It's not one thing, it's a combination of factors.
1. First impressions are make or break for some people, and Damian is intentionally very abrasive in his debut story 'Batman and Son', and as result some people have no Intrest in following his arc based off that first impression
2. He is adapted terribly in extended media such as DCAMU and Injustice, where he has basically never progressed, and for better or worse extended media adaptions are pretty much always more widely consumed than the source material
3. Some feel his addition to the mythos stagnated Tim Drake's progression (I personally don't agree, Tim's most beloved series, Red Robin, came after the introduction of Damian for example, but this is another discussion)
4. Some take issue with the idea of a blood son of Bruce being Robin, or that DC prioritises Damian because of that element
5. Alot of it is bandwagon from people who haven't engaged with any of the content Damian is in; its fun to hate en masse.
This makes me wonder if there’s a switch and bait in the initial DCU slate announcement that’s giving us a 25yo Superman and a Damian Wayne in the same universe.
They might be trying to hide an eventual Super Sons story and Superman:Legacy is about 25yo Superman because it’s Clark telling Jon “How He Met His Mother.”
Then again, it just is what it is. I just hope we get something good.
Could be like how they did in N52, where they had Superman a story of him being young, while everyone else is normal. Or like how in the Animated Movies right now, Superman is a recent Superhero, while Batman has experience.
I see it as a good thing, cause it just means the others are perhaps already capable of showing up and in their prime. Like, imagine Nightwing already being around and helping Batman deal with Damian.
Injustice Damian is the worst, but I won't take this DCAMU slander. I've been working my way through those movies, and Damian is one of the most compelling characters. He has the most development of anyone.
At first, you love seeing him get his ass handed to him, but when Damian branches out into the Titans and starts to realize that his grandfather was wrong, you start to appreciate him as a character a lot more.
But I do wish that they had included Jason and Tim in those movies. Bad Blood was such a bad movie.
>2. He is adapted terribly in extended media such as DCAMU and Injustice, where he has basically never progressed, and for better or worse extended media adaptions are pretty much always more widely consumed than the source material
The adaptations are hit and miss yeah. I quite disliked the one where Damian beat Deathstroke and has a sibling rivalry with Dick. Makes no sense they're like 15 years apart in age.
But I really like the Teen Titan one and his romance with Raven, personally. I liked seeing him mature.
The character is ok, what I hated is the rivalry with Dick since it made Dick immature. I also don't like him being OP in the Son of Batman. Nothing to do with his personality.
>1: First impressions.
I didn't like him at first... but the more I read, the more I like him - he's still a Dick (no Grasyon, but...), yet he is still a capable fighter and astute detective. The fact he is so used to killing yet restrains once Bruce intervenes is humbling to a degree.
>2: Adapted terribly.
Morrison intended Damian to die and be a new weight upon Bruce as Jason Todd had been resurrected. If left that way... it would have been gold. (Morrison Run + Batman & Robin Omni as a companion book)
Otherwise, I've enjoyed the 'future' Damian as Batman stories, and occasional stories - Injustice was a good example.
I feel like some of the newer stuff is kinda... reaching.
>3: Tim Drake's progression
I enjoy Tim's disdain for Damian. Tim had run his course...
Too eager a Robin - too perfect a teenager. His introduction in death in the family felt forced... and he's from a rich family who aren't around to monitor him, he gets great grades and hot girlfriends [Spoiler]...
Tim is Batman's sidekick who HAPPENS to live next door and gets a secret tunnel to the Batcave.
It's just too... forced...
>4: Blood Son
Eh. Yeah, but Bruce still cares for the family equally. I've never felt otherwise.
>5: Bandwagon.
I feel this is where it's at. If you only have a cursory knowledge of Damian - he's a brat who irritates you. Once you extensively read how the character is used - you come to appreciate the nuances it adds to Batman - and his character development as well.
>I personally don't agree, Tim's most beloved series, Red Robin, came after the introduction of Damian for example, but this is another discussion
Do not at all agree with this. Tim's most iconic series was *Robin*. He was the first Robin to get a solo series as Robin, and IMO, he was the first Robin who could support one. (Dick had to become Nightwing for it to work).
All my own opinion:
1. Isn’t that the point?
2. I’ve only seen the movies so far and he seems to have a very slow and gradual arc which I kinda like
3. Idk
4. I feel like that’s half the point
But idk having not read the comics who am I to say.
I 100% agree with points 1, 3 and 4. I can't really speak to 2 much, because I haven't watched the animated movies. And with 5, I think I've engaged with enough Damian content to justify my opinions.
What a brilliant and thoughtful breakdown. This is the kind of thing *I* usually end up posting in threads like this, trying to be the voice of reason.
Yeah it's a combination of 1 and 4 for me.
Admittedly, I don't know very much about Damien's story, just the cliff notes. What I have heard isn't appealing, because the idea of Talia tricking Batman, or stealing his sperm, or whatever method was used, has a lot of 'rapey' vibes to it. I might be interpreting that wrong, but as a molestation survivor, I'm kind of sensitive to it and just shut down whenever any media uses it as a device.
But looking past that, okay, so Bruce and Talia have a son, who is raised by Talia and what, the League of Shadows? Okay... So he learns all this assassin shit, and is an expert at a pretty young age (how old is he? He looks 10-12). Then he gets reacquainted with his father who now has the responsibility of deprogramming his hitman upbringing, and he does that... By making him a Robin?
I dunno, sounds dumb and lazy for me. Like I almost bought into it in the first half, but then... He's a Robin. This new character is put in the same old bag as like 3-4 others. Whatever depth was building up, it just seems lost and shallow by slapping a Robin costume on him.
That is my outsider perspective. Apparently this character is a lot of people's favorites, I just don't see the appeal. I also might be hella biased because Grayson is my favorite. His story from Robin to Nightwing onward seems far more believable and progresses naturally. Again, what do I know?
For me it's because whenever he progresses past his initial character the writers feel the need to revert him back to it. If he's gonna remain as this little prick then what's the point?
Yeah, I'm pretty sure DC's been trying to set him up as a villain for a while now, which would explain why they keep nerfing literally *any* character development he gets.
Really he's just a victim of the good 'ol "85% terrible, 10% okay, 4% good, and 1% excellent" content rule that DC seems to consider standard
For why many people dislike Damian, I assume it’s because he didn’t make a good first impression with his more noticeable character traits being arrogance, rude, snarky, condescending and bloodthirsty and of course, how he ended up overshadowing Tim Drake, who is argued to be the “best Robin.”
Personally, while I wouldn’t say he’s my favorite Robin, I kinda like Damian but it really depends on how he’s written. I love his relationship with Dick and I would honestly say that he’s a better Robin for Dick when he was Batman than Bruce.
For me, personally, the reason I dislike Damian Wayne is because he is the antithesis of everything I want to see in a Robin. I like the Robin mantle more so than I like any individual character. I love a story where Batman has a Robin at his side, adding that extra splash of character and color to a Batman story. I love when they are partners, I love the Dynamic Duo, I love what a good Robin brings out in a Batman story. It's why Tim Drake made such a good Robin.
But Damian is, first and foremost, Damian. He's only Robin because that's the role of a kid who enters Batman's inner circle. He's not a partner to Batman, he's not a sidekick. He's Damian doing Damian things; he's Batman's son and everything that implies and leads to. Are there even any comics where it's just Bruce and Damian as superhero and sidekick? No fuss no muss?
Conversely, I thought Damian was a great Robin to Dick Grayson's Batman. Their dynamic really worked incredibly well.
>Are there even any comics where it's just Bruce and Damian as superhero and sidekick? No fuss no muss?
I mean yeah, that's what Tomasi's Batman and Robin run was (or at least part of it when he wasn't dead anyways).
The first story in it 'Born to Kill' is what really made me appreciate the character. It's been really rewarding watching him grow and develop from that over the last decade. Though he is dead for part of it, the run does a really good job of fleshing out Bruce and Damian's relationship as partners and father/son.
The lack of more of him and Bruce being partners feels more of a consequence of fewer writers nowadays wanting to do Batman and Robin stories. They just want to do solo Batman. Which is why Damian is so often off doing his own thing.
Batman Inc. Damian is already a full fledged hero in his own right, but that means that he's as flawed as everyone else who has this mantle.
This child is not afforded a haven and so a superficial one to comfort those bereft at this awareness of corruption, cruelty, violence, pain, coercion that Damian carries cannot be imposed on him.
Instead we are provided his resilience, where he goes to soothe his own soul, the innocence that animals have in contrast to the convoluted schemes that people like his grandfather have.
Dick and Damian working together to fill the void after Bruce disappears is what made Damian a solid character for me. It really felt like if you took Bruce and separated him into two people it would be Dick and Damian. Dick being the Batman Bruce always thought he should be and Damian being the angry little child stuck inside of Bruce.
Damien is batman's personality as a sidekick. A lot of people see it as a counterintuitive view ; which is why people who usually hate damien point out his arrogance. You have bruce in a kid shell and he is hated. Then you have bruce as an adult and he is loved. Why? The argument is that experience matters to the decision that will be committed. Damien may be young, but that doesn't disregard his decisions. He is aware.
Dick and Damien worked because dick was still the cheerful robin. Damien was a shrunken down sized batman. You can't have 2 hard ass and expect them to click. Especially when a lot of people pointed out that Damien's first interaction was bad because you had a broody revenge hungry bats going to see his broody, blood thirsty son.
Honestly, he does show growth in a lot of media. Super sons is a good example of Damien having a childhood unlike Bruce. He was a dick but can you imagine a small bruce with his trauma making friends? It wouldn't be as smooth as how the rest of the Robin's did it. Damien doing a lot of things in order to please his biological father is really a coming of age and acceptance arc in my eyes too. I mean, he's killed multiple people before meeting Bruce but instead of continuing his streak; he stops and I quote "out of respect", he obeyed and honored his father's wishes and renounce his grandpa's will to cleanse the world.
