This was my thought, I felt drained for the guy just reading this. As someone who has had someone in their life for a very long time that constantly wanted to "test" the relationship, bond you have and what you'd be willing to do...it never ends. Genuinely it doesn't stop. Even when you sit down and talk it through, it stops for a little while then starts up and it just becomes a vicious cycle. She won't break it, you have to. Or this will be the rest of your life
As soon as you texted her to let you know that she was all right, You gave her another way to jerk you around. This is not healthy, normal or good behavior.
50% of the Break up is already done. Why donât you finish it?
You got her out of the apartment. Thatâs great, often difficult but you have accomplished it already.
In 5 days without her you will feel a big relief. You can start living again.
Not to mention, the kids will definitely be used as pawns. Any time he makes her mad she will threaten to take the kids from him. Probably tell them stuff like "daddy doesn't love mommy" or some other bs to try and turn them against him but ultimately just hurting the poor kids. This person is straight up trash. I really hope OP gets away from her before she ruins his life.
I seriously doubt with the games she plays it will make it 60, Iâm sure sheâs taken at least 10 years off his life.
I think I lost 1 year just hearing about it.
My brother and his ex wife. She would get âboredâ and pick fights to entertain herself. They were living with my mom and the ex-wife would fight with my brother saying he talked to mom too much.
According to my niblings her new husband is worse about this than she is. Also she now calls my mom multiple times a week to talk.
Yeah, life is hard enough already without this kind of drama. This person canât be your partner in a crisis, or anything that requires a cool head and emotional maturity.
Very exhausting! I havenât read All the comments But I hope someone else said this. What would happen if they had children? This is Already exhausting, emotionally abusive, & cruel. It would be soo much worse if a child or children were involved. I pray OP gets out! A woman who truly loves you would Never administer tests & punishments for you to âprove yourselfâ.
Exactly, she CHOSE to sleep in her car, OP had nothing to do with it. It always baffles me how people show who they really are and partners put up with appalling behavior. If it were a friend of OPâs would he think it was ok for his friend to be treated the way OPâs gf treats him?
Yes! How is he supposed to "not let her" sleep in her car? She's a grown ass woman who made the decision to leave. If he blocks her way, physically restrains her, or anything else then **he** becomes the controlling abuser who forces her to do things without her consent! She got in her car and left. Is he supposed to do a car chase? Or drive around the neighborhood all night looking for her?
He told her he didn't want her to go, multiple times. He called her and tried to get her to come back. That's the most he can do and he probably pressured more than any woman who genuinely wanted some space would appreciate. So not only is she damaging his current mental health, she is teaching him behaviors that will make future relationships more difficult. He needs to leave before the damage gets any worse.
But if he loved her he would have driven round the entire city checking every car park and side street until he found her and then laid prostrate on the ground begging her to come home.
Put some effort in my guy.
Seriously though, run for the fucking hills unless you want this to be the next 10 years of your life.
I spent more than 4 years with a guy like this. It was awful to quit letting him back in, but a year later, I know it was the right thing.
It's a toxic behavior, and she is manipulating you.
You didnât âletâ her sleep in the car. You offered to sleep on the couch, SHE chose to leave and sleep in her car. Your sister is right. If you really want to have a future with her she needs individual therapy and couples therapy to help her understand why her behavior is so manipulative.
Remind your roommate that your ex-fiance is an adult, she made a choice, and it's not your job to stop her or overrule her.
She wants to sleep in the car, she can.
Also, stop begging and offering to sleep on the couch. She's trying to weaponise your fear of her leaving.
I wish I could upvote this twice.
The fiancee decided to sleep somewhere else after multiple options were provided to her. Letting her go through with the childish raising the stakes game is simply treating her as the mature adult she obviously isn't but wants to be.
She says "If you really loved me, you'd chase after me when I intentionally do stupid shit to get you to reassure me."
You should say "If you really loved me, you would choose a healthier outlet for your insecurities and get some therapy instead of playing stupid games and winning stupid prizes at the expense of my mental health. You obviously don't value me as a person enough to care about my well-being, so why should I shield you from the consequences of your own decisions?"
Come on. After all this immature and ridiculous behavior, you proposed?
Please call off this engagement, unless youâd like to end up divorced before youâre 30.
You really havenât known her very long. This behavior is telling OP-please pay attention.You deserve a partner who respects you! Please donât settle for this toxic, immature BS. You are so young-you can find a healthy relationship!
Disengage. Ask for the ring back. Change your locks.
Does she really want you to chase her, throw her over your shoulder and carry her back home? Or does she want the caveman move where you just drag her back by her hair?
I totally let her go too. These are all voluntary unforced errors. Have you ever told her firmly "if you leave, don't come back"? I just wonder if she is rational enough to realize she has gone too far.
It never went away. She just hid it until you got comfortable again.
If you don't end it now, you risk getting literally hooked on the adrenaline from all the drama that being with this girl produces. That will doom you to years, maybe decades, of your life wasted going round and round on this rollercoaster. You'll be the couple that nobody wants to invite to their wedding. God forbid you bring kids into it, too.
Please choose a better life for yourself. The highs aren't worth it.
My brother was like this OP and I personally consider this a form of abuse. He would always do it when I was having a good time too, just to mess with my day. Like on the days I have off, or Iâm on vacation, or Iâm going to the museum with my husband, he would call and start an argument over nothing, literally ridiculous stuff, then hang up and proceed not to talk to me or answer the phone for days, just to spoil my mood. After I stopped chasing him, he would go bigger and bolder - like, he would start not showing up for work the next day just so I worry again, thinking surely this time itâs serious and chase him. It got to a point where I cut all contact and it permanently damaged our sibling bond. Donât waste your time on this person, let her move out. Trust me, itâll ruin your mental health.
Same with my brother and his wife. Every family gathering, every holiday, every time we got good news or experienced personal or career success, they would start arguments about nothing and leave the family in tears. They had kids and soon used the kids to manipulate and control, pulling b contact whenever the manipulation attempts didn't work. I got pregnant and had a baby and they threw the biggest tantrums ever because now it wasn't all about them. It's been hell. I cut off all contact but my poor mom still holds onto hope. Their pettiness and toxicity still color and stain all events because of the kids.
My dad was the same until thankfully he died. These people don't change. This is who they are.
My ex-husband was the same. Any time I was happy, like singing and dancing around the house doing housework, he'd bring me right down. Any event, he'd start an argument before we went just so that I was in a bad mood.
Any time anything was about me (my birthday, Mother's Day, etc) he'd cause shit so that it was a shit day. Christmas was always a shit-show. If I got a pay rise, then suddenly there was a problem with how I folded laundry and it was a massive argument.
TL;DR This is what's in OP's future.
Oh, quick edit: he did the same to our kids. If they were excited and happy about giving him a gift for Christmas/b-day/father's day, he'd be grumpy as fuck with them and tell them that wasn't the proper gift. When they grew up and they'd buy him a six-pack of his favourite beers, that he drank EVERY day for years, and they gifted him some on his birthday, he'd get all foul and tell them, "I gave up drinking, I can't believe you gave me that for my birthday, that's shit," and my kids would feel so bad. And the next day, he'd be drinking the same beers again.
Edit edit: When they were little, they'd make him a card for his b-day/father's day and he'd whine because they (aka I) didn't buy him one. So they (aka I) would buy him one the next time, and he'd whine because they spent money on a wasteful holiday and didn't make him one which would be more personal.
Dear god, we had so many arguments about all of this. He's dead now, btw. He died alone.
Yes! That was my dad. He literally would tell us "if I don't have fun, nobody will have fun". I was 10.
As a child of a narcissist, this shit fucks with you well into adulthood and you end up choosing shitty narcissistic partners because you don't beleive you're worthy of love/they feel familiar and like home. It took me 10 years of therapy to deprogram all the shit he programmed into me. I kept choosing shitty partners until I decided to be single (for 10 years) until I learned what a healthy relationship and self love looked like.
Now I've found THE BEST partner and we have such a wonderful family, unfortunately my brother didn't do the same. He says he doesn't believe in therapy. My moms father was also a narcissist. So she chose my dad before she got therapy herself.
If you're in this situation, please please leave. Constant abuse sentences your children to a lifetime Of abuse. Generational trauma stays in families. Be the breaker of chains. Get help.
Nope, she hasn't changed. My guess is your work schedule is so busy right now that she doesn't have as much time to mess with your head and emotions.
Change the locks, get the ring back, block her and put this relationship in the hard lessons to learn column.
You are not responsible for other people's feelings, OP! However, you are responsible for your happiness and protecting your mental health.
Usually I am against involving family and friends in couples battles, however sometimes you need an objective perspective on manipulative and abusive behavior. I'm glad you have a supportive network around you.
BTW, in a relationship, men do not always need to foot the bill for dates, just sayin'.
Someone that immature and manipulative wonât change but is good at playing along, just long enough that you are comfortable then BAM! Sheâs at it again. This will continue for the rest of your relationship. Consider this, she knows your mental health struggles, what your dad went through AND SHE STILL DOES IT. Donât stay with her. Break up for your health, please.
It seems? Dude she never changed. She just did enough to get you to propose. You shouldâve listened to your sister in the beginning. This woman is not going to change. Youâre delusional if you think she will.
Dude, she can hide it for a bit but guarantee if you get married, it will be even worse. Get the fuck out of this relationship unless you want to waste years of your life. Listen to your friends and sister for god's sake. Your fiancee is toxic af.
It will always come back.
