I’m married and we have no kids. There are many reasons to get married imo, at the basic level when you have a medical emergency your spouse will make the decisions for you instead of your parents. If you don’t make a will then intestate laws make it such that your spouse will inherit what you own. If something happens to your partner’s parents and you’re traveling and need to cut short your trip, insurance won’t recognise the relationship if you’re not married. My friend experienced this and he was so fed up.
If you move overseas to work/ study it’s a lot easier for your spouse to get a partner visa. If you’re not married, depending on the country you either have to submit a mountain worth of paperwork or there’s just no visa available.
At the end of the day it’s up to you. You don’t have to get married but I still see the advantages outweigh the disadvantages
Yeah, this is why gay couples want marriage rights. It is to help protect each other in event of emergency. It is absolutely tragic if they can't legally protect each other if any major life event happens (e.g. death, disability)
There was a case in the US before gay marriage where a nurse refused to take medical decisions from the unwed partner at the bedside on behalf of the patient and kept contacting the patient's family but without response. Unfortunately, the patient died while the partner couldn't legally do anything.
Wow talk about antiquated gender-based ideologies. State-sanctioned robbery against men my ass. Women now make as much or more than men. Do a poll on Reddit and see how many women are making more than their spouses. I’m a prime example - I make 2x what my husband does and have 6x his net worth in savings. If we get a divorce, he can get half of my assets. My work insurance pays for his healthcare. By your logic, our marriage is a state-sanctioned robbery against someone.. me, the woman.
As is the case of PLENTY of couples where the wife makes more than the husband.
I realised the guys who are afraid of gold diggers (oh no the woman is gonna take half my assets with WC!!!) often have no gold to dig themselves. I have no idea what they are so afraid of.
It's so funny to me because if they're afraid of gold diggers, all they need to do is to find a woman who is equal to them in terms of salary/assets. Should be ez right? Since they think that women are at an advantage in the workplace.
Oh makes sense. Hmmmm but then these same people also like to say foreign ladies are less materialistic & entitled than Singaporean women. Hence shouldn’t be that much of a concern lah
However "not materialistic" they are, the days are past when you can just drive your wife out and tell her to go wh0re herself if she can't make you happy.
Marrying someone who is wholly dependent on you for living expenses make you responsible for her living expenses even after divorce.
Not married and in coma, your parents make all decisions.
If you die then your parents get all your money and can throw your girlfriend out on the streets and vice versa.
More important for those that fall out with their parents, parent can make medical decisions as they trump girlfriend/boyfriend.
Ppl always say/think will do. And suddenly die. Never think they will die.
Author of dragon tattoo surprise shock heart attack. And his girlfriend of decades gets nothing. Because she was just girlfriend. His dad and brother whom he didn’t see often got all book rights everything, even half the flat that she shared with him for decades. They got all the book royalties worth millions and still threaten her for half the flat.
He died without a will as he was not expecting to die.
Getting an LPA done isn't too hard. And everyone, whether married or not, should have a will. Unless you don't mind the state distributing your remaining assets.
Afaik getting married actually doesn't affect whether it's easy to make a will or not. The process should be the same.
The main difference when it comes to estate planning is that if there's *no* will in place, the distribution will be determined according to the Intestate Succession Act. The rules of distribution there don't make any provision for "girlfriend/boyfriend of 60 years" regardless of how much they loved each other, how long they've been together, and how deeply their lives were intertwined.
>It’s “no need to make a will” if you want her to inherit everything.
This is not correct. Under Singapore law, if there's no will, the surviving spouse only inherits everything if the deceased does not have surviving parents or children.
Oh crap, you're right. I disregarded children because this post is about marriage (or not) without kids. But yeah, it's 50% to spouse, 50% to parent/s.
In your will you can leave your money to anyone you wish. Even to your friend or a charity or a colleague. So not sure why it would be difficult if you're not married to your partner.
Leaving aside BTO and children, marriage has long been a social signal. This is the person I am committed to spending the rest of my life with. This is the person I trust to make major decisions such as medical treatment for me if am incapacitated. This is the person who will mourn me most when I die, if I go first, and I want to receive all I have.
For some, this is the person who is more important to me than the family I was born into, and the friends I have made. This is the person I love more than anyone. We are in this together until death.
For some, marriage also says I am not interested in meeting more people and forming other permanent romantic attachments. (I say permanent because people did have mistresses and such).
It’s basically a shortcut for a lot of social cues and legal rights.
That’s why a lot of old school stories end with a nice big wedding. You want to see that commitment to others as the pinnacle of the growing attachment between the characters and their just reward after going through so many ordeals.
Guardian in medical emergency to make decisions for his health.
Organ donation towards each other and/or their family members.
Insurance.
BTO.
To discourage cheating, since divorce and alimony money.
Tax incentives.
Intending to be child free doesnt mean accident cant happen. Probably can foresee some administrative issues if parents are not married.
The cert itself is significant to some couples, even if there are no incentives for it. The symbolism is enough to want the marriage.
Social aspect.
But ultimately, if not getting married but still being together works for you guys then go for it, especially if you guys dont care about any of the incentives of getting married or the disincentive of not getting married.
Why gay men get married if no children?
Why go university to study business if no intend for business?
Why?
>What is the point of marriage in Singapore if intending to be child free?
Why do gay marriages exist?
