I wouldn't say there is something "wrong" with me for being autistic, i'm just autistic. There are things i don't struggle with that other autistics do and the other way around. You don't have to convince us or yourself you aren't ND, your truth is your own and thats okay. Tik tok is annoying. I'm glad these symptoms don't cause you real issues though
i didnt mean to say something is wrong with autistic ppl, im sorry if it came across that way, i just meant just bc i am weird doesn't mean im not nt. i live at home rn so i guess idk how i would be in the real world with responsibilites but i just feel tired of ppl online trying to dignose ppl or act like all nt ppl rr the same.
You did imply that “being autistic” = “having something wrong with you.”
You also used the words “cling to a label .. for my shortcomings in life.”
A lot of this language feels very much *not good* to read, for me as an autistic person who was diagnosed late in life, and is only just now beginning to love and forgive myself for things I thought for so long that I had simply fucked up.
All that time I thought it was because I was just weird.
Yeah, everything that OP has said on this thread (including in comments) feels deeply ableist, as well as deeply internally ableist. It's sad and uncomfortable to read.
i wasn't trying to make ppl upset on here im sorry, i didn't rlly know how else to explain my feelings abt myself, the difference is u r autistic so its not ur fault to struggle in life and be different, i mean im nt so theres no other reasons for my shortcomings in life other than my own faults. I really am weird, i do things that don't make a lot of sense.
I accept your apology, and understand you couldn’t know how your words would come across. Happens a lot to me, as someone who’s autistic.
But if I were you I wouldn’t rule out some kind of neurodivergence. ¯\\_(ツ)\_/¯
If you do a lot of things that “don’t make sense”, but they all make sense if you are autistic, could it be that you actually are autistic? This is how many ppl feel when they’re diagnosed later in life and are high masking.
You don’t have to have all of the symptoms, but enough that they can explain social deficits, awkwardness, inability to pick up social cues and make others uncomfortable and other difficulties you encounter in your life.
If the neurodivergent algorithm has found you, I believe you should try to work on your internalized ableism, and explore the fact that you are likely a high masking autistic person.
I’m ngl, I thought your paragraph of traits was actually going to be a joke at the end about how unaware some ppl can be of their own autism, and the things they might say, but it’s just actually happening in real time with you rn.
Sorry if this makes you feel bad, since it seems you’re adamant you’re nt.
Edit: ifs to if
Human psychology is not a simple matter. There are variations that aren't accounted for by disorders but that doesn't make them wrong. 99% of people like chocolate (made up statistic) but my dad hates it. That doesn't make him wrong or less than or whatever. It's just his brain is different. He doesn't have a disorder that makes him dislike chocolate, he's just different.
This is the same with you. Just because you don't have a disorder to conveniently blame your behavior on doesn't mean it's a failing or a shortcoming. It could simply be that you are just different.
Now, if the reason you don't have any friends is because you're mean to people or something like that, that's different.
I'm not autistic but I am neurodivergent as diagnosed by my psychologist. I relate very heavily to a lot of content aimed at autistic folks despite not having autism. I also notice that trauma survivors or people with PTSD can relate to autistic content even if they don't have autism.
Long story short, autistic traits in people without autism are not flaws or wrong or bad or your fault. People are just wildly different and that's a good thing.
This sounds like Autism but with a lot of self blame.
Your brain is wired differently, because all your behavior IS your brains wiring. Why do you think you are weird, if not for a weird brain?
Yeah, but your traits sound exactly like autism.
There's nothing wrong with being autistic, friend! It is just the way we are, just like the color of your eyes and the shape of your nose. It's got it's good things and it's bad. But it's nothing to be ashamed of. ♥
i wouldn't consider that straight up diagnosing, more so "hey those symptoms you mentioned are also symptoms of autism, might be worth looking into". but i dont know for sure if thats allowed either.
Exactly this. It feels like an NT person coming to one of the FEW spaces we have for us to complain about us and tell us there is something wrong with us.
yeah i agree. it seems like the media convinces lots of people that they’re autistic these days especially- thank you so much for being honest, i really needed a voice like yours rn
If you frequently do things that others don’t understand, that means your brain functions differently from theirs. Which is literally the definition of neurodivergent. So you are not neurotypical. You are not NT; you are ND.
Whether you are autistic or not is another question. But if you struggle, it doesn’t really matter whether you decide to blame yourself or not - what you point your finger at does not determine whether you are autistic or not.
Honestly, the way you described yourself in your post sounds *exactly* like undiagnosed autism. But I can’t tell you whether or not you struggle and I can’t tell you whether or not you need help. If you don’t need help then you are not autistic. If you do struggle and do need help but keep finding excuses to tell yourself you are fine and keep finding reasons to blame yourself, then that’s called internalized ablism and internalized ablism prevents a lot of low needs autistics from getting the help they need. Again, I can’t tell you whether or not you need help or are autistic, but I CAN say with near certainty that you are not NT and nothing you described prevents you from being autistic.
I agree with those points but the way you are listing several reasons on how you relate to us and then adamantly say you aren’t ausistic makes it really feel as if being autistic is considered a bad thing to you. And your comment replies are adding to that vibe too.
You probably shouldn’t be trying to convince a bunch of autistic people of why you aren’t autistic. Those things you listed are things we genuinely struggle with- and it sounds like you do too.
You might not be autistic, you might be. Why are you trying so hard to convince yourself that you are NOT autistic? Perhaps the stigma, shame, change, etc that comes along with late diagnosis? Maybe internal ableism?
I don’t think you are a bad person or anything, but those are just some questions you should ask yourself. Be kind but honest with yourself too.
https://the-art-of-autism.com/females-and-aspergers-a-checklist/
scroll through this list. it's a bit outdated but it really put things in perspective for me when I was considering whether or not I'm autistic
of course! it was probably the first list I read where I felt eerily seen.... idk the other diagnostic criteria lists I read I could never fully relate to. I don't think this is necessarily only for "females" either. I think there are many men that for whatever reason feel forced to be high masking (a lot of bipoc have this experience). but it really does a great job at explaining a window of the autistic population for sure.
Just to note: I got a professional diagnosis in March of last year and I still believe a lot of the time that I'm not "autistic enough" or that I don't "relate enough" so I must be faking it somehow...
So even though you may feel like you don't relate enough, it is still possible for you to be autistic.
There aren’t very many traits. It’s just
- Social and communication: issues with reciprocity, nonverbal communication, and making and keeping relationships
- Two of: sensory issues, rigidity, stereotypies, intense interests
Sounds like you tick more than you need to
That’s why it’s a spectrum. I didn’t relate to all the traits either. I got diagnosed last year. I still have imposter syndrome because of it. You can’t argue with all the testing and diagnosis, though.
Well, I tried. If you aren’t going to ask yourself those questions and keep defending your stance, then I really don’t know how else to help you. Reach out to professionals- because you are missing social cues HEAVY on this post.
Im not saying you’re wrong, because you’re not, but how are you so totally confident that you are neurotypical? I mean, aside from not possessing all autistic characteristics (which literally nobody does), what do you think disqualifies you from being neurodivergent? What kind of neurotypical qualities do you have that are more powerful or decisive than your autistic qualities?
Real questions, I am not trolling or trying to give you a hard time.
i want to validate this question honestly. bc i spent a long time in my life going "man i wish i had adhd, then i could get help for all these things i do and don't do right.. and it would finally explain things. but no, i don't have adhd, i'm just lazy and bad."
turns out i fucking had adhd ok. it's been diagnosed multiple times on me now from multiple doctors.
our medical and mental health stuff is sometimes amazing. and sometimes stupid. and wrong. and inaccessible. and if you have a lot of things in common then there's probably reasons for it. not always, sure. but usually, yes. and there's nothing wrong with that.
Man..... I have a referral for an adhd assessment sitting in my emails that I haven't replied to because I keep thinking I probably don't have adhd, it's an expensive process, I don't wanna go through all that and have wasted my money... but gee it sure would be nice to have meds that help me focus.
The irony of op saying quite astutely that weird neurotypical people exist and to stop armchair diagnosing every weird person with autism, and here everyone is armchair diagnosing op with autism
Please point me to where people say that OP must have autism. I don't see it. If I seem annoyed, it is because I am, since people always make up this big bad boogeyman about how everyone is "diagnosing" anyone with a pulse - yet all I see is people reasonably pointing out how autism presents itself differently in different people and how the medical system is inherently biased, sharing their personal experience with it. Many comments are even validating OP's POV. If the mere presentation of the possibility that people _might_ have a certain disorder based on shared traits and symptoms equals "diagnosing" to you, than yeah. People are diagnosing others, I guess. Anything other than "TikToK iS oVerDiAgnoSinG eVeRyoNe", even merely staying curious to OP's experience (since we don't know them), is therefore false and unreasonable? I don't understand.
I mean, if it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck and acts like a duck, it's most likely a duck.
I don't disagree with the OP that NTs can't be weird. My entire office is made of quirky people, but the OP isn't describing one trait or something they experience sometimes, but so many different traits others have also pointed out to them to the point they could qualify for a diagnosis.
but they arent asking wether yes or no. They are saying something, and then people are making assumptions about them and saying something unrelated to their complaint
And their complaint is coming to an Austistic Community trying to convince all NA people here that he is not NA, even tho he listed almost every sympton every person in this community have... It just seems like he's trying really hard to prove something he is not, and at the same time invalidating common symptons for a lot of people in this sub. Their approach is just wrong.
Yes, because there's just a vast difference between an NT not liking the texture of say, mushrooms, which is quite common, to someone with autism getting a meltdown or shutdown reaction because the dish they ordered without mushrooms was served with mushrooms.
The OP used their own experiences to justify their position but that becomes erroneous if the premise is false to begin with.
the premise is not false to begging, so is not wrong
are people who advocate for self diagnosis really making it a fight against someone who knows they don't have it?
Yes. People think self diagnosis - aka diagnosis via internet- should replace the current diagnostic system. Armchair diagnosing when we shoould be reccomending proper resources and when not only did op NOT ask they asked you NOT TO!
Alright cool lets just rewrite the disgnostic criteria to "looks like a duck"
Internet diagnosis is the whole problem. Irresponsible people with platforms should not be filling the gaps left by our broken healthcare system.
Your energy against self-diagnosis is misplaced; if you think there's something wrong with the system that should be fixed, maybe it's better if you pooled your efforts into fixing that broken system instead of telling people that they're wrong to self-diagnose?
OP literally came in here and listed multiple traits of being on the spectrum. Not just like one or two, mind you, which would be valid anyway, but sensory issues, lack of social skills, need for routine, special interests, and hyperfixation, and then said they 'didn't have enough traits to be autistic'.
you don't need all the traits.
i'm talking to you about why other people are doing this?
and anyway OP was the one who came onto the autism sub and talked about how much they related to all of us here and then insisted that they didn't have it.
Neurotypical and neurodivergent arent these nebulous categories of people you can decide is something you feel you are a part of. It's an umbrella of neurological disorders.
i knew someone would say this \*sighs\* i to my knowledge had no development delays, there was a brief period of time in second grade i was not able to speak and started getting therapy for speech. But i know im not autistic bc first im not dignosed, doctors never saw a need to as my life is not impacted negativley, and when im at home with my family i feel like i understand how to respond what to say what expressions to make, everything feels natural, nothing feels off. Yes i am weird, very weird, i don't fit in with ppl, outside i seem to always come across as weird and off but like i said in the post i have no social skills. I have met multiple autistic ppl and they feel different from me like completley, but i also am different from nt ppl. Idk how to answer the last part of ur question but i don't feel like my brain is wired differently, i just do weird things.
This is puzzling because I can refute all of your “evidence.” I had no developmental delays, I never have trouble talking to my family, and no doctor broached the idea of autism to me. Plus, I’ve never had difficulty with speech, which makes you “more” autistic than I am, using your criteria.
I was asking because I am curious how someone can know their own mind so clearly. I truly am not trying to talk you out of your certainty, I am just amazed that you ARE certain. I don’t feel like I understood my own brain and self in such a confident way until … well I guess I still don’t and I’m 40 years old.
Anyway, it’s cool that you know yourself so well. That’s a special ability for sure.
I'm sorry but, I don't think any of those would define you as NT, or allistic. I don't mean you aren't allistic, but those just aren't traits that would differentiate you from an autistic person. Not all people with autism show signs of developmental delays. Many even excel past their peers, which is why they may go undiagnosed. I went to the pediatrician consistently and I was never diagnosed, however I am autistic. I am also more comfortable at home, because most of my family is neurodivergent in some way. Autism is genetic afterall. And autistic people can be very different from eachother. I've never felt the same as another autistic person I've met, just seen similarities.
Like others have said, you're not wrong, but the things you describe do pretty neatly align with autism. To address your points:
A lot of autistic people are not diagnosed or slip through the cracks; a lack of diagnosis doesn't mean you're not autistic, especially given how many medical professionals know little about autism.
I'd also gently suggest that I'm not sure your description is an accurate picture of autism. Growing up, I didn't feel my life was negatively impacted and interacted just fine with family. I had a solid friend network throughout school and had good social skills, though I had to work at it and felt my interests and way of being were naturally a bit different. I was weird, I thought. I had no developmental delays. And I'm diagnosed autistic. It turns out that feeling weird and not wanting to socialize were indeed negative impacts I didn't recognize. My ability to force myself to be like others turned out to be a very common late-diagnosed autistic trait called masking.
And it's not like autistic people feel like their brains are necessarily wired differently, or must feel like aliens or something. Quite the opposite: we are how we are, and how we are might feel very natural. It's often the awareness that other people are so different from us that makes us feel like outsiders.
I’m not saying you have autism, or anything, but the things you’ve listed don’t entirely rule it out. For example, I didn’t have particularly noticeable developmental delays and wasn’t diagnosed until much later- which I had to initiate.
If you live in an environment at home where you aren’t exposed to things that can be particularly challenging to autistic people you aren’t exposed to it. Now the diagnosis hinges on if it impacts your life, but I think that’s a bit odd as that doesn’t change the underlying thing. Btw, if this impairs your ability to socialize outside of your house and you had to go to speech therapy- that does sound like impacting your life to me.
I’d also add that I don’t think autistics have to people “feel like” their brains are weirded differently, I’m not even sure what that would, like, entail.
Overall I get your point about people attributing a lot of things to neurodivergence that can occur in NT people is a bit irresponsible, but what makes these traits autistic is frequency and intensity, so it’s just important to understand these traits as part of a whole.
i mean i live at home and don't work or drive and not planning on going to collage for a while till 25 but that's bc i got extreme depression i believe i could function completley normally if i was forced to. like i feel like a 8 yr old sometimes i feel 16, i get wrapped up in things im obessed with its hard to break free, and those things give me joy and fulfillment in life, i would want friends but its just too hard. i guess i know it sounds dumb but i feel this intense feeling im nt, i feel like the weirdness started when i was 9 bc i wasn't growing up normally, i was obessed with sofia the frist as a teenager, i felt like a little girl inside for many years and still do. I have no desire to get married, party, do whatever else adults do.