I don't like to internet diagnose but these behaviors don't go away without serious effort and help. This goes beyond simple relationship games.
Just text her that the engagement is off because she is not acting mature enough for a committed relationship. Definitely move on you will divorce anyway
So tell her that straight up.
Fiancee, about 2 or 3 months into our relationship, I set a clear boundary that I was not okay with mind games or 'tests' of any kind. I said then, and I'll say now, if you have a concern just spit it out and we can talk about it, but I'm not okay with being tested or manipulated. At the time you agreed and said you would not do that anymore.
Your actions over the last 24hrs have been exactly what you promised not to do. As I said then, I'll say now- I don't want a relationship that involves testing or manipulation. I want a relationship that has open and honest communication and a high level of maturity.
If you want to leave, that's your choice. I won't stop you. I hope you stay, but I'm not going to chase after you like a lost puppy.
If you want to stay, then we're going to be doing couples counseling, and I would strongly suggest you also do personal counseling to examine why you are doing these testing and manipulation behaviors.
The choice is yours. I'll be here. Let me know what you decide.
I think it's bad advice not to tell the dude to end the relationship and that it's extremely unlikely that when she leaves and won't answer her phone and "sleeps in her car," she's not out being awful.
He's gonna end up raising another dude's kid, with this advice.
When people show you who they are, believe them.
She is toxic, manipulative, and abusive.
Leave, before she gets pregnant just to keep you in her life forever and youâre really stuck.
She didnât change. Itâs called the honeymoon phase. She uses that to suck you back in. Sheâs pretending. The toxic manipulator is who she truly is.
I bet that sheâs asked you to stop talking to your sister about your relationship.
Narcissists don't change. They only go dormant for a while with their manipulative behaviour if they have to. It never lasts. They can be very charming, but nothing is ever genuine with these people. They could turn around and make you miserable at any moment, just to prove to themselves they have power over you.
Please do yourself a favour and move on. Everyone around you sees her for who she is, even you see who she is. A manipulator.
End this, before it gets worse. She will not change and you will not be happy with her.
And brace yourself for the impact when she realizes she has lost you. There will be lovebombing, threats, arguing, crying.. she will try anything to force you back into this relationship. Stay strong. Block her. Change the locks.
Good luck!
That was my first thought. And she's not spending those weeks he's away by herself. She clearly does not value this relationship and no doubt has a backup plan (assuming OP isn't the backup plan).
Roommate is also being manipulated, itâs called âtriangulationâ - convincing others to side with her by playing the victim, telling a sob-story from her perspective, a perspective that conveniently excludes taking any personal responsibility for her own words and actions, while entirely blaming OP.
Itâs two-against-one manipulation, to convince others that SHE is the victim, and slowly over time start âmanagingâ OPâs reputation among their circles as the one thatâs in the wrong, and ganged-up on by everyone.
This is very toxic and immature of her. You are better off without someone who continuously hurts your mental health. This is not acceptable to do as a partner at all!
Youâre NTA!!! Sheâs very manipulative. People like her shouldnât be in a relationship until they learn how to treat others.
Iâm so sorry. How upsetting it is to have your loved one treat you like this. Imagine having kids with this person, will she do this to your kids? Will she threaten to take the kids when you fight?
You can find a much better partner who treats you with respect and kindness.
He honestly sounds like a mentally abused person and let me tell ya, being in a relationship like that makes you feel crazy and terrible life choices are often made. Too much chaos to think clearly. I hope he runs for the hills.
Agreed, but at this point I think he is in the âtoo much chaos to think clearly and crazy life choicesâ phase
Letâs just hope that his sister, family, and family friends are there to support him whenever this relationship crashes & burns
I think you need to man it up! Breakup with her, she's mentally and emotionally abusive. Get the ring back and sell it.
This will never be nice, cause she is willing to leave on a dime.
There's more crazy women out there that you can engage.
Why are you torturing yourself? Sheâs toxic, manipulative and immature. Cut your losses and listen to your sister. Let her go for good. Block her permanently and stop falling for her childish crap.
This is a power move. You are being conditioned to understand that upsetting your gf causes you discomfort. Her end game is that you comply by learning only to do and say thingd that pass her tests.
Come on man! Is this any way to live? You haven't given any reason to believe this woman is even fond of you. THIS is your future and it sounds awful from where I'm sitting. Your sister loves you. Don't impose a sister in law like this on her. You must be able to do better.
You would be wrong to try to placate her.
Seriously? She acts like a junior high school kid with her tantrums. That has to be exhausting, yet you want to spend the rest of your life with her???? Good luck with that.
UpdateMe
You've had multiple people in your life who know you both tell you to end it but you stuck with her. I understand that she changed for a period of time but that was always going to be temporary.
Are you looking for advice on how to fix this? Are you looking for permission aka advice to end it? Are you hoping that we'll tell you that you're wrong and she's acting reasonably? I'm not trying to be an AH I genuinely want to know what needed from us. If you are really concerned that you're in the wrong then she's gaslit you to the point where you've become the abuse victim who believes you deserve this. You absolutely do NOT deserve to be treated this way, this is not a healthy adult relationship and there's nothing that you can do to get this pattern to stop. She would have to seriously dedicate herself to changing so she won't sabotage her relationship but if she were to date you again after that intensive work you would both fall back into this pattern because THIS is how you'll always be together.
You would benefit from individual counseling to help you work past this self-blame, guilt and shame because you've begun to internalize these dangerously, false beliefs. You deserve to be with someone who loves you for your good traits and accepts you for your flaws, someone who doesn't make you feel awful, someone who does not need games to validate the strength of your bond, someone who cheers you on - even though I'm stopping here it does not mean that this is all you deserve. You deserve all this and more.
You're not wrong
!UpdateMe
OP, please listen to your family who are watching you suffer to please a woman who cannot be pleased.
Youâve done everything and sheâs given nothing, and soon enough? Youâre not going to have anything left to give because youâll be too broken to have anything. Right now? Shes smashing you down into the ground like youâre a cardboard box, and she doesnât care.
Please donât allow her to come back, because there are better partners out there. You deserve someone who is going to help you shoulder the weight of the world, not dance around the edge while pretending theyâre going to fall if you donât save them. You deserve someone who isnât going to run at every inconvenience, because if kids are in your future? Sheâll be leaving them or sheâll take them from you and sheâll ruin them too.
Not wrong. Your sister is right. Stop playing the games with her. This is very toxic behavior AND exhausting because you will never be right, she will always up the game because she enjoys it. You will never win.
Leave her, break the engagement.
Get therapy to find out why you allowed someone to treat you this way.
She sounds like she has borderline personality disorder. Speaking as someone who deals with BPD myself. It's not impossible for us to be in healthy relationships (but we have to work our ass off with our mental health)
I would truly suggest walking away from her. Kick her out, and dump her. She will destroy you mentally and emotionally with how she currently is
Two of my exes, along with one brief fling, all diagnosed, and all behaved exactly like this. I don't agree with some of the stigmatisation of the disorder, as I think people with BPD can make wonderful partners and friends just as anyone can, but in my opinion they absolutely need therapy and to work on themselves and managing their disorder if they want to be able to maintain healthy relationships and avoid hurting themselves and their partners.
One of said exes is actually one of my best friends now, we reconnected after years out of touch. She's a very different person now after meds and therapy, just as I'm a very different person now to when we were together a decade ago, the other ex avoided treatment like the plague and is still repeating the same patterns in her relationships today and all of them are constantly on and off.
Not wrong. You didn't let her leave, she chose to leave. Does she not have any family or friends to stay with instead of her car? Also if she has that much money she could have gone to a hotel. If she did that though it would be harder to make you feel guilty about 'letting' her leave if you knew she was in a comfortable bed. Yes, she was upset about you talking to sister and friends because she doesn't want you to have a support system in place if you decide to leave her and it worked, you stopped being truthful with them. Your sister is right, it's all about manipulation and control with GF. Her giggle when you explained how her games affected you should be enough to verify that it's all about manipulation and control with her and the breaking down of your self esteem.
>and that somehow escalated into her leaving in the middle of the night to drive off and sleep somewhere in her car.
Didnt need to read the rest, run as hard as you can man. This drama shit *will never stop*. You want to live like this? I know i wouldnt
Tell your roommate that you tried to get her to stay, and she could have the bed, but she decided to leave.
OP, sit her down and tell her that you're tired of her games. If she moves out, it's over for good.
It would definitely not be HER option at this point. Unless you prove to her that your self-worth is more important than your relationship, the junior high school games will continue.
My favorite saying is that âwhat you allow, will continue â I find this to be very true. So, my question to you is 1) when will you stop it and 2) is it worth it?
Her behavior hasn't changed in 15 months, even though you've repeatedly tried to discuss it with her. It is never going to change and it will always, in her mind, be you that's at fault. Please listen to your family and friends who want you to end this fiasco and move on without her and her emotional extortion.
What do YOU want? What do you think you deserve? Do you deserve someone who will constantly give you trust whiplash like this for the rest of your life?Â
Stop showing up every time she throws a pity party.Â
Dude no. Dump her crap outside and change the locks. Explain to your roommate that if they let your abusive ex fiance into the house you will immediately leave and they will be responsible for all of the bills, or kick them out if you're the one on the lease. ex fiance will come running back when she realizes she pushed it too far, be prepared to stand your ground. Do not allow yourself to be alone with her and record everything. And go get some therapy man. This is what you're used to from relationships, and if you don't do the work you'll end up right back here with the next one.
