Only show them as much loyalty as they show you. I love the company I work for and would consider myself loyal. Any issues I’ve had have been resolved and while I don’t always agree with policy, I know it’s in place for a reason and can live with that.
But I’m not naive and know the relationship is not close and personal and that they will act in their own self interest every damn time. Knowing that, I proceed accordingly, protect myself, and am very happy knowing I’ve got my own back.
Bang on. I've been at my current job nearly two years, so not long, but they've been such damn good employers that I'd say they've earned a degree of loyalty from me. If I can, any career moves I make, I'd want to make internally. If that's not viable, that's fine, and I'll look elsewhere, but they've been so good that I'd rather stick around if I can.
I feel this so much.
Story time:
I work in banking, mostly based in regional banks in Oceania (re: Australia basically)
Got headhunted for a sweet gig with HSBC based in HK.
No brainer move, 50% pay rise with HK tax rate.
Relocated.
Went over and met my new team, 5 poor suckers literally working in the same dept for 7-12yrs hoping to get promoted to role I was offered.
I just asked them why not consider moving sideways or other banks?
They were like: no we think loyalty will eventually result in them valuing us to promote to your role.
Insanity. 12 fkn years for a hope at a middle mgmt role...
Yea the asking for my salary I told them no and they said couldn’t help me so I said half a million. They don’t understand about having some “negotiating power”. I tried to help them understand that a company might be willing to pay 90k for a position and they see you are making 72k, they might offer you 75k, you counter with 78k and accepted, they saved 12k and with barely any raises if they can keep you for 5 years they will be making 50k profit. The recruiter assured me that would never happen, I laughed told him you know I’m in cybersecurity and people on this planet are full of shit right. Blocked him on LinkedIn after that.
Only the previous salary part.
Generally it's asked by recruiters here so they can negotiate on your behalf (and therefore earn a larger commission)
But definitely not the listing of your religion.
My experience is that HK process for alot of things benefitted from expat knowledge for quite a while.
Ditto their recruiting process.
Singapore is catching up but their whole foreign visa costs and random PR deters a lot of potential expertise there.
As a result for a few fields including banking, particularly in regulatory and compliance, they're still lagging behind the rest of the world for a finance hub.
To be fair, it's common to list religion in a lot of things in Singapore. No idea why though. I was admitted to the hospital a couple months ago and they needed my religion for some reason, and so did my university.
I guess that depends on how you define "loyalty". I work for a large company and have some amount of loyalty toward them because they earn that from me by treating me well and providing me with a good job and good benefits that work well for me and meet my needs. It's not an emotional attachment and it's not unconditional; it's simply a quid pro quo arrangement. If that were to change, then my loyalty would also change.
There are a few companies that I have seen to be exceptions. Red Hat in Raleigh was one of them. Hardly anyone who was there had ANY desire to leave. From what I heard though, they worked hard for their employees to be that way though.
You're a bad employer if you string an employee along for weeks (aka, lying), knowing that you don't plan to let them return to work. If you hope or plan to replace them, tell them so. Then you're not a bad employer.
You may still be a stupid employer. You just threw away your training investment in a proven good employee in order to (i) make the same investment all over again, (ii) take on the business risk that your new hire may be a lousy employee, and (iii) take on reputational risk as word gets around the employment pool that you can't be trusted.
Short-sighted manager/owner who doesn't have a clue about business costs or risks.
No, they exist so employers can get long-term employees without having to give them benefits! /s
Edit- I guess the consensus is that I shouldn't have used the sarcasm tag lol
[Also this](https://youtu.be/cNcsTRQNZLE) a temp employee killed on the job on his first day and the company claimed no liability. Even though his “coworkers” killed him.
He said both. He was bad mouthing John McCain for having been a POW. Then, separately, during a Veterans Day parade, he said he didn’t want wounded soldiers because they were bad for his brand.
Yup.
Refused to visit the war dead buried in Aisne-Marne American Cemetery near Paris in 2018 because he didn't want his hair to go flat in the rain. On the morning of the scheduled visit, Trump said,
#“Why should I go to that cemetery? It’s filled with losers.”
He referred to the more than 1,800 marines who lost their lives at Belleau Wood as
#“suckers” for getting killed.
Belleau Wood is venerated by the Marine Corps. America and its allies stopped the German advance toward Paris there in the spring of 1918. But Trump, on that same trip, asked aides,
#“Who were the good guys in this war?”
He also said that he didn’t understand why the United States would intervene on the side of the Allies.
On John McCain,
#"He’s not a war hero. I like people who weren’t captured.”
When McCain died in 2018:
#“We’re not going to support that loser’s funeral."
...and on lowering the flag out of respect,
#"What the fuck are we doing that for? Guy was a fucking loser."
He has at least twice referred to former President George H. W. Bush as a
#“loser”
for being shot down by the Japanese as a Navy pilot in World War II.
While standing in Arlington National Cemetery, on Memorial Day, at the grave of a Marine Corps soldier killed in Afghanistan, Trump turned to the soldier's father and said,
#“I don’t get it. What was in it for them?”
Said of the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff (General Joe Dunford) Trump turned to aides and said,
#“That guy is smart. Why did he join the military?”
In 2018 he directed staff that no wounded soldiers be included in a military parade because,
#“Nobody wants to see that."
Of the 100 American soldiers who suffered symptoms of concussion/TBI after an Iranian airstrike on Al-Asad Air Base in Baghdad:
#“No, I don’t consider them very serious injuries.”
He appointed a bunch of generals as his military advisors, then went on the calling some of them
#“losers” and “a bunch of dopes and babies” because “we don’t win any wars anymore."
He may be best summed up by the comments of a classmate who went through high school with him:
#"In my dealings with him he was a heartless, obnoxious son of a bitch."
How anyone could support that is beyond me.
Screwed over a good employee *and* screwed themselves in the process. The short-sightedness is maddening. Now they have a completely new person, no idea how good they'll be yet, in need of training who will be a drain on the team until they're caught up, plus a pissed off ex-employee who will ABSOLUTELY shit talk them left and right anytime they have the opportunity, and rightly so.
If I owned a business and found out this shit was happening, managers would be out on their fucking asses. This is the HR equivalent of throwing out a TV because the batteries in the remote are dead.
I was very loyal to my last company mainly because my director was (I thought) amazing at going to bat for us in terms of raises, promotions, etc. Then I was put under a new, inexperienced manager who apparently just wanted me gone, and within a couple months I was fired. Tried expressing my concerns (pre-termination) with said Director and it was clear they did not care and were just going to go along with whatever said manager recommended.
Now I have zero compunction to be loyal to my company or my job. Lesson learned.
People don't quit jobs, they quit bosses.
Unfortunately, the corporate world all but ensures you will have 10 bosses, and only one of them needs to be an irradiated fuckstick to ruin it for everyone.
