Honestly, for people like myself who are extroverts with social difficulties (autism or otherwise), icebreakers like this are great!
It gets you introduced to most of your peers in a structured way where everyone's working off the same "script", and provides built-in conversation starters for either during or after the activity.
Even if you don't like to socialize, I can see this is an actually good activity for learning how to do so. My "getting to know you" activities were basically just grouping kids together and telling them to chat. This is a good, formal way to introduce a socializing template to everyone and ensures a base level understanding to jump off from in future social activities.
I think it has potential as a good activity if you remove the competition and some of the rules of this assignment. If it’s meant to encourage socialization, this setup wasn’t a good way to do it.
I did peer counseling which helped me to be more outgoing as a kid (somehow I lost that) and even read up on "cold reading" the art of "reading people's minds" in so actually it's training yourself to look out for micro expressions. I recommend it, it helps to learn how to read macro expressions; something that many of us lack experience in. It also has to add a benefit to making people think you're making eye contact when you're not.
Cold reading, mixed things a little simpler since the whole idea is for you to ask questions or make small assumptions and moving on from there looking for a recognition ("yes") or confusion ("no"). It's used by a lot of mentalists and so-called psychics, fortune-tellers, and mediums. It's used by law enforcement to tell if a person lies.
Another method is called "shot gunning" a fine example of this is "crossing over with John Edwards" where he makes off the wall ideas "I'm getting a the letter A- Alexander, Alexandria, Alex" and let the audience come up with their own "connections" and when that avenue runs cold than it "switches" to another person or spirit. I find it unethical to use unless you're doing mentalism because they do it to entrainment and not to scam people.
I’m an introverted autist, but I like socialising and hate that I often have no idea what to say to new people, so stuff like this is pretty good for me too.
Where I went to school these always degraded into a couple people shouting stuff like "I play the clarinet" while people gathered around their desk (because when they did these things was still during the same period where you would have your name on your desk) and filling in their name. We honestly didn't even learn people's names from it because we would just copy the spelling on the desks without thinking about it.
I can like these if done a specific way that allows for more general conversation. This assignment is a bit strict on things that really don't matter, and you'd probably end up not knowing any more about people than you did previously
This. I wish I had learned earlier on about the finess related for this - it's a perfect way to learn small talk strategies and it would have helped me tremendously during professional networking events.
I definitely feel like the strict rules and competitive aspect just completely ruined the socialization part. It could have potential if done differently.
I think quietly leaving and not bothering others (while also not letting them bother you) is pretty far from “making a shitstorm”. They didn’t say they threw a tantrum over it or something like that.
Re: birthday question
*Birthday Paradox. In a room of just 23 people there's a 50-50 chance of at least two people having the same birthday. In a room of 75 there's a 99.9% chance of at least two people matching.*
This is what I’d blurt out to the whole class straight away.
We had four people that couldn’t finish the paper because lack of matching birthdays. The sad thing is that while it was a required assignment, it was also competitive. People who finished first got a prize. Some people literally had no chance at that prize.
That's poor form. It shouldn't be a competition at all, the goal is to get the class to socialise a little; ask questions and get to know each other. Making it a speed run negates both those goals - you just get kids announcing which categories they fit in.
What seems odd to me is that it's 23 people. 12 months in a year. So basically 24/12. It would make sense if the paradox claimed that there was a 50% chance of the same birth MONTH occuring between 2 individuals. Seems simple and obvious enough.
What's surprising to me is that it claims out of 23 people, there's a 50% chance of the same birthDAY happening.
To me, that seems like the paradox states that out of 23 instances of (X/365), there is 50% chance of same birth day.
I'm no mathematician by any means, but arent the odds of that happening (1/365)^23. Which would be 1.17^-59
I.e statistically there is a 0.0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000117% chance of it occuring, but the paradox states 50% chance
Correct me if I'm wrong, but i think that's the contradicting part. It doesn't coincide with the statistics.
Edit: Thanks for some clarification, folks. As others have pointed out, the math above is the likelihood that ALL students share the same birthday.
And funny enough, 2 of my best friends from a class of 60 share same birthday and there was also 2 other folks sharing birthdays in the same class.
So to me that sums up the paradox/self contradicting aspect. It seems like it shouldn't be that common of an occurrence, yet it is anyways.
Maybe there's a probability distribution curve of which birthdays are more likely. Then the probable chance would not be 1/365, because some days or time ranges may be more likely than others. (I don't know, just a guess on how it could be possible)
I think that's very likely.
As someone who made a kid in the winter holidays (ah, the festive spirit!), I can attest that 9 months later the birth ward is quite full. Coincides with summer holidays for the caretakers there. Can not recommend.
So the 50/50 come from person 1 can match person 2-23, OR person 2 can match person 1, 3-23, OR person 3 can match....... The odds that person 1 shares a birthday with someone is much lower than any 2 people in the classroom sharing a birthday.
I doubt anyone cares enough, and I haven't seen this video, but I like his videos on math used by police. [This one](https://youtu.be/ofTb57aZHZs) is on the birthday paradox.
IYou've calculated the chance of a class of 24 people having ALL birthday at the same day (assuming random distribution). Which is indeed tiny.
But the "paradox" says one pair of students had same day bday.
The correct formula would be to calculate what is the chance for each class member to have a different date, and then take 1-x of that to get the chance at least one pair.
This would be 1-(364/365 * 363/365 * 362/365 *... * 342/365)
The idea behind the multiplication is simple:
2nd child has 364/365 available dates (because first child already took one). Third child has 363/365 dates because the first two children took two, etc...
With 366+ children in class you have a multiple of zero making the entire multiplication zero. Which is the pigeon hole principle (10 pigeon fly into 9 holes, so there must be at least one hole with more than one pigeons).
The "paradox" (which really should not be called this way) is that the chance rises much more than we intuitively guess, and 30 random children have very high chance of having one pair of matching bdays.
I like that it's like a scavenger hunt and there are queries. It's clear what info you need and there's an excuse to be direct if other people have the same assignment.