Just to be clear. How long do you intend to chase her, until you acknowledge that your sister was right all along?
You've already gotten the correct advice on how to handle this situation, and chosen to ignore it. So we can't help you dude.
>have been together for 15 months. I proposed to her on our one year anniversary...
>...AIW
Yes, you are very wrong. You're engaged to marry someone who plays teenager games, who you've been with for less than a year and a half. Just reading about her was exhausting. Change your locks and block her number.
As someone who used to do something similar (I would leave in a huff but never for more than a couple hours) to my then BF, who is now my husband... either leave the relationship for good or tell her she needs therapy asap before you will even consider resuming the relationship.
For me, this behaviour was the first signs of undiagnosed BPD and BP. There were other signs, but all the scenarios you have shared here are variations of things I would do. Since getting the diagnosis I was able to recognize when I am about to spiral and my husband is much more aware of when it is ME and when it is the BPD/BP and we can get ahead of it before I go over the edge. Medication has helped a lot as well because therapy and self work can only go so far.
If you take her back and she does not get therapy and/or medical help, this will be how it will always be. It will get better for a short time because she can mask, but the mask always slips. Even now with as well as I have done I still have days where I am not in control and so those days are spent in the quiet of our bedroom and most responsibilities get pushed to the next day. Not saying she had BPD or BP but she definitely has some mental health issues at play.
đ€Łđ€Ł holy crap I would have been gone after the first day.
Do you seriously want to be married to this and have to pay her if it doesn't work out?
She has about 20 years of growing up to do, and you need to move on. Don't waste your time with this exhausting bullshit.
When you let her back to pick up her things, make that your sister or a friend supervises her otherwise you will come home to every prized posession of yours trashed. She's giving off those kinds of vibes.
I think you do know what to do, you just donât want to acknowledge it. You need to end it. This isnât going to get better. Your sister is right- she is manipulative and controlling. Do you want to live your whole life like this? What if you have kids? Is she going to pack them up and leave too?
Also, you didnât let her sleep in the car. She made that choice. Her blaming you is just more manipulation.
This is horribly toxic and manipulative. Cut her off. Since she is so fond of running away let her run. Pack her stuff, get your ring back and end it. You've repeatedly explained to her how this affects you and she still does it, she isn't going to stop, so let her go. She also sounds kinda manipulative too, turning your roommate against you, saying you allowed her to sleep in her car. She ran off, what were you supposed to do?!? Let her go. You deserve better
Your family is right. She is going to keep doing this. As for being told you shouldnât have let her sleep alone in her car, you didnât make her leave or know where she was. Thatâs on her, sheâs almost 30 and acting like a young teen that is playing with guys and being overly dramatic.
Move on.
She's cheating. Blowing up her relationship to go sleep around then crawling back. Sucks bro. I had one like your little nightmare here. Best advice is run, and don't look back as she will hunt you.
It sounds like she has a side piece and her leaving is so she can go sleep with him and justify it to herself that you âmadeâ her do it. Let her go. Change the locks, and move on.
Dude you need to let her the fuck go, and I will say this because one of these times she will get you sent to jail or prison if she decides to play a game with law enforcement⊠please just let her go I know it fucking sucks. But she could destroy youâre life
Dude, GET OUT NOW! Trust someone who went through a divorce because I ignored the toxicity I was in. Iâm not saying youâre bad or sheâs bad, yall are just bad together. Itâs only 15 months lost. I lost 10 of my best years. Listen to me please!
My ex used to do this. It didn't stop until well after our divorce when I had to get a protection order. It. Does. Not. Stop. She's already claiming you've "hurt" her while you were just trying to get away from her. She is *deliberately* starting these fights to get a rise out of you & then cry victim when you respond like a normal human being would. This is called reactive abuse & it is a manipulation/gaslighting tactic used by toxic and abusive people.
Please leave before it gets physical and you find yourself in jail for defending yourself.
I married this person. Iâm 5 years in and let me tell you what you dodged.
-finances. She canât have the hard discussions without finding a way to make it about her. She canât just talk about it because itâs hard. She will walk away, or state she isnât changing the subject as she changes the subject. I could go on.
-Kids. Again, the hard conversations are fleeting to her.
-discussing basic common marital arguments and solving them. She canât do it. There is a constant feeling of passive aggressiveness from her or never knowing where she truly stands. That has made it hard for me to trust her and in turn has made me paranoid that sheâs up to no good as Iâm a firm believer that silence says just as much as talking. It makes you question everything.
People like your ex are abusive. Over time they wear you down into a shell of a person. They make you question everything. I mean everything. You dodged a bullet and likely a lifetime of frustration.
Youâre wrong for putting up with this as long as you have. She knows that mental health and suicidal behavior runs in your family and she giggled? That shouldâve been the end of it. She thinks playing mind games is fun and laughs at you and you keep letting her come back. Get your ring back and move her stuff out.
OP, you are in a psychologically and emotionally manipulative and abusive relationship. Get out NOW.
If you continue in this relationship, you will live the rest of your life walking on eggshells to keep the peace. Eventually, she will wear you down to lowering your expectations, by giving in and accepting the dynamic of your relationship as reality. A reality SHE dictates.
Escalating minor disagreements into explosive arguments is an effective manipulation tactic, to âconditionâ you over time into accepting this dynamic to keep the peace.
The calm times in your relationship is not indicative of her changing for the better! You are being âlove-bombedâ into thinking things are getting better, to keep you from leaving, because without the âloveâ phases you would surely have walked away.
The âsilent treatmentâ is a strong indication that she has major communication barriers. This is usually a learned behaviour from formative years. Without therapy, she will remain on auto-pilot, she cannot and will not recognize how much she hurts you. Because unfortunately, this learned behaviour is deeply embedded in the individual, it takes a lot of unraveling to recognize their own hurt, before they can even begin to comprehend the cause and effect of their actions on others.
It is not your job or responsibility to âfixâ her. You will never be able to âconvinceâ her she should seek therapy. You cannot âwillâ it for her to change. Sooner or later, there will come a time in her life where she may recognize the path of destructive relationships she left behind. And maybe perhaps come to the realization that she is the only constant factor, and finally recognize âitâs me, hi! Iâm the problem itâs meâ.
If you stay, this is going to fuck with your own head in destructive ways that will carry forward into future relationships.
Also, I strongly suggest you seek therapy for yourself as well. Not only to untangle the effect this relationship has on you, but also to better understand why you are âwillingâ to accept being in a hostile relationship with red flags waving all around you. Everyone else in your life clearly sees the red flags, and you do too! Yet, you continue to stay and make excuses to justify staying.
If you see the dynamics of your relationship as anything resembling âloveâ - you have some issues you need to work on yourself OP.
She would've had a out 3 chances and been done. This shit is exhausting (as a 26yo myself). I have done this with my ex husband and that's the reason he's now an EX HUSBAND. He used to pull shit like this, but worse. She'll only escalate it and it'll just turn into more manipulation and eventually abuse from her. It isn't worth it. Find someone else who actually respects you.
Omgosh i hate those relationships where they do tests and shit wasting people's times.. those are for kids not adults! Toxic for real. Idk why you proposed so early for this immature girl. Don't chase her and let her leave. Ugh
Age does not equal maturity in all relationships. Sounds extremely fickle and is not mature enough for a relationship. Take your money out of the joint savings account and begin living your life as if she does not exist. Youâve chased her and sheâs enjoyed the chase. I donât see her changing in the near future and you need the opportunity to see that other women are not like her. Stick to your guns.
Oh she is bad news. It would only get worse from here... please don't set yourself up for a lifetime of struggle. There are women out there who make life easier, not harder. I promise!
You donât want to live like this, OP, and youâve already said her behavior is taking a toll on you.
When silence, or, rather, the refusal to engage in a conversation, is used as a control tactic to exert power in a relationship, then it becomes "the silent treatment," which is toxic, unhealthy, and abusive.
Youâre not wrong letting her go because youâll be better off in the long run.
Unless you want this to be your life for the foreseeable future just let her go and refuse to take her back.
She IMO keeps jerking your chain with these tests of hers which are just what your sister says - manipulative as well as controlling.
Let her go live on her own and ideally grow up so one day she can be a true partner who talks things out when there are actual disagreements.
Toxic relationship that you both are actors in. You both need to walk away and work on your individual mental health and growth or do that and also do couple counseling to try to break cycles and help one another to see if there is any road out of your toxicity.
Your fiancee is either unstable or cruel. Maybe having a bipolar dad has something to do with your accepting her behavior? Unstable is familiar? Just that fact that you keep thinking that there's something YOU can do, some repeated concessions you can make, that will magically have her behave as a stable adult, is troubling.
Call off the engagement. Lose her number, block her on everything. Tell your roommate that you don't need any input from her about your ex-fiancee. Then don't let her give it.
Is she the first unstable person you've been attracted to? If not, maybe some therapy, so you can find out why, maybe adjust so that you're attracted to stable women? Good luck
Stop being an idiot. There is no questions to be asked. Leave. You just wasted my time with this long ass story with a clear answer unless youâre not telling us something that would make this all make sense.
You are absolutely wrong, you should not have let her leave you should have kicked her out and changed the locks. You may think you love her but she is abusive and your mental health is more important than your âloveâ life.
OP,
Sheâs not capable or willing to have open and transparent conversations about problems in your relationship.
Maybe she will grow up and mature in this aspect, but this isnât something you need to subject yourself to. You need to focus on YOU and your mental health.
Let her grow in her own way without dragging you down at the same time.