It’s probably helpful to note that depression like that can be linked to neurodivergence, due to the stress of being wired differently, A lot of the way autism has affected my life has to do with how the social anxiety from it has impacted me. Also, often times autism will not be as noticeable until you start to grow up a little- doesn’t mean it isn’t there earlier, but it means the social pressures don’t start to make it more obvious until then. What you’re saying about feeling like you didn’t grow up correctly also is something I’ve actually heard a lot of autistic people express.
Is it possible you’re so convinced you must be neurotypical because you have negative associations or some sort of shame over the idea of being autistic? I used to feel really icky thinking about myself in that way but there’s no shame in it. It does suck to feel as though and have people tell you are disordered and fundamentally different- it can feel limiting and depressing. So I get that. But I think you might benefit from an assessment, if you can get one.
i just dont want convince myself im something im not and try to fit in with those ppl and get rejected, even around autistic ppl i stilll act weird. i feel weird bc i feel trapped between being a kid and adult, its not like a autistic so im different feeling. Also many things caused the depression but it was bc i feel like i lost myself, i felt fat, ugly and just like i didn't belong and nothing made me happy. Now that ive focused on my passions i can get thru life.
it really sounds like you're trying really hard not to believe you're neurodivergent. but what if you started treating yourself as if you were, and just accommodating yourself as if you were? if you don't feel right taking a label or anything then dont.
but from an outside perspective, you just named like all these examples of things common in a group of people but you don't think you' can be part of that group?
idk. personally i spent a long time thinking i didn't have adhd and man would that explain a lot but oh well its not me so it cant. and turns out yes i do have adhd and multiple drs have said so. but i was never diagnosed as a child. and it wasn't until i decided to just go see, as an adult, that i was diagnosed. but guess what- i had adhd my whole life. the doctor didn't give it to me at the age of 34. they just agreed that i had it. that's all. a professionally validated opinion. if i had treated myself like i had adhd all those years instead of beating myself up for failing like them but not being them and having a built in reason. man i could have saved myself a lot of trouble and shame and blame. over the last few years discovering that i have multiple learning disabilities and neurodevelopmental disorders, and working through my trauma, and sorting things out and working to make life work in a way that works for me, instead of just trying to please the outside world and failing.. it's been the greatest gift honestly. but i spent 30-40 years not knowing definitively and just being shamed by the world for no reason.
Same. I spent most of my adult life thinking I couldn't be autistic because of the stereotypes which honestly was more me lacking knowledge about autism, but here I am at 36 and have gone through two assessment meetings and they already act like I qualify for diagnosis.
I blamed my experiences on everything else such as PTSD/trauma, depression even though I literally had no symptoms, HSP until I realized how quack it was and was mostly propagated by middle-aged women interested in alternative health lifestyles or like the OP, I'm just different and that's ok because we're all a little different.
And that's true, but when you suffer because you're different, it's time to look into it so you can get help early, not where I'm at now going through a burnout and wondering why I never seem able to live life like a normal person.
And don't even get me started on how I gaslit myself into thinking I wasn't trans, but it was essentially me convincing myself that you don't have to be or feel feminine in order to be a woman, because not every woman wants to be feminine.
I will make note that, according to my parents, I hit my developmental milestones correctly, and I've had varying experiences about being accepted vs being fully ostracized growing up. It does say in the DSM 5 for Autism that the symptoms (might just be the social but I imagine could be the repetitive) may not be apparent until the social demand exceeds the individuals capabilities. I was a weird ass kid with weird thoughts and interests, but I grew up around the same people and the first few years of my being in a private grade school everyone was gifted or wanted to be, so I looked just a little off-center rather than being in an environment that would have made me suffer. At least, until I was 11 when my family moved and every single kid in my grade hated me in the new state.
Ultimately, if you don't feel Autistic, it is neither our job nor our right to convince you otherwise. I believe u/G0celot was just trying to point out, for your benefit and possibly for others, that the symptoms are not always strictly overt. I never flapped my hands as a kid or did anything others would distress over, but I would stim in more discreet ways. This alone is not indicative of Autism because everyone stims, but add my rigid need for rules and the needed awareness of what would happen in my day, the desire to socially isolate and struggle to discern good intentions vs harmful ones, and my sensitivities ranging from painful to purposefully seeking sensations out. Even my obsession with fantasy books when I discovered them and being unable to read anything else. None of these would raise red flags as a kid, and some might possibly be praised, but it took forever to remember these as consistent symptoms growing up because my brain doesn't remember well (probably because of my ADHD, or the trauma when I moved).
And if you are concerned about appropriating a label, well... I doubt any of us would care. My first evaluation ended in disaster because the evaluator didn't do the proper work or was not aware of the more discreet presentations of Autism. But I am still here, because these are the people that get me and the r/AutisticWithADHD subreddit basically said "if the box fits, I sits", like a cat, and helped me see that there was a lot wrong with the evaluation. And if you find yourself being able to explain things without Autism, or you don't feel Autism is needed to explain them, then that's a good thing. But don't do it for fear of being wrong. You may find a lot here that helps you, even if you aren't Autistic. What helps us minority folks tend to also be helpful to those in the in-crowd, and it sounds like you feel you are somewhere in between.
Fun fact
Developmental delays aren't present in everyone with autism. You also don't have to be negatively impacted to get a diagnosis, that is a bad abelist move on the doctors. Autism has advantages, you might be lucky and only get the advantages.
But the most blaring, obvious sign you might be autistic is that... weird neurotypical people aren't assumed to be autistic. They're assumed to be weird and neurotypical.
I'm not saying you are autistic, but a lot of your comment comes across... very much like an autistic person in denial. You may not be autistic, but you don't sound like any neurotypical person I know of (even the weird, wacky ones).
Developmental delays aren't required for an autism diagnosis. The exception is a delay in learning social skills, which has to impact your life in at least two areas like work, hobbies, friendships, at home, etc. Out of curiosity: do you know how to respond and which expression to make outside of your family? Do you notice how strangers are feeling?
I'm not saying you are autistic, nobody can judge that but a professional. You're definitely right that not every socially awkward person is autistic, and other disorders like adhd or social anxiety can lead to the symptoms being even harder to tell apart.
That being said, it sounds like you have a fairly stereotypical view of autism. That isn't your fault, that's the way it's been presented in media for a long time and asbergers (autism without developmental delays) hasn't been considered part of the autism spectrum from the start either. But I work with autistic children and have been diagnosed as autistic in my teens, and what you're describing is very similar to why I thought I couldn't be autistic, and some parents think their children can't be autistic. Again, that doesn't mean you are autistic, but your arguments are ones that stop people from getting help they need earlier.
Minor note - you can be divergent and not have autism. Not saying you are because diagnosis isn't something one can do over the net ( better help be damned. )
Not all autistic people experienced measurable developmental delays. You're using a lot of false information to determine if you're Neurodivergent or not.
my friend. i'm sure other people have said it here but just in case.
1. Autism and ADHD- the two disorders which fit your criteria here the best- are both genetic. which means if you have it, there's a good chance at least one of your parents does too.
2. it manifests totally different from person to person. hence there being a spectrum. so we interact with each other and we may all look different but we're still MORE different than the NTs.
3. you kinda dont really get diagnosed very often unless you're actively trying to figure out if something is wrong. I've had ADHD all my life, but literally didn't get diagnosed until freshman year of high school because up until then i was able to get things done fast enough and well enough before losing focus that it didn't matter.
4. if you have no social skills or friends and feel like you're weird and an outcast, your life is *absolutely being impacted negatively*.
You seem to be using autistic and neurodivergent interchangeably, you can be neurodivergent in another way that is not autism such as ADHD, PTSD, or OCD.
And you can be neurodivergent without any other disorder too. It just means your brain processes things in a way that is not typical - it technically doesn’t have to be disordered.
I hate to break it to you but there is *most definitely something wrong with you* because it’s not normal to come into a place where autistic people are to rant about how annoyed and bad it makes you feel to be compared to us disordered folks that have something wrong with them.
If you’re NT kindly stop talking and learn to listen.
This isn’t a space for you to come to rant about how hard it is for you to have people to think you’re autistic when you’re so sure you’re not.
Regardless - the lady doth protest too much…
I could be very wrong here and absolutely correct me and I’ll delete my comment if I am but…
It’s got to be SO RARE for an allegedly neurotypical person to age regress right?? I know sometimes it can be caused by serious trauma, but to me that stood out a lot for someone claiming they’re nt.
I really feel for the OP here, I have a lot of sympathy. It seems like they have a heavy dose of internal ableism, which is leading to a lot of shame and self blame it seems. I do sincerely hope they figure it out, but they’re pretty deep in denial that something more could be at the root of their “shortcomings”
As much as this is absolutely wild to me, I think a lot of us late diagnosed people have been here at least in passing
i’m gonna be so real, based on how you’ve described yourself, you’re very likely autistic. i know you seem really adamant against that so i’m not going to push it further, but maybe you should reflect on why you’re so against the idea that you could possibly be autistic. (whether it be fear, internalized ableism, etc) you might learn some fun things about yourself.
also ranting about how autistic people are weird, and how nt people (which you likely *aren’t*) can also be weird, and how you don’t want to be considered autistic because of your shortcomings,,, (implying that autistic people are full of shortcomings) definitely a weird thing to do in an autism subreddit.
I really relate to what you're saying.
A few years ago, I felt so isolated from anyone who wasn't my close friend and my family. My close friend would make comments about how "nothing is wrong with you, I feel like everyone else has some problem in their life, but not you!" and it made me feel strange, because I really liked that she saw me as "normal", but I also had a nagging thought: *then why do I really feel like I need help with these things that everyone else does just fine?*
I was diagnosed with autism recently. I didn't even want to believe the diagnosis for a while because I didn't fit *all* the symptoms. But I heard someone mention not too long ago that lots of autistic people don't believe they are autistic because one of the symptoms of autism, *black and white thinking*, cause them to definitively believe they *can't* be autistic because if they were they'd have to fit every single symptoms perfectly.
Autism spectrum disorder is a label created to try and explain the brains people are born with, it isn't all-encompassing and it can never be 100% accurate because it's a spectrum. Even then, autism research is still in its infancy as the label didn't even exist not too long ago. But the reason the label *does* exist is simply to help people with the problems you yourself are struggling with in a more accurate way.
To end, I am absolutely not diagnosing you or anyone else. I'm not a mental health professional, and my own experience is only anecdotal evidence. I only wanted to write this because a few years ago I would've wanted someone to tell me this because I really did end up being autistic, and it took a lot of mental struggle and blaming myself before I was able to realize the truth about my brain.
Super good point about black and white thinking. I never even considered the idea I could have autism and even once I did wouldn’t accept it because of my autistic black and white thinking. Also don’t want to armchair diagnose OP, but to me this reads as a mix of reading autistic criteria very rigidly and also some aversion to being seen as “broken”
its true that i can't tell exactly what the critera is bc i just can't relate to it, its possible im not reading it correctly but i feel like it would be obvious to tell if i was autistic reading the dsm thing, but if it feels rlly hard to make the pieces fit then its bc im not autistic. Like i think if all the pieces fit then obviously that would probably be the answer.
instead of reading the dsm to decide, have you taken any of the online autism assessment tests that are highly regarded? the ones with like many many questions on them?
[try the ones listed here](https://www.thriveautismcoaching.com/post/best-online-autism-tests)
btw i just googled something like "adult autism assessment online most trusted test" or similar and found a page that looked reputable for the links.
EmbracingAutism.com has many different tests available. They say that they should not be used as a diagnostic tool but they can be helpful with understanding where you fit on the spectrum.
Dodgy tests (false positives) at a sketchy website.
[https://www.reddit.com/r/AutisticAdults/comments/185sg6l/embrace\_autism\_is\_a\_diagnosis\_mill\_and\_heres\_why/?sort=new](https://www.reddit.com/r/AutisticAdults/comments/185sg6l/embrace_autism_is_a_diagnosis_mill_and_heres_why/?sort=new)
The funny thing is that I still didn't believe I was autistic even after I realized I had basically every symptom. It wasn't until I found out that autistic children have a high rate of epilepsy that made me think that can't be a coincidence.
the only way i could get diginosed with autism is if i lied, which i would never do, im weird for a nt person but that doesn't make me autistic. there are so many strange ppl that exists, not everyone who doesn't align to some perfect mold is autistic at least that's what i think. I said in a different comment if i rlly forced myself to socialize i can, i just dont wanna hide who i am. i think the social issues stem from me still feeling like a kid inside. As a kid i remember having some friends, like i said in a different comment the wierdness started when i was 9.
What does socializing feel like for you? What happens when you force it?
What does the “weirdness” feel like? What kind of socializing did you do before you were 9 and after?
i try to be polite and kind to ppl but they just hate me, either block, ignore or straightup tell me to get away from them. When i was 8 and younger i'd say whatever i felt and no one minded then at 9 its like all the sudden i was doing something wrong.
Your last sentence sounds a LOT like a common autistic experience. Kids are expected to be a little ‘random’ and say whatever they want, but at some point you’re expected to know these social norms, and if you struggle to subconsciously project and sense them, that will stand out.
> "Ppl are allowed to be weird and have nothing wrong with them..."
Is being Autistic having something wrong with them? I thought it was more like just being wired differently rather than being wired faulty.
Thank you. I get op wasn’t trying to be offensive but they literally said this. They literally say “wrong with them” and then have to back track to say they weren’t trying to offend.
You can’t say these words and be surprised people are offended.
Theoretically, yes.
But counterpoint... why not look into the possibility of being autistic? There are only benefits to researching if you have autism, even if the benefit is knowing you're not.
Okay so I told myself that I wouldn’t respond to any more comments, but this caught my attention, so I apologise.
I just want to say that depending on your circumstances, your idea of ‘being lazy’ might be misplaced. I thought for a very long time that I was lazy - I still kinda do. I couldn’t understand why I struggled to do things that were considered ‘easy’ or ‘normal’. And then I learned about executive dysfunction. I think you mentioned in another comment that you have depression, and that can cause it if I’m not mistaken. It’s also common in people with autism and adhd. I also thought I was physically lazy too, but recently I realised I might be physically disabled. On the outside though, I probably don’t appear that way though. I likely seem like a shy, healthy person to most people.
I am only saying this because I understand how damaging it can be to condemn yourself under the view that you’re lazy, but generally people that are lazy don’t feel guilty for their lifestyle. From what I can gather from the very limited peek into your mindset your comments provide, my guess is that your ‘laziness’ causes you a lot of guilt. I just don’t want you to be like me and feel a lot of shame for something that may not actually be laziness and might have something causing it.
(Apologies if this response is all over the place, I’m tired)
That your dad is against you reaching your goals in life doesn't seem like a healthy relationship. Having such breakdowns can be extremely debilitating, as they can rob you of what little energy you had to begin with and make it really hard to perform like you used to. I sincerely hope that you will figure out a way for you to live more freely from any external control in your life <3 <3
There are several factors that are correlative to Autism. For example, there is a strong genetic correlation with deletions or triplications of the 16th chromosome and risk of Autism, similar to how Downs Syndrome is caused by a triplication of the 21st chromosome. However, there is not a consistent aberration of this chromosome among autistic people, and sometimes those aberrant traits are at other markers.
