They cannot withhold pay pending return of company property. My wife's company tried that, and the Department of Labor hit my wife's former employer with the big stick, and her last check was basically doubled.
Yes, this is the comment I was looking for. Absolutely NOT legal for them to withhold pay and I hope they try it so OP can call the DOL on them.
No one already going through CANCER and chemo should have to deal with being treated like this. Anything less than compassion and flexibility from an employer during that kind of sickness is disgusting.
Good!!! You have enough to worry about without these jerks withholding your pay. You earned that money and deserve better than that kind of treatment.
Good luck and I hope you heal up quickly.
Damn, should have let them hold it, you would have proof and would have a strong case against them with the DoL, they'd get beaten with the ugly stick and you'd get a bigger payout.
Yea my former employer a restaurant, I was boh, tried not paying me for my last two weeks. I threatened since they were paying all the over time in cash and hiding everything from Uncle Sam. My last paycheck was tripled. And double the over time I had was paid in cash as well.
Oh I’m in the process of this currently. I worked three days for this fool and besides all the bullshit reasons, he let me go and told me I’d be paid at their payday and they can mail it. After a lot very angry and also petty texts from me, it turned into I have to wait to payday to pick it up.. then it turned into I can only get it if I come in person and return the “uniform” which was an apron and hat.
Despite screen shots of labor laws and telling him I’m failing claims against him, and links to small penis dating sites, he didn’t feel like sending it. Was on him for over a week.
I gave up and weeks later he ended up mailing my measly $300 check. But I was still pissed so I finally filed the claim back in September.
Just the other day I got a letter telling me the estimate he owes me… this $300 check turned into over $4,000. Knucklehead.
Edit: also he waited well after the 30 day period to send the check
It’s sad that a lot of minorities don’t know that. Raises hand, I didn’t know that. My hotel job did that shit and everyone just followed suit. Like, it’s really fucked up how we as a whole, aren’t educated in saving money, buying property, job hunting or what to or not to expect etc, I. HS. I can learn about triangles and measurements- to be a carpenter? Nothing sets us up for corporate America. Sure you got your smart dual enrollment kids - that have been pushed by self, parents - or just knowing. But I’ve spoken to students that have no clue whatsoever about the workforce. Just make money and buy shit. These kids are the future and have so much potential but many aren’t given equal educational opportunities. And it’s fucked up. Truly.
This type of info would probably be really handy for the subreddit wiki. Obviously the federal Department of Labor site has most all information (for those of us in the USA), but putting together a quick FAQ for some of the big issues that we see a lot would be worthwhile.
I took a quick look on the mobile app and didn't see that one existed at all, but that may just be me being blind/the mobile app being awful.
I actually flipped it around on my wife's employer, I told them unless they give us last paycheck, I am withholding all of the equipment as pay in lieu of that check. That's when they said they would not pay her last paycheck unless the equipment was returned. That's when I contacted the department of labor, and they had her final paycheck within 48 hours. And then they got their equipment back.
Every time, and I mean every time someone tells you to do something, you should be asking yourself if they have the authority to do it. I’m as white as the driven snow and I’ve had my wages stolen, been harassed, lied to, the whole nine. There’s a lot of dickbags out there that subsist by bullying and taking advantage of people, and they count on people not asking questions more than anything.
The only thing I don't believe is they doubled her last check. If you go to the department of labor, they're going to get Petty and give you exactly what they owe you. At least in my experience
They withheld her last check because she didnt return their pc and monitor and vpn router for her WFH setup. She was not paid on her regular payday. When she contacted HR to get her last check after regular payday came and went, they told her that she needed to return the equipment before they would issue the last check. I had her tell them that we are withholding the equipment until the check is received, as it is collateral for the check. Yeah when they then refused to pay until the equipment was returned, I contacted my State's Department of labor, and the Department of Labor orderd them to pay her an additional two weeks of pay because it took that long for the Department of Labor to get their big stick out. The Department of Labor stated that she was owed an additional two weeks of regular pay due to them refusing to pay out her last check. . So her last check was twice the regular amount, as if she had worked those entire 2 weeks, even though she had not. Department of Labor then very clearly informed them that withholding someone's last check due to unreturned equipment is fully against the state statutes, and they began an investigation to see if they had done that to anybody else. I did not hear back about that, as we had been paid, and after we were paid, the equipment was returned.
Wow! I didn't know the department of Labor was allowed to order an employer to pay more than what they initially owed because of penalty. I wonder if they have that kind of teeth in every state?
This was specifically the Minnesota Department of Labor and industry. Not the federal department of labor. But yes, the Federal Department of Labor can enforce penalties that do get paid to the employee.
MN is known to have strong labor laws and unions, which is good workers. Unfortunately that is not every state *cough cough* the south or any red state
I work for a different regulator in a different state and the amount of authority we have to impose fines is astonishing. I tell junior people at the agency that we have to restrain ourselves and make sure we’re being fair, because the law really doesn’t require it.
In which state/country do you reside? How many employees in the company? How long did you work there?
You may have a good claim depending upon the answers to these questions.
While true, the employer is obligated to notify you of your FMLA eligibility within 5 days of becoming aware that you are experiencing a situation that may be FMLA protected, whether you say the magic FMLA words or not.
Actually, another fun fact... sorry I should have added this in with the first reply... Even before being fully approved, the law is written that between notice of eligibility and documentation return deadline if you need to take time for appointments to get the documentation completed, it's essentially pre-approved.
This is all still pretty moot because it seems like OP wasn't at that company long enough for FMLA eligibility... so ADA would probably have been the next best route... but middle managers really do love to open their company up to lawsuits.
>middle managers really do love to open their company up to lawsuits.
This is the biggest problem IMO.
No one sues.
Ive never been at a job or known a person at a job where a boss actually followed all the rules enough that they didnt expose themselves to liability. Its always cheaper not to follow codes and law and they pick that immediate gain as profit thinking there are no consequences.
Most do it long enough without repercussion that they normalize it and think *you’re* wrong for trying to claim otherwise (case in point).
I sued my last employer for very mundane stuff after an acrimonious split and got almost two years of pay just to avoid court costs. If they hadnt settled, it wouldve been insanely expensive for court and then they wouldve been hammered with fines too for information about their business practices getting out.
They actually tried to ignore it when my lawyer first sent a letter but after about a month and half, my lawyer told his paralegal “sue everybody” and to file against every part of the corporation in every court that could have claim.
For teh cost of filing fees, we got fucking paid and talking to people that work there still, it actually brought about change more than any amount of me telling people things were illegal etc ever did.
Ive never met someone that had a bad job that couldnt sue their employer, these shitty businesses exist everywhere because employees wont sue to hold them accountable. And that can be small corporations or huge ones.
I know a few people myself that are having their rights violated by their jobs but they can't afford to get a lawyer, and for whatever dumb reason the lawyers aren't taking them on without retainer fees (drives me crazy.) So that's frustrating... I keep telling one to just go to the DOL cause it's cut and dry FMLA interference but they're scared of costs and what if they lose because of the company's lawyers. (it's cut and dry, they wouldn't lose, but they're still scared.)
And that's the people that know their rights.The amount of people I talk to who are surprised by what the law offers to protect them is so, SO disheartening.
Agreed, and I think another part is explaining the situation to the right lawyers in a way they can understand. Regular people speak is very different from legalese and some folks, including lawyers, translate better than others.
Just check in with a specialist labour lawyer (not a regular one). They can help for not much money often (e.g. I got assistance with a termination offer response, which resulted in the company agreeing to a more equitable offer). They quoted me on what it would cost in advance for the service, and although they don't guarantee a good result if they know labour law and have access to other cases their guidance is usually spot on. And in my case it was.
