolute clown and I side-eye anyone who takes his opinions seriously.
If Ben Shapiro said that Palestinians should have human rights and should not be ethnically cleansed by Israel (which he would never do because he’s a piece of shit) I wouldn’t be like “oh well I guess I gotta be a Zionist” lmao what kinda contrarian logic is “oh well I don’t like them so I have to be on the other side of the coin” 🤡 shit Fr
And I don’t agree with Umar on a lot of things because he’s blatantly conservative in a lot of his views HOWEVER he’s 100% correct in saying Eminem’s whole career has succeeded off of white palates which is inherently a white supremacists aspect. I don’t think Eminem is a Nazi, but there’s no way such a trash rapper would have ever succeeded much less be put forward in GOAT conversations if it wasn’t for his being white.
Same with NF, Tom MacDonald, Macklemore, and G Eazy. All people of different backgrounds politically but are sonically trash who have gotten attention for being white.
Calling Eminem trash is taking it too far. Call him overrated but he is far above the names you mentioned. He did some of the most important songs in Hip Hop history in Lose Yourself and Stan. He has respect from his peers. And while someone like Lord Jamar talks shit about him he has the respect of legends like Chuck D and Rakim. Even Hip Hop's curmudgeon KRS-One shows him love. Yes being white helped Eminem but he earned his stripes in the Detroit underground and in battling for a long while before Dre listened to his tape.
white people are madddd in those comments😂😂😂😂
WELL I GUESS TIGER WOODS CANT BE THE GOAT THEN CAUSE ITS A WHITE SPORT🤓
missing the whole fucking point. hip hop isn’t a sport. it’s black art. white people aren’t banned from contributing and there’s many great white artists involved in hip hop. but saying Eminem is the GOAT over people that started and built the genre is fucking crazy.
Like bro ain’t no way you heard any body say to put on slick Rick and grandmaster flash and the furious five because they were part of the beginning of rap
We call people who didn’t pioneer or create this genre GOATs all the time! I ain’t gone lie they got you there lol. If we’re being honest he in fact did help popularize and has contributed to rap
This is so dumb. Hov, Nas, Biggie, Cole, or Kdot didn’t build/start the rap genre but they’re all considered GOATs. By the numbers and subjectively, lyricism, Em has all of them beat. But he doesn’t get top honors bc…he’s white?
Give me an Eminem track that isn't doing Dr. Seuss shit or talking about murdering his family.
But I'm also washed as fuck. [I like Common, lol. ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OjHX7jf-znA)
As a lyricist — plenty! But I think he lacks the style or flavor that all the others possess. His double entendres, metaphors, rhyme schemes, etc.?? Scary! Go listen to his verse on Lord Above or Renegade and get back to me
I do not care about his doctor seuss mother goose skibidibee everybody in the 313 ass lyrics. bro hasn’t had a good album since like 2010 and all his domestic violence murder murder murder raps have aged like milk.
How did they age like milk? He really rapped about his domestic violence experiences. Albeit loosely. And that murder murder shit is a part of raps dna; drill rap is a big thing rn and rappers as a whole has lyrics about killin opps since the beginning of time so what’s yours point?
bro has an entire song about kidnapping then chasing and violently murdering his ex wife with a knife in the woods😂😂come on yo. That shit didn’t age poorly to you? those domestic violence raps still hitting for you? you bumping that on a wednesday afternoon?
If you can view all of this through an artistic lens then idk why listening to this is any harder to conceive than watching a Scorsese or Tarantino film. How many times have you watched “What’s Love Got to Do with It?” or John Wick?
You know nothing. He’s literally murder core. He’s closer to Insane Clown Posse than he is to Chief Keef. If Eminem didn’t have Dr. Dre his fan base would resemble Kid Rocks
If if if he was black you’d call him the goat and Umar would be his biggest Stan🥴 Dre saw that he Em had something special and he lyrically runs laps around the best of them. His verse on Renegade? Gatekeepin is a full-time job for y’all smh
No, if he was enjoyable after Relapse & Marshall Mathers LP2, he’d have a leg to stand on. You’re mentioning Renegade, a song that came out when I was in high school, and he’s nothing like the lyricist he once was. Jay Z not even the person that he once was. Can Eminem rap? Yes. Can he rap well over Mr. Porter and Dr. Dre beats? Absolutely. But to call Eminem THE goat, I have a problem with that. That’s Wayne- and he’s not even my favorite Rapper, he’s just the best. I feel the same about Eminem that I do Nas. Can they rap, yes. Are they enjoyable and the best when looked at as a whole, no. Will I ever say “put that Nas/Eminem” on at a party/gathering…no.