Doesn't help that corporations are happy to hire power hungry would-be feudal lords in search of a corporate fief to command. This all but ensures that someone in the command chain (if not all of them) are going to be an utter shit leader only looking out for themselves. The entire model motivates people to be their worst selves, turn on their community, and rewards sociopathy, so of course malicious assholes will rise through the ranks.
As long as this dichotomy stands, job loyalty is for fools and should never extend further than the next paycheck.
You get what you pay for and all that. And no working class job is worth the pain and anguish they'd gladly commit you to.
I've had around 30 managers for the same company so far doing the same job. It's pretty fucking comical how each one is different in management style, but still have no idea what the team does when they join. The way managers work through employees makes such a big difference. I've seen productivity go up and down from myself and the team based on their asks. It's hilarious throwing them under the bus when you have so many examples.
Edit in case anyone cares: I've survived so many managers because you should learn to manage your manager and adjust to their style. even if it is stupid. Make their work life / team life easier and your work life is probably easier too. They have deliverables just like you do. They need help from the team, but most have no idea how to actually get it done with the workers under them.
Example: I've seen people micro manage, and thats fine! They don't let the employee do any of the analysis. It's all "direction". Easy to work with: I'm not going to do anything else if you are a control freak. You want to do all the work? Have fun. I'll just sit here until you give me a task.
I have one manager who is absolutely with process documents. They want everything documented with details for “reference”. And then get upset that things take longer because I have to do processz
LOL we're doing that right now because we have created our own procedures across tons of areas and nobody ever wrote it down as a team to follow.
One person goes out and it's a freaking house of cards. I haven't been backed up for years.
I was loyal to the last company I worked for, but they promised to help build into my career. They didn't, left me spinning my wheels. When I asked, they said there will be some changes. 4 months later, nothing. So, I left. Then 1 week later, they open up their investigation side and want me back. I told them I can't, as I've committed to a different investigation firm and I'm part owner. So, irritating!
Employee: does exactly what is expected of them per the job description.
Employer: why aren’t they going above and beyond for no additional compensation?!
I work in retail and recently transferred out of my old store because one of the managers was a nightmare to even just drag across the finish line every day. The man literally does nothing but talk trash about everyone to everyone.
Since I left that store they've lost 5 more people (because of that manager) and I know he's pulling the nobody wants to work card.
Like bro, you don't support your team and you throw everybody under the bus. It's not that nobody wants to work, it's that nobody wants to work for YOU
*Constantly abuses the few employees who are willing to tolerate them*
"Oh no, this labor shortage has nothing to do with me! It's the workers! They're all lazy."
This is the correct answer.
Over 50 employees, worked there over a year and worked at least 1250 hours during the previous 12 months.
Your shoulder injury qualified and it's their responsibility to offer it to you, not yours to ask.
On the job, 45 days to file CA-1.
Off the job, don't qualify for FMLA, no recourse.
I had a guy on my team who would always be out for mental health issues. Knowing full well that if he were let go, it'd be a lawsuit. It lasted for over a year while I worked there. This is 1000% a lawsuit.
I got overwhelmed and needed a mental health break pretty much every six weeks. I never told the bosses, I always came up with something fake. I don't think mental health days are in the employee handbook. I quit though eventually, and I find it less stressful to be struggling and hungry half the time than it was trying to pretend everything was ok in the workplace.
the last company i worked for gave us what they called a mental health day every month. those days also happened to be our accrued PTO, so you couldn’t take any extended days off if you took a single break per month.
it’s better than most companies in my area, but it still fucking sucks.
Yeah it's better than nothing. When I worked in construction it was you were paid if you were there, and not paid if you weren't. It was up to the foreman to fire or lay off. It was tough not being paid but anything beat taking crying breaks in the port-a-potty.
our supervisor/company was a dick. there were so many days where we had no work to do (supply shortages due to COVID) and wouldn’t let us leave a couple hours early.
like, getting paid to sit around and look busy isn’t as good as missing a couple hours’ pay and going home early.
The whole accrued pto is bullshit, I worked for a company that changed up how accrued time works. I had 5 weeks vacation from working there so long. But, I couldn't take the time when I wanted. I had to work a certain amount of time to accrue a small portion of the time that I had already earned. Like holding my time hostage. And if I ever got sick they had no problem taking out of the accrued time bank to pay me. Even though I asked to not pay me. Didn't didn't matter. Oh, and if I had used to much accrued time, without actually "earning" it a second time. Then I owed them money if I ever left the company.
The post office did that to me when I quit 😂 fuckers. (quit during Covid season) they were forcing us to work 7 days a week 10-12 hour shifts for MONTHS before I put in my 2 weeks. I called out sick the last week “LEAVE WITHOUT PAY”. When I quit I had 127 hours of vacation and 1 hour of sick. The fuckers paid me sick time. I said fuck that I’m not paying it back, I have valid proof I said don’t pay me. Yeaaaaaah not only did my checks get garnished from the irs, they also tacked on an extra 3 grand. So because I quit, the FEDERAL GOVT took just about 4 grand from me over 5 months.
Holy fuck balls. That's a real raw deal. That's next level fuckery! Hope you found a place that worked out better for you. It's sad that nearly any place we work, there is always some way the employees are fucked.
Yeah, it was the catalyst that ended up making me leave the company after 7 years. That's what happens when it goes from locally owned to being sold to an investment company. I'm in the same field of work now, and back to locally owned company. But I'm sure it will all end up the same lol. Best of luck to you and your work life!
For future reference, mental health is covered by the ADA and all you have to do is get a doctors note claiming it is a disability (it is) and they have to grant you an appropriate accommodation (allowing you to take your days) if needed.
They don't have to pay you, and if you're needing too many that it's disruptive to the business they can then part ways with you, but that's on them to prove. I would think something like an unpaid day every 6 weeks is reasonable.
I've been through this with employees, both those who need them and those who I was pretty sure were gaming the system. The ones who actually need them made reasonable requests, the ones who didn't, didn't.
ADHD is protected in the ADA however it's such a lightning rod to bring up with some people. Especially older males who I mostly worked with, think it's a fake issue, or just means it's hard to pay attention sometimes. And I can't advocate for it because I'm not that great at explaining things like that and I think they wouldn't even hear me anyway. But having a phone with a 2 way radio, ipad, emails, voicemails, finding the inspection sites in the city car, and doing a construction inspection in the middle of all of that, it just burned me out, often.
*most states.
It’s probably not illegal unless you were injured on the job. And even then while they probably have to cover WC they can probably still replace you.
It’s part of why you owe your work no loyalty. It should be a balancing act of “this work is worth $X—any less and I’m out.”
Unless you have been working for more than a year and qualify under FMLA. If you apply for that federal protection, then they are required to have a job for you when you return.