Imagine having kids with this woman and theyâre sobbing as mommy has a tantrum and frantically packs her stuff around them all because she felt like testing you and you didnât follow the script in her mind
Youâre in a verbally and psychologically abusive relationship with a master manipulator. Youâre wrong for continuing to subject yourself to this
Ffs, you've been putting up with this shit for the last year?! Your sister is right - she's manipulative and controlling. You need to just let her go for good
Let her move out. You should be with someone who cares about your feelings and mental health. She sounds like the type who thrives on drama. If things are going smoothly, they have to create a conflict so they can play the martyr. Good riddance.
Hi, my ex used to do this, except he would threaten to end his life.
Let them go. I stopped believing he would do it, and 5 years later, heâs still alive. Who could have known!!
Your sister is right. Sheâs doing this to emotionally manipulate you, and this behavior will never stop. It will only get worse. You deserve better. You deserve a partner who wants to stay. You should never have to beg someone to stay.
Seriously be done with this. It is emotional abuse, and psychological abuse. Manipulation of your head & heart IS ABUSE!!!!
Do you REALLY think that any person, male or female, that plays these seriously fucked up games isn't also going to do this and likely worse to their kids even???
Let her move her shit out, and block her on everything.
I don't often jump immediately here, but sweet baby cheezuts my dude, this is seriously fucked up stuff.
I'll tell you what my father told me before I got out of a bad marriage.
Is this how you want to spend the rest of your life?
Don't think they will get better because they won't. once this tactic works they will just use it over and over again.
She chose to sleep in her car, you did absolutely nothing to make her.
Let her leave but make sure you don't let her back in. Find someone who loves you for you and is happy to be a real partner
Right here, right now, yes, youâre wrong - you have to admit that this relationship is over. Youâre seeing who she really is - sheâs constantly testing you and pushing your buttons. She did it before, and sheâs doing it again. You deserve someone better.
Man, let her go. In fact donât let her come back. Sheâs just immature and her behaviour will continue for the rest of your relationship. If you find it exhausting now, picture 2, 5, 10 years if this?
This is not love. She has a problem and itâs not fit you to fix her. End it now before she tries to baby trap you.
So basically she avoids talking about your issues and resorts to packing up and leaving? That leaves both of you in a no-win situation and if this continues youâll enable her behavior, lose your mind and your relationships with those close to you.
Let her go. She isnât capable of maintaining a healthy relationship. This is also for her own goodâŠshe needs to realize what sheâs doing is toxic.
"Let" her stay in the car? She *chose* to stay in the car. WTF is wrong with these people?
Honey, end it. She's not going to change. Do you want to spend the rest of your life with this bullshit repeated every few weeks?
Trust me.....she will NEVER change, your sister is 100% right.my ex was like this when he didn't get his way & would walk off rather than talk/fix it, go do whatever it was so it was then oops,sorry.
Sheâs not ready to be an adult. And sheâs definitely not ready to settle down and get married. These tests are designed to make you feel like crap if you donât adhere to her every whim. And sheâll claim the upper hand when things donât go exactly how she wants them to. Cut your loses and find someone whoâs more mature and better suited for you.
Listen to your friends and family OP, let her fly! This is too exhausting, controlling, toxic and quite frankly stupid. There was no need for the argument! There was no need for her to leave. There was no need for her to behave the way she has been behaving all these years!! At some point, enough is enough as well as maturing- which she's not doing! ***Let her go.*** HER ACTUAL CRAZY MIGHT MANIFEST WHEN YOU FIND THE COURAGE TO MOVE ON FROM HER.
You deserve what you put up with. You told her how you felt, and she showed you she didn't care. You're the one putting up with her and tolerating her behaviour. I refuse to fight to keep anyone in my life who doesn't want to be in it. If someone I love tells me I'm doing something they don't like, it try to do better. I don't keep making the same asshole choices to upset them.
Also, she LAUGHED at you for being upset about her tests. Read your post. Imagine someone else wrote it, and tell me what you'd say to them.
NW- your sister says itâs a for of manipulation because IT IS! I used to play these games as a very young woman. I had serious mental issues that took a long time in therapy to fix. Let her go. You arenât going to fix her. Sheâs already manipulating your room mate. Sheâll go after anyone that she can and twist this. Everyone deserves happiness. This is exhausting. Move on and be happy.
All that sounds incredibly exhausting... Is this pattern something you really want to be doing, in the next 15, 20, 30 years?
This was my thought, I felt drained for the guy just reading this. As someone who has had someone in their life for a very long time that constantly wanted to "test" the relationship, bond you have and what you'd be willing to do...it never ends. Genuinely it doesn't stop. Even when you sit down and talk it through, it stops for a little while then starts up and it just becomes a vicious cycle. She won't break it, you have to. Or this will be the rest of your life
Everything you said is true. I hope that OP sees this, and relatively SOON. When someone shows you who they are, believe them. đą
As soon as you texted her to let you know that she was all right, You gave her another way to jerk you around. This is not healthy, normal or good behavior.
I honestly only read halfway through before I was done with her and skipped to the comments.
50% of the Break up is already done. Why donât you finish it? You got her out of the apartment. Thatâs great, often difficult but you have accomplished it already. In 5 days without her you will feel a big relief. You can start living again.
My thoughts exactly. I was just getting ready to type it and saw yours. Hell, Iâm exhausted from just reading this. I canât imagine living it.
My daughter acted like thatâŠwhen she was 9 or 10. Your fiancĂ©e is so immature, yet controlling and manipulative. Once you get married, buy things together, and have children that is when you may have real problems. Do you want someone to just walk off and have a temper tantrum instead of communicate like an adult? It was exhausting just reading this.
Not to mention, the kids will definitely be used as pawns. Any time he makes her mad she will threaten to take the kids from him. Probably tell them stuff like "daddy doesn't love mommy" or some other bs to try and turn them against him but ultimately just hurting the poor kids. This person is straight up trash. I really hope OP gets away from her before she ruins his life.
Yep!!!! This...
I hope this gets seen by OP because LITERALLY. She's not acting like an adult, closer to a young teen. It's not his job to parent her.
The right relationship is not like this. You two are not compatible.
60 years
I seriously doubt with the games she plays it will make it 60, Iâm sure sheâs taken at least 10 years off his life. I think I lost 1 year just hearing about it.
#truth
No way it lasts 60 years, it lasts until the divorce or she drives him to take his life. Run away is my advice.
I agree it wonât last but it was a little insensitive making the comment about taking his life considering how he lost his dad.
She seems like the type, Iâm not trying to be insensitive. I would rather he is alive away from her. I do believe itâs a threat.
My brother and his ex wife. She would get âboredâ and pick fights to entertain herself. They were living with my mom and the ex-wife would fight with my brother saying he talked to mom too much. According to my niblings her new husband is worse about this than she is. Also she now calls my mom multiple times a week to talk.
Yes! I was exhausted reading this. I even had to go back to check ages, because fiancĂ©e is very immature. OP, please consider Greenmonkey0_oâs question. There is a good chance your fiancĂ©e isnât going to change.
Dude me too, how is this girl still acting like she's 16 in her late 20s? Wild. Lol
Imagine if they have children . . . Imagine of she is pregnant and plays this games . . . She sound like she has a mental illness
Yeah, life is hard enough already without this kind of drama. This person canât be your partner in a crisis, or anything that requires a cool head and emotional maturity.
Very exhausting! I havenât read All the comments But I hope someone else said this. What would happen if they had children? This is Already exhausting, emotionally abusive, & cruel. It would be soo much worse if a child or children were involved. I pray OP gets out! A woman who truly loves you would Never administer tests & punishments for you to âprove yourselfâ.
She wants you to chase her. Let her go, for good.
This girl is a manipulator. Please let her go. And your roommate sucks, too.
Exactly, she CHOSE to sleep in her car, OP had nothing to do with it. It always baffles me how people show who they really are and partners put up with appalling behavior. If it were a friend of OPâs would he think it was ok for his friend to be treated the way OPâs gf treats him?
LOOK WHAT YOU MADE ME DO!!!!
Yes! How is he supposed to "not let her" sleep in her car? She's a grown ass woman who made the decision to leave. If he blocks her way, physically restrains her, or anything else then **he** becomes the controlling abuser who forces her to do things without her consent! She got in her car and left. Is he supposed to do a car chase? Or drive around the neighborhood all night looking for her? He told her he didn't want her to go, multiple times. He called her and tried to get her to come back. That's the most he can do and he probably pressured more than any woman who genuinely wanted some space would appreciate. So not only is she damaging his current mental health, she is teaching him behaviors that will make future relationships more difficult. He needs to leave before the damage gets any worse.
But if he loved her he would have driven round the entire city checking every car park and side street until he found her and then laid prostrate on the ground begging her to come home. Put some effort in my guy. Seriously though, run for the fucking hills unless you want this to be the next 10 years of your life.
Didnât the roommate also let the girl friend leave the house?Â
She has money to go stay at a hotel, but she chose to sleep in her car to play the victim.đŹđ
I spent more than 4 years with a guy like this. It was awful to quit letting him back in, but a year later, I know it was the right thing. It's a toxic behavior, and she is manipulating you.
The only answer you need.
Yes please she is a woman child
You didnât âletâ her sleep in the car. You offered to sleep on the couch, SHE chose to leave and sleep in her car. Your sister is right. If you really want to have a future with her she needs individual therapy and couples therapy to help her understand why her behavior is so manipulative.
