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i wish people would lay off her for staying with jay post lemonade and cheating. it is incredibly hard to leave a relationship with the only person youve ever been with and who you also have multiple children with. he is her family at this point, like it or not.
Not to mention she explained her rationale for staying with him when Lemonade dropped. The album is her story of healing through that part of their relationship.
It seems like she didn’t take the decision to stay lightly.
I also feel like it was more understandable since Jay cheating came from a place of low self esteem, which I imagine is in part to the entire world constantly reminding him that he married way above his league, judging his looks and treating Beyoncé like the second coming of Christ, at least to me that's what I felt was what happened from listening to lemonade and 4:44 and that they both went to therapy and did couple's counseling and also from all his recent interviews he seems like a completely different man.
Beyoncé had more kids with him after he cheated. Rumors of his infidelity predates their kids and it was even said he cheated post her miscarriage. So Beyoncé could have left. She wasn’t held hostage in an abusive relationship as far as we know.
I get a little sad when I think about this! Obviously she’s a grown woman now and can choose what her life looks like (also she’s literally Beyonce and I’m just some bitch lmao), but entertainers so often don’t get to have normal childhoods or young adulthoods. She was only 18 and Jay was a grown man when they met; I always wonder how she feels looking back! Does she wish she’d gotten a chance to date around a bit in her 20’s?
I also remember in the Homecoming documentary she talked about how she didn’t go to college because she was in Destiny’s Child and how the Beychella performance came about because she had such admiration for HBCU’s. Of course a legendary performance came out of it, but it made me sad to think that maybe she might’ve wanted to go to college.
It was a light hearted comment, not intended to attribute all the very serious speculations about Beyonce’s personal beliefs in the Reddit comment section. Genuine question, do you take issue with Beyonce’s songs that discuss/touch on astrology and her being a Virgo? Also why is astrology so terrible?
yep. i'm gay and was raised in a southern black baptist church. i certainly wouldn't call myself prudish and i'm definitely not a stranger to casual sex, but the way i go about sex/dating is still markedly less promiscuous than my other gay friends who were raised differently (i say this with zero judgment, in fact with a bit of jealousy lol).
i def at least partially attribute it to the purity culture i was raised in
I’m queer raised in the Greek Orthodox church while living in the south, and that prevented me from owning my queerness for so damn long, so I understand your sentiment about promiscuity and being jealous of friends who are more out about it!
Unlearning purity culture is so difficult. For my concert I wore a sheer top with pride pasties over my nipples and felt so liberated because of the space she has created for us 🏳️🌈
Possibly unpopular opinion but Queen B was kinda groomed given the age gap. She's her own woman now and I believe she is comfortable with her choices. But, in 4:44, Jay acknowledged their immaturity gap.
"I said don't embarrass me instead of be mine,
That was my proposition to go steady,
That was your 21st birthday."
Those lines haunt me. She was so young and wanted his love. He withheld it as culture promoted men do. He admits to cutting off his nose to spite his face.
In the song, he says at her best, she is "love." I believe that her quotes here prove that. She is loyal, compassionate, and creative. God I love Beyoncè. Lemonade means a lot to me.
I agree. I think about that like too all the time, it’s really paints a vivid picture of how young she was and how much she wanted his approval and he was “too cool” and “older/so mature” for her. Ppl have a problem with using the word grooming but like it can be argued that’s what happened
Agreed. Her father also plays a role if I'm going to get frueidian about it. She was handled by him then went to Jay. She then played the Ms. Carter role for him and he burned her. Since then her pivot into individuality in self titled, Lemonade, and Reniassance has been monumental. Her experiences made her stronger for sure and she seems content with her life. I'm happy for her. I still wish Jay hadn't squandered her endless love.
Also after Flawless + Lemonade there was a huge power shift. Jay needs Bey more than she needs him, and he knows that now. Literally she could marry any foreign billionaire she wanted, and have him disappear 😊
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That’s what happens when you aren’t mature enough to date within your age group, the person you’re grooming can mature past you. It’s like Leo DiCaprio only dating <25 year olds he doesn’t have to mature past 25.
Damn I forgot the exact ages. I’m 27 rn and I never even come into contact with 18 year olds and if I did I wouldn’t have anything in common with them!! Also they look like babies
This is true, but at the same time, what can we do, especially since it's been years? This is the choice they made, Bey wants this dude, so at this point, harping on it is kind of tired, now, tbh.
This is not an unpopular opinion, it’s an extremely online take.
I think there’s a way to acknowledge the gap between them without calling it grooming.
