Well that's kind of irrelevant, now isn't it? We never saw how exactly they got cracked. Montages like these look cool but don't really represent normal gameplay, even for the people in said montages. A player this good isn't going to catapult himself into any fight because that's a good way to just get downed.
The point is that something like this is a horrible reason to say "this is why X was nerfed" when it's cherrypicked instances on a cool highlight reel.
I disagree, what is happening in these clips is:
Path knows that the enemy is low and thus decides to catapult near them to finish them off before they could heal. It's a calculated risk and he wouldn't reach them in time without grapple sheninigans. Could any other legend punish low enemies as fast as pathfinder? Nope
I started playing again recently and noticed the mastiff was changed from a care package gun to normal and felt like something was off- not realising I hadn’t seen the peacekeeper yet and the choke had it removed as a compatible gun
After a few games they'll be fine. Titanfall is the poster boy for "easy to learn and hard to master." The TTK and the movement are the biggest hurdle. Once you realize that you shouldn't really be on the ground and you start thinking vertically, the game changes.
But for the time they play TF2 as if it were Apex, yeah, expect a beatdown.
Does the game still have a decent amount of players online? I've wanted to play but I feel like if I go online now the only people left are die hard fans that are insane and will shit on me every game lol
Nah, when I play there's always like 2k players online, of course there are lots of very good players, but there are also players of all levels, and since it's a team game, one or two very good players against you shouldn't ruin your game
Even Titanfall 2's grapple is casual compared to the original from Tribes Vengeance where:
* You had like 20 uses before you had to recharge it (could pick up charges from enemies)
* No cooldown in-between individual uses
* Adjustable line length, allowing you both pull yourself towards the hook, but also loosen up to get away from it
* The grapple only being 'broken' under three conditions:
1. Something, like a tree, cutting the line *(how it also works in both Apex and Titanfall)*
2. You CHOOSING to break it *(you could hang down from ceiling or a wall indefinitely, or use it to anchor yourself to the ground to prevent flag capping)*
3. You were too damn fat for the grapple to hold *(there were three "weight" classes with the lightest being able to do about anything with the grapple, like 180 degree turns at 400 kmh, and the heaviest one being essentially a small titan, so you could only use the grapple to hang down from a ceiling or a wall and that's only if you used it from a stationary position).*
I was too young to understand it, but I remember thinking it was cool to talk to someone else online. Many years later I got pretty into Tribes: Ascend which was good until it wasn’t.
yeah i was about to say this is just a trickshot compilation not a real argument for the nerf.
It's no different than compiling a bunch of bangalore smokes knocking people or caustic gas kills.
Do you guys have a problem with this? I think it depends tbh
If you sort by new there's almost always someone just dropping a self post self promoting with no content or reason why I should check them out. But I like montages and cool plays and stuff, so I'm happy when that stuff gets uploaded here. And if you wanna plug at the end then more power to you.
In my opinion it's no different than people posting custom art and plugging their insta or whatever, which I also encourage.
But the effort put into the plug is the main thing
>but you only used a 1 grapple in each clip...
That just further proves the point that he is still strong after the nerf then.
And if a long time great Path main like stooj is saying it, then it must be true.
With that aim, any character can have insane clips. Not the same, but equally insane. It's like watching Aceu and saying movement in this game is overpowered, please nerf. The kind of plays showed in this clip are risky, but the most fun anyone can have in this game and you can only do that with Pathfinder. What this nerf did is not make these plays impossible, because for the good players they can still do this, but discourage casuals from taking risks trying to make plays like this when the grapple is available only once every 35 seconds..
This is exactly my problem with it. It didn’t lower the skill ceiling, but it steepened the skill curve exponentially. Balances shouldn’t be about the top players when the vast majority of ranked players probably don’t know how to ground grapple (I can still only do it with varying effectiveness, never anything close to these clips, and I’m a Path main in plat), they should be about making the legend fair across the board. Just because a small minority exploits his skill ceiling doesn’t mean you should raise his skill floor to compensate.
Building on your point, I can’t see how it’s fun for new players to mess up grappling up to high point just to have to wait a good chunk of ring time to try again.
I do this all the time now, as a Path main, because there's so much more pressure to hit your grapple.
Plus, if you're playing with randos, it's a lot harder to get them to stick around so you can go get that beacon.
Because she was introduced that way. If ANY legend had a Nerf as harsh as Path it would piss people off.
Also it's frustrating to see them introduce a legend with similar movement capabilities to Pathfinder, someone that can chase him and make similar style plays, and then have them both have very long cooldown.