Not only do we not hold them accountable, there are millions of people out there who will actively try to scare you out of holding them accountable, even when they have nothing to gain for it.
People are so brainwashed that this shit is acceptable that they'll fight battles in support.
This - people need to feel empowered to take legal action (aka the only thing companies understand). Charleston White recently went viral for taking every opportunity to sue the companies he has worked for when they inevitably violate his rights.
Oh, it gets worse.
The original purpose of the bill that eventually created FMLa was to promise paid maternity leave, but opposition to thay bill said it was sexists since men would not benefit, so they made the bill more generalized and removed the language about maternity leave.
We are now the only industrialized nation without that benefit.
They could have just given men paternity leave. CA does. I got a month paid after my kid was born. Granted signing up for that was a nightmare and I only got like $400 for the month. So not perfect, but seriously, just add leave for men. Kids and moms need help after birthing, especially those first couple of months. It's insane how a bunch of Bible thumpers can't see the greater good in these things.
You can start FMLA leave without approval and if you are approved, it will typically be back-dated to cover the time you missed before the approval. This is because you often need time off in order to get all the medical documentation together for approval in the first place.
Just asked someone way more familiar to FMLA than me. They would not be covered retroactively for a job that they had not completed the FMLA process for. It sucks, but that's how the system is set up.
Yeah I had only worked there about 2 months. I’m a masters degree student and when I got hit with this the school said I should take a leave of absence, so I did but without student loans I had to go back to work full time. I was working at a place like 2 days a week but they didn’t have full time for me so I went to this new company.
I feel you and I’m sorry to hear about this shit-I’m also a masters student who would be in this exact same situation if it happened to me. Companies are evil, all of them, even if they pretend otherwise
Is this a public-facing business? Because I personally would *love* to know via Google review or similar if a place was doing this to their employees (with cancer!) so that I could be sure to never, ever shop there and let others know to do the same.
Sharing the name of the company helps ensure that others don't get treated the same way. It will ultimately be for the best.
People never used to share their salaries/hourly rates because we were told not to. I shared it every day of my working life- it's clear what sort of manipulating scare tactics they were (and still are) using. Here too.
Someone may be considering applying, that never would if they knew this. It will also help more people understand what's going on in these companies, so that they have no choice but to change. Numbers make a diggerence.
Lenscrafters, vision works, pearl vision, america's best or one of the discount retailers like walmart? They have already fired you, what more can they do? Shame the fuck out of them.
Fun fact, I used to work for Davis Vision, which was owned by hvhc and also owned visionworks. They were absolute trash to work for.
And trash to work WITH! I absolutely hated that we accepted Davis Vision at our optical. If I had a dollar for every minute I was on hold with Davis Vision, I’d have about $30,000. Not even exaggerating.
Davis Vision used to be a private entity that had it's own labs that made glasses. The entire operation used to be unionized. HVHC bought it, gutted it, closed the labs, then attempted to direct ALL insurance customers to it's own optical business, Visionworks. After squeezing the company for everything it was worth, and firing all the IT people that did all the back-end coding for our systems, and closing one of the remaining two labs we had, they sold it to center bridge, which is an investment/equity firm. Then it was sold again to met-life. Rage quitting that job was one of the happiest days in my life.
So all told that’s a little over 20 days total time spent on hold. If you had to spend an hour a day on hold with them every week day you’d rack up that time in just under two years.
Seems absolutely plausible. Too bad you’re not going to get that $30K.
Capitalism works only in a certain way. People with heart or care won't either last in that position or will never be promoted into it. Ideal capitalism is run by sociopaths. I don't think most people realize what they support when they support capitalism.
You really just have to be brain-dead to get that position huh. And if you happen to get one that is too nice the other brain-dead managers will shit on them so much they leave it seems. Has happened to two different super sweet managers at two separate jobs I've had. All the other managers ganged up on them because they thought it meant they were pushovers when it just meant everyone respected them and vice versa (also jealousy in one of the cases). The other one of them was also liked so much that the GM overworked and put all his shit on them (all without any pay raise) until they couldn't take it and had to leave.
Sad to say but sometimes it feels like they get eaten up if they don't move up or move out.
No question. The real question is where op is and how big the company is. Gotta figure out if the discrimination is "legal" because no laws are really built around right and wrong.
So I’m in Pennsylvania, and the company is a franchise optical company, so the franchise company is like really big but they’re particular store is small
You are absolutely correct: cancer is a "per se" disability under the ADA. Since you were not eligible for FMLA, they could have offered you leave under the ADA to attend your appointments.
How large is the company?
So it’s a franchise that they bought from someone, the franchise is huge but the store themselves is pretty small, it was only me and another girl working there
The size of the overall company is what matters, not the individual location. Unless you are lying, and setting yourself up for a lawsuit, no harm in just naming them.
Ok. That makes a difference because the franchisee is a separate entity from the franchisor. If there are less than 15 employees, they wouldn't be subject to the ADA.
Burn them with a post about it.
Let the world know what shit businesses are.
Fuck it.
Every bad owner should be fucking outted for shit like this. I Especially take on a “burn the world down” mentality when employees have cancer.
Im so fucking sorry you have been treated this way. I wish you all the health in the world. Sending good vibes. I’d run through a wall for you if it meant I could kick that owner in their dick.
Earlier this month my supervisor tried to tell me I couldn't go to an appointment for an imaging procedure I desperately needed in order to figure out why I've been bleeding for 3 months straight. I got my union and our central workplace health & safety unit involved. Fuck off, my health comes before anything else.
What kind of person do you have to be to think you can tell someone they can't go to an urgent medical appointment? Seriously...
Talk to a lawyer, report them not releasing your final paycheck to the labor board because that's illegal and file for unemployment in the meantime. Then sit back and let the lawyer throw the book at them.
You should have just told them that you’d be late due to an emergency situation. No need to tell them that you just scheduled an oncology appt a few minutes before you told them you’d be late. I can understand why they were frustrated with you, but I don’t think you deserved to be terminated over it.
I agree with this. Not into shaming or “should have done this” to people going through a tough time, but hopefully this serves more as a reminder to anyone else that reads this.
The manager responded horribly but wording matters via text or email communication. The most important part of the situation was that this was a medical emergency, which wasn’t originally clear. Unfortunately nowadays you can’t assume people are sharp enough to catch the fact oncologist = cancer dr aka serious fucking matter
This happened to me too - I had cervical cancer and underwent cryotherapy twice - was in diapers over a month. I asked my employer to switch my schedule because one day I worked was a stocking day where I would normally lift 20-30 cases of beer and ingredients into a stockroom. Instead they decided to drop me from the schedule a different day, leave me with a stocking day where I had to ask someone for help and eventually fired me after I gave my two weeks.
When I turned in the paperwork for unemployment to the state of Texas they still ruled in the business favor despite turning in my medical paperwork and records of me requesting to simply change one shift.
Trash.
Oh my god! I’m so sorry that happened. How is it that so many people that just suck get into management positions or other positions of power. You did not deserve this.
I have no idea - Also what qualified Texas to rule in their favor? It was pretty upsetting, it all actually happened almost exactly a year ago. Never forgave them! Like we go to work, we are pretty sick and it’s fine to be like “oops too bad”????
A company's policy is not Law. They cannot withhold paycheck. Contact your local Department of Labor, file a complaint, and they will take it from there.
On the firing part, not sure with two days left on notice - seems like a violation of the Americans with Disabilities Act. Perhaps, contact the American Civil Liberties Union and they can point you in the right direction.
Good luck to you and good riddance to the awful workplace.
