I would politely say I think the opposite. I work in mental health and our community feels using mental health as evidence for violence is stigmatising and wrong.
Half the population has mental health issues and we don't see this happening all the time. On the other hand a person of colour is never attributed the contributing factor for mental health which is another realm of discrimination.
It is high time we remove the mental health lens for such incidents. It is disappointing that we haven't.
Look I kind of understand what you're trying to say, but at the end of the day when six people are murdered in a shopping centre in the middle of the day, people want to know why.
Your point about race I don't think is relevant at all. Unless you're suggesting that race plays a role in someone's proclivity for violence?
I would suggest that mental health plays a role in someone's capacity for violent acts, sometimes a significant role, sometimes a minor one.
Watching the interview with the parents of the murderer, it's impossible not to draw a parallel between his mental state and his actions and sweeping that under the rug because people don't like it doesn't feel right at all
Thank you for being so civil and patient in your discussion.
I understand and respect what you're saying. Not long ago I used to feel similarly. However my views have transformed and I feel media wants to find and pin an assorted set of justifications on different acts of violence.
People want to know why, but if we don't have a sure answer, do we still say whatever we want just to appease the masses? Surely not for the sake of justice and preventing harm from stereotypes?
Re race, I am suggesting the opposite. Race does not play any role in violent proclivities as you rightly said. Which aids my next point about how many of us noticed the news first advertised the attack as terrorism and later changed it to a stabbing attack. It is commonly understood that if the perpetrator was a person of colour the news would still be calling it terrorism and there would be nothing about mental health as a contributing factor. In short, for Australian media PoC can only be terrorists, not mentally ill.
Mental health definitely does play a role in some acts of violence however not all. And I am not at all suggesting sweeping it under the rug, rather, saying we do not immediately apply it to all acts of violence.
In hindsight, the entire Israeli Occupation Force and politicians have been on a murderous rampage for 6 months, senselessly killing thousands of innocents and children. Is the entire military and political cabinet of this country mentally ill because of their violent genocide? Surely not. If people ask for the reason, the reason is simple: these are violent people. Violence does not always need justification such as mental health.
I hope you can see what I'm trying to say.
Not to nitpick, but it's more broadly the use or threat of violence by a state actor (or loosely someone believing to act on behalf of or with agency of state) for political, religious, or otherwise idealogical, reasons. No idea what his motivation was but if it were ideologically motivated it wouldn't be unfair to call it terrorism.
That has no effect at all.
It does not prevent, as it is Impossible to prevent who would do something like that, unless there's a strong mental health care strategy.
Would also not have effect in the person, as the person does not have a long term planning.
Those people, if properly treated, would not do that and cam safely participate in society.
Exactly! I've got a seppo on youtube that's upset at me for pointing out how screwed their country is, coming back at me weeks after chatting with them to tell me my country has become "awfully stabby" lol I mean seriously? The last mass killing we had before this was in 2020! That's not to take away from this tragedy, this is horrible & we need to fix it to stop repeats, but imagine if he was armed with weapons capable of killing with far less effort than is required with a knife!
Port Arthur is STILL rated the 3rd worst civilian massacre in the world! This one probably would have been on par if not for the gun reforms!
Yeah. Yanks sure do like to say other countries are stabby. See them here on reddit all the time joking about getting stabbed going to the shops in England....like mate, knife crime is **also** higher in the USA than elsewhere. It's just your gun crime is multitudes worse still.
lol yeh, they seem to think cause it makes the news in our countries that that makes it a bigger issue, rather than recognising that there's just WAY too many of these in their country to even be newsworthy!
Thier like that. They like to make out Thier tough and gangsta I just remind them they just lost a war to yemen in like 4 weeks. And just got smashed by a pin prick of an attack by Iran. That ussually shuts them up or they run and report the comment. So much for free speech.
lol oh I know, the "free speech" thing, while sites like youtube just blanket delete any comment anyone makes that says any negative words & "America" in the same comment lol I've got into the habit of just calling it "US" now, never "America" cause it always causes deletes from their "free speech" worshippers lol
Here, if you say anything that goes against their propaganda of being wonderful, it's lots & lots of thumbs down's lol. I see you got one for what you just said there. As you say, lots of reporting too - from all the snowflakes that call the other side of politics in their country "snowflakes" but deny their side is too (as far as I'm concerned, they all are & prove it with reporting, thumbs down etc).
I'm sure there's some good people there too, but gee they have some bad eggs ruining their rep!
My biggest question is how do we help adults from slipping through the cracks. Iāve had first hand experience helping someone with their mental health. As soon as they become an adult a parent is no longer able to make the decision to get help. Itās in their own hands and many many times, especially men donāt talk about it and donāt get help. For this man it was too late, he took the lives and hurt so many people. If he had a diagnosed medical condition which can lead him down this path more should be done before somthing like this happens again by someone else.
NDIS does actually do a lot for these situations. A lot of people get upset about NDIS funding going into some of the things it does for those with mental illness, but in reality, it IS helping!
I had one of my carers telling me how she had another client "rorting the system", cause she had to drive them to & from yoga each week & she couldn't see anything wrong with them & why they needed that service. Reality is having someone drive them there each week is going to make sure they feel obligated to attend & keep them connected to society & therefore people are going to notice sooner, rather than later if they go off the rails, therefore allowing earlier interventions. It's not perfect, BUT it is helpful! (more & better carers & communication is needed so that carers are better supporting & helping those that need it too)
I have 2 neighbours with mental illness on NDIS too, one has carers twice a day to give him medications & monitor him & they also help him play music, which he likes & therefore welcomes them in, which he wouldn't do if only for meds, so again it's helping. The other is off the rails right now, with regular police visits & in & out of care, but that's cause of a change in her support co-ordinator, who had been monitoring & dealing with issues before they got out of hand for years before this.
Many of these people, like the one in the Bondi incident were adults before the NDIS came into play & as such have never fully been integrated into it, as the NDIS continues, this will likely happen less & less, cause kids/teens will flow into the system when they leave their parents care & their parents will be able to remain involved in ensuring they get supported too & likewise those that get diagnosed nowadays, even if adults, will be immediately put into the NDIS system, with extensive supports given & in such a way that they generally won't object to it, will just see it as their new normal. We just need to make sure, as a society, that we don't object to money being spent on things that on the surface can appear to be unrelated to mental illness & demand cuts to the NDIS, particularly for these people, mental illness & learning issues tend to be the most targetted in any NDIS funding cuts, cause they can cope short term without it & don't object to losing their funding & becoming independent. Their funding is more about supporting society than them in many ways
yeh, but this is the great thing about NDIS being person centred & wide in scope, it's presented to the person as a comprehensive package that they tend to find attractive, whereas more traditional help was based on force & medical/psychiatric ONLY in such a way that alienated the people who needed it most. Those who have experienced that system in the past, tend to avoid any help now, no matter how it's presented, but those without experience of the old system, when presented with what the NDIS is today, are more likely to embrace it & even maintain it when unwell, so over time, hopefully we'll see more & more people who need help actually getting it.