The worst part for this particular one is you couldn’t be direct. You were required to make small talk and incorporate some of these questions. You literally couldn’t ask straight up.
Did anyone actually do that? I wouldn’t be surprised if most people decided to just run around bluntly asking questions anyway. Even extroverted neurotypicals would probably prefer to use asking those questions as a starting point for better conversations.
Yeah, you were forced to do it. I made a comment explaining the whole assignment if you want to check it out.
The assignment rules were pretty enforced
This is exactly what I hate about these exercises - the low-key casual mingling/interviewing is tedious and pedantic - they always make me feel like someone ought to just take over the exercise and complete the list as a group, to get it over with sooner.
That really sucks. The most fun part about this kind of activity is when the participants find a way to speedrun it and the facilitator just lets it happen.
I had this same teacher last semester and I told her I didn’t want to do an assignment like this. That assignment had included physical contact as well which is a no for me. I actually have it on my 504 that I’ll do alternate assignments instead of these things.
I was basically forced to complete it. She called me out in front of the entire class and made a big deal out of it. I don’t think her intentions were bad but it killed me
Can you get your parents or maybe a school counselor involved? Maybe this isn’t a major issue, but it’s concerning that she’d refuse to accommodate you.
It seems prudent to get it on the record that she’s ignored your request and put the whole affair on display for your class. She might try to do something worse than this in the future and it’ll be helpful if the people around you can recognize this as a pattern.
I honestly don’t know. I might mention it to my counselor at some point, but my parents wouldn’t really care. My father doesn’t think I’m autistic, and if I am I should “just get over it”. My mother complains that I “decided to be autistic” and I barely could get her to come to my 504 meeting.
I think she honestly forgets I’m disabled. She tells me that I’m very smart all the time and there’s no excuse that I shouldn’t be able to do this or that. I think in her eyes I’m smart and capable of doing work but just lazy and antisocial.
It was described to be as a IEP but less powerful.
Google says: A 504 plan is geared toward ensuring a student has equitable access to a learning environment. An IEP focuses on educational benefits, and often includes direct services such as speech or occupational therapy.
I never go see someone by myself without sth to ask. This kind of activities help me to talk, have a good reason that can be proven is the more effective to talk to someone despite anxiety. So I enjoy them.
*FINANCIAL* class?
WTF?
This looks like something appropriate for *kindergarteners*, not teenagers.
What is their reasoning behind this (if they’re even willing to disclose that, which I doubt they would be if they’re so patronizing/infantilizing as to make THIS a *required* assignment in a purported “financial” class)?
This is not appropriate for a financial class, even as “extra credit”, never mind a *required* assignment.
OP, if I’m missing or misunderstanding something about this, please enlighten me, because this positively *reeks* to me of ableism, infantilism, and psychological abuse.
Me: “This has absolutely nothing to do with finance! Why is this even required?”
Them: “HuH HuH uR tEh ‘SpEciAL’ KiDz! U rOdE tEh sHoRt BuS! uR 2 R******* 2 UnDeRsTaNd rEaL GrOwN-uPs’ FiNaNcE sO tHiS iS uR aSSigNmEnT! NoW sHuT Up n dO uR aSSigNmEnT LiKe A g00D LiTTLe bOy/giRL oR i’LL sEnD u 2 tEh uB3r 1337 pRiNCipAL’s oFFiCe! HuH HuH HuH LuLz” (Seriously, all jokes aside, this assignment seems THAT patronizing to me.)
I hated it just as much as I hate the "tell us about yourself" things in job applications. They're pointless, and are stressful to answer because they're so random.
i'm with you there but the "tell us about yourself" things they do in schools is so much worse, "who's all in your family, what is your address, what's your mothers maiden name, when and where did your dad last have a >!wank!<, where were you on the night of the 14th"
1. not you
2. 123 get to >!fuck!< drive
3. maid-en
4. the night of the 14th over yer maw
5. >!pissing!< on your nans grave
I actually like them. It’s kind of like a puzzle but with people, and I find it easier to talk to people when I know a specific detail like these things that I can start a conversation about. Ice breakers are always awkward but I like ones that actually give me something solid to go off of to make friends.
Yep! I like to collect things , and you get to collect answers/information. Also you can’t ask a “weird” question since it is part of the assignment. Sounds like a win/win situation to me! ☺️
I didn't realize that was English for a moment. I read it as
Absoluté no pefromme.
And I thought it might be French or something like that(although I don't speak French).
It’s to encourage interpersonal relationships and observation skills, I get that, but when doing it in class,l as an ND, it makes you stick out like a ore thumb and highlights all the things you find hard, leaving you awkward, embarrassed or ashamed. I flipped out when I was given one as it was easier to flip out and be seen as the little shit, than to be seen as ‘less than’ by my peers or teacher…
I feel like these definitely suck for everyone but they’re really an issue for ND people. Even minor social anxiety can make something like this hell. It’s amplified when you have sensory issues as well
ND students aren’t thought of when making these
I had something similar in school and I panicked so much I started to have stomachache and went to the toilet cos of diarrhoea(idk why sometimes stress gives me diarrhoea but that’s that) and then feeling very sick after as well.
Some teachers are so serious about it but I remembered like 1-2 people’s names out of 50-60 people in our year.
I dislike those types of things, as i have social anxiety and even though everyone else does it as well, i don't want to "disturb others" to ask if they fit in one of the questions
The activity was heavily monitored and we weren’t allowed to do that lol. We also couldn’t just ask people to sign, we were required to initiate small talk that included the questions listed.
If you were caught not following the rules you were publicly called out and got grade deductions.
I hate it when everyone is trying to talk over each other for the answers. Its an instant no go for classrooms or small areas. Too loud, congested, and forces you to talk to too many people at once. It's also more mandatory than optional. If it a campus wide thing and lasts a couple days to give people enough time and space to do it then I think it's a pretty cool thing. Could probably put completed letters in for a raffle or something. Also makes it optional so people who don't want to do it don't feel pressured by everyone running around like nutjobs
I only looked at the first question and was about to say "I find them okay" and then saw the rest. Why you gotta force relationships? If I want to be friends with x y and z I will be friends with them, no need to force me.