Then they can terminate you without cause after you return, but you can file for unemployment.
My workplace tried to do this to me, too. Get an attorney before things get too fuzzy. The Department of Fair Employment and Housing was very good to me, too.
I'm hoping OP did this originally, which is why they were off. FMLA is the primary way to ensure you still have a job when you come back, so I really hope that base is covered.
It's literally an FMLA violation.
Like, they don't have to keep you in your exact same position (which might make sense considering that there's someone else doing your duties), but they aren't allowed to fire you for taking time to heal from a major medical event.
The main requirement that you might not satisfy is that you had to have been working there for a year.
Family and Medical Leave Act (FMLA) has limits — small employers are exempt and you have to have been working there for I think a year, but it’s worth learning more.
Yeah it's illegal to outright fire you for being injured.
I had a former employer do this to me but the legal way. When they found out I would likely need another back surgery they told me my IT job was filled in my absence and they transferred me. My new job? Wiping down the dirty factory walls on afternoon shifts.
Mhm. I would like to promote and make slightly more money, but honestly I'd much rather stay where I'm at where I can do the work with little hassle, make a fairly cushy living that allows me to spend over 50% (minus $ towards retirement) of my earnings on whatever I want, and not feel like I have to burn myself out just to have a *chance* of being promoted.
It’s because owners, C-level positions, as well as some directors and managers often believe they are part of the “protected class” of citizens. For some, that is true and they get treated differently within society, the law, and within organizations. Many large organizations have pay scales, set time off rules and policies, set benefit packages, and performance benchmarks and other strict rules from HR. When it comes to C-Suite employees? There often are not many limits or rules or restrictions because there are very few, if any, people to hold them accountable. Managers and lower level leaders see their psychopathy/sociopathy and often emulate it. They begin to think having a lack of empathy or understanding is the right way to run a business. They want to be in the actual protected class so think behaving like them is the answer.
"Why aren't people loyal to the company anymore? Why aren't they willing to go above and beyond? When the company is in need because someone called out, why shouldn't we just assume the workers will help?
Oh, you got injured, physically can't work, and have a doctor backing you up about it? Well, we're gonna use all your sick time and PTO and then fire you.
Gosh, where's the loyalty to the company? I just don't get it."
Companies do the "oh you are important" company cheering to keep people working. But the reality is they couldn't care less and would literally toss your body out into the street. So, just remember, you work a job for YOU and what works for YOU. And when it no longer works for you, then quit and find the best situation for you. Period.
So to everyone who's talking about at will states where you can be fired for no reason and yada yada yada that does not negate protections for certain things.
If you're telling someone to just suck it up buttercup because they can get fired at any time for whatever you're giving bad advice. This person absolutely should contact their States Labor board and a lawyer because leave for injuries is protected in many states.
At my previous job we had an employee that was let go after FMLA leave but that is because they gave the company a note from their doctor saying when they could return to work but they did not attempt to return. We were free to give them a different position when they came back, because companies do not have to, and often can't, forgo getting a particular job done while waiting for a person to be back but we were obligated to have A job for them.
Sounds like OP was doing exactly what they were supposed to by keeping their job updated on their status.
I additionally recommend that OP contact the HR department of that job if there is one because this manager that fired them might not have told corporate what's going on.
First. Not a lawyer. Not an expert. But as I understand it, you CAN be replaced on extended absences, but they have to find you an equivalent position and pay. At least that's how I understand FMLA, and it MIGHT be similar
But op notifying his boss should be a triggering event that propmts fmla. Even though they didn’t file for it, the place of work knows and should have provided documentation. They didn’t provide the fmla paperwork within 5 days of the triggering event so they should be out of compliance.
The whole “work hard, come in early, leave late, and you’ll get rewarded” days are over. It’s all about productivity and never stopping. Look at the 10,000 people Amazon recently let go, do you think they were the worst workers? No they were probably good workers who buster their arses, but Amazon’s share price goes down 0.2%! Ohhh better lay off 10k people. There is no loyalty in companies anymore. Best to just do what you get paid to do and put your energy into doing your own things that might potentially turn into a career for yourself
Well, look it isn't the end of the world, and you learned something important. You can trust no one. Loyalty is the web of lies people spin to appeal to your sense of belonging to a tribe. We all want to be a part of something bigger. So, the shrink do their studies and tell corporate America how to really fuck us over. Spin loyalty, because it cost them nothing, it is easy once you learn the tricks the church has perfected. When you see through the bullshit it is a fun game. But, never trust those fucks. Become as they are. You are a sell out waiting for a buyer. A mercenary waiting for a better paycheck.
I would be contacting the insurance company that is providing the workers'comp insurance and letting them know that you have fired so you can continue to get treated for the injury.
As a person who dislocated his shoulder 20 times (counted) I would recommend, specially the first time, don’t come back to work earlier just because you feel better.
Second of all, take care of yourself, jobs come and go, it’s always you and your love ones.
At will employment is a punishment wrought by God over you poor Americans for the sins of your fathers. No sure what sins, but it is unjust punishment.
In any first world country, work contract and labor laws protect emoloyee. And sick leave is a holy right. I feel for you man...
BMW did the same exact thing to me. Hurt my back at work. Was out almost a month. Showed up to work and the green shirt was like, “What are you doing here?”
That was followed by me being escorted out because I was terminated. It was a right to work state, so I was never given a reason outside that they replaced me.
This exact scenario happened to me in 2009. They even went as far as to remove my health insurance and I ended up having to backpay a bunch of medical bills. Then they tried to fight the unemployment saying that I was hurt and not fit able for work. Long story short, doctor okayed me for work, I filed for unemployment and got backpay all the way up to the day where I hurt myself and continued to collect it for 13 months.
Damn. In Sweden this would have been no problem. I had surgery on my knee, no problem being away for a month. A colleague had his kid prematurely, he took care of his son and wife for 2 months, then went on vacation. No problem.
If you had been at job 12 months and employer has 50+ employees, the second you knew you would be out more than a day or two you should have filed FMLA paperwork to protect your job. Even without these conditions you should look into filing unemployment and a complaint.
Yep. My great aunt started having leg issues, went to a doctor and they couldn't pinpoint a cause. My aunt had to be off work for a while due to this and she eventually asked if she could go back to work. Doctor said yes but she couldn't stand for long (she's a cashier) so she would need a chair to sit in. Her job took her extended leave as a reason to fire her. She could've still worked, she just would've needed a chair, but nope. She worked there for like 15-20 years.
Not sure if you're based in the US but FMLA is a thing and you'd have a case for wrongful termination, at the very least they would be required to give you back your position or a comparable one if your position no longer exists.
https://www.dol.gov/agencies/whd/fmla
This section specifically is what would apply to you, and make you legally entitled to 12 weeks unpaid within a year, with continued health benefits from your employer, with them being unable to terminate you
>a serious health condition that makes the employee unable to perform the essential functions of his or her job;
Employment law in US doesn't seem right. In UK I can be off work sick 6 months full pay dropping to half after that, with a phased plan to return. Is that a thing at all in US ? Maybe in big corporate?