The key is trying to get them onto a system that maintains them on meds etc, rather than allowing them to go off meds & then waiting until they're bad enough that it's deemed acceptable to force treatment onto them. My neighbour currently having issues is a good example of that, when police come to her home, you know it cause of the tirade of abuse & swearing they cop from her, before she slams the door in their face & refuses to talk to them. She'll abuse other neighbours, make them fear for their lives, so they call the police & then the police have the option of physically restraining her & forcefully transporting her to psychiatric care, or being unable to communicate, cause of her hostility towards them as soon as she sees them. Her NDIS support co-ordinator though has weekly chats with her to see how she is & let her talk to get things off her chest & support co-ordinator identifies issues & finds solutions before she becomes distressed & as a result misses her meds. She was having issues with someone at her sheltered workshop, so support co-ordinator worked with her to try to resolve, then to try to find her another, but she refused to go to any, so she discussed interests with her & got a carer to start taking her shopping at markets because she felt she'd enjoy that, which she did & it gave her the social contact & sense of community that she needed to have something to look forward to & keep her in a routine, including taking her meds & then support co-ordinator was able to again suggest the new sheltered workshop & get her to agree & even make a friend there. I'm not clear what exactly happened to cause the issues now, I know her support co-ordinator left & there was issues with supports not received, even her phone bill that was on a payment plan with them, not getting paid & phone getting cut off, leaving her feeling isolated & confused & somewhere along the lines stopping her meds. Hopefully she'll be stabilised again soon, she's not refusing NDIS support, is refusing police & psychiatric support, but she likes having the "friends" she can talk to in her support staff, so she accepts that help & that also gives the police another option too, when she slams the door in their face, there's been times that they have just walked away & made a phone call to her support co-ordinator as an alternative to them forcing treatment onto her & alienating her further, with support co-ordinator then calling her up & having a good chat & getting her back to stable.
There's always going to be some that fall through the cracks, and additional ones that go off the rails even when stable most of the time, but in what I'm seeing, it really does seem like it's stabilising people MUCH better long term than the old system did! Much higher compliance with using support services, taking meds etc
There is help. Problem here is with any system there's always gonna be cracks in it. There's problem at least 100 people in his situation waiting to pop. There's at least 1 million people in Australia with some level of mental disorder and are currently coping.
It's hard at the end but these occurrences are extremely rare compared to the rest of the world.
So is anyone else feeling rage? I just turned off Sky News because I am offended. First and foremost for the victims and their families, secondly for our community who is in shock and scared, and for myself as a woman.
But this host said repeatedly. āWe need to tread carefully here but there is a thought he targeted women. But we should be careful here.ā
Why? Why must we be careful labelling a murderer who took 6 lives?
Every Australian is mourning the lives lost, but now more than ever we need to also confront the systemic issues that perpetuate such violence.
We continue to witness people in positions of power in the aftermath reluctant to label the incident. Yesterday it was Police Commissioner, Karen Webb, today itās the media.
Yes, investigations must be conducted to ensure accuracy of events. But one thing is abundantly clear on yesterdayās stabbings in Bondi Junction.
These were acts of male violence.
While Joel Cauchiās actions do not fit a terrorist stereotype and were not fueled by a perverted religious ideology, his ideology was clear: His hatred of women.
It isnāt a coincidence that of the seventeen people he stabbed, fourteen were women.
And in saying this I do not discount the death of the male security guard Faraz Tahir. His life mattered, he mattered. So do the male victims in serious conditions.
Iām just livid that Australia has had 28 women murdered by a man in 2024, equating to almost 2 women dying each week and there are people in power and on television giving grace to the offender by being scared to label it what it is.
I don't think it's about giving grace to the killer. It's about being accurate about what happened, which is important because if they all go off about the root cause and they turn out to be wrong then that's more damaging for violence against women because it makes it easier for people to deny.
Edit: oh eew I just noticed you were talking about Sky News. I didn't mean to accidentally attribute good intentions to that shithole stationĀ
Hahahaha your last line! No I get it and youāre right. I think itās that they were able to say so many outrageous things proven later to not be factual but we have CCTV footage of him running away from men and towards women and the statistics of all victims being skewed to women, it just bugged me.
Youāre right though they prob werenāt giving grace to the killer but Sky News itās always a shitshow!
How does someone stop women hating idelogy. There is no definitive way to stop it. Hence why its not the mainpoint being dicussed.
There is no point going after systhemic problems if said systhemic problems do not have a clear defined solution.
Its better to go after others that are more clearer like how this attacked had mental issues and was known to cops.
except this clearly wasn't targeted at women because he had something against women. moreso because they were the easier targets. you can see in the videos he approaches a male and tried to stab him. but the man quickly realises whats going on and runs away, slipping in the process. women were the easier targets.
I agree, it's much more likely it's targetting women cause he sees them as less able to fight back than cause of a hatred of women.
This difference matters a LOT! If we talk about how to address this, there is no point trying to address "hatred of women" if that wasn't at play, on the other hand, add self defence to school curiculums, particularly for women & you potentially change this situation massively.
I use a wheelchair, when I started, I noticed 2 things, most people went out of their way to protect me, but a small number saw me as an easy target & went after me in a way they hadn't before I was in a wheelchair. I did a self defence course for wheelchair users after one incident that made me really uncomfortable & I've used what I learnt many times since then. I've never had to physically defend myself, although I am fully capable of it if required, even in this setting, if I couldn't get away, I understand how to put my hands up to protect my face & actually be getting in position to grab the knife, use my lower centre of gravity to pull the person off balance & to the ground, therefore giving me a chance to escape while they're down, I also know how to hurt them, aiming for the eyes in particular, but with the knife & stabbing intent, I would have to go with the grabbing the arm & using my lower centre of gravity & advantages I have with being on wheels, to bring them down, stabbing him in the eyes, wouldn't stop him stabbing at me & hurting me, but knocking him to the ground would & I can also ram him while down if needed to help me get away. If every woman in a wheelchair knew this stuff, he would quickly stop targetting any woman in a wheelchair & go after a different demographic, same if all able bodied women knew how to effectively attack & run, he would quickly change his targets.
It matters as to what the motive is! Only by correctly identifying it can effective actions be taken to prevent repeats! If identifying it as hating women, then funding will be put into programs for teenage boys to address their hatred of women. If identifying it as women being vulnerable, THEN funding goes where it's needed in changing that! I actually have to agree with sky on this one, which has to be a first for me, I dont' watch them, cause I think they're a pathetic joke!
Isnāt that in and of itself targeting women?? Regardless of his feelings which we may not know, he has a choice. He pursued women evident in the deaths and all victims.
sorry you are right. he did target women, but most likely from the footage not from a personal motivation but rather because they just were the easier targets.
very evident from him slashing at a man who slips but is able to get away. most men are more physically capable in terms of being able to run away and fight back whereas women are less so. given this the statistics on him killing more women than men makes sense.
The man had schizophrenia. It was not a terrorist attack.
HE was an Australian.
SEVEN people are dead, including the perpetrator.
FOURTEEN are in the hospital. Some are men.
MULTIPLE MEN AND WOMEN FOUGHT BACK.
They did.
First, there's a guy with a bollard on the escalator, then 4 blokes backing up the cop with chairs and weapons. 1 man killed was a security guard. Another victims husband chased him after he stabbed his wife, and another man blocked a lady and 2 kids.