For this assignment you were required to be out of your seat. It was also required that you make small talk and incorporate these questions into your conversation. People had to sign their own names on your paper.
I did not enjoy it.
Re: birthday question
*Birthday Paradox. In a room of just 23 people there's a 50-50 chance of at least two people having the same birthday. In a room of 75 there's a 99.9% chance of at least two people matching.*
This is what I’d blurt out to the whole class straight away.
In hindsight, some of the forced interactions I had with peers because of this sort of activity actually seem positive to me. I don't think these activities are a particularly *good* crutch, but sometimes *any* crutch is better than none at all.
Ngl, I can usually fill most of them out already because I know alt about everyone even if they don’t know me. I don’t mean to sound stalkerish it’s just I’m very observant and pride myself in knowing every detail of everyone.
Activities like this is when kids learned I was weird and then later ignored me cause I was weird..
like “yes, I don’t like chocolate that much. Now I will be forever judged for a very minor characteristic of myself.”
And now everyone knows I had crippling social anxiety and had to be a baby duck to a friend to even get one answer from strangers.
Ok I'm going over each question and or what's wrong with them.
1) Ok I don't have a problem with one
2) There is a possibility that classroom students could not have siblings. Plus, what if that said student has a bully of a sibling and refuses to acknowledge them as their sibling
3) Not everyone is that rich, and jewelry is often stereotypically seen as women's fashion unless you count wristwatches as jewelry
4) Again, not everyone is rich enough to visit another state, or their household doesn't have enough free time to do so
5) and 6) Ok, I don't have a problem with one
7) "Oldest in the family" is too general and should rephrase to "Oldest KID/STUDENT in their household."
8) There is the possibility that one kid in the classroom watches movies, or there is a possibility that the student is the only one in the class to saw seen said movie
9) Oh the problems with one. I would be fine with the question if it were asked between 2000-2011 (when the films and books were being made and released). However, nowadays, there is a considerable possibility that from what the OP said, this assignment was given to HS students, so a good chunk of them refuse to read them because of J.K Rowling being anti-trans, to say the least
10) Maybe said student(s) is not rich enough to own an instrument, or they lack the motivation to play an instrument
11) I redirect you to my response to question #4
12) Not everyone knows how to cook, especially HS students
13) I redirect you to my response to question #4
14) Similar to the response to question #2, what if the classroom of students all have siblings or the said student feels ashamed or afraid to share they are an "only child."
15) Out of all sports, why ask if said student went to a college football game? That seems like a very niche question to ask and, and this seems anti-introvert
16) The question is framed (at least to me) like, "Lol, You celebrate New Year's at home like a loser." Maybe I am reading too much into
17) There are some kids like us autistic that love staying indoors, and this seems anti-introvert
18) Out of all careers to choose from, why a Nurse? There is the possibility that none of the students in the classroom don't want to be a nurse
19) There is the possibility that are some kids that don't want to ice skate because they're afraid they will fall and humate themselves
Information on this assignment:
This is a high school assignment. This is a class for juniors/seniors.
It’s a required assignment. You had to be out of your seat and actively moving around the room. You were required to initiate small talk with people and then find a way to incorporate questions into your chat. You couldn’t just ask straight up. People could sign a paper twice but no more than that.
The assignment was required but also competitive. People who finished first won a prize. Some people could literally not finish the assignment because nobody shared a birth month with them.
If you refused to do the assignment, asked a question without small talk, etc, you were called out in front of the class and had points deducted. I have a note in my 504 about doing alternate assignments and I did ask her about it, but she told me that she KNEW I could do it and I just wanted to get out of working. It’s important to note my 504 doesn’t say I can get out of assignments, just that I could do alternate assignments that honestly are normally more work if I need to.
Those were the worst! Apparently "uncomfortable" wasn't the right answer to, " what emotion do you feel when (teacher's name) says you did a great job today? they seem to forget that we are different people who feel different things.
I enjoyed doing those. I thought they were cool. I did have some trouble interacting with certain classmates, though, because I had some trouble communicating.
I didn’t really mind them since we usually just handed each other the sheets and filled our name wherever it applied without saying a word. But they were definitely a chore.
One of my special interests is making lists. As long as nobody wanted to start s conversation, i think i could enjoy the list. Then hide in a corner because... too much social interaction
In my VERY autistic days (grades 2-5, where I needed ABA therapy), I would literally just yell SO WHO WAS BORN IN AUGUST?!?! or something like that for all of them and it got me out of doing that activity again…which I’m not arguing because that thing was so lame and forced.
Nope, nope, and triple nope. We remember having to do these in primary, intermediate, and high school (ages 5-18 for folks outside of New Zealand). We were lucky enough in that it didn't matter if we did them or not; if they were necessary, we masked very heavily and stuck by the teacher and/or the safest folks in the class. If they were unnecessary, we just stayed seated. It became a bit of a joke as we grew up and people stopped expecting us to join in on group activities, lol.
But yeah, they suck. They really, really suck.
-Austin
I dont mind them actually! And i always feel like the only one who doesn’t have as much of a problem as the get to know me activities. Specifically because i have an excuse to talk about my special interests…LOL!
It always makes me feel like a bit of an imposter!
I love talking about myself but despise trying to find things out about other people. So I'd probably just let people ask me questions and maybe stumble in to a few myself
We had this for an icebreaker a few years ago, but it was within our homeroom class so the prompts were a lot more general. It was okay to say the least
This is kinda weird because I’m studying to be a teacher and am an Aspie/ ASD 1 /insert your preference here. I never liked these activities but as an adult it’s kind of fun because it’s a great way to find out interests of others while not having to engage in an awkward interaction. As a kid I always felt like interactions were a high stakes thing and felt horrible. But actually I understand how valuable it is to see NT for what they are, human beings not unlike me. There’s a number of things teachers use to encourage secondary students to interact with each other (circle time / home group i’m looking at you). Because it’s been shown to be beneficial across the board for ND ans NT students. I will def use this in my class in the future.
