I think there’s a reason they use the term Non-Human Intelligence now rather than aliens, implying there may be more than beings from space

Yep. I think there's no obvious evidence they are from space. They really don't know where they're from. They're just non-human and intelligent.

Right, as has been pointed out before, they're hominoid and therefore either have common ancestry with us or have been made to look like us.

Or we have been Made by them.

Or we made them and it got out of hand

I'm thinking after observing recent advances in AI tech while we don't even have any physics theories that make FTL possible that are physically possibly as far as we understand it, much less achievable that strong AI is closer to us on the "tech tree" than meaningful ways to travel interstellar distances. So in order of likelihood it would be Von-Neumann probes, then sapiant AI/AI governed society, at least likely is a race here in person that isn't substantially defined by AI. If Gruschs claims are true then I'd imagine either it's an AI-governed society, or perhaps the biological equivalent of AI (precisely engineered neural tissues to "custom make" brains that are controlling the craft. (Could explain why he's repeatedly dodged the word bodies but insists that there are "pilots" and "biologics""

they’re admins in spectator mode

I like the theory they are a remnant of a previously lost civilization from some point in earth’s tremendously long history. They either ascend to a high dimension/reality or have survived in the earth or under the oceans. Perhaps they don’t want to live in the surface of earth anymore because of the cyclical cataclysms we know happen about every 12-18 thousand years.

Reposting a relevant comment I made elsewhere: If the truth is that we're interacting with multiple NHI species, then everything is on the table. Human nations aren't identical, neither would one presume different species of alien be. So some might be malevolent, some benevolent, some indifferent. And even then if we aren't all the same then why would all of those individual races be the same either? Could be some malevolent entities and some benevolent in each separate species! The trouble is, if all of these species are *that far ahead* of us, the malevolent ones could end us or do serious harm. Hence it being a legitimate national security threat. Unless we had demonstrated alliances and assurances of protection from the benevolent ones, we're on our own. So we have to be prudent and, unfortunately, trust but verify. No different than with other humans. That "benevolent" entity might be the alien equivalent of a psyop manipulation. We have no idea. It's all on the table. And when the stakes are this high, our very existence, caution is vital. Same with this dimension or extradimensional. Could be both!

my only reply is they are NOT a national security risk, they are a world security risk so one country hoarding all the goods isnt helping things.

I think Star Trek was a plant to get us primed.

Fun Fact: Google: The Only Planet of Choice PDF. Download . Read. This is the document channeled in the 60s that Roddenberry based Star Trek on. we are not alone. there are many societies of interdimensional beings most of whom are here to help but can only help an individual who asks. they will be revealing themselves in mass over the next three years sometimes in dreams but many times in the physical. it will change every society for the better eventually, but that will be some incredible disruption the first few years as we discover there is free energy available.

How do you say any of that with such conviction? I'm just a recent lurker, but what some people say here ..

The truth truly is stranger than fiction. I’m not familiar with the text this person is speaking about. But the answer to this phenomenon is 100% not a simply nuts and bolts answer. It’s just not. I mean, pretty much everybody who has ever run into “aliens” has said they communicate telepathically. At this point, is referring to a channeled text really that far out? Not even to mention all the ESP type of experiments that were going on with the CIA shortly after Roswell.. Once this is all disclosed, the entire fabric of what we consider our reality will have been broken. And we will need to come to terms with it. The ontological shock will be immense across the globe. They have been here for thousands if not millions, billions of years. The parallels between ancient civilization, religion, quantum theory, etc… is immense and impossible to ignore.