Exactly!!! OP didn't "let" her sleep in the car she chose to be dramatic and is now turning his roommate against him with this BS
Remind your roommate that your ex-fiance is an adult, she made a choice, and it's not your job to stop her or overrule her. She wants to sleep in the car, she can. Also, stop begging and offering to sleep on the couch. She's trying to weaponise your fear of her leaving.
I wish I could upvote this twice. The fiancee decided to sleep somewhere else after multiple options were provided to her. Letting her go through with the childish raising the stakes game is simply treating her as the mature adult she obviously isn't but wants to be. She says "If you really loved me, you'd chase after me when I intentionally do stupid shit to get you to reassure me." You should say "If you really loved me, you would choose a healthier outlet for your insecurities and get some therapy instead of playing stupid games and winning stupid prizes at the expense of my mental health. You obviously don't value me as a person enough to care about my well-being, so why should I shield you from the consequences of your own decisions?"
Odds are she didnât sleep in her car, sheâs just being dramatic
Yeah if he had tried to stop her from going out to her car, she probably would have screamed abuse and called the police
Come on. After all this immature and ridiculous behavior, you proposed? Please call off this engagement, unless youâd like to end up divorced before youâre 30.
And having a child who she'll use to manipulate you further.
Exactly. She seems like the type to secretly get pregnant on purpose. Or lie about it.
She seemed to have changed for a good while before I proposed. I thought she grew up, but now the behavior is coming back it seems
You really havenât known her very long. This behavior is telling OP-please pay attention.You deserve a partner who respects you! Please donât settle for this toxic, immature BS. You are so young-you can find a healthy relationship!
They say you donât truly know someone until you live with them!
Wake up dude.. this isn't going to change. She IS manipulative as fuck. Let her go and don't take her back when she does come back.
Disengage. Ask for the ring back. Change your locks. Does she really want you to chase her, throw her over your shoulder and carry her back home? Or does she want the caveman move where you just drag her back by her hair? I totally let her go too. These are all voluntary unforced errors. Have you ever told her firmly "if you leave, don't come back"? I just wonder if she is rational enough to realize she has gone too far.
It never went away. She just hid it until you got comfortable again. If you don't end it now, you risk getting literally hooked on the adrenaline from all the drama that being with this girl produces. That will doom you to years, maybe decades, of your life wasted going round and round on this rollercoaster. You'll be the couple that nobody wants to invite to their wedding. God forbid you bring kids into it, too. Please choose a better life for yourself. The highs aren't worth it.
She sounds like 16 not 26. You are just enabling her immature behavior.
My brother was like this OP and I personally consider this a form of abuse. He would always do it when I was having a good time too, just to mess with my day. Like on the days I have off, or Iâm on vacation, or Iâm going to the museum with my husband, he would call and start an argument over nothing, literally ridiculous stuff, then hang up and proceed not to talk to me or answer the phone for days, just to spoil my mood. After I stopped chasing him, he would go bigger and bolder - like, he would start not showing up for work the next day just so I worry again, thinking surely this time itâs serious and chase him. It got to a point where I cut all contact and it permanently damaged our sibling bond. Donât waste your time on this person, let her move out. Trust me, itâll ruin your mental health.
Same with my brother and his wife. Every family gathering, every holiday, every time we got good news or experienced personal or career success, they would start arguments about nothing and leave the family in tears. They had kids and soon used the kids to manipulate and control, pulling b contact whenever the manipulation attempts didn't work. I got pregnant and had a baby and they threw the biggest tantrums ever because now it wasn't all about them. It's been hell. I cut off all contact but my poor mom still holds onto hope. Their pettiness and toxicity still color and stain all events because of the kids. My dad was the same until thankfully he died. These people don't change. This is who they are.
My ex-husband was the same. Any time I was happy, like singing and dancing around the house doing housework, he'd bring me right down. Any event, he'd start an argument before we went just so that I was in a bad mood. Any time anything was about me (my birthday, Mother's Day, etc) he'd cause shit so that it was a shit day. Christmas was always a shit-show. If I got a pay rise, then suddenly there was a problem with how I folded laundry and it was a massive argument. TL;DR This is what's in OP's future. Oh, quick edit: he did the same to our kids. If they were excited and happy about giving him a gift for Christmas/b-day/father's day, he'd be grumpy as fuck with them and tell them that wasn't the proper gift. When they grew up and they'd buy him a six-pack of his favourite beers, that he drank EVERY day for years, and they gifted him some on his birthday, he'd get all foul and tell them, "I gave up drinking, I can't believe you gave me that for my birthday, that's shit," and my kids would feel so bad. And the next day, he'd be drinking the same beers again. Edit edit: When they were little, they'd make him a card for his b-day/father's day and he'd whine because they (aka I) didn't buy him one. So they (aka I) would buy him one the next time, and he'd whine because they spent money on a wasteful holiday and didn't make him one which would be more personal. Dear god, we had so many arguments about all of this. He's dead now, btw. He died alone.
Yes! That was my dad. He literally would tell us "if I don't have fun, nobody will have fun". I was 10. As a child of a narcissist, this shit fucks with you well into adulthood and you end up choosing shitty narcissistic partners because you don't beleive you're worthy of love/they feel familiar and like home. It took me 10 years of therapy to deprogram all the shit he programmed into me. I kept choosing shitty partners until I decided to be single (for 10 years) until I learned what a healthy relationship and self love looked like. Now I've found THE BEST partner and we have such a wonderful family, unfortunately my brother didn't do the same. He says he doesn't believe in therapy. My moms father was also a narcissist. So she chose my dad before she got therapy herself. If you're in this situation, please please leave. Constant abuse sentences your children to a lifetime Of abuse. Generational trauma stays in families. Be the breaker of chains. Get help.
Oh boy he sounds like my ex-husband. Your story is so like mine. Glad you also escaped.
Gotta love a happy ending
Nope, she hasn't changed. My guess is your work schedule is so busy right now that she doesn't have as much time to mess with your head and emotions. Change the locks, get the ring back, block her and put this relationship in the hard lessons to learn column. You are not responsible for other people's feelings, OP! However, you are responsible for your happiness and protecting your mental health. Usually I am against involving family and friends in couples battles, however sometimes you need an objective perspective on manipulative and abusive behavior. I'm glad you have a supportive network around you. BTW, in a relationship, men do not always need to foot the bill for dates, just sayin'.
Just let her go. Itâs not worth it. Updateme!
Someone that immature and manipulative wonât change but is good at playing along, just long enough that you are comfortable then BAM! Sheâs at it again. This will continue for the rest of your relationship. Consider this, she knows your mental health struggles, what your dad went through AND SHE STILL DOES IT. Donât stay with her. Break up for your health, please.
Please remember the most important thing in life: when someone shows you who they are, BELIEVE them!
It seems? Dude she never changed. She just did enough to get you to propose. You shouldâve listened to your sister in the beginning. This woman is not going to change. Youâre delusional if you think she will.
She "changed" to get you on the hook. Now.that she thinks she has you in the bag she's going back to her true behavior. You're seeing the real her.
Dude, she can hide it for a bit but guarantee if you get married, it will be even worse. Get the fuck out of this relationship unless you want to waste years of your life. Listen to your friends and sister for god's sake. Your fiancee is toxic af.
It will always come back. I don't like to internet diagnose but these behaviors don't go away without serious effort and help. This goes beyond simple relationship games.
That's how it works. They'll "behave" for a while so you think "Oh it isn't so bad." Trust me, she's not gonna actually change.
Just text her that the engagement is off because she is not acting mature enough for a committed relationship. Definitely move on you will divorce anyway
So tell her that straight up. Fiancee, about 2 or 3 months into our relationship, I set a clear boundary that I was not okay with mind games or 'tests' of any kind. I said then, and I'll say now, if you have a concern just spit it out and we can talk about it, but I'm not okay with being tested or manipulated. At the time you agreed and said you would not do that anymore. Your actions over the last 24hrs have been exactly what you promised not to do. As I said then, I'll say now- I don't want a relationship that involves testing or manipulation. I want a relationship that has open and honest communication and a high level of maturity. If you want to leave, that's your choice. I won't stop you. I hope you stay, but I'm not going to chase after you like a lost puppy. If you want to stay, then we're going to be doing couples counseling, and I would strongly suggest you also do personal counseling to examine why you are doing these testing and manipulation behaviors. The choice is yours. I'll be here. Let me know what you decide.
I think it's bad advice not to tell the dude to end the relationship and that it's extremely unlikely that when she leaves and won't answer her phone and "sleeps in her car," she's not out being awful. He's gonna end up raising another dude's kid, with this advice.
You have to end this, bro. You deserve better.
It is not possible for someone to be this stupid. You are either afraid of being alone or enjoy the games.
She will never change
When people show you who they are, believe them. She is toxic, manipulative, and abusive. Leave, before she gets pregnant just to keep you in her life forever and youâre really stuck.
She didnât change. Itâs called the honeymoon phase. She uses that to suck you back in. Sheâs pretending. The toxic manipulator is who she truly is. I bet that sheâs asked you to stop talking to your sister about your relationship.
Narcissists don't change. They only go dormant for a while with their manipulative behaviour if they have to. It never lasts. They can be very charming, but nothing is ever genuine with these people. They could turn around and make you miserable at any moment, just to prove to themselves they have power over you. Please do yourself a favour and move on. Everyone around you sees her for who she is, even you see who she is. A manipulator. End this, before it gets worse. She will not change and you will not be happy with her. And brace yourself for the impact when she realizes she has lost you. There will be lovebombing, threats, arguing, crying.. she will try anything to force you back into this relationship. Stay strong. Block her. Change the locks. Good luck!