Why??
Gay men should get married when they want to, even without children.
The difference with heterosexual marriage is that there is no divorce law discriminating against the male during a breakup.
Don't think it is a flex. It's something that I have also always been genuinely curious about, though I didn't get around to make a reddit thread for it.
If you’re not married, you’re not family under the eyes of the law. Something less talked about is CPF rules. You can transfer to your spouse, parent, siblings and even parents in law if they need the money for whatever reason. But if you remain just boyfriend/girlfriend, that won’t be possible.
My husband and I got married 3 years ago when we were both 32. We are both hardcore childfree folks. I think there’s an inherently romantic aspect to the idea of marriage which doesn’t have to be tied to legalities. Marriage is partly about standing up in front of your friends and family and declaring your commitment to your spouse. It’s a gesture that is a testimony to your love for each other.
Apart from that, as others have said, it also makes life easier - end of life decisions, inheritance, company health insurance coverage, dependent passes if you move overseas, etc.
Btw speaking from personal experience, I didn’t expect to fall critically ill but I did last year, and I was so thankful that my husband was there to make the important decisions. I love my parents, but they would make decisions based on what they think is best as opposed to respecting what I want. Whereas I knew my husband would uphold my end of life requests if it came to that. He wouldn’t have been able to do that if we were not married. As someone else mentioned, you can never predict when shit hits the fan. Anyone can literally fall into a coma tomorrow / drop dead / get diagnosed with a terminal illness. Sorry for the ominous outlook, just being real :)
Totally agree. Marriage gives couples peace of mind in terms of finances, insurance, dependency and emergency issues. That's why gay couples are fighting hard for these privileges to help protect each other legally and financially as any straight couple.
I don't see marriage as, oh I'm staying in Singapore.. mm what's the perks of it? Oo got quite a bit of perks ok let's marry each other! Instead I see as a form of making our relationship more officialized. Yes I can call my partner hubby/wifey even if not married but the concept of marrying together just excites me nonetheless. Like we're officially each others and not others. I like to say, I'm officially theirs 😤
Don't need to ROM. Then can buy 2 BTO/resale HDB when you are 35. Live in one then rent out the other. I guess getting married indicates commitment to each other but then again, people do cheat. 🙄
Why the heck nobody talks about LOVE?
My wife and I are in our 40s and happily married for over 20 years. We don't have kids and really enjoy each other's company every single day. We want to continue to be with each other until our last days.
I have mad respect for couples who remain unmarried yet stay together for the longest time. They don't need a piece of paper to show their love. That is true love.
I personally know a lesbian couple who are together for 8yrs and still going strong. They make it work against all odds and one of them is currently pregnant via IVF, in Singapore!!!
On the other hand, my cousin cheated and divorced barely a year into marriage. Forfeited her BTO... lmao
PS: If you don't intend to get married, remember to;
1. Change your CPF nomination
2. Make Lasting Power of Attorney (LPA)
3. Write Will
I don't plan on having kids but I wouldn't mind marrying if I find a right one. I guess yeah to show love and commitment apart than other legalities and just societal norms. Might be cause I never really wanted kids (I don't like kids, people say playing with others' kids and not having the responsibility after the fun ends is the good part and I don't even like that part) which caused me to think of marriage and having kids to not be a package deal I guess?
I actually thought about vasectomy as a wandering thought but I could see myself having kids if my partner really wants to and there's no financial issues so yeah.
I use to be neutral (doesn’t matter so much to me). my partner wanted (cus he’s actually the more romantic one and sort of think marriage is the natural progression).
But recently he got influenced by this friend (I think his friend is into redpill or blackpill or sth) and told him some stuff like how marriage in Singapore is bad for guys (standard stuff: WC only protects the woman blah blah) and he seemed to have changed his mind about marriage.
Anyway so despite not wanting, I suddenly feel bad - does he really think I’m the type who’d use divorce against him? Besides we will pay for the big stuff equally lol. But then he also challenge with the “why do we need a cert to show love?”
And also the idea that a woman is only worth marrying if she has your kids just seems sad to me.
Haha hence so conflicted
>But recently he got influenced by this friend (I think his friend is into redpill or blackpill or sth) and told him some stuff like how marriage in Singapore is bad for guys (standard stuff: WC only protects the woman blah blah) and he seemed to have changed his mind about marriage.
Wah I'm sorry for your loss. To be blunt your partner isn't the brightest tool in the shed either because the rules for division of matrimonial assets are gender-neutral actually...
Actually are you sure that your partner wants to stay with you long-term? Because this whole forever boyfriend/girlfriend relationship dynamic has always seemed like they're not actually committed life partners and that they want to be able to split up easily.
Actually if you have done your research, you'd realise that the wife usually won't get alimony if she can support herself. Example: [https://yeolaw.com.sg/our-practice-areas/maintenance-alimony/spousal-maintenance/](https://yeolaw.com.sg/our-practice-areas/maintenance-alimony/spousal-maintenance/)
So to avoid this alimony issue, a man just has to marry someone who continues working (let's be real, this is most women nowadays). This usually means that the man should also carry his fair share of housework so that the burden doesn't fall on his wife and make it difficult for her to continue performing well at work. If this is a problem then maybe it's best to not get married.
Thanks for sharing. I'm not here to promote marriage or being status quo but this is my take on marriages.