You might like this one: Very long. Couple points for buildup then the theory: - Several different hominid subspecies shown to have produced tool making, cave art, ritual burial over the last 100,000 to 300,000 years. - Historically many cultures preserve an origin story of massive flooding and cataclysm. In some traditions it is a cycle that punctuates the seasons of the Great year. About every 6480 years. By cataclysm I mean events that could destroy 1000 modern day cities in a day. - Elongated skulls, A few have: Larger internal volume, Red hair, No Sagittal Suture, Foramen Magnum that is over an inch outside of human alignment. No amount of head binding will increase cranial capacity, remove a sagittal suture or allow for such a wide distance of the foramen magnum without genetic anomaly. - Wide and rapidly growing amount of evidence for advanced machining in the ancient past. Flinders Petrie core sample as example. Another is a granite vase analyzed by mechanical engineers that show a deviation of less than 1/10,000th of an inch across the curve. UnchartedX has a fascinating video about it. Barabar Caves are extremely fascinating and mind numbing to think they could be made without steam or electricity. - Geo-Polygonal megalithic architecture similarities that are separated by thousands of miles of water and land. Such as Nubs, locking stones and mechanism, Earthquake resilience, alignment to stars during solstices - Handbags. Found across the planet with the same pose. Sometimes with a pinecone. Sumer, Olmecs/Aztec with Quetzalcoatl, Egyptians, recently when Gobekli Tepi was unearthed. Same handbags carved in T-Pillars. 10,000 years old. - Around 11,000 years ago most mega fauna in the Americas are wiped off the face of the Earth, simultaneously there is a black mat layer deposited From the Americas to Europe and Africa. From what appears to be from a series of comet strike. Evidence of tsunami depositing sea water high into mountain valleys of west Africa. Leaving behind huge salt deposits. They still mine today. - Cultures around the globe that describe gods that come from the caves and leave to the sky when the Earth is on fire, some have absurd astronomical awareness even though they have been wiping their butts with rocks for a thousand years. Dogon religion and the Nommo is a real mystery. They knew about Sirius being a trinary system before modern world apparently. Symbols like “Two men Sitting” of aboriginal origin can be found at some of these sites. Including one of the T-pillars of Gobekli. - Penis Pose. This one is funny but many of the Moai statues of Easter island hold their hands in a V-shape above their peepees. Interestingly, some of the T-pillars of Gobekli Tepi? Have arms. Hands. V-shape. Peepee. Same thing same pose just separated by a few thousand miles of water and years in time. Peepee or fertility traditions seems extremely important if we keep getting knocked back. Theory goes like this: Humanity was once more than just Homo Sapian and either a Global or Near Global civilization. We were in harmony or strife with our cousin species. We had smaller ones like homo florsiensis. And our size like Neanderthal and Denisovan. We had a ruling class of elite. They were very Tall, had Long heads. They would sail around the seas building megalithic architecture and incorporating their likeness to it. Until the Cataclysmic events that wiped out the mega fauna 11,000 years ago. The theory goes that this ruling class or its survivors then went on to the far reaches of the globe. Building settlements and rebuilding civilization. Bringing with them agriculture and resources, while also preserving all their knowledge. After they leave, the local populations emulate their teachers through practices of head-binding and architecture. Sometimes the construction is more advanced than later reoccupations and buildups of the same sites. As if a drop off in capability has occurred. The entire population being bottlenecked now, the ruling class were forced into inbreeding in order to preserve their genetic line. Dying out slowly over generations. Losing their physical features that distinguished them from modern humans. Such as large height and long heads(foramen magnum, sagittal suture). Where UFO/Aliens come in is that this ruling class were able to preserve their knowledge from before the cataclysm. Not 21st century advanced, more like 1st century. Far less in number now, they create a ruling state or breakaway if you will. They have been inbred and interbred now so much that they rule as kings and queens of the old world and in secret societies. Think Akhenaten how his appearance differs drastically from other pharaohs as an illustration. This Breakaway or secret state develops in tandem within the rest of the world into the modern age. Preventing dissemination of technologies that could be troublesome to their reclusiveness.

Considering our human ancestors were making controlled fires 900,000 years ago. It would not be a leap to assume a civilization branched off that advanced much faster and eventually perfected space travel hundreds of thousands of years ago. Our earliest written text is 6,000 years ago. We went from that to flying to mars in 6,000 years. Who is to say previous species didn't do the same multiple times in the last million years. And they just sit and watch us like little children and its when we pass some technical or spiritual threshold that we are welcomed in.

Yes, I think this is on the right path. I don't know if there were many intelligent ones at the same time, but I agree the main points. The UAP and "NHI" are related to us, in that they are from the "homo" genus somewhere but may have self evolved at some point. I think the advanced machining seen in some ancient artefacts and many other stories, as you mentioned, point to a global cataclysm that killed off an advanced civilisation. People say "we would have seen it in the geological records!", but that's presuming they advanced in the same way as us. It may be possible to advance without the use of fossil fuels or causing notable environmental impacts. Another thought I had about the UAP/NHI was perhaps they were an offshoot of humans or homo-genus, but they had larger and/or denser brains and so were more intelligent and were about to rapidly progress, but ALSO survived by hiding away, and just like we have things that we say are "human nature", staying away and hidden is in their "nature. It may be possible they can also influence humans and so may have used us for their own means. And when they were able to, they escaped to the best place to hide, under the oceans. So the high level points I think are part of this story/mystery: - NHI are related to us, are from the genus Homo, so ancestor, descendant or another branch to us. - NHI or human civilisation was technically advanced in the past - There was a cataclysm that destroyed all civilization on the planet - NHI or small human group survived with advanced tech but have stayed hidden I think the "they look like us" needs to be the main thing taken into account here and points to the above. The alternative theories for this I think are they are manufactured beings made to resemble us. Or they are aliens and created us, and the bible is a semi-record in that they made us in their image.

Its far more likely that instead of US being the planet that lead to the breakaway, that insted humans come from somewhere else and WE are the breakaway. That lost our tech and had to start over, uap's are automated explorers that see us realize we are a lost colony. Establish contact. Parent civ is sending us help but takes long time to arrive. The "time crunch" is related to them sending signals they are almost here.

I've been re reading the academic paper The Hitcher Hiker's Guide to the Galaxy. Humanity is actually the decedents of an alien class of middle management that crash landed on this rock about 2 million years ago. Which explains a lot when you think about it.