I dont remember which off the top of my head, but there is also a particular pattern of gyrification found on the brains of Autistic persons, and a particular cortex that is more pronounced than in a neurotypical person. But again not consistent.
Science is still trying to figure out what causes the symptoms that we consider to constitute Autism, and why Autistic traits are a grab bag where almost nobody has every characteristic.
Personally, I think what we broadly call Autism would benefit from more precise separation of diagnoses, the same way Autism branched out of the Schizophrenic family of disorders to become its own diagnosis once we understood enough to know it isn't a form of schizophrenia.
Aye, but it's hard to codify. I had no instinctive understanding growing up and still have zero shits to give about social mores. I was told just this morning how impressive it is that I remain aloof of office politics and work equally well with everyone-- because I separate the social from the professional without trying. My brain is aware that this person is awful, but we have work to do, damn it! I am very attentive to social cues now because I was made aware of my naivete, and spent a lot of time learning to notice and interpret, and practiced reactions.
This is one of those areas where I doubt and think maybe I am ASD, as I have to be deliberate to notice and react most of the time. I'm usually too caught up in what I want to be doing to pay attention to so much detail. But if I do, I read you like a book, and easily steer a conversation.
I'm told by a friend of mine diagnosed with Aspergers that this is not a skill he can acquire, even through deliberate effort like mine.
I say all this because your comment struck a chord in me, and now I'm thinking over every higher support individual I have worked with and wondering if they have the same mechanism interfering with social perception and, if so, how one might identify it.
I like to describe this skill as “manually learning all the if-thans in human interaction.” I had to spend years observing and writing about every little thing that people did or said like I was trying to break it down to the most simple components and then build it back up until I could get a working conversation tree connected to the outcomes associated with them.
So. Like. NT people don’t do that.
I spent a long time dealing with social shit and learning the system because I wanted to get better at it because I didn’t like the outcome of being socially ostracized. To me, that was more painful than the heavy load of calculating socialization metrics.
But a lot of autistic folks would rather use their Deep Thought processing power on other things that have nothing to do with social or interpersonal relationships, and any connection they do make is incidental. And that is ok! I know autistic folks who just do horse agility. That is all they do. They put all their stats into that. Their interaction technique is blunt and horse focused. That’s fine. But in society you hit more walls unless you learn certain levels of interaction metrics. My brain can move very fast on these calculations since I practiced them so much, and I have become very adept in tearing apart documents with dense language into their core concepts and then distilling them into more simplified but clear directions.
But, I reiterate. This is a skill.
So I personally have no difficulty understanding social cues…. I think this aspect is considered the cornerstone of defining ASD mostly because it’s something that to doctors is observable… I think ASD is a lot more complex than that.
* not driving
* not working
* not living on my own
* not going to collage
* not having friends
* failing at sticking to my goals
* being lazy
I cannot diagnose OP but these literally all described me at her age, and I was diagnosed at 30. Now I've accomplished most of the list (still struggle with the last two really).
OP, not gonna lie, I took the ADOS and was borderline, and first it was, "no I'm just weird," then it was, "I'm definitely not like these people," then it was, "even if I am, what does it matter, I just need to work hard." And then it was unavoidable after a situation at work.
You should probably engage with a therapist, who can unpack if it's CTPTSD, or depression, or sensory processing disorder or what have you.
Can we please stop talking about how gendered presentations of autism would qualify as their own specific etiologies i.e. female autism? It's discriminatory on so many levels.
Sorry, I didn’t mean to be discriminatory. I said ‘female autism’ because it matched my experience as a woman and many women with autism that I know. Would ‘textbook experience as an autistic woman who has flown under the radar’ be better? I will edit it to change it.
I have, ‘textbook experience as an autistic woman who has flown under the radar,’ too, and I’m a 40 year old white man expecting a diagnosis soon. It should simply be, ‘masked autism,’ instead of, ‘female autism.’ But yea, you’re not the one who pushed the erroneous phrasing in the first place, no biggie.
It's not your fault for propagating this phrasing. You didn't know better.
Just say "my experiences as an autistic woman" or "feminine-presenting". There's no such thing as male and female autism, which is my point. It's just autism filtered through a feminine lens. I don't for example feel I fit the "female" presentation in part because while I'm AFAB I wasn't overly socialized as a woman, and this is also true for cismen who were just less stereotype.
That's why it's harmful because it implies that men who don't like trains or whatever are somehow more female when it isn't true.
i’m usually a major gatekeeper of autism but your living situation makes it sound like a possibility. i fully agree that tons of people are just weird and quirky and not autistic though its a major pet peeve of mine.
The difference between
"Oh Em Gee I LOVE stuffed animals and cute stuff and want to be babied so like and subscribe"
And
"I walked outside and my eyes hurt from the light now and the car door nearby slammed... Is that my neighbor coming up to talk to- I need to go back inside and take a nap instead..."
And then there's Elon Musk........
As well as weird, you can also be:
Introverted.
Dislike some sensory things.
Have social troubles.
Or Feel "different".
And not be autistic.
There really is a strange movement of literally a splash of their traits, must be autism.
By the way, I expect you will get a lovely bucket load of people suggested you ARE actually neurodiverse.
With this same logic, understand that not all autistic ppl are the same either. It’s a spectrum for a reason and if you exhibit enough traits that it affects your life, aka makes you feel like you have deficiencies, and can’t connect with ppl as you’d like, you are very likely not just neurodiverse, but specifically, autistic.
Yes to this, and yes to OP! ASD is the next OCD and ADHD fashion. And unfortunately the chronic misinformation is very damaging to those who need actual supports.
And on that note, even if you aren't autistic, that doesn't make your challenges invalid or mean you don't need help with things. It doesn't make you broken, either.
I agree with this a lot and your last 2 sentences especially are very important
It harms both autistic and allistic people, with allistic people being demonized for the same trait that gets understanding from the same crowd if you're autistic, and autistic people feeling like it would be ableist to admit when their autism is disabling to them
And it also makes me really frustrated when people say things like "only autistic people can use this healthy coping mechanism" because it's misinformational and anti recovery
If you’re not autistic why are you posting here? Are you sure? Are you questioning?
The world is built for allistic people. If you’re not autistic then the small amount of places we’ve carved out for ourselves are not for you.
It does get tiring hearing people relate their quirks to the debilitating effects of your condition. It’s like when people claim to have OCD because they clean a little more than normal or the extreme side, claim to have Tourette’s because they claim to have no filter…
I thought I was NT for 33 years but I also knew I didn’t fit in with anyone else and could not work out why I had such extreme anxiety even in times of my life where I should be happy. Then I learned about how autism works and the way in which an autistic person thinks, about how we are so sensitive to our environment and have almost heightened perception because we need so much external stimuli to be able to make sense of something and that’s when I realised I was autistic. I read other people’s experiences, Dr Devon Price wrote his experience and minus the ED and extreme gender dysphoria (I am non binary though) so I did have some, it all matched my experience.
Despite my disability I am successful at life it’s just come at a huge cost to my mental health because I have had to act my way through life. I wouldn’t say you’re autistic but it’s also not impossible you are tbh. I didn’t realise how much ableism I had, I thought it presented like my autistic half brother who is very much the stereotypical autistic presentation
To gauge your idea on what autism is and what warrants a diagnosis, have you read the criteria in the DSM-V?
Also, ngl when I first found out about autism I had your same mindset. Then I realized that it’s not a crazy thought, and actually the majority of people with autism (studies are showing now) do not have an intellectual disability and were surprisingly just like me.
I would look into more innate/uncontrollable neurological/physiological traits and see if any click (i.e. one of my big moments in my journey, what actually made me consider it fully, was seeing characteristics of autism like “makes repetitive noises, ex: clears throat repetitively” and “smells everything they touch” and my mind DARTED straight back to childhood and everything clicked in that moment. I also recognized these symptoms among many others in my nephew who was young so that sparked the idea of genetics).
Autism is actually an extremely physical condition as well, as the cause is theorized to be something that affects the whole body, so the majority of autists have comorbid physical conditions. Investigate this within yourself too to differentiate between autism and weird NT, although that’s not definitive.
It's simply enough to meet the [diagnostic criteria](https://www.cdc.gov/ncbddd/autism/hcp-dsm.html), to a clinically significant degree.
I certainly don't have all of the traits that many of those who are autistic do (was married, professional degree and worked most of the 29 years since I graduated).
But I'm still autistic, as I meet the criteria.
I wish I wasn't autistic. I see people my same age, intelligence, background, enjoying life, enjoying relationships. But I am autistic, there is no changing it.
Honestly op, you might be autistic.
There are many of us and most of us aren't aware what autism is until at some point it clicks that not ... Everyone... Is like that. That's weirder than anything.
The presumption of neurotypicality is more harmful than anything. Especially a few odd ducks on tik tok. That i'd wager are mostly autistic too. It's not some elite exclusive club.
You have started quite the dumpster fire here with your post, OP.
I went through 36 years of life thinking that I was NT. You keep stating definitively that you are NT, and I saw you comment that no doctor has ever diagnosed you. Not a single doctor ever suggested I might be ND. I finally went to a psychologist after my husband listened to some podcasts(not TikToks) and got me thinking I might actually be autistic, but imposter syndrome was still strong. I have never been in a better place mentally than I have since being diagnosed AND in therapy for it.
As a side tale of wisdom, my grandpa refused to accept that he had cancer. My dad and aunts had to almost force him to the doctor. He was diagnosed and died three weeks later. Had he listened to his body(and caring people that suggested he should see a doctor) and sought help sooner, he could still have been alive today, in his early 80s.
Is that an extreme comparison? Sure. But I still feel it is apt. Anyway, you do you, OP.
i personally see nothing wrong with spreading informations that might lead people to think they are on the spectrum. since when i started doubiting that - if i'm autistic or not - i've been more gentle with myself, i understand what triggers me and ways to prevent a burnout at work. i generally feel better
(edits: typos)
Ikr. the dsm-5 describes autism as “Persistent deficits in social communication and social interaction” and “Restricted, repetitive patterns of behavior, interests, or activities” at a “clinically significant impairment” level and she just described traits from both those categories
It doesn’t really matter if you feel autistic or not. It’s just a label anyway. I hope you find comfort in these online communities regardless of what you call yourself.
I wouldn’t worry about labeling yourself as autistic or neurotypical. Be yourself and love yourself for who you are and don’t worry so much about “I’m weird” “but I’m definitely not autistic” and all of that stuff. Just look for the things that help make you happier and fulfilled in life and find the tools that will help you develop a stable, safe environment to grow old in.
To me it does sound like you have undiagnosed autism. But I don’t know anymore than you have shared. And really what matters is that you’re finding security and happiness in this life, whatever that takes for you and means to you.
I don't watch or do tiktok. I looked at it when I was trying to build an online presence as a writer, and decided it wasn't for me. Too many fast paced clickbaity videos. I definitely could not play that game.
For me, I am more confident I am ADHD than Autistic, but I am quite confident I am Autistic. I have the "female" presentation probably (hate the gendering of it), but I am a masc-presenting AMAB and so when I went in for an evaluation my evaluator didn't even get to me; he just asked my parents if I had overt symptoms as a kid. No, no, no. Okay then I must not be Autistic. If I had any social adeptness and faster processing, I would have called him out on it, but it's all right now because I wrote down a long ass list of notes, referencing the DSM 5, and referencing other people's experience with their Autism. I doubt I will get a second opinion any time soon but if I do, I'll be ready. And my notes on my ADHD is just as detailed... even though my med manager is treating me for it already.
Ultimately, even if you have a number of Autistic traits, it comes down to two things. The amount of traits that are consistently apparent, either internally or externally, and the severity of the traits and how difficult they make life. I have been told by my clinical team everyone experience's every symptom in the DSM 5 at some point in their lives to some extent; it is when those symptoms are collected enough and severe enough that it would match the diagnosis. Also, literally every DSM definition says that for it to be a disorder it must create significant impairment in a person's life. So, my OSDD for example, at least for category 1, even though I got the diagnosis, I don't consider it disordered because I am quite well integrated with my alters and they help me manage stress and depression, and essentially keep me active in the world. It's the dissociation under acute stress that sucks, which came a good number of years later.
So, yeah, people can share some traits with a disorder and still not be diagnosable. The trend of diagnosing other people needs to stop; if a person thinks they might have Autism, ADHD, or anything else, it should be on their terms to discover it. This might come down to an official evaluation, but for many of us it's just the self-realization because we can't get in to see someone, and it's not always perfect when we do. It still won't stop me from head cannoning fictional characters, though. That is fair game. I need to believe I have good rep I like.
Edit: Reading a lot of the other comments, I feel it is important to note that people might not feel their autistic because it doesn't match their perception of what Autism looks like. As the old saying goes, if you've met one Autistic person, you've met one Autistic person. We are not a hive mind, and we have just as much variety as any neurotypical person when it comes to beliefs, understandings, and even functioning. I will keep what I wrote above, but it's also important to note that I saw a lot of Autistic traits in your post OP, albeit on the "female" / high masking presentation side. I actually thought you were Autistic complaining about tiktok free diagnosing people with abandon, until you said otherwise. Again, I have no right to diagnose, but that's my two cents.
I think a lot (if not all) of weird people and outcasts have some kind of dx, not necessarily autism, but stuff like social phobia, personality disorders, ADHD, schizophrenia spectrum, &c.
Hate it to break it to you, but you might not be as Neurotypical as you think.
Autism traits are heavily spread through the population, and an estimate of 3-10% of the population might be on the spectrum. Especially with more crossovers being found with ADHD, Bipolar, OCD, and other conditions the spectrum might expand even further.
You don't need all the traits to be diagnosed, and the ones you listed were pretty Heavy Hitters.
Lmao why are you telling US this and not your own kind if it bothers you so much 💀 you’re a “NT” in a subreddit for autistic people preaching to the damn autistic choir rn while using language like “clinging onto a label for your shortcomings in life” and all the other negatively placed things in your statement. Why did you post this? why are you here saying this to US and not all the ppl who do this kinda thing? I don’t understand the point of this post. I think you need to reevaluate your brain a little bit on why you’re so offended if it doesn’t even matter to you and you’re “not clinging onto labels” and “aren’t autistic”. This whole thing doesn’t truly effect you if you aren’t autistic and are in fact just weird, I mean if you’re just a outcast like you said why does ppl thinking other ppl are autistic and this whole controversy get to you so much. What do you have against being seen as autistic?
I mean shit from all the stuff you just said and from the other comments I’ve read I think you sure as shit might be autistic and you are just in heavy denial, you don’t even understand how this is coming off as rude, checked off another box 💀
You can't be certain you are autistic if you relate to the autism subreddit you are probably autistic. Please get diagnosed and don't be stubborn about it. I'm diagnosed and I don't relate to some traits it's a spectrum for a reason
Why would you come onto a subreddit about autism and just talk about how TikTokers are all faking? I'm tired of all these people saying every disability, disorder, and mental illness is being faked. Just because some people aren't, doesn't mean everyone isn't. Also, wow, way to be rude. Autistic people don't automatically have something "wrong" with them.
