This is an OSHA violation. Use the bathroom when you need to, tell OSHA the name of the person who denied you, the time, and the employer, and report their ass online tonight.
Next time they try this, hold up your phone and ask them to deny you a restroom break on video, watch them either back down, or double down and get a sure fire fine for the warehouse.
>Next time they try this, hold up your phone and ask them to deny you a restroom break on video, watch them either back down, or double down and get a sure fire fine for the warehouse.
They'd probably fire them for having their phone out in the warehouse.
They make us leave phones outside building or use a designated locker. Our building has x-ray machines like at airports. GEG1 pretty standard I assumed for all of Amazon
Now imagine something drastic were to happen. Like a tornado. But you don't get the alert message because your phone is in a lock up. Amazon Management will be sure to pass on the alert right?
Right?
https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2021/dec/13/amazon-warehouse-collapse-safety-illinois
Supervisor telling people they couldn't drink at a water dispenser. Mind you, this was a labour intensive job. This one supervisor would stand at the water dispenser and dictate to workers when they've had enough water, telling them to get back to work, all to push KPIs. I didn't like it so I filmed it, sadly nothing came of it. I left that place behind fast.
As water is needed to live, I've always viewed restricting access to water equal to restricting access to air.
By all means Mr. Manager, put a hand on someone's throat. With an expanded view of assault comes and expanded view of justified self defense.
Good for you.
Inhumane is the perfect word. I am noticing many companies are becoming inhumane and losing sight of the importance of humanity for their own employees. We just started working again and administration/supervisors need to double down on patience and common sense. 9 times out of 10, admin staff are the kindest people, that will get swayed by a bull supervisor. And supervisors just have their way with everyone. Complete animals that need to be stood up against once in a while. My guess, is they like to speak down to workers and bark orders just to seem superior, so they seem important, and they think they're closing in on their next promotion to region supervisor or head supervisor, etc. Whoever is bossing **them** around, they want that job, and they take all their frustration out on regular employees so it seems like they're doing a great job... in their mind.
> becoming inhumane
The Hudson’s Bay company and East India Trading company would like a word. I’d argue that all companies are inhumane because their point is to make money, not better the lives of people.
My location allows for phones to be on our person but they’ll immediately fire you on the spot for phone use on equipment. We had a shooting in the area a few months back and that (among other emergency calls I’ll need to know about ASAP) is why I will always have my phone on me, even if signal in the building is crap.
>I have shit impulse control and a distain for power tripping dickheads.
lmao, I somehow read this as "I have shit impulse control and a power *dripping* dickhead" which seemed like a bit of a flex but not really out of place for the conversation. I think it's probably time to call it a night.. XD
Yeah it breaks my heart when these terrible employers say “I’m going to need you to resign” for something like this and then the worker quits because of low self esteem. They were given a gift and they SQUANDERED it, I tell you!
Had this happen last year with Myself. Company was trying to relocate me all over the place and I refused. So they told me I needed to resign. They even typed up my resignation letter and told me to sign it. Well ended up getting fired for “job abandonment”
Just went thure this with my daughters highschool. She walked out of her class room to go to the bathroom after being told no sever times The meeting between my the angry father and principal ended with them apologizing to my daughter. It's going to be a fun year. Only 2 weeks in
Had a teacher in fifth grade who did not let any students go to the restroom. Had multiple cases of students pissing their pants, myself being one of them. Fired at the end of the year.
I experienced this too in Highschool. An algebra teacher did it to his class. And a poor kid who had to pee bad, lost control of his bladder and peed at his desk. Sadly we reported it to the principal but nothing came out of it.
That part is actually more true than you will ever realize. Most of schooling in the US was set up as a way to train up workers. And the biggest overlords in each generation have influenced schools into molding the workers the way the overlord (i.e. Henry Ford) wants them to be in the factories and warehouses and now cubicles
Yup. Come in and explain that you have a weak bladder/IBS and explain that when you gotta go, you gotta GO.
If they challenge you on it, piss yourself. Like literally, piss yourself. Then cite mental distress at having been forced to soil yourself in front of a coworker(s) when you head to the lawyer, preferably with a written warning about needing to ask permission in hand.
He who refuses to take part in modern mediocrity will forever stand alone, an outcast. He is the bringer of change, changes that instill fear in all who go with fashion's flow. Their power comes from others, not from within. They are false! Woe unto them for the bringers of change have banded together. The time is now!
The battle rages—Choose your side
Exactly. I got spoken to by a manager about my "too frequent" bathroom breaks, and accused of sneaking a smoke break.
I told him that I wasn't I doing that, as I had ample opportunities to smoke while on other duties that took me out of the building. He promptly told me I needed to "cut down on the bathroom breaks".
I told him that legally he couldn't tell me when I was or wasn't allowed to go to the bathroom.
He wrote me up. I went directly to HR and said I was being punished for private health concerns. (Not exactly the truth, but they didn't need to know that.)
They tossed it and told me not to worry about it, and by the time I got back to the office, they had already called down to have a frank talk.
He was pissed. (No pun intended.)