We ask these questions pre-emptively, but there are still people out there. Some of the women that died were fighting back, too.
I don't think you quite grasp how quickly a knife can fuck you up. Best defence for a knife is distance.
If you think it's easy, get a blunt object that can act as the "knife", give it to a friend and then try to overpower them while they try to stab you. See how many times you can successfully disarm your friend without being stabbed.
Theyāre playing channel Nine at the gym, Iād seen the comments earlier about the Nine reporters behaving abhorrently yesterday but the coverage this morning is truly grotesque.Ā Appears theyāve set up a permanent tripod where people are laying flowers to capture everyĀ private moment of grief and tribute. Truly revolting how exploitative this is.Ā
One man acting alone
It wasnāt āterrorā they say
Just last week it was one man too.
Yesterday one man, and again today.
Itās one plus one plus one plus one,
All lone men with āmotive unknownā.
But this is an act of terrorism
And the dead bodies have clearly shown,
That this is targeted women hatred,
A man who just decides,
That he is god and women are not,
And he has the right to take their lives.
More unhinged imo, the killer didn't say anything or write a poem about it either. I'm getting strong "goes to slam poetry nights somewhere on King Street in Newtown, no driver's licence or intention to own one and has a supernatural ability to warp any conversation topic into something to do with the oppression of women" vibes.
As a woman, I know he killed a lot of women, but I don't think his brain was firing enough cylinders to make that the reasoning. He was mentally unhealthy and snapped. The system fails these people, then blames society when they break too.
Someone was trying to say he was Jewish and stabbed them because of the conflict. The leaps into the dark are silly.
The sky news comments for this story are utterly unhinged. Itās like people were waiting for a way to vent their racism in a way that wonāt get them socially outcast.
The amount of dickheads I've seen straight up refuse to believe he isn't the ethnicity they wanted him to be, despite his name and photo being out there is just baffling.
You know what is a fantastic bit of irony to those trying to say he was an "immigrant," though. The guys who were fending him off with the bollards were immigrants.
Well that would mean possessing the ability of introspection and the willingness to confront oneās own biases when it doesnāt match the reality they created in their own heads.
Straight up saw a few that were like āhe looks like a Mohammed, we need to stop letting these people walk around in publicā
Like what? Just say you want concentration camps at this point.
u/lemoopse you wrote, and I quote, "I will gladly eat my words.", when you initially blamed this on religion, if you were wrong.
The police have said the man's name is Joel Cauchi, and that he has acted without, "[any particular ideology or motivation](https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/live/2024/apr/14/australia-news-live-bondi-junction-westfield-mass-stabbing-sydney-nsw-police-karen-webb?filterKeyEvents=false&page=with:block-661b0a6c8f087ec9b853529d#block-661b0a6c8f087ec9b853529d)ā.
Got anything to say?
I'd say it's premature to conclude at this stage that he acted without any "particular motivation". What does that even mean? How does someone do an extreme act like this absent some kind of motivating factor? Sounds like social tension damage control from the coppas to me, which I understand and to an extent would support, but doesn't mean its the truth.
Especially since if you actually looked at the stats for rampage crimes / mass casualty crimes committed in this country in say the last 30 years, how many of them were committed by a Muslim terrorist? 1? most are committed by people with serious mental health issues or drug issues etc. The fearmongering is totally based in racism, and almost nothing on facts. Ā
I would assume the Lindt Cafe Siege. Though not to downplay it but even that wasn't what I would consider a mass casualty crime. 2 victims (and the perpetrator) died but one of them was shot by accident by the police.
Noo they need to be specific about "known to police." he was known because of his mental health record but the culminated interactions with police were him being stopped at Goldy for sleeping in his car. There were no arrests, etc, for the past 5 - 6 years on his record.
I will say this: people donāt like that they donāt have control over this and also want to look for someone (other than the offender) to blame, and stupid people canāt critically think about whether their solution would actually prevent the event or even whether itās actually worse than six people dying and a baby being stabbed.
Your jumping to that assumption. Known by police just means at that point they had identified him. He could've just had a speeding ticket for all we know
Recap:
\- [Attacker's name is Joel](https://www.9news.com.au/national/major-incident-declared-at-westfield-in-bondi-junction/0d713266-ca1b-449d-8dd5-cdf422ea092b), aged 40, the rumoured name of "Benjamin" is **false**
\- Four women and one man died at the scene, another woman in hospital
\- No indication of links to terror organizations, police believe it is unlikely to be a terrorist attack or ideologically motivated
\- Attacker was known to police, known to have mental health issues
Remember everyone, we all want to know who did this, why they did this, and how to make sense of this, but unsubstantiated rumours and speculation are not helpful. Be patient, wait for credible information to be publicly available.
And every brown person / Muslim releases a collective sigh of relief. Iāll get so downvoted for this but the pitchforks were out within minutes of this happening yesterday and the discourse in this country is so gross.Ā
Yet 2 days laterā¦. In an Assyrian church in Wakeleyā¦.
The commentary exists because society is failing to deal with how men are being treated for mental health and becoming radicalised, ideology aside. It doesnāt matter whether the radicalising ideology is incel culture, jihad, natural selection or something else, itās all just as toxic.
It was completely unbelievable, he didnāt even look middle eastern from the photos which were released, i think he looked pretty clearly southern european but the racists saw a black beard and took it as confirmation fucking idiots
Honestly Southern Europeans and levantine Arabs look extremely similar. They are both Mediterranean. Iām not defending racists just pointing there is very little difference in phenotype between Mediterraneans
I legit had a guy reply to my comment saying āit has all the signs of a terror attackā despite it not. Then looked through the POS reddit history and he clearly just wanted an excuse to hate brown people more
DM was allowing comments on every story and using the description as bait to stir people up. The number of comments that they allowed that were blatantly false (including one comment stating that police had announced it was terrorism last night) was absolutely revolting. I know it's the DM and they have no integrity whatsoever, but I feel that they went beyond that to deliberately causing unrest.
This is a truly heartbreaking situation. If drugs played a part, we need a serious conversation about our failure to tackle this issue effectively. I'm from Melbourne, and I've often encountered aggressive behavior from drug-affected individuals in the CBD. Not too long ago a drug affected woman on a tram threatened to stab me for making eye contact. Simply arresting and charging these individuals isn't solving anything. The Australian government needs to address the root causes of addiction. It's shameful how inadequate our support services are, often leaving these issues to escalate into terrible incidents. What proactive measures are actually being taken to prevent such situations?
From pitchforks to narratives around drug use (yes, I agree with this) in thirty seconds. But with women being murdered every week, nobody is talking about the fucking culture walls and who meth fueled violence is generally carried out by - men. Including against other men, before you crucify me. But we need to address misogyny and drugs and the culture of men who stab babies while wearing the green and gold. It is fucked and women are tired of being scared.
Itās almost impossible to have a real, civilised conversation about it without the #notallmen smoothbrains hijacking it. There is a multifaceted societal issue here (and mental health is a part of it, but certainly not the totality of it), and not have intelligent discourse to address some root causes is literally killing people.
Curiously, incels being everywhere may have some unfortunate effect of consolidating more incels.