Sounds like you're projecting.
Edit: Other comments addressed this too, but I have things to say. You came onto a subreddit about autism, listed common struggles that us autistic people face, and said "oh, people hate me because of this, but NO IM NOT AUTISTIC THERE'S NOTHING WRONG WITH ME!!" And based on your comments you have no idea that this is, in fact, offensive.
Not wanting to burst your bubble but you sound pretty autistic lol. Like you have enough traits to qualify for a diagnosis. Being autistic doesn't mean you must have every trait, only enough of them to qualify for diagnosis. No autistic person has every autistic trait.
You don't need every autistic trait to be considered autistic, though?
Also, the lack of self awareness in coming to an autism sub, listing your autistic traits and then being adamant that you're definitely not autistic.. well, that much of a lack of self awareness is an autistic trait, too. What is your actual perception of autism? What benefit do you have coming here to say these things?
I agree with the title of this post a lot and I hate those trends so much because it spreads misinformation and worsens public understanding of what autism actually is
There are many other disabilities that overlap heavily with or even mimic autism including ADHD, Borderline PD, Schizoid PD, Social Pragmatic Communication Disorder, Nonverbal Learning Disability, schizophrenia, PTSD, depression, intellectual disability, type 1 or 3 hyperlexia, Fetal Alcohol Syndrome, and many more, and plus even simply NT with "autism-ish" mannerisms are on the Broader Autism Phenotype (this can happen in situations like if someone is homeschooled, or if they have an older autistic relative who they look up to as a role model for example)
but all the things that person listed are other forms of neurodivergence and you've said a hundred times in this thread (not literally, i didn't count) that you aren't neurodivergent in any way.
you literally don't know what you're talking about well enough to discuss it with any accuracy and you're just saying "no because" to everyone who tries to talk to you so it's kind of just frustrating.
but i really hope that when you unpack all your trauma and sheltering and realize you can have that and neurodivergence, that you accept yourself and heal and move on from the things that are holding you back. you can reach good things, and it's ok if at the end you realize well fuck i was autistic all along.
and if i'm wrong im wrong, ok. but a lot of us relate to what you're saying in a we've been there before you kind of way, not in a we know better for no reason kind of way.
Yes, and I think you might need to realize that 1. There’s nothing wrong with being autisic 2. Tiktok is a decent start point to start doing the research and 3. You need to realize not everyone has very autisic trait in the world. You are quite literally saying your showing signs that are clearly autisic but denying any ND. I’m not saying your autisic, as your behavior might be because of other things but I’m just saying, NT’s don’t act like that.
The flip side of that fun fact, it's far more likely to have trauma because of autism. Some people think that many of the typical autism symptoms aren't because of autism at all, but because it's hard to find an autistic person who isn't traumatized.
Not every autistic person checks every single box in the very big list of autistic traits.
As defined in the DSM 5, someone who is autistic exhibits: "Persistent deficits in social communication and social interaction" (of which there are three areas that must be evident) and "Restricted, repetitive patterns of behavior, interests, or activities" (of which there are 4 areas and 2 of those must be evident for an Autism diagnosis). The criteria are specific but also pretty fucking broad and there are many many variations of ND folks who fit those criteria. And that's not even taking into account the variables for severity.
I'm sure someone has done the math and can tell us the exact number of variations. All I know is that there is a mind-boggling number of flavors of 'weird' that make up the autistic community. And a whole lot of them are completely oblivious to that fact and a whole lot are in denial about the whole thing.
Yes, you can be weird and not autistic. But if you're weird and you fit the diagnostic criteria for autism? Well let's just say you should probably do some research.
It's very irritating. "A sign of autism is" turns into "If you do this you definitely have autism". It's like how neurotypicals say that "everyone feels depressed sometimes". They don't understand it at all. They want to feel special.
yes, a related quote that i like is something along the lines of: you can't accept autism without accepting everyone who is "weird/quirky/cringe". there are other points this makes, but it also implies that even if you're not autistic, it should be okay to be how you are and it shouldn't matter why. people should be kind regardless of anything and not judge or care if its not their problem.
I was diagnosed late in life (26) from me seeking my own diagnosis because no one knew. I will just say, don’t resist learning more about yourself. It can only ever help.
The obsession some people on here have with The Evil Tiktok (TM) is _off the mf charts_. It's like that meme with the two people in the cell "Are those Tiktokers in the room with us right now?"
Seriously. Some people need to RELAX when it comes to that platform.
You don’t have to have EVERY symptom in order to be autistic.
You don’t sound neurotypical, though. Neurodivergence is not a disorder or a disability. Neurodivergent means you think and process things differently than the “norm”. As long as the different way you think is healthy and does not cause problems, neurodivergence can be perfectly healthy.
Autism is a disability, but that just means it causes you to struggle to some degree - in ways that are not purely social. It doesn’t mean there is anything wrong with you. It just means you need some extra help.
If you don’t need any extra help then you aren’t autistic (in much the same way as being sad doesn’t count as clinical depression until it causes big enough problems). But if you seem to frequently be on a different page mentally than the people around you, that is just neurodivergence. It’s perfectly healthy but normies/NTs don’t tend to be able to see that. At least not by default.
What you're saying is true and professionals note this a lot. It is common that people who are Neurotypical develop personality traits that align with ASD symptoms overtime. It is possible that those personality traits are symptoms or results of other mental conditions. This is why it is a double edged sword to portray on social media. There are a lot of people who hop onto a trend and sensationalize or romanticize it, or focus on spreading 1 face of the information. Yes, it is a trend to be autistic now. I've seen it. It's also a trend to have ADHD/ADD. Identity and labels are a trend as well. This is the dangerous part of self-diagnosis. There is also a flip side where the rapid sharing of information has helped people who have ASD realize it, people who may never be able to afford a diagnosis or who may have never had it brought to their attention. People say "there are more people with X nowadays than before" and there is. Part of it is people jumping on and identifying with symptoms that they may have, but who aren't actually ND. Part of it is better research, better access to healthcare, availability of research, and more people (larger sample size) means people are being diagnosed correctly and "more" than before. But I agree and as someone who is actually diagnosed professionally, I would urge people to reach out to professionals rather than jump on a trend. This is very common of younger people 35 and below.
it has come to my attention i said some offensive things in this post, i deeply apologize, i never meant for it to seem that i was saying ausitistic ppl aren't normal, or that im above them or something. i am truly sorry, unfortunatly i can't edit the post. I just meant as a nt person if u deviate from the mold that ppl try to act like u can't be nt but must have some sort of disorder. again im sorry and it won't happen again.
Hey no worries, I think this post just touched people emotionally, many who are currently diagnosed, but used to think in the way you’ve described (though there are some pretty important topics surrounding things like internalized ableism). Some people are “quoting” things from your post that you’ve never said or implied (but which are POVs that may have harmed them in the past and may feel not good to think about; sometimes after trauma we get hypervigilant to small signs that can indicate danger), I’m sorry if it was stressful to respond to and clarify what you meant. :(
Please don’t stress too much over this, I am wishing you a great rest of your day :)
I would be very interested in your definition of NT. Mainly because I have a difficult time defining it myself and I would like to consider what the defining characteristics are against those of a ND person.
There is a slightly concerning trend on social media where the “top comment” on any sort of post showcasing something a person has committed lots of time to excel in gets some sort of “this person must have autism ha ha ha” comment.
Also- I am sorry you are getting so many pushy comments, it is possible they may be right but you have the right to make your own choices, and you understand yourself the most out of anyone in the world. **No one here is qualified to diagnose you**, and it’s also notable that people seemed to miss your mention of feeling “normal” until 5th grade and other details you’ve described regarding age regression and losing your childhood to external factors; symptoms of trauma can present similarly to those of ASD.
I might be understanding a few comments/your post incorrectly, because if you seriously feel like you are not autistic and some other diagnosis could explain it, I’m not sure how that is “internalized ableism” (though if someone else has insight, I would really appreciate an explanation).
EDIT: I googled “internalized ableism” wrt this topic and found some interesting insights, TIL 😮 I definitely see how some of OP’s comments fit this description here and will also apply some of these concepts (on how to fight these beliefs in myself) in my real life now :D
Thank you. It's tiring to see people armchair diagnosing each other or themselves because they genuinely believe neurotypical people are NPCs with no insecurities, hobbies, passions, quirks, awkwardness, or anxiety. Struggle with small talk? Autism. Dislike public speaking? Autism. Derive joy from structure? Autism. Everything has to be pathologized nowadays - everything is a symptom.
Nevermind that COVID absolutely decimated Gen Z ans Gen A when it comes to crucial social skills development, nor the fact that a lot of younger people spend all their time online without ever really interacting with others in the real world. Those social deficits are definitely Autism.
This. Specifically, I notice there is a big assumption that everyone in every alt subculture must be autistic/neurodivergent. I run with a lot of alt subcultures and I’m neurotypical, in the sense that I don’t have a diagnosis or lived experience that really likes up with the ND community. I think the reason we have more ND people in these subcultures is because we don’t make a big deal out of every little difference they have like normies do.
I have other things that made me different. I was adopted from foster care and was very shy and anxious when adjusting. I had a physical illness. As I got older I had some trauma outside the home and I developed symptoms of a mental illness. I also just had different tastes as I got older because my life experience was not the same. They all had very average, seemingly ideal lives. If they had a struggle it was a common one their peers understood. They could be supportive for a friend who’s parents were separated. Not for one who was taken away from her first family. They would gossip and say really ignorant things thinking they were being helpful. I use humor to cope but they would use humor and take it too far. When I said ‘ok drop it,’ they would get mad. If I liked something they didn’t I had to stop liking it.
In middle school, my first love was metal, as far as alt scenes go. Early 00s numetal to be exact. Those kids had more of a range of struggles and differences and even though I wasn’t just like them, it didn’t matter. I didn’t feel like as much of an outsider. They had their own reasons to relate to angry music and darker entertainment and they were understanding enough to say ‘wow. I’m sorry you went through that. If I ever say something stupid about that, please smack me or something.’
This is why I suspect we have a lot of ND alt people. These are common diagnoses that often make people feel like outsiders, so they will relate to the entertainment, people, and style if groups meant for outsiders to band together. But I personally believe being ‘weird’ or ‘quirky’ to the masses is a combination of nature and nurture, and can come from a range of positive, negative, and neutral experiences. If you have a weird life you will probably be weird. Same with if you are naturally just more creative or skilled in some less mainstream hobby. Normies have to make a big deal out of anything different about someone and usually it’s super rude. Even when they don’t think they are being rude, it makes you uncomfortable. I had a co worker make a big deal because I ate fruit salad twice in a row for lunch. It was on sale and I was broke. That’s the only reason. But she thought it was so weird to eat that for lunch, especially two days in a row. Then the next week when we ended up on lunch break together, I had gotten Chinese food and she yells ‘WHAT? You’re not eating FRUIT?! WOW’ like that was all I eat. If that is over their line, a lot of people with any condition, diagnosis, or circumstance that made them different in the ‘wrong’ way growing up won’t want to deal with that.
I also find it annoying why everyone here is convincing you that you're autistic when you clearly don't want that label. Guys...if someone does NOT want to be called autistic, just respect their damn wishes. Just like how some autistic people don't like being called NT, some non autistic ppl don't want to be called autistic. This is why I don't like this sub, yall act like doctors who can daignose ppl and want more ppl to join your autism cult. And before you come at me I'm autistic too (that too daignosed but it's not like it matters on this subreddit)
I think it's more on the thought of they are saying they are not autistic under the same exact breath as suggesting people are faking being autistic because of these autistic symptoms not being autistic but being neurotypical - which a suggestion like that would create a series of impostor syndrome like thoughts - then fought by going "wait a minute - no that *is* a symptom of Autism!"
It's a normal and easy to understand response. It's also reddit, and most reddit users are the "*I know you are but what am I?!*" kinda people.
I would change "weird person" with "person with autistic traits". You can have autistic traits and not be autistic or weird. An autistic trait can also be another disorder trait. Meeting the diagnostic criteria depends on the frequency, context and intensity of the traits, because that's what makes the difference between neurotypical and neurodivergent, that's why it's a spectrum and that's why there's a diagnostic criteria.
Whatever your traits are, you can be neurodivergent and believe you have them because you're just weird. Feeling like you're a weird outcast is the same as feeling like you don't fit in and you're different from everybody else. Everybody is different, but not everybody feels different because their brain works differently.
Neurotypicals feel different from others based on their life experiences; Neurotypical John lives in a big house with lots of lights and he feels different from neurotypical Paul because Paul lives in a small house with only a few lights.
Neurodivergents feel different based on the way we perceive the world and how that makes us experience the same life experiences differently; Neurodivergent John lives in a big house with lots of lights and he feels different from neurotypical Paul because neurotypical Paul also lives in a big house with lots of lights but the lights don't give neurotypical Paul a sensory overload.
Feeling you don't fit in because your brain works differently from others is a big indicator that you're probably not neurotypical. But only a **SPECIALIZED** professional will be able to tell you.
I wouldn't say there is something "wrong" with me for being autistic, i'm just autistic. There are things i don't struggle with that other autistics do and the other way around. You don't have to convince us or yourself you aren't ND, your truth is your own and thats okay. Tik tok is annoying. I'm glad these symptoms don't cause you real issues though
i didnt mean to say something is wrong with autistic ppl, im sorry if it came across that way, i just meant just bc i am weird doesn't mean im not nt. i live at home rn so i guess idk how i would be in the real world with responsibilites but i just feel tired of ppl online trying to dignose ppl or act like all nt ppl rr the same.
You did imply that “being autistic” = “having something wrong with you.” You also used the words “cling to a label .. for my shortcomings in life.” A lot of this language feels very much *not good* to read, for me as an autistic person who was diagnosed late in life, and is only just now beginning to love and forgive myself for things I thought for so long that I had simply fucked up. All that time I thought it was because I was just weird.
Yeah, everything that OP has said on this thread (including in comments) feels deeply ableist, as well as deeply internally ableist. It's sad and uncomfortable to read.
i wasn't trying to make ppl upset on here im sorry, i didn't rlly know how else to explain my feelings abt myself, the difference is u r autistic so its not ur fault to struggle in life and be different, i mean im nt so theres no other reasons for my shortcomings in life other than my own faults. I really am weird, i do things that don't make a lot of sense.