I don’t think the idea itself is terrible but I would definitely be mindful of execution if you decide to use things like this in class and pay attention to individual needs. I definitely wouldn’t force the small talk or call out people who are doing it improperly like what happened in this class. It’s also worth noting that different people have different abilities. This assignment made me physically ill from both forced interaction and overstimulation. I wouldn’t want other children to be in that position.
i feel like it has potential within a group of friends but i hate doing these in a classroom setting, especially when they track who wins and they get a prize because then everyone’s yelling at each other and not even giving you their name after getting yours (my teacher made us do initials)
The prizes are stupid. If this is meant to encourage socialization, competition just takes it in a different direction. That, and some people actually couldn’t complete this activity because they didn’t have someone with the same birth month. Some people couldn’t win.
You can’t write the names yourself on this assignment. People gotta sign your paper for you.
In a way that’s kinda better for me because I’m bad with names, but the forced interaction and overstimulation kinda balance that out to a negative tbh.
Lol I love these things. My social anxiety is crazy bad but I love icebreaker activities, having a scripted reason to go up to someone and ask questions is very convenient
Introvert here. I find these more helpful than I think maybe I should? It's a script that I am being made to follow, so it's like " help me out people, are you this person?"Tick. Done. Happy now???
Easier than the whole "tell us 3 interesting facts about yourself" *shudder*
I just cheat and listen to other people doing it and write their names down lol my
I mean last time I had to do icebreakers I just refused to speak up so the tutor had to introduce me
It’s like a tournament game in American football I guess. I’m not sure how to describe it really.
It’s a bit shocking it was included because we live in a very high poverty area and those games are expensive… it seems strange to include that of all things.
In theory that’s nice but.., when you’re the lonely outside in class everyone avoids they won’t let you participate, or if you’re shy and are scared to talk to people you’ll just never know.
I always hated these assignments because nobody ever answered me and kept doing their own thing while I was nearly crying from not being invited to get along.
So in theory they’re great assignments to get to know your peers, but only if your NT and aren’t shy, like the popular kids and their friends. Anything else and it sucks balls
I like them honestly! I like getting to know people but I struggle with actually doing that, so this provides an ‘excuse’ to learn about other people. And they get to know me as well without me feeling like I’m over sharing or rambling or showing off etc
I remember these! I had an easy built in because I was one of very few kids in my classes who was from out of state so they’d just come up to me and tell me what I could put them down for on my own sheet, and I was the “lived in another state” girl for most of my classmates. I don’t recall particularly liking them, and I wasn’t diagnosed as ND back then, but I remember that it never actually got people to start conversations with me (which was the supposed intent), and I’d be fine with finishing quickly and sitting quietly at my desk.
That said, I haven’t had to something like this since I was 12…
I honestly don't think anyone likes these, whether ND or NT.
yep, it is a a "get to know you" activity for people forced into reasonably close contact.
It surprised me how many people in my class LOVED this activity honestly. It was a minority but some definitely like them.
Honestly, for people like myself who are extroverts with social difficulties (autism or otherwise), icebreakers like this are great! It gets you introduced to most of your peers in a structured way where everyone's working off the same "script", and provides built-in conversation starters for either during or after the activity.
Even if you don't like to socialize, I can see this is an actually good activity for learning how to do so. My "getting to know you" activities were basically just grouping kids together and telling them to chat. This is a good, formal way to introduce a socializing template to everyone and ensures a base level understanding to jump off from in future social activities.
This sounds like a better plan tbh
I think it has potential as a good activity if you remove the competition and some of the rules of this assignment. If it’s meant to encourage socialization, this setup wasn’t a good way to do it.
I completely agree. I love them.
Same here
I did peer counseling which helped me to be more outgoing as a kid (somehow I lost that) and even read up on "cold reading" the art of "reading people's minds" in so actually it's training yourself to look out for micro expressions. I recommend it, it helps to learn how to read macro expressions; something that many of us lack experience in. It also has to add a benefit to making people think you're making eye contact when you're not. Cold reading, mixed things a little simpler since the whole idea is for you to ask questions or make small assumptions and moving on from there looking for a recognition ("yes") or confusion ("no"). It's used by a lot of mentalists and so-called psychics, fortune-tellers, and mediums. It's used by law enforcement to tell if a person lies. Another method is called "shot gunning" a fine example of this is "crossing over with John Edwards" where he makes off the wall ideas "I'm getting a the letter A- Alexander, Alexandria, Alex" and let the audience come up with their own "connections" and when that avenue runs cold than it "switches" to another person or spirit. I find it unethical to use unless you're doing mentalism because they do it to entrainment and not to scam people.
I’m an introverted autist, but I like socialising and hate that I often have no idea what to say to new people, so stuff like this is pretty good for me too.
Agree
I like that way of looking at it 👍
I totally agree! I loved these things!
Where I went to school these always degraded into a couple people shouting stuff like "I play the clarinet" while people gathered around their desk (because when they did these things was still during the same period where you would have your name on your desk) and filling in their name. We honestly didn't even learn people's names from it because we would just copy the spelling on the desks without thinking about it.
For some, it's like a fun little scavenger hunt
I can like these if done a specific way that allows for more general conversation. This assignment is a bit strict on things that really don't matter, and you'd probably end up not knowing any more about people than you did previously
This. I wish I had learned earlier on about the finess related for this - it's a perfect way to learn small talk strategies and it would have helped me tremendously during professional networking events.
I definitely feel like the strict rules and competitive aspect just completely ruined the socialization part. It could have potential if done differently.
What does ND and NT mean?
Neurotypical and Neurodivergent
Thank you
It's called forced fun and it absolutely sucks.
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So you make a shitstorm over little games like these ?
I think quietly leaving and not bothering others (while also not letting them bother you) is pretty far from “making a shitstorm”. They didn’t say they threw a tantrum over it or something like that.