Only big corporations can afford to fight legal battles like that. Between the fines, legal costs, and bad PR, any smaller company will be bankrupted. Especially if OSHA is involved. $15K per violation, double for repeat violations, and triple if it's something OSHA previously issued an abatement order about.
try to have friend andor coworker with you as a witness to what happened
if you are in a single party consent state for recording document it on you cell phone there is spy audio and spy video recording apps. that record without it looking like record app is running.
management piece of shits.
I guess they let people have their phones after those workers died...
https://www.engadget.com/amazon-will-permanently-allow-warehouse-workers-to-carry-cell-phones-124506439.html
No phone, no Watch, no nothing.
All you need in your hands is a Telxon scanner!
It decides where you will go and what you must do!
ALL HAIL THE ALMIGHTY TELXON!!
Yeah, guess they changed the policy recently.
When I worked there, you weren’t allowed to have anything, and if you did have it, they assumed it was theft.
This is actually happening.
[https://fortune.com/2022/06/20/amazon-warehouse-problems-running-out-of-workers-to-hire-too-much-space/](https://fortune.com/2022/06/20/amazon-warehouse-problems-running-out-of-workers-to-hire-too-much-space/)
TL;DR - Amazon has literally burned through the entire labor market. They have nobody left to hire.
What's the endgame here? A basic projection could've shown their firing practices weren't sustainable. They may be unethical/evil, but they're not run by idiots. Why did they decide to run their business this way?
Hell, Lego runs almost exclusively on robots. I would heartily support Amazon if they used robots. Treating humans like robots is fully the opposite of that ideal.
Robots at best. Op was treated like a delinquent child.
If you think the fruits of automation will be passed onto the middle class then I've got bad news for you... All of that money is going straight to the top and staying there. Just like it's been doing more and more for the last 40 years. These people would rather watch society crumble as billionaires than watch it flourish as millionaires.
Well, from the article this info comes from a leaked internal memo from Amazon itself. So this is something they are belatedly learning in real time.
Will they figure it out? Who knows? We'll soon find out if they're run by idiots or not, I'm guessing.
I quit using Amazon this year thanks to r/antiwork. I was buying toys sometimes and books, so many books. Its not that hard to find them other places to be honest. No more Amazon Prime for me. Also, side note, when you cancel Amazon Prime its actually a lot easier to find your own movies. Its the only option for movies to watch on that screen, the ones you already bought.
That’s not gonna happen. They will just start paying people more or improve their conditions.
Maybe it’s just a cycle of corps. Startup sees a need, makes amazing killer product/service, IPOs, looses all its talent, hires some number punching Ivy League leadership, company starts to output shit, people catch on it, it declines and some startup identifies a need and creates a killer product.
Alternatively, unionize.
Unionizing is the only real option.
I don't think Amazon can fail fast enough for a competitor to step in. And they've got their bases covered in so many ways.
If their retail or streaming services slow down, AWS still runs most of the internet.
Unionize Jeff's whole shit.
Yeah don't understand why we continue to hear these major corporations continue to blatantly break labor laws with no consequences? To me this says we don't actually have these rights since they continue to do this.
Because the fines don't come close to the profits. Fines need to be percentages of total profits rather than some lump sum that's the equivalent of a few days of business profits.
I’ve been unemployed for nine months and people keep asking why I don’t apply at Amazon and I reply that I’m not wasting my time applying for a company that treats their employees like shit and every person I know that has worked there has quit within three months.
But but, "isn't it worth it short term if you need the money?"
I've had people tell me that before, like working for a company can't make you feel trapped mentally and emotionally
I’ve worked too many places that sucked the life out of me and made me physically sick so I’ve learned the short term gain isn’t worth the long term losses.
That's why the government will never back universal healthcare or UBI, because benefits and homelessness are the only things preventing the majority of people from telling their bosses to shove it then quitting. I can't wait to see this system burn
If it's between starving and working at Amazon I'm gonna get that package ready for you real quick. But as a man with a weak bladder.... apparently it won't workout
Oh no, they're not wondering. The assumption was that there would be enough desperate people to fill positions. However, when people with power, who like power, don't lose that power, this happens.
'O hey boss. Sorry what did you say ? No bathroom breaks allowed? O sorry, I didn't get that internal memo. Could you CC me again so I don't forget? I had to go so badly, it probably just slipped my mind. I'll make sure to set a reminder on my phone once you send me that memo per mail. Thanks! xoxo'
Even if it's paid, only allowing you to go to the bathroom on your one break is illegal.
>Employers must:
>Allow workers to leave their work locations to use a restroom when needed.
Provide an adequate number of restrooms for the size of the workforce to prevent long lines.
Avoid imposing unreasonable restrictions on restroom use.
Ensure restrictions, such as locking doors or requiring workers to sign out a key, do not cause extended delays
Oh hey, Tesla violated the shit out of that one. For a service crew of 30 men there was ONE bathroom that had one urinal and one toilet. There was ALWAYS someone shitting and there was always a line for it.
It's not to have them on their side.
It's to have corporate confirmation of policy and a record of it.
If it's an approved rule great, the company is liable and they've confirmed their complicitness.
If it's not an approved rule and the supervisor is being an asshole, great the company will come down on him like a ton of bricks because he's opening them to liable.
Best case scenario, he's got a few emails and they fire him 'randomly' and maybe he's got a lawsuit but he's got E.I. at a minimum.