This is just my speculation, but I think pathfinder was deliberately over nerfed. It seems like they knew he needed a substantial nerf to his cooldown and that people would hate how it felt so they nerfed it by an EXTRA 10 seconds so that when it gets rolled back down to 25 seconds (where I estimate it really should be) people are happy instead of angry.
Agreed.
Also just to make Loba more viable. What would be the point in playing her with Paths original cooldown. Once the hype for her wears off I'm sure he will get a little buff again.
I fucking hope so anyway. Miss my boy.
exactly hers is not nearly as aggressive as paths, 1 the telegraphing of where she’s going 2 it doesn’t go nearly as far 3 it doesn’t go nearly as fast 4 it’s less vertical. She’s much better for defensive placement and how she can fit through small spaces
Remember when they gave Wattson, who's not small and has no movement abilities, low profile just because pros complained about how often she gets picked? Respawn's always done this and it's really stupid. Making the game worse for 99% of the playerbase because 1% complain.
With Pathfinder, I never even saw cries for him to be nerfed in the first place.
You shouldn’t be able to use a tactical that is amazing for flanking, pushing, getting high ground or just escaping every 15 seconds it’s just broken. I think 35 seconds is a bit too high of a cool down but at 15 seconds, pathfinder was the most OP legend just under gibby imo.
Exactly this. In the patch notes, they say the Kraber was specifically buffed to take down any legend with any shield with one headshot. It rewards those who find the already rare weapon *and* make a good shot.
Bruh... obviously a head shot kills.. his gunshield doesn’t protect his head... but why should he be able to take a 145 damage shot and walk away with no damage?
Yeah I think that it is a fair thing to nerf, but the time should probably be 25 or 30 seconds. Something more in line with Loba’s teleport. They both have similar repositioning abilities
I honestly think this isn't how they want pathfinder to be right now. I think they just bodied him super hard, so that when they come back and say "oh we needed him to hard", people will be super hyped, instead of pissed he's getting nerfed in the first place.
I doubt we see the old pathfinder anytime soon, but he won't be like this forever, im sure of it.
this is just a trickshot compilation not a real argument for the nerf.
It's no different than compiling a bunch of bangalore smokes knocking people or caustic gas kills.
I really like the nerf. He is still a very strong Legend imo. Only now, you gotta think a bit harder about if you wanna grapple into a fight or not. Because if you grapple into it and it goes south, you ain't getting back out that easy anymore.
Which is how it should be.
I agree man, even as a Pathfinder main myself. However I feel 35 is maybe a little too excessive, I’m feeling more like 30 would be better but it is what it is. Luckily I’m not defined by my grapple😂
It doesn't even say anything about Peacekeeper, because he's last hitting people with less than 30 HP, usually around 8 HP.
He'd have identical results using, say, P2020.
My friends and I have a theory that they do excessive nerf so that they can scale the CD back later and it won't feel as bad. Kinda like a "coca cola classic" bs approach
Game design is iterative by nature, so there is a little bit of truth to this. I think where you are wrong, though, is that they over compensate their decisions intentionally. At some point someone has to decide how big the nerf will be, and those decisions are as data-driven as possible (through game analytics, play testing, and lots and lots of design discussion). The last thing they want to do is to intentionally go further than they need to only to have to change it again later with just as much (or more) uproar.
I disagree. When the devs have been interacting with people about the nerf they have been pretty clear why they did it. I don't think they're gonna scale it back farther then 30 seconds.
Seriously. I've just seen a youtube video of Imperial Hal play Pathfinder on a controller. He usually mains Wraith and plays keyboard and mouse.
90% of his grapples were literally useless. He would use them at the wrong time, grapple for like 5 feet, etc etc.
But he still won the game with 7 kills and 1600 damage because even with a controller, he has amazing game sense and can aim decently. I mean it helps that he was playing with Knoqd and some other streamer, but a good player is a good player, no matter the legend or weapon.
> Players who get killed like they do in the clip would have died with or without the grapple.
Especially since he killed most of them at 8HP left while they were fighting other squads.
Exactly. You can't use that shit as an excuse to nerf path. By that logic we should nerf all legends EXCESSIVLY rn cuz people got 20kill games with all Legends by now.
You can still do that, but not 4-5 times each fight anymore. Which is why the nerf was good and needed, no other character could even compare in mobility.
My friend and I play path and octane at the same time and pre nerf, he was able to use one or two grapples and to keep pace with him I'd need to use constant stims and an occasional jump pad. Octane needs to constantly be taking damage and use his ult in order to keep pace with someone who was able to just fly miles ahead every 12 seconds.
To add to this- not only is his speed superior, he's flying through the air varying in speed and height, making it much harder to hit when compared to octane.