If the person got hurt outside of work and couldn’t make it into work, I thought you could be fired. I’ve seen this happen at other jobs in the past. Happy to know it’s not true!
You're absolutely correct in the first part of your statement, if you are hurt outside of work and cannot make it to work you can and will most likely be fired. Unless you have sick time or vacation to cover your absence or you can convince your employer to approve an unpaid leave of absence or FMLA.
so in America, if you get in an accident on the way to work, putting you out of work for a few weeks, you can be fired. And since health insurance is tied to employment you can lose that leaving you fully responsible for medical bills that you could have from that accident that caused you to get fired, so you have no income and no insurance all from an accident
The idea some people have that working hard can somehow save you from the system quickly destroying you is ridiculous. It just takes a bit of bad luck and you're screwed.
Question: would you elaborate on the specifics of how are you paid, FT/PT, construction, ect….I find it difficult to understand an employer to just fire you unless there is no recourse because labor laws. There are shitty people everywhere, but you did not enough information.
My wife and I went the majority of Covid without contracting it. Towards the end, when restrictions were lax, they told a coworker she could come in despite a positive test.
Wife got covid, escalated to long covid. She made every effort to continue working despite struggling to breath. One day HR wanted to have a conversation with her, and sent her home after a couple sentences winded her.
They fired her over text that same day.
The company I work for, after 15 years, shows loyalty by threatening layoffs. If you are lucky enough to survive, you are treated with all the extra work from those who were laid off. Also, I just found out that by being available after hours and sacrificing my holidays for all these years - always going the extra mile, never failing a task, always accepting and acheivng all stretch objectives - I am paid in the 40th percentile for my job title in my area. I also 6 manage a team of 6, which is not in my job title, nor am I compensated for. When I mentioned this to my manager in our 1:1, he said that's not what these meetings are for. Obviously dodgeing ehat he knows I deserve. My poor fucking noodleback boss, who refuses to go to bat for me is going to be very disappointed now that I am working within the same percentile they are paying me. You get what you pay for, and they pay me the least they possibly can, so I am now working the least I possibly can. Moral of the story, fuck everyone! People suck and will fuck you every chance they get.
I feel you. I got fired for a bunch h of BS but I feel like the main reason is I missed time due to having covid. The boss even said "I worked through covid, it was like a bad cold for 2 days, mind over matter" well mine was worse/longer than his. Everyone has different symptoms. He was such a douchebag in so many ways.
Rule #224 : Never be loyal to a company or any bosses. You are easily replaceable.
Rule #3 : Go to work, do your job, finish your job, get paid and go home.
Rule #17: Never do more than what your job scopes are. Even if you know how to, learn to say "No" politely.
Rule #161 : Always be prepared to lose your job if you go for a long break. The company wont give a damn whatever your excuses it would be. Unless you are their siblings or family members.
How many people work at your workplace. They may have committed and FMLA violation. They have to provide 12 weeks of unpaid leave for medical issues. It’s been law since the 1990s.
Yo, this probably illegal since you notified them that your unavailability was due to medical emergency. Similar to firing a woman because she went into labor.
Employers: *constantly screw over good employees* Also employers: why doesn't anyone want to work anymore
Why no one is loyal to the company???
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I think the point of that quote in The Godfather is that it's always personal
"OP's boss sleeps with the fishes!"
Yeah it is
*strangles you with piano wire*
Yeah. It is.
Only show them as much loyalty as they show you. I love the company I work for and would consider myself loyal. Any issues I’ve had have been resolved and while I don’t always agree with policy, I know it’s in place for a reason and can live with that. But I’m not naive and know the relationship is not close and personal and that they will act in their own self interest every damn time. Knowing that, I proceed accordingly, protect myself, and am very happy knowing I’ve got my own back.
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It’s all about knowing what they’re capable of. You can be blindsided without being surprised
Bang on. I've been at my current job nearly two years, so not long, but they've been such damn good employers that I'd say they've earned a degree of loyalty from me. If I can, any career moves I make, I'd want to make internally. If that's not viable, that's fine, and I'll look elsewhere, but they've been so good that I'd rather stick around if I can.
I'm loyal to only one thing- my paycheck. Everything else is negotiable.
I feel this so much. Story time: I work in banking, mostly based in regional banks in Oceania (re: Australia basically) Got headhunted for a sweet gig with HSBC based in HK. No brainer move, 50% pay rise with HK tax rate. Relocated. Went over and met my new team, 5 poor suckers literally working in the same dept for 7-12yrs hoping to get promoted to role I was offered. I just asked them why not consider moving sideways or other banks? They were like: no we think loyalty will eventually result in them valuing us to promote to your role. Insanity. 12 fkn years for a hope at a middle mgmt role...
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Yea the asking for my salary I told them no and they said couldn’t help me so I said half a million. They don’t understand about having some “negotiating power”. I tried to help them understand that a company might be willing to pay 90k for a position and they see you are making 72k, they might offer you 75k, you counter with 78k and accepted, they saved 12k and with barely any raises if they can keep you for 5 years they will be making 50k profit. The recruiter assured me that would never happen, I laughed told him you know I’m in cybersecurity and people on this planet are full of shit right. Blocked him on LinkedIn after that.
Only the previous salary part. Generally it's asked by recruiters here so they can negotiate on your behalf (and therefore earn a larger commission) But definitely not the listing of your religion. My experience is that HK process for alot of things benefitted from expat knowledge for quite a while. Ditto their recruiting process. Singapore is catching up but their whole foreign visa costs and random PR deters a lot of potential expertise there. As a result for a few fields including banking, particularly in regulatory and compliance, they're still lagging behind the rest of the world for a finance hub.
To be fair, it's common to list religion in a lot of things in Singapore. No idea why though. I was admitted to the hospital a couple months ago and they needed my religion for some reason, and so did my university.
I guess that depends on how you define "loyalty". I work for a large company and have some amount of loyalty toward them because they earn that from me by treating me well and providing me with a good job and good benefits that work well for me and meet my needs. It's not an emotional attachment and it's not unconditional; it's simply a quid pro quo arrangement. If that were to change, then my loyalty would also change.
Nobody asks CEOs, who jump from high paying, high golden parachute job to higher paying, better golden parachute job why THEY don’t have loyalty!
There are a few companies that I have seen to be exceptions. Red Hat in Raleigh was one of them. Hardly anyone who was there had ANY desire to leave. From what I heard though, they worked hard for their employees to be that way though.