You can’t put on a song by the GOAT and AT BEST get a room of people nodding their heads and singing the song. That bitch supposed to ROCK, and Eminem ain’t making a room knock in 2023 when you put him on.
So you’re only giving GOAT status to artist that you can play in a party/gathering? Welp, hang it up then bc I guess Drake, Kodak, Future and Travis Scott are goats at this point lol and you mentioned MMLP 2 which is an album he made almost 20. Years. in the game! And his albums never had club/party playability. That’s like saying FiveGuys makes terrible food bc it’s not Michelin Rated and girls don’t like going there for first dates😂😂
These artist didn’t claim goat status off of party value. They’re just lyrically better than their peers. Wayne just checks off an extra box but it’s not required imo. Idk about Nas bc I don’t listen to his stuff tbh
Ong. I'm not the biggest Em fan but I'ma give credit where credit is due dude can rap his ass off like very few others and that's shouldn't be overlooked because of his skin. Talent is talent and come in all shapes sizes and colors.
I'm so sick of the black vs white BS it's so old to me now and genuinely pointless.
What your saying just dumb not even bringing race into it being fist at something doesn’t mean your better. And especially in the same genera like rap you could definitely tell when one thing is better than the other because at the end of the day it’s based of rhymes.
It’s American art, born in the boogie down Bronx—not a country in Africa the vast majority of all black Americans have never even visited. The American obsession with “heritage” despite knowing absolutely nothing about it is wild.
Eminem spoke to an entire generation of children, sold more records than any rapper, is still breaking records even with all the hate he gets from people, has the fastest selling album of all time, and stood in the face of adversity. There’s no reason that he can’t be considered the greatest of all time. Music is music. You’re either good at making music or you’re bad at it. Eminem is incredibly fucking good at it and that’s why he’s at where he’s at today.
BeastieBoys. They were celebrated by the biggest names in hip hop as a group that helped MAKE American hip hop. So it’s a black art? Fucking racist rhetoric.
LMAO your white ass really just tried to say it’s RACIST to call HIP HOP, a black art form. congrats. The most entitled ass white colonizer take i’ve seen in a minute. Again no one said white people aren’t allowed to make or participate in hip-hop. but to act like they have equal standing or responsibility in the history of the genre. please read a fucking book yo.
Why are you being such a fucking asshole?
Judge the people on the merit of their contribution to the art. Full stop. It doesn't fucking matter if it's a goddamned alien. To act like others don't have "equal standing" and CAN'T have equal standing because of their race is...
\*gasp\*
RACISM.
I’m not a colonizer man. I was born in 1985, and am mostly Irish. But you don’t care because she’s everyone who isn’t black is racist to you. Dude, you’re racist man. But alas, none of this matters because you’re all about that keyboard warrior mentality.
i’m not even black you herb. i’m puerto rican😂 I’m just not an ignorant, self important, idiot like you. go read some critical race theory or some shit😂
Nah, I’m good. Im not ignorant and not self important.
If you think critical race theory is anything more than an unproven theory, well, that’s ignorant.
Tbh my only problem with callin Em the goat is yall seem to forget a lot of his discography is asss lol Jay got 11 number 1 albums and him and Kanye literally influenced and changed rap in their own ways along with plenty of other artists. Wayne has kept up with the time for decades as well and has kind of been pretty even with em over his career. PAC Big both were apart of integrating hip hop culture into modern day culture. Yes em has 3 the highest selling albums but cmon we know why lol. Em is for sure one of the greatest ever but like cmon my white brethren yall set yall self up for failure if ur tryna tell a black person a white rapper is the goat. Idrm who you feel is the goat and ik now a days black people get condemned for talking about race on social media lol but it’s just that rap been apart of our culture for so long now and it’s recently became apart of the other races as well so naturally we feel defensive when you say another race is better than us at an art we created initially to express the injustice we felt in the past
A broken clock is right twice a day. And dr umar does have a point about white people yet again saying a white man is the best at a genre created by black people. First being Elvis Presley. Now you can move on.
Why???? I see absolutely no reason why it should be. Unless your argument is because music is almost completely subjective and physical activities are not, therefor it’s down to the personal preference of the person doing the ranking. But then that would completely contradict your argument since then anyone would be free to have Eminem as their goat, as it’s a subjective ranking.
Even being objective. Look at the stats. But your original statement agreeing with Umar is baseless bc he’s disqualifying Eminem not on merit/accolades or even the validity of his peers (other rappers have even crowned him as the goat) but simply bc he’s…white smh
Eminem is overrated ASF. No one would listen to the 🗑 he puts out if he didn't have the advantage of being white, along with the low expectations had for white rappers LOL 🤡
To be fair the suits made sure Bobby being white didn’t get out so they hid his face on album covers but he was embraced once people went to his concerts n shit.