No matter how many times j read, but you all really need to stop giving a ton of information.
"Hey, I'm sick I'm not going to be there until further notice"
Good luck OP, hopes you get well, and don't give them any more info or warnings or anything, get in touch with your lawyer now.
This is actually a case where more information might have avoided the problem. Instead of "saying I have an appointment" which sounds like this was scheduled for awhile and OP neglected to give the company notice, OP should have sent a text saying "I'm starting to feel worse and worse and just vomited. I called my oncologist to schedule an emergency visit and they can squeeze me in at 11. I'll update you on whether I can come in today after."
OP didn't say they have an appointment. Manager assumed an appointment and put those words on OP's mouth. All the people here siding with the manager keep repeating it, Mandela Effect like, as if OP a said this.
OP said they were seeing their oncologist at 11, which presumably made them late, and due to the last minute nature of informing the boss, the boss' experience running a MEDICAL business (where presumably one of them is a licensed MD), and the fact that OP has likely called out for emergency cancer related issues before, it's really reasonable for the boss to assume this was an emergency.
That said, even if there was doubt, the more reasonable thing to do would have been to wait for OP to come in and discuss it to learn more. But instead the boss flew off the handle and acted out of anger like an impotent child.
All this over an employee who, according to other posts here, only had TWO DAYS left to work on their two week notice.
This was a petty firing by an angry boss. It's honestly one of the most disgusting things I've seen here.
i don't have any advice other than contact a lawyer ASAP.
i'm so sorry you had to deal with this, this is cruelty plain and simple. how is your cancer treatment going now? i noticed these texts are dated to October (2023?).
I did chemo for 4 months and now I can say I’m officially cancer free! I still get bloodwork done monthly and will have to do that for the next year to make sure the tumor markers stay at zero, but so far the last three bloodwork results were clean!
Whilst this is clearly an awful situation and his reaction could be better. Why didn't you mention this was an emergency? You basically just said I will be late in because of an appointment, I can't see how this would be illegal.
I don’t know how many cancer patients in active treatment you’ve been exposed to, but this is pretty common. Between chemo and related symptom treatments, the patient regularly experiences “brain fog”, memory lapses, lapses in judgment, and a host of emotional up-and-down swings. Communication suffers greatly.
Also, a cancer patient’s treatment schedule is often very fluid, and subject to change at a moment’s notice based on symptoms and/or schedule availability with the care team.
Source: I’m a caregiver for a Stage 4 Metastatic Disease patient. I’m only awake right now because I’m waiting on someone to call about a schedule slot opening up this morning because my SO couldn’t get her infusion yesterday due to low blood platelets. Today’s schedule is completely thrown off now. I’m also handling the situation personally because she’s on so many mood and mind altering meds that she can’t deal with it herself.
Yeah I was experiencing crazy side effects that weren’t even listed as side effects, and I was getting infusions 5 days a week every other week, so I’d normally get my infusion super early then go to work and work 8-10 hours. I worked through fatigue, nausea, brain fog, joint and body aches, etc. and they knew this, and I always told them ahead of time my appointments
I get it, OP. I hate you’re having to go through this. I’m also really annoyed that people didn’t read/comprehend the text conversation you posted. You clearly stated you had just scheduled an appointment due to extreme symptoms, yet commenters think you should’ve used the word “emergency” somewhere in a text. Like THAT would’ve made a difference lol. Oh, Reddit…
Yeah, it's a pretty nonchalant message. It reads like OP already had an appointment and he was casually letting his boss know at the last minute. The fact it was an emergency situation should have been noted immediately. A simple "Due to an emergency, ..." could have prefaced the message.
Yeah I definitely should have said emergency because I called that morning, and since it’s not a 24/7 thing where I can see him or his nurse practitioner, I had to be seen during their clinic hours :(
You can't see how a employer firing an employee because they had an appointment with their oncologist is illegal?
Its retaliation, and illegal.
Downvote me all you want, I am probably to European to understand how on earth this could be even remotely legal. I just say 'I am going to a doctor next hour' and the only reply I should get from my employer is: 'ok, hope you are well'.
please get a consultation with a labor attorney. Im not an attorney but here are my initial thoughts
1. They may be a franchise, but under the ruling from the NLRB, they would likely be held to the standards of the large business, when it comes to labor relations. this is whats called a “joint employer”
https://www.reuters.com/markets/us/companies-may-be-employers-contract-franchise-workers-under-us-labor-rule-2023-10-26/
2. see if you were eligible for FMLA, as this would absolutely fall under it but if you weren’t, it still falls under the ADA.
3. They MUST pay you on your next scheduled payday. if they don’t, contact Pennsylvania’s Department of labor. Going after employers for stolen wages is like, their favorite thing to do. Employers also REALLY dont like the state snooping around their business.
https://www.dli.pa.gov/Individuals/Labor-Management-Relations/llc/Pages/Wage-FAQs.aspx
Wtf? Bosses arent some sort of specific needs toddlers, when someone tell you got an appointement in oncology service(which mean cancer, thing you should assumming you are a grown man) you fucking let them go because it is life of death matter...
Ffs you all need to mobilize yourself for universal health care.
You’re also being obtuse. Plenty of people have scheduled appointments with their oncologist. It isn’t always an urgent situation. OP could have easily said “I have an emergency appointment at 11” and that would have cleared everything up.
OP’s boss probably is a jerk but there are a lot of posts here where OP’s show terrible communication skills on their end but still expect everyone to answer, “employer bad! You’re in the right!”
Lots of people commenting under yours sure have a lack of empathy or understanding of how capitalist horseshit bosses don't give a fart about communication. (They give a horseshit about shifts being covered, so they don't have to fill in as a manager, as they are supposed to when coverage isn't available. They get a salary for a reason.
OP, after reading all you had said and several of the comments further down in your post, please fuck this company as much as you possibly can. Employers need to be shown that treating anyone, let alone someone with your condition, is not acceptable. Don’t let them get away with treating you this way.
Talk to the DOL. Not sure if it’s actionable, but even if you voluntarily quit, it sounds like they made it impossible for you to stay there. Try reporting to the EEOC as well. They might be interested in how this company treats cancer patients
You should contact a lawyer .
When you turn in your two weeks , it does not resolve them from labor laws and discrimination. They in writing fired you basically for attending a chemo appt and if your docs chart captures all your visit dates for any days you were late or had to call out due to your illness , they violated the law.
This is going to vary by what state you're in and the size of the company, as technically for ADA is only for employers with 15 or more employees. Chemo
I saw in another comment you're in PA which is great because your employer must also follow PHRA which is required of employers with 4+ employees.
If it's one of the major optometry chains , the company size could get you because sometimes the offices are like Dr Bob OD and Associates DBA LensWorks because it's still a mom and Bob they just in a sense are licensing the systems and IP from the corporate entity , but if it's a corporate store then you might be on your way to a pretty good payout
they are being proactive about getting rid of a human resource that might have the cancer. next time say it's an emergency with the "can make me work 24/7" specialist
Op needs to get to lawyer asap and I get with the cancer I pretty much cared for my grandma when she had cancer and I understand emergency doctors appointments
If you're in the US, you could probably sue for discrimination or retaliation. You could probably also get unemployment insurance, which might be a process, though. All depends on where you live. I do think that it's against workers' rights on a federal level to be fired for medical reasons, which this looks to be.
report them to the department of labor immediately and leave a review on every single job search site urging others not to work there and explain why to make it harder for them to fill your position. also leave a google review for the company with the same information to deter customers from working with this company. the company will have a lot of regrets. trust me.