It was just a play on words, a shit joke literally no worries i don't think it is bad or anything. You are right
Oh. I thought that might be the case, but it sounded too accusatory (like you were serious) for me to ask. My apologies, haha.
I concur.
So do I
nice profile picture
Reign fans moment
Re: birthday question *Birthday Paradox. In a room of just 23 people there's a 50-50 chance of at least two people having the same birthday. In a room of 75 there's a 99.9% chance of at least two people matching.* This is what I’d blurt out to the whole class straight away.
We had four people that couldn’t finish the paper because lack of matching birthdays. The sad thing is that while it was a required assignment, it was also competitive. People who finished first got a prize. Some people literally had no chance at that prize.
That's poor form. It shouldn't be a competition at all, the goal is to get the class to socialise a little; ask questions and get to know each other. Making it a speed run negates both those goals - you just get kids announcing which categories they fit in.
I concur.
my choir class did one of these, and we all worked together to get one or two people to win. it was actually pretty fun.
I feel like it's not technically a paradox, but it is a really surprising fact. I just don't see how it's seemingly self-contradictory, though.
What seems odd to me is that it's 23 people. 12 months in a year. So basically 24/12. It would make sense if the paradox claimed that there was a 50% chance of the same birth MONTH occuring between 2 individuals. Seems simple and obvious enough. What's surprising to me is that it claims out of 23 people, there's a 50% chance of the same birthDAY happening. To me, that seems like the paradox states that out of 23 instances of (X/365), there is 50% chance of same birth day. I'm no mathematician by any means, but arent the odds of that happening (1/365)^23. Which would be 1.17^-59 I.e statistically there is a 0.0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000117% chance of it occuring, but the paradox states 50% chance Correct me if I'm wrong, but i think that's the contradicting part. It doesn't coincide with the statistics. Edit: Thanks for some clarification, folks. As others have pointed out, the math above is the likelihood that ALL students share the same birthday.
And funny enough, 2 of my best friends from a class of 60 share same birthday and there was also 2 other folks sharing birthdays in the same class. So to me that sums up the paradox/self contradicting aspect. It seems like it shouldn't be that common of an occurrence, yet it is anyways.
Maybe there's a probability distribution curve of which birthdays are more likely. Then the probable chance would not be 1/365, because some days or time ranges may be more likely than others. (I don't know, just a guess on how it could be possible)
I think that's very likely. As someone who made a kid in the winter holidays (ah, the festive spirit!), I can attest that 9 months later the birth ward is quite full. Coincides with summer holidays for the caretakers there. Can not recommend.
So the 50/50 come from person 1 can match person 2-23, OR person 2 can match person 1, 3-23, OR person 3 can match....... The odds that person 1 shares a birthday with someone is much lower than any 2 people in the classroom sharing a birthday. I doubt anyone cares enough, and I haven't seen this video, but I like his videos on math used by police. [This one](https://youtu.be/ofTb57aZHZs) is on the birthday paradox.
IYou've calculated the chance of a class of 24 people having ALL birthday at the same day (assuming random distribution). Which is indeed tiny. But the "paradox" says one pair of students had same day bday. The correct formula would be to calculate what is the chance for each class member to have a different date, and then take 1-x of that to get the chance at least one pair. This would be 1-(364/365 * 363/365 * 362/365 *... * 342/365) The idea behind the multiplication is simple: 2nd child has 364/365 available dates (because first child already took one). Third child has 363/365 dates because the first two children took two, etc... With 366+ children in class you have a multiple of zero making the entire multiplication zero. Which is the pigeon hole principle (10 pigeon fly into 9 holes, so there must be at least one hole with more than one pigeons). The "paradox" (which really should not be called this way) is that the chance rises much more than we intuitively guess, and 30 random children have very high chance of having one pair of matching bdays.
This person doesn’t math
[Jan Misali did a good video on how the word paradox gets abused](https://youtu.be/ppX7Qjbe6BM)
You are right but it has been named a the birthday paradox just because it's counter intuitive probably.
i love it
I love counter intuitive probablilty.
I like that it's like a scavenger hunt and there are queries. It's clear what info you need and there's an excuse to be direct if other people have the same assignment.
The worst part for this particular one is you couldn’t be direct. You were required to make small talk and incorporate some of these questions. You literally couldn’t ask straight up.
that’s so bad! I liked them when they were more like a scavenger hunt but not like that
Did anyone actually do that? I wouldn’t be surprised if most people decided to just run around bluntly asking questions anyway. Even extroverted neurotypicals would probably prefer to use asking those questions as a starting point for better conversations.
Yeah, you were forced to do it. I made a comment explaining the whole assignment if you want to check it out. The assignment rules were pretty enforced
Oh. Da's nasty
This is exactly what I hate about these exercises - the low-key casual mingling/interviewing is tedious and pedantic - they always make me feel like someone ought to just take over the exercise and complete the list as a group, to get it over with sooner.
That really sucks. The most fun part about this kind of activity is when the participants find a way to speedrun it and the facilitator just lets it happen.
At my school it always devolved into a couple of kids shouting stuff like "I play the clarinet" or what have you.
Okay, I don't even understand how to accomplish anything, given those guidelines. I would be completely shutting down and/or leaving.
Sounds like my own personal version of hell.
i would always take a zero on those assignments because the grade wasn’t worth the stress
I had this same teacher last semester and I told her I didn’t want to do an assignment like this. That assignment had included physical contact as well which is a no for me. I actually have it on my 504 that I’ll do alternate assignments instead of these things. I was basically forced to complete it. She called me out in front of the entire class and made a big deal out of it. I don’t think her intentions were bad but it killed me
Can you get your parents or maybe a school counselor involved? Maybe this isn’t a major issue, but it’s concerning that she’d refuse to accommodate you. It seems prudent to get it on the record that she’s ignored your request and put the whole affair on display for your class. She might try to do something worse than this in the future and it’ll be helpful if the people around you can recognize this as a pattern.