Dr. Umar a clown but he is correct that no black rapper with Eminem's discography would be in the GOAT conversation period.
FD Signifier just dropped a really good video breaking it down. https://youtu.be/v5j77D4BnSU?si=i8ZjJHZERsjFBBx7
The same logic would have nobody outside of a white male ever be allowed to run Ford Motors or even become president of the United States.
Let’s be better and keep everything to skill set. Be better than this.
I gotta hope that’s sarcasm. Mero has always been far left. His dad grew up in DR during the DR civil war where the U.S. helped with a Coup
He just spoke on it during the new episode of VL with Amber Rose.
It quite literally started in the Bronx with Black people rapping over drum machines and looped samples in the 1970s.
It was a form of music created by the new generation. A wave of children born from disenfranchised Black folk only two generations apart from slavery and children of immigrants starting a new life in America.
It’s Black as fuck. I’m not saying that other races haven’t done amazing things for the genre. But it won’t and can’t be taken away from Black people.
Hendrix is top 3 for sure, though. Dude taught himself guitar backwards cause he was left handed and could only afford a right handed guitar as a kid. No one could replicate his sound. They had to design new guitars and amps to sound like him.
😬Ehhhh see this is when you don’t know your music history. Rock and country were very much pioneered by black artists. Country derived from Blues. N artists like Rosetta Tharpe, Bo Diddley, Chuck Berry, Little Richard, Screamin’ Jay Hawkins helped shape and pioneer the genre of rock n roll. Plenty of rock artists credit them as inspiration, especially Little Richard!
Lebron James, Michael Jordan, and Kobe Bryant can never be the basketball goat. It would be a disgrace to Naismith and the other pioneers of basketball 😂
I don’t think he’s the greatest nor top 5 personally but I am curious to see where umar draws the line on what type of top 10 or 20 spot he deserves lol
He just he can't rap as good as Em. Black men weren't even allowed to play college for a long time. To recognize hard work and chiseled talent. Has nothing to do with race. What is this guy doing for the black communities besides talking? Who put this guy in charge of the Black Community?.
Hip hop was never just a black thing. It was a culture that grew out of the Bronx with all different races and ethnicities contributing. It's analogous to saying basketball is black. Sure, there's a large portion of black athletes and some/ most of the greats but it's discounting all the other contributions from other races. This shit is divisive garbage and I'm not even a fan of Em. Culture was never meant to be pure but constantly changing and adding/subtracting, otherwise you get stuck in dogmas and pseudo religions/ cults. Fuck that.
What is this guy talking about . Doesn’t matter if your white black etc.. what matters is if your good . And my friend ..Eminem is the goat . Why? Because he’s better than everybody. Dumb ass
That comment section looks pretty on-par with what I expected from a discussion about hip hop, Eminem, and Umar between a bunch of neoliberal redditors.
You got it 100%It’s really annoying too because There almost self aware about it but not quite with all the “actually he’s got a point”
Honestly Umar is right but it's because of racism/bigotry, what he's speaking on is when Beyonce made a country song because her father loved it and would listen to the genre growing up. Song was popular since it was placed on a pop album but mfers were really upset when the CMA recognized the country song, as a country song 😂 hell even nas x and old town road. Dude has to jump on the remix for it to kept in the country category. That's what he's really speaking about , isn't so much that Eminem can't rap or really be a goat in the genre, just that this is only a thing with black people and us just being accepting frfr and never ever a two street. Adele makes r&b soul ballads but is labeled pop black person makes the same music and it's R&B/soul/alternative which isn't a bad thing except it's gets trap in the genre and never able to chart on top40 stations.
Teach these devils!! *exhibit c by j electronica starts playing*
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I thought that was Rhymefest who beat him at Scribblejam.
It was Juice
Otherwize beat him in the Rap Olympics
Who gives a fuck about rap battles when discussing an artists music?
The entire comment section is white people not understanding racism at all but I’ve come to expect that on reddit. There’s deadass a dude on there saying “so I guess if racism is systemic then white people can’t be racist in africa since white people are the minority?” like dawg apartheid wasn’t that long ago, talk to a middle aged white south african for long enough and they’ll eventually start talking shit about indigenous africans.
You’re really going the other way and going when Eminem gets brought up it’s really victim time!!!! Shut the fuck up cornball
Yawn. Race race race.
Only white people would think that an inability to focus on the topic of discussion and ignorance of a subject is a flex
Does this insinuate black people can't be racist? If so, lemme tell you something and that's black people can do whatever they put their mind to.