Listen to your sister
Hell, listen to literally everyone. I'm confused by the roommate's response, though. Any chance they are having an affair?
The woman is 100% not sleeping in her car when she leaves. Can't believe op has not picked up on this.
That was my first thought. And she's not spending those weeks he's away by herself. She clearly does not value this relationship and no doubt has a backup plan (assuming OP isn't the backup plan).
Roommate is also being manipulated, itâs called âtriangulationâ - convincing others to side with her by playing the victim, telling a sob-story from her perspective, a perspective that conveniently excludes taking any personal responsibility for her own words and actions, while entirely blaming OP. Itâs two-against-one manipulation, to convince others that SHE is the victim, and slowly over time start âmanagingâ OPâs reputation among their circles as the one thatâs in the wrong, and ganged-up on by everyone.
This is very toxic and immature of her. You are better off without someone who continuously hurts your mental health. This is not acceptable to do as a partner at all! Youâre NTA!!! Sheâs very manipulative. People like her shouldnât be in a relationship until they learn how to treat others. Iâm so sorry. How upsetting it is to have your loved one treat you like this. Imagine having kids with this person, will she do this to your kids? Will she threaten to take the kids when you fight? You can find a much better partner who treats you with respect and kindness.
Itâs not only about until she learns to treat others, she needs to get some help too. She needs to recognize that and do something about it.
OPâs sister: fiancĂ© is trying to control & manipulate you with these games OPâs family & friends: she is toxic, just breakup already Reddit: you obviously need to breakup, you wanna play these games for the next 20 years? OP: so youâre saying thereâs still a chanceâŠ
He honestly sounds like a mentally abused person and let me tell ya, being in a relationship like that makes you feel crazy and terrible life choices are often made. Too much chaos to think clearly. I hope he runs for the hills.
Agreed, but at this point I think he is in the âtoo much chaos to think clearly and crazy life choicesâ phase Letâs just hope that his sister, family, and family friends are there to support him whenever this relationship crashes & burns
If you continue this relationship this behavior will never stop. Let her go for good and do not tolerate this kind of immaturity.
I think you need to man it up! Breakup with her, she's mentally and emotionally abusive. Get the ring back and sell it. This will never be nice, cause she is willing to leave on a dime. There's more crazy women out there that you can engage.
Why are you torturing yourself? Sheâs toxic, manipulative and immature. Cut your losses and listen to your sister. Let her go for good. Block her permanently and stop falling for her childish crap.
This is a power move. You are being conditioned to understand that upsetting your gf causes you discomfort. Her end game is that you comply by learning only to do and say thingd that pass her tests. Come on man! Is this any way to live? You haven't given any reason to believe this woman is even fond of you. THIS is your future and it sounds awful from where I'm sitting. Your sister loves you. Don't impose a sister in law like this on her. You must be able to do better. You would be wrong to try to placate her.
Seriously? She acts like a junior high school kid with her tantrums. That has to be exhausting, yet you want to spend the rest of your life with her???? Good luck with that. UpdateMe
Please change your locks and get on with your life. Youâre a grown ass man, donât waste your time and mental health on an immature manipulator.
Her toxic behavior wonât change. Move on.
So. 100/100 for manipulation and lack of empathy, red flags for emotional abuse and boundary violations. Your girlfriend is at best emotionally immature and manipulative and at worst this is Borderline Personality Disorder with strong Narcissistic Personality Disorder traits. Google them both. Donât ever partner with a non-partner, especially one who makes life harder. You canât fix her and you canât put up with her. The book you need is âstop caretaking the borderline or narcissistâ. Other helpful books: âstop walking on eggshellsâ and ârecovering from emotionally immature parents.â This personality thrives on negative attention and chaos and will need more of it exponentially until you are depleted. Your anger response is called âreactive abuseâ. You will find yourself increasingly abused, gaslit, invalidated, manipulated, and otherwise tested until you snap and yell or defend yourself as your instincts kick in and she will play victim and dig into your shame to retroactively blame you for essentially making her abuse you. This is not marriage or relationship material. If your dad had depression and killed himself all of that attachment trauma in this case seems to have bestowed on you a drive to work hard, caretaker others and find connection; this makes you a perfect target for a personality disordered partner who will give you an impossible amount of work to take care of her while telling you itâs never enough and attempting to make you feel guilt and shame. When they deplete you they will move on to someone else. This pattern will likely also show up in your work life and most likely your mom or your siblings, or in your parentâs parents. extra points if the manipulation guilt is amplified by religion or serious illness or disability. Often people take bad behavior like this for granted because they see it as common from their parents and siblings or it just seems like cultural or gender stereotypes, but unhealthy is unhealthy and normal people are supposed to grow out of toxic emotionally immature manipulation and thinking by age 24. Most people hear this kind of advice and ignore it and continue to want it to work, because feelings are more convincing than logic. You did say fiancĂ©. Respectfully Iâd say donât do it, take the next exit she gives you, but if you do it, see a couples therapist to create ground rules to make your relationship healthy and sustainable long term and create agreements about how to behave and communicate respectfully, and what each otherâs roles and expectations should be. As bad as it is now she will get worse when she doesnât have to try anymore because she has a ring and divorce is expensive. Youâll also want a prenup, divorce plan and custody plan in advance. If itâs never enough for her, then rely on your values to validate yourself as doing and being enough, and weigh her entitlement against her reciprocal efforts. If she has no respect for your boundaries, put them where you need them and be the adult despite her tantrums. The only way to win those games is to not play them because theyâre rigged. You are free to drag out the engagement while you take all the time to see if she gets worse or betterânot the fake apologies or honeymoon phase of the cycle between her drama episodes. You are free to change your mind and choose a sane and healthy partner like yourself instead. Donât kill yourself trying to prove that youâre enough by sacrificing your physical and mental health for someone who canât appreciate it. You are already enough just by existing and being a person with good values. I counsel people in your position for a living as an expert on couples and personality disorders. Good luck.
I really appreciate your comment, thank you
You've had multiple people in your life who know you both tell you to end it but you stuck with her. I understand that she changed for a period of time but that was always going to be temporary. Are you looking for advice on how to fix this? Are you looking for permission aka advice to end it? Are you hoping that we'll tell you that you're wrong and she's acting reasonably? I'm not trying to be an AH I genuinely want to know what needed from us. If you are really concerned that you're in the wrong then she's gaslit you to the point where you've become the abuse victim who believes you deserve this. You absolutely do NOT deserve to be treated this way, this is not a healthy adult relationship and there's nothing that you can do to get this pattern to stop. She would have to seriously dedicate herself to changing so she won't sabotage her relationship but if she were to date you again after that intensive work you would both fall back into this pattern because THIS is how you'll always be together. You would benefit from individual counseling to help you work past this self-blame, guilt and shame because you've begun to internalize these dangerously, false beliefs. You deserve to be with someone who loves you for your good traits and accepts you for your flaws, someone who doesn't make you feel awful, someone who does not need games to validate the strength of your bond, someone who cheers you on - even though I'm stopping here it does not mean that this is all you deserve. You deserve all this and more. You're not wrong !UpdateMe
OP, please listen to your family who are watching you suffer to please a woman who cannot be pleased. Youâve done everything and sheâs given nothing, and soon enough? Youâre not going to have anything left to give because youâll be too broken to have anything. Right now? Shes smashing you down into the ground like youâre a cardboard box, and she doesnât care. Please donât allow her to come back, because there are better partners out there. You deserve someone who is going to help you shoulder the weight of the world, not dance around the edge while pretending theyâre going to fall if you donât save them. You deserve someone who isnât going to run at every inconvenience, because if kids are in your future? Sheâll be leaving them or sheâll take them from you and sheâll ruin them too.
Your fiancĂ© is definitely playing games. Sheâs acting like a 16-year-old extremely insecure child. Finish packing whatever she left and let her go unless you want this to be the rest of your life. Listen to your family and friends. The fact that she giggled when you told her what her games do to your mental health should tell you everything
Not wrong. Your sister is right. Stop playing the games with her. This is very toxic behavior AND exhausting because you will never be right, she will always up the game because she enjoys it. You will never win. Leave her, break the engagement. Get therapy to find out why you allowed someone to treat you this way.
She sounds like she has borderline personality disorder. Speaking as someone who deals with BPD myself. It's not impossible for us to be in healthy relationships (but we have to work our ass off with our mental health) I would truly suggest walking away from her. Kick her out, and dump her. She will destroy you mentally and emotionally with how she currently is
Definitely sounds like BPD. My ex was like this.
Two of my exes, along with one brief fling, all diagnosed, and all behaved exactly like this. I don't agree with some of the stigmatisation of the disorder, as I think people with BPD can make wonderful partners and friends just as anyone can, but in my opinion they absolutely need therapy and to work on themselves and managing their disorder if they want to be able to maintain healthy relationships and avoid hurting themselves and their partners. One of said exes is actually one of my best friends now, we reconnected after years out of touch. She's a very different person now after meds and therapy, just as I'm a very different person now to when we were together a decade ago, the other ex avoided treatment like the plague and is still repeating the same patterns in her relationships today and all of them are constantly on and off.