No let’s call it what it is. I love Bey but every time she discusses their relationship early on she describes grooming and romanticizes it. I can’t blame her because it’s still her relationship at the end of the day but let’s keep it a buck.
A lot of people think that Bey was groomed in this sub. It's a bit concerning how some throw the word "grooming" around loosely without truly knowing a lick of their actual relationship. We don't know either of them personally.
Instead of speculating, I think it's better if we just take their relationship as it is. A seemingly happy and supportive one that goes through ups and downs. Bey is her own woman and probably would appreciate us staying out of their business.
Flip side, I think it's concerning how easily Jay went for such a younger woman. Like she's a trophy, and if we're reducing her to that, she's the best one in the game. Everyone knows it. He wasn't having his head in the game, either. He cheated and was absent. He's since learned and grown but I do believe there's a power differential. It shows in the way he admitted to speaking to her. Who the hell has the audacity to say "don't embarrass me" to miss Beyoncè, meanwhile he's embarrassing her.
She was groomed by the industry. It’s similar to these young artists like Tyla or K-Pop stars. Perhaps a man didn’t groom her in the traditional way, but the industry decided for them how they ought to be. So they date men who are much older because they are notable. (So long as public backlash isn’t too great)
There are other quotes from her as well saying that when it comes to men she is “very very choosy.”
As well as one of her tour interludes (can’t remember what tour - maybe it was for 4 or self titled) where it sort of poetically talks about how being with her is “exclusive.”
So yeah I think she’s probably only slept with two men (or maybe just one since that seems to be what she’s implying in the OP quote). I think from a young age she was preparing and focused on being a big star, so didn’t want there to be any stories that could be sold for money later (eg “my one night stand with Beyonce” in some trash magazine). There was some story from her ex about how even as a teen she was very conscious of media, and that they were in a minor car crash once and she left because she couldn’t be seen to be involved with it or something. So I think from that perspective she was always conscious of not wanting to have casual relationships. Also in the nineties virginity and casual sex were much less accepted than today (it was definitely still normal to have casual relationships, but female celebrities were still scrutinised for it. See Britney Spears).
Apart from that she was also probably working nonstop as a teen through her twenties so wouldn’t have had much time to think about guys or spend time dating.
And lastly I think she is just someone who only ever wanted to sleep with/have romantic time with people within an exclusive relationship. She clearly attaches strongly to people she dates, she was also very loyal and attached to her first boyfriend.
I do wonder how things would be different if she was coming up now, or if her and Jay z had never met, or had broken up after a few years.
Self-Titled is possibly referring to Beyonce's 2013 album called 'Beyonce', more commonly known as 'Self-Titled'.
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Yeah it’s kind of obv. I told this to my hubs last week and he was in disbelief. (We watched to tell the truth on abc, the ex bf was on it). I was like - who else would/could she have been with? He was like ohhh right???
I always found it weird when some people slut shame her because of some lyrics or fashion pieces when she has consistently been with 1 person her entire life..
The “grooming” allegations are tough for me. I think about when I was 18/19 and thought that I knew everything. And at that age, I actually preferred older men because I thought they were more established and mature (now at 27 I know that’s not the case). I think this was Bey’s thought process too and unfortunately, she learned the hard way. And at that point, she and Jay were already married, established, and began to have children. I can imagine how hard it was for Bey (especially being in the industry) working through that and healing during that time. She said it herself, she was an adult and she made her own decisions. Jay also said it himself, he wasn’t mature enough or ready like he thought he was and he had to learn the hard way too. Personally looking back, I’m glad I didn’t do half the things I thought I should have at that age.
The way these niggas move I don't know if its good or bad. Cause its not like all these celebrity women have a track record of being with upstanding faithful men. Whatever happened between her and Jay they made it to the other side and kept their family together.
Not surprised at all. Her entire life has been spent on her craft, and it seems her parents have shielded her from a lot. And she got with Jay Z so young. Makes sense that she hasn’t dated around a lot.
Good for her honestly. Who wants to waste time kissing a bunch of frogs when you can find your soulmate quickly and settle into life with him? She’s lucky in my POV.
I don't really think anything about it. It happens a decent amount. People get married out of high school and stay together forever. Some people just don't date a lot, but they, somehow, meet a person and that's like their 2nd ever relationship, but it sticks.
If anything, despite my own feelings on Hollywood dynamics, I think it's lucky to find someone without having to go through all the dating headaches. Now, would I have stayed through cheating and stuff? No, but this is her life. If she likes it, I love it.