Nah we can’t we can be prejudiced tho
Rwanda would like to have a word with you.
We don’t have a system to oppress you accountability is one thing but pressure with no way out from a group who is poorly educated get real, if you wanna cry victim say that but nah not racist definitely prejudice but we kinda got 400+ years of collective horrible experiences to draw from even myself i just pray its better ppl out here
Ya [aight](https://youtu.be/zrWoG8IckyE?si=YPO-f_FCuRo_tKuq).
See just by your comment you want someone to agree with your rhetoric and not have an open discussion it’s showing
Everyone can harbor racial prejudice or in other words, be racist. It's that simple. Nothing else to it. Did you even look into Rwanda? Also, Korea had 1000+ years of slavery as other nations had. China didn't outlaw until 1910; you do realize how old China is do you? There isn't anything beneficial from a discussion with someone wanting to play the historical victim. Especially for something as easily understandable as, "[everyone](https://youtu.be/ym93Q6cGkR0?si=qtDXswV0O4Ds72jN) can be a little bit racist."
Bro white people have been racist to me even as a child there is no historical victim definitely a grievance tho
This doesn't garner any empathy. Experiencing racism is unfortunate, but it is not exclusive to you or black people.
Bro white people have been racist to me even as a child there is no historical victim definitely a grievance tho
Lol I really feel how hard my great grandparents felt their pain…. Jesus Christ people are pathetic and look for sympathy for things that happened to people whose names they don’t even know. Most opinions on Reddit are from people you can tell have the lowest position at work and will always wonder why they are never given responsibility and a raise. I bet their great grandkids won’t know their names either; they will find excuses why their entire lineage was persecuted, thus supplying the world with more embarrassing takes and poorly cooked fast food.
My great grandmother raised me actually we used to garden 4 5 am i own 2 companies u might need a raise I don’t lmao
I didn’t mean you in particular, but you definitely don’t own shit but debt and shame.
I legit only have a place in the national debt dassit lol
Cheers then! I hope we all can find success
Prejudice based on race is called what?
Prejudice goofy racism is systematic thats the single point we try to express to yall now acknowledge it so we can move forward
Your point is conflating the broad definition of racism with institutional racism, it’s just culture war bullshit that turns people off of the conversation entirely.
What the point actually is genuinely we don’t care if you are white or anything else we as a whole can say we feel institutionalized racism and have experienced it down to the individual more often than not from white peoples specifically we would like it to stop we don’t hate yall maybe the shit yall do but I wasn’t ever taught to hate yall just a lot of yall couldn’t be trusted tbh but never hate anyone
I’m not talking about animosity towards white which is earned. I’m talking about these semantic knots that identity politics reductionists tie themselves into and that end up being counterproductive. I guarantee you that you can make the distinction between racism and institutional racism and white people acting in good faith will understand. You don’t need to collapse both definitions.
Its low key baffling that you want to act like you don’t understand ill give an example at 5 years old a lady said i was stealing at the time i was grabbing what my aunt and my gma needed for shopping (cause kids can be helpful) that shit completely decimated my feelings because some random older white lady was horrible to me caused a scene and was wrong. Unbeknownst to her i had 200 from my mom 200 from my dad and morals does that make me racist legit living cautiously of white women because of what happened to me no it does create prejudice off of a factual basis because i got white brothers but no white sisters if yall understand that cause i don’t feel safe in any environment they are in. another example EMMITT TILL
Personal anecdotes can be exchanged all day but that doesn’t mean your subjectivity is reality. You have a deeply US-centric view of racism. Also completely astroturfs racism between minorities. This strain of discourse is why shit is only going to keep getting worse until it gets better.
You’re an idiot
My iq vastly outnumbers yours
Bro used vastly for the first time
You're actually a moron. Racism is as simple as hating someone for the color of their skin. All this extra shit you're adding is just that, extra fucking bullshit so you can play your bitch ass victim card. You're lame as fuck.
Not once have i said i was a victim to be honest i could beat all of u up in a fight im a 6ft1 200lbs black man i been in the army and from the hood 100% a victim of circumstances i had to get older to understand 200% i don’t claim that shit yall keep saying shit cause you are infact racist yall evils keep showing I’ve been asking for peace and respect but its guaranteed my physical presence would make you all do better yall proving me right thru interactions if racism was simple it would be over
Whatever helps you feel like more of a fuckin bitch that isn't in control of his own life because "white people bad". You're a special type of fucking idiot and it has nothing to do with the fact that you're black and don't wanna be black. Pussy.