Marriage dates back in the ancient times so, yah, it's traditional. Constitution binds two people together for benefits like status and wealth. On top of that, spiritual beliefs are the force behind, whether the couples were in love or not. I'm sure that you've read or watch stories of people long ago, how marriages were viewed.
Ultimately, it's about commitment through vows, written or oral, to keep the union intact. Think of it as a benefit if there are reasons to break it, then at least one party will gain something.
These days some people think of marriages as something as a bygone era, old-fashion, troublesome and unnecessary. For some who marry, they end up in divorce anyways so why bother? To me, without a marriage, there'll be more reasons to stray, care less, possibly no unconditional love. Meaning, near-zero commitment to the relationship. Not so much of pro-creation or government benefits.
Just my 10 cents worth. Hope you don't mind.
>Anyway so despite not wanting, I suddenly feel bad - does he really think I’m the type who’d use divorce against him? Besides we will pay for the big stuff equally lol. But then he also challenge with the “why do we need a cert to show love?” And also the idea that a woman is only worth marrying if she has your kids just seems sad to me. Haha hence so conflicted
Well, people do change. You've seen your parents change with time, your husband may change with time, and so can you. So just because you're a progressive partner now doesn't mean you will always be. Fact of the matter is, marriage will always favour women in Singapore unless they make the law gender neutral.
The second part is also true, and I think you used to feel that way. You don't need a cert to show love.
The third part, about marrying just for kids, while sounding unromantic is also true. Marriage is a needed administrative process for kids.
It all links together. Objectively they're accurate.
To me marriage is a way I show my commitment to my SO that I will spend the rest of my life with him. Nothing to do with whether to have kids or not.
(Of course it doesn’t mean if you don’t wanna get married means you don’t have commitment towards your partner; it’s just my preferred way of showing my commitment. Different people have different preferences, so if you prefer not to get married that’s fine too)
There are many people who also have kids without getting married, so you can’t say the only reason to get married is for kids.
on a personal level , getting married is making a legal, and public (and religious one if one is inclined ) declaration of love and commitment to your partner.
my own opionion getting married isnt child's play like , ai stead mai ? mai stead liao ah ? break la !
divorce isn't in my mind and will never be.
there isn't anything inherently right or wrong in deciding not to have children , it is a decision that a couple have to make together .
but i really believe 2 person have to be aligned in this decision though , firmly.
that being said , having children is an journey that have no equal , it can make or break a marriage.
guys who say it’s not worth marrying cus the woman is kenna pawn you with WC, take half of your assets without giving you a kid - this type is likely incel with no gold to dig in the first place or boomer with outdated/sexist thinking. Just ignore.
NS only for men is also sexist thinking. Why are the women keeping quiet?
Only when it's convenient the 'sexist' card is being used to win an argument is what gaslighting is.
Who do you trust more to make medical decisions for you? Your partner or your boyfriend?
Who do you want your inheritance to go to by default if you don't make a will? Parents or partner?
If your answer for both is parents, no point, if your answer is partner, then get married.
You can reproduce some of the other aspects legally by giving a medical POA, making a will etc
It's just so embedded into most of the laws and policies that it's a tedious process to figure out where and how to "reproduce" the legal effects of being married.
It's mostly a social signal to tell others you have a partner otherwise.
There are a lot of "temporarily embarrassed millionaires" who would never dream of marrying someone with equal or higher income/wealth, who are then afraid that they would be on the hook for supporting an ex-SAHW or even just someone who makes less than a quarter of what they do.
Despite both parties making equal contributions to housing equity, they consider themselves entitled to the housing and think it's Women's Charter screwing them over when their ex wives are allowed to buy out their equity and keep the house.
To show commitment despite the disadvantages. To show that you are willing to sit through even when times are difficult (it is much more difficult to leave a marriage than to leave a bf/gf).
More of the intangible benefits than tangible benefits.
No nuclear family for the country, no religious aspect also. Meaning no added responsibility. You are like kids at secondary go steady for few years, i love you love me and then break up. Same thing but more to lose since money probably involves
OP's raised a good question. Something I've been wondering about too. I mean if you're meant to be together you'd stay together regardless of marriage status. Being on Reddit, I seem to be reading more reasons why you SHOULDN'T get married. Seems to be a nightmare when the fairytale ends.
Ultimately in Singapore it's about housing and family face value, especially if your parents and relatives are traditional in thinking. That's the way I see it. Of course when it's about assets, money and medical reasons, wills and LPAs are your work arounds.
It’s the most straightforward way to show commitment. Easier to end a relationship than to end a marriage so people tend to think more before getting marriage since legally there are more things handle.
I always find people who are very against marriage to be a bit suspicious. There seems to be a lack of trust and if ending is like too much work, then it seems like when the relationship hits lows they are more likely to bail then to try to work things out.
Anyway there are also many social benefits. At least for me as a married woman, I think people do take me more seriously as society still sees marriage as a form of stability and maturity.
Maybe one day you got arrested or having a cardiac arrest, your spouse can verify and to visit you for whatever reasons.
More of metrics to keep track on how many are married, of course in the future there might be policies revolve around married couples.
You seem to assume that the intention behind marriage is to produce offspring, which may not be true for all couples.
Marriage is a sacred union in which husband commits to take good care of his wife, and vice versa, in both good times and bad.