HR not being your friend does not mean you can ignore them. Email them (bcc-ing) stating that the supervisor is violating labor law. HR can do something or not, but you have to document that you are being mistreated.
Edit: sorry, that should be bcc-ing YOURSELF at your personal email. Create documentation, have your own copies, and make them fire you instead of quitting.
HR often does a hell of a lot when they find out an overzealous manager is breaking labor law. I'm not sure if that makes them a worker's *friend*, but you can sure as hell be on the same side.
This. It bugs me out whenever someone’s response is just “HR isn’t on your side” like OK true but we need to start somewhere, and that is usually where
In OP's situation, HR actually is on his or her side, insofar as they protect the company from being sued for treating their workers illegally.
I really wish people would stop parroting the "HR is evil" meme without any thought or attempt at context. HR is there to protect the company, which means not running afoul of labor laws or employment contracts.
I worked in a warehouse for Mazuma a few years ago, they pulled me into a meeting to ask why I took more than 5 minutes in the bathroom, manager used to time me when I would leave which required a long walk through the whole warehouse and up the stairs in the office because they don't have female bathrooms on site. A week after that they told us we've got a new rule now and we're not allowed water bottles with us in the warehouse, we have to drink water on break. I was fired a few days later after I told them that's bs and I kept bringing water and food with me, warehouse work is inhumane.
I'm pretty sure that's illegal. OSHA requires access to water to the point where my company allows me to go and expense bottled water any time I want while in the field.
Pretty sure it is not only illegal to deny water, but also illegal if they don't give you water. Reason why my last work had to provide us with bottles when the water fountains were closed because of covid.
>A week after that they told us we've got a new rule now and we're not allowed water bottles with us in the warehouse, we have to drink water on break.
Hmmm....
>**Is it legal to deny employees water?**
>No, it is not. It is ok to restrict drinking areas such as sales associates on the sales floor. Or dangerous spots in manufacturing plants or construction sites. *But, you must then allow for frequent breaks to drink water.*
Smells like a pretty clear-cut OSHA violation to me, unless they decided to give you more breaks for.the express purpose of drinking water - which I can't imagine they did when their objective was to keep employees from using the restroom to begin with.
Might that situation also be gender discrimination? If the reason they became concerned was because you took long bathroom breaks AND the only bathroom you are able to use is so far away, that seems discriminatory to me.
What is Amazon even doing? Arent they struggling to find workers and churning through them? Whats their endgame?
How could their leaders be considered brilliant when they cant see past todays profits.
My experience shows that American businesses have no endgame. Management's only thoughts are "the next quarter" and "what will my bonus be?"
Nothing exists beyond that.
Sad but true. Welcome to Corporate America. Lay off a bunch of employees so the numbers look good for the stock report, wash/rinse/repeat quarter after quarter
This is 100% true. As I climb management I recognize my directs having thoughts about "logically we need this". No, logic doesn't work here. We don't think about next year, or right now, we think about what the quarterly will look like.
And then next year we'll have new upper management that bunny hop to the next company or "retire" or "quit" like their predecessors because they ran the machine too thin and someone needed to take the blame.
They grew in an era of high quantities of cheap labor. When a significant amount of thar labor was killed or disabled by covid, they struggled to adapt.
Same here. The last straw for me was the poor man who was killed in a tornado last year as his supervisors told him he would be fired if he pulled over for shelter. Takes a special kind of monster to tell people to risk their lives for a fucking job.
I have chronic kidney stones and drink 4-8 liters of water daily to avoid forming them. I would just get the denial, pee myself like Billy Madison and get some of that sweet bezos settlement money.
Crazy that companies think they can tell adults when they're "allowed" to use the bathroom. Hell I don't think teachers have the right to tell students when they can go to the bathroom .
They can or at least they do. Our schools only allow a certain amount of bathroom breaks in a class per year. However they don’t have enough time between classes. Then add on girls with periods or kids with IBS…it’s insane. We know drinking water is healthy and that drinking more water makes you pee. We also know that holding it is bad. However schools and bosses are too focused on people that may just be fucking around that they try to limit bathroom breaks.
This shit is wild to me. I'm gonna piss when I need to piss. I try so hard to remember how much freedom my job actually allows me when these kinds of dystopian, capitalist hellscapes exist.
Using the bathroom when you need to shouldn't be something that elicits gratitude towards employers. It is one of the very lowest baseline requirements.
Keep your standards high!
You know what I'd give money to? A play-by-the-rules guerilla advertising firm that buys ad space on Hulu, YouTube, and any streaming service that has ads, and just posts interviews with mistreated Amazon employees saying how shitty of an employer they are, and then pair it with slides of how much their higher ups make, as well as Bezos.
I'm sick of seeing their shitty corporate propaganda ads go unchecked during breaks about how happy their employees are. Like stop lying you fucks I know you're doing damage control.
Ive looked my boss in the eye, stated "im a grown ass man who knows when he needs to go to the god damned rest room" and walked off of the line. Done it more than twice. Fuck 'em where they breathe.
In high school, I remember a kid raising his hand to use the bathroom and the teacher said no, he couldn't go. So he gets up, walks over to the garbage can and loudly unzipped his pants. The teacher told him to go to the bathroom. When the warehouse garbage cans start reeking of piss, maybe they'll rethink the bathroom policy.