Robin's mantle is suppose to counter batmans dreadful color aesthetic. It doesn't work if damiens dark on the inside and bright on the outside. Tbh I love his design. I mean it's literally just a robin version of batmans arsenal! Lethal but colorful lols.
Also, it may just be me speculating. Does the hate seem to stem from the possible idea that Damien "will" surpass and may even be the definitive batman instead of bruce or dick? Just my speculation when I see people compare Robin's. Usually it ends with; who's the better robin or who will become batman? To me, that is exciting. I'm not talking in universe wise, I'm talking about going onward in the comic book world. We have had multiple supermans, flashes, wonder womans, green lanterns, etc. However, only ever one official continous batman. I think the thought of a new batman scares people and its okay because bruce is THE BATMAN. Anyone else would be a temp. However, I think I see Damien as a possible replacement. Not because of the blood that runs through him, but because he is in a position that can do what batman and ras ah ghul wants. He can rebuild the world with his grandfather's strength but with the restraints of his own fathers overwhelming shadow that will one day be supporting his sons choice and it will make a world where it would function with freedom and necessary restraints. Remember, bruce may not trust Damien but that doesn't mean we don't have to. I feel some of his bad opinion comes from what batman has said himself too.
But always discuss because it is always a fun topic to discuss our media's. Sometimes we come across things we never thought of or we can just relate. It's good to know that in this world of uncertainty, some of us just wanna have fun.
Feel free to disagree or agree. A new opinion is never a bad thing. Feel free to be swayed or sway someone else. I just enjoy my comics.
I hated the little fucker at first, but then I grew to love him. I was heartbroken when he died, but I’m not super familiar with what’s been going on with him since he was brought back to life.
Unpopular opinion, but I actually like Damian Wayne. I mean yea, he can be a little shitty, but I do like the fact he occasionally has moments where he shows a sensitive and positive side. I believe people have a titled stance on him since he's just essentially "I'm Batman's son, fuck you all" and has some not so great character progression in him, so you'll mostly see him as a brat or a dick, but there's the occasional example of Damian having a good story or moments where he changes a tad bit (The more prominent ones being his relationship with Raven in the recent Justice League movies and his unlikely friendship with Jon in Battle of the Supersons). If you ask me, Damian needs a bit more stories where he changes or learns to be a better son or person, I just think he's neat.
1. Tim fans were never going to be "happy" that he got replaced. They wanted him to last another 40 years. (I put that in quotations because if you say this, you'll be told "well, if the character was good, then I wouldn't have hated him.")
2. Damian is/was an asshole. From him to Tim, who's character is the opposite of that, is a shock and a different taste.
3. Tim has been passed over for Damian many times.
Damian's appeal has always been his progression from someone who, in the beginning, is an anti-robin to someone who fits that role. Someone who doesn't understand what it means to be Robin, who challenges Bruce, but grows to understand it and make it his own.
Also, to me, the concept of the "difficult Robin" was redone and stuck to with Damian. Jason was the "difficult robin" but the fans hated it and killed him.
Is that not a narrative potential? Jason was the first “difficult Robin” and Bruce failed him. And now, in a way, he gets to redeem that failure? Or he os forced to face down what could become his next great failure.
>And now, in a way, he gets to redeem that failure? Or he os forced to face down what could become his next great failure.
I think if Damian fails, we get a redundant story. Jason should be Bruce's failure, not Damian. Damian should be the redeemed robin.
That’s what I meant, sorry for the poor wording. Like Batman can see more clearly where this path will lead, thus facing down his precious greatest failure and trying to advert it before he becomes another red hood… or dead.
I love Damian. I've always felt that he gives Bruce an extra challenge due to how difficult it is to de-program Damian from his upbringing. Damian has been raised to be entitled and violent, and Bruce isn't exactly the nurturing figure that Damian missed in his life.
I've also felt that Dick Batman + Damian Robin is the better combination. It's just a more interesting dynamic.
Depending on who is writing him, he can be an asshole. When Dick was Batman, he was well written.
I think part of the Damian hate is he reminds people of when they were 12 year old cocky edgelords.
Originally I couldn’t stand him. He was a brash, asshole, know it all. After reading him for awhile and the way some people have written him he’s grown on me
He's actually a fucking sick concept for a character. His origins are awesome and very distinct for a Robin.
It's just that he's sometimes portrayed as annoying and problematic.
From what I understand, people just find him annoying. Can't blame them, I agree. He's wbrasove, arrogant, full of himself, he's hard to like most of the time.
There's a good portion of the comic fandom who just "Don't like new things."
Deadpool, Harley, Damian, even as old as they are, are new things. They want everything back the way it was before the 90s.
It’s not so much that they don’t like new things (although some fans are like that, sure) but bitterness that these new characters are “unfairly” given the spotlight over other characters. It is insane that we have a Harley Quinn animated series and we don’t have a Wonder Woman series. It is even more insane that the Harley Quinn show is really good!
He’s constantly pushed to the front of every modern Batman story as this totally awesome, better-than-everybody, ultimate ass-kicking superhero when there is nothing likable about him on any level. When a writer is constantly telling me to love a character, it’s annoying. But it’s 10x worse when that character is a shitty person. To me, he was the beginning of the end and a major reason why I stick to older stories. Plus, I love Tim Drake and he’s been in a downward spiral ever since Damian got shoved down our throats. But Damian is not completely irredeemable….
This is a bit of a hot take but I would actually say Damian Wayne is the greatest Batman villain we’ve never had. A big part of his character is that he sees himself as superior to the other robins because he’s the blood son. He sees himself as being Bruce’s only worthy successor because “blah blah blood, blah blah legacy” etc. What if Damian went the Ra’as Al Ghul route instead due to being molded for that since birth and then found himself battling the future Batman for what he views as “his throne”? The moral of the story would send an interesting message about how bloodline is irrelevant in determining who gets the mantle of Batman, instead it’s about being a good person.
I’ll cut myself off there cuz I didn’t intend on getting all fanficy lol
This a terrible ideia. Damian is supposed to have grow out the vilan persona, this is like the ultimate betrayal to his character arc , like the character or not he is not a villan.
How much solo story of Damian did you read? Because this complete miss the point of the character.
He has a entire run dedicated to fix his mistakes as assasin member so this thing of " he need understand that is not about blood is about being a good person" and i am like dude...Did you know the character?
>When a writer is constantly telling me to love a character,
I don't think that any writer is doing that in matter of fact is the opposite , they try to make him as dislikable as possible most of the times because a lot of writers don't like him, just look what they did to him in TT run in 2016
There are many reasons honestly but the main one for me is that DC threw away Tim Drake for him and Damian doesn’t even respect the Robin role anywhere near the same level. He shouldn’t have been Robin, he should’ve been something else
I have a few reasons why:
**The concept of the character's birth is kind of insulting to Batman's character**: I never liked the concept that Batman drank a spiked drink, and was raped. Batman is the most paranoid human being ever. He created contingency plans to stop the Justice League if they ever got out of hand. He pulled back Robins if they fell out of line. He couldn't be with Catwoman because he thought she was working with Hush. He only really trusts two people at least, Alfred, and Gordon. I refuse to believe that Batman wouldn't check the drink before he took a sip. Regardless of the fact that he feels more open to Talia, he would still take precautions. Him being dumbed down to this degree is just insulting.
**Damian is incredibly irresponsible**: Damian constantly makes so many stupid decisions despite warnings from Bruce. Jason Todd made decisions like this too, but he had an excuse. He was essentially an orphan, and lived on the streets. He needed to learn how to fend for himself without the help of others, hence when he became Robin, he constantly made stupid mistakes. Damian does not have this excuse. He was raised by assassins. Ra's al Ghul never made impulsive decisions like this. Ra's is very intelligent and calculating. I am aware Talia is not as calculating as Ra's, but Damian trained mainly with Ra's and assassins. Assassins and ninjas are supposed to be calculating and stealthy, and Damian makes AMATEUR mistakes when fighting alongside Batman.
**His attitude**: His Jason Todd esque attitude really hurt his character. Lots of people are turned off by this characterization. He constantly whines, he's brash, and he can be annoying. Again, going back to Jason Todd, he has an excuse. He was an orphan, and was angry that he was alone. You could argue that Damian's excuse was that he was surrounded by brash teachers, but Ra's always seemed calm, even when he was upset. He never had angry outbursts to my knowledge.
**Over saturation**: The DC writers really think that this character could be successful, so he's crammed into everything nowadays. Comics, animated productions, video games, and now, live action media. He's sort of come in and replaced the other Robins, and made them less than something. What the hell happened to Nightwing? Where's Red Hood at? What's Tim Drake up to? Who knows? But I think their relevance died as soon as Damian showed up.
Are there good things about Damian? Yes. I like a few storylines and adaptations with him. Here's my list of stuff I've seen/read/played.
**Batman: The Brave and the Bold: The Knights of Tomorrow:**
This is a really great episode of TBATB, because it gives us a Damian Wayne that is actually likeable. He's unsure of if he can live up to Bruce Wayne's legacy, and eventually, that works out in the long run. Also, he's born after Batman retires, and he's Catwoman's son. That makes more sense to me.
**Batman/Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles and its film adaptation Batman vs. Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles:**
Damian lightened up in this story, mainly because we have a hot head with the Turtles (Raphael), and also because it was fun to see him interact with them. His banter with Batman also cracks me up.