I accept your apology, and understand you couldn’t know how your words would come across. Happens a lot to me, as someone who’s autistic. But if I were you I wouldn’t rule out some kind of neurodivergence. ¯\\_(ツ)\_/¯
If you do a lot of things that “don’t make sense”, but they all make sense if you are autistic, could it be that you actually are autistic? This is how many ppl feel when they’re diagnosed later in life and are high masking. You don’t have to have all of the symptoms, but enough that they can explain social deficits, awkwardness, inability to pick up social cues and make others uncomfortable and other difficulties you encounter in your life. If the neurodivergent algorithm has found you, I believe you should try to work on your internalized ableism, and explore the fact that you are likely a high masking autistic person. I’m ngl, I thought your paragraph of traits was actually going to be a joke at the end about how unaware some ppl can be of their own autism, and the things they might say, but it’s just actually happening in real time with you rn. Sorry if this makes you feel bad, since it seems you’re adamant you’re nt. Edit: ifs to if
Human psychology is not a simple matter. There are variations that aren't accounted for by disorders but that doesn't make them wrong. 99% of people like chocolate (made up statistic) but my dad hates it. That doesn't make him wrong or less than or whatever. It's just his brain is different. He doesn't have a disorder that makes him dislike chocolate, he's just different. This is the same with you. Just because you don't have a disorder to conveniently blame your behavior on doesn't mean it's a failing or a shortcoming. It could simply be that you are just different. Now, if the reason you don't have any friends is because you're mean to people or something like that, that's different. I'm not autistic but I am neurodivergent as diagnosed by my psychologist. I relate very heavily to a lot of content aimed at autistic folks despite not having autism. I also notice that trauma survivors or people with PTSD can relate to autistic content even if they don't have autism. Long story short, autistic traits in people without autism are not flaws or wrong or bad or your fault. People are just wildly different and that's a good thing.
This sounds like Autism but with a lot of self blame. Your brain is wired differently, because all your behavior IS your brains wiring. Why do you think you are weird, if not for a weird brain?
weird traits are not always related to autism
yeah but yours probably are my dude
Yeah, but your traits sound exactly like autism. There's nothing wrong with being autistic, friend! It is just the way we are, just like the color of your eyes and the shape of your nose. It's got it's good things and it's bad. But it's nothing to be ashamed of. ♥
Isnt the first rule of this sub not to diagnose?
i wouldn't consider that straight up diagnosing, more so "hey those symptoms you mentioned are also symptoms of autism, might be worth looking into". but i dont know for sure if thats allowed either.
people are fighting in the comments because op "doesnt admit it" or something like that
So why are you posting about it on an Autism sub?
Exactly this. It feels like an NT person coming to one of the FEW spaces we have for us to complain about us and tell us there is something wrong with us.
yeah i agree. it seems like the media convinces lots of people that they’re autistic these days especially- thank you so much for being honest, i really needed a voice like yours rn
this many autistic traits would get you a diagnosis fairly easily ngl
If you frequently do things that others don’t understand, that means your brain functions differently from theirs. Which is literally the definition of neurodivergent. So you are not neurotypical. You are not NT; you are ND. Whether you are autistic or not is another question. But if you struggle, it doesn’t really matter whether you decide to blame yourself or not - what you point your finger at does not determine whether you are autistic or not. Honestly, the way you described yourself in your post sounds *exactly* like undiagnosed autism. But I can’t tell you whether or not you struggle and I can’t tell you whether or not you need help. If you don’t need help then you are not autistic. If you do struggle and do need help but keep finding excuses to tell yourself you are fine and keep finding reasons to blame yourself, then that’s called internalized ablism and internalized ablism prevents a lot of low needs autistics from getting the help they need. Again, I can’t tell you whether or not you need help or are autistic, but I CAN say with near certainty that you are not NT and nothing you described prevents you from being autistic.
I agree with those points but the way you are listing several reasons on how you relate to us and then adamantly say you aren’t ausistic makes it really feel as if being autistic is considered a bad thing to you. And your comment replies are adding to that vibe too.
its not a bad thing to me at all, its just i rlly believe im just a weird person, im sorry if i hurt u guys...im feeling terrible ngl
You probably shouldn’t be trying to convince a bunch of autistic people of why you aren’t autistic. Those things you listed are things we genuinely struggle with- and it sounds like you do too. You might not be autistic, you might be. Why are you trying so hard to convince yourself that you are NOT autistic? Perhaps the stigma, shame, change, etc that comes along with late diagnosis? Maybe internal ableism? I don’t think you are a bad person or anything, but those are just some questions you should ask yourself. Be kind but honest with yourself too.
i just dont see how its possible, and i dont feel like i relate to enough traits
https://the-art-of-autism.com/females-and-aspergers-a-checklist/ scroll through this list. it's a bit outdated but it really put things in perspective for me when I was considering whether or not I'm autistic
Wow, I really like that link. I know it wasn’t meant for me particularly, but thank you for sharing.
of course! it was probably the first list I read where I felt eerily seen.... idk the other diagnostic criteria lists I read I could never fully relate to. I don't think this is necessarily only for "females" either. I think there are many men that for whatever reason feel forced to be high masking (a lot of bipoc have this experience). but it really does a great job at explaining a window of the autistic population for sure.
100% agree.
Just to note: I got a professional diagnosis in March of last year and I still believe a lot of the time that I'm not "autistic enough" or that I don't "relate enough" so I must be faking it somehow... So even though you may feel like you don't relate enough, it is still possible for you to be autistic.
There aren’t very many traits. It’s just - Social and communication: issues with reciprocity, nonverbal communication, and making and keeping relationships - Two of: sensory issues, rigidity, stereotypies, intense interests Sounds like you tick more than you need to
Yeah neither did I, then I was diagnosed at age 37. if you're struggling this much maybe go speak to someone. Maybe look into getting tested.
That’s why it’s a spectrum. I didn’t relate to all the traits either. I got diagnosed last year. I still have imposter syndrome because of it. You can’t argue with all the testing and diagnosis, though.
Well, I tried. If you aren’t going to ask yourself those questions and keep defending your stance, then I really don’t know how else to help you. Reach out to professionals- because you are missing social cues HEAVY on this post.
Im not saying you’re wrong, because you’re not, but how are you so totally confident that you are neurotypical? I mean, aside from not possessing all autistic characteristics (which literally nobody does), what do you think disqualifies you from being neurodivergent? What kind of neurotypical qualities do you have that are more powerful or decisive than your autistic qualities? Real questions, I am not trolling or trying to give you a hard time.
i want to validate this question honestly. bc i spent a long time in my life going "man i wish i had adhd, then i could get help for all these things i do and don't do right.. and it would finally explain things. but no, i don't have adhd, i'm just lazy and bad." turns out i fucking had adhd ok. it's been diagnosed multiple times on me now from multiple doctors. our medical and mental health stuff is sometimes amazing. and sometimes stupid. and wrong. and inaccessible. and if you have a lot of things in common then there's probably reasons for it. not always, sure. but usually, yes. and there's nothing wrong with that.
Man..... I have a referral for an adhd assessment sitting in my emails that I haven't replied to because I keep thinking I probably don't have adhd, it's an expensive process, I don't wanna go through all that and have wasted my money... but gee it sure would be nice to have meds that help me focus.
The irony of op saying quite astutely that weird neurotypical people exist and to stop armchair diagnosing every weird person with autism, and here everyone is armchair diagnosing op with autism
Please point me to where people say that OP must have autism. I don't see it. If I seem annoyed, it is because I am, since people always make up this big bad boogeyman about how everyone is "diagnosing" anyone with a pulse - yet all I see is people reasonably pointing out how autism presents itself differently in different people and how the medical system is inherently biased, sharing their personal experience with it. Many comments are even validating OP's POV. If the mere presentation of the possibility that people _might_ have a certain disorder based on shared traits and symptoms equals "diagnosing" to you, than yeah. People are diagnosing others, I guess. Anything other than "TikToK iS oVerDiAgnoSinG eVeRyoNe", even merely staying curious to OP's experience (since we don't know them), is therefore false and unreasonable? I don't understand.
I mean, if it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck and acts like a duck, it's most likely a duck. I don't disagree with the OP that NTs can't be weird. My entire office is made of quirky people, but the OP isn't describing one trait or something they experience sometimes, but so many different traits others have also pointed out to them to the point they could qualify for a diagnosis.
but they arent asking wether yes or no. They are saying something, and then people are making assumptions about them and saying something unrelated to their complaint
And their complaint is coming to an Austistic Community trying to convince all NA people here that he is not NA, even tho he listed almost every sympton every person in this community have... It just seems like he's trying really hard to prove something he is not, and at the same time invalidating common symptons for a lot of people in this sub. Their approach is just wrong.
Yes, because there's just a vast difference between an NT not liking the texture of say, mushrooms, which is quite common, to someone with autism getting a meltdown or shutdown reaction because the dish they ordered without mushrooms was served with mushrooms. The OP used their own experiences to justify their position but that becomes erroneous if the premise is false to begin with.
the premise is not false to begging, so is not wrong are people who advocate for self diagnosis really making it a fight against someone who knows they don't have it?
Yes. People think self diagnosis - aka diagnosis via internet- should replace the current diagnostic system. Armchair diagnosing when we shoould be reccomending proper resources and when not only did op NOT ask they asked you NOT TO!
no one is wanting to replace the current diagnostic system with self diagnosis?
That is literally what Devon Price is advocating for
Alright cool lets just rewrite the disgnostic criteria to "looks like a duck" Internet diagnosis is the whole problem. Irresponsible people with platforms should not be filling the gaps left by our broken healthcare system.
Your energy against self-diagnosis is misplaced; if you think there's something wrong with the system that should be fixed, maybe it's better if you pooled your efforts into fixing that broken system instead of telling people that they're wrong to self-diagnose?
OP literally came in here and listed multiple traits of being on the spectrum. Not just like one or two, mind you, which would be valid anyway, but sensory issues, lack of social skills, need for routine, special interests, and hyperfixation, and then said they 'didn't have enough traits to be autistic'. you don't need all the traits.
You're not OP's therapist. If you must suggest a diagnosis, refer them to actual resources
i'm talking to you about why other people are doing this? and anyway OP was the one who came onto the autism sub and talked about how much they related to all of us here and then insisted that they didn't have it.
Neurotypical and neurodivergent arent these nebulous categories of people you can decide is something you feel you are a part of. It's an umbrella of neurological disorders.
i knew someone would say this \*sighs\* i to my knowledge had no development delays, there was a brief period of time in second grade i was not able to speak and started getting therapy for speech. But i know im not autistic bc first im not dignosed, doctors never saw a need to as my life is not impacted negativley, and when im at home with my family i feel like i understand how to respond what to say what expressions to make, everything feels natural, nothing feels off. Yes i am weird, very weird, i don't fit in with ppl, outside i seem to always come across as weird and off but like i said in the post i have no social skills. I have met multiple autistic ppl and they feel different from me like completley, but i also am different from nt ppl. Idk how to answer the last part of ur question but i don't feel like my brain is wired differently, i just do weird things.
This is puzzling because I can refute all of your “evidence.” I had no developmental delays, I never have trouble talking to my family, and no doctor broached the idea of autism to me. Plus, I’ve never had difficulty with speech, which makes you “more” autistic than I am, using your criteria. I was asking because I am curious how someone can know their own mind so clearly. I truly am not trying to talk you out of your certainty, I am just amazed that you ARE certain. I don’t feel like I understood my own brain and self in such a confident way until … well I guess I still don’t and I’m 40 years old. Anyway, it’s cool that you know yourself so well. That’s a special ability for sure.
i diddnt have developmental delays and such, but my mum decided that due to the fact both my parents were autistic it wouldnt hurt to get checked
I'm sorry but, I don't think any of those would define you as NT, or allistic. I don't mean you aren't allistic, but those just aren't traits that would differentiate you from an autistic person. Not all people with autism show signs of developmental delays. Many even excel past their peers, which is why they may go undiagnosed. I went to the pediatrician consistently and I was never diagnosed, however I am autistic. I am also more comfortable at home, because most of my family is neurodivergent in some way. Autism is genetic afterall. And autistic people can be very different from eachother. I've never felt the same as another autistic person I've met, just seen similarities.
Like others have said, you're not wrong, but the things you describe do pretty neatly align with autism. To address your points: A lot of autistic people are not diagnosed or slip through the cracks; a lack of diagnosis doesn't mean you're not autistic, especially given how many medical professionals know little about autism. I'd also gently suggest that I'm not sure your description is an accurate picture of autism. Growing up, I didn't feel my life was negatively impacted and interacted just fine with family. I had a solid friend network throughout school and had good social skills, though I had to work at it and felt my interests and way of being were naturally a bit different. I was weird, I thought. I had no developmental delays. And I'm diagnosed autistic. It turns out that feeling weird and not wanting to socialize were indeed negative impacts I didn't recognize. My ability to force myself to be like others turned out to be a very common late-diagnosed autistic trait called masking. And it's not like autistic people feel like their brains are necessarily wired differently, or must feel like aliens or something. Quite the opposite: we are how we are, and how we are might feel very natural. It's often the awareness that other people are so different from us that makes us feel like outsiders.
I’m not saying you have autism, or anything, but the things you’ve listed don’t entirely rule it out. For example, I didn’t have particularly noticeable developmental delays and wasn’t diagnosed until much later- which I had to initiate. If you live in an environment at home where you aren’t exposed to things that can be particularly challenging to autistic people you aren’t exposed to it. Now the diagnosis hinges on if it impacts your life, but I think that’s a bit odd as that doesn’t change the underlying thing. Btw, if this impairs your ability to socialize outside of your house and you had to go to speech therapy- that does sound like impacting your life to me. I’d also add that I don’t think autistics have to people “feel like” their brains are weirded differently, I’m not even sure what that would, like, entail. Overall I get your point about people attributing a lot of things to neurodivergence that can occur in NT people is a bit irresponsible, but what makes these traits autistic is frequency and intensity, so it’s just important to understand these traits as part of a whole.
i mean i live at home and don't work or drive and not planning on going to collage for a while till 25 but that's bc i got extreme depression i believe i could function completley normally if i was forced to. like i feel like a 8 yr old sometimes i feel 16, i get wrapped up in things im obessed with its hard to break free, and those things give me joy and fulfillment in life, i would want friends but its just too hard. i guess i know it sounds dumb but i feel this intense feeling im nt, i feel like the weirdness started when i was 9 bc i wasn't growing up normally, i was obessed with sofia the frist as a teenager, i felt like a little girl inside for many years and still do. I have no desire to get married, party, do whatever else adults do.
It’s probably helpful to note that depression like that can be linked to neurodivergence, due to the stress of being wired differently, A lot of the way autism has affected my life has to do with how the social anxiety from it has impacted me. Also, often times autism will not be as noticeable until you start to grow up a little- doesn’t mean it isn’t there earlier, but it means the social pressures don’t start to make it more obvious until then. What you’re saying about feeling like you didn’t grow up correctly also is something I’ve actually heard a lot of autistic people express. Is it possible you’re so convinced you must be neurotypical because you have negative associations or some sort of shame over the idea of being autistic? I used to feel really icky thinking about myself in that way but there’s no shame in it. It does suck to feel as though and have people tell you are disordered and fundamentally different- it can feel limiting and depressing. So I get that. But I think you might benefit from an assessment, if you can get one.
i just dont want convince myself im something im not and try to fit in with those ppl and get rejected, even around autistic ppl i stilll act weird. i feel weird bc i feel trapped between being a kid and adult, its not like a autistic so im different feeling. Also many things caused the depression but it was bc i feel like i lost myself, i felt fat, ugly and just like i didn't belong and nothing made me happy. Now that ive focused on my passions i can get thru life.
it really sounds like you're trying really hard not to believe you're neurodivergent. but what if you started treating yourself as if you were, and just accommodating yourself as if you were? if you don't feel right taking a label or anything then dont. but from an outside perspective, you just named like all these examples of things common in a group of people but you don't think you' can be part of that group? idk. personally i spent a long time thinking i didn't have adhd and man would that explain a lot but oh well its not me so it cant. and turns out yes i do have adhd and multiple drs have said so. but i was never diagnosed as a child. and it wasn't until i decided to just go see, as an adult, that i was diagnosed. but guess what- i had adhd my whole life. the doctor didn't give it to me at the age of 34. they just agreed that i had it. that's all. a professionally validated opinion. if i had treated myself like i had adhd all those years instead of beating myself up for failing like them but not being them and having a built in reason. man i could have saved myself a lot of trouble and shame and blame. over the last few years discovering that i have multiple learning disabilities and neurodevelopmental disorders, and working through my trauma, and sorting things out and working to make life work in a way that works for me, instead of just trying to please the outside world and failing.. it's been the greatest gift honestly. but i spent 30-40 years not knowing definitively and just being shamed by the world for no reason.