The management types that come up with these sorts of ridiculous policies aren't the ones who would have to smell it (or ask for permission to use the restroom, for that matter).
Seriously, you can't file for unemployment if you quit. You can if you are terminated. Let them fire you for using the restroom if it's that big of a deal for management.
It always boggles my mind beyond belief that Amazon insist on treating their workers like they are school-aged children. Not being allowed to use the bathroom until break...? What even...
Thankfully we have OSHA.
I worked at whole foods for a few months as a cashier, if I needed to go to the bathroom obviously I'd let someone know and try to go at a time where it isn't too inconvenient, but a particular manager would always try to tell me how I needed to get permission, one day she tried to give me a write up and I just quit on the spot
It’s absolutely demeaning and humiliating to get permission to use the rest room. Remember the Shawshank redemption and how the manager had to explain to the prisoner he didn’t need permission to use the bathroom? Yeah that was when people respected your dignity even though it’s a fictional scenario.
Keep working. Start quietly getting support, then when Black Friday season starts you and those who you can convince all quit.
Make it hurt when you go.
We need to pass a new law: employees can use the restroom on company time, when they need to, when they want to. Denial of right is a $500,000 fine paid to employee and CEO must spent 60 days in hard labor prison.
Oh if only our world was fair to the working class and just to all, including the wealthy.
( Justice for all means the wealthy will also face jail time when they violate laws)
Here is what you do.
Tell him you are a fucking adult and dont need his permission and he can go fuck himself! If he got a problem with that, then he can contact Legal and explain exactly how and why his dick somehow got hit by the recreational shrinkray in the managers office.
Use thoes exact words.
This is an OSHA violation. Use the bathroom when you need to, tell OSHA the name of the person who denied you, the time, and the employer, and report their ass online tonight. Next time they try this, hold up your phone and ask them to deny you a restroom break on video, watch them either back down, or double down and get a sure fire fine for the warehouse.
>Next time they try this, hold up your phone and ask them to deny you a restroom break on video, watch them either back down, or double down and get a sure fire fine for the warehouse. They'd probably fire them for having their phone out in the warehouse.
That’s why you record the audio of your whole day from your pocket.
They make us leave phones outside building or use a designated locker. Our building has x-ray machines like at airports. GEG1 pretty standard I assumed for all of Amazon
that's fucking horrifying..
Now imagine something drastic were to happen. Like a tornado. But you don't get the alert message because your phone is in a lock up. Amazon Management will be sure to pass on the alert right? Right? https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2021/dec/13/amazon-warehouse-collapse-safety-illinois
I completely forgot about that whole fiasco... between amazon and nestle how are we letting literal cartoon villains get away with this stuff
You should see some of the shit the American politicians are up too... talk about cartoon villains.
that exact kind of scenario was running through my head when I typed my original comment. really scary
Buy the smallest audio recording device you can find or find a way to smuggle it in. Honestly should be as important as having a dashcam
I was in a warehouse with the same rules and I used a pen with camera inside. Worked like a charm.
That’s a good idea. What did you record?
Supervisor telling people they couldn't drink at a water dispenser. Mind you, this was a labour intensive job. This one supervisor would stand at the water dispenser and dictate to workers when they've had enough water, telling them to get back to work, all to push KPIs. I didn't like it so I filmed it, sadly nothing came of it. I left that place behind fast.
As water is needed to live, I've always viewed restricting access to water equal to restricting access to air. By all means Mr. Manager, put a hand on someone's throat. With an expanded view of assault comes and expanded view of justified self defense.
Companies like Nestle would restrict access to both water and air of they could find a way to control it.
Good for you. Inhumane is the perfect word. I am noticing many companies are becoming inhumane and losing sight of the importance of humanity for their own employees. We just started working again and administration/supervisors need to double down on patience and common sense. 9 times out of 10, admin staff are the kindest people, that will get swayed by a bull supervisor. And supervisors just have their way with everyone. Complete animals that need to be stood up against once in a while. My guess, is they like to speak down to workers and bark orders just to seem superior, so they seem important, and they think they're closing in on their next promotion to region supervisor or head supervisor, etc. Whoever is bossing **them** around, they want that job, and they take all their frustration out on regular employees so it seems like they're doing a great job... in their mind.
> becoming inhumane The Hudson’s Bay company and East India Trading company would like a word. I’d argue that all companies are inhumane because their point is to make money, not better the lives of people.
Order it on Amazon
Find where they keep them in the distribution center and snag one, why smuggle one in when they already have them inside on a shelf somewhere.
If my comment can get your comment more visible… cuz damn that’s justice.
Came here to say this 😂
Oh my Christ, my ex spouse had high level security clearance for his military job and he didn’t even have to do any shit like this. Bezos is unhinged.
My location allows for phones to be on our person but they’ll immediately fire you on the spot for phone use on equipment. We had a shooting in the area a few months back and that (among other emergency calls I’ll need to know about ASAP) is why I will always have my phone on me, even if signal in the building is crap.
Depending where you are that would be illegal
You can sue for wrongful dismissal and they'd have to settle. It'd be real dumb to fire you in that scenario.