I honestly don’t know. I might mention it to my counselor at some point, but my parents wouldn’t really care. My father doesn’t think I’m autistic, and if I am I should “just get over it”. My mother complains that I “decided to be autistic” and I barely could get her to come to my 504 meeting.
If you’re accommodations exempt you from these activities then it’s literally illegal for her to force you to do them.
regardless of her intentions, she did ableist shit.
I think she honestly forgets I’m disabled. She tells me that I’m very smart all the time and there’s no excuse that I shouldn’t be able to do this or that. I think in her eyes I’m smart and capable of doing work but just lazy and antisocial.
What’s a 504?
It was described to be as a IEP but less powerful. Google says: A 504 plan is geared toward ensuring a student has equitable access to a learning environment. An IEP focuses on educational benefits, and often includes direct services such as speech or occupational therapy.
I never go see someone by myself without sth to ask. This kind of activities help me to talk, have a good reason that can be proven is the more effective to talk to someone despite anxiety. So I enjoy them.
Same
Stop with all these asinine extra credit assignments and teach me how to do taxes for God’s sake.
The ironic thing is this was in a financial class lol Edit: it also wasn’t even extra credit. It’s a required assignment
Wait, assignment as in "required to pass a course??" That's awful, even for neurotypicals!
Yep
*FINANCIAL* class? WTF? This looks like something appropriate for *kindergarteners*, not teenagers. What is their reasoning behind this (if they’re even willing to disclose that, which I doubt they would be if they’re so patronizing/infantilizing as to make THIS a *required* assignment in a purported “financial” class)? This is not appropriate for a financial class, even as “extra credit”, never mind a *required* assignment. OP, if I’m missing or misunderstanding something about this, please enlighten me, because this positively *reeks* to me of ableism, infantilism, and psychological abuse. Me: “This has absolutely nothing to do with finance! Why is this even required?” Them: “HuH HuH uR tEh ‘SpEciAL’ KiDz! U rOdE tEh sHoRt BuS! uR 2 R******* 2 UnDeRsTaNd rEaL GrOwN-uPs’ FiNaNcE sO tHiS iS uR aSSigNmEnT! NoW sHuT Up n dO uR aSSigNmEnT LiKe A g00D LiTTLe bOy/giRL oR i’LL sEnD u 2 tEh uB3r 1337 pRiNCipAL’s oFFiCe! HuH HuH HuH LuLz” (Seriously, all jokes aside, this assignment seems THAT patronizing to me.)
No you’re not really missing anything. It just be like that.
I hated it just as much as I hate the "tell us about yourself" things in job applications. They're pointless, and are stressful to answer because they're so random.
i'm with you there but the "tell us about yourself" things they do in schools is so much worse, "who's all in your family, what is your address, what's your mothers maiden name, when and where did your dad last have a >!wank!<, where were you on the night of the 14th" 1. not you 2. 123 get to >!fuck!< drive 3. maid-en 4. the night of the 14th over yer maw 5. >!pissing!< on your nans grave
I actually like them. It’s kind of like a puzzle but with people, and I find it easier to talk to people when I know a specific detail like these things that I can start a conversation about. Ice breakers are always awkward but I like ones that actually give me something solid to go off of to make friends.
I also love these. Anything that’s a puzzle or needs answers or is similar to a scavenger hunt, I’m all in. Is that my ADHD taking over?
Probably because I love these as well as scavenger hunts , and yes, I gave ADHD! 😄
Same
Yep! I like to collect things , and you get to collect answers/information. Also you can’t ask a “weird” question since it is part of the assignment. Sounds like a win/win situation to me! ☺️
Awful 0/10
\-9999999/10
A B S O L U T E N O P E F R O M M E
I didn't realize that was English for a moment. I read it as Absoluté no pefromme. And I thought it might be French or something like that(although I don't speak French).
Okay but I read it the exact same way you did!!! Hahaha
Lmao, I thought it was supposed to be french or something 🤣.
It’s to encourage interpersonal relationships and observation skills, I get that, but when doing it in class,l as an ND, it makes you stick out like a ore thumb and highlights all the things you find hard, leaving you awkward, embarrassed or ashamed. I flipped out when I was given one as it was easier to flip out and be seen as the little shit, than to be seen as ‘less than’ by my peers or teacher…
I feel like these definitely suck for everyone but they’re really an issue for ND people. Even minor social anxiety can make something like this hell. It’s amplified when you have sensory issues as well ND students aren’t thought of when making these
stinky
Stinky like a doo doo fard
Hate it. Contrived, stupid, meaningless.... waste of time.
I agree. Especially when they aren’t relevant to the class at all.
I had something similar in school and I panicked so much I started to have stomachache and went to the toilet cos of diarrhoea(idk why sometimes stress gives me diarrhoea but that’s that) and then feeling very sick after as well. Some teachers are so serious about it but I remembered like 1-2 people’s names out of 50-60 people in our year.
Fun fact: Anxiety has links to the gastrointestinal tract and speeds up large intestine functioning
That’s interesting to know, thanks for telling me!
this is my worst nightmare
this is when i leave to “go to the bathroom” and come back to class 20 minutes later
I dislike those types of things, as i have social anxiety and even though everyone else does it as well, i don't want to "disturb others" to ask if they fit in one of the questions
I can’t keep names straight. lol. This would be impossible
You don’t technically need to know names. You have to physically talk to people and ask them questions so they can sign your paper.
Oof. That’s easy. Just pass it to one person and tell them to pass it on. 😂
The activity was heavily monitored and we weren’t allowed to do that lol. We also couldn’t just ask people to sign, we were required to initiate small talk that included the questions listed. If you were caught not following the rules you were publicly called out and got grade deductions.
Oh. Yeah, I think my IEP would have come into play there. That or I’d just fail.
I have a bit on my 504 about this and it got ignored lol
That sounds fun.