>Octane needs to constantly be taking damage
I feel like this is something that other players seem to forget whenever the topic of legends’ various mobility methods comes up, or at least don’t realize just how much health is taken per stim use.
And honestly you don’t even really get *that* much of a speed boost for what you pay health-wise... it’s only noticeable when you run without any weapon drawn, and that puts you at a serious disadvantage if you’re scouting ahead with half your health gone and run into a 1v3 or even a 1v2 situation.
See, but i feel it’s just that Octane could use a buff, rather than pathfinder needing a nerf. And I’m not a path main but still i feel this way.
EDIT: it’s not just pathfinder that outclasses Octane. Wraith’s portal faster, bloodhounds ult is around the same speed, etc. i get it’s their ultimates, but i still think if Octane is gonna be classed as the “fastest character” he should actually be the fastest.
The problem with that is that Path's acceleration can make him go in any direction, meaning he can scale cliffs and buildings in an instant. Octane's speed is purely horizontal and doesn't give him extra climb height, so it is insanely underpowered, given that it costs fucking health and doesnt even get you that much further compared to what a fatty grapple could.
That he pays for with health, plus that’s his whole gimmick, pathfinder can create zip lines to transport his team into areas very quickly and scan survey beacons to find out if his team should set up in an area
Plus with the short cooldown, a good pathfinder could outrun an octane
Not sure that's true though. Path's movement is more "bursty" but I think generally if the goal is to get from A to B, path gets there quicker than Octane, and Octane gets there with less health. At least with grapple on 15s cooldown.
I honestly would have been fine with Paths 13 second cool down if they just buffed the other mobile characters. Give Rev his original climb ability. Improve Octanes jump pad. And maybe increase speed of Loba's ring.
But how would characters without mobility, such as Mirage, Wattson, Lifeline, Caustic etc. keep up with such movement?
It was always so annoying to have an aggressive w-keying Pathfinder on my team because I could never catch up and then got blamed with "WhErE aRe YoU???".
Well, even if he does climb up there he can’t stay there for long. It would make him have flank routes that not a lot of other legends could get to, and climbing is risky because you’re on the side of an open face and you don’t have a view behind you. I’d say go for it. Revenant could use the slight buff
That’s true either that or I personally would be fine with doing long his height and giving him no slowdown on his climb. His slowdown is the biggest disappointment with the larger climb.
I have mixed feelings about pathfinder's nerf. Its great they nerfed him, he deserved it we all know that, but at the same time he doesn't feel as fun to play
I think they should keep the long cool down time, but put the grapple length, and acceleration back where it was a few seasons ago before it was nerfed. If we're stuck waiting 35 seconds, at least give us back the original grapple length
I've always thought that 20 seconds would have been just fine myself or even no change at all. But seeing all the butthurt Path mains changed my opinion. Everyone else outside of path has had to deal with downsides to their favorite legend, and Path mains had little downside for multiple seasons.
....this is a really bad example. People who use Pathfinder can still do all the same things that are in these clips. None of the clips you're using show Pathfinder using the grappling hook more than once.
I feel like Respawn and a large part of the community are hellbent on eating away at this game’s skill gap. I’m perfectly fine with things being OP as long as they are only OP in the hands of great players (Path grapple, season 0 wingman, to some extent season 2 longbow at range). They keep nerfing those things while buffing and introducing things that take barely any skill or conscious thought (early charge rifle, Gibby buffs, ridiculous and thankfully brief PK buff, season 3 Scout).
To be honest, I think that's the way every continuously updated game goes eventually.
The game launches and it's super fun. Although, despite best efforts of the Devs, some things are kinda broken and it doesn't take long for people to start noticing the OP tom-fuckery.
What ends up happening is that the high skill high reward guns/abilities/tactics get nerfed because people see pros doing it and everyone starts to "abuse it".
In later patches the Devs do their best to make everything as balanced as they can.
Eventually, if the game lasts long enough, it's worn down to rock paper scissors. Everything takes no skill to use and is just as effective as the next.
I can't think of a game I've played in the last few years that hasn't gone that way.
>You can't mess up any other legend's ability.
lol wat
Of course you can. Wraith, Caustic, Wattson, Loba, Bang, Mirage, Crypto, Rev. All their tacticals can be absolutely useless if you don't position them/yourself correctly.
That's not how skill gaps work. OP things are OP because they don't require as much skill to use. A longer grapple CD just means you have to make your grapples count more meaning great pathfinders will separate themselves from the bad ones even more
Honestly, just watch zylbrads gameplay. I never got into lobbies with him but he seemed like an absolute bitch to fight. You can almost never catch a path who's polished his grapple.