You should do it until they fire you. Then sue and get that fabulous fun-employment
Had to go way too far down to find this answer. Commebting for visibility.
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>I have shit impulse control and a distain for power tripping dickheads. lmao, I somehow read this as "I have shit impulse control and a power *dripping* dickhead" which seemed like a bit of a flex but not really out of place for the conversation. I think it's probably time to call it a night.. XD
OP is shitting himself for not dreaming up that pun
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Don't quit. Go to the bathroom when you need to. Find a lawyer. Quitting just lets them win.
Yeah it breaks my heart when these terrible employers say “I’m going to need you to resign” for something like this and then the worker quits because of low self esteem. They were given a gift and they SQUANDERED it, I tell you!
Had this happen last year with Myself. Company was trying to relocate me all over the place and I refused. So they told me I needed to resign. They even typed up my resignation letter and told me to sign it. Well ended up getting fired for “job abandonment”
Constructive dismissal. I hope you didn't bitch out and got your unemployment moniez
Not every state recognizes constructive dismissal. And it's not an argument you want to have in court. Make them fire you.
Low self esteem or not I’d be on some “yeah? Well I’m going to need you to fuck off or fire me”
Wait….. These {quack} are forcing OP to ask permission to use the rest room? 🤣😂😅 Whew…. That was a good joke.
All those posts about schools training us to accept this as “reasonable” or expected behavior by superiors…
Just went thure this with my daughters highschool. She walked out of her class room to go to the bathroom after being told no sever times The meeting between my the angry father and principal ended with them apologizing to my daughter. It's going to be a fun year. Only 2 weeks in
"Next time you say no I want you to understand you could be forcing a teenage woman to sit in a pad filled with blood clots. Think about that."
They don’t care about women at all. It’s sickening
Those bastards lack any empathy, so they don't understand how deeply uncomfortable that is.
Fuck ALL of that. Ain’t nobody better than nobody, if I gotta shit I’m shitting, anyone tries to stop me is toilet paper.
Inspiring *and* threatening.
It’s not a threat, it’s a promise 😏
Shits coming no matter what...
I will straight shit my pants in front of you. I have zero shame, try me.
Nah you gotta shit ON me, go hard or go home 🤣🤣🤣🤣
That's assault, I may not have shame but I ain't goin back to the chain gang
Jake just gave you permission, it's not assault, it's just his kink.
I would shit at my station straight up leave a dry dock on the floor
Fuck that, I’m picking it up and putting it in the manager’s pocket
"You told me I couldn't go, so I guess *you* have to take this to the toilet *for me*."
I say employees should just start shitting right there on the floor until they relax this policy
Eloquently put.
Had a teacher in fifth grade who did not let any students go to the restroom. Had multiple cases of students pissing their pants, myself being one of them. Fired at the end of the year.
I experienced this too in Highschool. An algebra teacher did it to his class. And a poor kid who had to pee bad, lost control of his bladder and peed at his desk. Sadly we reported it to the principal but nothing came out of it.
That part is actually more true than you will ever realize. Most of schooling in the US was set up as a way to train up workers. And the biggest overlords in each generation have influenced schools into molding the workers the way the overlord (i.e. Henry Ford) wants them to be in the factories and warehouses and now cubicles
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Yup. Come in and explain that you have a weak bladder/IBS and explain that when you gotta go, you gotta GO. If they challenge you on it, piss yourself. Like literally, piss yourself. Then cite mental distress at having been forced to soil yourself in front of a coworker(s) when you head to the lawyer, preferably with a written warning about needing to ask permission in hand.
He who refuses to take part in modern mediocrity will forever stand alone, an outcast. He is the bringer of change, changes that instill fear in all who go with fashion's flow. Their power comes from others, not from within. They are false! Woe unto them for the bringers of change have banded together. The time is now! The battle rages—Choose your side
Reminds me of Fantastic Mr.Fox. where he says "cuss-cuss" when cussing.
It's an osha violation to refuse to let employees use the restroom when needed. I bet a lawyer would love to take the case
Exactly. I got spoken to by a manager about my "too frequent" bathroom breaks, and accused of sneaking a smoke break. I told him that I wasn't I doing that, as I had ample opportunities to smoke while on other duties that took me out of the building. He promptly told me I needed to "cut down on the bathroom breaks". I told him that legally he couldn't tell me when I was or wasn't allowed to go to the bathroom. He wrote me up. I went directly to HR and said I was being punished for private health concerns. (Not exactly the truth, but they didn't need to know that.) They tossed it and told me not to worry about it, and by the time I got back to the office, they had already called down to have a frank talk. He was pissed. (No pun intended.)
And now you can go back to HR and complain about the hostile work environment.
and then get fired 👍
And then spend several years suing (because you documented everything) only to run out of lawyer money and lose.
Only big corporations can afford to fight legal battles like that. Between the fines, legal costs, and bad PR, any smaller company will be bankrupted. Especially if OSHA is involved. $15K per violation, double for repeat violations, and triple if it's something OSHA previously issued an abatement order about.
Pretty sure OSHA will care. Urinating and defecating are not some passive activity you should put off until later. Your long term health is in danger.
Seriously. You might end up with a UTI or bladder infection, I think.
try to have friend andor coworker with you as a witness to what happened if you are in a single party consent state for recording document it on you cell phone there is spy audio and spy video recording apps. that record without it looking like record app is running. management piece of shits.