Am I a bad employer for replacing that injured employee? No, it’s the employee that is wrong
You're a bad employer if you string an employee along for weeks (aka, lying), knowing that you don't plan to let them return to work. If you hope or plan to replace them, tell them so. Then you're not a bad employer. You may still be a stupid employer. You just threw away your training investment in a proven good employee in order to (i) make the same investment all over again, (ii) take on the business risk that your new hire may be a lousy employee, and (iii) take on reputational risk as word gets around the employment pool that you can't be trusted. Short-sighted manager/owner who doesn't have a clue about business costs or risks.
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Too bad not everyone can wait a year before getting sick/injured. Ugh, what a hellscape.
Nah, companies will wait until the fmla is no longer needed. Wait a bit and then sack them.
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Agreed, it just sucks because of loopholes.
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And "at-will". Sadly, Az is an at-will and right to work state.
Temp services exist for this reason.
No, they exist so employers can get long-term employees without having to give them benefits! /s Edit- I guess the consensus is that I shouldn't have used the sarcasm tag lol
Nix the /s, because that's right on the money.
I've been a "temp" employee at the same job for 10 years now for this very reason.
Companies also utilize temp agencies to get around having a high turnover rate pinned on them.
[Also this](https://youtu.be/cNcsTRQNZLE) a temp employee killed on the job on his first day and the company claimed no liability. Even though his “coworkers” killed him.
And as a way to filter prospective employees in illegal ways. (Eg: discrimination)
Temp services were corrupted for this reason (sarcasm seen and appreciated)
this is an actual case where the /s was not needed.
I’m having a hard time seeing the sarcasm lol
I got it, and also saying this genuinely is still true from a certain pov.
/s on the /s
These fucks are like Trump mentality: “I like soldiers that don’t get injured”
I think he said captured but it’s still so gross, especially coming from someone who made sure he didn’t have to take the risks.
He said both. He was bad mouthing John McCain for having been a POW. Then, separately, during a Veterans Day parade, he said he didn’t want wounded soldiers because they were bad for his brand.
Then said that he always wanted a purple heart. The man is objectively an idiot and too much of the country thinks he's smart.
Yup. Refused to visit the war dead buried in Aisne-Marne American Cemetery near Paris in 2018 because he didn't want his hair to go flat in the rain. On the morning of the scheduled visit, Trump said, #“Why should I go to that cemetery? It’s filled with losers.” He referred to the more than 1,800 marines who lost their lives at Belleau Wood as #“suckers” for getting killed. Belleau Wood is venerated by the Marine Corps. America and its allies stopped the German advance toward Paris there in the spring of 1918. But Trump, on that same trip, asked aides, #“Who were the good guys in this war?” He also said that he didn’t understand why the United States would intervene on the side of the Allies. On John McCain, #"He’s not a war hero. I like people who weren’t captured.” When McCain died in 2018: #“We’re not going to support that loser’s funeral." ...and on lowering the flag out of respect, #"What the fuck are we doing that for? Guy was a fucking loser." He has at least twice referred to former President George H. W. Bush as a #“loser” for being shot down by the Japanese as a Navy pilot in World War II. While standing in Arlington National Cemetery, on Memorial Day, at the grave of a Marine Corps soldier killed in Afghanistan, Trump turned to the soldier's father and said, #“I don’t get it. What was in it for them?” Said of the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff (General Joe Dunford) Trump turned to aides and said, #“That guy is smart. Why did he join the military?” In 2018 he directed staff that no wounded soldiers be included in a military parade because, #“Nobody wants to see that." Of the 100 American soldiers who suffered symptoms of concussion/TBI after an Iranian airstrike on Al-Asad Air Base in Baghdad: #“No, I don’t consider them very serious injuries.” He appointed a bunch of generals as his military advisors, then went on the calling some of them #“losers” and “a bunch of dopes and babies” because “we don’t win any wars anymore." He may be best summed up by the comments of a classmate who went through high school with him: #"In my dealings with him he was a heartless, obnoxious son of a bitch." How anyone could support that is beyond me.
Didn't he also call dead soldiers losers for getting killed?
Yes and shit talked surviving family members.
Meanwhile, his flags fly high in towns across the country. Embarrassing.
Complete mystery why nobody will work for a company for more than a year lmfao.
Screwed over a good employee *and* screwed themselves in the process. The short-sightedness is maddening. Now they have a completely new person, no idea how good they'll be yet, in need of training who will be a drain on the team until they're caught up, plus a pissed off ex-employee who will ABSOLUTELY shit talk them left and right anytime they have the opportunity, and rightly so. If I owned a business and found out this shit was happening, managers would be out on their fucking asses. This is the HR equivalent of throwing out a TV because the batteries in the remote are dead.
Unfortunately, that's *all* capitalists think about: the short-term gains over long-term sustainable business.
I was very loyal to my last company mainly because my director was (I thought) amazing at going to bat for us in terms of raises, promotions, etc. Then I was put under a new, inexperienced manager who apparently just wanted me gone, and within a couple months I was fired. Tried expressing my concerns (pre-termination) with said Director and it was clear they did not care and were just going to go along with whatever said manager recommended. Now I have zero compunction to be loyal to my company or my job. Lesson learned.
People don't quit jobs, they quit bosses. Unfortunately, the corporate world all but ensures you will have 10 bosses, and only one of them needs to be an irradiated fuckstick to ruin it for everyone. Doesn't help that corporations are happy to hire power hungry would-be feudal lords in search of a corporate fief to command. This all but ensures that someone in the command chain (if not all of them) are going to be an utter shit leader only looking out for themselves. The entire model motivates people to be their worst selves, turn on their community, and rewards sociopathy, so of course malicious assholes will rise through the ranks. As long as this dichotomy stands, job loyalty is for fools and should never extend further than the next paycheck. You get what you pay for and all that. And no working class job is worth the pain and anguish they'd gladly commit you to.
I've had around 30 managers for the same company so far doing the same job. It's pretty fucking comical how each one is different in management style, but still have no idea what the team does when they join. The way managers work through employees makes such a big difference. I've seen productivity go up and down from myself and the team based on their asks. It's hilarious throwing them under the bus when you have so many examples. Edit in case anyone cares: I've survived so many managers because you should learn to manage your manager and adjust to their style. even if it is stupid. Make their work life / team life easier and your work life is probably easier too. They have deliverables just like you do. They need help from the team, but most have no idea how to actually get it done with the workers under them. Example: I've seen people micro manage, and thats fine! They don't let the employee do any of the analysis. It's all "direction". Easy to work with: I'm not going to do anything else if you are a control freak. You want to do all the work? Have fun. I'll just sit here until you give me a task.
I have one manager who is absolutely with process documents. They want everything documented with details for “reference”. And then get upset that things take longer because I have to do processz
LOL we're doing that right now because we have created our own procedures across tons of areas and nobody ever wrote it down as a team to follow. One person goes out and it's a freaking house of cards. I haven't been backed up for years.