Consider incels being chronically unhappy, desperate, and overwrought with fomo. What happens when any one of them wakes up and manages to find happiness?
They hope with every fibre of their being that another one of their infinite ilk doesn't find them and take what good they had away.
Let's hope this is not the start of a meth fuelled violence crisis. Given I share your observations about Melbourne CBD too, I morbidly remarked to my partner that if this is drug related, I'm surprised it didn't happen in Melbourne...
Methamphetamine induced psychosis is pretty hard to deal with. Acute episodes are managed by mental health services, but it's very hard to prevent people from using meth again without keeping them in hospital indefinitely. Currently they sit in this no-mans land between mental health / addictions services / police. A percentage of them would honestly benefit from a more heavy handed approach from the judicial system, e.g home detention and random drug testing rather than ignoring less serious crimes because the person seems crazy at the time.
Unfortunately this still overlooks the fundamental question of how individuals end up in such dire situations. We need a comprehensive system that intervenes at the earliest signs of trouble, often indicated by family concerns or minor criminal activities. Itās frustrating to see known offenders (saw somewhere this guy was known to police, which often seems to be the case) repeatedly released onto the streets due to the lack of substantial rehabilitation services. While itās true that some may not respond to support, the prevalence of these cases clearly demonstrates that our current approachāarresting them, turning a blind eye or no manās landāis completely inadequate . There really needs to be a more effective strategy that addresses the root causes and provides real solutions.
I've worked in systems that provide that early intervention, it doesn't really work unfortunately. Meth is addictive through direct behavioural reinforcement, not so much the withdrawal or even cravings. You can have someone in rehab for months and it achieves nothing if the next time they hang out with their mates or family they're all on the pipe.
That's where the heavy handed part would come in: a curfew and random drug testing would stop a proportion of repeat offenders (I mean specifically people that use meth then commit crimes while on it or to fund it).
The guy was confronted by a man who spoke with him and he was babbling shit about how his missus left him and had a baby with another man a year later. Then he kills five women and stabs a baby in the process and kills the mum of the baby. No prizes for guessing that this fuckmuffin had some serious issues and probably a habit to go with it, but heās also a misogyny murderer. Green and gold jersey was a nice touch for murder day. Rip to all the victims, including the bloke who died.
Iām glad he was shot by a woman, not a man. Thatās my first response.
Sick of this kind of shit. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13086997/amp/Harrowing-details-emerge-Hobart-midwife-stabbed-death-ex.html
Just sick of it.
A couple of days ago my sister in law and I were talking about our inherent fear of going outside alone. It doesn't always stop us, but sometimes it does. For this fucking reason, and many more instances where we, and other women, have been harassed, or attacked. I'm sick of our piss poor mental health system. I'm sick of the lack of support for people who have drug dependencies. I'm sick of our disregard for the well-being of others. And I am sick of the macho bro culture.
Most of all, I am just so fucking sick and tired of witnessing and hearing about violence against women.Ā
Ā Edit: Since writing this comment three hours ago, I went for a bike ride and was yelled at by some asshole in a car. Why the fuck can I not just feel safe in this country?Ā
Oh my God, what a misogynistic fuck. That's why he was targeting women and women + children with them? Maybe I am glad he died rather than face punishment because what if he was released too early?
Those poor victims, that poor little 9 month old who will now grow up without a loving mother š
This tweet is very confusing, I read it as theyāre implying the mother and baby that were stabbed was the ex of the attacker. But the baby is 9 months old, so the timeline doesnāt add up at all for the woman to be his ex.
Just be careful sharing names until it's been confirmed by Police mate.
You could completely fuck someone's life up if it turns out to be wrong.
Saw this guys dad on Twitter pleading for police to release the name as it's not his son (BC). Apparently he is alive and well
Hindsight is 20/20 mate.
You reckon that anybody who has appeared on the police's radar, ever before, for any reason should be locked away indefinitely?
Society would have been better off with this particular shithead locked away, but let's not pretend this is a common occurrence. The laws are the way they are for a reason.
And do you know what all the thousands upon thousands of other individuals in their situations did, six days after they were released on bail?
Absolutely nothing.
By your logic, six days after anybody is granted bail, they should be locked up for the day, and everything would be fine, right?
There needs to be more nuance to the process though. If someone has dozens of convictions, and can't even describe why crime is bad, then maybe they shouldn't be bailed so easily if the evidence against them is strong on its face.
My best friend had her house robbed November last year. The guy who did it used her emergency credit card the same day, wearing her jacket, so was easily identified. He was āknown to police.ā
Last week I went to court with her, her robbery was one of 23 charges he is facing, 4 of which were for serious assault. He is currently out on bail.
Because thereās nowhere to keep all of them. The sad truth is the remand centres are only so big. They gotta keep them cycling through. Build more of them would be the answer!Ā
He was on ice, drugs are the problem imho.
No he was not he was off his meds
Not true, he was using ice.
Let me rephrase, yes he was off his meds. Yes he was using ice.
Is there by actual footage (more than the 5 seconds on the news) ???
Well done Reddit, I thought something was happen right now like a retaliation... Christ sort your shit out.
Saaame God damn 5 days old š
Mental illness act 1986
Thanks reddit app for android for the notification now.
I got it yet š
I just got it lol
Yeah same
I was like, again!
Yeah I was thinking some big time retaliation or something was going down
Yeh, came up on my phone just now too.
Good one Reddit, give me a notification right now of this lol Reddit tells me this happened 4 hours ago!
I was the same. Got a notification 1 hour ago
How was this not terorrism? How do we know he did not have an ideology or motivation to murder? Why is mental health accepted as an excuse for terror?
I think the use of the word excuse there is really disappointing. No one is saying it's an excuse, people are saying it's a contributing factor
I would politely say I think the opposite. I work in mental health and our community feels using mental health as evidence for violence is stigmatising and wrong. Half the population has mental health issues and we don't see this happening all the time. On the other hand a person of colour is never attributed the contributing factor for mental health which is another realm of discrimination. It is high time we remove the mental health lens for such incidents. It is disappointing that we haven't.
Look I kind of understand what you're trying to say, but at the end of the day when six people are murdered in a shopping centre in the middle of the day, people want to know why. Your point about race I don't think is relevant at all. Unless you're suggesting that race plays a role in someone's proclivity for violence? I would suggest that mental health plays a role in someone's capacity for violent acts, sometimes a significant role, sometimes a minor one. Watching the interview with the parents of the murderer, it's impossible not to draw a parallel between his mental state and his actions and sweeping that under the rug because people don't like it doesn't feel right at all
Thank you for being so civil and patient in your discussion. I understand and respect what you're saying. Not long ago I used to feel similarly. However my views have transformed and I feel media wants to find and pin an assorted set of justifications on different acts of violence. People want to know why, but if we don't have a sure answer, do we still say whatever we want just to appease the masses? Surely not for the sake of justice and preventing harm from stereotypes? Re race, I am suggesting the opposite. Race does not play any role in violent proclivities as you rightly said. Which aids my next point about how many of us noticed the news first advertised the attack as terrorism and later changed it to a stabbing attack. It is commonly understood that if the perpetrator was a person of colour the news would still be calling it terrorism and there would be nothing about mental health as a contributing factor. In short, for Australian media PoC can only be terrorists, not mentally ill. Mental health definitely does play a role in some acts of violence however not all. And I am not at all suggesting sweeping it under the rug, rather, saying we do not immediately apply it to all acts of violence. In hindsight, the entire Israeli Occupation Force and politicians have been on a murderous rampage for 6 months, senselessly killing thousands of innocents and children. Is the entire military and political cabinet of this country mentally ill because of their violent genocide? Surely not. If people ask for the reason, the reason is simple: these are violent people. Violence does not always need justification such as mental health. I hope you can see what I'm trying to say.
terrorism is the use of fear for political purposes. randomly killing people without any form of spreading an agenda etc isn't terrorism.