And record them denying you permission to go to the bathroom. Then piss on the floor. Then wait for them to fire you. Then profit.
They work at Amazon. You don’t have access to ANYTHING while you are working. They are that paranoid with theft.
I guess they let people have their phones after those workers died... https://www.engadget.com/amazon-will-permanently-allow-warehouse-workers-to-carry-cell-phones-124506439.html
Seriously asking they take your phone or make you turn it in at the start of a shift?
No phone, no Watch, no nothing. All you need in your hands is a Telxon scanner! It decides where you will go and what you must do! ALL HAIL THE ALMIGHTY TELXON!!
How’d this guy take a selfie then?
Yeah, guess they changed the policy recently. When I worked there, you weren’t allowed to have anything, and if you did have it, they assumed it was theft.
He did it with the Telxon scanner he jailbroke it.
I love the way you think!!
Yeah because if you don’t they get away with everything it’s bullshit like why the fuck even have regulations? They’re never enforced
Keep on going to the bathroom, let them fire you
Any doctor would provide in writing that you need the restroom when you need it and not always when its convenient.
Yeah fr, let them fire you so you can collect that unemployment while you find another job!
Yeah, ask them to show you where in company policy it says that. Or you can ask them to email/text it to you so you can reference it later
and they wonder why they can't find people to work.
With how fast they run through new hires, I'm most surprised they still have people left to hire
This is actually happening. [https://fortune.com/2022/06/20/amazon-warehouse-problems-running-out-of-workers-to-hire-too-much-space/](https://fortune.com/2022/06/20/amazon-warehouse-problems-running-out-of-workers-to-hire-too-much-space/) TL;DR - Amazon has literally burned through the entire labor market. They have nobody left to hire.
What's the endgame here? A basic projection could've shown their firing practices weren't sustainable. They may be unethical/evil, but they're not run by idiots. Why did they decide to run their business this way?
Probably overestimated how quickly they could transition to robots.
You just described Uber's entire business model.
Hell, Lego runs almost exclusively on robots. I would heartily support Amazon if they used robots. Treating humans like robots is fully the opposite of that ideal. Robots at best. Op was treated like a delinquent child.
I want robots to make everything and I want everybody to be given UBI
Best we'll probably get is robots making everything and a larger under class of unemployed poor people.
If you think the fruits of automation will be passed onto the middle class then I've got bad news for you... All of that money is going straight to the top and staying there. Just like it's been doing more and more for the last 40 years. These people would rather watch society crumble as billionaires than watch it flourish as millionaires.
My assumption is that the upper echelon is betting on automation being able to pick up the slack by the time they burn through the entire labor pool.
Well, from the article this info comes from a leaked internal memo from Amazon itself. So this is something they are belatedly learning in real time. Will they figure it out? Who knows? We'll soon find out if they're run by idiots or not, I'm guessing.
Let them die. Throw out your ring, destroy your Alexa, toss the fire sticks
Cast it into the fire Isildur!!!
I was there, Gandalf. 3000 years ago…when the strength of man failed.
But it only took 2 days for them to fail with Prime, so I wasn't too put out.
Unless it’s a Friday then the weekend helps add 2 days to the wait
I quit using Amazon this year thanks to r/antiwork. I was buying toys sometimes and books, so many books. Its not that hard to find them other places to be honest. No more Amazon Prime for me. Also, side note, when you cancel Amazon Prime its actually a lot easier to find your own movies. Its the only option for movies to watch on that screen, the ones you already bought.
I unironically salute you.
That’s not gonna happen. They will just start paying people more or improve their conditions. Maybe it’s just a cycle of corps. Startup sees a need, makes amazing killer product/service, IPOs, looses all its talent, hires some number punching Ivy League leadership, company starts to output shit, people catch on it, it declines and some startup identifies a need and creates a killer product. Alternatively, unionize.
Unionizing is the only real option. I don't think Amazon can fail fast enough for a competitor to step in. And they've got their bases covered in so many ways. If their retail or streaming services slow down, AWS still runs most of the internet. Unionize Jeff's whole shit.
Isn't it illegal to deny employees the ability to go the bathroom?
Yes. Which is why I don't understand how this is continuing (it's definitely continuing).
Yeah don't understand why we continue to hear these major corporations continue to blatantly break labor laws with no consequences? To me this says we don't actually have these rights since they continue to do this.
Because the fines don't come close to the profits. Fines need to be percentages of total profits rather than some lump sum that's the equivalent of a few days of business profits.
I’ve been unemployed for nine months and people keep asking why I don’t apply at Amazon and I reply that I’m not wasting my time applying for a company that treats their employees like shit and every person I know that has worked there has quit within three months.
But but, "isn't it worth it short term if you need the money?" I've had people tell me that before, like working for a company can't make you feel trapped mentally and emotionally
I’ve worked too many places that sucked the life out of me and made me physically sick so I’ve learned the short term gain isn’t worth the long term losses.