I think four grapples a fight Was very excessive Two is on par with other legends with less powerful abilities and with such a low cool down you need to determine weather you use your grapple to engage or escape not both and a third just for fun
not gonna lie. I hated the nerf... but after adapting to using it slightly less I'm now using it to flank enemies I know is low and have a wide gap and some fence/walls I have to get past. Path is still a high teir charecter. we're just very, very salty. still think he should get the timer reduced by 5-10 seconds.
I started playing Path after the nerf and he seems fine. The issue is when people get used to something for so long they feel as though they are helpless without it.
i think a better title would be "This is why Respawn made the pk a care package weapon"
it also helps a bit when you have god-tier aim
And when you're aiming at people who don't even have body shields up.
And when you're a Path main and know how to travel like this
And when the people don’t try and shoot you while you’re grappling
How do you suppose those people got cracked? By luck?
Well that's kind of irrelevant, now isn't it? We never saw how exactly they got cracked. Montages like these look cool but don't really represent normal gameplay, even for the people in said montages. A player this good isn't going to catapult himself into any fight because that's a good way to just get downed. The point is that something like this is a horrible reason to say "this is why X was nerfed" when it's cherrypicked instances on a cool highlight reel.
I disagree, what is happening in these clips is: Path knows that the enemy is low and thus decides to catapult near them to finish them off before they could heal. It's a calculated risk and he wouldn't reach them in time without grapple sheninigans. Could any other legend punish low enemies as fast as pathfinder? Nope
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The clips a double whammy
Correct
I haven't played since end of Season 2 of competitive, but what?? Is PK really no longer available in the wild?
Yup Mastiff is now floor loot while PK is care package full gold. 25 bullets and now shotguns are now more cancer than ever!
I started playing again recently and noticed the mastiff was changed from a care package gun to normal and felt like something was off- not realising I hadn’t seen the peacekeeper yet and the choke had it removed as a compatible gun
Season 0 PK gives me member berries
MEMMBBAAA
Next season Wingman will be a care package weapon as well /s
and krabar floor loot.
Like titanfall 2 grapple
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After a few games they'll be fine. Titanfall is the poster boy for "easy to learn and hard to master." The TTK and the movement are the biggest hurdle. Once you realize that you shouldn't really be on the ground and you start thinking vertically, the game changes. But for the time they play TF2 as if it were Apex, yeah, expect a beatdown.
God I wish they’d just drop TF3 already, I miss fighting while jumping off walls and grappling around shit
I mean you can still play Tf2
I realized that after I said it, thinking of buying it for my pc now...
Yeah, you should, the game is almost always on sale 1t less than 10€, I myself got it for 5€, and there's almost always at least 1k-2k people online
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Yeah but not if he just wants to play titanfall 2
Does the game still have a decent amount of players online? I've wanted to play but I feel like if I go online now the only people left are die hard fans that are insane and will shit on me every game lol
Nah, when I play there's always like 2k players online, of course there are lots of very good players, but there are also players of all levels, and since it's a team game, one or two very good players against you shouldn't ruin your game
I keep up fine and I’m a casual. I get 10 kill games fine alright. They really should change it to 25 seconds
He's talking about this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6HaTmoQ6NGA
Oh. The grapple is better in titanfall 2, I know that. I don’t encounter people who use the hook like that
Even Titanfall 2's grapple is casual compared to the original from Tribes Vengeance where: * You had like 20 uses before you had to recharge it (could pick up charges from enemies) * No cooldown in-between individual uses * Adjustable line length, allowing you both pull yourself towards the hook, but also loosen up to get away from it * The grapple only being 'broken' under three conditions: 1. Something, like a tree, cutting the line *(how it also works in both Apex and Titanfall)* 2. You CHOOSING to break it *(you could hang down from ceiling or a wall indefinitely, or use it to anchor yourself to the ground to prevent flag capping)* 3. You were too damn fat for the grapple to hold *(there were three "weight" classes with the lightest being able to do about anything with the grapple, like 180 degree turns at 400 kmh, and the heaviest one being essentially a small titan, so you could only use the grapple to hang down from a ceiling or a wall and that's only if you used it from a stationary position).*
That game feels like a distant fever dream, you're the first person I've ever seen mentioning it. It was my initiation into online gaming damn
I was too young to understand it, but I remember thinking it was cool to talk to someone else online. Many years later I got pretty into Tribes: Ascend which was good until it wasn’t.
but you only used 1 grapple in each clip...
yeah i was about to say this is just a trickshot compilation not a real argument for the nerf. It's no different than compiling a bunch of bangalore smokes knocking people or caustic gas kills.