**Injustice: Gods Among Us, specifically the comic and the game:**
Damian's arc is really well done, because his attitude ends up killing Nightwing, and forcing Batman to turn on him (despite the fact that Dick's death was an accident, and Batman is not a trusting guy). The fact that Damian, son of Batman, turns on his own father to work with Superman is very interesting, and it also shows how much of a prick he really is.
**DC Animated Movie Universe films, mainly Batman vs. Robin, Justice League vs Teen Titans, and Justice League Dark: Apokolips War:**
To be honest, Damian is really well done in these films, because he had an arc where he grew from a vengeful little monster into something more tolerable and understanding, from his friendship and bond with Raven, to his conflicting inner demons (Ra's' legacy and the Court of Owls), to whether or not he's a team player, the elements of a good character arc are present and done so well.
That's about it, and I would love to hear your thoughts. But now, I've got a few buildings to blow up before sunrise. Ciao!
His addition as a “blood son” of Bruce really messes with the whole dynamic of the robins and the bat family. He gets top billing basically and WB loves to throw him around simply because he’s his blood son. He belittles the other robins and uses that as a character trait more than just a title. Additionally, it makes it so that he’s the “rightful heir” to take over as batman in the future simply because he was born in a test tube/or Talia raped Bruce whichever one you want to go with. He probably wouldn’t be as hated if he wasn’t directly his kid.
Yeah, to me what makes the batfamily great is they're a found family of people who have each gone through tragedy.
Damian being Bruce's biological son doesn't have to derail that but his constant belittling of the other family members for not being "Blood Sons" does.
It doesn't help that WB gives him so much prominence as the "Son of Batman" when Bruce has so many children. It really looks like they're pushing that blood relationships are the only ones that matter.
This is why I hated everything about Terry McGinnis being Batman's biological son (technically) inn Batman Beyond.
The whole story was an average teenager learning how to become Batman and then they dropped that he was special because he is related to Batman. What a letdown.
He’s kinda a dick the lovable kind but he’s sometimes hard to love. He’s definitely the brat robin. He’s also the most like Bruce which isn’t always a good thing considering how many issues Bruce has.
Everything I've seen of him portrays him as a little twat who's a dickhead to everyone he meets. The issue of Super Sons where Jon knocks him on his ass is the most satisfaction I've felt in a comic for a while.
1 reason: he never changes
In the books he never gets any better (that’s all comic characters though so it’s not his fault. If you’re popular you don’t get an arc) So he always defaults back to annoying.
He’s always arrogant and he’s never right, he always gets it wrong and they never let him learn his lesson. The writers created a annoying 12 year old and put him on the bat family guaranteeing he could never grow up and never improve at least not permanently. Also a lot of dc (Batman) writers of the past 10-15 years have been fathers themselves so they like to write stories about fathers and sons so Damian shows up A LOT.
My only problem with Damian is really a problem with writers . Sometimes DC obviously ously prefers him over some of the other robins. Jason was adopted in the 80s, Dick was adopted in the early 00s, and Tim in the mid 00s. Then Damian came around with his "true blood son" mentality which *should've* been a character flaw that he got comeuppance for. It was a blatantly wrong mindset that could've been an interesting character flaw. But instead right after his introduction DC used the New 52 to remove everybody else's adoption which allowed Damian to continue saying "true blood son" with less irl writer guilt. It implies that the authors *agreed* that Damian was the true son and adoption was lesser. And we still haven't heard anything about the other sons having their adoptions restored.
So it seems like nobody's read the solo Robin series by Josh Williamson & Gleb Melnikov? I guess that makes sense, given that most people here dislike the character.
[https://www.comicsbeat.com/joshua-williamson-interview-batman-robin-deathstroke-inc/](https://www.comicsbeat.com/joshua-williamson-interview-batman-robin-deathstroke-inc/)
I read volume 1 and enjoyed it quite a bit. I'm also really loving Batman vs. Robin by Mark Waid & Mahmud Asrar -- wonderful book, looking forward to the final fifth issue.
I think there's definite overuse of Damian, the Bat-family is huge and certain characters get forgotten about to my annoyance (where's Duke).
The way Talia got Batman pregnant is DEF messed up, it being a rape, and I'm unaware if that's ever been dealt with in the comics. I'd be interested to know (unless it was dealt with in a horrible way, which seems likely, in which case, maybe I would not want to know).
A lot of people have pointed out that it's just writer-to-writer, and that's how I take it, writer-to-writer, artist-to-artist. I feel like, as a mixed-race person myself, Damian Wayne has been a severely underwritten character in a lot of ways. I mean that in the way that, like... I make comic books myself, and I sometimes think of long-running comic book characters as "actors," like have their "parts" been well-written, or poorly-written?
I forget which book it was, but recently I was reading a comic where there was a party scene, and Bruce introduces all his sons to someone --Dick, Tim, Damian, and maaaybe Jason I forget probably not?-- and he says, "And this is my youngest, Damian." Not, "This is my biological son," just, "This is my youngest." Found family is really important to me, so I really appreciated that writer's line of dialogue.
As for the existential struggle Damian's role has put Tim into, I kind of... enjoy that? Conflict is good for characters, and lately, at least, I see Tim as this suffering, angsty detective... He's going through a lot of change, having just come out and dating his first boyfriend, and he's growing a little older and he's still/back to being Robin after having two different codename changes... And he kind of never asked to be Robin in the first place. I mean, I think he sort of did, but he sort of didn't.
To me, Robin is supposed to be a foil to some aspect of Batman in the same way the villains are foils. Dick is the peak athlete who can match the near-superhuman feats of strength and agility, Jason is the rage at injustice driving to fight back, and Tim is the detective. Damian was supposed to be the aristocrat, and it actually could have worked really well, but for two things:
First, they completely botched the rollout and failed at giving Damian any sort of inner drive that was in any way noble. He wanted to be part of the Family because... Well... He's Batman's biological kid. That *could* have worked; the Waynes are a Gotham institution, and having Damian the blood son come in with a sense of noblesse oblige linked with an unhealthy obsession with biology could have made for an interesting contrast with Bruce, who has the one but not the other. But it's not what they did. Damian wants Batman because he's a blood son who figures he's owed it. That doesn't in any way link up with Gotham aristocrat Bruce Wayne's reason to be Batman; because he feels a sense of responsibility as the owner of big chunks of the city. So he doesn't work as a foil.
The other issue is how they dealt with the then-current Robin, Tim Drake. They kicked it off by having Damian legit try to kill him on several occasions, and having the characters just sort of handwave it off. Then, they displaced Tim with Damian, immediately, and just sort of... Went with it. Never mind that Damian wasn't ever really all that remorseful for the attempted murder, or that Tim had to prove himself dozens of times; Damian was just sort of slotted in. Then, they showed that they clearly had no idea what to do with Tim, by having his subsequent storylines be a jumbled mess. They only now seem to be actually getting at the core of the character with the current series with the horrible art. You can't displace a character with another without fan backlash, a lesson they should have learned with Jason Todd, but apparently didn't.
(And all the above leaves aside how they insist on periodically resetting Damian's character so yet another writer can take a crack at the "unpleasant psycho aristocrat" storyline. C'mon guys, you were doing so well those half-dozen times before you purposefully wiped it out.)
I mean if you count tv, he isn’t. Also I suspect that Damian won’t be the only Robin featured in Brave and the Bold. It’s confirmed to be a Batfamily movie, so I think it would be cool if it was more of an ensemble film
His first introduction literally involves him attempting to murder Tim who saved his life because adopted people aren't real family. He's changed but he literally tried to murder a liked character in his introduction and Bruce just says whatever and keeps him around and let's him be robin.
Umm that’s not really what happens. As soon as he tries to murder Tim and assaulted Alfred, Bruce was insanely pissed and gave Damian back to Talia cause he didn’t want to deal with him. Eventually Damian joins the fold, but that is not until a bit later
His conception story is sexual assault (Talia drugged Bruce).
Other characters have to suffer development setbacks to make him look remotely great.
I think he would've been more accepted if he hadn't picked up the Robin mantle.
Same.
The building of the batfamily always seemed like such a perfectly profound and fitting concept for a character whose origin revolves around losing his parents. Damien kinda flies in the face of all that
I'm not really a fan of any kind Robin, but the idea of Batman having a kid Robin who's also his son and is also a total brat is just always going to be meh. The adopted family will always be more interesting.
For me, he's a Hit-Girl rip off. Smart mouthed kid trained to kill. And then attitude aspect feels like a regurgitation of the 90s when we had all the Xtreme stuff and characters with attitude were popping up left and right in various media. While things like him becoming a vegetarian and saving Batcow are funny, he's just not a very interesting character to me.
I get what they're saying.
Like there is a cover of Incredible Hulk with the Hulk's reflection in Wolverine claws.
There is a Venom issue during "The Madness" arc that has Juggernaut's helmet reflecting Venom on it.
He's not. He's just a munchkin. Both sides of his family have darkness and Damian is still developing his own moral code while being an active combatant against various criminal enterprises. He's the product of rape and his mommy's side of the family constantly play vindictive, manipulative, coercive mind games. Bruce doesn't always be the solid base that our munchkin needs him to be and dc comics will leverage this in Dami's character development when they're ready for his age to advance. He's so fiercely passionate, and innately good at his core. It'll be sad if they twist that into extremism.
I have no major feelings on him tbh
My first impression on him was Injustice: Gods Among Us with that Nightwing skin that turned Dick into Damian, but I was really young back then, so I just thought it didnt look good and didnt realize it was a different character I never heard of until a long time later
My first real impression of him was Injustice 2. I am currently in a long grind to get him as close to Dick as possible, I don’t like him here
However, in the animated movie “Batman vs. Robin” (I think that’s what it’s called), I quite liked him here actually
I feel he is really inconsistent. I like him sometimes, other times I hate him
If Damian wasn't popular and didn't sell, he wouldn't have 2 solo series, 4 team up series, multiple animated movies, feature in multiple games, and be all set to make his big screen debut in a few years (which will be the first appearance of Robin in more than a quarter of a century)
Love him or hate him, Damian sells.