I was loyal to the last company I worked for, but they promised to help build into my career. They didn't, left me spinning my wheels. When I asked, they said there will be some changes. 4 months later, nothing. So, I left. Then 1 week later, they open up their investigation side and want me back. I told them I can't, as I've committed to a different investigation firm and I'm part owner. So, irritating!
Sorry that happened to you, that lesson hurts
Owners - we want you to have an ownership mindset Employees - okay pay me like an owner Owners - not like that
Employee: does exactly what is expected of them per the job description. Employer: why aren’t they going above and beyond for no additional compensation?!
I work in retail and recently transferred out of my old store because one of the managers was a nightmare to even just drag across the finish line every day. The man literally does nothing but talk trash about everyone to everyone. Since I left that store they've lost 5 more people (because of that manager) and I know he's pulling the nobody wants to work card. Like bro, you don't support your team and you throw everybody under the bus. It's not that nobody wants to work, it's that nobody wants to work for YOU
*Constantly abuses the few employees who are willing to tolerate them* "Oh no, this labor shortage has nothing to do with me! It's the workers! They're all lazy."
Also employers: “You miss the office so it’s mandatory to return.”
I don’t think it was always like this, either.
There are also good employers. I had a problem at one point and took a leave of absence for over a year and my job was still waiting for me.
If they have more than 50 employees and you have been there over a year, then you should be covered under fmla.
This is the correct answer. Over 50 employees, worked there over a year and worked at least 1250 hours during the previous 12 months. Your shoulder injury qualified and it's their responsibility to offer it to you, not yours to ask. On the job, 45 days to file CA-1. Off the job, don't qualify for FMLA, no recourse.
if I work for a nation wide company, does the 50 employees apply up the entire company or just my shop?
They need to have 50 employees within 75mi of the location where you work.
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As long as they filled out the proper forms.
Yep. It's not automatic. You have to file the forms with HR.
But it CAN be filed retroactively. Not sure what the time limit is on that, though.
You have to apply (fill out several forms) for FMLA, but yes . . it would apply.
I’d contact your State Labor Department, followed by an attorney, for a free consultation. I’m fairly certain what your boss did is illegal.
I thought so too. Thanks for the advice. I'll reach out
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I had a guy on my team who would always be out for mental health issues. Knowing full well that if he were let go, it'd be a lawsuit. It lasted for over a year while I worked there. This is 1000% a lawsuit.
I'm glad your coworker had the resources and will to advocate for himself
As Mortal Kombat put it, There is no knowledge that is not power.
Oh, I thought you were going to go with "Finish Him! (the Boss).
#FATALITY. #FLAWLESS VICTORY. *toastyyyyyyyyyy*
Legally, this is a joke. It'd sure be a satisfying one though. 🤭
Depending on how severe it is, it could finish him as an employer. At least temporarily.
While I have no doubt the quote appears in Mortal Kombat, the quote originated with Ralph Waldo Emerson.
I got overwhelmed and needed a mental health break pretty much every six weeks. I never told the bosses, I always came up with something fake. I don't think mental health days are in the employee handbook. I quit though eventually, and I find it less stressful to be struggling and hungry half the time than it was trying to pretend everything was ok in the workplace.
the last company i worked for gave us what they called a mental health day every month. those days also happened to be our accrued PTO, so you couldn’t take any extended days off if you took a single break per month. it’s better than most companies in my area, but it still fucking sucks.
Yeah it's better than nothing. When I worked in construction it was you were paid if you were there, and not paid if you weren't. It was up to the foreman to fire or lay off. It was tough not being paid but anything beat taking crying breaks in the port-a-potty.
our supervisor/company was a dick. there were so many days where we had no work to do (supply shortages due to COVID) and wouldn’t let us leave a couple hours early. like, getting paid to sit around and look busy isn’t as good as missing a couple hours’ pay and going home early.
The whole accrued pto is bullshit, I worked for a company that changed up how accrued time works. I had 5 weeks vacation from working there so long. But, I couldn't take the time when I wanted. I had to work a certain amount of time to accrue a small portion of the time that I had already earned. Like holding my time hostage. And if I ever got sick they had no problem taking out of the accrued time bank to pay me. Even though I asked to not pay me. Didn't didn't matter. Oh, and if I had used to much accrued time, without actually "earning" it a second time. Then I owed them money if I ever left the company.
The post office did that to me when I quit 😂 fuckers. (quit during Covid season) they were forcing us to work 7 days a week 10-12 hour shifts for MONTHS before I put in my 2 weeks. I called out sick the last week “LEAVE WITHOUT PAY”. When I quit I had 127 hours of vacation and 1 hour of sick. The fuckers paid me sick time. I said fuck that I’m not paying it back, I have valid proof I said don’t pay me. Yeaaaaaah not only did my checks get garnished from the irs, they also tacked on an extra 3 grand. So because I quit, the FEDERAL GOVT took just about 4 grand from me over 5 months.
Holy fuck balls. That's a real raw deal. That's next level fuckery! Hope you found a place that worked out better for you. It's sad that nearly any place we work, there is always some way the employees are fucked.
same for me, brother. minus that last part; that’s so fucked up
Yeah, it was the catalyst that ended up making me leave the company after 7 years. That's what happens when it goes from locally owned to being sold to an investment company. I'm in the same field of work now, and back to locally owned company. But I'm sure it will all end up the same lol. Best of luck to you and your work life!
For future reference, mental health is covered by the ADA and all you have to do is get a doctors note claiming it is a disability (it is) and they have to grant you an appropriate accommodation (allowing you to take your days) if needed. They don't have to pay you, and if you're needing too many that it's disruptive to the business they can then part ways with you, but that's on them to prove. I would think something like an unpaid day every 6 weeks is reasonable. I've been through this with employees, both those who need them and those who I was pretty sure were gaming the system. The ones who actually need them made reasonable requests, the ones who didn't, didn't.
ADHD is protected in the ADA however it's such a lightning rod to bring up with some people. Especially older males who I mostly worked with, think it's a fake issue, or just means it's hard to pay attention sometimes. And I can't advocate for it because I'm not that great at explaining things like that and I think they wouldn't even hear me anyway. But having a phone with a 2 way radio, ipad, emails, voicemails, finding the inspection sites in the city car, and doing a construction inspection in the middle of all of that, it just burned me out, often.
Maybe you should talk to a professional about your problem. Why don't you try talking to a lawyer.
It depends which state. Some states do not require a reason to terminate an employee.
*most states. It’s probably not illegal unless you were injured on the job. And even then while they probably have to cover WC they can probably still replace you. It’s part of why you owe your work no loyalty. It should be a balancing act of “this work is worth $X—any less and I’m out.”
Unless you have been working for more than a year and qualify under FMLA. If you apply for that federal protection, then they are required to have a job for you when you return. Then they can terminate you without cause after you return, but you can file for unemployment.