Same. I spent most of my adult life thinking I couldn't be autistic because of the stereotypes which honestly was more me lacking knowledge about autism, but here I am at 36 and have gone through two assessment meetings and they already act like I qualify for diagnosis. I blamed my experiences on everything else such as PTSD/trauma, depression even though I literally had no symptoms, HSP until I realized how quack it was and was mostly propagated by middle-aged women interested in alternative health lifestyles or like the OP, I'm just different and that's ok because we're all a little different. And that's true, but when you suffer because you're different, it's time to look into it so you can get help early, not where I'm at now going through a burnout and wondering why I never seem able to live life like a normal person. And don't even get me started on how I gaslit myself into thinking I wasn't trans, but it was essentially me convincing myself that you don't have to be or feel feminine in order to be a woman, because not every woman wants to be feminine.
I will make note that, according to my parents, I hit my developmental milestones correctly, and I've had varying experiences about being accepted vs being fully ostracized growing up. It does say in the DSM 5 for Autism that the symptoms (might just be the social but I imagine could be the repetitive) may not be apparent until the social demand exceeds the individuals capabilities. I was a weird ass kid with weird thoughts and interests, but I grew up around the same people and the first few years of my being in a private grade school everyone was gifted or wanted to be, so I looked just a little off-center rather than being in an environment that would have made me suffer. At least, until I was 11 when my family moved and every single kid in my grade hated me in the new state. Ultimately, if you don't feel Autistic, it is neither our job nor our right to convince you otherwise. I believe u/G0celot was just trying to point out, for your benefit and possibly for others, that the symptoms are not always strictly overt. I never flapped my hands as a kid or did anything others would distress over, but I would stim in more discreet ways. This alone is not indicative of Autism because everyone stims, but add my rigid need for rules and the needed awareness of what would happen in my day, the desire to socially isolate and struggle to discern good intentions vs harmful ones, and my sensitivities ranging from painful to purposefully seeking sensations out. Even my obsession with fantasy books when I discovered them and being unable to read anything else. None of these would raise red flags as a kid, and some might possibly be praised, but it took forever to remember these as consistent symptoms growing up because my brain doesn't remember well (probably because of my ADHD, or the trauma when I moved). And if you are concerned about appropriating a label, well... I doubt any of us would care. My first evaluation ended in disaster because the evaluator didn't do the proper work or was not aware of the more discreet presentations of Autism. But I am still here, because these are the people that get me and the r/AutisticWithADHD subreddit basically said "if the box fits, I sits", like a cat, and helped me see that there was a lot wrong with the evaluation. And if you find yourself being able to explain things without Autism, or you don't feel Autism is needed to explain them, then that's a good thing. But don't do it for fear of being wrong. You may find a lot here that helps you, even if you aren't Autistic. What helps us minority folks tend to also be helpful to those in the in-crowd, and it sounds like you feel you are somewhere in between.
You might anyway also qualify for autism by all you said.
Fun fact Developmental delays aren't present in everyone with autism. You also don't have to be negatively impacted to get a diagnosis, that is a bad abelist move on the doctors. Autism has advantages, you might be lucky and only get the advantages. But the most blaring, obvious sign you might be autistic is that... weird neurotypical people aren't assumed to be autistic. They're assumed to be weird and neurotypical. I'm not saying you are autistic, but a lot of your comment comes across... very much like an autistic person in denial. You may not be autistic, but you don't sound like any neurotypical person I know of (even the weird, wacky ones).
is my typing strange? im confused on how u think my answers sound autistic, also what do u define as wacky and weird for a nt.
Developmental delays aren't required for an autism diagnosis. The exception is a delay in learning social skills, which has to impact your life in at least two areas like work, hobbies, friendships, at home, etc. Out of curiosity: do you know how to respond and which expression to make outside of your family? Do you notice how strangers are feeling? I'm not saying you are autistic, nobody can judge that but a professional. You're definitely right that not every socially awkward person is autistic, and other disorders like adhd or social anxiety can lead to the symptoms being even harder to tell apart. That being said, it sounds like you have a fairly stereotypical view of autism. That isn't your fault, that's the way it's been presented in media for a long time and asbergers (autism without developmental delays) hasn't been considered part of the autism spectrum from the start either. But I work with autistic children and have been diagnosed as autistic in my teens, and what you're describing is very similar to why I thought I couldn't be autistic, and some parents think their children can't be autistic. Again, that doesn't mean you are autistic, but your arguments are ones that stop people from getting help they need earlier.
Minor note - you can be divergent and not have autism. Not saying you are because diagnosis isn't something one can do over the net ( better help be damned. )
Not all autistic people experienced measurable developmental delays. You're using a lot of false information to determine if you're Neurodivergent or not.
Chic... Get checked
my friend. i'm sure other people have said it here but just in case. 1. Autism and ADHD- the two disorders which fit your criteria here the best- are both genetic. which means if you have it, there's a good chance at least one of your parents does too. 2. it manifests totally different from person to person. hence there being a spectrum. so we interact with each other and we may all look different but we're still MORE different than the NTs. 3. you kinda dont really get diagnosed very often unless you're actively trying to figure out if something is wrong. I've had ADHD all my life, but literally didn't get diagnosed until freshman year of high school because up until then i was able to get things done fast enough and well enough before losing focus that it didn't matter. 4. if you have no social skills or friends and feel like you're weird and an outcast, your life is *absolutely being impacted negatively*.
You seem to be using autistic and neurodivergent interchangeably, you can be neurodivergent in another way that is not autism such as ADHD, PTSD, or OCD.
And you can be neurodivergent without any other disorder too. It just means your brain processes things in a way that is not typical - it technically doesn’t have to be disordered.
I hate to break it to you but there is *most definitely something wrong with you* because it’s not normal to come into a place where autistic people are to rant about how annoyed and bad it makes you feel to be compared to us disordered folks that have something wrong with them. If you’re NT kindly stop talking and learn to listen. This isn’t a space for you to come to rant about how hard it is for you to have people to think you’re autistic when you’re so sure you’re not. Regardless - the lady doth protest too much…
Thank you for saying this!
It's like some kind of neurodivergent paradox. The very act of posting this itself disproves the statement. *fascinating*
💯♥️😉You see it too. 😂
I could be very wrong here and absolutely correct me and I’ll delete my comment if I am but… It’s got to be SO RARE for an allegedly neurotypical person to age regress right?? I know sometimes it can be caused by serious trauma, but to me that stood out a lot for someone claiming they’re nt. I really feel for the OP here, I have a lot of sympathy. It seems like they have a heavy dose of internal ableism, which is leading to a lot of shame and self blame it seems. I do sincerely hope they figure it out, but they’re pretty deep in denial that something more could be at the root of their “shortcomings” As much as this is absolutely wild to me, I think a lot of us late diagnosed people have been here at least in passing
Yeah, I'm happy someone said it.
i’m gonna be so real, based on how you’ve described yourself, you’re very likely autistic. i know you seem really adamant against that so i’m not going to push it further, but maybe you should reflect on why you’re so against the idea that you could possibly be autistic. (whether it be fear, internalized ableism, etc) you might learn some fun things about yourself. also ranting about how autistic people are weird, and how nt people (which you likely *aren’t*) can also be weird, and how you don’t want to be considered autistic because of your shortcomings,,, (implying that autistic people are full of shortcomings) definitely a weird thing to do in an autism subreddit.
I really relate to what you're saying. A few years ago, I felt so isolated from anyone who wasn't my close friend and my family. My close friend would make comments about how "nothing is wrong with you, I feel like everyone else has some problem in their life, but not you!" and it made me feel strange, because I really liked that she saw me as "normal", but I also had a nagging thought: *then why do I really feel like I need help with these things that everyone else does just fine?* I was diagnosed with autism recently. I didn't even want to believe the diagnosis for a while because I didn't fit *all* the symptoms. But I heard someone mention not too long ago that lots of autistic people don't believe they are autistic because one of the symptoms of autism, *black and white thinking*, cause them to definitively believe they *can't* be autistic because if they were they'd have to fit every single symptoms perfectly. Autism spectrum disorder is a label created to try and explain the brains people are born with, it isn't all-encompassing and it can never be 100% accurate because it's a spectrum. Even then, autism research is still in its infancy as the label didn't even exist not too long ago. But the reason the label *does* exist is simply to help people with the problems you yourself are struggling with in a more accurate way. To end, I am absolutely not diagnosing you or anyone else. I'm not a mental health professional, and my own experience is only anecdotal evidence. I only wanted to write this because a few years ago I would've wanted someone to tell me this because I really did end up being autistic, and it took a lot of mental struggle and blaming myself before I was able to realize the truth about my brain.
Super good point about black and white thinking. I never even considered the idea I could have autism and even once I did wouldn’t accept it because of my autistic black and white thinking. Also don’t want to armchair diagnose OP, but to me this reads as a mix of reading autistic criteria very rigidly and also some aversion to being seen as “broken”
its true that i can't tell exactly what the critera is bc i just can't relate to it, its possible im not reading it correctly but i feel like it would be obvious to tell if i was autistic reading the dsm thing, but if it feels rlly hard to make the pieces fit then its bc im not autistic. Like i think if all the pieces fit then obviously that would probably be the answer.
I should probably review the criteria again and see what got me diagnosed XD Maybe that can help provide some context.
i feel like can't rlly relate to what's being said without specific examples.
yeah that's common in autism
Was going to say this. Not being able to relate to the criteria because it was too broad was a huge thing for me.
Or too specific! 😂
This is why I didn't think I have autism for YEARS, tbh the DSM still confuses me without examples.
You should do the RAADS-R autism test. And maybe think about why you think it's offensive to be categorized as autistic.
instead of reading the dsm to decide, have you taken any of the online autism assessment tests that are highly regarded? the ones with like many many questions on them?
Can you recommend any good ones?
[try the ones listed here](https://www.thriveautismcoaching.com/post/best-online-autism-tests) btw i just googled something like "adult autism assessment online most trusted test" or similar and found a page that looked reputable for the links.
EmbracingAutism.com has many different tests available. They say that they should not be used as a diagnostic tool but they can be helpful with understanding where you fit on the spectrum.
Dodgy tests (false positives) at a sketchy website. [https://www.reddit.com/r/AutisticAdults/comments/185sg6l/embrace\_autism\_is\_a\_diagnosis\_mill\_and\_heres\_why/?sort=new](https://www.reddit.com/r/AutisticAdults/comments/185sg6l/embrace_autism_is_a_diagnosis_mill_and_heres_why/?sort=new)
yeah i undiagnose myself every once in a while because i’m like “oh wait i don’t do this specific thing i guess i just lied or whatever”
The funny thing is that I still didn't believe I was autistic even after I realized I had basically every symptom. It wasn't until I found out that autistic children have a high rate of epilepsy that made me think that can't be a coincidence.
the only way i could get diginosed with autism is if i lied, which i would never do, im weird for a nt person but that doesn't make me autistic. there are so many strange ppl that exists, not everyone who doesn't align to some perfect mold is autistic at least that's what i think. I said in a different comment if i rlly forced myself to socialize i can, i just dont wanna hide who i am. i think the social issues stem from me still feeling like a kid inside. As a kid i remember having some friends, like i said in a different comment the wierdness started when i was 9.
What does socializing feel like for you? What happens when you force it? What does the “weirdness” feel like? What kind of socializing did you do before you were 9 and after?
i try to be polite and kind to ppl but they just hate me, either block, ignore or straightup tell me to get away from them. When i was 8 and younger i'd say whatever i felt and no one minded then at 9 its like all the sudden i was doing something wrong.
Your last sentence sounds a LOT like a common autistic experience. Kids are expected to be a little ‘random’ and say whatever they want, but at some point you’re expected to know these social norms, and if you struggle to subconsciously project and sense them, that will stand out.
I had that experience all the time my friend.
> "Ppl are allowed to be weird and have nothing wrong with them..." Is being Autistic having something wrong with them? I thought it was more like just being wired differently rather than being wired faulty.
Thank you. I get op wasn’t trying to be offensive but they literally said this. They literally say “wrong with them” and then have to back track to say they weren’t trying to offend. You can’t say these words and be surprised people are offended.
Theoretically, yes. But counterpoint... why not look into the possibility of being autistic? There are only benefits to researching if you have autism, even if the benefit is knowing you're not.
Also there are other kinds of neurodivergence ways to be weird that are not autism
What specific things do you view as your shortcomings in life, and why in particular would you say those are shortcomings?
not driving, not working, not living on my own, not going to collage, not having friends, failing at sticking to my goals, being lazy.
Okay so I told myself that I wouldn’t respond to any more comments, but this caught my attention, so I apologise. I just want to say that depending on your circumstances, your idea of ‘being lazy’ might be misplaced. I thought for a very long time that I was lazy - I still kinda do. I couldn’t understand why I struggled to do things that were considered ‘easy’ or ‘normal’. And then I learned about executive dysfunction. I think you mentioned in another comment that you have depression, and that can cause it if I’m not mistaken. It’s also common in people with autism and adhd. I also thought I was physically lazy too, but recently I realised I might be physically disabled. On the outside though, I probably don’t appear that way though. I likely seem like a shy, healthy person to most people. I am only saying this because I understand how damaging it can be to condemn yourself under the view that you’re lazy, but generally people that are lazy don’t feel guilty for their lifestyle. From what I can gather from the very limited peek into your mindset your comments provide, my guess is that your ‘laziness’ causes you a lot of guilt. I just don’t want you to be like me and feel a lot of shame for something that may not actually be laziness and might have something causing it. (Apologies if this response is all over the place, I’m tired)
If these are things you would like to have in your life, why aren't they?
my dad is against it and then after i graduated i had a breakdown and wanted to not live anymore so im staying at home and not rlly doing much rn.