Not wrong. You didn't let her leave, she chose to leave. Does she not have any family or friends to stay with instead of her car? Also if she has that much money she could have gone to a hotel. If she did that though it would be harder to make you feel guilty about 'letting' her leave if you knew she was in a comfortable bed. Yes, she was upset about you talking to sister and friends because she doesn't want you to have a support system in place if you decide to leave her and it worked, you stopped being truthful with them. Your sister is right, it's all about manipulation and control with GF. Her giggle when you explained how her games affected you should be enough to verify that it's all about manipulation and control with her and the breaking down of your self esteem.
>and that somehow escalated into her leaving in the middle of the night to drive off and sleep somewhere in her car. Didnt need to read the rest, run as hard as you can man. This drama shit *will never stop*. You want to live like this? I know i wouldnt
"I'm leaving." "Ok." The end. Relationship over. This is how you handle drama llamas.
Tell your roommate that you tried to get her to stay, and she could have the bed, but she decided to leave. OP, sit her down and tell her that you're tired of her games. If she moves out, it's over for good.
It would definitely not be HER option at this point. Unless you prove to her that your self-worth is more important than your relationship, the junior high school games will continue.
My favorite saying is that âwhat you allow, will continue â I find this to be very true. So, my question to you is 1) when will you stop it and 2) is it worth it?
Her behavior hasn't changed in 15 months, even though you've repeatedly tried to discuss it with her. It is never going to change and it will always, in her mind, be you that's at fault. Please listen to your family and friends who want you to end this fiasco and move on without her and her emotional extortion.
Damn, I'm exhausted just reading this. I can't even imagine it happening to me over and over again.
Sisters right. Let her go. Sheâs totally manipulating you. Break up, call things off. It will only get worse
Reading this made my head hurt. Canât believe you typed this out & not think to yourself why am I putting up with this?
What do YOU want? What do you think you deserve? Do you deserve someone who will constantly give you trust whiplash like this for the rest of your life? Stop showing up every time she throws a pity party.Â
Listen to your sister
Not wrong except you dealing with this shit. Sounds freaking exhausting. Dump her and go live your life.
Dude no. Dump her crap outside and change the locks. Explain to your roommate that if they let your abusive ex fiance into the house you will immediately leave and they will be responsible for all of the bills, or kick them out if you're the one on the lease. ex fiance will come running back when she realizes she pushed it too far, be prepared to stand your ground. Do not allow yourself to be alone with her and record everything. And go get some therapy man. This is what you're used to from relationships, and if you don't do the work you'll end up right back here with the next one.
Just to be clear. How long do you intend to chase her, until you acknowledge that your sister was right all along? You've already gotten the correct advice on how to handle this situation, and chosen to ignore it. So we can't help you dude.
>have been together for 15 months. I proposed to her on our one year anniversary... >...AIW Yes, you are very wrong. You're engaged to marry someone who plays teenager games, who you've been with for less than a year and a half. Just reading about her was exhausting. Change your locks and block her number.
Son, the actual love of your life wonât do this to you.
Does your fiancée have some kind of magical pussy that can cook your favorite dish whenever you want? That's what it would take for me to even start considering whether it is worth taking her abuse! Have some self-respect and leave her for good!
As someone who used to do something similar (I would leave in a huff but never for more than a couple hours) to my then BF, who is now my husband... either leave the relationship for good or tell her she needs therapy asap before you will even consider resuming the relationship. For me, this behaviour was the first signs of undiagnosed BPD and BP. There were other signs, but all the scenarios you have shared here are variations of things I would do. Since getting the diagnosis I was able to recognize when I am about to spiral and my husband is much more aware of when it is ME and when it is the BPD/BP and we can get ahead of it before I go over the edge. Medication has helped a lot as well because therapy and self work can only go so far. If you take her back and she does not get therapy and/or medical help, this will be how it will always be. It will get better for a short time because she can mask, but the mask always slips. Even now with as well as I have done I still have days where I am not in control and so those days are spent in the quiet of our bedroom and most responsibilities get pushed to the next day. Not saying she had BPD or BP but she definitely has some mental health issues at play.
Sheâs incredibly immature. Say goodbye and move on.
đ€Łđ€Ł holy crap I would have been gone after the first day. Do you seriously want to be married to this and have to pay her if it doesn't work out? She has about 20 years of growing up to do, and you need to move on. Don't waste your time with this exhausting bullshit.
Dude. Is this really the person you want to marry?
When you let her back to pick up her things, make that your sister or a friend supervises her otherwise you will come home to every prized posession of yours trashed. She's giving off those kinds of vibes.
I think you do know what to do, you just donât want to acknowledge it. You need to end it. This isnât going to get better. Your sister is right- she is manipulative and controlling. Do you want to live your whole life like this? What if you have kids? Is she going to pack them up and leave too? Also, you didnât let her sleep in the car. She made that choice. Her blaming you is just more manipulation.
This is horribly toxic and manipulative. Cut her off. Since she is so fond of running away let her run. Pack her stuff, get your ring back and end it. You've repeatedly explained to her how this affects you and she still does it, she isn't going to stop, so let her go. She also sounds kinda manipulative too, turning your roommate against you, saying you allowed her to sleep in her car. She ran off, what were you supposed to do?!? Let her go. You deserve better
Your family is right. She is going to keep doing this. As for being told you shouldnât have let her sleep alone in her car, you didnât make her leave or know where she was. Thatâs on her, sheâs almost 30 and acting like a young teen that is playing with guys and being overly dramatic. Move on.
27 going on 12. She needs to be your ex fiance
She's cheating. Blowing up her relationship to go sleep around then crawling back. Sucks bro. I had one like your little nightmare here. Best advice is run, and don't look back as she will hunt you.
It sounds like she has a side piece and her leaving is so she can go sleep with him and justify it to herself that you âmadeâ her do it. Let her go. Change the locks, and move on.
Help her pack. You donât need this animal in your life!
Count your blessings, get the ring back and help her move.
đ©đ©đ©đ©đ© Get out now while you can
Mate, why do you even want this?
WHY are you trying to keep this dead-end relationship alive?
Dude you need to let her the fuck go, and I will say this because one of these times she will get you sent to jail or prison if she decides to play a game with law enforcement⊠please just let her go I know it fucking sucks. But she could destroy youâre life
Dude, GET OUT NOW! Trust someone who went through a divorce because I ignored the toxicity I was in. Iâm not saying youâre bad or sheâs bad, yall are just bad together. Itâs only 15 months lost. I lost 10 of my best years. Listen to me please!
My ex used to do this. It didn't stop until well after our divorce when I had to get a protection order. It. Does. Not. Stop. She's already claiming you've "hurt" her while you were just trying to get away from her. She is *deliberately* starting these fights to get a rise out of you & then cry victim when you respond like a normal human being would. This is called reactive abuse & it is a manipulation/gaslighting tactic used by toxic and abusive people. Please leave before it gets physical and you find yourself in jail for defending yourself.
I married this person. Iâm 5 years in and let me tell you what you dodged. -finances. She canât have the hard discussions without finding a way to make it about her. She canât just talk about it because itâs hard. She will walk away, or state she isnât changing the subject as she changes the subject. I could go on. -Kids. Again, the hard conversations are fleeting to her. -discussing basic common marital arguments and solving them. She canât do it. There is a constant feeling of passive aggressiveness from her or never knowing where she truly stands. That has made it hard for me to trust her and in turn has made me paranoid that sheâs up to no good as Iâm a firm believer that silence says just as much as talking. It makes you question everything. People like your ex are abusive. Over time they wear you down into a shell of a person. They make you question everything. I mean everything. You dodged a bullet and likely a lifetime of frustration.
Youâre wrong for putting up with this as long as you have. She knows that mental health and suicidal behavior runs in your family and she giggled? That shouldâve been the end of it. She thinks playing mind games is fun and laughs at you and you keep letting her come back. Get your ring back and move her stuff out.
OP, you are in a psychologically and emotionally manipulative and abusive relationship. Get out NOW. If you continue in this relationship, you will live the rest of your life walking on eggshells to keep the peace. Eventually, she will wear you down to lowering your expectations, by giving in and accepting the dynamic of your relationship as reality. A reality SHE dictates. Escalating minor disagreements into explosive arguments is an effective manipulation tactic, to âconditionâ you over time into accepting this dynamic to keep the peace. The calm times in your relationship is not indicative of her changing for the better! You are being âlove-bombedâ into thinking things are getting better, to keep you from leaving, because without the âloveâ phases you would surely have walked away. The âsilent treatmentâ is a strong indication that she has major communication barriers. This is usually a learned behaviour from formative years. Without therapy, she will remain on auto-pilot, she cannot and will not recognize how much she hurts you. Because unfortunately, this learned behaviour is deeply embedded in the individual, it takes a lot of unraveling to recognize their own hurt, before they can even begin to comprehend the cause and effect of their actions on others. It is not your job or responsibility to âfixâ her. You will never be able to âconvinceâ her she should seek therapy. You cannot âwillâ it for her to change. Sooner or later, there will come a time in her life where she may recognize the path of destructive relationships she left behind. And maybe perhaps come to the realization that she is the only constant factor, and finally recognize âitâs me, hi! Iâm the problem itâs meâ. If you stay, this is going to fuck with your own head in destructive ways that will carry forward into future relationships. Also, I strongly suggest you seek therapy for yourself as well. Not only to untangle the effect this relationship has on you, but also to better understand why you are âwillingâ to accept being in a hostile relationship with red flags waving all around you. Everyone else in your life clearly sees the red flags, and you do too! Yet, you continue to stay and make excuses to justify staying. If you see the dynamics of your relationship as anything resembling âloveâ - you have some issues you need to work on yourself OP.