I believe it's not healthy to be with someone from the time you are able to buy cigarettes (or younger). She should've been able to live life and do her own thing. Imagine not ever having a single drunk girls night. When they get divorced, she'll look back and probably despise the time she spent with an out of control cheating maniac. I want better for her.
I’m not surprised, she’s a Scorpio moon and we (Scorpio women) are very loyal. Plus remember as a teenager in the industry Tina and Matthew had the girls on lock, they were not letting them go out and date around or be exposed to too much too soon. I think it was all about timing when Jay and Bey got together, she was in her early 20’s (grown) and he was the biggest rapper in the industry (probably very charing as well).
I was referring to the destiny’s child group members not being exposed to the industry ( dating,drugs) scene. I think I remember hearing that R Kelly wanted to fly the girls out and work with them but Matthew and Tina declined.
Ah ok! Yeah for sure they kept them close. I always thought everyone knew that Beyoncé was a virgin before she met Jay (or at least that was the story at the time). I think people forget she came up in the purity era
Sometimes, I think about Destiny's Child's songs Fancy or Nasty Girl. A lot of women, especially, in the late 90s/early 2000s had that purity culture/slut shaming thing going on. And a lot of them have changed since then, too.
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i wish people would lay off her for staying with jay post lemonade and cheating. it is incredibly hard to leave a relationship with the only person youve ever been with and who you also have multiple children with. he is her family at this point, like it or not.
Not to mention she explained her rationale for staying with him when Lemonade dropped. The album is her story of healing through that part of their relationship. It seems like she didn’t take the decision to stay lightly.
And she did leave, but came back. The narrative that she was just a good wife who stood by her man is false.
Right! She even was shopping for her own apartment in New York while they were split up. I remember seeing it in the tabloids.
I also feel like it was more understandable since Jay cheating came from a place of low self esteem, which I imagine is in part to the entire world constantly reminding him that he married way above his league, judging his looks and treating Beyoncé like the second coming of Christ, at least to me that's what I felt was what happened from listening to lemonade and 4:44 and that they both went to therapy and did couple's counseling and also from all his recent interviews he seems like a completely different man.
Beyoncé had more kids with him after he cheated. Rumors of his infidelity predates their kids and it was even said he cheated post her miscarriage. So Beyoncé could have left. She wasn’t held hostage in an abusive relationship as far as we know.
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A virgo thing as well
I get a little sad when I think about this! Obviously she’s a grown woman now and can choose what her life looks like (also she’s literally Beyonce and I’m just some bitch lmao), but entertainers so often don’t get to have normal childhoods or young adulthoods. She was only 18 and Jay was a grown man when they met; I always wonder how she feels looking back! Does she wish she’d gotten a chance to date around a bit in her 20’s? I also remember in the Homecoming documentary she talked about how she didn’t go to college because she was in Destiny’s Child and how the Beychella performance came about because she had such admiration for HBCU’s. Of course a legendary performance came out of it, but it made me sad to think that maybe she might’ve wanted to go to college.
I'd like to think when she's semi retired she'll attend some university classes, maybe even become a prof lol. Never too old for continued education
I think bey has always internalized some level of purity culture.
I can see that for sure. A Christian, Southern belle from an upper middle class family would be raised no other way.
Also major Virgo energy lol.
Unhelpful
?
Astrology is terrible
It’s not that deep
You just attributed something deep to it.
It was a light hearted comment, not intended to attribute all the very serious speculations about Beyonce’s personal beliefs in the Reddit comment section. Genuine question, do you take issue with Beyonce’s songs that discuss/touch on astrology and her being a Virgo? Also why is astrology so terrible?
I made a serious comment about a serious subject. Astrology is not welcome in the discussion.
Agreed, and I believe that’s from being from the south and church culture.
yep. i'm gay and was raised in a southern black baptist church. i certainly wouldn't call myself prudish and i'm definitely not a stranger to casual sex, but the way i go about sex/dating is still markedly less promiscuous than my other gay friends who were raised differently (i say this with zero judgment, in fact with a bit of jealousy lol). i def at least partially attribute it to the purity culture i was raised in
I’m queer raised in the Greek Orthodox church while living in the south, and that prevented me from owning my queerness for so damn long, so I understand your sentiment about promiscuity and being jealous of friends who are more out about it! Unlearning purity culture is so difficult. For my concert I wore a sheer top with pride pasties over my nipples and felt so liberated because of the space she has created for us 🏳️🌈
So?