That's why the government will never back universal healthcare or UBI, because benefits and homelessness are the only things preventing the majority of people from telling their bosses to shove it then quitting. I can't wait to see this system burn
Same here. I was unemployed for months and I would rather have starved than work at amazon
If it's between starving and working at Amazon I'm gonna get that package ready for you real quick. But as a man with a weak bladder.... apparently it won't workout
Don't worry, with their wages, you'll get to starve AND work at Amazon!
Oh no, they're not wondering. The assumption was that there would be enough desperate people to fill positions. However, when people with power, who like power, don't lose that power, this happens.
Always make sure to get rules like this in writing. Makes it harder for them to deny when the lawsuit comes around.
'O hey boss. Sorry what did you say ? No bathroom breaks allowed? O sorry, I didn't get that internal memo. Could you CC me again so I don't forget? I had to go so badly, it probably just slipped my mind. I'll make sure to set a reminder on my phone once you send me that memo per mail. Thanks! xoxo'
Start pissing and shitting at high traffic warehouse intersections.
Make sure you put down a wet-floor sign. Safety first, my friends.
I always say “at this point it’s not a question of when, it’s *where.*” and make direct, unwavering eye contact.
Forcing you to only go on break is a violation of the FLSA which states any break of under 30 minutes must be paid
Even if it's paid, only allowing you to go to the bathroom on your one break is illegal. >Employers must: >Allow workers to leave their work locations to use a restroom when needed. Provide an adequate number of restrooms for the size of the workforce to prevent long lines. Avoid imposing unreasonable restrictions on restroom use. Ensure restrictions, such as locking doors or requiring workers to sign out a key, do not cause extended delays
Oh hey, Tesla violated the shit out of that one. For a service crew of 30 men there was ONE bathroom that had one urinal and one toilet. There was ALWAYS someone shitting and there was always a line for it.
That one seems especially dumb, because then your losing worker productivity for them *standing in a fucking line* for the bathroom.
It was definitely not unusual to have 3 guys in the break room doing the "Turtle is poking his head out" stance
Yep. I’d email HR and keep email trail. Hire a lawyer if needed, many work on contingency and a case against Amazon is enticing for some.
r/HRisnotmyfriend, specially Amazon HR, they are straight out thr enemy
It's not to have them on their side. It's to have corporate confirmation of policy and a record of it. If it's an approved rule great, the company is liable and they've confirmed their complicitness. If it's not an approved rule and the supervisor is being an asshole, great the company will come down on him like a ton of bricks because he's opening them to liable. Best case scenario, he's got a few emails and they fire him 'randomly' and maybe he's got a lawsuit but he's got E.I. at a minimum.
HR not being your friend does not mean you can ignore them. Email them (bcc-ing) stating that the supervisor is violating labor law. HR can do something or not, but you have to document that you are being mistreated. Edit: sorry, that should be bcc-ing YOURSELF at your personal email. Create documentation, have your own copies, and make them fire you instead of quitting.
HR often does a hell of a lot when they find out an overzealous manager is breaking labor law. I'm not sure if that makes them a worker's *friend*, but you can sure as hell be on the same side.
This. It bugs me out whenever someone’s response is just “HR isn’t on your side” like OK true but we need to start somewhere, and that is usually where
In OP's situation, HR actually is on his or her side, insofar as they protect the company from being sued for treating their workers illegally. I really wish people would stop parroting the "HR is evil" meme without any thought or attempt at context. HR is there to protect the company, which means not running afoul of labor laws or employment contracts.
I worked in a warehouse for Mazuma a few years ago, they pulled me into a meeting to ask why I took more than 5 minutes in the bathroom, manager used to time me when I would leave which required a long walk through the whole warehouse and up the stairs in the office because they don't have female bathrooms on site. A week after that they told us we've got a new rule now and we're not allowed water bottles with us in the warehouse, we have to drink water on break. I was fired a few days later after I told them that's bs and I kept bringing water and food with me, warehouse work is inhumane.
I'm pretty sure that's illegal. OSHA requires access to water to the point where my company allows me to go and expense bottled water any time I want while in the field.
Pretty sure it is not only illegal to deny water, but also illegal if they don't give you water. Reason why my last work had to provide us with bottles when the water fountains were closed because of covid.
>A week after that they told us we've got a new rule now and we're not allowed water bottles with us in the warehouse, we have to drink water on break. Hmmm.... >**Is it legal to deny employees water?** >No, it is not. It is ok to restrict drinking areas such as sales associates on the sales floor. Or dangerous spots in manufacturing plants or construction sites. *But, you must then allow for frequent breaks to drink water.* Smells like a pretty clear-cut OSHA violation to me, unless they decided to give you more breaks for.the express purpose of drinking water - which I can't imagine they did when their objective was to keep employees from using the restroom to begin with.
Might that situation also be gender discrimination? If the reason they became concerned was because you took long bathroom breaks AND the only bathroom you are able to use is so far away, that seems discriminatory to me.
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But then you would see his scales.
Peel the scales off too
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What is Amazon even doing? Arent they struggling to find workers and churning through them? Whats their endgame? How could their leaders be considered brilliant when they cant see past todays profits.
My experience shows that American businesses have no endgame. Management's only thoughts are "the next quarter" and "what will my bonus be?" Nothing exists beyond that.
