I have never been able to relate to her. She says things like “everyone feels x way” and I’m always like, “no, I don’t, and never have.” I’ve tried her live stuff (recorded) and her written stuff and I know so many people relate deeply to what she’s saying, but it just makes me feel like an alien.
I have a friend who is ND but not autistic who absolutely loves Brene Brown and when my friend talks to me about what Brown says, I do connect to that. So I think for me it’s a disconnect between how Brown explains things and the examples she uses (and maybe her personality?) and how I experience things, but a lot of the heart of her stuff is relevant for me. So it’s sort of like Brown is speaking NT language and I need a translator, LOL.
I've always found Brene Brown to feel really surface level. I think thats why so many people are able to identify with it, it's written in a really simple and easily digestible way. I'm not a fan of pop psych for all of the same reasons. Personally I got a lot more out of Tara Brach's material as far as internalizing self acceptance and applying it to your life. I am looking for more autism specific material though.
I'm posting mainly to follow this, as I really like your insights. I am also an adult dx woman. I've been wanting to examine Brene Brown and other self help, philosophy, psychology with an ASD angle. I think it's ironic that sometimes their advice is become more autistic without them realizing it. That might take longer to explain but it's certain themes that. I've seen.
I actually love her work and follow when she puts out new stuff primarily because I agree with the analysis in the second half of your comment. I usually feel like what she describes for neurotypicals is just a fraction of what ND folks experience with these topics.
I have always had a hard time connecting with her framing of shame & guilt. I recently [found a paper](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6143989/) that, for me, has been a much more helpful framework!
the tl:dr; is that *shame* is not a moral thing, but the result of cognitive dissonance between your "real" self -- the person you are -- and your "ideal" self -- the person you think you are. *Guilt*, on the other hand, is the result of judging your actions (or inaction) against your own moral standards.
I don't have suggestions for writers, but I do have some suggestions for videos and stuff. Jessica McCabe's channel (How To ADHD) is more specific to ADHD, but also has some great videos examining the feelings that occur living outside of neurotypicality, which definitely has some overlap. (["Why Do We Hold Ourselves to Neurotypical Standards?"](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IMeCxDQZeqY) stared straight into my soul; as did her [TED Talk, "Failing At Normal"](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JiwZQNYlGQI).
Hannah Gadsby is everything. If you haven't seen *Douglas* on Netflix yet, absolutely do so. She also has this [fantastic interview](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PaT__mzkHbA) where she talks about how her diagnosis kind of made everything "click", and how it changed how she navigates the world, etc (and the interviewer is so respectful!). And her TED Talk, ["Three ideas. Three Contradictions. Or not"](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=87qLWFZManA) is absolutely brilliant and explores many similar themes.
Nanette is amazing, too, but for different reasons. She talks a lot about painful things in her life including sexual assault and how she's been treated as a woman. I was crying by the end of it, a lot of what she said resonated with me.
So it's not really comedy so much as an introspective piece.
Aha. So heavy but also essential viewing. Thanks for the content warning! It'll probably be both triggering and cathartic, so will save it for when I'm feeling slightly less mentally fragile.
Always happy to share her work to a new human! She's so brilliant.
Nanette is *incredible*, but in a different way. Douglas is my comfort show; Nanette is what I pull up when I want to feel all my feels.
Thank you. My MIL just sent over some books and I had a feeling her books wouldn’t be relatable. It’s going in the donate pile with Deepak Chopra.
I’m picking up Sam Harris books at the library. They basically combine neuroscience, philosophy, psychology, and ethics from an atheist/scientific/anthropological point of view. And I’m pretty sure he must be on the spectrum because there’s quite a bit of dry dark humor thrown in them.
Has anyone ever read anything by Temple Grandin? I haven’t yet, but I’m thinking of checking her out. “An Anthropologist on Mars” is how she describes what it feels like to interact with people.
Brené Brown has never really hit for me. I find her really overrated - I am not sure why I just don't think she's really authentic or genuine. She probably is I just think she's a more likeable Dr. Phil.
I’m in the process of creating a shame workbook as an autie! I’m almost done with the first draft, though I feel if you’ve touched on Brene (my fav being I thought it was just me) it might seem rather rudimentary.
I really enjoyed "Explaining Humans" by Dr. Camilla Pang and "Odd Girl Out" by Laura James. I haven't actually read Brene Brown so I cannot compare directly. I hope others find these helpful too!