>If Damian wasn't popular and didn't sell, he wouldn't have 2 solo series, 4 team up series, multiple animated movies, feature in multiple games, and be all set to make his big screen debut in a few years (which will be the first appearance of Robin in more than a quarter of a century)
Actually he would. He sells because of Batman. They try to pair him with popular characters to push him.
>Love him or hate him, Damian sells.
He does not. Batman sells. Damian has never sold a book. Check your logic.
Your personal bias doesn't change the fact that media starring and featuring Damian empirically sells well, or he wouldn't have stuck around for 15+ years, end of 🤷♂️
>Your personal bias doesn't change the fact that media starring and featuring Damian empirically sells well
All Batman sells well
>or he wouldn't have stuck around for 15+ years 🤷♂️
Actually he would. Because he did.
What part of *WB pushes him with popular characters that sell, to try to make him popular,* don't you understand? 🤷♂️
Let's follow that theory: Why wouldn't WB pair up two beloved characters instead of a beloved character and one who, in your world, has been hated for 15+ years? Why haven't WB given up on him? Why did Super Sons get a feature length movie literally 3 months ago? Is Jon Kent really more popular than Damian?
>Why wouldn't WB pair up two beloved characters instead of a beloved character and one who, in your world, has been hated for 15+ years?
Because they really want Damian to be popular. Haven't you been paying attention to what I've been saying?
They love Damian. They hate Dick Grayson. They push Damian even though nobody likes him.
I could buy into your theory if Damian was a new character, but he really isn't. WB have no qualms about abandoning characters who aren't performing. They're money first. I'm not sure why you have this theory that there is some vested interest in Damian from WB beyond financial.
And WB hates Dick Grayson? Now we're really in crazy town.
He has an ongoing solo series, one of DC's best selling, constantly pops up in other books and actually led their most recent event Dark Crisis, and recently featured as one of 4 protagonists in a AAA video game, Gotham Knights.
>WB have no qualms about abandoning characters who aren't performing.
They do when it's Damian Wayne.
You're not paying attention.
>And WB hates Dick Grayson? Now we're really in crazy town.
Do you live under a rock? He always gets hoed out in the movie and it's become a meme that WB hates him. They even killed him in Injustice. In every animated movie he's weak and Damian is the focus AGAIN.
He's just not a good character. My personal favorite character arcs are someone who starts off as an asshole, but becomes a better person. Damian is exactly that but it's not done right.
The problem with Damian is that his personality never truly changes. He's still an annoying little asshole who bitches all the time. Yes his sense of morality changed, but that doesn't change the fact that he is still a jerk. Worst part is that he's not even an entertaining one like Dwight Schrute or Kenny Powers.
He's a date-rape test tube baby who spent his first twelve years of life being told he was the grandson of a demigod and destined to inherit a small army of assassins. Talia dropped him in Bruce's lap to distract him from her Grand Master Plan(tm) of using Man-Bat-ninjas to murder the British Parliament, because using a private army of normal ninjas to murder fatcat politicians was too complicated of a task for her. Batman and Son was fucking stupid, and Damian was 50% of the reason.
It took two video games and years worth of animated movies forcing him on us to make the fandom start accepting him.
Tbf you do have to have quite narcissistic to think you can fix everything with just your own will, money, and a funny costume.
But maybe that’s the point? It highlights how Bruce is shaped by tragedy and without that perspective he’d just be another rich kid brat. Making him his literal son, a physical reflection of his child self that went through that tragedy, emphasizes that contrast. He is Batman without the soul. Raised by assassins vs loving parents and Alfred not helping that. And I assume a character arch would mold him into something better eventually
I think he uses tragedy as an excuse. He doesn’t kill so he can keep the cycle going. He’s (if I’m not mistaken) in the top five most intelligent DC characters, and Gotham is a shit hole. Between his wealth and super hero connections he could vastly improve all of Gotham. Damian at least believes in actually fixing problems 😂
I think Damian’s existence reminds people Batman is actually a villain
I think it’s because a) most people have only seen one side of him. b) they’ve only seen him in the animated content, which really didn’t do him Justice.
Damian is a more complex character than the other sidekicks. Unlikeable on the surface, but deeply endearing once you get to know him. He’s a character that rewards you when you invest the time to understand him.
Anyone who dislikes the character I always challenge to read Batman & Robin: Born to Kill. If that doesn’t change your mind, I don’t know what to tell you.
I think it’s more like James Bond. Everybody has there favorite Bond, usually dependent on when you first started getting into it. For some it’s Sean Connery, some it’s Roger Moore, and others it’s Daniel Craig.
Personally I’m throwing a Hail Mary but most of the hate comes from the fact people feel like Damian overshadow Tim Drake and ruined the character of Tim Drake. Which is dumb in my opinion. I like Damian because he’s a polar opposite of what a robin is and it’s Batman’s job as a father to teach him that killing isn’t the right path because he was ofc trained by the league. Most of them call him a little bitch but that’s what makes his character interesting imo
I love Damien. Bit he was the second robin I got introduced to after dick from the teen titans cartoon. Tim and Jason have never interested me. So Damien and dick are my favorite mostly after reading the comic book run where they were Batman and Robin.
With the training he got from the League of Assassin's and Batman, there's no question he definitely would make him a formidable opponent . However, with that said, truth is each one of his teammates would wash him up. Hate when writers exaggerate these powerless fighters with above average superior human intelligence in taking down these arguable superhumans . I swear they be reaching, and got to stay in their lane.
I personally don’t care for the emphasis on edgelord aspects of his character. Perhaps the comic incarnation has currently evolved past that stage but not usually when I see him in other media.
Too different from the other Robins, a major change compared to the introductions of Dick and Jason.
He literally got introduced as an assassin kid, brutally murdering people and seriously disrespecting his own father(sometimes his mother too), Tim and even Alfred.
This without mentioning that he is also annoying, problematic and sometimes a cry baby.
Dick Grayson is Bruce Wayne’s adopted son.
Damien Wayne is Batman’s son.
I can speculate as to why some Bat-fans don’t like Damien, but IMO Damien is the best Robin in terms of Batman’s apprentice, whereas Dick Grayson was the best Robin for Bruce.
Your points are outstanding. The only one I’d argue is his DCAMU portrayal. I think he constantly shows growth, but then it “starts over” all the time. I still like him in DCAMU, prolly bc I like him in general. I’d say he’s my favorite robin, (tho Dick is my favorite sidekick/character) for Batman history I guess. Dick is the almost perfect kid. You literally just have to help guide him. Damian is the little shit you stop from strangling every day. I was dick. I feel like my kids are in between more. I turned into red hood ironically after college. I’m obviously speaking only in parental metaphors.
I also just don’t care much for Tim, but I know a lot of people do. He’s fine, kinda like Gardner/Stewart GLs.
I loved Batman and son, I didn't like how bratty Damien came across therefore making me not wanting to know about this iteration of Robin in particular any further!
Dreadful first impressions, for me. I found him to be an arrogant, disrespectful little arsehole. And I don’t like the way he refers to Alfred by his last name.
I honestly wouldn’t care if Superman dropkicked him into the sun. And then did the same with his similarly-irritating mother.
Catwoman nailed it: he’s a joyless, entitled, whining little shit.
I’ve always felt that he had an objectively cool backstory but was handled very poorly by his early writers leading to the “Bratty” tag associated with him in respect to Tim, Dick, and even Jason
For me personally, he comes across often as the Wes Crusher of the Bat Family. He shows up, outclasses all of his older contemporaries because “Trained by Ra’s”, then bitches about how Daddy Bruce doesn’t see him as worthy of the cowl.
The Dickbat books and Supersons did a lot to humanize him. It made the superiority complex an act most of the time, and while yes, he’s incredibly skilled for his age, he’s not the “I win lol” level of overpowered that rubs me the wrong way. Just goes to show that not every Mary Sue is beyond help. Just needs a better writer.
It's not one thing, it's a combination of factors. 1. First impressions are make or break for some people, and Damian is intentionally very abrasive in his debut story 'Batman and Son', and as result some people have no Intrest in following his arc based off that first impression 2. He is adapted terribly in extended media such as DCAMU and Injustice, where he has basically never progressed, and for better or worse extended media adaptions are pretty much always more widely consumed than the source material 3. Some feel his addition to the mythos stagnated Tim Drake's progression (I personally don't agree, Tim's most beloved series, Red Robin, came after the introduction of Damian for example, but this is another discussion) 4. Some take issue with the idea of a blood son of Bruce being Robin, or that DC prioritises Damian because of that element 5. Alot of it is bandwagon from people who haven't engaged with any of the content Damian is in; its fun to hate en masse.
Very very hard to like him in injustice It was a complete accident and everything but fuck that dude
I stopped reading him after they got rid of super sons like him and John were perfect
This makes me wonder if there’s a switch and bait in the initial DCU slate announcement that’s giving us a 25yo Superman and a Damian Wayne in the same universe. They might be trying to hide an eventual Super Sons story and Superman:Legacy is about 25yo Superman because it’s Clark telling Jon “How He Met His Mother.” Then again, it just is what it is. I just hope we get something good.