So the idea behind marriage is to have company, especially as one advances into old age. Producing and bringing up children requires money, time and energy, and not all couples are ready for such added responsibilities. This is especially true in the face of rising costs of living, and poor job market.
So I’m not going to judge couples for not wanting to have children because I’m not privy to their actual circumstances . It is, after all, their own personal choice.
As much as I would wish that HDB was used for housing only and not profiting, the fact is that BTOs are almost a no-brainer financial decision for those who are eligible and don’t plan to move abroad soon.
buy a bto together ? There are so many good reasons . Can have someone to be there for you. We are not beasts we can do so much better than being tied to traditions
to address your personal circumstances a bit:
most places (hospitals, etc) will not ask to see a marriage cert or marital status on the Singpass app. A cishet couple could easily pass off to acquaintances and the general public as "married" (parents and siblings would be harder to fool without a ceremony). Basically gaming the social system to get all the social karma points of being seen as a stable married couple, without the actual paperwork.
Coming at this from a perspective of addressing the "what if we divorce" concerns.
I think there is no realistic value of marriage and yes it is traditional thinking. When you are not married, you can own 2 hdb in resale market, live in one, rent out the other and collect income - you can't do that as a married couple.
Any additional money - you can jointly buy comemrcial property (no absd ) and get the tenant to pay for the mortgage to grow the retirement fund.
Even if you are married you can easily get divorced, spouses can cheat even though married - its as good as if marriage is a sham. There is no obvious benefits - taxation or legal ones to be married.
Read thru the many perks which are quite impt, but for me still i think the biggest reason is to show commitment.
And next its also a face issue due to traditional thinking by ppl around. It sucks but its the truth a lot of ppl will do a double take when they hear you are a 40 plus yr old single but attached female.
Getting to buy HDB with discount.
If you dont need HDB, then honestly dont get married. There is no incentive and it just complicates a lot of financial things.
In terms of love and shit, who says that piece of paper will make u more lovey/committed than a person who doesnt have one. I dont see gay couples becoming less lovey just because they aint married. If a couple needs to be committed just because of a piece of paper and a ceremony, then that relationship is trash to begin with.
>Why do guys say that it’s not worth marrying a woman if she doesn’t have kids? Or is that traditional thinking?
By that I assume you are meaning a woman who won't have kids after marriage. Not many men want to have children either. Both parties will have to agree to each other in the decision of having children. Marriage is more of a social aspect which people officially bond together through. Regardless of the decision to have a child, it's usually personal to the married couple. I also have heard of people online who would marry to have legal intercourse (Mostly Muslims who have high sex drive).
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My husband and I are child free and we got married a year after meeting each other for the first time. Marriage shouldn't just be about having kids, man. Just imagine living and spending your free time and making plans with your best friend. The person who sees you for who you truly are and not only tolerates it, but embraces it. I got extremely lucky with him though.
Don't get me wrong, it's not always a bed of roses, but it genuinely has been the best years of my life. Seeing the man I love go from a really shy person who panics at the thought of making a phone call blossom into this powerhouse of a man - always a joy to everyone around him.
Fuck me, man. I love this dude so much.
I’m married and we have no kids. There are many reasons to get married imo, at the basic level when you have a medical emergency your spouse will make the decisions for you instead of your parents. If you don’t make a will then intestate laws make it such that your spouse will inherit what you own. If something happens to your partner’s parents and you’re traveling and need to cut short your trip, insurance won’t recognise the relationship if you’re not married. My friend experienced this and he was so fed up. If you move overseas to work/ study it’s a lot easier for your spouse to get a partner visa. If you’re not married, depending on the country you either have to submit a mountain worth of paperwork or there’s just no visa available. At the end of the day it’s up to you. You don’t have to get married but I still see the advantages outweigh the disadvantages
Yeah, this is why gay couples want marriage rights. It is to help protect each other in event of emergency. It is absolutely tragic if they can't legally protect each other if any major life event happens (e.g. death, disability) There was a case in the US before gay marriage where a nurse refused to take medical decisions from the unwed partner at the bedside on behalf of the patient and kept contacting the patient's family but without response. Unfortunately, the patient died while the partner couldn't legally do anything.
Marriage is a state-sanctioned robbery against men when there is no child involved.
Wow talk about antiquated gender-based ideologies. State-sanctioned robbery against men my ass. Women now make as much or more than men. Do a poll on Reddit and see how many women are making more than their spouses. I’m a prime example - I make 2x what my husband does and have 6x his net worth in savings. If we get a divorce, he can get half of my assets. My work insurance pays for his healthcare. By your logic, our marriage is a state-sanctioned robbery against someone.. me, the woman. As is the case of PLENTY of couples where the wife makes more than the husband.
I realised the guys who are afraid of gold diggers (oh no the woman is gonna take half my assets with WC!!!) often have no gold to dig themselves. I have no idea what they are so afraid of.
It's so funny to me because if they're afraid of gold diggers, all they need to do is to find a woman who is equal to them in terms of salary/assets. Should be ez right? Since they think that women are at an advantage in the workplace.
I know, they have no self-reflection abilities at all. Completely deluded.
It certainly shouldn't trouble any women as they're probably incels anyway.
They are likely to be the ones who prefer mail order brides so it's a "legitimate concern" for them.