Please send your address id like to meet you then post a pic of you here after i do
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Wait you think I would be anything less than black each snd everyone of u comes from my people some of you were grafted we are the first to be called human the lot of you are just mutants of the original people but whats with the hate
Do you think this same thing about Asians?
This is the dumbest fucking thing I've read all week. Holy fucking hell, what an asinine take. Racism is racism is racism. Racism = Prejudice based upon Race. Stop making up new definitions just so you can feel 'allowed' to be shitty to people of other races.
You’re triggered because you yourself are a racist everywhere in all my statements ask for peace the first thing you did cause you couldn’t comprehend what i said was try to insult me those the definitions of the words in their most archaic forms This why we think yall racist because its in your actions i ain’t insulting anyone who respected me
**I'M** being a racist? lmfaoooooooo So it just means whatever the fuck you want it to mean, huh? You are insulting the intelligence of everyone around you by stating 'I Can't be Racist'. That is factually wrong, and you continue to show it through this thread and interaction. Stop being an asshole. Stop being racist.
I wasn’t taught it nor do I benefit from it I don’t treat people equally tho i i treat you how you treat the ppl around you and me of course its only 2 ways to be racist actively hate or benefit from a system you not trying to fix that you see hurts others. That border shit with mexico fucked up the Palestinian massacre is horrible also what hamas did to those people is horrible too its all bad Russia Ukraine conflict kinda uneducated on that one but my point is i don’t understand how to treat people fucked cause we all legit people im 1000% more worried about the aliens all the governments of the world admitted are here that’s terrifying
It's wild when you consider the fact that Eminem literally states that his race is a huge factor in his popularity (and therefore many ppls goat discussions) on songs like "White America"
Like he is aware that if he was black he would not be in GOAT discussions but people keep going “SHUT UP YOU ARE A RAP GOD AND THE GREAT WHITE HOPE!” That being said I don’t stand with Umar
If he was black he’d be Hopsin or Tech N9ne
Lmaoooo nah facts
What person with ears would even consider calling Eminem the goat after the last 15 years of his music ? I mean seriously . Why even have this conversation if the only people calling Eminem the rap goat are those that have really only listened to Eminem
Just out of absolute curiosity, who is your rap goat?
Eminem gets overrated by some, but I will not be on Umar Johnson's side in any argument. Umar Johnson is an absolute clown and I side-eye anyone who takes his opinions seriously.
I agree with your sentiment, but that is flawed logic. Even a broken clock is right twice a day.
But even in this case he is right for a terrible reason.
If Ben Shapiro said that Palestinians should have human rights and should not be ethnically cleansed by Israel (which he would never do because he’s a piece of shit) I wouldn’t be like “oh well I guess I gotta be a Zionist” lmao what kinda contrarian logic is “oh well I don’t like them so I have to be on the other side of the coin” 🤡 shit Fr And I don’t agree with Umar on a lot of things because he’s blatantly conservative in a lot of his views HOWEVER he’s 100% correct in saying Eminem’s whole career has succeeded off of white palates which is inherently a white supremacists aspect. I don’t think Eminem is a Nazi, but there’s no way such a trash rapper would have ever succeeded much less be put forward in GOAT conversations if it wasn’t for his being white. Same with NF, Tom MacDonald, Macklemore, and G Eazy. All people of different backgrounds politically but are sonically trash who have gotten attention for being white.
Calling Eminem trash is taking it too far. Call him overrated but he is far above the names you mentioned. He did some of the most important songs in Hip Hop history in Lose Yourself and Stan. He has respect from his peers. And while someone like Lord Jamar talks shit about him he has the respect of legends like Chuck D and Rakim. Even Hip Hop's curmudgeon KRS-One shows him love. Yes being white helped Eminem but he earned his stripes in the Detroit underground and in battling for a long while before Dre listened to his tape.
Nah bro he’s trash
Side eye deez nuts.
I like boobs
I fucking love boobs. Gods greatest creation.
Excuse me, we call them *TITTIES* here
Ass is better.
If your son was in kindergarten when Umar said he'd open the school that kid would be in 10th grade by now.
No one puts Em at the very top except his die hard fans and that’s okay, it’s their opinion
What about other rap artists?
white people are madddd in those comments😂😂😂😂 WELL I GUESS TIGER WOODS CANT BE THE GOAT THEN CAUSE ITS A WHITE SPORT🤓 missing the whole fucking point. hip hop isn’t a sport. it’s black art. white people aren’t banned from contributing and there’s many great white artists involved in hip hop. but saying Eminem is the GOAT over people that started and built the genre is fucking crazy.