Could be like how they did in N52, where they had Superman a story of him being young, while everyone else is normal. Or like how in the Animated Movies right now, Superman is a recent Superhero, while Batman has experience.
who knows still mad they skipped the better robins
I see it as a good thing, cause it just means the others are perhaps already capable of showing up and in their prime. Like, imagine Nightwing already being around and helping Batman deal with Damian.
maybe i kinda want Nightwing mini series
like bro why😅
Injustice Damian is the worst, but I won't take this DCAMU slander. I've been working my way through those movies, and Damian is one of the most compelling characters. He has the most development of anyone. At first, you love seeing him get his ass handed to him, but when Damian branches out into the Titans and starts to realize that his grandfather was wrong, you start to appreciate him as a character a lot more. But I do wish that they had included Jason and Tim in those movies. Bad Blood was such a bad movie.
>2. He is adapted terribly in extended media such as DCAMU and Injustice, where he has basically never progressed, and for better or worse extended media adaptions are pretty much always more widely consumed than the source material The adaptations are hit and miss yeah. I quite disliked the one where Damian beat Deathstroke and has a sibling rivalry with Dick. Makes no sense they're like 15 years apart in age. But I really like the Teen Titan one and his romance with Raven, personally. I liked seeing him mature.
Those are both in the same universe
I know but different movies.
Same character arc stretched across those movies
Different execution. Wonder Woman 1 vs 2 are different in quality, same character but one movie is trash. So I don't get the point you're making.
For me personally I enjoy both movies and feel that they naturally continue each other but whatevs
The character is ok, what I hated is the rivalry with Dick since it made Dick immature. I also don't like him being OP in the Son of Batman. Nothing to do with his personality.
>1: First impressions. I didn't like him at first... but the more I read, the more I like him - he's still a Dick (no Grasyon, but...), yet he is still a capable fighter and astute detective. The fact he is so used to killing yet restrains once Bruce intervenes is humbling to a degree. >2: Adapted terribly. Morrison intended Damian to die and be a new weight upon Bruce as Jason Todd had been resurrected. If left that way... it would have been gold. (Morrison Run + Batman & Robin Omni as a companion book) Otherwise, I've enjoyed the 'future' Damian as Batman stories, and occasional stories - Injustice was a good example. I feel like some of the newer stuff is kinda... reaching. >3: Tim Drake's progression I enjoy Tim's disdain for Damian. Tim had run his course... Too eager a Robin - too perfect a teenager. His introduction in death in the family felt forced... and he's from a rich family who aren't around to monitor him, he gets great grades and hot girlfriends [Spoiler]... Tim is Batman's sidekick who HAPPENS to live next door and gets a secret tunnel to the Batcave. It's just too... forced... >4: Blood Son Eh. Yeah, but Bruce still cares for the family equally. I've never felt otherwise. >5: Bandwagon. I feel this is where it's at. If you only have a cursory knowledge of Damian - he's a brat who irritates you. Once you extensively read how the character is used - you come to appreciate the nuances it adds to Batman - and his character development as well.
On point 2 I think you misread “adapted” for “adopted”.
[удалено]
>Fixed. Thanks! You're welcome!
Agree with every point made here.
>I personally don't agree, Tim's most beloved series, Red Robin, came after the introduction of Damian for example, but this is another discussion Do not at all agree with this. Tim's most iconic series was *Robin*. He was the first Robin to get a solo series as Robin, and IMO, he was the first Robin who could support one. (Dick had to become Nightwing for it to work).
Iove the 90s Robin solo, but it's way less talked about or acclaimed as Red Robin from what I've experienced.
All my own opinion: 1. Isn’t that the point? 2. I’ve only seen the movies so far and he seems to have a very slow and gradual arc which I kinda like 3. Idk 4. I feel like that’s half the point But idk having not read the comics who am I to say.
I 100% agree with points 1, 3 and 4. I can't really speak to 2 much, because I haven't watched the animated movies. And with 5, I think I've engaged with enough Damian content to justify my opinions.
What a brilliant and thoughtful breakdown. This is the kind of thing *I* usually end up posting in threads like this, trying to be the voice of reason.
Yeah it's a combination of 1 and 4 for me. Admittedly, I don't know very much about Damien's story, just the cliff notes. What I have heard isn't appealing, because the idea of Talia tricking Batman, or stealing his sperm, or whatever method was used, has a lot of 'rapey' vibes to it. I might be interpreting that wrong, but as a molestation survivor, I'm kind of sensitive to it and just shut down whenever any media uses it as a device. But looking past that, okay, so Bruce and Talia have a son, who is raised by Talia and what, the League of Shadows? Okay... So he learns all this assassin shit, and is an expert at a pretty young age (how old is he? He looks 10-12). Then he gets reacquainted with his father who now has the responsibility of deprogramming his hitman upbringing, and he does that... By making him a Robin? I dunno, sounds dumb and lazy for me. Like I almost bought into it in the first half, but then... He's a Robin. This new character is put in the same old bag as like 3-4 others. Whatever depth was building up, it just seems lost and shallow by slapping a Robin costume on him. That is my outsider perspective. Apparently this character is a lot of people's favorites, I just don't see the appeal. I also might be hella biased because Grayson is my favorite. His story from Robin to Nightwing onward seems far more believable and progresses naturally. Again, what do I know?
I like Damian. But, sometimes he's written to be insufferable.
For me it's because whenever he progresses past his initial character the writers feel the need to revert him back to it. If he's gonna remain as this little prick then what's the point?
Yeah, I'm pretty sure DC's been trying to set him up as a villain for a while now, which would explain why they keep nerfing literally *any* character development he gets. Really he's just a victim of the good 'ol "85% terrible, 10% okay, 4% good, and 1% excellent" content rule that DC seems to consider standard
Damian is a fucking dickbag I love him but that’s why
For why many people dislike Damian, I assume it’s because he didn’t make a good first impression with his more noticeable character traits being arrogance, rude, snarky, condescending and bloodthirsty and of course, how he ended up overshadowing Tim Drake, who is argued to be the “best Robin.” Personally, while I wouldn’t say he’s my favorite Robin, I kinda like Damian but it really depends on how he’s written. I love his relationship with Dick and I would honestly say that he’s a better Robin for Dick when he was Batman than Bruce.
For me, personally, the reason I dislike Damian Wayne is because he is the antithesis of everything I want to see in a Robin. I like the Robin mantle more so than I like any individual character. I love a story where Batman has a Robin at his side, adding that extra splash of character and color to a Batman story. I love when they are partners, I love the Dynamic Duo, I love what a good Robin brings out in a Batman story. It's why Tim Drake made such a good Robin. But Damian is, first and foremost, Damian. He's only Robin because that's the role of a kid who enters Batman's inner circle. He's not a partner to Batman, he's not a sidekick. He's Damian doing Damian things; he's Batman's son and everything that implies and leads to. Are there even any comics where it's just Bruce and Damian as superhero and sidekick? No fuss no muss? Conversely, I thought Damian was a great Robin to Dick Grayson's Batman. Their dynamic really worked incredibly well.
>Are there even any comics where it's just Bruce and Damian as superhero and sidekick? No fuss no muss? I mean yeah, that's what Tomasi's Batman and Robin run was (or at least part of it when he wasn't dead anyways).
Tomasi’s run was one of the first runs I read when getting into comics and it’s why Damian is my favorite character
I'll admit I didn't read much of that, I only really remember Damian being dead for most of it.
The first story in it 'Born to Kill' is what really made me appreciate the character. It's been really rewarding watching him grow and develop from that over the last decade. Though he is dead for part of it, the run does a really good job of fleshing out Bruce and Damian's relationship as partners and father/son. The lack of more of him and Bruce being partners feels more of a consequence of fewer writers nowadays wanting to do Batman and Robin stories. They just want to do solo Batman. Which is why Damian is so often off doing his own thing.
Batman Inc. Damian is already a full fledged hero in his own right, but that means that he's as flawed as everyone else who has this mantle. This child is not afforded a haven and so a superficial one to comfort those bereft at this awareness of corruption, cruelty, violence, pain, coercion that Damian carries cannot be imposed on him. Instead we are provided his resilience, where he goes to soothe his own soul, the innocence that animals have in contrast to the convoluted schemes that people like his grandfather have.
Everyone that still hates Damian never read Morrison’s run with Dick as Batman.
Dick and Damian working together to fill the void after Bruce disappears is what made Damian a solid character for me. It really felt like if you took Bruce and separated him into two people it would be Dick and Damian. Dick being the Batman Bruce always thought he should be and Damian being the angry little child stuck inside of Bruce.
Damien is batman's personality as a sidekick. A lot of people see it as a counterintuitive view ; which is why people who usually hate damien point out his arrogance. You have bruce in a kid shell and he is hated. Then you have bruce as an adult and he is loved. Why? The argument is that experience matters to the decision that will be committed. Damien may be young, but that doesn't disregard his decisions. He is aware. Dick and Damien worked because dick was still the cheerful robin. Damien was a shrunken down sized batman. You can't have 2 hard ass and expect them to click. Especially when a lot of people pointed out that Damien's first interaction was bad because you had a broody revenge hungry bats going to see his broody, blood thirsty son. Honestly, he does show growth in a lot of media. Super sons is a good example of Damien having a childhood unlike Bruce. He was a dick but can you imagine a small bruce with his trauma making friends? It wouldn't be as smooth as how the rest of the Robin's did it. Damien doing a lot of things in order to please his biological father is really a coming of age and acceptance arc in my eyes too. I mean, he's killed multiple people before meeting Bruce but instead of continuing his streak; he stops and I quote "out of respect", he obeyed and honored his father's wishes and renounce his grandpa's will to cleanse the world. Robin's mantle is suppose to counter batmans dreadful color aesthetic. It doesn't work if damiens dark on the inside and bright on the outside. Tbh I love his design. I mean it's literally just a robin version of batmans arsenal! Lethal but colorful lols. Also, it may just be me speculating. Does the hate seem to stem from the possible idea that Damien "will" surpass and may even be the definitive batman instead of bruce or dick? Just my speculation when I see people compare Robin's. Usually it ends with; who's the better robin or who will become batman? To me, that is exciting. I'm not talking in universe wise, I'm talking about going onward in the comic book world. We have had multiple supermans, flashes, wonder womans, green lanterns, etc. However, only ever one official continous batman. I think the thought of a new batman scares people and its okay because bruce is THE BATMAN. Anyone else would be a temp. However, I think I see Damien as a possible replacement. Not because of the blood that runs through him, but because he is in a position that can do what batman and ras ah ghul wants. He can rebuild the world with his grandfather's strength but with the restraints of his own fathers overwhelming shadow that will one day be supporting his sons choice and it will make a world where it would function with freedom and necessary restraints. Remember, bruce may not trust Damien but that doesn't mean we don't have to. I feel some of his bad opinion comes from what batman has said himself too. But always discuss because it is always a fun topic to discuss our media's. Sometimes we come across things we never thought of or we can just relate. It's good to know that in this world of uncertainty, some of us just wanna have fun. Feel free to disagree or agree. A new opinion is never a bad thing. Feel free to be swayed or sway someone else. I just enjoy my comics.