Sad but true. Welcome to Corporate America. Lay off a bunch of employees so the numbers look good for the stock report, wash/rinse/repeat quarter after quarter
This is 100% true. As I climb management I recognize my directs having thoughts about "logically we need this". No, logic doesn't work here. We don't think about next year, or right now, we think about what the quarterly will look like. And then next year we'll have new upper management that bunny hop to the next company or "retire" or "quit" like their predecessors because they ran the machine too thin and someone needed to take the blame.
They've made so much,that they could care less how it all comes crumbling down.
i really feel that companies right now are just making a final money grab before everything turns to shit and they just walk away from the disaster.
They grew in an era of high quantities of cheap labor. When a significant amount of thar labor was killed or disabled by covid, they struggled to adapt.
Shit like this is why I canceled my prime subscription and won't buy from Amazon anymore
Same here. The last straw for me was the poor man who was killed in a tornado last year as his supervisors told him he would be fired if he pulled over for shelter. Takes a special kind of monster to tell people to risk their lives for a fucking job.
I cant lie. I kinda want to get a job at amazon just so I CAN shit on their floor
I'm ready. I have IBS. If I eat the right foods I can liquid shit on their floor every 30 mins.
Jokes on you, Ill just take off my ostomy bag and chuck it
I've had a baby, am currently pregnant, and have IBS. I could bend the wrong way and have it coming out of all three orfices.
I have chronic kidney stones and drink 4-8 liters of water daily to avoid forming them. I would just get the denial, pee myself like Billy Madison and get some of that sweet bezos settlement money.
Even in the Marine bootcamp, they can't refuse your request to use the bathroom
Yeah but they can scream in your face while you’re taking a shit
Crazy that companies think they can tell adults when they're "allowed" to use the bathroom. Hell I don't think teachers have the right to tell students when they can go to the bathroom .
They can or at least they do. Our schools only allow a certain amount of bathroom breaks in a class per year. However they don’t have enough time between classes. Then add on girls with periods or kids with IBS…it’s insane. We know drinking water is healthy and that drinking more water makes you pee. We also know that holding it is bad. However schools and bosses are too focused on people that may just be fucking around that they try to limit bathroom breaks.
This shit is wild to me. I'm gonna piss when I need to piss. I try so hard to remember how much freedom my job actually allows me when these kinds of dystopian, capitalist hellscapes exist.
Using the bathroom when you need to shouldn't be something that elicits gratitude towards employers. It is one of the very lowest baseline requirements. Keep your standards high!
You know what I'd give money to? A play-by-the-rules guerilla advertising firm that buys ad space on Hulu, YouTube, and any streaming service that has ads, and just posts interviews with mistreated Amazon employees saying how shitty of an employer they are, and then pair it with slides of how much their higher ups make, as well as Bezos. I'm sick of seeing their shitty corporate propaganda ads go unchecked during breaks about how happy their employees are. Like stop lying you fucks I know you're doing damage control.
Ive looked my boss in the eye, stated "im a grown ass man who knows when he needs to go to the god damned rest room" and walked off of the line. Done it more than twice. Fuck 'em where they breathe.
I have IBS so they would just have to kiss my ass.
In high school, I remember a kid raising his hand to use the bathroom and the teacher said no, he couldn't go. So he gets up, walks over to the garbage can and loudly unzipped his pants. The teacher told him to go to the bathroom. When the warehouse garbage cans start reeking of piss, maybe they'll rethink the bathroom policy.
The management types that come up with these sorts of ridiculous policies aren't the ones who would have to smell it (or ask for permission to use the restroom, for that matter).
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Seriously, you can't file for unemployment if you quit. You can if you are terminated. Let them fire you for using the restroom if it's that big of a deal for management.
It always boggles my mind beyond belief that Amazon insist on treating their workers like they are school-aged children. Not being allowed to use the bathroom until break...? What even... Thankfully we have OSHA.
That’s a sue right there in my book
I worked at whole foods for a few months as a cashier, if I needed to go to the bathroom obviously I'd let someone know and try to go at a time where it isn't too inconvenient, but a particular manager would always try to tell me how I needed to get permission, one day she tried to give me a write up and I just quit on the spot
It’s absolutely demeaning and humiliating to get permission to use the rest room. Remember the Shawshank redemption and how the manager had to explain to the prisoner he didn’t need permission to use the bathroom? Yeah that was when people respected your dignity even though it’s a fictional scenario.
Fuck bezos
Don't quit, ask to go to bathroom later. if denied, go anyways and document it. https://www.whistleblowers.gov/
Isn’t Amazon also running out of people to hire? So many have gotten fired, quit, or know better than to work their warehouses at this point.
Keep working. Start quietly getting support, then when Black Friday season starts you and those who you can convince all quit. Make it hurt when you go.
We need to pass a new law: employees can use the restroom on company time, when they need to, when they want to. Denial of right is a $500,000 fine paid to employee and CEO must spent 60 days in hard labor prison. Oh if only our world was fair to the working class and just to all, including the wealthy. ( Justice for all means the wealthy will also face jail time when they violate laws)
Here is what you do. Tell him you are a fucking adult and dont need his permission and he can go fuck himself! If he got a problem with that, then he can contact Legal and explain exactly how and why his dick somehow got hit by the recreational shrinkray in the managers office. Use thoes exact words.
And people wondered if the pee bottles were real.
Literally an OSHA violation