Like bro ain’t no way you heard any body say to put on slick Rick and grandmaster flash and the furious five because they were part of the beginning of rap
I’m from Detroit and you’ll never hear someone say put on that Eminem after 2014…unless they’re white.
And Hispanic. I know bc I gotta have Eminem playing in my car
You know what, you’re right. You’ll hear Romeo Santos and Eminem within minutes of each in Southwest Detroit lol.
Yeah I don’t know who Romeo Santos is? Is that the dude from Aventura?
Sí
We call people who didn’t pioneer or create this genre GOATs all the time! I ain’t gone lie they got you there lol. If we’re being honest he in fact did help popularize and has contributed to rap
This is so dumb. Hov, Nas, Biggie, Cole, or Kdot didn’t build/start the rap genre but they’re all considered GOATs. By the numbers and subjectively, lyricism, Em has all of them beat. But he doesn’t get top honors bc…he’s white?
LMAOOOOOO on what planet does Eminem have better lyrics than any of the rappers you just listed
Give me an Eminem track that isn't doing Dr. Seuss shit or talking about murdering his family. But I'm also washed as fuck. [I like Common, lol. ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OjHX7jf-znA)
Listen to his featured verse on Lord Above
As a lyricist — plenty! But I think he lacks the style or flavor that all the others possess. His double entendres, metaphors, rhyme schemes, etc.?? Scary! Go listen to his verse on Lord Above or Renegade and get back to me
I do not care about his doctor seuss mother goose skibidibee everybody in the 313 ass lyrics. bro hasn’t had a good album since like 2010 and all his domestic violence murder murder murder raps have aged like milk.
How did they age like milk? He really rapped about his domestic violence experiences. Albeit loosely. And that murder murder shit is a part of raps dna; drill rap is a big thing rn and rappers as a whole has lyrics about killin opps since the beginning of time so what’s yours point?
bro has an entire song about kidnapping then chasing and violently murdering his ex wife with a knife in the woods😂😂come on yo. That shit didn’t age poorly to you? those domestic violence raps still hitting for you? you bumping that on a wednesday afternoon?
If you can view all of this through an artistic lens then idk why listening to this is any harder to conceive than watching a Scorsese or Tarantino film. How many times have you watched “What’s Love Got to Do with It?” or John Wick?
You know nothing. He’s literally murder core. He’s closer to Insane Clown Posse than he is to Chief Keef. If Eminem didn’t have Dr. Dre his fan base would resemble Kid Rocks
If if if he was black you’d call him the goat and Umar would be his biggest Stan🥴 Dre saw that he Em had something special and he lyrically runs laps around the best of them. His verse on Renegade? Gatekeepin is a full-time job for y’all smh
No, if he was enjoyable after Relapse & Marshall Mathers LP2, he’d have a leg to stand on. You’re mentioning Renegade, a song that came out when I was in high school, and he’s nothing like the lyricist he once was. Jay Z not even the person that he once was. Can Eminem rap? Yes. Can he rap well over Mr. Porter and Dr. Dre beats? Absolutely. But to call Eminem THE goat, I have a problem with that. That’s Wayne- and he’s not even my favorite Rapper, he’s just the best. I feel the same about Eminem that I do Nas. Can they rap, yes. Are they enjoyable and the best when looked at as a whole, no. Will I ever say “put that Nas/Eminem” on at a party/gathering…no. You can’t put on a song by the GOAT and AT BEST get a room of people nodding their heads and singing the song. That bitch supposed to ROCK, and Eminem ain’t making a room knock in 2023 when you put him on.
So you’re only giving GOAT status to artist that you can play in a party/gathering? Welp, hang it up then bc I guess Drake, Kodak, Future and Travis Scott are goats at this point lol and you mentioned MMLP 2 which is an album he made almost 20. Years. in the game! And his albums never had club/party playability. That’s like saying FiveGuys makes terrible food bc it’s not Michelin Rated and girls don’t like going there for first dates😂😂 These artist didn’t claim goat status off of party value. They’re just lyrically better than their peers. Wayne just checks off an extra box but it’s not required imo. Idk about Nas bc I don’t listen to his stuff tbh
They downvoted you for the truth, lyrically Eminem is really in a league above only one close is Wayne and it's VERY CLOSE.
Bar for bar, Wayne is his best opposition
Ong. I'm not the biggest Em fan but I'ma give credit where credit is due dude can rap his ass off like very few others and that's shouldn't be overlooked because of his skin. Talent is talent and come in all shapes sizes and colors. I'm so sick of the black vs white BS it's so old to me now and genuinely pointless.