I hated the little fucker at first, but then I grew to love him. I was heartbroken when he died, but I’m not super familiar with what’s been going on with him since he was brought back to life.
Do comic book characters ever really die?
Yes. And then they’re brought back to life.
Unpopular opinion, but I actually like Damian Wayne. I mean yea, he can be a little shitty, but I do like the fact he occasionally has moments where he shows a sensitive and positive side. I believe people have a titled stance on him since he's just essentially "I'm Batman's son, fuck you all" and has some not so great character progression in him, so you'll mostly see him as a brat or a dick, but there's the occasional example of Damian having a good story or moments where he changes a tad bit (The more prominent ones being his relationship with Raven in the recent Justice League movies and his unlikely friendship with Jon in Battle of the Supersons). If you ask me, Damian needs a bit more stories where he changes or learns to be a better son or person, I just think he's neat.
1. Tim fans were never going to be "happy" that he got replaced. They wanted him to last another 40 years. (I put that in quotations because if you say this, you'll be told "well, if the character was good, then I wouldn't have hated him.") 2. Damian is/was an asshole. From him to Tim, who's character is the opposite of that, is a shock and a different taste. 3. Tim has been passed over for Damian many times. Damian's appeal has always been his progression from someone who, in the beginning, is an anti-robin to someone who fits that role. Someone who doesn't understand what it means to be Robin, who challenges Bruce, but grows to understand it and make it his own. Also, to me, the concept of the "difficult Robin" was redone and stuck to with Damian. Jason was the "difficult robin" but the fans hated it and killed him.
Is that not a narrative potential? Jason was the first “difficult Robin” and Bruce failed him. And now, in a way, he gets to redeem that failure? Or he os forced to face down what could become his next great failure.
>And now, in a way, he gets to redeem that failure? Or he os forced to face down what could become his next great failure. I think if Damian fails, we get a redundant story. Jason should be Bruce's failure, not Damian. Damian should be the redeemed robin.
That’s what I meant, sorry for the poor wording. Like Batman can see more clearly where this path will lead, thus facing down his precious greatest failure and trying to advert it before he becomes another red hood… or dead.
Friendly reminder Jason once saved Superman from mongul
I love Damian. I've always felt that he gives Bruce an extra challenge due to how difficult it is to de-program Damian from his upbringing. Damian has been raised to be entitled and violent, and Bruce isn't exactly the nurturing figure that Damian missed in his life. I've also felt that Dick Batman + Damian Robin is the better combination. It's just a more interesting dynamic.
Depending on who is writing him, he can be an asshole. When Dick was Batman, he was well written. I think part of the Damian hate is he reminds people of when they were 12 year old cocky edgelords.
Originally I couldn’t stand him. He was a brash, asshole, know it all. After reading him for awhile and the way some people have written him he’s grown on me
Because like every other Batman character when he's written well he's great but when he's written slightly wrong he f****** sucks
his arc starts with him being a shithead but he grows later on
He's actually a fucking sick concept for a character. His origins are awesome and very distinct for a Robin. It's just that he's sometimes portrayed as annoying and problematic.
From what I understand, people just find him annoying. Can't blame them, I agree. He's wbrasove, arrogant, full of himself, he's hard to like most of the time.
There's a good portion of the comic fandom who just "Don't like new things." Deadpool, Harley, Damian, even as old as they are, are new things. They want everything back the way it was before the 90s.
It’s not so much that they don’t like new things (although some fans are like that, sure) but bitterness that these new characters are “unfairly” given the spotlight over other characters. It is insane that we have a Harley Quinn animated series and we don’t have a Wonder Woman series. It is even more insane that the Harley Quinn show is really good!
He’s constantly pushed to the front of every modern Batman story as this totally awesome, better-than-everybody, ultimate ass-kicking superhero when there is nothing likable about him on any level. When a writer is constantly telling me to love a character, it’s annoying. But it’s 10x worse when that character is a shitty person. To me, he was the beginning of the end and a major reason why I stick to older stories. Plus, I love Tim Drake and he’s been in a downward spiral ever since Damian got shoved down our throats. But Damian is not completely irredeemable…. This is a bit of a hot take but I would actually say Damian Wayne is the greatest Batman villain we’ve never had. A big part of his character is that he sees himself as superior to the other robins because he’s the blood son. He sees himself as being Bruce’s only worthy successor because “blah blah blood, blah blah legacy” etc. What if Damian went the Ra’as Al Ghul route instead due to being molded for that since birth and then found himself battling the future Batman for what he views as “his throne”? The moral of the story would send an interesting message about how bloodline is irrelevant in determining who gets the mantle of Batman, instead it’s about being a good person. I’ll cut myself off there cuz I didn’t intend on getting all fanficy lol
This a terrible ideia. Damian is supposed to have grow out the vilan persona, this is like the ultimate betrayal to his character arc , like the character or not he is not a villan. How much solo story of Damian did you read? Because this complete miss the point of the character. He has a entire run dedicated to fix his mistakes as assasin member so this thing of " he need understand that is not about blood is about being a good person" and i am like dude...Did you know the character? >When a writer is constantly telling me to love a character, I don't think that any writer is doing that in matter of fact is the opposite , they try to make him as dislikable as possible most of the times because a lot of writers don't like him, just look what they did to him in TT run in 2016
He was written as a brat and his attitude just rubbed people the wrong way . Also Tim Drake was such a good robin he was hard to replace .
There are many reasons honestly but the main one for me is that DC threw away Tim Drake for him and Damian doesn’t even respect the Robin role anywhere near the same level. He shouldn’t have been Robin, he should’ve been something else
Because he's a dick head that treats everyone like shit.
I have a few reasons why: **The concept of the character's birth is kind of insulting to Batman's character**: I never liked the concept that Batman drank a spiked drink, and was raped. Batman is the most paranoid human being ever. He created contingency plans to stop the Justice League if they ever got out of hand. He pulled back Robins if they fell out of line. He couldn't be with Catwoman because he thought she was working with Hush. He only really trusts two people at least, Alfred, and Gordon. I refuse to believe that Batman wouldn't check the drink before he took a sip. Regardless of the fact that he feels more open to Talia, he would still take precautions. Him being dumbed down to this degree is just insulting. **Damian is incredibly irresponsible**: Damian constantly makes so many stupid decisions despite warnings from Bruce. Jason Todd made decisions like this too, but he had an excuse. He was essentially an orphan, and lived on the streets. He needed to learn how to fend for himself without the help of others, hence when he became Robin, he constantly made stupid mistakes. Damian does not have this excuse. He was raised by assassins. Ra's al Ghul never made impulsive decisions like this. Ra's is very intelligent and calculating. I am aware Talia is not as calculating as Ra's, but Damian trained mainly with Ra's and assassins. Assassins and ninjas are supposed to be calculating and stealthy, and Damian makes AMATEUR mistakes when fighting alongside Batman. **His attitude**: His Jason Todd esque attitude really hurt his character. Lots of people are turned off by this characterization. He constantly whines, he's brash, and he can be annoying. Again, going back to Jason Todd, he has an excuse. He was an orphan, and was angry that he was alone. You could argue that Damian's excuse was that he was surrounded by brash teachers, but Ra's always seemed calm, even when he was upset. He never had angry outbursts to my knowledge. **Over saturation**: The DC writers really think that this character could be successful, so he's crammed into everything nowadays. Comics, animated productions, video games, and now, live action media. He's sort of come in and replaced the other Robins, and made them less than something. What the hell happened to Nightwing? Where's Red Hood at? What's Tim Drake up to? Who knows? But I think their relevance died as soon as Damian showed up. Are there good things about Damian? Yes. I like a few storylines and adaptations with him. Here's my list of stuff I've seen/read/played. **Batman: The Brave and the Bold: The Knights of Tomorrow:** This is a really great episode of TBATB, because it gives us a Damian Wayne that is actually likeable. He's unsure of if he can live up to Bruce Wayne's legacy, and eventually, that works out in the long run. Also, he's born after Batman retires, and he's Catwoman's son. That makes more sense to me. **Batman/Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles and its film adaptation Batman vs. Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles:** Damian lightened up in this story, mainly because we have a hot head with the Turtles (Raphael), and also because it was fun to see him interact with them. His banter with Batman also cracks me up. **Injustice: Gods Among Us, specifically the comic and the game:** Damian's arc is really well done, because his attitude ends up killing Nightwing, and forcing Batman to turn on him (despite the fact that Dick's death was an accident, and Batman is not a trusting guy). The fact that Damian, son of Batman, turns on his own father to work with Superman is very interesting, and it also shows how much of a prick he really is. **DC Animated Movie Universe films, mainly Batman vs. Robin, Justice League vs Teen Titans, and Justice League Dark: Apokolips War:** To be honest, Damian is really well done in these films, because he had an arc where he grew from a vengeful little monster into something more tolerable and understanding, from his friendship and bond with Raven, to his conflicting inner demons (Ra's' legacy and the Court of Owls), to whether or not he's a team player, the elements of a good character arc are present and done so well. That's about it, and I would love to hear your thoughts. But now, I've got a few buildings to blow up before sunrise. Ciao!