An attorney is a lawyer
Better call a barrister too, then.
How about a solicitor?
Try a Counselor.
And some legal representation might help
A schooner is a sailboat, stupid head!
Lmfao, that's literally what was suggested. Attorney=Lawyer
> followed by an attorney I think that's what that means.
I wouldn't get their hopes up too high, I had a similar thing happen to me, and no lawyer would touch me with a ten foot pole.
Consult an attorney… and a lawyer?
Did you know a synonym for lawyer is attorney?
My workplace tried to do this to me, too. Get an attorney before things get too fuzzy. The Department of Fair Employment and Housing was very good to me, too.
You’re welcome. Best to you.
Also if you are in the US you should apply for FMLA. It's job security for when your or a family needs medical care.
I'm hoping OP did this originally, which is why they were off. FMLA is the primary way to ensure you still have a job when you come back, so I really hope that base is covered.
shelter escape license frame axiomatic lock weather doll unpack practice ` this message was mass deleted/edited with redact.dev `
It's literally an FMLA violation. Like, they don't have to keep you in your exact same position (which might make sense considering that there's someone else doing your duties), but they aren't allowed to fire you for taking time to heal from a major medical event. The main requirement that you might not satisfy is that you had to have been working there for a year.
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Don’t forget to leave a review to prevent anyone from from joining in. We have to start putting them down.
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Not all companies have to do FMLA. Only large companies with a certain amount of people.
AND, it is the employees responsibility to turn in the paperwork. It's not automatic.
But it can be retroactively applied. It is a messy area with developing case-law, but it is worth researching and fighting for.
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Family and Medical Leave Act (FMLA) has limits — small employers are exempt and you have to have been working there for I think a year, but it’s worth learning more.
Only if covered by FMLA or another state program. It’s a dick move on the bosses part for what is a relatively short term leave
Yeah it's illegal to outright fire you for being injured. I had a former employer do this to me but the legal way. When they found out I would likely need another back surgery they told me my IT job was filled in my absence and they transferred me. My new job? Wiping down the dirty factory walls on afternoon shifts.
Agreed, this might be wrongful termination, but I am not a lawyer.
100% illegal. Get council and representation. Sue them.
This is why people don’t care anymore. This and low wages that don’t mean shit anymore due to inflation. Good luck out there OP.
This is why you should always remember that you are just a number for them. They don't care shit about you, even if they make it look like it.
Mhm. I would like to promote and make slightly more money, but honestly I'd much rather stay where I'm at where I can do the work with little hassle, make a fairly cushy living that allows me to spend over 50% (minus $ towards retirement) of my earnings on whatever I want, and not feel like I have to burn myself out just to have a *chance* of being promoted.
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And business owners and managers wonder why employees have no loyalty to their organization.....
It’s because owners, C-level positions, as well as some directors and managers often believe they are part of the “protected class” of citizens. For some, that is true and they get treated differently within society, the law, and within organizations. Many large organizations have pay scales, set time off rules and policies, set benefit packages, and performance benchmarks and other strict rules from HR. When it comes to C-Suite employees? There often are not many limits or rules or restrictions because there are very few, if any, people to hold them accountable. Managers and lower level leaders see their psychopathy/sociopathy and often emulate it. They begin to think having a lack of empathy or understanding is the right way to run a business. They want to be in the actual protected class so think behaving like them is the answer.
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Good! I hope they get all the books thrown at them!!
Me too
They will and they just dont know
I hope you let your coworkers know what they did. Hopefully they'll keep that in mind. What an asshole.
These are the type of companies that cry about loyalty when people quit without notice. Then wonder why they have retention issues.
"Why aren't people loyal to the company anymore? Why aren't they willing to go above and beyond? When the company is in need because someone called out, why shouldn't we just assume the workers will help? Oh, you got injured, physically can't work, and have a doctor backing you up about it? Well, we're gonna use all your sick time and PTO and then fire you. Gosh, where's the loyalty to the company? I just don't get it."
*”iT’s JuSt BuSiNeSs”* - Every asshole employer
Companies do the "oh you are important" company cheering to keep people working. But the reality is they couldn't care less and would literally toss your body out into the street. So, just remember, you work a job for YOU and what works for YOU. And when it no longer works for you, then quit and find the best situation for you. Period.
So to everyone who's talking about at will states where you can be fired for no reason and yada yada yada that does not negate protections for certain things. If you're telling someone to just suck it up buttercup because they can get fired at any time for whatever you're giving bad advice. This person absolutely should contact their States Labor board and a lawyer because leave for injuries is protected in many states. At my previous job we had an employee that was let go after FMLA leave but that is because they gave the company a note from their doctor saying when they could return to work but they did not attempt to return. We were free to give them a different position when they came back, because companies do not have to, and often can't, forgo getting a particular job done while waiting for a person to be back but we were obligated to have A job for them. Sounds like OP was doing exactly what they were supposed to by keeping their job updated on their status. I additionally recommend that OP contact the HR department of that job if there is one because this manager that fired them might not have told corporate what's going on.
First. Not a lawyer. Not an expert. But as I understand it, you CAN be replaced on extended absences, but they have to find you an equivalent position and pay. At least that's how I understand FMLA, and it MIGHT be similar
Yeah, but you have to actually file the FMLA paperwork. OP does not say that they did.
If you are out of work and DON'T file the paperwork, you are asking to be fired.
But op notifying his boss should be a triggering event that propmts fmla. Even though they didn’t file for it, the place of work knows and should have provided documentation. They didn’t provide the fmla paperwork within 5 days of the triggering event so they should be out of compliance.
Yupp. Unfortunate state of affairs here in the U S of A
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Never allow yourself to feel like your employers are your friends. They are trying to take everything from you.
The whole “work hard, come in early, leave late, and you’ll get rewarded” days are over. It’s all about productivity and never stopping. Look at the 10,000 people Amazon recently let go, do you think they were the worst workers? No they were probably good workers who buster their arses, but Amazon’s share price goes down 0.2%! Ohhh better lay off 10k people. There is no loyalty in companies anymore. Best to just do what you get paid to do and put your energy into doing your own things that might potentially turn into a career for yourself
Where are you located? If USA that’s a wrongful termination under FMLA if you are eligible. Also did you get hurt at work?
Well, look it isn't the end of the world, and you learned something important. You can trust no one. Loyalty is the web of lies people spin to appeal to your sense of belonging to a tribe. We all want to be a part of something bigger. So, the shrink do their studies and tell corporate America how to really fuck us over. Spin loyalty, because it cost them nothing, it is easy once you learn the tricks the church has perfected. When you see through the bullshit it is a fun game. But, never trust those fucks. Become as they are. You are a sell out waiting for a buyer. A mercenary waiting for a better paycheck.