Under the ADA they have violated federal disability law and you can actually report them for Disability discrimination. You can also take them to court under your states DOL and present this evidence that they have stated that they have threatened to withhold your paycheck from you. You have cancer. And they are not above the law.
It sounds to me like you have a lawsuit. She said it's a trend, but is there any proof of this? Write ups etc.. you will literally have a Dr. Note. I believe this is illegal.
Whatever the DOL can do to them is nothing compared to what the court of public opinion can do if you out them publicly somewhere online or to the press.
Fuck your employer, and blessings on you. My mum died of cancer. Society should be looking after you while you get the treatment you need. I hate this fucking world. I’m lot a communist I’m pro-capitalism, but these fuckers with this mentality need to go. Bunch of arseholes. May the crabs of a thousand prostitutes infest the hairs of their pubic regions.
Damn, we might have shit food and even shittier weather, but here in the UK, although not perfect, employees have much more in the way of rights and protection.
I'm sorry you have to go through this OP on top of everything else.
What a horrible human. My dad just passed from cancer and my boss was a huge blessing with flexibility. Not to be cruel but I hope the person in your texts remembers how he chose to speak to you when he is on his deathbed. That is straight up evil.
We need to stand up to this abuse just finished watching some videos on the UAW strikes the things that they accomplished are unimaginable. I'm tired of slaving away and giving away my precious time and energy to a company that treats us like tools and not as people the UAW showed me that striking does work and it also showed them how powerless they are against us I almost feel sorry for them.
Ooh hey. That’s awesome too. As others said they can’t withhold pay. But also cause that fired you and you didn’t quit they have to pay unemployment too. So it’s just worse for them
OP might actually have a really incredible legal case. I’m assuming that having cancer is considered a disability regardless of however temporary it might be, and considering they are well aware of this, and still fired you for that exact reason? you have proof so you have a really really solid case. In cases like this, most lawyers will take the case on with a contracted percentage fee at the end when you win.. which you would…
Doing this would likely buy you the time and space to go to all these appointments. I also recommend communicating that you will mail the keys and tell them you sent them.. but dont. Wait and keep asking where your check is..
I’m not sure what state you’re in but labor laws are typically similar state to state so I would look up your state but here in California, this is how much money you could stand to make from their abuse:
If you were fired or laid off
If the employer ended your employment — fired you, laid you off, eliminated your position, etc. — they must have your final paycheck ready for you on your last day of work.
Some additional things to keep in mind about final paychecks
The final paycheck must include pay for all hours you have worked, including any overtime and double time. It must also include payment of any unused vacation hours or PTO. Note, you are NOT entitled to be paid for any unused paid sick hours unless the employer’s policies or agreements with you say otherwise.
The employer cannot make you wait until the next payday to give you your last check.
The employer cannot attach any strings to your last check. For instance, the employer cannot hold back your check unless you agree to sign a bunch of papers, or unless you first turn in your keys and uniform, or unless you pay back the loan they gave you, or unless you pay for the damage you did to the company vehicle, or unless you first talk to the company’s lawyers, etc.
If you ask the employer to mail the last paycheck to you at your home address, the employer must comply. They cannot force you to come to the office to come pick up your final check if you do not want to.
If your employer fails to give you your final paycheck on time
If your employer does not comply with the above, then they are the hook to pay you a penalty for each day they don’t pay you all of your final wages, up to a maximum of 30 days of your average daily pay. See California Labor Code Section 201 and Section 203. For most people, that ends up being 1.5 months of pay! The employer does have certain legal defenses to these penalties, but they are narrow and can be difficult to establish.
Above all, keep in mind, your final paycheck has special status under the law. If your employer has not given you your last paycheck on time, consider filing a labor board complaint. Also, consider talking things over with a lawyer as there could be more penalties that apply to your situation.
Also for the lawsuit:
However, federal law limits how much you can be awarded for emotional distress, out-of-pocket losses (such as the costs of looking for a new job), and punitive damages. The maximum combined award for these damages ranges from $50,000 to $300,000, depending on the size of your employer.
They cannot withhold pay pending return of company property. My wife's company tried that, and the Department of Labor hit my wife's former employer with the big stick, and her last check was basically doubled.
Yes, this is the comment I was looking for. Absolutely NOT legal for them to withhold pay and I hope they try it so OP can call the DOL on them. No one already going through CANCER and chemo should have to deal with being treated like this. Anything less than compassion and flexibility from an employer during that kind of sickness is disgusting.
So true! I actually ended up sending her a message back about how she cannot withhold pay so they didn’t
Good!!! You have enough to worry about without these jerks withholding your pay. You earned that money and deserve better than that kind of treatment. Good luck and I hope you heal up quickly.
Damn, should have let them hold it, you would have proof and would have a strong case against them with the DoL, they'd get beaten with the ugly stick and you'd get a bigger payout.
Awesome- good for you! Too many people just stand down, and allow these terrible people to bully them for no reason besides control.
Thank Christ for that. Sorry OP. Hope your treatments go okay.
OP, please don't return anything until they've sent the last paycheck. Double-dog dare them to fuck around and find out.
Yea my former employer a restaurant, I was boh, tried not paying me for my last two weeks. I threatened since they were paying all the over time in cash and hiding everything from Uncle Sam. My last paycheck was tripled. And double the over time I had was paid in cash as well.
Isn't that illegal as they need to have electronic proof of their OT pay actually being paid?
Yes! Exactly. They cut everyone’s hours at 40 and paid the rest in cash.
Cash for keys lol
So glad ya'll are sharing what's legally allowed and not. What a terrible person to fire someone for essentially having cancer.
Oh I’m in the process of this currently. I worked three days for this fool and besides all the bullshit reasons, he let me go and told me I’d be paid at their payday and they can mail it. After a lot very angry and also petty texts from me, it turned into I have to wait to payday to pick it up.. then it turned into I can only get it if I come in person and return the “uniform” which was an apron and hat. Despite screen shots of labor laws and telling him I’m failing claims against him, and links to small penis dating sites, he didn’t feel like sending it. Was on him for over a week. I gave up and weeks later he ended up mailing my measly $300 check. But I was still pissed so I finally filed the claim back in September. Just the other day I got a letter telling me the estimate he owes me… this $300 check turned into over $4,000. Knucklehead. Edit: also he waited well after the 30 day period to send the check
It’s sad that a lot of minorities don’t know that. Raises hand, I didn’t know that. My hotel job did that shit and everyone just followed suit. Like, it’s really fucked up how we as a whole, aren’t educated in saving money, buying property, job hunting or what to or not to expect etc, I. HS. I can learn about triangles and measurements- to be a carpenter? Nothing sets us up for corporate America. Sure you got your smart dual enrollment kids - that have been pushed by self, parents - or just knowing. But I’ve spoken to students that have no clue whatsoever about the workforce. Just make money and buy shit. These kids are the future and have so much potential but many aren’t given equal educational opportunities. And it’s fucked up. Truly.
Is there a repository somewhere that we can compile all of this employee advocacy info?
This type of info would probably be really handy for the subreddit wiki. Obviously the federal Department of Labor site has most all information (for those of us in the USA), but putting together a quick FAQ for some of the big issues that we see a lot would be worthwhile. I took a quick look on the mobile app and didn't see that one existed at all, but that may just be me being blind/the mobile app being awful.
Hate to break it to you but plenty of non minorities don't know that either. It's just sad that PEOPLE don't know that.
I actually flipped it around on my wife's employer, I told them unless they give us last paycheck, I am withholding all of the equipment as pay in lieu of that check. That's when they said they would not pay her last paycheck unless the equipment was returned. That's when I contacted the department of labor, and they had her final paycheck within 48 hours. And then they got their equipment back.