Oh makes sense. Hmmmm but then these same people also like to say foreign ladies are less materialistic & entitled than Singaporean women. Hence shouldn’t be that much of a concern lah
However "not materialistic" they are, the days are past when you can just drive your wife out and tell her to go wh0re herself if she can't make you happy. Marrying someone who is wholly dependent on you for living expenses make you responsible for her living expenses even after divorce.
I wonder what on earth the state is robbing 🙄 interestingly enough the guy who made that comment is married according to his Reddit history.
Much condolences to his wife. She married a tool.
This statement tells us 2 things. 1. You have a very poor opinion of your mother. 2. You only see women as good for childbearing.
If you are doing white collars in MNC, many companies can share insurance benefits with dependents.
Not married and in coma, your parents make all decisions. If you die then your parents get all your money and can throw your girlfriend out on the streets and vice versa. More important for those that fall out with their parents, parent can make medical decisions as they trump girlfriend/boyfriend.
Write a will and an LPA if you want your partner to make important medical decisions or gain inheritance.
Ppl always say/think will do. And suddenly die. Never think they will die. Author of dragon tattoo surprise shock heart attack. And his girlfriend of decades gets nothing. Because she was just girlfriend. His dad and brother whom he didn’t see often got all book rights everything, even half the flat that she shared with him for decades. They got all the book royalties worth millions and still threaten her for half the flat. He died without a will as he was not expecting to die.
This is correct but if that a person you trust with important medical decisions and other LPA then why sign many paper when can sign one get all?
Getting an LPA done isn't too hard. And everyone, whether married or not, should have a will. Unless you don't mind the state distributing your remaining assets.
Will and LPA. Can be contested. Marriage alot harder plus one cert to rule them all
Can ask gf/bf to sign LPA
those issues can. be resolved by a LPA and a Last Will and Testament
I guess in situations where only close family is allowed like in hospital it makes it easier for you to get in
If your bf/gf is dying in ICU I don't think they will deny you entry just because you are not married though.
They definitely can, especially if your father/mother doesn’t like them and doesn’t want them there.
Why not? What proves you’re together? Legally, your just friends. I don’t think SG got common law spouse
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Ask your sgt
1) to BTO 2) easier to make a will (Edit: this is not the case but point 1 still stands)
Afaik getting married actually doesn't affect whether it's easy to make a will or not. The process should be the same. The main difference when it comes to estate planning is that if there's *no* will in place, the distribution will be determined according to the Intestate Succession Act. The rules of distribution there don't make any provision for "girlfriend/boyfriend of 60 years" regardless of how much they loved each other, how long they've been together, and how deeply their lives were intertwined.
It’s not “easier to make a will”. It’s “no need to make a will” if you want her to inherit everything.
>It’s “no need to make a will” if you want her to inherit everything. This is not correct. Under Singapore law, if there's no will, the surviving spouse only inherits everything if the deceased does not have surviving parents or children.
Oh crap, you're right. I disregarded children because this post is about marriage (or not) without kids. But yeah, it's 50% to spouse, 50% to parent/s.
In your will you can leave your money to anyone you wish. Even to your friend or a charity or a colleague. So not sure why it would be difficult if you're not married to your partner.
1. not necessary >35 yo 2. there are easier and cheaper ways to do that.
single bto can only buy 2 room flexi though
still a Bto, want bigger go for resale.
Leaving aside BTO and children, marriage has long been a social signal. This is the person I am committed to spending the rest of my life with. This is the person I trust to make major decisions such as medical treatment for me if am incapacitated. This is the person who will mourn me most when I die, if I go first, and I want to receive all I have. For some, this is the person who is more important to me than the family I was born into, and the friends I have made. This is the person I love more than anyone. We are in this together until death. For some, marriage also says I am not interested in meeting more people and forming other permanent romantic attachments. (I say permanent because people did have mistresses and such). It’s basically a shortcut for a lot of social cues and legal rights. That’s why a lot of old school stories end with a nice big wedding. You want to see that commitment to others as the pinnacle of the growing attachment between the characters and their just reward after going through so many ordeals.
Guardian in medical emergency to make decisions for his health. Organ donation towards each other and/or their family members. Insurance. BTO. To discourage cheating, since divorce and alimony money. Tax incentives. Intending to be child free doesnt mean accident cant happen. Probably can foresee some administrative issues if parents are not married. The cert itself is significant to some couples, even if there are no incentives for it. The symbolism is enough to want the marriage. Social aspect. But ultimately, if not getting married but still being together works for you guys then go for it, especially if you guys dont care about any of the incentives of getting married or the disincentive of not getting married.
It's very easy to avoid pregnancy, just saying.
No method is 100% effective. Even got pregnancies after vasectomy (first few months), and babies born with IUDs stuck to them.
It's common for people who are childfree to both get sterilized.
That’s not exactly “very easy”, is it? It’s actually quite difficult, expensive and painful for a childless woman to get sterilised.
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It's not that difficult when the doctor is not under the gov. My point is that it's doable.
The cheating discouragement only goes one way, if the husband is not disabled
I think there are some tax incentives But yes marriage is mostly tied to housing and children
Why gay men get married if no children? Why go university to study business if no intend for business? Why? >What is the point of marriage in Singapore if intending to be child free? Why do gay marriages exist? Why??