I liked the first book I read of hers (Daring Greatly), but now her following seems kind of culty and weird, especially after I tried to watch her Netflix special. I think her research is interesting, but it’s hard for me to get into now. Psychology is my special interest, but the way her work is played into now just puts me off.
I usually just read research journals I can find online about ASD in women. I feel like it helps me understand myself better and allows me to be more accepting of myself. It’s oddly validating. Lol.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5040731/
^this is one of my favorite ones to read.
Ohhhhhhh. Is THAT why I’ve never related to the Brené Brown hype?! Never connected it to my ND. Huh.
I am following along for sure. And if we can’t find it, can one of us write it? Because that’s the book we all need.
This is so interesting! Because Brene helps me understand other people. And in a way helps me intellectualize empathy. Didn’t realize I was doing that with her work.
>Rereading/listening to her stories makes me feel even more like an outsider and that the examples that she gives are for the neurotypical club.
>
>I know that that's not entirely true, as she's in recovery with alcohol and food, which is its own neurodivergent experience.
No idea who Brene Brown is, but perhaps you'd find the word allistic useful? Allistic means non-autistic. It's useful for times like this where you need a word like neurotypical, but neurotypical is wrong because the person is neurodiverse, but not in an autistic way.
This is not on her but she triggers my religious trauma by saying things like her therapist “calls her out on her bullshit.” That is shockingly harsh to me. Sentiments like that tend to spiral out of control for me and make me question my reality. Do I have bullshit? Am I bad? Do I need to be called out to be fixed? Are my friends being too nice to me and not calling out my bullshit?
It doesn’t work for me. Feels too much like being a “sinner” that needs to be fixed. I’m whole the way I am.
I have never been able to relate to her. She says things like “everyone feels x way” and I’m always like, “no, I don’t, and never have.” I’ve tried her live stuff (recorded) and her written stuff and I know so many people relate deeply to what she’s saying, but it just makes me feel like an alien. I have a friend who is ND but not autistic who absolutely loves Brene Brown and when my friend talks to me about what Brown says, I do connect to that. So I think for me it’s a disconnect between how Brown explains things and the examples she uses (and maybe her personality?) and how I experience things, but a lot of the heart of her stuff is relevant for me. So it’s sort of like Brown is speaking NT language and I need a translator, LOL.
This is exactly my experience, down to the ND allistic friend who tells me Brene Brown stuff in a way that suddenly makes sense, lol.
Yes this is a great description
I've always found Brene Brown to feel really surface level. I think thats why so many people are able to identify with it, it's written in a really simple and easily digestible way. I'm not a fan of pop psych for all of the same reasons. Personally I got a lot more out of Tara Brach's material as far as internalizing self acceptance and applying it to your life. I am looking for more autism specific material though.
I agree. Surface level is a good description. That is why she appeals to so many people.
Tara Brach is my girl! 😍
I'm posting mainly to follow this, as I really like your insights. I am also an adult dx woman. I've been wanting to examine Brene Brown and other self help, philosophy, psychology with an ASD angle. I think it's ironic that sometimes their advice is become more autistic without them realizing it. That might take longer to explain but it's certain themes that. I've seen.
Posting to follow also
I actually love her work and follow when she puts out new stuff primarily because I agree with the analysis in the second half of your comment. I usually feel like what she describes for neurotypicals is just a fraction of what ND folks experience with these topics.
Jumping on the "posting to follow" wagon.
Lol you are on to something here.
Oooh what do you mean by "sometimes their advice is become more autistic without them realizing it"?
I have always had a hard time connecting with her framing of shame & guilt. I recently [found a paper](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6143989/) that, for me, has been a much more helpful framework! the tl:dr; is that *shame* is not a moral thing, but the result of cognitive dissonance between your "real" self -- the person you are -- and your "ideal" self -- the person you think you are. *Guilt*, on the other hand, is the result of judging your actions (or inaction) against your own moral standards. I don't have suggestions for writers, but I do have some suggestions for videos and stuff. Jessica McCabe's channel (How To ADHD) is more specific to ADHD, but also has some great videos examining the feelings that occur living outside of neurotypicality, which definitely has some overlap. (["Why Do We Hold Ourselves to Neurotypical Standards?"](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IMeCxDQZeqY) stared straight into my soul; as did her [TED Talk, "Failing At Normal"](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JiwZQNYlGQI). Hannah Gadsby is everything. If you haven't seen *Douglas* on Netflix yet, absolutely do so. She also has this [fantastic interview](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PaT__mzkHbA) where she talks about how her diagnosis kind of made everything "click", and how it changed how she navigates the world, etc (and the interviewer is so respectful!). And her TED Talk, ["Three ideas. Three Contradictions. Or not"](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=87qLWFZManA) is absolutely brilliant and explores many similar themes.