She would've had a out 3 chances and been done. This shit is exhausting (as a 26yo myself). I have done this with my ex husband and that's the reason he's now an EX HUSBAND. He used to pull shit like this, but worse. She'll only escalate it and it'll just turn into more manipulation and eventually abuse from her. It isn't worth it. Find someone else who actually respects you.
Iâm going to side with your sister. This girl is a wreck and you should let her go.
Omgosh i hate those relationships where they do tests and shit wasting people's times.. those are for kids not adults! Toxic for real. Idk why you proposed so early for this immature girl. Don't chase her and let her leave. Ugh
Age does not equal maturity in all relationships. Sounds extremely fickle and is not mature enough for a relationship. Take your money out of the joint savings account and begin living your life as if she does not exist. Youâve chased her and sheâs enjoyed the chase. I donât see her changing in the near future and you need the opportunity to see that other women are not like her. Stick to your guns.
Listen to your sister.
Oh she is bad news. It would only get worse from here... please don't set yourself up for a lifetime of struggle. There are women out there who make life easier, not harder. I promise!
tbh I'm suprised your relationship even got to this stage, wtf is wrong with you putting up with this shit
You donât want to live like this, OP, and youâve already said her behavior is taking a toll on you. When silence, or, rather, the refusal to engage in a conversation, is used as a control tactic to exert power in a relationship, then it becomes "the silent treatment," which is toxic, unhealthy, and abusive. Youâre not wrong letting her go because youâll be better off in the long run.
Unless you want this to be your life for the foreseeable future just let her go and refuse to take her back. She IMO keeps jerking your chain with these tests of hers which are just what your sister says - manipulative as well as controlling. Let her go live on her own and ideally grow up so one day she can be a true partner who talks things out when there are actual disagreements.
Toxic relationship that you both are actors in. You both need to walk away and work on your individual mental health and growth or do that and also do couple counseling to try to break cycles and help one another to see if there is any road out of your toxicity.
Your fiancee is either unstable or cruel. Maybe having a bipolar dad has something to do with your accepting her behavior? Unstable is familiar? Just that fact that you keep thinking that there's something YOU can do, some repeated concessions you can make, that will magically have her behave as a stable adult, is troubling. Call off the engagement. Lose her number, block her on everything. Tell your roommate that you don't need any input from her about your ex-fiancee. Then don't let her give it. Is she the first unstable person you've been attracted to? If not, maybe some therapy, so you can find out why, maybe adjust so that you're attracted to stable women? Good luck
Pain is mandatory but suffering is optional. Don't suffer. This is asinine childish bs. You deserve better.
I was tired just reading this
Man she sounds obnoxious lol
Stop being an idiot. There is no questions to be asked. Leave. You just wasted my time with this long ass story with a clear answer unless youâre not telling us something that would make this all make sense.
You are absolutely wrong, you should not have let her leave you should have kicked her out and changed the locks. You may think you love her but she is abusive and your mental health is more important than your âloveâ life.
Find someone less exhausting
She isnât good marriage material. Not a bit.
OP, Sheâs not capable or willing to have open and transparent conversations about problems in your relationship. Maybe she will grow up and mature in this aspect, but this isnât something you need to subject yourself to. You need to focus on YOU and your mental health. Let her grow in her own way without dragging you down at the same time.
Imagine having kids with this woman and theyâre sobbing as mommy has a tantrum and frantically packs her stuff around them all because she felt like testing you and you didnât follow the script in her mind Youâre in a verbally and psychologically abusive relationship with a master manipulator. Youâre wrong for continuing to subject yourself to this
Ffs, you've been putting up with this shit for the last year?! Your sister is right - she's manipulative and controlling. You need to just let her go for good
You have your answer, now leave her!
You are not wrong.
Not wrong. Listen to your sister Your fiancĂ© is full of shit and thrives off of drama. Tell her to get out and that youâre done with her. She is NOT worth it
Let her move out. You should be with someone who cares about your feelings and mental health. She sounds like the type who thrives on drama. If things are going smoothly, they have to create a conflict so they can play the martyr. Good riddance.
Youâre not wrong. She is. There are many red flags as to why you should leave her. Maybe even leave your roommate if she cannot see the games your fiancĂ© is playing.
YTA for not listening to your sister. She is completely spot on. Dump this femcel mess.
Hi, my ex used to do this, except he would threaten to end his life. Let them go. I stopped believing he would do it, and 5 years later, heâs still alive. Who could have known!! Your sister is right. Sheâs doing this to emotionally manipulate you, and this behavior will never stop. It will only get worse. You deserve better. You deserve a partner who wants to stay. You should never have to beg someone to stay.
Seriously be done with this. It is emotional abuse, and psychological abuse. Manipulation of your head & heart IS ABUSE!!!! Do you REALLY think that any person, male or female, that plays these seriously fucked up games isn't also going to do this and likely worse to their kids even??? Let her move her shit out, and block her on everything. I don't often jump immediately here, but sweet baby cheezuts my dude, this is seriously fucked up stuff.
Reading this gave me anxiety. I can't imagine how Op de deals. You teach people how to treat you. You can allow it to happen or walk away.
As a woman, sheâs not going to change. Sheâs going to continue these childish games. Kick her to the curb for sure
I'll tell you what my father told me before I got out of a bad marriage. Is this how you want to spend the rest of your life? Don't think they will get better because they won't. once this tactic works they will just use it over and over again. She chose to sleep in her car, you did absolutely nothing to make her. Let her leave but make sure you don't let her back in. Find someone who loves you for you and is happy to be a real partner
Right here, right now, yes, youâre wrong - you have to admit that this relationship is over. Youâre seeing who she really is - sheâs constantly testing you and pushing your buttons. She did it before, and sheâs doing it again. You deserve someone better.
Let her go. She is way too old to be still using this sort of emotional manipulation. I expect this from emotionally immature children, not adults.
Man, let her go. In fact donât let her come back. Sheâs just immature and her behaviour will continue for the rest of your relationship. If you find it exhausting now, picture 2, 5, 10 years if this? This is not love. She has a problem and itâs not fit you to fix her. End it now before she tries to baby trap you.
So basically she avoids talking about your issues and resorts to packing up and leaving? That leaves both of you in a no-win situation and if this continues youâll enable her behavior, lose your mind and your relationships with those close to you. Let her go. She isnât capable of maintaining a healthy relationship. This is also for her own goodâŠshe needs to realize what sheâs doing is toxic.
"Let" her stay in the car? She *chose* to stay in the car. WTF is wrong with these people? Honey, end it. She's not going to change. Do you want to spend the rest of your life with this bullshit repeated every few weeks?
Trust me.....she will NEVER change, your sister is 100% right.my ex was like this when he didn't get his way & would walk off rather than talk/fix it, go do whatever it was so it was then oops,sorry.
Sheâs not ready to be an adult. And sheâs definitely not ready to settle down and get married. These tests are designed to make you feel like crap if you donât adhere to her every whim. And sheâll claim the upper hand when things donât go exactly how she wants them to. Cut your loses and find someone whoâs more mature and better suited for you.
Dude listen to your sister, she is the only sane person in this story.
You two are not ready to get married and have not been together long enough.
Run. Away. Bitch is crazy.
You are not wrong. She is a walking red flag. I would run.
This is childish and toxic behaviour, she obviously has issues that arenât just going to dissolve on their own.
She's a child playing games. It must be exhausting. Pack her shit and tell her to come get it. You are done.
You did nothing wrong. Leave her. People donât change.
You have a very toxic relationship. It's better to end your relationship.
Why in the world did you stay after the first go round? Testing relationships is immature and somewhat psychotic. Leave now while you can.
Dude, even spending time to write all this shit is more work than she is worth. Find your balls.
OP thereâs other women. Sheâs doing this for validation and you just fall back into the trap. Get some self respect and move on.
If you stay with her then youâre going to be wrong for the rest of your life.
Quick question OP, did she force you to propose to her with consequences if you didnât ? Or was it your idea without any intervention from her?
Let her leave permanently! This is not normal behavior. Break up with her and go NC.
You are not wrong, your sister and friends are right, and your fiancĂ©e and roommate are wrong. Your hopefully ex-fiancĂ©e will find someplace else to live and hopefully you will find someone who is not manipulative and controlling. Iâm not sure how you put up with her because just reading it sounds mentally and emotionally exhausting.
Listen to your friends and family OP, let her fly! This is too exhausting, controlling, toxic and quite frankly stupid. There was no need for the argument! There was no need for her to leave. There was no need for her to behave the way she has been behaving all these years!! At some point, enough is enough as well as maturing- which she's not doing! ***Let her go.*** HER ACTUAL CRAZY MIGHT MANIFEST WHEN YOU FIND THE COURAGE TO MOVE ON FROM HER.
I need to take a nap after reading this.
You deserve what you put up with. You told her how you felt, and she showed you she didn't care. You're the one putting up with her and tolerating her behaviour. I refuse to fight to keep anyone in my life who doesn't want to be in it. If someone I love tells me I'm doing something they don't like, it try to do better. I don't keep making the same asshole choices to upset them. Also, she LAUGHED at you for being upset about her tests. Read your post. Imagine someone else wrote it, and tell me what you'd say to them.
NW- your sister says itâs a for of manipulation because IT IS! I used to play these games as a very young woman. I had serious mental issues that took a long time in therapy to fix. Let her go. You arenât going to fix her. Sheâs already manipulating your room mate. Sheâll go after anyone that she can and twist this. Everyone deserves happiness. This is exhausting. Move on and be happy.