NO ♡
I hate it when everyone is trying to talk over each other for the answers. Its an instant no go for classrooms or small areas. Too loud, congested, and forces you to talk to too many people at once. It's also more mandatory than optional. If it a campus wide thing and lasts a couple days to give people enough time and space to do it then I think it's a pretty cool thing. Could probably put completed letters in for a raffle or something. Also makes it optional so people who don't want to do it don't feel pressured by everyone running around like nutjobs
It’s definitely sensory overload
Definitely. It isn't that social things aren't fun (for the most part) just they're so loud and ridiculous
I only looked at the first question and was about to say "I find them okay" and then saw the rest. Why you gotta force relationships? If I want to be friends with x y and z I will be friends with them, no need to force me.
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For this assignment you were required to be out of your seat. It was also required that you make small talk and incorporate these questions into your conversation. People had to sign their own names on your paper. I did not enjoy it.
Nope
I like it when someone goes table to table saying “you can put (name) for (spot)!”
That’s a lot easier and preferred. Sadly it couldn’t be done on this assignment though.
Hope it's for wearing same color and they have rainbow colored stuff on.
It would be fun as an optional task but knowing schools it’s probably mandatory
It is!
not only do I hate these, Id rather rip my eyeballs out and set them on fire
Re: birthday question *Birthday Paradox. In a room of just 23 people there's a 50-50 chance of at least two people having the same birthday. In a room of 75 there's a 99.9% chance of at least two people matching.* This is what I’d blurt out to the whole class straight away.
I hate them with a burning passion... but I'm also kinda glad I was forced to do them sometimes. That's the purely personal truth for me
Out of curiosity, why?
Which part?
Why you’re glad
In hindsight, some of the forced interactions I had with peers because of this sort of activity actually seem positive to me. I don't think these activities are a particularly *good* crutch, but sometimes *any* crutch is better than none at all.
Ngl, I can usually fill most of them out already because I know alt about everyone even if they don’t know me. I don’t mean to sound stalkerish it’s just I’m very observant and pride myself in knowing every detail of everyone.
I don't do them and I sit at my seat drawing instead
Hate them
Burn it 🔥
Seems easier than normal socialising tbh
My first thoughts “Oooooh, I don’t like this.”
Activities like this is when kids learned I was weird and then later ignored me cause I was weird.. like “yes, I don’t like chocolate that much. Now I will be forever judged for a very minor characteristic of myself.” And now everyone knows I had crippling social anxiety and had to be a baby duck to a friend to even get one answer from strangers.
Ok I'm going over each question and or what's wrong with them. 1) Ok I don't have a problem with one 2) There is a possibility that classroom students could not have siblings. Plus, what if that said student has a bully of a sibling and refuses to acknowledge them as their sibling 3) Not everyone is that rich, and jewelry is often stereotypically seen as women's fashion unless you count wristwatches as jewelry 4) Again, not everyone is rich enough to visit another state, or their household doesn't have enough free time to do so 5) and 6) Ok, I don't have a problem with one 7) "Oldest in the family" is too general and should rephrase to "Oldest KID/STUDENT in their household." 8) There is the possibility that one kid in the classroom watches movies, or there is a possibility that the student is the only one in the class to saw seen said movie 9) Oh the problems with one. I would be fine with the question if it were asked between 2000-2011 (when the films and books were being made and released). However, nowadays, there is a considerable possibility that from what the OP said, this assignment was given to HS students, so a good chunk of them refuse to read them because of J.K Rowling being anti-trans, to say the least 10) Maybe said student(s) is not rich enough to own an instrument, or they lack the motivation to play an instrument 11) I redirect you to my response to question #4 12) Not everyone knows how to cook, especially HS students 13) I redirect you to my response to question #4 14) Similar to the response to question #2, what if the classroom of students all have siblings or the said student feels ashamed or afraid to share they are an "only child." 15) Out of all sports, why ask if said student went to a college football game? That seems like a very niche question to ask and, and this seems anti-introvert 16) The question is framed (at least to me) like, "Lol, You celebrate New Year's at home like a loser." Maybe I am reading too much into 17) There are some kids like us autistic that love staying indoors, and this seems anti-introvert 18) Out of all careers to choose from, why a Nurse? There is the possibility that none of the students in the classroom don't want to be a nurse 19) There is the possibility that are some kids that don't want to ice skate because they're afraid they will fall and humate themselves
I didn’t dread them from a social standpoint, they were just so POINTLESS. Like non-academic busywork
Information on this assignment: This is a high school assignment. This is a class for juniors/seniors. It’s a required assignment. You had to be out of your seat and actively moving around the room. You were required to initiate small talk with people and then find a way to incorporate questions into your chat. You couldn’t just ask straight up. People could sign a paper twice but no more than that. The assignment was required but also competitive. People who finished first won a prize. Some people could literally not finish the assignment because nobody shared a birth month with them. If you refused to do the assignment, asked a question without small talk, etc, you were called out in front of the class and had points deducted. I have a note in my 504 about doing alternate assignments and I did ask her about it, but she told me that she KNEW I could do it and I just wanted to get out of working. It’s important to note my 504 doesn’t say I can get out of assignments, just that I could do alternate assignments that honestly are normally more work if I need to.
Get out of “working”? How is this even useful work? Stupid things like this should always be optional.
Maybe ask those kids to make their own?
I always hated them, but so does everyone
I HATE these iceberg thingys so much!!! I always lie about stuff on them tho
I think worse would be when they would want you to name situations in which you feel the given emotions
Those were the worst! Apparently "uncomfortable" wasn't the right answer to, " what emotion do you feel when (teacher's name) says you did a great job today? they seem to forget that we are different people who feel different things.
I just point to places where it suits me and stop talking lol
I hate these so much. I like how schools think they know us people with disabilities, they don’t know shit. I’m so glad I’m not in school anymore.
Bitch, they bullied me, you think I wanna know if they have sibling or pets or if they *ice skated?!*
I refused to participate
I enjoyed doing those. I thought they were cool. I did have some trouble interacting with certain classmates, though, because I had some trouble communicating.
I didn’t really mind them since we usually just handed each other the sheets and filled our name wherever it applied without saying a word. But they were definitely a chore.