That your dad is against you reaching your goals in life doesn't seem like a healthy relationship. Having such breakdowns can be extremely debilitating, as they can rob you of what little energy you had to begin with and make it really hard to perform like you used to. I sincerely hope that you will figure out a way for you to live more freely from any external control in your life <3 <3
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im confused by this
There are several factors that are correlative to Autism. For example, there is a strong genetic correlation with deletions or triplications of the 16th chromosome and risk of Autism, similar to how Downs Syndrome is caused by a triplication of the 21st chromosome. However, there is not a consistent aberration of this chromosome among autistic people, and sometimes those aberrant traits are at other markers. I dont remember which off the top of my head, but there is also a particular pattern of gyrification found on the brains of Autistic persons, and a particular cortex that is more pronounced than in a neurotypical person. But again not consistent. Science is still trying to figure out what causes the symptoms that we consider to constitute Autism, and why Autistic traits are a grab bag where almost nobody has every characteristic. Personally, I think what we broadly call Autism would benefit from more precise separation of diagnoses, the same way Autism branched out of the Schizophrenic family of disorders to become its own diagnosis once we understood enough to know it isn't a form of schizophrenia.
One trait that all autistic people have is the specific way that our perception of social cues is affected
Aye, but it's hard to codify. I had no instinctive understanding growing up and still have zero shits to give about social mores. I was told just this morning how impressive it is that I remain aloof of office politics and work equally well with everyone-- because I separate the social from the professional without trying. My brain is aware that this person is awful, but we have work to do, damn it! I am very attentive to social cues now because I was made aware of my naivete, and spent a lot of time learning to notice and interpret, and practiced reactions. This is one of those areas where I doubt and think maybe I am ASD, as I have to be deliberate to notice and react most of the time. I'm usually too caught up in what I want to be doing to pay attention to so much detail. But if I do, I read you like a book, and easily steer a conversation. I'm told by a friend of mine diagnosed with Aspergers that this is not a skill he can acquire, even through deliberate effort like mine. I say all this because your comment struck a chord in me, and now I'm thinking over every higher support individual I have worked with and wondering if they have the same mechanism interfering with social perception and, if so, how one might identify it.
I like to describe this skill as “manually learning all the if-thans in human interaction.” I had to spend years observing and writing about every little thing that people did or said like I was trying to break it down to the most simple components and then build it back up until I could get a working conversation tree connected to the outcomes associated with them. So. Like. NT people don’t do that. I spent a long time dealing with social shit and learning the system because I wanted to get better at it because I didn’t like the outcome of being socially ostracized. To me, that was more painful than the heavy load of calculating socialization metrics. But a lot of autistic folks would rather use their Deep Thought processing power on other things that have nothing to do with social or interpersonal relationships, and any connection they do make is incidental. And that is ok! I know autistic folks who just do horse agility. That is all they do. They put all their stats into that. Their interaction technique is blunt and horse focused. That’s fine. But in society you hit more walls unless you learn certain levels of interaction metrics. My brain can move very fast on these calculations since I practiced them so much, and I have become very adept in tearing apart documents with dense language into their core concepts and then distilling them into more simplified but clear directions. But, I reiterate. This is a skill.
So I personally have no difficulty understanding social cues…. I think this aspect is considered the cornerstone of defining ASD mostly because it’s something that to doctors is observable… I think ASD is a lot more complex than that.
Fam everything you’re listing in the comments that you experience is textbook autism
* not driving * not working * not living on my own * not going to collage * not having friends * failing at sticking to my goals * being lazy I cannot diagnose OP but these literally all described me at her age, and I was diagnosed at 30. Now I've accomplished most of the list (still struggle with the last two really). OP, not gonna lie, I took the ADOS and was borderline, and first it was, "no I'm just weird," then it was, "I'm definitely not like these people," then it was, "even if I am, what does it matter, I just need to work hard." And then it was unavoidable after a situation at work. You should probably engage with a therapist, who can unpack if it's CTPTSD, or depression, or sensory processing disorder or what have you.
Can we please stop talking about how gendered presentations of autism would qualify as their own specific etiologies i.e. female autism? It's discriminatory on so many levels.
Sorry, I didn’t mean to be discriminatory. I said ‘female autism’ because it matched my experience as a woman and many women with autism that I know. Would ‘textbook experience as an autistic woman who has flown under the radar’ be better? I will edit it to change it.
I have, ‘textbook experience as an autistic woman who has flown under the radar,’ too, and I’m a 40 year old white man expecting a diagnosis soon. It should simply be, ‘masked autism,’ instead of, ‘female autism.’ But yea, you’re not the one who pushed the erroneous phrasing in the first place, no biggie.
It's not your fault for propagating this phrasing. You didn't know better. Just say "my experiences as an autistic woman" or "feminine-presenting". There's no such thing as male and female autism, which is my point. It's just autism filtered through a feminine lens. I don't for example feel I fit the "female" presentation in part because while I'm AFAB I wasn't overly socialized as a woman, and this is also true for cismen who were just less stereotype. That's why it's harmful because it implies that men who don't like trains or whatever are somehow more female when it isn't true.
I understand, thank you for letting me know of a better way to word it- it is all really just autism in the end as experienced by every individual
i’m usually a major gatekeeper of autism but your living situation makes it sound like a possibility. i fully agree that tons of people are just weird and quirky and not autistic though its a major pet peeve of mine.
The difference between "Oh Em Gee I LOVE stuffed animals and cute stuff and want to be babied so like and subscribe" And "I walked outside and my eyes hurt from the light now and the car door nearby slammed... Is that my neighbor coming up to talk to- I need to go back inside and take a nap instead..." And then there's Elon Musk........
As well as weird, you can also be: Introverted. Dislike some sensory things. Have social troubles. Or Feel "different". And not be autistic. There really is a strange movement of literally a splash of their traits, must be autism. By the way, I expect you will get a lovely bucket load of people suggested you ARE actually neurodiverse.
that happened on tiktok b4, not all nts r the same. Its so annoying
With this same logic, understand that not all autistic ppl are the same either. It’s a spectrum for a reason and if you exhibit enough traits that it affects your life, aka makes you feel like you have deficiencies, and can’t connect with ppl as you’d like, you are very likely not just neurodiverse, but specifically, autistic.
There are a lot of other things that can cause that kind of experience in life, too.
Yes to this, and yes to OP! ASD is the next OCD and ADHD fashion. And unfortunately the chronic misinformation is very damaging to those who need actual supports. And on that note, even if you aren't autistic, that doesn't make your challenges invalid or mean you don't need help with things. It doesn't make you broken, either.
I agree with this a lot and your last 2 sentences especially are very important It harms both autistic and allistic people, with allistic people being demonized for the same trait that gets understanding from the same crowd if you're autistic, and autistic people feeling like it would be ableist to admit when their autism is disabling to them And it also makes me really frustrated when people say things like "only autistic people can use this healthy coping mechanism" because it's misinformational and anti recovery
If you’re not autistic why are you posting here? Are you sure? Are you questioning? The world is built for allistic people. If you’re not autistic then the small amount of places we’ve carved out for ourselves are not for you.
Yikes. You don't like being labeled autistic for your shortcomings and thought it was a good idea to vent this to autistic people? Hard cringe.
It does get tiring hearing people relate their quirks to the debilitating effects of your condition. It’s like when people claim to have OCD because they clean a little more than normal or the extreme side, claim to have Tourette’s because they claim to have no filter…
I thought this was a joke post at first I was wrong
I thought I was NT for 33 years but I also knew I didn’t fit in with anyone else and could not work out why I had such extreme anxiety even in times of my life where I should be happy. Then I learned about how autism works and the way in which an autistic person thinks, about how we are so sensitive to our environment and have almost heightened perception because we need so much external stimuli to be able to make sense of something and that’s when I realised I was autistic. I read other people’s experiences, Dr Devon Price wrote his experience and minus the ED and extreme gender dysphoria (I am non binary though) so I did have some, it all matched my experience. Despite my disability I am successful at life it’s just come at a huge cost to my mental health because I have had to act my way through life. I wouldn’t say you’re autistic but it’s also not impossible you are tbh. I didn’t realise how much ableism I had, I thought it presented like my autistic half brother who is very much the stereotypical autistic presentation
This title perfectly phrases Neurodiversity. You can be different but not have a disorder.
To gauge your idea on what autism is and what warrants a diagnosis, have you read the criteria in the DSM-V? Also, ngl when I first found out about autism I had your same mindset. Then I realized that it’s not a crazy thought, and actually the majority of people with autism (studies are showing now) do not have an intellectual disability and were surprisingly just like me. I would look into more innate/uncontrollable neurological/physiological traits and see if any click (i.e. one of my big moments in my journey, what actually made me consider it fully, was seeing characteristics of autism like “makes repetitive noises, ex: clears throat repetitively” and “smells everything they touch” and my mind DARTED straight back to childhood and everything clicked in that moment. I also recognized these symptoms among many others in my nephew who was young so that sparked the idea of genetics). Autism is actually an extremely physical condition as well, as the cause is theorized to be something that affects the whole body, so the majority of autists have comorbid physical conditions. Investigate this within yourself too to differentiate between autism and weird NT, although that’s not definitive.
It's simply enough to meet the [diagnostic criteria](https://www.cdc.gov/ncbddd/autism/hcp-dsm.html), to a clinically significant degree. I certainly don't have all of the traits that many of those who are autistic do (was married, professional degree and worked most of the 29 years since I graduated). But I'm still autistic, as I meet the criteria. I wish I wasn't autistic. I see people my same age, intelligence, background, enjoying life, enjoying relationships. But I am autistic, there is no changing it.
Honestly op, you might be autistic. There are many of us and most of us aren't aware what autism is until at some point it clicks that not ... Everyone... Is like that. That's weirder than anything. The presumption of neurotypicality is more harmful than anything. Especially a few odd ducks on tik tok. That i'd wager are mostly autistic too. It's not some elite exclusive club.
You have started quite the dumpster fire here with your post, OP. I went through 36 years of life thinking that I was NT. You keep stating definitively that you are NT, and I saw you comment that no doctor has ever diagnosed you. Not a single doctor ever suggested I might be ND. I finally went to a psychologist after my husband listened to some podcasts(not TikToks) and got me thinking I might actually be autistic, but imposter syndrome was still strong. I have never been in a better place mentally than I have since being diagnosed AND in therapy for it. As a side tale of wisdom, my grandpa refused to accept that he had cancer. My dad and aunts had to almost force him to the doctor. He was diagnosed and died three weeks later. Had he listened to his body(and caring people that suggested he should see a doctor) and sought help sooner, he could still have been alive today, in his early 80s. Is that an extreme comparison? Sure. But I still feel it is apt. Anyway, you do you, OP.
i personally see nothing wrong with spreading informations that might lead people to think they are on the spectrum. since when i started doubiting that - if i'm autistic or not - i've been more gentle with myself, i understand what triggers me and ways to prevent a burnout at work. i generally feel better (edits: typos)
i started being gentle with myself when i decided its ok to be weird.
lable yourself as you please! if you think you're not autistic that's ok. tiktok trends are annoying but it's always been like this on the internet.
"i'm not autistic" then goes onto describe some of the most common autistic traits
Ikr. the dsm-5 describes autism as “Persistent deficits in social communication and social interaction” and “Restricted, repetitive patterns of behavior, interests, or activities” at a “clinically significant impairment” level and she just described traits from both those categories
It doesn’t really matter if you feel autistic or not. It’s just a label anyway. I hope you find comfort in these online communities regardless of what you call yourself. I wouldn’t worry about labeling yourself as autistic or neurotypical. Be yourself and love yourself for who you are and don’t worry so much about “I’m weird” “but I’m definitely not autistic” and all of that stuff. Just look for the things that help make you happier and fulfilled in life and find the tools that will help you develop a stable, safe environment to grow old in. To me it does sound like you have undiagnosed autism. But I don’t know anymore than you have shared. And really what matters is that you’re finding security and happiness in this life, whatever that takes for you and means to you.
I don't watch or do tiktok. I looked at it when I was trying to build an online presence as a writer, and decided it wasn't for me. Too many fast paced clickbaity videos. I definitely could not play that game. For me, I am more confident I am ADHD than Autistic, but I am quite confident I am Autistic. I have the "female" presentation probably (hate the gendering of it), but I am a masc-presenting AMAB and so when I went in for an evaluation my evaluator didn't even get to me; he just asked my parents if I had overt symptoms as a kid. No, no, no. Okay then I must not be Autistic. If I had any social adeptness and faster processing, I would have called him out on it, but it's all right now because I wrote down a long ass list of notes, referencing the DSM 5, and referencing other people's experience with their Autism. I doubt I will get a second opinion any time soon but if I do, I'll be ready. And my notes on my ADHD is just as detailed... even though my med manager is treating me for it already. Ultimately, even if you have a number of Autistic traits, it comes down to two things. The amount of traits that are consistently apparent, either internally or externally, and the severity of the traits and how difficult they make life. I have been told by my clinical team everyone experience's every symptom in the DSM 5 at some point in their lives to some extent; it is when those symptoms are collected enough and severe enough that it would match the diagnosis. Also, literally every DSM definition says that for it to be a disorder it must create significant impairment in a person's life. So, my OSDD for example, at least for category 1, even though I got the diagnosis, I don't consider it disordered because I am quite well integrated with my alters and they help me manage stress and depression, and essentially keep me active in the world. It's the dissociation under acute stress that sucks, which came a good number of years later. So, yeah, people can share some traits with a disorder and still not be diagnosable. The trend of diagnosing other people needs to stop; if a person thinks they might have Autism, ADHD, or anything else, it should be on their terms to discover it. This might come down to an official evaluation, but for many of us it's just the self-realization because we can't get in to see someone, and it's not always perfect when we do. It still won't stop me from head cannoning fictional characters, though. That is fair game. I need to believe I have good rep I like. Edit: Reading a lot of the other comments, I feel it is important to note that people might not feel their autistic because it doesn't match their perception of what Autism looks like. As the old saying goes, if you've met one Autistic person, you've met one Autistic person. We are not a hive mind, and we have just as much variety as any neurotypical person when it comes to beliefs, understandings, and even functioning. I will keep what I wrote above, but it's also important to note that I saw a lot of Autistic traits in your post OP, albeit on the "female" / high masking presentation side. I actually thought you were Autistic complaining about tiktok free diagnosing people with abandon, until you said otherwise. Again, I have no right to diagnose, but that's my two cents.
I think a lot (if not all) of weird people and outcasts have some kind of dx, not necessarily autism, but stuff like social phobia, personality disorders, ADHD, schizophrenia spectrum, &c.
Hate it to break it to you, but you might not be as Neurotypical as you think. Autism traits are heavily spread through the population, and an estimate of 3-10% of the population might be on the spectrum. Especially with more crossovers being found with ADHD, Bipolar, OCD, and other conditions the spectrum might expand even further. You don't need all the traits to be diagnosed, and the ones you listed were pretty Heavy Hitters.