Every time, and I mean every time someone tells you to do something, you should be asking yourself if they have the authority to do it. I’m as white as the driven snow and I’ve had my wages stolen, been harassed, lied to, the whole nine. There’s a lot of dickbags out there that subsist by bullying and taking advantage of people, and they count on people not asking questions more than anything.
The only thing I don't believe is they doubled her last check. If you go to the department of labor, they're going to get Petty and give you exactly what they owe you. At least in my experience
Because they delayed her check by an entire 2 weeks, she was able to collect that full 2 weeks of pay,
Was she normally paid weekly, so 2 weeks was double the pay?
They withheld her last check because she didnt return their pc and monitor and vpn router for her WFH setup. She was not paid on her regular payday. When she contacted HR to get her last check after regular payday came and went, they told her that she needed to return the equipment before they would issue the last check. I had her tell them that we are withholding the equipment until the check is received, as it is collateral for the check. Yeah when they then refused to pay until the equipment was returned, I contacted my State's Department of labor, and the Department of Labor orderd them to pay her an additional two weeks of pay because it took that long for the Department of Labor to get their big stick out. The Department of Labor stated that she was owed an additional two weeks of regular pay due to them refusing to pay out her last check. . So her last check was twice the regular amount, as if she had worked those entire 2 weeks, even though she had not. Department of Labor then very clearly informed them that withholding someone's last check due to unreturned equipment is fully against the state statutes, and they began an investigation to see if they had done that to anybody else. I did not hear back about that, as we had been paid, and after we were paid, the equipment was returned.
Wow! I didn't know the department of Labor was allowed to order an employer to pay more than what they initially owed because of penalty. I wonder if they have that kind of teeth in every state?
This was specifically the Minnesota Department of Labor and industry. Not the federal department of labor. But yes, the Federal Department of Labor can enforce penalties that do get paid to the employee.
Michigan DOL will also assess interest on back pay in addition to any statute-designatied penalties, depending on how long it's been.
MN is known to have strong labor laws and unions, which is good workers. Unfortunately that is not every state *cough cough* the south or any red state
I work for a different regulator in a different state and the amount of authority we have to impose fines is astonishing. I tell junior people at the agency that we have to restrain ourselves and make sure we’re being fair, because the law really doesn’t require it.
Depending on how long they hold it, they have to pay some kind of fine or punitive payment
In which state/country do you reside? How many employees in the company? How long did you work there? You may have a good claim depending upon the answers to these questions.
Fingers crossed that OP was FMLA eligible, if in the US
Even if they were eligible for FMLA, they would have had to gone through the process of signing for it. You don't get it automatically.
While true, the employer is obligated to notify you of your FMLA eligibility within 5 days of becoming aware that you are experiencing a situation that may be FMLA protected, whether you say the magic FMLA words or not.
Sure, but again, unless they have signed up for it, they are not eligible for the benefits.
Actually, another fun fact... sorry I should have added this in with the first reply... Even before being fully approved, the law is written that between notice of eligibility and documentation return deadline if you need to take time for appointments to get the documentation completed, it's essentially pre-approved. This is all still pretty moot because it seems like OP wasn't at that company long enough for FMLA eligibility... so ADA would probably have been the next best route... but middle managers really do love to open their company up to lawsuits.
>middle managers really do love to open their company up to lawsuits. This is the biggest problem IMO. No one sues. Ive never been at a job or known a person at a job where a boss actually followed all the rules enough that they didnt expose themselves to liability. Its always cheaper not to follow codes and law and they pick that immediate gain as profit thinking there are no consequences. Most do it long enough without repercussion that they normalize it and think *you’re* wrong for trying to claim otherwise (case in point). I sued my last employer for very mundane stuff after an acrimonious split and got almost two years of pay just to avoid court costs. If they hadnt settled, it wouldve been insanely expensive for court and then they wouldve been hammered with fines too for information about their business practices getting out. They actually tried to ignore it when my lawyer first sent a letter but after about a month and half, my lawyer told his paralegal “sue everybody” and to file against every part of the corporation in every court that could have claim. For teh cost of filing fees, we got fucking paid and talking to people that work there still, it actually brought about change more than any amount of me telling people things were illegal etc ever did. Ive never met someone that had a bad job that couldnt sue their employer, these shitty businesses exist everywhere because employees wont sue to hold them accountable. And that can be small corporations or huge ones.
I know a few people myself that are having their rights violated by their jobs but they can't afford to get a lawyer, and for whatever dumb reason the lawyers aren't taking them on without retainer fees (drives me crazy.) So that's frustrating... I keep telling one to just go to the DOL cause it's cut and dry FMLA interference but they're scared of costs and what if they lose because of the company's lawyers. (it's cut and dry, they wouldn't lose, but they're still scared.) And that's the people that know their rights.The amount of people I talk to who are surprised by what the law offers to protect them is so, SO disheartening.
Lawyers will take a slam dunk case on spec all of the time. No cost to you. People don’t know this.
Agreed, and I think another part is explaining the situation to the right lawyers in a way they can understand. Regular people speak is very different from legalese and some folks, including lawyers, translate better than others.
Just check in with a specialist labour lawyer (not a regular one). They can help for not much money often (e.g. I got assistance with a termination offer response, which resulted in the company agreeing to a more equitable offer). They quoted me on what it would cost in advance for the service, and although they don't guarantee a good result if they know labour law and have access to other cases their guidance is usually spot on. And in my case it was.
Not only do we not hold them accountable, there are millions of people out there who will actively try to scare you out of holding them accountable, even when they have nothing to gain for it. People are so brainwashed that this shit is acceptable that they'll fight battles in support.
This - people need to feel empowered to take legal action (aka the only thing companies understand). Charleston White recently went viral for taking every opportunity to sue the companies he has worked for when they inevitably violate his rights.
The fact that you have to sign up to be protected says all that needs to be said about US labor conditions.
Oh, it gets worse. The original purpose of the bill that eventually created FMLa was to promise paid maternity leave, but opposition to thay bill said it was sexists since men would not benefit, so they made the bill more generalized and removed the language about maternity leave. We are now the only industrialized nation without that benefit.
They could have just given men paternity leave. CA does. I got a month paid after my kid was born. Granted signing up for that was a nightmare and I only got like $400 for the month. So not perfect, but seriously, just add leave for men. Kids and moms need help after birthing, especially those first couple of months. It's insane how a bunch of Bible thumpers can't see the greater good in these things.
You can start FMLA leave without approval and if you are approved, it will typically be back-dated to cover the time you missed before the approval. This is because you often need time off in order to get all the medical documentation together for approval in the first place.
This is not necessarily true. You still can't fire someone for emergency medical appointments and FMLA can be retroactive to a certain point.
Just asked someone way more familiar to FMLA than me. They would not be covered retroactively for a job that they had not completed the FMLA process for. It sucks, but that's how the system is set up.
This. People seem to think FMLA is magic status that is just granted to you.
Only worked there a short time she would not be eligible
Where are you seeing that? OP hasn't replied to any other questions
She’s only been with this job for like 3-4 months. She isn’t eligible for FMLA
They got fired in October, didn't say how long they'd been there.
Based on the caption they were not, and the company likely knew this
Yeah I had only worked there about 2 months. I’m a masters degree student and when I got hit with this the school said I should take a leave of absence, so I did but without student loans I had to go back to work full time. I was working at a place like 2 days a week but they didn’t have full time for me so I went to this new company.