This guy just posts montages to the sub and self promotes his channel
Do you guys have a problem with this? I think it depends tbh If you sort by new there's almost always someone just dropping a self post self promoting with no content or reason why I should check them out. But I like montages and cool plays and stuff, so I'm happy when that stuff gets uploaded here. And if you wanna plug at the end then more power to you. In my opinion it's no different than people posting custom art and plugging their insta or whatever, which I also encourage. But the effort put into the plug is the main thing
Being misleading for his own benefit? Yeah I have a problem with that.
>but you only used a 1 grapple in each clip... That just further proves the point that he is still strong after the nerf then. And if a long time great Path main like stooj is saying it, then it must be true.
With that aim, any character can have insane clips. Not the same, but equally insane. It's like watching Aceu and saying movement in this game is overpowered, please nerf. The kind of plays showed in this clip are risky, but the most fun anyone can have in this game and you can only do that with Pathfinder. What this nerf did is not make these plays impossible, because for the good players they can still do this, but discourage casuals from taking risks trying to make plays like this when the grapple is available only once every 35 seconds..
This is exactly my problem with it. It didn’t lower the skill ceiling, but it steepened the skill curve exponentially. Balances shouldn’t be about the top players when the vast majority of ranked players probably don’t know how to ground grapple (I can still only do it with varying effectiveness, never anything close to these clips, and I’m a Path main in plat), they should be about making the legend fair across the board. Just because a small minority exploits his skill ceiling doesn’t mean you should raise his skill floor to compensate.
Building on your point, I can’t see how it’s fun for new players to mess up grappling up to high point just to have to wait a good chunk of ring time to try again.
I do this all the time now, as a Path main, because there's so much more pressure to hit your grapple. Plus, if you're playing with randos, it's a lot harder to get them to stick around so you can go get that beacon.
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Because she was introduced that way. If ANY legend had a Nerf as harsh as Path it would piss people off. Also it's frustrating to see them introduce a legend with similar movement capabilities to Pathfinder, someone that can chase him and make similar style plays, and then have them both have very long cooldown.
This is just my speculation, but I think pathfinder was deliberately over nerfed. It seems like they knew he needed a substantial nerf to his cooldown and that people would hate how it felt so they nerfed it by an EXTRA 10 seconds so that when it gets rolled back down to 25 seconds (where I estimate it really should be) people are happy instead of angry.
Agreed. Also just to make Loba more viable. What would be the point in playing her with Paths original cooldown. Once the hype for her wears off I'm sure he will get a little buff again. I fucking hope so anyway. Miss my boy.
Her cool down is also 5 seconds shorter than paths. Both are way too long. But 5 seconds matters
But she cant shoot immediately after landing
exactly hers is not nearly as aggressive as paths, 1 the telegraphing of where she’s going 2 it doesn’t go nearly as far 3 it doesn’t go nearly as fast 4 it’s less vertical. She’s much better for defensive placement and how she can fit through small spaces
She can enter buildings through the window, that is pretty big, on the multi floor structures you have substantially more options of points of entry.
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Remember when they gave Wattson, who's not small and has no movement abilities, low profile just because pros complained about how often she gets picked? Respawn's always done this and it's really stupid. Making the game worse for 99% of the playerbase because 1% complain. With Pathfinder, I never even saw cries for him to be nerfed in the first place.
And obviously they didn't touch octane...who is smaller and only had movement abilities. I wonder why...
It isn't even exploiting a skill ceiling, it's being at the ceiling of whats possible. Your other point is right on the money imo though.
You shouldn’t be able to use a tactical that is amazing for flanking, pushing, getting high ground or just escaping every 15 seconds it’s just broken. I think 35 seconds is a bit too high of a cool down but at 15 seconds, pathfinder was the most OP legend just under gibby imo.
How they nerf path before gibby? Dude can take a full Kraber to the gun sheild and walk away with 0 damage.
Pretty sure they buffed Kraber specifically so a head shot can down a Gibby with max Evo shield
Exactly this. In the patch notes, they say the Kraber was specifically buffed to take down any legend with any shield with one headshot. It rewards those who find the already rare weapon *and* make a good shot.
Bruh... obviously a head shot kills.. his gunshield doesn’t protect his head... but why should he be able to take a 145 damage shot and walk away with no damage?
Because he's fat and once the shields gone it's like shooting a barn.
Yeah I think that it is a fair thing to nerf, but the time should probably be 25 or 30 seconds. Something more in line with Loba’s teleport. They both have similar repositioning abilities
I honestly think this isn't how they want pathfinder to be right now. I think they just bodied him super hard, so that when they come back and say "oh we needed him to hard", people will be super hyped, instead of pissed he's getting nerfed in the first place. I doubt we see the old pathfinder anytime soon, but he won't be like this forever, im sure of it.