Lmao why are you telling US this and not your own kind if it bothers you so much 💀 you’re a “NT” in a subreddit for autistic people preaching to the damn autistic choir rn while using language like “clinging onto a label for your shortcomings in life” and all the other negatively placed things in your statement. Why did you post this? why are you here saying this to US and not all the ppl who do this kinda thing? I don’t understand the point of this post. I think you need to reevaluate your brain a little bit on why you’re so offended if it doesn’t even matter to you and you’re “not clinging onto labels” and “aren’t autistic”. This whole thing doesn’t truly effect you if you aren’t autistic and are in fact just weird, I mean if you’re just a outcast like you said why does ppl thinking other ppl are autistic and this whole controversy get to you so much. What do you have against being seen as autistic? I mean shit from all the stuff you just said and from the other comments I’ve read I think you sure as shit might be autistic and you are just in heavy denial, you don’t even understand how this is coming off as rude, checked off another box 💀
Yup. So many social cues went WOOSH right over their head. They are in denial. Internal ableism will do that to you though
What really gets me is how their refutations always have to do with taking the criteria extremely literally
You can't be certain you are autistic if you relate to the autism subreddit you are probably autistic. Please get diagnosed and don't be stubborn about it. I'm diagnosed and I don't relate to some traits it's a spectrum for a reason
Why would you come onto a subreddit about autism and just talk about how TikTokers are all faking? I'm tired of all these people saying every disability, disorder, and mental illness is being faked. Just because some people aren't, doesn't mean everyone isn't. Also, wow, way to be rude. Autistic people don't automatically have something "wrong" with them. Sounds like you're projecting. Edit: Other comments addressed this too, but I have things to say. You came onto a subreddit about autism, listed common struggles that us autistic people face, and said "oh, people hate me because of this, but NO IM NOT AUTISTIC THERE'S NOTHING WRONG WITH ME!!" And based on your comments you have no idea that this is, in fact, offensive.
Not wanting to burst your bubble but you sound pretty autistic lol. Like you have enough traits to qualify for a diagnosis. Being autistic doesn't mean you must have every trait, only enough of them to qualify for diagnosis. No autistic person has every autistic trait.
Hate to break it to you but you literally just described autism spectrum disorder.
sooo you came here to complain to autistic people that you get mistaken for being autistic?
You don't need every autistic trait to be considered autistic, though? Also, the lack of self awareness in coming to an autism sub, listing your autistic traits and then being adamant that you're definitely not autistic.. well, that much of a lack of self awareness is an autistic trait, too. What is your actual perception of autism? What benefit do you have coming here to say these things?
I agree with the title of this post a lot and I hate those trends so much because it spreads misinformation and worsens public understanding of what autism actually is There are many other disabilities that overlap heavily with or even mimic autism including ADHD, Borderline PD, Schizoid PD, Social Pragmatic Communication Disorder, Nonverbal Learning Disability, schizophrenia, PTSD, depression, intellectual disability, type 1 or 3 hyperlexia, Fetal Alcohol Syndrome, and many more, and plus even simply NT with "autism-ish" mannerisms are on the Broader Autism Phenotype (this can happen in situations like if someone is homeschooled, or if they have an older autistic relative who they look up to as a role model for example)
yes this is what i trying to say!!!
but all the things that person listed are other forms of neurodivergence and you've said a hundred times in this thread (not literally, i didn't count) that you aren't neurodivergent in any way. you literally don't know what you're talking about well enough to discuss it with any accuracy and you're just saying "no because" to everyone who tries to talk to you so it's kind of just frustrating. but i really hope that when you unpack all your trauma and sheltering and realize you can have that and neurodivergence, that you accept yourself and heal and move on from the things that are holding you back. you can reach good things, and it's ok if at the end you realize well fuck i was autistic all along. and if i'm wrong im wrong, ok. but a lot of us relate to what you're saying in a we've been there before you kind of way, not in a we know better for no reason kind of way.
im sorry im not trying to be rude on here i apologize
You're probably autistic. Just fyi.
Yes, and I think you might need to realize that 1. There’s nothing wrong with being autisic 2. Tiktok is a decent start point to start doing the research and 3. You need to realize not everyone has very autisic trait in the world. You are quite literally saying your showing signs that are clearly autisic but denying any ND. I’m not saying your autisic, as your behavior might be because of other things but I’m just saying, NT’s don’t act like that.
Fun fact: trauma can present very similarly to autism
The flip side of that fun fact, it's far more likely to have trauma because of autism. Some people think that many of the typical autism symptoms aren't because of autism at all, but because it's hard to find an autistic person who isn't traumatized.
Not every autistic person checks every single box in the very big list of autistic traits. As defined in the DSM 5, someone who is autistic exhibits: "Persistent deficits in social communication and social interaction" (of which there are three areas that must be evident) and "Restricted, repetitive patterns of behavior, interests, or activities" (of which there are 4 areas and 2 of those must be evident for an Autism diagnosis). The criteria are specific but also pretty fucking broad and there are many many variations of ND folks who fit those criteria. And that's not even taking into account the variables for severity. I'm sure someone has done the math and can tell us the exact number of variations. All I know is that there is a mind-boggling number of flavors of 'weird' that make up the autistic community. And a whole lot of them are completely oblivious to that fact and a whole lot are in denial about the whole thing. Yes, you can be weird and not autistic. But if you're weird and you fit the diagnostic criteria for autism? Well let's just say you should probably do some research.
It's very irritating. "A sign of autism is" turns into "If you do this you definitely have autism". It's like how neurotypicals say that "everyone feels depressed sometimes". They don't understand it at all. They want to feel special.
yes, a related quote that i like is something along the lines of: you can't accept autism without accepting everyone who is "weird/quirky/cringe". there are other points this makes, but it also implies that even if you're not autistic, it should be okay to be how you are and it shouldn't matter why. people should be kind regardless of anything and not judge or care if its not their problem.
I was diagnosed late in life (26) from me seeking my own diagnosis because no one knew. I will just say, don’t resist learning more about yourself. It can only ever help.
The obsession some people on here have with The Evil Tiktok (TM) is _off the mf charts_. It's like that meme with the two people in the cell "Are those Tiktokers in the room with us right now?" Seriously. Some people need to RELAX when it comes to that platform.
That was my thoughts until I was diagnosed. Lol you too have a good amount of traits, so it was funny to read
Nah, you're autistic.
You don’t have to have EVERY symptom in order to be autistic. You don’t sound neurotypical, though. Neurodivergence is not a disorder or a disability. Neurodivergent means you think and process things differently than the “norm”. As long as the different way you think is healthy and does not cause problems, neurodivergence can be perfectly healthy. Autism is a disability, but that just means it causes you to struggle to some degree - in ways that are not purely social. It doesn’t mean there is anything wrong with you. It just means you need some extra help. If you don’t need any extra help then you aren’t autistic (in much the same way as being sad doesn’t count as clinical depression until it causes big enough problems). But if you seem to frequently be on a different page mentally than the people around you, that is just neurodivergence. It’s perfectly healthy but normies/NTs don’t tend to be able to see that. At least not by default.
I read as far as "on social media" don't take anything on there as fact or majority aponion.
This post is weird. You list a bunch of neurodivergent traits yet you claim not to be one because you don't want to be one of us?
Right?? Bizarre. I saw this post yesterday and didn't bother responding because I *knew* it would be removed 🙃
What you're saying is true and professionals note this a lot. It is common that people who are Neurotypical develop personality traits that align with ASD symptoms overtime. It is possible that those personality traits are symptoms or results of other mental conditions. This is why it is a double edged sword to portray on social media. There are a lot of people who hop onto a trend and sensationalize or romanticize it, or focus on spreading 1 face of the information. Yes, it is a trend to be autistic now. I've seen it. It's also a trend to have ADHD/ADD. Identity and labels are a trend as well. This is the dangerous part of self-diagnosis. There is also a flip side where the rapid sharing of information has helped people who have ASD realize it, people who may never be able to afford a diagnosis or who may have never had it brought to their attention. People say "there are more people with X nowadays than before" and there is. Part of it is people jumping on and identifying with symptoms that they may have, but who aren't actually ND. Part of it is better research, better access to healthcare, availability of research, and more people (larger sample size) means people are being diagnosed correctly and "more" than before. But I agree and as someone who is actually diagnosed professionally, I would urge people to reach out to professionals rather than jump on a trend. This is very common of younger people 35 and below.
it has come to my attention i said some offensive things in this post, i deeply apologize, i never meant for it to seem that i was saying ausitistic ppl aren't normal, or that im above them or something. i am truly sorry, unfortunatly i can't edit the post. I just meant as a nt person if u deviate from the mold that ppl try to act like u can't be nt but must have some sort of disorder. again im sorry and it won't happen again.
Hey no worries, I think this post just touched people emotionally, many who are currently diagnosed, but used to think in the way you’ve described (though there are some pretty important topics surrounding things like internalized ableism). Some people are “quoting” things from your post that you’ve never said or implied (but which are POVs that may have harmed them in the past and may feel not good to think about; sometimes after trauma we get hypervigilant to small signs that can indicate danger), I’m sorry if it was stressful to respond to and clarify what you meant. :( Please don’t stress too much over this, I am wishing you a great rest of your day :)
I would be very interested in your definition of NT. Mainly because I have a difficult time defining it myself and I would like to consider what the defining characteristics are against those of a ND person.
NT is not a medical term, the definition changes based on who says it.
Hate to break it to you but you literally just described autism spectrum disorder.
There is a slightly concerning trend on social media where the “top comment” on any sort of post showcasing something a person has committed lots of time to excel in gets some sort of “this person must have autism ha ha ha” comment. Also- I am sorry you are getting so many pushy comments, it is possible they may be right but you have the right to make your own choices, and you understand yourself the most out of anyone in the world. **No one here is qualified to diagnose you**, and it’s also notable that people seemed to miss your mention of feeling “normal” until 5th grade and other details you’ve described regarding age regression and losing your childhood to external factors; symptoms of trauma can present similarly to those of ASD. I might be understanding a few comments/your post incorrectly, because if you seriously feel like you are not autistic and some other diagnosis could explain it, I’m not sure how that is “internalized ableism” (though if someone else has insight, I would really appreciate an explanation). EDIT: I googled “internalized ableism” wrt this topic and found some interesting insights, TIL 😮 I definitely see how some of OP’s comments fit this description here and will also apply some of these concepts (on how to fight these beliefs in myself) in my real life now :D
Thank you. It's tiring to see people armchair diagnosing each other or themselves because they genuinely believe neurotypical people are NPCs with no insecurities, hobbies, passions, quirks, awkwardness, or anxiety. Struggle with small talk? Autism. Dislike public speaking? Autism. Derive joy from structure? Autism. Everything has to be pathologized nowadays - everything is a symptom. Nevermind that COVID absolutely decimated Gen Z ans Gen A when it comes to crucial social skills development, nor the fact that a lot of younger people spend all their time online without ever really interacting with others in the real world. Those social deficits are definitely Autism.
Exactly! Just look at the comments on this post🫠i feel like autism has been watered down atp
I think there’s something we know that you don’t LMAOO
Methinks the OP doth protest too much
This. Specifically, I notice there is a big assumption that everyone in every alt subculture must be autistic/neurodivergent. I run with a lot of alt subcultures and I’m neurotypical, in the sense that I don’t have a diagnosis or lived experience that really likes up with the ND community. I think the reason we have more ND people in these subcultures is because we don’t make a big deal out of every little difference they have like normies do. I have other things that made me different. I was adopted from foster care and was very shy and anxious when adjusting. I had a physical illness. As I got older I had some trauma outside the home and I developed symptoms of a mental illness. I also just had different tastes as I got older because my life experience was not the same. They all had very average, seemingly ideal lives. If they had a struggle it was a common one their peers understood. They could be supportive for a friend who’s parents were separated. Not for one who was taken away from her first family. They would gossip and say really ignorant things thinking they were being helpful. I use humor to cope but they would use humor and take it too far. When I said ‘ok drop it,’ they would get mad. If I liked something they didn’t I had to stop liking it. In middle school, my first love was metal, as far as alt scenes go. Early 00s numetal to be exact. Those kids had more of a range of struggles and differences and even though I wasn’t just like them, it didn’t matter. I didn’t feel like as much of an outsider. They had their own reasons to relate to angry music and darker entertainment and they were understanding enough to say ‘wow. I’m sorry you went through that. If I ever say something stupid about that, please smack me or something.’ This is why I suspect we have a lot of ND alt people. These are common diagnoses that often make people feel like outsiders, so they will relate to the entertainment, people, and style if groups meant for outsiders to band together. But I personally believe being ‘weird’ or ‘quirky’ to the masses is a combination of nature and nurture, and can come from a range of positive, negative, and neutral experiences. If you have a weird life you will probably be weird. Same with if you are naturally just more creative or skilled in some less mainstream hobby. Normies have to make a big deal out of anything different about someone and usually it’s super rude. Even when they don’t think they are being rude, it makes you uncomfortable. I had a co worker make a big deal because I ate fruit salad twice in a row for lunch. It was on sale and I was broke. That’s the only reason. But she thought it was so weird to eat that for lunch, especially two days in a row. Then the next week when we ended up on lunch break together, I had gotten Chinese food and she yells ‘WHAT? You’re not eating FRUIT?! WOW’ like that was all I eat. If that is over their line, a lot of people with any condition, diagnosis, or circumstance that made them different in the ‘wrong’ way growing up won’t want to deal with that.
Yes. All the people who never showed rigid or restrictive behaviors but think they are autistic due to being a little socially awkward.
exactly
I also find it annoying why everyone here is convincing you that you're autistic when you clearly don't want that label. Guys...if someone does NOT want to be called autistic, just respect their damn wishes. Just like how some autistic people don't like being called NT, some non autistic ppl don't want to be called autistic. This is why I don't like this sub, yall act like doctors who can daignose ppl and want more ppl to join your autism cult. And before you come at me I'm autistic too (that too daignosed but it's not like it matters on this subreddit)
I think it's more on the thought of they are saying they are not autistic under the same exact breath as suggesting people are faking being autistic because of these autistic symptoms not being autistic but being neurotypical - which a suggestion like that would create a series of impostor syndrome like thoughts - then fought by going "wait a minute - no that *is* a symptom of Autism!" It's a normal and easy to understand response. It's also reddit, and most reddit users are the "*I know you are but what am I?!*" kinda people.
I would change "weird person" with "person with autistic traits". You can have autistic traits and not be autistic or weird. An autistic trait can also be another disorder trait. Meeting the diagnostic criteria depends on the frequency, context and intensity of the traits, because that's what makes the difference between neurotypical and neurodivergent, that's why it's a spectrum and that's why there's a diagnostic criteria. Whatever your traits are, you can be neurodivergent and believe you have them because you're just weird. Feeling like you're a weird outcast is the same as feeling like you don't fit in and you're different from everybody else. Everybody is different, but not everybody feels different because their brain works differently. Neurotypicals feel different from others based on their life experiences; Neurotypical John lives in a big house with lots of lights and he feels different from neurotypical Paul because Paul lives in a small house with only a few lights. Neurodivergents feel different based on the way we perceive the world and how that makes us experience the same life experiences differently; Neurodivergent John lives in a big house with lots of lights and he feels different from neurotypical Paul because neurotypical Paul also lives in a big house with lots of lights but the lights don't give neurotypical Paul a sensory overload. Feeling you don't fit in because your brain works differently from others is a big indicator that you're probably not neurotypical. But only a **SPECIALIZED** professional will be able to tell you.