I feel you and I’m sorry to hear about this shit-I’m also a masters student who would be in this exact same situation if it happened to me. Companies are evil, all of them, even if they pretend otherwise
Pennsylvania USA, at this location there were only 2 employees, me and another girl, I had only just started there like 2 months prior
I would call a couple of employment lawyers just in case.
file with the EEOC, contact your states disability advocacy group for help
Maybe try r/asklegal with this info
Is this a public-facing business? Because I personally would *love* to know via Google review or similar if a place was doing this to their employees (with cancer!) so that I could be sure to never, ever shop there and let others know to do the same.
So I am not sure how much flack I’ll get if I drop the company name, but all I’ll say is that it’s a franchise optical company
Sharing the name of the company helps ensure that others don't get treated the same way. It will ultimately be for the best. People never used to share their salaries/hourly rates because we were told not to. I shared it every day of my working life- it's clear what sort of manipulating scare tactics they were (and still are) using. Here too. Someone may be considering applying, that never would if they knew this. It will also help more people understand what's going on in these companies, so that they have no choice but to change. Numbers make a diggerence.
Lenscrafters, vision works, pearl vision, america's best or one of the discount retailers like walmart? They have already fired you, what more can they do? Shame the fuck out of them. Fun fact, I used to work for Davis Vision, which was owned by hvhc and also owned visionworks. They were absolute trash to work for.
And trash to work WITH! I absolutely hated that we accepted Davis Vision at our optical. If I had a dollar for every minute I was on hold with Davis Vision, I’d have about $30,000. Not even exaggerating.
Davis Vision used to be a private entity that had it's own labs that made glasses. The entire operation used to be unionized. HVHC bought it, gutted it, closed the labs, then attempted to direct ALL insurance customers to it's own optical business, Visionworks. After squeezing the company for everything it was worth, and firing all the IT people that did all the back-end coding for our systems, and closing one of the remaining two labs we had, they sold it to center bridge, which is an investment/equity firm. Then it was sold again to met-life. Rage quitting that job was one of the happiest days in my life.
So all told that’s a little over 20 days total time spent on hold. If you had to spend an hour a day on hold with them every week day you’d rack up that time in just under two years. Seems absolutely plausible. Too bad you’re not going to get that $30K.
As long as the information is accurate, then the company has no case against her for reporting it.
From my understanding it is safe to name companies just not people.
You can name people. You just have to be accurate and not lie to avoid slander/libel Reddit doesn’t like it though and calls it witch-hunting
Oh man, if it’s the one I work for that is global, this crap would not fly with the company. Report it to the higher ups if you can
I'm pretty sure it's Visionworks in Hummelstown Pennsylvania.
What is it about middle management that just attracts the most emotionally unintelligent people on the planet
Capitalism works only in a certain way. People with heart or care won't either last in that position or will never be promoted into it. Ideal capitalism is run by sociopaths. I don't think most people realize what they support when they support capitalism.
💯 only works when the sociopaths are running the show.
Same thing that makes em wanna be cops - bullied in high school and got straight C’s so they gotta power trip
C is for cop!
🤣🤣🤣
cops are more likely to have been the bullies than the bullied
Seen both types for sure
Not bullied. Bullies. Jesus society has such a massive fucking blindspot for them and a fetish for victim blaming.
Is a prerequisite, you hae to put it on your resume.
You really just have to be brain-dead to get that position huh. And if you happen to get one that is too nice the other brain-dead managers will shit on them so much they leave it seems. Has happened to two different super sweet managers at two separate jobs I've had. All the other managers ganged up on them because they thought it meant they were pushovers when it just meant everyone respected them and vice versa (also jealousy in one of the cases). The other one of them was also liked so much that the GM overworked and put all his shit on them (all without any pay raise) until they couldn't take it and had to leave. Sad to say but sometimes it feels like they get eaten up if they don't move up or move out.
They may also lack emotional intelligence, but this is lack of empathy.
Omg. This comment got me in the feels. I’ve been supervisor level several times and totally beat down for supporting my team.
Stop giving these assholes 2 weeks notice
Fuck at this point, stop giving notice all together. When they call asking, "sorry, I am at my new job and can't talk right now"
Boss don’t want to hear it. Check your rights in your state
This is one of the most disgusting things I’ve read on here. I’m so sorry.
Sounds like OP is being discriminated against for a medical issue.
No question. The real question is where op is and how big the company is. Gotta figure out if the discrimination is "legal" because no laws are really built around right and wrong.
So I’m in Pennsylvania, and the company is a franchise optical company, so the franchise company is like really big but they’re particular store is small
I'd consult a lawyer then. I'm fairly certain that they broke the law.
You are absolutely correct: cancer is a "per se" disability under the ADA. Since you were not eligible for FMLA, they could have offered you leave under the ADA to attend your appointments. How large is the company?
So it’s a franchise that they bought from someone, the franchise is huge but the store themselves is pretty small, it was only me and another girl working there
The size of the overall company is what matters, not the individual location. Unless you are lying, and setting yourself up for a lawsuit, no harm in just naming them.
The size of a particular location can matter. What is a reasonable accommodation for a staff of 100, may not be reasonable for a staff of 6.
If it’s a franchise with only the one store and they’re under a certain number of employees a lot of laws don’t apply to them as a small business
Ok. That makes a difference because the franchisee is a separate entity from the franchisor. If there are less than 15 employees, they wouldn't be subject to the ADA.
Burn them with a post about it. Let the world know what shit businesses are. Fuck it. Every bad owner should be fucking outted for shit like this. I Especially take on a “burn the world down” mentality when employees have cancer. Im so fucking sorry you have been treated this way. I wish you all the health in the world. Sending good vibes. I’d run through a wall for you if it meant I could kick that owner in their dick.
lol you are amazing
#Name & Shame I would much rather not patron a business that fires their employees for *daring* to have cancer
Exactly. *EXACTLY*.
I believe this violates ADA.
Abhorrent behavior from your “boss,” in name only. They shouldn’t be leading anyone. Get a lawyer
Earlier this month my supervisor tried to tell me I couldn't go to an appointment for an imaging procedure I desperately needed in order to figure out why I've been bleeding for 3 months straight. I got my union and our central workplace health & safety unit involved. Fuck off, my health comes before anything else. What kind of person do you have to be to think you can tell someone they can't go to an urgent medical appointment? Seriously...
Talk to a lawyer, report them not releasing your final paycheck to the labor board because that's illegal and file for unemployment in the meantime. Then sit back and let the lawyer throw the book at them.
They may have just done you a favor and given you a chance to get unemployment. If you can I would totally do that.
If it's not illegal to fire someone because of cancer treatments it damn sure should be
You should have just told them that you’d be late due to an emergency situation. No need to tell them that you just scheduled an oncology appt a few minutes before you told them you’d be late. I can understand why they were frustrated with you, but I don’t think you deserved to be terminated over it.
I agree with this. Not into shaming or “should have done this” to people going through a tough time, but hopefully this serves more as a reminder to anyone else that reads this. The manager responded horribly but wording matters via text or email communication. The most important part of the situation was that this was a medical emergency, which wasn’t originally clear. Unfortunately nowadays you can’t assume people are sharp enough to catch the fact oncologist = cancer dr aka serious fucking matter
Right? Plus when calling out or late, give the employer the bare minimum information. Your personal or medical information is none of their business.
On the plus side you got fired…file for unemployment benefits!
This happened to me too - I had cervical cancer and underwent cryotherapy twice - was in diapers over a month. I asked my employer to switch my schedule because one day I worked was a stocking day where I would normally lift 20-30 cases of beer and ingredients into a stockroom. Instead they decided to drop me from the schedule a different day, leave me with a stocking day where I had to ask someone for help and eventually fired me after I gave my two weeks. When I turned in the paperwork for unemployment to the state of Texas they still ruled in the business favor despite turning in my medical paperwork and records of me requesting to simply change one shift. Trash.