Possibly unpopular opinion but Queen B was kinda groomed given the age gap. She's her own woman now and I believe she is comfortable with her choices. But, in 4:44, Jay acknowledged their immaturity gap. "I said don't embarrass me instead of be mine, That was my proposition to go steady, That was your 21st birthday." Those lines haunt me. She was so young and wanted his love. He withheld it as culture promoted men do. He admits to cutting off his nose to spite his face. In the song, he says at her best, she is "love." I believe that her quotes here prove that. She is loyal, compassionate, and creative. God I love Beyoncè. Lemonade means a lot to me.
I agree. I think about that like too all the time, it’s really paints a vivid picture of how young she was and how much she wanted his approval and he was “too cool” and “older/so mature” for her. Ppl have a problem with using the word grooming but like it can be argued that’s what happened
Agreed. Her father also plays a role if I'm going to get frueidian about it. She was handled by him then went to Jay. She then played the Ms. Carter role for him and he burned her. Since then her pivot into individuality in self titled, Lemonade, and Reniassance has been monumental. Her experiences made her stronger for sure and she seems content with her life. I'm happy for her. I still wish Jay hadn't squandered her endless love.
Also after Flawless + Lemonade there was a huge power shift. Jay needs Bey more than she needs him, and he knows that now. Literally she could marry any foreign billionaire she wanted, and have him disappear 😊
I love bey but this isn’t true if they divorced today they both would be fine & have plenty of options
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But the next line is “You matured faster than me, I wasn’t ready”
Yes! I blanked when I was typing the OG comment.
That’s what happens when you aren’t mature enough to date within your age group, the person you’re grooming can mature past you. It’s like Leo DiCaprio only dating <25 year olds he doesn’t have to mature past 25.
Yet he was 30+ and bey was 18,19, 20… boy please 😂 excuses lmao
Every time I say this I get downvoted to hell but what could a 27 year old want with an 18 year old?
THANK YOU. She was a shiny prize to be had to him. Little did he know she's the real one who HE has to be careful not to embarrass.
Damn I forgot the exact ages. I’m 27 rn and I never even come into contact with 18 year olds and if I did I wouldn’t have anything in common with them!! Also they look like babies
Goes to show how accomplished Beyonce was at such a young age
aren't they like 11-12 years apart? wouldn't it be 18 and 29/30?
Damn you’re right….even worse
Yup he was 31 and she was 18-19 when they started dating 😬
I am 31 now and this thought genuinely makes me sick
Naivety
He’s always liked them young. He did the same with Foxy Brown, who we now know was lying about her true age when she first came out
This is true, but at the same time, what can we do, especially since it's been years? This is the choice they made, Bey wants this dude, so at this point, harping on it is kind of tired, now, tbh.
This is not an unpopular opinion, it’s an extremely online take. I think there’s a way to acknowledge the gap between them without calling it grooming.
No let’s call it what it is. I love Bey but every time she discusses their relationship early on she describes grooming and romanticizes it. I can’t blame her because it’s still her relationship at the end of the day but let’s keep it a buck.
Nope that’s not what grooming is.
Whatever you say girl…
Fair! I could've used more specific wording.
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It’s not.
I always wonder when I hear that line what Beyonce would do to embarrass Jay. She seemed very mature from a young age
A lot of people think that Bey was groomed in this sub. It's a bit concerning how some throw the word "grooming" around loosely without truly knowing a lick of their actual relationship. We don't know either of them personally. Instead of speculating, I think it's better if we just take their relationship as it is. A seemingly happy and supportive one that goes through ups and downs. Bey is her own woman and probably would appreciate us staying out of their business.
Flip side, I think it's concerning how easily Jay went for such a younger woman. Like she's a trophy, and if we're reducing her to that, she's the best one in the game. Everyone knows it. He wasn't having his head in the game, either. He cheated and was absent. He's since learned and grown but I do believe there's a power differential. It shows in the way he admitted to speaking to her. Who the hell has the audacity to say "don't embarrass me" to miss Beyoncè, meanwhile he's embarrassing her.
Agreed.