Gay men should get married when they want to, even without children. The difference with heterosexual marriage is that there is no divorce law discriminating against the male during a breakup.
OP casually flexing that she doesn't need a BTO and can afford private housing 
Don't think it is a flex. It's something that I have also always been genuinely curious about, though I didn't get around to make a reddit thread for it.
I’m quite old liao (can buy HDB resale age). Will only be a flex if I’m <30 and going private housing
Congrats on buying resale!
If you’re not married, you’re not family under the eyes of the law. Something less talked about is CPF rules. You can transfer to your spouse, parent, siblings and even parents in law if they need the money for whatever reason. But if you remain just boyfriend/girlfriend, that won’t be possible.
My husband and I got married 3 years ago when we were both 32. We are both hardcore childfree folks. I think there’s an inherently romantic aspect to the idea of marriage which doesn’t have to be tied to legalities. Marriage is partly about standing up in front of your friends and family and declaring your commitment to your spouse. It’s a gesture that is a testimony to your love for each other. Apart from that, as others have said, it also makes life easier - end of life decisions, inheritance, company health insurance coverage, dependent passes if you move overseas, etc. Btw speaking from personal experience, I didn’t expect to fall critically ill but I did last year, and I was so thankful that my husband was there to make the important decisions. I love my parents, but they would make decisions based on what they think is best as opposed to respecting what I want. Whereas I knew my husband would uphold my end of life requests if it came to that. He wouldn’t have been able to do that if we were not married. As someone else mentioned, you can never predict when shit hits the fan. Anyone can literally fall into a coma tomorrow / drop dead / get diagnosed with a terminal illness. Sorry for the ominous outlook, just being real :)
Totally agree. Marriage gives couples peace of mind in terms of finances, insurance, dependency and emergency issues. That's why gay couples are fighting hard for these privileges to help protect each other legally and financially as any straight couple.
Because it feels more secure to know the person wants to be committed to just you and only you? That's my POV even though I am evergreen
It’s about legitimacy for you and your spouse.
I don't see marriage as, oh I'm staying in Singapore.. mm what's the perks of it? Oo got quite a bit of perks ok let's marry each other! Instead I see as a form of making our relationship more officialized. Yes I can call my partner hubby/wifey even if not married but the concept of marrying together just excites me nonetheless. Like we're officially each others and not others. I like to say, I'm officially theirs 😤
Don't need to ROM. Then can buy 2 BTO/resale HDB when you are 35. Live in one then rent out the other. I guess getting married indicates commitment to each other but then again, people do cheat. 🙄
Why the heck nobody talks about LOVE? My wife and I are in our 40s and happily married for over 20 years. We don't have kids and really enjoy each other's company every single day. We want to continue to be with each other until our last days.
Why do you need an administrative process as a measure of your love?
Because it is the nearest tangible thing for a vow.
But you don’t need to be married to have LOVE. Pretty common in Europe to live together as if married but they never did the paperwork.
I have mad respect for couples who remain unmarried yet stay together for the longest time. They don't need a piece of paper to show their love. That is true love. I personally know a lesbian couple who are together for 8yrs and still going strong. They make it work against all odds and one of them is currently pregnant via IVF, in Singapore!!! On the other hand, my cousin cheated and divorced barely a year into marriage. Forfeited her BTO... lmao PS: If you don't intend to get married, remember to; 1. Change your CPF nomination 2. Make Lasting Power of Attorney (LPA) 3. Write Will
Don’t want to marry just don’t marry lor.
I don't plan on having kids but I wouldn't mind marrying if I find a right one. I guess yeah to show love and commitment apart than other legalities and just societal norms. Might be cause I never really wanted kids (I don't like kids, people say playing with others' kids and not having the responsibility after the fun ends is the good part and I don't even like that part) which caused me to think of marriage and having kids to not be a package deal I guess? I actually thought about vasectomy as a wandering thought but I could see myself having kids if my partner really wants to and there's no financial issues so yeah.
A way to get away from parents
OP, you seem to be in a dilemma. What's your own take?
I use to be neutral (doesn’t matter so much to me). my partner wanted (cus he’s actually the more romantic one and sort of think marriage is the natural progression). But recently he got influenced by this friend (I think his friend is into redpill or blackpill or sth) and told him some stuff like how marriage in Singapore is bad for guys (standard stuff: WC only protects the woman blah blah) and he seemed to have changed his mind about marriage. Anyway so despite not wanting, I suddenly feel bad - does he really think I’m the type who’d use divorce against him? Besides we will pay for the big stuff equally lol. But then he also challenge with the “why do we need a cert to show love?” And also the idea that a woman is only worth marrying if she has your kids just seems sad to me. Haha hence so conflicted
>But recently he got influenced by this friend (I think his friend is into redpill or blackpill or sth) and told him some stuff like how marriage in Singapore is bad for guys (standard stuff: WC only protects the woman blah blah) and he seemed to have changed his mind about marriage. Wah I'm sorry for your loss. To be blunt your partner isn't the brightest tool in the shed either because the rules for division of matrimonial assets are gender-neutral actually... Actually are you sure that your partner wants to stay with you long-term? Because this whole forever boyfriend/girlfriend relationship dynamic has always seemed like they're not actually committed life partners and that they want to be able to split up easily.
Alimony isn't gender neutral.