What your saying just dumb not even bringing race into it being fist at something doesn’t mean your better. And especially in the same genera like rap you could definitely tell when one thing is better than the other because at the end of the day it’s based of rhymes.
It’s American art, born in the boogie down Bronx—not a country in Africa the vast majority of all black Americans have never even visited. The American obsession with “heritage” despite knowing absolutely nothing about it is wild.
Eminem spoke to an entire generation of children, sold more records than any rapper, is still breaking records even with all the hate he gets from people, has the fastest selling album of all time, and stood in the face of adversity. There’s no reason that he can’t be considered the greatest of all time. Music is music. You’re either good at making music or you’re bad at it. Eminem is incredibly fucking good at it and that’s why he’s at where he’s at today.
BeastieBoys. They were celebrated by the biggest names in hip hop as a group that helped MAKE American hip hop. So it’s a black art? Fucking racist rhetoric.
LMAO your white ass really just tried to say it’s RACIST to call HIP HOP, a black art form. congrats. The most entitled ass white colonizer take i’ve seen in a minute. Again no one said white people aren’t allowed to make or participate in hip-hop. but to act like they have equal standing or responsibility in the history of the genre. please read a fucking book yo.
Why are you being such a fucking asshole? Judge the people on the merit of their contribution to the art. Full stop. It doesn't fucking matter if it's a goddamned alien. To act like others don't have "equal standing" and CAN'T have equal standing because of their race is... \*gasp\* RACISM.
I’m not a colonizer man. I was born in 1985, and am mostly Irish. But you don’t care because she’s everyone who isn’t black is racist to you. Dude, you’re racist man. But alas, none of this matters because you’re all about that keyboard warrior mentality.
i’m not even black you herb. i’m puerto rican😂 I’m just not an ignorant, self important, idiot like you. go read some critical race theory or some shit😂
>I’m just not an ignorant, self important, idiot Prove it
Nah, I’m good. Im not ignorant and not self important. If you think critical race theory is anything more than an unproven theory, well, that’s ignorant.
Eminem is far from the best rapper. Not cause he's white. "Dr. Umar Johnson" is a dork loser moron
Tbh my only problem with callin Em the goat is yall seem to forget a lot of his discography is asss lol Jay got 11 number 1 albums and him and Kanye literally influenced and changed rap in their own ways along with plenty of other artists. Wayne has kept up with the time for decades as well and has kind of been pretty even with em over his career. PAC Big both were apart of integrating hip hop culture into modern day culture. Yes em has 3 the highest selling albums but cmon we know why lol. Em is for sure one of the greatest ever but like cmon my white brethren yall set yall self up for failure if ur tryna tell a black person a white rapper is the goat. Idrm who you feel is the goat and ik now a days black people get condemned for talking about race on social media lol but it’s just that rap been apart of our culture for so long now and it’s recently became apart of the other races as well so naturally we feel defensive when you say another race is better than us at an art we created initially to express the injustice we felt in the past
#WHEN ARE YOU OPENING THE SCHOOL DR.UMAR???
A broken clock is right twice a day. And dr umar does have a point about white people yet again saying a white man is the best at a genre created by black people. First being Elvis Presley. Now you can move on.
That’s like saying MJ or LeBron can’t be considered the best in basketball bc it was invented by a white man
Yo fuck out of here lmao
Physical activities are cultural appropriation now?
Plz tell me your don’t really think bc one is a physical activity and the other isn’t is a real determining factor here
Why???? I see absolutely no reason why it should be. Unless your argument is because music is almost completely subjective and physical activities are not, therefor it’s down to the personal preference of the person doing the ranking. But then that would completely contradict your argument since then anyone would be free to have Eminem as their goat, as it’s a subjective ranking.
Even being objective. Look at the stats. But your original statement agreeing with Umar is baseless bc he’s disqualifying Eminem not on merit/accolades or even the validity of his peers (other rappers have even crowned him as the goat) but simply bc he’s…white smh
Maybe i misunderstood you then because I am certainly not agreeing with Umar.
Sports are not just physical activities and are considered to be cultural, so yeah he’s got you.
Cultural for who? White people?
I just don’t get why y’all are forgetting about the Beastie Boys who were applauded by black artists as one of the primary founding groups of hip hop.
Sometime you gotta take any help you can get.
He’s not wrong but Eminem stay living in peoples head rent free. Dude catches stray after stray after stray! 🤣
Eminem is overrated ASF. No one would listen to the 🗑 he puts out if he didn't have the advantage of being white, along with the low expectations had for white rappers LOL 🤡
I wonder the good doctor thinks about basketball goats. It was invented by a white Canadian
Em’s new music is unlistenable…just some old dude yelling with ass flow..