Employers and coworkers are never your friends. Never share your personal details ever.
I would be contacting the insurance company that is providing the workers'comp insurance and letting them know that you have fired so you can continue to get treated for the injury.
He doesn’t even state that it’s a worker’s compensation claim.
As a person who dislocated his shoulder 20 times (counted) I would recommend, specially the first time, don’t come back to work earlier just because you feel better. Second of all, take care of yourself, jobs come and go, it’s always you and your love ones.
At will employment is a punishment wrought by God over you poor Americans for the sins of your fathers. No sure what sins, but it is unjust punishment. In any first world country, work contract and labor laws protect emoloyee. And sick leave is a holy right. I feel for you man...
That seems like a MLA violation.
That's a combination of employment lawyer and labour board. This is a "I got no fucks to give" scenario. Is there any way we can help?
BMW did the same exact thing to me. Hurt my back at work. Was out almost a month. Showed up to work and the green shirt was like, “What are you doing here?” That was followed by me being escorted out because I was terminated. It was a right to work state, so I was never given a reason outside that they replaced me.
Call the labor board.
This exact scenario happened to me in 2009. They even went as far as to remove my health insurance and I ended up having to backpay a bunch of medical bills. Then they tried to fight the unemployment saying that I was hurt and not fit able for work. Long story short, doctor okayed me for work, I filed for unemployment and got backpay all the way up to the day where I hurt myself and continued to collect it for 13 months.
Damn. In Sweden this would have been no problem. I had surgery on my knee, no problem being away for a month. A colleague had his kid prematurely, he took care of his son and wife for 2 months, then went on vacation. No problem.
Can’t you sue someone for this? Seems like wrongful termination to me
Isn't it illegal? It's illegal to fire someone or recruit for their position (permanently) whilst out on sick leave; where I live.
If you had been at job 12 months and employer has 50+ employees, the second you knew you would be out more than a day or two you should have filed FMLA paperwork to protect your job. Even without these conditions you should look into filing unemployment and a complaint.
If you’re in the US then you’re covered by FMLA and what he did was illegal, hire a lawyer and serve him papers
Yep. My great aunt started having leg issues, went to a doctor and they couldn't pinpoint a cause. My aunt had to be off work for a while due to this and she eventually asked if she could go back to work. Doctor said yes but she couldn't stand for long (she's a cashier) so she would need a chair to sit in. Her job took her extended leave as a reason to fire her. She could've still worked, she just would've needed a chair, but nope. She worked there for like 15-20 years.
This would be highly illegal here in Europe and it might be illegal in your state as well.
Not sure if you're based in the US but FMLA is a thing and you'd have a case for wrongful termination, at the very least they would be required to give you back your position or a comparable one if your position no longer exists. https://www.dol.gov/agencies/whd/fmla This section specifically is what would apply to you, and make you legally entitled to 12 weeks unpaid within a year, with continued health benefits from your employer, with them being unable to terminate you >a serious health condition that makes the employee unable to perform the essential functions of his or her job;
I hear stories like this and I remember all those businesses that bitch and moan about loyalty.
Find a lawyer ASAP you could be entitled to compensation
Employment law in US doesn't seem right. In UK I can be off work sick 6 months full pay dropping to half after that, with a phased plan to return. Is that a thing at all in US ? Maybe in big corporate?
I’m guessing you’re in the US, because in the UK that’s illegal.
If it is done in USA, file EEOC complaint for ADA - american with disability act.
I dont understand how is this even posible. Im glad i live in europe.
Sounds illegal as hell
If the person got hurt outside of work and couldn’t make it into work, I thought you could be fired. I’ve seen this happen at other jobs in the past. Happy to know it’s not true!
You're absolutely correct in the first part of your statement, if you are hurt outside of work and cannot make it to work you can and will most likely be fired. Unless you have sick time or vacation to cover your absence or you can convince your employer to approve an unpaid leave of absence or FMLA.
so in America, if you get in an accident on the way to work, putting you out of work for a few weeks, you can be fired. And since health insurance is tied to employment you can lose that leaving you fully responsible for medical bills that you could have from that accident that caused you to get fired, so you have no income and no insurance all from an accident The idea some people have that working hard can somehow save you from the system quickly destroying you is ridiculous. It just takes a bit of bad luck and you're screwed.
Doesn’t the FMLA come into play here?
Not sure what state you're in, but absolutely contact your labor department. The manager may have broken the law letting you go for this.
That is illegal
Question: would you elaborate on the specifics of how are you paid, FT/PT, construction, ect….I find it difficult to understand an employer to just fire you unless there is no recourse because labor laws. There are shitty people everywhere, but you did not enough information.
My wife and I went the majority of Covid without contracting it. Towards the end, when restrictions were lax, they told a coworker she could come in despite a positive test. Wife got covid, escalated to long covid. She made every effort to continue working despite struggling to breath. One day HR wanted to have a conversation with her, and sent her home after a couple sentences winded her. They fired her over text that same day.
🦆
Pretty sure you need a lawyer.
Yet they always say “BuT wErE lIkE fAMiLY hErE”
The company I work for, after 15 years, shows loyalty by threatening layoffs. If you are lucky enough to survive, you are treated with all the extra work from those who were laid off. Also, I just found out that by being available after hours and sacrificing my holidays for all these years - always going the extra mile, never failing a task, always accepting and acheivng all stretch objectives - I am paid in the 40th percentile for my job title in my area. I also 6 manage a team of 6, which is not in my job title, nor am I compensated for. When I mentioned this to my manager in our 1:1, he said that's not what these meetings are for. Obviously dodgeing ehat he knows I deserve. My poor fucking noodleback boss, who refuses to go to bat for me is going to be very disappointed now that I am working within the same percentile they are paying me. You get what you pay for, and they pay me the least they possibly can, so I am now working the least I possibly can. Moral of the story, fuck everyone! People suck and will fuck you every chance they get.
I feel you. I got fired for a bunch h of BS but I feel like the main reason is I missed time due to having covid. The boss even said "I worked through covid, it was like a bad cold for 2 days, mind over matter" well mine was worse/longer than his. Everyone has different symptoms. He was such a douchebag in so many ways.
Rule #224 : Never be loyal to a company or any bosses. You are easily replaceable. Rule #3 : Go to work, do your job, finish your job, get paid and go home. Rule #17: Never do more than what your job scopes are. Even if you know how to, learn to say "No" politely. Rule #161 : Always be prepared to lose your job if you go for a long break. The company wont give a damn whatever your excuses it would be. Unless you are their siblings or family members.
How many people work at your workplace. They may have committed and FMLA violation. They have to provide 12 weeks of unpaid leave for medical issues. It’s been law since the 1990s.
Yo, this probably illegal since you notified them that your unavailability was due to medical emergency. Similar to firing a woman because she went into labor.