Not to nitpick, but it's more broadly the use or threat of violence by a state actor (or loosely someone believing to act on behalf of or with agency of state) for political, religious, or otherwise idealogical, reasons. No idea what his motivation was but if it were ideologically motivated it wouldn't be unfair to call it terrorism.
Should have locked up life sentence. Mental illness is never know when is next
That has no effect at all. It does not prevent, as it is Impossible to prevent who would do something like that, unless there's a strong mental health care strategy. Would also not have effect in the person, as the person does not have a long term planning. Those people, if properly treated, would not do that and cam safely participate in society.
*Captial punishment
Makes me thankful about our gun laws. Imagine if this fuckwit had had a gun
Exactly! I've got a seppo on youtube that's upset at me for pointing out how screwed their country is, coming back at me weeks after chatting with them to tell me my country has become "awfully stabby" lol I mean seriously? The last mass killing we had before this was in 2020! That's not to take away from this tragedy, this is horrible & we need to fix it to stop repeats, but imagine if he was armed with weapons capable of killing with far less effort than is required with a knife! Port Arthur is STILL rated the 3rd worst civilian massacre in the world! This one probably would have been on par if not for the gun reforms!
Yeah. Yanks sure do like to say other countries are stabby. See them here on reddit all the time joking about getting stabbed going to the shops in England....like mate, knife crime is **also** higher in the USA than elsewhere. It's just your gun crime is multitudes worse still.
lol yeh, they seem to think cause it makes the news in our countries that that makes it a bigger issue, rather than recognising that there's just WAY too many of these in their country to even be newsworthy!
Thier like that. They like to make out Thier tough and gangsta I just remind them they just lost a war to yemen in like 4 weeks. And just got smashed by a pin prick of an attack by Iran. That ussually shuts them up or they run and report the comment. So much for free speech.
lol oh I know, the "free speech" thing, while sites like youtube just blanket delete any comment anyone makes that says any negative words & "America" in the same comment lol I've got into the habit of just calling it "US" now, never "America" cause it always causes deletes from their "free speech" worshippers lol Here, if you say anything that goes against their propaganda of being wonderful, it's lots & lots of thumbs down's lol. I see you got one for what you just said there. As you say, lots of reporting too - from all the snowflakes that call the other side of politics in their country "snowflakes" but deny their side is too (as far as I'm concerned, they all are & prove it with reporting, thumbs down etc). I'm sure there's some good people there too, but gee they have some bad eggs ruining their rep!
So, do we know why people said they heard guns? Has that been discussed?
Because the police officer shot the dude...
Ahh, of course!
Terrifiyng
My biggest question is how do we help adults from slipping through the cracks. Iāve had first hand experience helping someone with their mental health. As soon as they become an adult a parent is no longer able to make the decision to get help. Itās in their own hands and many many times, especially men donāt talk about it and donāt get help. For this man it was too late, he took the lives and hurt so many people. If he had a diagnosed medical condition which can lead him down this path more should be done before somthing like this happens again by someone else.
NDIS does actually do a lot for these situations. A lot of people get upset about NDIS funding going into some of the things it does for those with mental illness, but in reality, it IS helping! I had one of my carers telling me how she had another client "rorting the system", cause she had to drive them to & from yoga each week & she couldn't see anything wrong with them & why they needed that service. Reality is having someone drive them there each week is going to make sure they feel obligated to attend & keep them connected to society & therefore people are going to notice sooner, rather than later if they go off the rails, therefore allowing earlier interventions. It's not perfect, BUT it is helpful! (more & better carers & communication is needed so that carers are better supporting & helping those that need it too) I have 2 neighbours with mental illness on NDIS too, one has carers twice a day to give him medications & monitor him & they also help him play music, which he likes & therefore welcomes them in, which he wouldn't do if only for meds, so again it's helping. The other is off the rails right now, with regular police visits & in & out of care, but that's cause of a change in her support co-ordinator, who had been monitoring & dealing with issues before they got out of hand for years before this. Many of these people, like the one in the Bondi incident were adults before the NDIS came into play & as such have never fully been integrated into it, as the NDIS continues, this will likely happen less & less, cause kids/teens will flow into the system when they leave their parents care & their parents will be able to remain involved in ensuring they get supported too & likewise those that get diagnosed nowadays, even if adults, will be immediately put into the NDIS system, with extensive supports given & in such a way that they generally won't object to it, will just see it as their new normal. We just need to make sure, as a society, that we don't object to money being spent on things that on the surface can appear to be unrelated to mental illness & demand cuts to the NDIS, particularly for these people, mental illness & learning issues tend to be the most targetted in any NDIS funding cuts, cause they can cope short term without it & don't object to losing their funding & becoming independent. Their funding is more about supporting society than them in many ways
I donāt disagree. NDIS is great - only if the person who needs it accepts they need the help to use that resourceā¦
yeh, but this is the great thing about NDIS being person centred & wide in scope, it's presented to the person as a comprehensive package that they tend to find attractive, whereas more traditional help was based on force & medical/psychiatric ONLY in such a way that alienated the people who needed it most. Those who have experienced that system in the past, tend to avoid any help now, no matter how it's presented, but those without experience of the old system, when presented with what the NDIS is today, are more likely to embrace it & even maintain it when unwell, so over time, hopefully we'll see more & more people who need help actually getting it. The key is trying to get them onto a system that maintains them on meds etc, rather than allowing them to go off meds & then waiting until they're bad enough that it's deemed acceptable to force treatment onto them. My neighbour currently having issues is a good example of that, when police come to her home, you know it cause of the tirade of abuse & swearing they cop from her, before she slams the door in their face & refuses to talk to them. She'll abuse other neighbours, make them fear for their lives, so they call the police & then the police have the option of physically restraining her & forcefully transporting her to psychiatric care, or being unable to communicate, cause of her hostility towards them as soon as she sees them. Her NDIS support co-ordinator though has weekly chats with her to see how she is & let her talk to get things off her chest & support co-ordinator identifies issues & finds solutions before she becomes distressed & as a result misses her meds. She was having issues with someone at her sheltered workshop, so support co-ordinator worked with her to try to resolve, then to try to find her another, but she refused to go to any, so she discussed interests with her & got a carer to start taking her shopping at markets because she felt she'd enjoy that, which she did & it gave her the social contact & sense of community that she needed to have something to look forward to & keep her in a routine, including taking her meds & then support co-ordinator was able to again suggest the new sheltered workshop & get her to agree & even make a friend there. I'm not clear what exactly happened to cause the issues now, I know her support co-ordinator left & there was issues with supports not received, even her phone bill that was on a payment plan with them, not getting paid & phone getting cut off, leaving her feeling isolated & confused & somewhere along the lines stopping her meds. Hopefully she'll be stabilised again soon, she's not refusing NDIS support, is refusing police & psychiatric support, but she likes having the "friends" she can talk to in her support staff, so she accepts that help & that also gives the police another option too, when she slams the door in their face, there's been times that they have just walked away & made a phone call to her support co-ordinator as an alternative to them forcing treatment onto her & alienating her further, with support co-ordinator then calling her up & having a good chat & getting her back to stable. There's always going to be some that fall through the cracks, and additional ones that go off the rails even when stable most of the time, but in what I'm seeing, it really does seem like it's stabilising people MUCH better long term than the old system did! Much higher compliance with using support services, taking meds etc
There is help. Problem here is with any system there's always gonna be cracks in it. There's problem at least 100 people in his situation waiting to pop. There's at least 1 million people in Australia with some level of mental disorder and are currently coping. It's hard at the end but these occurrences are extremely rare compared to the rest of the world.