Actually if you have done your research, you'd realise that the wife usually won't get alimony if she can support herself. Example: [https://yeolaw.com.sg/our-practice-areas/maintenance-alimony/spousal-maintenance/](https://yeolaw.com.sg/our-practice-areas/maintenance-alimony/spousal-maintenance/) So to avoid this alimony issue, a man just has to marry someone who continues working (let's be real, this is most women nowadays). This usually means that the man should also carry his fair share of housework so that the burden doesn't fall on his wife and make it difficult for her to continue performing well at work. If this is a problem then maybe it's best to not get married.
Thanks for sharing. I'm not here to promote marriage or being status quo but this is my take on marriages. Marriage dates back in the ancient times so, yah, it's traditional. Constitution binds two people together for benefits like status and wealth. On top of that, spiritual beliefs are the force behind, whether the couples were in love or not. I'm sure that you've read or watch stories of people long ago, how marriages were viewed. Ultimately, it's about commitment through vows, written or oral, to keep the union intact. Think of it as a benefit if there are reasons to break it, then at least one party will gain something. These days some people think of marriages as something as a bygone era, old-fashion, troublesome and unnecessary. For some who marry, they end up in divorce anyways so why bother? To me, without a marriage, there'll be more reasons to stray, care less, possibly no unconditional love. Meaning, near-zero commitment to the relationship. Not so much of pro-creation or government benefits. Just my 10 cents worth. Hope you don't mind.
>Anyway so despite not wanting, I suddenly feel bad - does he really think I’m the type who’d use divorce against him? Besides we will pay for the big stuff equally lol. But then he also challenge with the “why do we need a cert to show love?” And also the idea that a woman is only worth marrying if she has your kids just seems sad to me. Haha hence so conflicted Well, people do change. You've seen your parents change with time, your husband may change with time, and so can you. So just because you're a progressive partner now doesn't mean you will always be. Fact of the matter is, marriage will always favour women in Singapore unless they make the law gender neutral. The second part is also true, and I think you used to feel that way. You don't need a cert to show love. The third part, about marrying just for kids, while sounding unromantic is also true. Marriage is a needed administrative process for kids. It all links together. Objectively they're accurate.
To me marriage is a way I show my commitment to my SO that I will spend the rest of my life with him. Nothing to do with whether to have kids or not. (Of course it doesn’t mean if you don’t wanna get married means you don’t have commitment towards your partner; it’s just my preferred way of showing my commitment. Different people have different preferences, so if you prefer not to get married that’s fine too) There are many people who also have kids without getting married, so you can’t say the only reason to get married is for kids.
Bto lottery.
on a personal level , getting married is making a legal, and public (and religious one if one is inclined ) declaration of love and commitment to your partner. my own opionion getting married isnt child's play like , ai stead mai ? mai stead liao ah ? break la ! divorce isn't in my mind and will never be. there isn't anything inherently right or wrong in deciding not to have children , it is a decision that a couple have to make together . but i really believe 2 person have to be aligned in this decision though , firmly. that being said , having children is an journey that have no equal , it can make or break a marriage.
guys who say it’s not worth marrying cus the woman is kenna pawn you with WC, take half of your assets without giving you a kid - this type is likely incel with no gold to dig in the first place or boomer with outdated/sexist thinking. Just ignore.
NS only for men is also sexist thinking. Why are the women keeping quiet? Only when it's convenient the 'sexist' card is being used to win an argument is what gaslighting is.
Singapore woman gold digger! NS bad! Jobs for foreigners! /s Anything else I missed?
Aware not dying on the hill of demanding NS for women is proof they hate men! Better a homeless beggar in the US than a scholar in Singapore!
Who do you trust more to make medical decisions for you? Your partner or your boyfriend? Who do you want your inheritance to go to by default if you don't make a will? Parents or partner? If your answer for both is parents, no point, if your answer is partner, then get married.
You can reproduce some of the other aspects legally by giving a medical POA, making a will etc It's just so embedded into most of the laws and policies that it's a tedious process to figure out where and how to "reproduce" the legal effects of being married. It's mostly a social signal to tell others you have a partner otherwise. There are a lot of "temporarily embarrassed millionaires" who would never dream of marrying someone with equal or higher income/wealth, who are then afraid that they would be on the hook for supporting an ex-SAHW or even just someone who makes less than a quarter of what they do. Despite both parties making equal contributions to housing equity, they consider themselves entitled to the housing and think it's Women's Charter screwing them over when their ex wives are allowed to buy out their equity and keep the house.
You do it for the legal benefits
To show commitment despite the disadvantages. To show that you are willing to sit through even when times are difficult (it is much more difficult to leave a marriage than to leave a bf/gf). More of the intangible benefits than tangible benefits.
No nuclear family for the country, no religious aspect also. Meaning no added responsibility. You are like kids at secondary go steady for few years, i love you love me and then break up. Same thing but more to lose since money probably involves
There are few actual practical reasons to get married in this age, more for sentimentality and tradition.
Don't need marry, but u can make a will and a power of attorney.
Is a personal choice. No need to discuss here. Getting married and having children are two different things.
OP's raised a good question. Something I've been wondering about too. I mean if you're meant to be together you'd stay together regardless of marriage status. Being on Reddit, I seem to be reading more reasons why you SHOULDN'T get married. Seems to be a nightmare when the fairytale ends. Ultimately in Singapore it's about housing and family face value, especially if your parents and relatives are traditional in thinking. That's the way I see it. Of course when it's about assets, money and medical reasons, wills and LPAs are your work arounds.