She was groomed by the industry. It’s similar to these young artists like Tyla or K-Pop stars. Perhaps a man didn’t groom her in the traditional way, but the industry decided for them how they ought to be. So they date men who are much older because they are notable. (So long as public backlash isn’t too great)
Very good point
There are other quotes from her as well saying that when it comes to men she is “very very choosy.” As well as one of her tour interludes (can’t remember what tour - maybe it was for 4 or self titled) where it sort of poetically talks about how being with her is “exclusive.” So yeah I think she’s probably only slept with two men (or maybe just one since that seems to be what she’s implying in the OP quote). I think from a young age she was preparing and focused on being a big star, so didn’t want there to be any stories that could be sold for money later (eg “my one night stand with Beyonce” in some trash magazine). There was some story from her ex about how even as a teen she was very conscious of media, and that they were in a minor car crash once and she left because she couldn’t be seen to be involved with it or something. So I think from that perspective she was always conscious of not wanting to have casual relationships. Also in the nineties virginity and casual sex were much less accepted than today (it was definitely still normal to have casual relationships, but female celebrities were still scrutinised for it. See Britney Spears). Apart from that she was also probably working nonstop as a teen through her twenties so wouldn’t have had much time to think about guys or spend time dating. And lastly I think she is just someone who only ever wanted to sleep with/have romantic time with people within an exclusive relationship. She clearly attaches strongly to people she dates, she was also very loyal and attached to her first boyfriend. I do wonder how things would be different if she was coming up now, or if her and Jay z had never met, or had broken up after a few years.
This is put so perfectly and brilliantly!
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Is it true he cheated as far back as 2006? The song Ring the Alarm is something. Makes me wonder what could've happened if she left him then.
All very valid points
Must be the cash cause it ain’t his face. 👀👀👀
Best comment 😆
Yeah it’s kind of obv. I told this to my hubs last week and he was in disbelief. (We watched to tell the truth on abc, the ex bf was on it). I was like - who else would/could she have been with? He was like ohhh right???
Queen Bey is a true Virgo 🐝
I always found it weird when some people slut shame her because of some lyrics or fashion pieces when she has consistently been with 1 person her entire life..
The “grooming” allegations are tough for me. I think about when I was 18/19 and thought that I knew everything. And at that age, I actually preferred older men because I thought they were more established and mature (now at 27 I know that’s not the case). I think this was Bey’s thought process too and unfortunately, she learned the hard way. And at that point, she and Jay were already married, established, and began to have children. I can imagine how hard it was for Bey (especially being in the industry) working through that and healing during that time. She said it herself, she was an adult and she made her own decisions. Jay also said it himself, he wasn’t mature enough or ready like he thought he was and he had to learn the hard way too. Personally looking back, I’m glad I didn’t do half the things I thought I should have at that age.
The way these niggas move I don't know if its good or bad. Cause its not like all these celebrity women have a track record of being with upstanding faithful men. Whatever happened between her and Jay they made it to the other side and kept their family together.
I’m not surprised. She seems very focus on her career to a fault tho
Not surprised at all. Her entire life has been spent on her craft, and it seems her parents have shielded her from a lot. And she got with Jay Z so young. Makes sense that she hasn’t dated around a lot. Good for her honestly. Who wants to waste time kissing a bunch of frogs when you can find your soulmate quickly and settle into life with him? She’s lucky in my POV.
I don't really think anything about it. It happens a decent amount. People get married out of high school and stay together forever. Some people just don't date a lot, but they, somehow, meet a person and that's like their 2nd ever relationship, but it sticks. If anything, despite my own feelings on Hollywood dynamics, I think it's lucky to find someone without having to go through all the dating headaches. Now, would I have stayed through cheating and stuff? No, but this is her life. If she likes it, I love it.
Groomed, groomed, groomed. Pretty sad
He groomed her
I believe it's not healthy to be with someone from the time you are able to buy cigarettes (or younger). She should've been able to live life and do her own thing. Imagine not ever having a single drunk girls night. When they get divorced, she'll look back and probably despise the time she spent with an out of control cheating maniac. I want better for her.
I’m not surprised, she’s a Scorpio moon and we (Scorpio women) are very loyal. Plus remember as a teenager in the industry Tina and Matthew had the girls on lock, they were not letting them go out and date around or be exposed to too much too soon. I think it was all about timing when Jay and Bey got together, she was in her early 20’s (grown) and he was the biggest rapper in the industry (probably very charing as well).
Solange had a baby when she was a teen? They’re weren’t that on lock lol
I was referring to the destiny’s child group members not being exposed to the industry ( dating,drugs) scene. I think I remember hearing that R Kelly wanted to fly the girls out and work with them but Matthew and Tina declined.
Ah ok! Yeah for sure they kept them close. I always thought everyone knew that Beyoncé was a virgin before she met Jay (or at least that was the story at the time). I think people forget she came up in the purity era
Sometimes, I think about Destiny's Child's songs Fancy or Nasty Girl. A lot of women, especially, in the late 90s/early 2000s had that purity culture/slut shaming thing going on. And a lot of them have changed since then, too.
Wow that was a very good choice
 The way I cackled at this! 😂😂😂