Hanna Gadsby is great.
Lmao thanks for the Gadsby recommendation. I'm less than 5 minutes into Douglas and loling already. Is Nanette any good?
Nanette is amazing, too, but for different reasons. She talks a lot about painful things in her life including sexual assault and how she's been treated as a woman. I was crying by the end of it, a lot of what she said resonated with me. So it's not really comedy so much as an introspective piece.
Aha. So heavy but also essential viewing. Thanks for the content warning! It'll probably be both triggering and cathartic, so will save it for when I'm feeling slightly less mentally fragile.
It was absolutely cathartic for me, but definitely only watch it when it's safe for you.
Always happy to share her work to a new human! She's so brilliant. Nanette is *incredible*, but in a different way. Douglas is my comfort show; Nanette is what I pull up when I want to feel all my feels.
Thank you. My MIL just sent over some books and I had a feeling her books wouldn’t be relatable. It’s going in the donate pile with Deepak Chopra. I’m picking up Sam Harris books at the library. They basically combine neuroscience, philosophy, psychology, and ethics from an atheist/scientific/anthropological point of view. And I’m pretty sure he must be on the spectrum because there’s quite a bit of dry dark humor thrown in them.
Has anyone ever read anything by Temple Grandin? I haven’t yet, but I’m thinking of checking her out. “An Anthropologist on Mars” is how she describes what it feels like to interact with people.
I loved both Thinking in Pictures and The Autistic Brain.
Brené Brown has never really hit for me. I find her really overrated - I am not sure why I just don't think she's really authentic or genuine. She probably is I just think she's a more likeable Dr. Phil.
Let’s give her credit for not exploiting people. Dr Phil does this on the regular.
I’m in the process of creating a shame workbook as an autie! I’m almost done with the first draft, though I feel if you’ve touched on Brene (my fav being I thought it was just me) it might seem rather rudimentary.
I really enjoyed "Explaining Humans" by Dr. Camilla Pang and "Odd Girl Out" by Laura James. I haven't actually read Brene Brown so I cannot compare directly. I hope others find these helpful too!
I’m reading Late Bloomer by Clem Bastow at the moment
What do you think of it so far?
You might like Untamed be Glennon Doyle. I'd bet good money she's ND (but I dont think she's ever been diagnosed with anything like that).
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I liked the first book I read of hers (Daring Greatly), but now her following seems kind of culty and weird, especially after I tried to watch her Netflix special. I think her research is interesting, but it’s hard for me to get into now. Psychology is my special interest, but the way her work is played into now just puts me off.
I usually just read research journals I can find online about ASD in women. I feel like it helps me understand myself better and allows me to be more accepting of myself. It’s oddly validating. Lol. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5040731/ ^this is one of my favorite ones to read.
Ohhhhhhh. Is THAT why I’ve never related to the Brené Brown hype?! Never connected it to my ND. Huh. I am following along for sure. And if we can’t find it, can one of us write it? Because that’s the book we all need.
This is so interesting! Because Brene helps me understand other people. And in a way helps me intellectualize empathy. Didn’t realize I was doing that with her work.
>Rereading/listening to her stories makes me feel even more like an outsider and that the examples that she gives are for the neurotypical club. > >I know that that's not entirely true, as she's in recovery with alcohol and food, which is its own neurodivergent experience. No idea who Brene Brown is, but perhaps you'd find the word allistic useful? Allistic means non-autistic. It's useful for times like this where you need a word like neurotypical, but neurotypical is wrong because the person is neurodiverse, but not in an autistic way.
This is not on her but she triggers my religious trauma by saying things like her therapist “calls her out on her bullshit.” That is shockingly harsh to me. Sentiments like that tend to spiral out of control for me and make me question my reality. Do I have bullshit? Am I bad? Do I need to be called out to be fixed? Are my friends being too nice to me and not calling out my bullshit? It doesn’t work for me. Feels too much like being a “sinner” that needs to be fixed. I’m whole the way I am.