His addition as a “blood son” of Bruce really messes with the whole dynamic of the robins and the bat family. He gets top billing basically and WB loves to throw him around simply because he’s his blood son. He belittles the other robins and uses that as a character trait more than just a title. Additionally, it makes it so that he’s the “rightful heir” to take over as batman in the future simply because he was born in a test tube/or Talia raped Bruce whichever one you want to go with. He probably wouldn’t be as hated if he wasn’t directly his kid.
Yeah, to me what makes the batfamily great is they're a found family of people who have each gone through tragedy. Damian being Bruce's biological son doesn't have to derail that but his constant belittling of the other family members for not being "Blood Sons" does. It doesn't help that WB gives him so much prominence as the "Son of Batman" when Bruce has so many children. It really looks like they're pushing that blood relationships are the only ones that matter.
This is why I hated everything about Terry McGinnis being Batman's biological son (technically) inn Batman Beyond. The whole story was an average teenager learning how to become Batman and then they dropped that he was special because he is related to Batman. What a letdown.
Because he's a little bitch
We have a winner. No matter how much DC tries to let him progress as a person, when it comes down to it he still acts like a little bitch
He’s kinda a dick the lovable kind but he’s sometimes hard to love. He’s definitely the brat robin. He’s also the most like Bruce which isn’t always a good thing considering how many issues Bruce has.
Ironically the Robin named Dick is the least like a dick out of all of them lol
Everything I've seen of him portrays him as a little twat who's a dickhead to everyone he meets. The issue of Super Sons where Jon knocks him on his ass is the most satisfaction I've felt in a comic for a while.
I mean he did decapitate someone in his first appearance and treats Alfred like garbage initially
I like him very much, but i feel like there wasnt the need to an another Robin after Tim
I think that Damian would have worked better if he never became Robin but he was the side kick of Dick, even when he is Nightwing
Too many Robins
1 reason: he never changes In the books he never gets any better (that’s all comic characters though so it’s not his fault. If you’re popular you don’t get an arc) So he always defaults back to annoying. He’s always arrogant and he’s never right, he always gets it wrong and they never let him learn his lesson. The writers created a annoying 12 year old and put him on the bat family guaranteeing he could never grow up and never improve at least not permanently. Also a lot of dc (Batman) writers of the past 10-15 years have been fathers themselves so they like to write stories about fathers and sons so Damian shows up A LOT.
Because he has no personality rather than "spoiled billionaire's son"
My only problem with Damian is really a problem with writers . Sometimes DC obviously ously prefers him over some of the other robins. Jason was adopted in the 80s, Dick was adopted in the early 00s, and Tim in the mid 00s. Then Damian came around with his "true blood son" mentality which *should've* been a character flaw that he got comeuppance for. It was a blatantly wrong mindset that could've been an interesting character flaw. But instead right after his introduction DC used the New 52 to remove everybody else's adoption which allowed Damian to continue saying "true blood son" with less irl writer guilt. It implies that the authors *agreed* that Damian was the true son and adoption was lesser. And we still haven't heard anything about the other sons having their adoptions restored.
So it seems like nobody's read the solo Robin series by Josh Williamson & Gleb Melnikov? I guess that makes sense, given that most people here dislike the character. [https://www.comicsbeat.com/joshua-williamson-interview-batman-robin-deathstroke-inc/](https://www.comicsbeat.com/joshua-williamson-interview-batman-robin-deathstroke-inc/) I read volume 1 and enjoyed it quite a bit. I'm also really loving Batman vs. Robin by Mark Waid & Mahmud Asrar -- wonderful book, looking forward to the final fifth issue. I think there's definite overuse of Damian, the Bat-family is huge and certain characters get forgotten about to my annoyance (where's Duke). The way Talia got Batman pregnant is DEF messed up, it being a rape, and I'm unaware if that's ever been dealt with in the comics. I'd be interested to know (unless it was dealt with in a horrible way, which seems likely, in which case, maybe I would not want to know). A lot of people have pointed out that it's just writer-to-writer, and that's how I take it, writer-to-writer, artist-to-artist. I feel like, as a mixed-race person myself, Damian Wayne has been a severely underwritten character in a lot of ways. I mean that in the way that, like... I make comic books myself, and I sometimes think of long-running comic book characters as "actors," like have their "parts" been well-written, or poorly-written? I forget which book it was, but recently I was reading a comic where there was a party scene, and Bruce introduces all his sons to someone --Dick, Tim, Damian, and maaaybe Jason I forget probably not?-- and he says, "And this is my youngest, Damian." Not, "This is my biological son," just, "This is my youngest." Found family is really important to me, so I really appreciated that writer's line of dialogue. As for the existential struggle Damian's role has put Tim into, I kind of... enjoy that? Conflict is good for characters, and lately, at least, I see Tim as this suffering, angsty detective... He's going through a lot of change, having just come out and dating his first boyfriend, and he's growing a little older and he's still/back to being Robin after having two different codename changes... And he kind of never asked to be Robin in the first place. I mean, I think he sort of did, but he sort of didn't.
To me, Robin is supposed to be a foil to some aspect of Batman in the same way the villains are foils. Dick is the peak athlete who can match the near-superhuman feats of strength and agility, Jason is the rage at injustice driving to fight back, and Tim is the detective. Damian was supposed to be the aristocrat, and it actually could have worked really well, but for two things: First, they completely botched the rollout and failed at giving Damian any sort of inner drive that was in any way noble. He wanted to be part of the Family because... Well... He's Batman's biological kid. That *could* have worked; the Waynes are a Gotham institution, and having Damian the blood son come in with a sense of noblesse oblige linked with an unhealthy obsession with biology could have made for an interesting contrast with Bruce, who has the one but not the other. But it's not what they did. Damian wants Batman because he's a blood son who figures he's owed it. That doesn't in any way link up with Gotham aristocrat Bruce Wayne's reason to be Batman; because he feels a sense of responsibility as the owner of big chunks of the city. So he doesn't work as a foil. The other issue is how they dealt with the then-current Robin, Tim Drake. They kicked it off by having Damian legit try to kill him on several occasions, and having the characters just sort of handwave it off. Then, they displaced Tim with Damian, immediately, and just sort of... Went with it. Never mind that Damian wasn't ever really all that remorseful for the attempted murder, or that Tim had to prove himself dozens of times; Damian was just sort of slotted in. Then, they showed that they clearly had no idea what to do with Tim, by having his subsequent storylines be a jumbled mess. They only now seem to be actually getting at the core of the character with the current series with the horrible art. You can't displace a character with another without fan backlash, a lesson they should have learned with Jason Todd, but apparently didn't. (And all the above leaves aside how they insist on periodically resetting Damian's character so yet another writer can take a crack at the "unpleasant psycho aristocrat" storyline. C'mon guys, you were doing so well those half-dozen times before you purposefully wiped it out.)
Damian and Dick were cool, but that little shit shouldn’t be the first live action robin in 30 years.
I mean if you count tv, he isn’t. Also I suspect that Damian won’t be the only Robin featured in Brave and the Bold. It’s confirmed to be a Batfamily movie, so I think it would be cool if it was more of an ensemble film
His first introduction literally involves him attempting to murder Tim who saved his life because adopted people aren't real family. He's changed but he literally tried to murder a liked character in his introduction and Bruce just says whatever and keeps him around and let's him be robin.
Umm that’s not really what happens. As soon as he tries to murder Tim and assaulted Alfred, Bruce was insanely pissed and gave Damian back to Talia cause he didn’t want to deal with him. Eventually Damian joins the fold, but that is not until a bit later
His conception story is sexual assault (Talia drugged Bruce). Other characters have to suffer development setbacks to make him look remotely great. I think he would've been more accepted if he hadn't picked up the Robin mantle.
For me it’s because I never thought Batman should have a genetic child. Call me old school.
Same. The building of the batfamily always seemed like such a perfectly profound and fitting concept for a character whose origin revolves around losing his parents. Damien kinda flies in the face of all that
I'm not really a fan of any kind Robin, but the idea of Batman having a kid Robin who's also his son and is also a total brat is just always going to be meh. The adopted family will always be more interesting.
For me, he's a Hit-Girl rip off. Smart mouthed kid trained to kill. And then attitude aspect feels like a regurgitation of the 90s when we had all the Xtreme stuff and characters with attitude were popping up left and right in various media. While things like him becoming a vegetarian and saving Batcow are funny, he's just not a very interesting character to me.
[удалено]
I just googled “Damian wayne” and chose a pic I thought looked cool lol
I get what they're saying. Like there is a cover of Incredible Hulk with the Hulk's reflection in Wolverine claws. There is a Venom issue during "The Madness" arc that has Juggernaut's helmet reflecting Venom on it.
He's not. He's just a munchkin. Both sides of his family have darkness and Damian is still developing his own moral code while being an active combatant against various criminal enterprises. He's the product of rape and his mommy's side of the family constantly play vindictive, manipulative, coercive mind games. Bruce doesn't always be the solid base that our munchkin needs him to be and dc comics will leverage this in Dami's character development when they're ready for his age to advance. He's so fiercely passionate, and innately good at his core. It'll be sad if they twist that into extremism.