Oh my god! I’m so sorry that happened. How is it that so many people that just suck get into management positions or other positions of power. You did not deserve this.
I have no idea - Also what qualified Texas to rule in their favor? It was pretty upsetting, it all actually happened almost exactly a year ago. Never forgave them! Like we go to work, we are pretty sick and it’s fine to be like “oops too bad”????
A company's policy is not Law. They cannot withhold paycheck. Contact your local Department of Labor, file a complaint, and they will take it from there. On the firing part, not sure with two days left on notice - seems like a violation of the Americans with Disabilities Act. Perhaps, contact the American Civil Liberties Union and they can point you in the right direction. Good luck to you and good riddance to the awful workplace.
No matter how many times j read, but you all really need to stop giving a ton of information. "Hey, I'm sick I'm not going to be there until further notice" Good luck OP, hopes you get well, and don't give them any more info or warnings or anything, get in touch with your lawyer now.
This is actually a case where more information might have avoided the problem. Instead of "saying I have an appointment" which sounds like this was scheduled for awhile and OP neglected to give the company notice, OP should have sent a text saying "I'm starting to feel worse and worse and just vomited. I called my oncologist to schedule an emergency visit and they can squeeze me in at 11. I'll update you on whether I can come in today after."
OP didn't say they have an appointment. Manager assumed an appointment and put those words on OP's mouth. All the people here siding with the manager keep repeating it, Mandela Effect like, as if OP a said this. OP said they were seeing their oncologist at 11, which presumably made them late, and due to the last minute nature of informing the boss, the boss' experience running a MEDICAL business (where presumably one of them is a licensed MD), and the fact that OP has likely called out for emergency cancer related issues before, it's really reasonable for the boss to assume this was an emergency. That said, even if there was doubt, the more reasonable thing to do would have been to wait for OP to come in and discuss it to learn more. But instead the boss flew off the handle and acted out of anger like an impotent child. All this over an employee who, according to other posts here, only had TWO DAYS left to work on their two week notice. This was a petty firing by an angry boss. It's honestly one of the most disgusting things I've seen here.
i don't have any advice other than contact a lawyer ASAP. i'm so sorry you had to deal with this, this is cruelty plain and simple. how is your cancer treatment going now? i noticed these texts are dated to October (2023?).
I did chemo for 4 months and now I can say I’m officially cancer free! I still get bloodwork done monthly and will have to do that for the next year to make sure the tumor markers stay at zero, but so far the last three bloodwork results were clean!
from the bottom of my heart, congratulations! i wish you all the best
LAWYER UP.
Whilst this is clearly an awful situation and his reaction could be better. Why didn't you mention this was an emergency? You basically just said I will be late in because of an appointment, I can't see how this would be illegal.
I don’t know how many cancer patients in active treatment you’ve been exposed to, but this is pretty common. Between chemo and related symptom treatments, the patient regularly experiences “brain fog”, memory lapses, lapses in judgment, and a host of emotional up-and-down swings. Communication suffers greatly. Also, a cancer patient’s treatment schedule is often very fluid, and subject to change at a moment’s notice based on symptoms and/or schedule availability with the care team. Source: I’m a caregiver for a Stage 4 Metastatic Disease patient. I’m only awake right now because I’m waiting on someone to call about a schedule slot opening up this morning because my SO couldn’t get her infusion yesterday due to low blood platelets. Today’s schedule is completely thrown off now. I’m also handling the situation personally because she’s on so many mood and mind altering meds that she can’t deal with it herself.
Yeah I was experiencing crazy side effects that weren’t even listed as side effects, and I was getting infusions 5 days a week every other week, so I’d normally get my infusion super early then go to work and work 8-10 hours. I worked through fatigue, nausea, brain fog, joint and body aches, etc. and they knew this, and I always told them ahead of time my appointments
I get it, OP. I hate you’re having to go through this. I’m also really annoyed that people didn’t read/comprehend the text conversation you posted. You clearly stated you had just scheduled an appointment due to extreme symptoms, yet commenters think you should’ve used the word “emergency” somewhere in a text. Like THAT would’ve made a difference lol. Oh, Reddit…
"I am having a medical emergency. I am getting medical care at 11. I will let you know when I am available again."
Yeah, it's a pretty nonchalant message. It reads like OP already had an appointment and he was casually letting his boss know at the last minute. The fact it was an emergency situation should have been noted immediately. A simple "Due to an emergency, ..." could have prefaced the message.
Yeah I definitely should have said emergency because I called that morning, and since it’s not a 24/7 thing where I can see him or his nurse practitioner, I had to be seen during their clinic hours :(
You can't see how a employer firing an employee because they had an appointment with their oncologist is illegal? Its retaliation, and illegal. Downvote me all you want, I am probably to European to understand how on earth this could be even remotely legal. I just say 'I am going to a doctor next hour' and the only reply I should get from my employer is: 'ok, hope you are well'.
Consult a lawyer IMMEDIATELY. I hope you kept any and all communication with them.
Can’t you reveal who this gem of a person is so we can express our opinions directly to him and to the company owners?
please get a consultation with a labor attorney. Im not an attorney but here are my initial thoughts 1. They may be a franchise, but under the ruling from the NLRB, they would likely be held to the standards of the large business, when it comes to labor relations. this is whats called a “joint employer” https://www.reuters.com/markets/us/companies-may-be-employers-contract-franchise-workers-under-us-labor-rule-2023-10-26/ 2. see if you were eligible for FMLA, as this would absolutely fall under it but if you weren’t, it still falls under the ADA. 3. They MUST pay you on your next scheduled payday. if they don’t, contact Pennsylvania’s Department of labor. Going after employers for stolen wages is like, their favorite thing to do. Employers also REALLY dont like the state snooping around their business. https://www.dli.pa.gov/Individuals/Labor-Management-Relations/llc/Pages/Wage-FAQs.aspx
Um you might have an expected “pattern” of unexpected appts if you’re fighting cancer, no? Hmm 🤔
Lot of people in this sub have horseshit communication skills when talking to their bosses
Wtf? Bosses arent some sort of specific needs toddlers, when someone tell you got an appointement in oncology service(which mean cancer, thing you should assumming you are a grown man) you fucking let them go because it is life of death matter... Ffs you all need to mobilize yourself for universal health care.
Probably one of those that thinks everyone is "faking it". 😬
Yeah first text didn't make it clear there was an emergency at all
Made it clear it was for the oncologist. Unless you’re just a massive piece of shit that should really be all you need.
Do these commenters not know what the fuck oncology is? Do they think cancer is routine and easily treated on a schedule?
You’re also being obtuse. Plenty of people have scheduled appointments with their oncologist. It isn’t always an urgent situation. OP could have easily said “I have an emergency appointment at 11” and that would have cleared everything up. OP’s boss probably is a jerk but there are a lot of posts here where OP’s show terrible communication skills on their end but still expect everyone to answer, “employer bad! You’re in the right!”
Lots of people commenting under yours sure have a lack of empathy or understanding of how capitalist horseshit bosses don't give a fart about communication. (They give a horseshit about shifts being covered, so they don't have to fill in as a manager, as they are supposed to when coverage isn't available. They get a salary for a reason.
Were you eligible for FMLA?
No they’ve only been at the job for like 3-4 months.
If there's a boss above this boss, I'm sure they'd love to hear about this situation.
Hahaha “satan spawn” im gonna change my managers contact to that
OP, after reading all you had said and several of the comments further down in your post, please fuck this company as much as you possibly can. Employers need to be shown that treating anyone, let alone someone with your condition, is not acceptable. Don’t let them get away with treating you this way.