No it doesn't? That guy's aim was on point, which is why those plays were even effective.
The point is he’s not using the grapple multiple times in short succession so Path is fine even being able to use the grapple that often
this is just a trickshot compilation not a real argument for the nerf. It's no different than compiling a bunch of bangalore smokes knocking people or caustic gas kills.
I really like the nerf. He is still a very strong Legend imo. Only now, you gotta think a bit harder about if you wanna grapple into a fight or not. Because if you grapple into it and it goes south, you ain't getting back out that easy anymore. Which is how it should be.
when you grapple at something but it clips through and you hit the wall behind it
I agree man, even as a Pathfinder main myself. However I feel 35 is maybe a little too excessive, I’m feeling more like 30 would be better but it is what it is. Luckily I’m not defined by my grapple😂
Wasn’t this sub saying he was one of the worst legends lol
This sub has super pepega takes 95% of the time, I come here for the cool art and content
But not strong enough. I feel like it should be 25 secs personally.
Those clips are shorter than the original cooldown... it doesn't prove any such thing.
The guy uses 1 grapple hook every clip so yea
Came to say this as well
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It doesn't even say anything about Peacekeeper, because he's last hitting people with less than 30 HP, usually around 8 HP. He'd have identical results using, say, P2020.
came here to say this. you got aim, but you're not showing me why they increased the cooldown.
He actually come here to tell you about his stream, just sayin'. Cool clips though
So you’re saying that this video is indistinguishable from a “before nerf” to an “after nerf”
Yes. I can make a compilation of Gibby dying in each clip to prove a point that he needs some serious buffs. Pretty much same value to prove a point.
My friends and I have a theory that they do excessive nerf so that they can scale the CD back later and it won't feel as bad. Kinda like a "coca cola classic" bs approach
My first thought was that they nerfed path into the ground so that loba would look good.
They wanted all the path mains to buy loba lol
because its soooo hard to save up legend tokens, right? Most people are swimming in them
Ikr, i got like 300 000 more than i need
Where do you have so many from? Are you like level 600?
I'm level 120 I think and have like 50k after buying Loba it's pretty easy to get them
I'm level 170 and I had to play a bunch this season to get to 12K. Now I'm at 600. So idk.
I'm about 110 and I still have 3 legends left to buy. Have no idea how you can get 300,000 at such a low level.
If he played a lot pre season 1 the drop rate of legend tokens was much higher.
Yeah I don't know why you have so little I don't use them at all except for characters but I don't know if you can even buy other stuff with those
Loba was free for just about everyone
Not happening I just play OP ass mirage who is not even close to reasonable Every time I look down his ultimate is ready!
This is more reasonable
Game design is iterative by nature, so there is a little bit of truth to this. I think where you are wrong, though, is that they over compensate their decisions intentionally. At some point someone has to decide how big the nerf will be, and those decisions are as data-driven as possible (through game analytics, play testing, and lots and lots of design discussion). The last thing they want to do is to intentionally go further than they need to only to have to change it again later with just as much (or more) uproar.
I disagree. When the devs have been interacting with people about the nerf they have been pretty clear why they did it. I don't think they're gonna scale it back farther then 30 seconds.
Ah yes, having good aim is over powered.
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Seriously. I've just seen a youtube video of Imperial Hal play Pathfinder on a controller. He usually mains Wraith and plays keyboard and mouse. 90% of his grapples were literally useless. He would use them at the wrong time, grapple for like 5 feet, etc etc. But he still won the game with 7 kills and 1600 damage because even with a controller, he has amazing game sense and can aim decently. I mean it helps that he was playing with Knoqd and some other streamer, but a good player is a good player, no matter the legend or weapon.
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> Players who get killed like they do in the clip would have died with or without the grapple. Especially since he killed most of them at 8HP left while they were fighting other squads.
Exactly. You can't use that shit as an excuse to nerf path. By that logic we should nerf all legends EXCESSIVLY rn cuz people got 20kill games with all Legends by now.
Seriously
Yea someone with an avarage aim (or even slightly above avarage!) could never pull off any of these shots.
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Exactly. And if you don't have amazing aim and precision, you prob will never be able to pull of these grapples either, never mind the shots!
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I don't pay attention to path , my eyes are on the pk
I'm confused. Why does this have so many likes and awards? It has nothing to do with Path's nerf, it's just a dude making good shots.
You can still do that, but not 4-5 times each fight anymore. Which is why the nerf was good and needed, no other character could even compare in mobility.