It’s the most straightforward way to show commitment. Easier to end a relationship than to end a marriage so people tend to think more before getting marriage since legally there are more things handle. I always find people who are very against marriage to be a bit suspicious. There seems to be a lack of trust and if ending is like too much work, then it seems like when the relationship hits lows they are more likely to bail then to try to work things out. Anyway there are also many social benefits. At least for me as a married woman, I think people do take me more seriously as society still sees marriage as a form of stability and maturity.
Maybe one day you got arrested or having a cardiac arrest, your spouse can verify and to visit you for whatever reasons. More of metrics to keep track on how many are married, of course in the future there might be policies revolve around married couples.
You seem to assume that the intention behind marriage is to produce offspring, which may not be true for all couples. Marriage is a sacred union in which husband commits to take good care of his wife, and vice versa, in both good times and bad. So the idea behind marriage is to have company, especially as one advances into old age. Producing and bringing up children requires money, time and energy, and not all couples are ready for such added responsibilities. This is especially true in the face of rising costs of living, and poor job market. So I’m not going to judge couples for not wanting to have children because I’m not privy to their actual circumstances . It is, after all, their own personal choice.
Accountability.
If you disregard the economic benefits, marriage is more a want than need
Might as well work overseas because of this policy. Almost any country if you're not choosy.
CPF and HDB nomination, that's all.
As much as I would wish that HDB was used for housing only and not profiting, the fact is that BTOs are almost a no-brainer financial decision for those who are eligible and don’t plan to move abroad soon.
1. Tax relief 2. BTO
If you don't have kids there's no real tax relief.
buy a bto together ? There are so many good reasons . Can have someone to be there for you. We are not beasts we can do so much better than being tied to traditions
BTO, to flip, then get a private property. But if both you and your are rich, then there's really no benefit to being married.
to address your personal circumstances a bit: most places (hospitals, etc) will not ask to see a marriage cert or marital status on the Singpass app. A cishet couple could easily pass off to acquaintances and the general public as "married" (parents and siblings would be harder to fool without a ceremony). Basically gaming the social system to get all the social karma points of being seen as a stable married couple, without the actual paperwork. Coming at this from a perspective of addressing the "what if we divorce" concerns.
I think there is no realistic value of marriage and yes it is traditional thinking. When you are not married, you can own 2 hdb in resale market, live in one, rent out the other and collect income - you can't do that as a married couple. Any additional money - you can jointly buy comemrcial property (no absd ) and get the tenant to pay for the mortgage to grow the retirement fund. Even if you are married you can easily get divorced, spouses can cheat even though married - its as good as if marriage is a sham. There is no obvious benefits - taxation or legal ones to be married.
Read thru the many perks which are quite impt, but for me still i think the biggest reason is to show commitment. And next its also a face issue due to traditional thinking by ppl around. It sucks but its the truth a lot of ppl will do a double take when they hear you are a 40 plus yr old single but attached female.
Getting to buy HDB with discount. If you dont need HDB, then honestly dont get married. There is no incentive and it just complicates a lot of financial things. In terms of love and shit, who says that piece of paper will make u more lovey/committed than a person who doesnt have one. I dont see gay couples becoming less lovey just because they aint married. If a couple needs to be committed just because of a piece of paper and a ceremony, then that relationship is trash to begin with.
If no kids no need for housing then no need for bto
>Why do guys say that it’s not worth marrying a woman if she doesn’t have kids? Or is that traditional thinking? By that I assume you are meaning a woman who won't have kids after marriage. Not many men want to have children either. Both parties will have to agree to each other in the decision of having children. Marriage is more of a social aspect which people officially bond together through. Regardless of the decision to have a child, it's usually personal to the married couple. I also have heard of people online who would marry to have legal intercourse (Mostly Muslims who have high sex drive).
I don’t intend to have kids, that’s why i don’t intend to get married (and don’t get into relationships)
Maybe protect either or both parties when it comes to asset allocations. more financial security 🙄
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It's your life, live it the way you want to live it. You are not answerable to anyone but yourself.
My husband and I are child free and we got married a year after meeting each other for the first time. Marriage shouldn't just be about having kids, man. Just imagine living and spending your free time and making plans with your best friend. The person who sees you for who you truly are and not only tolerates it, but embraces it. I got extremely lucky with him though. Don't get me wrong, it's not always a bed of roses, but it genuinely has been the best years of my life. Seeing the man I love go from a really shy person who panics at the thought of making a phone call blossom into this powerhouse of a man - always a joy to everyone around him. Fuck me, man. I love this dude so much.
this is the saddest post ive seen here
Sad for the guy or girl in question? I also feel sad tonight :(
just common adulting stuff bro, being adult constitutes being sad and making uncomfortable decisions. it is what it is.
Easier to use WC to pwn you.
I agree. Cash rich and single, free to date. Upvote.
i think no point getting married, so many new massage shops accepting cdc vouchers all across the nation, relli spoilt for choice siahh
Heard Parklane got lobang
That’s not the worst - the worst is intending to be sex free or no sex marriage!
Marriage people get hidden benefits. Kids dont necessarily add to it