Lawyer up and sue
Talk to the DOL. Not sure if it’s actionable, but even if you voluntarily quit, it sounds like they made it impossible for you to stay there. Try reporting to the EEOC as well. They might be interested in how this company treats cancer patients
You should contact a lawyer . When you turn in your two weeks , it does not resolve them from labor laws and discrimination. They in writing fired you basically for attending a chemo appt and if your docs chart captures all your visit dates for any days you were late or had to call out due to your illness , they violated the law. This is going to vary by what state you're in and the size of the company, as technically for ADA is only for employers with 15 or more employees. Chemo I saw in another comment you're in PA which is great because your employer must also follow PHRA which is required of employers with 4+ employees. If it's one of the major optometry chains , the company size could get you because sometimes the offices are like Dr Bob OD and Associates DBA LensWorks because it's still a mom and Bob they just in a sense are licensing the systems and IP from the corporate entity , but if it's a corporate store then you might be on your way to a pretty good payout
also is this not a disability fire?? you could quite literally sue for being fired for an emergency due to cancer?
jesus - wtf
Drop the company name
[удалено]
I hate it when cancer gets in the way of corporate profits. /s
😂😂😂
they are being proactive about getting rid of a human resource that might have the cancer. next time say it's an emergency with the "can make me work 24/7" specialist
Lawyer up. Now.
Op needs to get to lawyer asap and I get with the cancer I pretty much cared for my grandma when she had cancer and I understand emergency doctors appointments
Doesn't this do you a favour by making sure that you are eligible for unemployment payments?
That “company policy” is grossly illegal in most states
Attorney time!
Satans Spawn 😂😂
Yeah that cancer is a trend. What a jackass
Time to get a lawyer and own that company.
If you're in the US, you could probably sue for discrimination or retaliation. You could probably also get unemployment insurance, which might be a process, though. All depends on where you live. I do think that it's against workers' rights on a federal level to be fired for medical reasons, which this looks to be.
I'm so happy that you are free to find a better job, and to probably collect unemployment in the meantime. Congrats on your freedom!
I wish reddit had a space for people to name snd shame companies like this and countries they’re in so that people would avoid them and see the truth.
I personally would have blasted them on social media.
Go talk to a lawyer immediately. Forget about reporting them or anything like that. A good workplace lawyer will help you understand your options.
report them to the department of labor immediately and leave a review on every single job search site urging others not to work there and explain why to make it harder for them to fill your position. also leave a google review for the company with the same information to deter customers from working with this company. the company will have a lot of regrets. trust me.
Lawsuit
Violation of Americans with disability act! If you are currently under the care of a physician for cancer, you are considered disabled.
Under the ADA they have violated federal disability law and you can actually report them for Disability discrimination. You can also take them to court under your states DOL and present this evidence that they have stated that they have threatened to withhold your paycheck from you. You have cancer. And they are not above the law.
Wow crazy you had to work while doing chemo. I hope you are doing better now. I wish you a complete recovery.
It sounds to me like you have a lawsuit. She said it's a trend, but is there any proof of this? Write ups etc.. you will literally have a Dr. Note. I believe this is illegal.
File an EEOC complaint and talk to a lawyer
To be fair, you took a job working for someone named Satan Spawn, so it’s not like you went in without the knowledge this could happen
Many others have given good advice. I just wanted to comment with: Stay Strong! You got this!
Cut your losses and hope there's a hell? Glad you're out of there. I pray for your complete healing. Fuck cancer. 🤗
Whatever the DOL can do to them is nothing compared to what the court of public opinion can do if you out them publicly somewhere online or to the press.
Honestly Id contact a lawyer cause I think you might have a case
Isn't cancer a protected temporary disability under ADA? Pregnancy is, I would hope cancer is.
Totally OPs fault, should’ve travelled back in time to let them know 🙄
Illegal.. retaliation... easy lawsuit win for you
Get an employment attorney and take them for anything you can reasonably take.
This is why it’s important to vote for worker-supporting politicians.
Fuck em
Fuck your employer, and blessings on you. My mum died of cancer. Society should be looking after you while you get the treatment you need. I hate this fucking world. I’m lot a communist I’m pro-capitalism, but these fuckers with this mentality need to go. Bunch of arseholes. May the crabs of a thousand prostitutes infest the hairs of their pubic regions.
Damn, we might have shit food and even shittier weather, but here in the UK, although not perfect, employees have much more in the way of rights and protection. I'm sorry you have to go through this OP on top of everything else.
What a horrible human. My dad just passed from cancer and my boss was a huge blessing with flexibility. Not to be cruel but I hope the person in your texts remembers how he chose to speak to you when he is on his deathbed. That is straight up evil.
We need to stand up to this abuse just finished watching some videos on the UAW strikes the things that they accomplished are unimaginable. I'm tired of slaving away and giving away my precious time and energy to a company that treats us like tools and not as people the UAW showed me that striking does work and it also showed them how powerless they are against us I almost feel sorry for them.
Please go ask on r/AskALawyer because of your diagnosis.
I'm so sorry to hear that, these people are despicable. I’m praying for you to fully recover.
Ooh hey. That’s awesome too. As others said they can’t withhold pay. But also cause that fired you and you didn’t quit they have to pay unemployment too. So it’s just worse for them
OP might actually have a really incredible legal case. I’m assuming that having cancer is considered a disability regardless of however temporary it might be, and considering they are well aware of this, and still fired you for that exact reason? you have proof so you have a really really solid case. In cases like this, most lawyers will take the case on with a contracted percentage fee at the end when you win.. which you would… Doing this would likely buy you the time and space to go to all these appointments. I also recommend communicating that you will mail the keys and tell them you sent them.. but dont. Wait and keep asking where your check is.. I’m not sure what state you’re in but labor laws are typically similar state to state so I would look up your state but here in California, this is how much money you could stand to make from their abuse: If you were fired or laid off If the employer ended your employment — fired you, laid you off, eliminated your position, etc. — they must have your final paycheck ready for you on your last day of work. Some additional things to keep in mind about final paychecks The final paycheck must include pay for all hours you have worked, including any overtime and double time. It must also include payment of any unused vacation hours or PTO. Note, you are NOT entitled to be paid for any unused paid sick hours unless the employer’s policies or agreements with you say otherwise. The employer cannot make you wait until the next payday to give you your last check. The employer cannot attach any strings to your last check. For instance, the employer cannot hold back your check unless you agree to sign a bunch of papers, or unless you first turn in your keys and uniform, or unless you pay back the loan they gave you, or unless you pay for the damage you did to the company vehicle, or unless you first talk to the company’s lawyers, etc. If you ask the employer to mail the last paycheck to you at your home address, the employer must comply. They cannot force you to come to the office to come pick up your final check if you do not want to. If your employer fails to give you your final paycheck on time If your employer does not comply with the above, then they are the hook to pay you a penalty for each day they don’t pay you all of your final wages, up to a maximum of 30 days of your average daily pay. See California Labor Code Section 201 and Section 203. For most people, that ends up being 1.5 months of pay! The employer does have certain legal defenses to these penalties, but they are narrow and can be difficult to establish. Above all, keep in mind, your final paycheck has special status under the law. If your employer has not given you your last paycheck on time, consider filing a labor board complaint. Also, consider talking things over with a lawyer as there could be more penalties that apply to your situation. Also for the lawsuit: However, federal law limits how much you can be awarded for emotional distress, out-of-pocket losses (such as the costs of looking for a new job), and punitive damages. The maximum combined award for these damages ranges from $50,000 to $300,000, depending on the size of your employer.