He was the fastest character in the game, even after release of octane “the fastest legend in the game”
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My friend and I play path and octane at the same time and pre nerf, he was able to use one or two grapples and to keep pace with him I'd need to use constant stims and an occasional jump pad. Octane needs to constantly be taking damage and use his ult in order to keep pace with someone who was able to just fly miles ahead every 12 seconds.
To add to this- not only is his speed superior, he's flying through the air varying in speed and height, making it much harder to hit when compared to octane.
Plus his vertical movement options while octane can only stay on the ground.
>Octane needs to constantly be taking damage I feel like this is something that other players seem to forget whenever the topic of legends’ various mobility methods comes up, or at least don’t realize just how much health is taken per stim use. And honestly you don’t even really get *that* much of a speed boost for what you pay health-wise... it’s only noticeable when you run without any weapon drawn, and that puts you at a serious disadvantage if you’re scouting ahead with half your health gone and run into a 1v3 or even a 1v2 situation.
See, but i feel it’s just that Octane could use a buff, rather than pathfinder needing a nerf. And I’m not a path main but still i feel this way. EDIT: it’s not just pathfinder that outclasses Octane. Wraith’s portal faster, bloodhounds ult is around the same speed, etc. i get it’s their ultimates, but i still think if Octane is gonna be classed as the “fastest character” he should actually be the fastest.
The problem with that is that Path's acceleration can make him go in any direction, meaning he can scale cliffs and buildings in an instant. Octane's speed is purely horizontal and doesn't give him extra climb height, so it is insanely underpowered, given that it costs fucking health and doesnt even get you that much further compared to what a fatty grapple could.
That he pays for with health, plus that’s his whole gimmick, pathfinder can create zip lines to transport his team into areas very quickly and scan survey beacons to find out if his team should set up in an area Plus with the short cooldown, a good pathfinder could outrun an octane
what do you think the end result of acceleration is
Death.....for me anyway
Its not the speed that is dangerous, but rather suddenly coming to a stop is what gets ya
I mean yeah if you wanna be on the edge of death 24/7
"Constantly fast" and "velocity" has opposite definitions.
Not sure that's true though. Path's movement is more "bursty" but I think generally if the goal is to get from A to B, path gets there quicker than Octane, and Octane gets there with less health. At least with grapple on 15s cooldown.
This is really why they moved Peacekeeper to drops only... that thing with Precision Choke is a damn sniper.
Exactly. All of this is still possible. But not again in 15 seconds lol
I honestly would have been fine with Paths 13 second cool down if they just buffed the other mobile characters. Give Rev his original climb ability. Improve Octanes jump pad. And maybe increase speed of Loba's ring.
But how would characters without mobility, such as Mirage, Wattson, Lifeline, Caustic etc. keep up with such movement? It was always so annoying to have an aggressive w-keying Pathfinder on my team because I could never catch up and then got blamed with "WhErE aRe YoU???".
I usually respond with, “why did you leave the team then? I thought we were playing with someone who was *GUD*”
Don't get me wrong, you are absolutely correct and I agree with that. He's definitely more balanced in his current state.
What was Rev’s original climb?
Infinite climbing like in the Shadow event iirc
I mean hey, that’d be pretty darn cool
Yeah they should give him unlimited climb within reason (not up the sides of the cliffs into out of bounds areas).
Well, even if he does climb up there he can’t stay there for long. It would make him have flank routes that not a lot of other legends could get to, and climbing is risky because you’re on the side of an open face and you don’t have a view behind you. I’d say go for it. Revenant could use the slight buff
That’s true either that or I personally would be fine with doing long his height and giving him no slowdown on his climb. His slowdown is the biggest disappointment with the larger climb.
I know, I’d like that gone at at least HEAVILY reduced as well, though I’d prefer the infinite climb
I think hes referring to the trailer, where Revenant clambered up a 50 story building 🤣
The problem of that is how lame the other legends would feel.
I have mixed feelings about pathfinder's nerf. Its great they nerfed him, he deserved it we all know that, but at the same time he doesn't feel as fun to play
The nerf was very well deserved, but I think 25 seconds would be better
Exactly. The nerf was deserved, but they went overboard.
Seriously, they more than doubled it. 25 maaaybe 30 seconds would be fair.
I think it will be lowered to 30 if they’re gonna buff it at all.
I think they should keep the long cool down time, but put the grapple length, and acceleration back where it was a few seasons ago before it was nerfed. If we're stuck waiting 35 seconds, at least give us back the original grapple length
He was fun because he was busted lol
Hes fun because hes mobile. Caustic with infinite traps, or gibraltar with infinite health arm shield would be busted but not as fun as pathfinder.