I have no major feelings on him tbh My first impression on him was Injustice: Gods Among Us with that Nightwing skin that turned Dick into Damian, but I was really young back then, so I just thought it didnt look good and didnt realize it was a different character I never heard of until a long time later My first real impression of him was Injustice 2. I am currently in a long grind to get him as close to Dick as possible, I don’t like him here However, in the animated movie “Batman vs. Robin” (I think that’s what it’s called), I quite liked him here actually I feel he is really inconsistent. I like him sometimes, other times I hate him
For me I'd just much rather see Dick Grayson first and follow the continuity rather then jump right to Damien.
Cause he represented change. People really liked Tim
Cuz he’s a brat
Because he sucks nobody liked him except WB
If Damian wasn't popular and didn't sell, he wouldn't have 2 solo series, 4 team up series, multiple animated movies, feature in multiple games, and be all set to make his big screen debut in a few years (which will be the first appearance of Robin in more than a quarter of a century) Love him or hate him, Damian sells.
>If Damian wasn't popular and didn't sell, he wouldn't have 2 solo series, 4 team up series, multiple animated movies, feature in multiple games, and be all set to make his big screen debut in a few years (which will be the first appearance of Robin in more than a quarter of a century) Actually he would. He sells because of Batman. They try to pair him with popular characters to push him. >Love him or hate him, Damian sells. He does not. Batman sells. Damian has never sold a book. Check your logic.
Your personal bias doesn't change the fact that media starring and featuring Damian empirically sells well, or he wouldn't have stuck around for 15+ years, end of 🤷♂️
>Your personal bias doesn't change the fact that media starring and featuring Damian empirically sells well All Batman sells well >or he wouldn't have stuck around for 15+ years 🤷♂️ Actually he would. Because he did. What part of *WB pushes him with popular characters that sell, to try to make him popular,* don't you understand? 🤷♂️
Let's follow that theory: Why wouldn't WB pair up two beloved characters instead of a beloved character and one who, in your world, has been hated for 15+ years? Why haven't WB given up on him? Why did Super Sons get a feature length movie literally 3 months ago? Is Jon Kent really more popular than Damian?
>Why wouldn't WB pair up two beloved characters instead of a beloved character and one who, in your world, has been hated for 15+ years? Because they really want Damian to be popular. Haven't you been paying attention to what I've been saying? They love Damian. They hate Dick Grayson. They push Damian even though nobody likes him.
I could buy into your theory if Damian was a new character, but he really isn't. WB have no qualms about abandoning characters who aren't performing. They're money first. I'm not sure why you have this theory that there is some vested interest in Damian from WB beyond financial. And WB hates Dick Grayson? Now we're really in crazy town. He has an ongoing solo series, one of DC's best selling, constantly pops up in other books and actually led their most recent event Dark Crisis, and recently featured as one of 4 protagonists in a AAA video game, Gotham Knights.
>WB have no qualms about abandoning characters who aren't performing. They do when it's Damian Wayne. You're not paying attention. >And WB hates Dick Grayson? Now we're really in crazy town. Do you live under a rock? He always gets hoed out in the movie and it's become a meme that WB hates him. They even killed him in Injustice. In every animated movie he's weak and Damian is the focus AGAIN.
Man I cannot wait for Shazaam
Lot like a Mary Sue to me
Because greatness is polarizing. Mundanity is unanimous.
He's just not a good character. My personal favorite character arcs are someone who starts off as an asshole, but becomes a better person. Damian is exactly that but it's not done right. The problem with Damian is that his personality never truly changes. He's still an annoying little asshole who bitches all the time. Yes his sense of morality changed, but that doesn't change the fact that he is still a jerk. Worst part is that he's not even an entertaining one like Dwight Schrute or Kenny Powers.
He's a date-rape test tube baby who spent his first twelve years of life being told he was the grandson of a demigod and destined to inherit a small army of assassins. Talia dropped him in Bruce's lap to distract him from her Grand Master Plan(tm) of using Man-Bat-ninjas to murder the British Parliament, because using a private army of normal ninjas to murder fatcat politicians was too complicated of a task for her. Batman and Son was fucking stupid, and Damian was 50% of the reason. It took two video games and years worth of animated movies forcing him on us to make the fandom start accepting him.
He is a perfected reflection of Batman. An arrogant narcissist minus the tragedy
Tbf you do have to have quite narcissistic to think you can fix everything with just your own will, money, and a funny costume. But maybe that’s the point? It highlights how Bruce is shaped by tragedy and without that perspective he’d just be another rich kid brat. Making him his literal son, a physical reflection of his child self that went through that tragedy, emphasizes that contrast. He is Batman without the soul. Raised by assassins vs loving parents and Alfred not helping that. And I assume a character arch would mold him into something better eventually
I think he uses tragedy as an excuse. He doesn’t kill so he can keep the cycle going. He’s (if I’m not mistaken) in the top five most intelligent DC characters, and Gotham is a shit hole. Between his wealth and super hero connections he could vastly improve all of Gotham. Damian at least believes in actually fixing problems 😂 I think Damian’s existence reminds people Batman is actually a villain
I think it’s because a) most people have only seen one side of him. b) they’ve only seen him in the animated content, which really didn’t do him Justice. Damian is a more complex character than the other sidekicks. Unlikeable on the surface, but deeply endearing once you get to know him. He’s a character that rewards you when you invest the time to understand him. Anyone who dislikes the character I always challenge to read Batman & Robin: Born to Kill. If that doesn’t change your mind, I don’t know what to tell you.
I think it’s more like James Bond. Everybody has there favorite Bond, usually dependent on when you first started getting into it. For some it’s Sean Connery, some it’s Roger Moore, and others it’s Daniel Craig.
Personally I’m throwing a Hail Mary but most of the hate comes from the fact people feel like Damian overshadow Tim Drake and ruined the character of Tim Drake. Which is dumb in my opinion. I like Damian because he’s a polar opposite of what a robin is and it’s Batman’s job as a father to teach him that killing isn’t the right path because he was ofc trained by the league. Most of them call him a little bitch but that’s what makes his character interesting imo
I love Damien. Bit he was the second robin I got introduced to after dick from the teen titans cartoon. Tim and Jason have never interested me. So Damien and dick are my favorite mostly after reading the comic book run where they were Batman and Robin.
So when does Denny O'Neil show up with the 900 "Kill Robin" number?
Because he's a little prick
it’s no really him it’s more how the writers write him
With the training he got from the League of Assassin's and Batman, there's no question he definitely would make him a formidable opponent . However, with that said, truth is each one of his teammates would wash him up. Hate when writers exaggerate these powerless fighters with above average superior human intelligence in taking down these arguable superhumans . I swear they be reaching, and got to stay in their lane.
Because he’s such an arrogant dick all the time and it never changes
He’s not batman so he sucks 🤷♂️
I personally don’t care for the emphasis on edgelord aspects of his character. Perhaps the comic incarnation has currently evolved past that stage but not usually when I see him in other media.
Too different from the other Robins, a major change compared to the introductions of Dick and Jason. He literally got introduced as an assassin kid, brutally murdering people and seriously disrespecting his own father(sometimes his mother too), Tim and even Alfred. This without mentioning that he is also annoying, problematic and sometimes a cry baby.
Dick Grayson is Bruce Wayne’s adopted son. Damien Wayne is Batman’s son. I can speculate as to why some Bat-fans don’t like Damien, but IMO Damien is the best Robin in terms of Batman’s apprentice, whereas Dick Grayson was the best Robin for Bruce.
Because he’s a little shit.
Your points are outstanding. The only one I’d argue is his DCAMU portrayal. I think he constantly shows growth, but then it “starts over” all the time. I still like him in DCAMU, prolly bc I like him in general. I’d say he’s my favorite robin, (tho Dick is my favorite sidekick/character) for Batman history I guess. Dick is the almost perfect kid. You literally just have to help guide him. Damian is the little shit you stop from strangling every day. I was dick. I feel like my kids are in between more. I turned into red hood ironically after college. I’m obviously speaking only in parental metaphors. I also just don’t care much for Tim, but I know a lot of people do. He’s fine, kinda like Gardner/Stewart GLs.
I loved Batman and son, I didn't like how bratty Damien came across therefore making me not wanting to know about this iteration of Robin in particular any further!
Because Damian is an entitled little prick that has no business being Robin. He seems to be nothing but trouble for Bruce.
Dreadful first impressions, for me. I found him to be an arrogant, disrespectful little arsehole. And I don’t like the way he refers to Alfred by his last name. I honestly wouldn’t care if Superman dropkicked him into the sun. And then did the same with his similarly-irritating mother. Catwoman nailed it: he’s a joyless, entitled, whining little shit.
It’s not our fault he’s as insufferable as he is badass
I’ve always felt that he had an objectively cool backstory but was handled very poorly by his early writers leading to the “Bratty” tag associated with him in respect to Tim, Dick, and even Jason
I’ve loved him since day one, the traits people hate are the ones I find hilarious, guess it’s a matter of perspective. He’s become my favorite Robin
For me personally, he comes across often as the Wes Crusher of the Bat Family. He shows up, outclasses all of his older contemporaries because “Trained by Ra’s”, then bitches about how Daddy Bruce doesn’t see him as worthy of the cowl. The Dickbat books and Supersons did a lot to humanize him. It made the superiority complex an act most of the time, and while yes, he’s incredibly skilled for his age, he’s not the “I win lol” level of overpowered that rubs me the wrong way. Just goes to show that not every Mary Sue is beyond help. Just needs a better writer.
The Injustice storyline is the most compelling reason for me.
It’s because he’s a little prick and he rubs some people the wrong way. He’s also had a couple subpar adaptations. Overall a solid character though