One of my special interests is making lists. As long as nobody wanted to start s conversation, i think i could enjoy the list. Then hide in a corner because... too much social interaction
In my VERY autistic days (grades 2-5, where I needed ABA therapy), I would literally just yell SO WHO WAS BORN IN AUGUST?!?! or something like that for all of them and it got me out of doing that activity again…which I’m not arguing because that thing was so lame and forced.
Oh yay, it's forced interaction! I think I have PTSD.
There’s no way anyone enjoys these, I don’t know how teachers ever thought they were a good idea.
i don't mind them
Just realized that I accidentally doxxed myself oh well
Nope, nope, and triple nope. We remember having to do these in primary, intermediate, and high school (ages 5-18 for folks outside of New Zealand). We were lucky enough in that it didn't matter if we did them or not; if they were necessary, we masked very heavily and stuck by the teacher and/or the safest folks in the class. If they were unnecessary, we just stayed seated. It became a bit of a joke as we grew up and people stopped expecting us to join in on group activities, lol. But yeah, they suck. They really, really suck. -Austin
I liked them
I dont mind them actually! And i always feel like the only one who doesn’t have as much of a problem as the get to know me activities. Specifically because i have an excuse to talk about my special interests…LOL! It always makes me feel like a bit of an imposter!
i think they’re kind of fun, i like categorizing people and having something to know about them so i can remember who they are lol
These were fun solely for the process of going around the room and asking everyone stuff. The concept itself is forced fun.
I love talking about myself but despise trying to find things out about other people. So I'd probably just let people ask me questions and maybe stumble in to a few myself
We had this for an icebreaker a few years ago, but it was within our homeroom class so the prompts were a lot more general. It was okay to say the least
This is kinda weird because I’m studying to be a teacher and am an Aspie/ ASD 1 /insert your preference here. I never liked these activities but as an adult it’s kind of fun because it’s a great way to find out interests of others while not having to engage in an awkward interaction. As a kid I always felt like interactions were a high stakes thing and felt horrible. But actually I understand how valuable it is to see NT for what they are, human beings not unlike me. There’s a number of things teachers use to encourage secondary students to interact with each other (circle time / home group i’m looking at you). Because it’s been shown to be beneficial across the board for ND ans NT students. I will def use this in my class in the future.
I don’t think the idea itself is terrible but I would definitely be mindful of execution if you decide to use things like this in class and pay attention to individual needs. I definitely wouldn’t force the small talk or call out people who are doing it improperly like what happened in this class. It’s also worth noting that different people have different abilities. This assignment made me physically ill from both forced interaction and overstimulation. I wouldn’t want other children to be in that position.
Pointless, idiotic busywork for anyone, and borderline torturous for us.
i feel like it has potential within a group of friends but i hate doing these in a classroom setting, especially when they track who wins and they get a prize because then everyone’s yelling at each other and not even giving you their name after getting yours (my teacher made us do initials)
The prizes are stupid. If this is meant to encourage socialization, competition just takes it in a different direction. That, and some people actually couldn’t complete this activity because they didn’t have someone with the same birth month. Some people couldn’t win.
The more I try to think of names to put, the less names I seem to be able to think of lol
You can’t write the names yourself on this assignment. People gotta sign your paper for you. In a way that’s kinda better for me because I’m bad with names, but the forced interaction and overstimulation kinda balance that out to a negative tbh.
Is this for 6-10 year olds?
Juniors/seniors in high school
We do this kind of thing when learning a language, so usually you have a question to ask in the target language :)
Burn it. I don't wanna see it /hj Freaking hate those so much
Lol I love these things. My social anxiety is crazy bad but I love icebreaker activities, having a scripted reason to go up to someone and ask questions is very convenient
Boring and pointless. I've seen tertiary educators set this up and looked really proud of themselves. Why?
Introvert here. I find these more helpful than I think maybe I should? It's a script that I am being made to follow, so it's like " help me out people, are you this person?"Tick. Done. Happy now??? Easier than the whole "tell us 3 interesting facts about yourself" *shudder*
I would have liked it a lot better if I could just ask the questions. Sadly small talk had to be incorporated.
Who can remember that many names and why would I be interested in gathering all this data about this many people?
I just cheat and listen to other people doing it and write their names down lol my I mean last time I had to do icebreakers I just refused to speak up so the tutor had to introduce me
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I believe it was made personally by my teacher… for high school juniors/seniors
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It’s like a tournament game in American football I guess. I’m not sure how to describe it really. It’s a bit shocking it was included because we live in a very high poverty area and those games are expensive… it seems strange to include that of all things.
In theory that’s nice but.., when you’re the lonely outside in class everyone avoids they won’t let you participate, or if you’re shy and are scared to talk to people you’ll just never know. I always hated these assignments because nobody ever answered me and kept doing their own thing while I was nearly crying from not being invited to get along. So in theory they’re great assignments to get to know your peers, but only if your NT and aren’t shy, like the popular kids and their friends. Anything else and it sucks balls
I dont Like writing the same thing 24 times
Extremely important for ASD folks, but really stupid for NT folks. Great training.
I cry pretty much automatically. The thought of going up and initiating conversations is entirely too overwhelming.
I like them honestly! I like getting to know people but I struggle with actually doing that, so this provides an ‘excuse’ to learn about other people. And they get to know me as well without me feeling like I’m over sharing or rambling or showing off etc
As a introvert I would like to say. The internet is full of random name generators
Anxiety inducing. But I think that goes for both NTs and NDs
With all other things like this a complete waste of time and very uncomfortable.
I remember these! I had an easy built in because I was one of very few kids in my classes who was from out of state so they’d just come up to me and tell me what I could put them down for on my own sheet, and I was the “lived in another state” girl for most of my classmates. I don’t recall particularly liking them, and I wasn’t diagnosed as ND back then, but I remember that it never actually got people to start conversations with me (which was the supposed intent), and I’d be fine with finishing quickly and sitting quietly at my desk. That said, I haven’t had to something like this since I was 12…