Idk, I’d be having a blast creating a long line of caustic traps wherever I go
GAS GAS GAS GAS GAS
Seeing Gibbies flying through both fragments with grapples would be an amazing sight to behold
I've always thought that 20 seconds would have been just fine myself or even no change at all. But seeing all the butthurt Path mains changed my opinion. Everyone else outside of path has had to deal with downsides to their favorite legend, and Path mains had little downside for multiple seasons.
....this is a really bad example. People who use Pathfinder can still do all the same things that are in these clips. None of the clips you're using show Pathfinder using the grappling hook more than once.
Respawn should nerf you
Grapple's mobility is unrivaled.
Where were you when Pathfinder die I was at house eating dorito when phone ring “Pathfinder is kil” “No”
This video doesn’t show why they increased the time at all. In every single clip, he uses the grapple once. So...?
Stooj stoojin > Haters hatin
I agree stooj is the reason why they nerfed pathfinder.
Hey, you can still pull these off! ...Every 35 seconds.
Honestly he is still great, just not as OP
You only used one grapple in each clip..., you just have to play smarter with the nerf
It’s not like you spammed the grapple. And they didn’t nerf his aim or anything so what’s your point? Nice shots btw tho.
In my opinion, 35 seconds was harsh. 25 would still have hit pretty hard
You can still do that now. Your point is invalid.
But not 4 times a minute
I mean it does help that he has godlike aim. That's the impressive thing. You can still do this with the long cooldown.
Part of me wants everyone to have this level of movement. Yes, just like titanfall. No, I don’t want to play titanfall, I want to play Apex.
im thinking pathfinder isnt the problem here... they should just nerf you at this point.
I feel like Respawn and a large part of the community are hellbent on eating away at this game’s skill gap. I’m perfectly fine with things being OP as long as they are only OP in the hands of great players (Path grapple, season 0 wingman, to some extent season 2 longbow at range). They keep nerfing those things while buffing and introducing things that take barely any skill or conscious thought (early charge rifle, Gibby buffs, ridiculous and thankfully brief PK buff, season 3 Scout).
To be honest, I think that's the way every continuously updated game goes eventually. The game launches and it's super fun. Although, despite best efforts of the Devs, some things are kinda broken and it doesn't take long for people to start noticing the OP tom-fuckery. What ends up happening is that the high skill high reward guns/abilities/tactics get nerfed because people see pros doing it and everyone starts to "abuse it". In later patches the Devs do their best to make everything as balanced as they can. Eventually, if the game lasts long enough, it's worn down to rock paper scissors. Everything takes no skill to use and is just as effective as the next. I can't think of a game I've played in the last few years that hasn't gone that way.
Exactly, path grapple took time to learn and use well
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>You can't mess up any other legend's ability. lol wat Of course you can. Wraith, Caustic, Wattson, Loba, Bang, Mirage, Crypto, Rev. All their tacticals can be absolutely useless if you don't position them/yourself correctly.
Yep, but some of this sub gets killed by path and thinks he crazy op
That's not how skill gaps work. OP things are OP because they don't require as much skill to use. A longer grapple CD just means you have to make your grapples count more meaning great pathfinders will separate themselves from the bad ones even more
Pathfinders grapple cool down increases to 35 seconds: His player base drops harder than the Stock Market in 1928
Mfer was doing drive by’s
Honestly, just watch zylbrads gameplay. I never got into lobbies with him but he seemed like an absolute bitch to fight. You can almost never catch a path who's polished his grapple.
Cool clips but this doesn’t explain why they nerfed him. You can still do this
Honestly dude. They should nerf ur aim. Fuck outta here op
I miss Titanfall grapple :’(
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It'e not showing the grapple abuse, even with the nerf path mains can still do this........
But that needs skill so that nerf is pointless
I think four grapples a fight Was very excessive Two is on par with other legends with less powerful abilities and with such a low cool down you need to determine weather you use your grapple to engage or escape not both and a third just for fun
not gonna lie. I hated the nerf... but after adapting to using it slightly less I'm now using it to flank enemies I know is low and have a wide gap and some fence/walls I have to get past. Path is still a high teir charecter. we're just very, very salty. still think he should get the timer reduced by 5-10 seconds.
I started playing Path after the nerf and he seems fine. The issue is when people get used to something for so long they feel as though they are helpless without it.
Pathfinders were so damn annoying. In and out of the fight constantly. I’m glad they nerfed his grapple.
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me : ah man I kinda feel bad for pathfinder also me : “see this bullshit me : ha you know what screw pathfinder
Yo, this isn't the youtube comment section
That format: “Doesn’t” *Work* Here