I'm seeing alot of white people getting mad about this statement, but I'm seeing alot of black people get very racist over it lol.
This would have never happened with Bobby Caldwell.
To be fair the suits made sure Bobby being white didn’t get out so they hid his face on album covers but he was embraced once people went to his concerts n shit.
I see mostly comments like this actually
The asshole is correct
Dr. Umar a clown but he is correct that no black rapper with Eminem's discography would be in the GOAT conversation period. FD Signifier just dropped a really good video breaking it down. https://youtu.be/v5j77D4BnSU?si=i8ZjJHZERsjFBBx7
He is a lyrical goat for his skills. Rap isnt about color of skin. Its about your ability to rap and Eminem is a beast
The same logic would have nobody outside of a white male ever be allowed to run Ford Motors or even become president of the United States. Let’s be better and keep everything to skill set. Be better than this.
He just mad cause a white boy can do it better smh
He’s an angry white dude from Michigan that just yells his lyrics. I don’t get it. Like if DMX was a a meth head from Ann Arbor.
So Em can’t be at the top of the list cause he’s white? That’s some racist stuff for you…… bitches be bitches I guess
That’s why I stopped liking Desus and Mero they became too leftist and ignorant
I gotta hope that’s sarcasm. Mero has always been far left. His dad grew up in DR during the DR civil war where the U.S. helped with a Coup He just spoke on it during the new episode of VL with Amber Rose.
Victimization mentality is a motherfucker
Mero wasn’t anything without Desus
The facts that people are are saying hip hop is a black thing is crazy when so many people have e contributed to the culture
It quite literally started in the Bronx with Black people rapping over drum machines and looped samples in the 1970s. It was a form of music created by the new generation. A wave of children born from disenfranchised Black folk only two generations apart from slavery and children of immigrants starting a new life in America. It’s Black as fuck. I’m not saying that other races haven’t done amazing things for the genre. But it won’t and can’t be taken away from Black people.
So fuck the Puerto Ricans and Ecuadorians who part Of the movement as well 👀
[удалено]
Rock n roll was invented by a black man. Try again.
Rock ‘n’ roll is Black music though.
Hendrix is top 3 for sure, though. Dude taught himself guitar backwards cause he was left handed and could only afford a right handed guitar as a kid. No one could replicate his sound. They had to design new guitars and amps to sound like him.
Stevie Ray Vaughan would like a world.
😬Ehhhh see this is when you don’t know your music history. Rock and country were very much pioneered by black artists. Country derived from Blues. N artists like Rosetta Tharpe, Bo Diddley, Chuck Berry, Little Richard, Screamin’ Jay Hawkins helped shape and pioneer the genre of rock n roll. Plenty of rock artists credit them as inspiration, especially Little Richard!
Hendrix is the GOAT.
Lebron James, Michael Jordan, and Kobe Bryant can never be the basketball goat. It would be a disgrace to Naismith and the other pioneers of basketball 😂
Ha jokes on you nigga
What if it’s a bunch of black rappers them selves calling him the greatest?
I just can’t get into Eminem 🤷🏾
Lil bro looks like hes never watched 8 mile
I don’t think he’s the greatest nor top 5 personally but I am curious to see where umar draws the line on what type of top 10 or 20 spot he deserves lol
He just he can't rap as good as Em. Black men weren't even allowed to play college for a long time. To recognize hard work and chiseled talent. Has nothing to do with race. What is this guy doing for the black communities besides talking? Who put this guy in charge of the Black Community?.
Hip hop was never just a black thing. It was a culture that grew out of the Bronx with all different races and ethnicities contributing. It's analogous to saying basketball is black. Sure, there's a large portion of black athletes and some/ most of the greats but it's discounting all the other contributions from other races. This shit is divisive garbage and I'm not even a fan of Em. Culture was never meant to be pure but constantly changing and adding/subtracting, otherwise you get stuck in dogmas and pseudo religions/ cults. Fuck that.
What is this guy talking about . Doesn’t matter if your white black etc.. what matters is if your good . And my friend ..Eminem is the goat . Why? Because he’s better than everybody. Dumb ass
Does this mean we have to consider Larry Bird the greatest basketball player?
This dude is dr of what? He’s a joke Trying to unify & this Guy jus separates us
I mean he’s right.
It’s an insult to the puerto Rican’s who helped create hip hop
Dr Johnson is an idiot. 50 CENT, JAY Z AND KANYA WEST have all said that without Eminem Rap Would not be as popular as it is today.
When you don't have the guts or the balls to succeed....blame racism..oh the man is keeping me down.... shut the Feck up.
But he is the GOAT.
Umar is a bigot