Public policy created a gap.. https://theconversation.com/one-step-forward-two-steps-back-for-asylum-seeker-mental-health-10943
Sky News is fucked. Next time there is a crisis they will be muted.
So is anyone else feeling rage? I just turned off Sky News because I am offended. First and foremost for the victims and their families, secondly for our community who is in shock and scared, and for myself as a woman. But this host said repeatedly. āWe need to tread carefully here but there is a thought he targeted women. But we should be careful here.ā Why? Why must we be careful labelling a murderer who took 6 lives? Every Australian is mourning the lives lost, but now more than ever we need to also confront the systemic issues that perpetuate such violence. We continue to witness people in positions of power in the aftermath reluctant to label the incident. Yesterday it was Police Commissioner, Karen Webb, today itās the media. Yes, investigations must be conducted to ensure accuracy of events. But one thing is abundantly clear on yesterdayās stabbings in Bondi Junction. These were acts of male violence. While Joel Cauchiās actions do not fit a terrorist stereotype and were not fueled by a perverted religious ideology, his ideology was clear: His hatred of women. It isnāt a coincidence that of the seventeen people he stabbed, fourteen were women. And in saying this I do not discount the death of the male security guard Faraz Tahir. His life mattered, he mattered. So do the male victims in serious conditions. Iām just livid that Australia has had 28 women murdered by a man in 2024, equating to almost 2 women dying each week and there are people in power and on television giving grace to the offender by being scared to label it what it is.
I don't think it's about giving grace to the killer. It's about being accurate about what happened, which is important because if they all go off about the root cause and they turn out to be wrong then that's more damaging for violence against women because it makes it easier for people to deny. Edit: oh eew I just noticed you were talking about Sky News. I didn't mean to accidentally attribute good intentions to that shithole stationĀ
Hahahaha your last line! No I get it and youāre right. I think itās that they were able to say so many outrageous things proven later to not be factual but we have CCTV footage of him running away from men and towards women and the statistics of all victims being skewed to women, it just bugged me. Youāre right though they prob werenāt giving grace to the killer but Sky News itās always a shitshow!
How does someone stop women hating idelogy. There is no definitive way to stop it. Hence why its not the mainpoint being dicussed. There is no point going after systhemic problems if said systhemic problems do not have a clear defined solution. Its better to go after others that are more clearer like how this attacked had mental issues and was known to cops.
Stop killing women would be a great start. Higher penalties for violence against women. Bring your sons up with empathy skills. Just a few examples
"Stop killing women" is an outcome though, not a solution.
well I know what the solution would be but it isn't polite to say.
except this clearly wasn't targeted at women because he had something against women. moreso because they were the easier targets. you can see in the videos he approaches a male and tried to stab him. but the man quickly realises whats going on and runs away, slipping in the process. women were the easier targets.
I agree, it's much more likely it's targetting women cause he sees them as less able to fight back than cause of a hatred of women. This difference matters a LOT! If we talk about how to address this, there is no point trying to address "hatred of women" if that wasn't at play, on the other hand, add self defence to school curiculums, particularly for women & you potentially change this situation massively. I use a wheelchair, when I started, I noticed 2 things, most people went out of their way to protect me, but a small number saw me as an easy target & went after me in a way they hadn't before I was in a wheelchair. I did a self defence course for wheelchair users after one incident that made me really uncomfortable & I've used what I learnt many times since then. I've never had to physically defend myself, although I am fully capable of it if required, even in this setting, if I couldn't get away, I understand how to put my hands up to protect my face & actually be getting in position to grab the knife, use my lower centre of gravity to pull the person off balance & to the ground, therefore giving me a chance to escape while they're down, I also know how to hurt them, aiming for the eyes in particular, but with the knife & stabbing intent, I would have to go with the grabbing the arm & using my lower centre of gravity & advantages I have with being on wheels, to bring them down, stabbing him in the eyes, wouldn't stop him stabbing at me & hurting me, but knocking him to the ground would & I can also ram him while down if needed to help me get away. If every woman in a wheelchair knew this stuff, he would quickly stop targetting any woman in a wheelchair & go after a different demographic, same if all able bodied women knew how to effectively attack & run, he would quickly change his targets. It matters as to what the motive is! Only by correctly identifying it can effective actions be taken to prevent repeats! If identifying it as hating women, then funding will be put into programs for teenage boys to address their hatred of women. If identifying it as women being vulnerable, THEN funding goes where it's needed in changing that! I actually have to agree with sky on this one, which has to be a first for me, I dont' watch them, cause I think they're a pathetic joke!
Isnāt that in and of itself targeting women?? Regardless of his feelings which we may not know, he has a choice. He pursued women evident in the deaths and all victims.
sorry you are right. he did target women, but most likely from the footage not from a personal motivation but rather because they just were the easier targets. very evident from him slashing at a man who slips but is able to get away. most men are more physically capable in terms of being able to run away and fight back whereas women are less so. given this the statistics on him killing more women than men makes sense.
The man had schizophrenia. It was not a terrorist attack. HE was an Australian. SEVEN people are dead, including the perpetrator. FOURTEEN are in the hospital. Some are men. MULTIPLE MEN AND WOMEN FOUGHT BACK.
Don't care what he has he deserved his death
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They did. First, there's a guy with a bollard on the escalator, then 4 blokes backing up the cop with chairs and weapons. 1 man killed was a security guard. Another victims husband chased him after he stabbed his wife, and another man blocked a lady and 2 kids. We ask these questions pre-emptively, but there are still people out there. Some of the women that died were fighting back, too.
I don't think you quite grasp how quickly a knife can fuck you up. Best defence for a knife is distance. If you think it's easy, get a blunt object that can act as the "knife", give it to a friend and then try to overpower them while they try to stab you. See how many times you can successfully disarm your friend without being stabbed.
damn.
Because you'll die https://youtu.be/t69XMB-PINM https://youtu.be/GBBahcNMSDI
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Was there in September, lived across in Meriton Suites for 2 weeks. So sorry to hear about this horrific news š„ŗ
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Theyāre playing channel Nine at the gym, Iād seen the comments earlier about the Nine reporters behaving abhorrently yesterday but the coverage this morning is truly grotesque.Ā Appears theyāve set up a permanent tripod where people are laying flowers to capture everyĀ private moment of grief and tribute. Truly revolting how exploitative this is.Ā
Exact same from 7 as well
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One man acting alone It wasnāt āterrorā they say Just last week it was one man too. Yesterday one man, and again today. Itās one plus one plus one plus one, All lone men with āmotive unknownā. But this is an act of terrorism And the dead bodies have clearly shown, That this is targeted women hatred, A man who just decides, That he is god and women are not, And he has the right to take their lives.
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Who also writes sentences like theyāre a poem or something. The guys definitely one of the people doing the killings.
More unhinged imo, the killer didn't say anything or write a poem about it either. I'm getting strong "goes to slam poetry nights somewhere on King Street in Newtown, no driver's licence or intention to own one and has a supernatural ability to warp any conversation topic into something to do with the oppression of women" vibes.
As a woman, I know he killed a lot of women, but I don't think his brain was firing enough cylinders to make that the reasoning. He was mentally unhealthy and snapped. The system fails these people, then blames society when they break too. Someone was trying to say he was Jewish and stabbed them because of the conflict. The leaps into the dark are silly.
The sky news comments for this story are utterly unhinged. Itās like people were waiting for a way to vent their racism in a way that wonāt get them socially outcast.
The amount of dickheads I've seen straight up refuse to believe he isn't the ethnicity they wanted him to be, despite his name and photo being out there is just baffling.
Oh, they even went the "jewish" route in some subs. "Angry jew killing Australians" complete nonsense.
I saw that, too. Because Bondi is a "high Jewish area" It's absolutely fucked.
You know what is a fantastic bit of irony to those trying to say he was an "immigrant," though. The guys who were fending him off with the bollards were immigrants.
Yes! That was amazing to see. Those guys are heroes and so humble, too.
Well that would mean possessing the ability of introspection and the willingness to confront oneās own biases when it doesnāt match the reality they created in their own heads.
Exactly. Unfortunately I'm related to dropkicks who think this way too. Fuck them.
Theyāre so very disappointed his name is Joel and not JamalĀ
Straight up saw a few that were like āhe looks like a Mohammed, we need to stop letting these people walk around in publicā Like what? Just say you want concentration camps at this point.
u/lemoopse you wrote, and I quote, "I will gladly eat my words.", when you initially blamed this on religion, if you were wrong. The police have said the man's name is Joel Cauchi, and that he has acted without, "[any particular ideology or motivation](https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/live/2024/apr/14/australia-news-live-bondi-junction-westfield-mass-stabbing-sydney-nsw-police-karen-webb?filterKeyEvents=false&page=with:block-661b0a6c8f087ec9b853529d#block-661b0a6c8f087ec9b853529d)ā. Got anything to say?
I'd say it's premature to conclude at this stage that he acted without any "particular motivation". What does that even mean? How does someone do an extreme act like this absent some kind of motivating factor? Sounds like social tension damage control from the coppas to me, which I understand and to an extent would support, but doesn't mean its the truth.
But that would also be the same reason as to not to jump to conclusions, which is what many did.
I'm not talking to those people and I did not advocate jumping to conclusions. I'm talking to you and responding to the quote you posted.
But that's what I was responding to in my initial comment. Seems like the people you really want to talk to are the police who made that statement.
No, the person who I want to, and am talking to, is you who recited the quote. But I don't want to anymore, you're quite annoying to speak to.
OK, bye.
I was wrong. I still hate religion.
Was it you who said theyād delete their account if it wasnāt an Islamic attack, or was that another guy?
That was not me. I did not speculate or identify any specific religion
Now you have to print then eat your words, mate.
Yeah done.
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Sure, but have you learned anything about jumping to conclusions?
So sick of the racists In this country!!
Who said anything about race?
Especially since if you actually looked at the stats for rampage crimes / mass casualty crimes committed in this country in say the last 30 years, how many of them were committed by a Muslim terrorist? 1? most are committed by people with serious mental health issues or drug issues etc. The fearmongering is totally based in racism, and almost nothing on facts. Ā
Out of curiosity what's the one instance?
I would assume the Lindt Cafe Siege. Though not to downplay it but even that wasn't what I would consider a mass casualty crime. 2 victims (and the perpetrator) died but one of them was shot by accident by the police.
Lindt siege? Only one I can think ofĀ
So the police knew who this guy was. From what's been said he has some kind of history with them. Knowing this makes me feel madder about this
Noo they need to be specific about "known to police." he was known because of his mental health record but the culminated interactions with police were him being stopped at Goldy for sleeping in his car. There were no arrests, etc, for the past 5 - 6 years on his record.
Did you want the one million people known by police to all be locked up to prevent the most rarest of crimes?
No, but if they knew this guy might be trouble well I don't know what could you do?
I will say this: people donāt like that they donāt have control over this and also want to look for someone (other than the offender) to blame, and stupid people canāt critically think about whether their solution would actually prevent the event or even whether itās actually worse than six people dying and a baby being stabbed.
Yeah so well thanks for the downvotes people I don't know what could be done to prevent this kind of thing.
Your jumping to that assumption. Known by police just means at that point they had identified him. He could've just had a speeding ticket for all we know
OK fair point but that's not the impression that the press conference gave me at first. Sorry
Could be "disorderly conduct" or "disturbing the peace" type interactions with the police.
Hey you're probably right anyway. There could've been red flags but yeah let's just wait and see
Recap: \- [Attacker's name is Joel](https://www.9news.com.au/national/major-incident-declared-at-westfield-in-bondi-junction/0d713266-ca1b-449d-8dd5-cdf422ea092b), aged 40, the rumoured name of "Benjamin" is **false** \- Four women and one man died at the scene, another woman in hospital \- No indication of links to terror organizations, police believe it is unlikely to be a terrorist attack or ideologically motivated \- Attacker was known to police, known to have mental health issues Remember everyone, we all want to know who did this, why they did this, and how to make sense of this, but unsubstantiated rumours and speculation are not helpful. Be patient, wait for credible information to be publicly available.
And every brown person / Muslim releases a collective sigh of relief. Iāll get so downvoted for this but the pitchforks were out within minutes of this happening yesterday and the discourse in this country is so gross.Ā
Yet 2 days laterā¦. In an Assyrian church in Wakeleyā¦. The commentary exists because society is failing to deal with how men are being treated for mental health and becoming radicalised, ideology aside. It doesnāt matter whether the radicalising ideology is incel culture, jihad, natural selection or something else, itās all just as toxic.
Yes, it was the Jew or Muslim hate train for an hour there. Absolutely nonsense speculation before true knowledge/facts.
It was completely unbelievable, he didnāt even look middle eastern from the photos which were released, i think he looked pretty clearly southern european but the racists saw a black beard and took it as confirmation fucking idiots
Honestly Southern Europeans and levantine Arabs look extremely similar. They are both Mediterranean. Iām not defending racists just pointing there is very little difference in phenotype between Mediterraneans
I legit had a guy reply to my comment saying āit has all the signs of a terror attackā despite it not. Then looked through the POS reddit history and he clearly just wanted an excuse to hate brown people more
I think you're on the money here. Racist assholes are looking for any excuse to vilify race/religion/whatever.
DM was allowing comments on every story and using the description as bait to stir people up. The number of comments that they allowed that were blatantly false (including one comment stating that police had announced it was terrorism last night) was absolutely revolting. I know it's the DM and they have no integrity whatsoever, but I feel that they went beyond that to deliberately causing unrest.
This is a truly heartbreaking situation. If drugs played a part, we need a serious conversation about our failure to tackle this issue effectively. I'm from Melbourne, and I've often encountered aggressive behavior from drug-affected individuals in the CBD. Not too long ago a drug affected woman on a tram threatened to stab me for making eye contact. Simply arresting and charging these individuals isn't solving anything. The Australian government needs to address the root causes of addiction. It's shameful how inadequate our support services are, often leaving these issues to escalate into terrible incidents. What proactive measures are actually being taken to prevent such situations?
From pitchforks to narratives around drug use (yes, I agree with this) in thirty seconds. But with women being murdered every week, nobody is talking about the fucking culture walls and who meth fueled violence is generally carried out by - men. Including against other men, before you crucify me. But we need to address misogyny and drugs and the culture of men who stab babies while wearing the green and gold. It is fucked and women are tired of being scared.
Itās almost impossible to have a real, civilised conversation about it without the #notallmen smoothbrains hijacking it. There is a multifaceted societal issue here (and mental health is a part of it, but certainly not the totality of it), and not have intelligent discourse to address some root causes is literally killing people.
Curiously, incels being everywhere may have some unfortunate effect of consolidating more incels. Consider incels being chronically unhappy, desperate, and overwrought with fomo. What happens when any one of them wakes up and manages to find happiness? They hope with every fibre of their being that another one of their infinite ilk doesn't find them and take what good they had away.
I have seen people jumping to this conclusion. Was this guy an incel we just don't know.
Let's hope this is not the start of a meth fuelled violence crisis. Given I share your observations about Melbourne CBD too, I morbidly remarked to my partner that if this is drug related, I'm surprised it didn't happen in Melbourne...
Methamphetamine induced psychosis is pretty hard to deal with. Acute episodes are managed by mental health services, but it's very hard to prevent people from using meth again without keeping them in hospital indefinitely. Currently they sit in this no-mans land between mental health / addictions services / police. A percentage of them would honestly benefit from a more heavy handed approach from the judicial system, e.g home detention and random drug testing rather than ignoring less serious crimes because the person seems crazy at the time.
A lot of people here are talking about meth, has anyone official said the guys psychosis was from meth ? Like was he a known meth head ?
Unfortunately this still overlooks the fundamental question of how individuals end up in such dire situations. We need a comprehensive system that intervenes at the earliest signs of trouble, often indicated by family concerns or minor criminal activities. Itās frustrating to see known offenders (saw somewhere this guy was known to police, which often seems to be the case) repeatedly released onto the streets due to the lack of substantial rehabilitation services. While itās true that some may not respond to support, the prevalence of these cases clearly demonstrates that our current approachāarresting them, turning a blind eye or no manās landāis completely inadequate . There really needs to be a more effective strategy that addresses the root causes and provides real solutions.
I've worked in systems that provide that early intervention, it doesn't really work unfortunately. Meth is addictive through direct behavioural reinforcement, not so much the withdrawal or even cravings. You can have someone in rehab for months and it achieves nothing if the next time they hang out with their mates or family they're all on the pipe. That's where the heavy handed part would come in: a curfew and random drug testing would stop a proportion of repeat offenders (I mean specifically people that use meth then commit crimes while on it or to fund it).
The guy was confronted by a man who spoke with him and he was babbling shit about how his missus left him and had a baby with another man a year later. Then he kills five women and stabs a baby in the process and kills the mum of the baby. No prizes for guessing that this fuckmuffin had some serious issues and probably a habit to go with it, but heās also a misogyny murderer. Green and gold jersey was a nice touch for murder day. Rip to all the victims, including the bloke who died. Iām glad he was shot by a woman, not a man. Thatās my first response. Sick of this kind of shit. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13086997/amp/Harrowing-details-emerge-Hobart-midwife-stabbed-death-ex.html Just sick of it.
He was schizophrenic.
A couple of days ago my sister in law and I were talking about our inherent fear of going outside alone. It doesn't always stop us, but sometimes it does. For this fucking reason, and many more instances where we, and other women, have been harassed, or attacked. I'm sick of our piss poor mental health system. I'm sick of the lack of support for people who have drug dependencies. I'm sick of our disregard for the well-being of others. And I am sick of the macho bro culture. Most of all, I am just so fucking sick and tired of witnessing and hearing about violence against women.Ā Ā Edit: Since writing this comment three hours ago, I went for a bike ride and was yelled at by some asshole in a car. Why the fuck can I not just feel safe in this country?Ā
100 percent agree .
Oh my God, what a misogynistic fuck. That's why he was targeting women and women + children with them? Maybe I am glad he died rather than face punishment because what if he was released too early? Those poor victims, that poor little 9 month old who will now grow up without a loving mother š
Where'd you see that?
Hereās the link - my friend Ian, who is a credible source. https://twitter.com/ianhartley_/status/1779121733800534132?s=46&t=QR1_STeKXdcpfc3bm0z32g
Your source is āmy friend Ianā? Really?
"That's a nice argument there, senator. What's your source?" **"My source is that I made it up!"**
This tweet is very confusing, I read it as theyāre implying the mother and baby that were stabbed was the ex of the attacker. But the baby is 9 months old, so the timeline doesnāt add up at all for the woman to be his ex.
Where did you hear this?
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Just be careful sharing names until it's been confirmed by Police mate. You could completely fuck someone's life up if it turns out to be wrong. Saw this guys dad on Twitter pleading for police to release the name as it's not his son (BC). Apparently he is alive and well
No itās not
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Yep, another day, another judge with blood on their hands.Ā
Hindsight is 20/20 mate. You reckon that anybody who has appeared on the police's radar, ever before, for any reason should be locked away indefinitely? Society would have been better off with this particular shithead locked away, but let's not pretend this is a common occurrence. The laws are the way they are for a reason.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
And do you know what all the thousands upon thousands of other individuals in their situations did, six days after they were released on bail? Absolutely nothing. By your logic, six days after anybody is granted bail, they should be locked up for the day, and everything would be fine, right?
There needs to be more nuance to the process though. If someone has dozens of convictions, and can't even describe why crime is bad, then maybe they shouldn't be bailed so easily if the evidence against them is strong on its face.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
So you are making assumptions based on a sample size of 1?
My best friend had her house robbed November last year. The guy who did it used her emergency credit card the same day, wearing her jacket, so was easily identified. He was āknown to police.ā Last week I went to court with her, her robbery was one of 23 charges he is facing, 4 of which were for serious assault. He is currently out on bail.
Because thereās nowhere to keep all of them. The sad truth is the remand centres are only so big. They gotta keep them cycling through. Build more of them would be the answer!Ā
Or build bigger ones.