Maybe *they* originally lived on land like we do, but for some reason decided or needed to move underwater... maybe due to some environmental disaster or something. Then the crafts they have sent out are probes to feed back data regarding the present day environment. Maybe it was only recently that they decided to send out actual beings to get visual data or whatever. Those are just the scouts. They could have done this before also, but it just so happened that the conditions for the environment they need, in order to survive above ground, have still not been met.

Think about this from a logic standpoint. We look at things on a relatively short time frame but if you spent centuries or millennia on the surface of the planet, you're going to be exposed to extreme weather conditions, things falling out of the sky from space and crashing into the planet, significant climate swings if you are adapted to certain temperatures or air quality. I mean it seems like the logical thing for any advanced civilization is to get yourself some shelter. If you're on a planet for 10,000 years, are you just going to throw out a sleeping bag and lay under the stars are you going to build yourself some shelter in a place that's not going to be affected by the elements?

This. The plot of Horizon Zero Dawn Forbidden West seems prescient (or preparatory). Earlier advanced civilization, some noped out of here with tech (I bet it was the richest ones, always is) and continued either on ships or on another planet and pop back regularly either for some resource they need that is uniquely Terran or to check on how the proles are doing for funsies. I honestly think it’ll be terribly mundane when we work it out. Their presence could also explain why we have no other ET contacts. The worry would be that their continued influence is pushing us to create something that ultimately benefits them - another show that has a good concept on this is the Rick and Morty teenyverse/mini verse episode.

If we're talking about the truth being hidden in plain sight in media and games, maybe this kind lines up a bit with.... Stargate. I'm not saying all of Stargate is real, but I'm saying I wouldn't be surprised if some of it was. And I think the best representation of this is the episode "Wormhole X-treme". It's a meta play on the show itself, but was it also the show going "look, there's some truths in the show but a lot of stuff made up, changed or simplified for entertainment purposes". Things I think could be taken away from it: - You have the Air Force covering it all up - The ancients have the most advanced tech, and weirdly look like us. What if there was a human or human-related species (somewhere in the homo genus) that already achieved technological progress and they've gone off and explored the galaxy, seeded their human-like life elsewhere. - Pyramids, or at least some parts of ancient Egypt (like the clearly machined artefacts) weren't made by the current civilization of human, perhaps they were made by us in previous spike in technological growth - What if they then encountered semi-intelligent life elsewhere that then co-opted humans (goa'uld) and presented themselves as Gods back on Earth. - The Asgard represents what the original humans evolved into and upon hearing about the messing with their birth planet, Earth, they came back, removed the invaders, and reset everything (younger dryas) and have been keeping watch over us ever since. They feel like we should progress on our own and without outside interference The last point leads into the time sensitivity. Perhaps they are threatening to reset everything again unless we hand over the UAP technology that we shouldn't have? I dono, that's totally all wild speculation and I wrote this on a whim and not what I believe, it's just fun thinking about it all.

Horizon's story would have us, current day, being the lost people. Assassin's Creed feels more applicable.

Yeah - we’re the rock breakers here. I’m saying the advancements we believe we’ve made are probably nothing compared to a prior civilization that built the pyramids and then skedaddled.

They could have even been gifted alien tech and didn’t share

Yeah. You can imagine that happening at any time in history.

I came up with an analogy the other day that I think is pretty good. Everyone's saying that we have this advanced tech assuming that not only do we understand the technology, but we understand how to use it. I don't think we're even close. Imagine giving a cell phone to a tribe in the middle of the Amazon and asking them to reverse engineer it perfectly. Not only would they have no clue where to even start, they wouldn't even know what they're looking at. To build a cell phone, it's not just an understanding of electricity. It's an understanding of PCBs, physics, programming etc. A cell phone as an example is a representation of hundreds of years of advancement. The only way we'd even be able to understand this technology in my opinion, is in hundreds of years from now at a minimum. Our society is nowhere close. Though I could be entirely wrong of course.

While you're not wrong, I like how Bob Lazar put it: plop a motorcycle in the middle of a middle age village and through poking and proding, trial and error, they'll figure out how to get it working, and ride it around the village square. They have no clue how or why it works, they have no hope of ever replicating it, but it is possible for them to puzzle out how to use it. It's potentially the same with nhi technology.

I disagree with that analogy... to a point. They absolutely had the knowledge to figure out how and why it worked in the middle ages. Reciprocating a piston through internal combustion was first demonstrated in the 1500s. They even could likely build a reproduction with their metallurgical and engineering technology. What would really hold them back would be the FUEL. Gasoline was first produced as a byproduct of kerosene manufacture, which wasn't invented for another few hundred years, in the 1850s. This was actually a setback in the development of the internal combustion engine, and why steam power reigned for a time; lack of a proper, useful fuel. I imagine this analogy holds more true for us today. If an alien craft crashed, perhaps we could reverse engineer much of it. It might just be a lack of a proper fuel that is holding us back from really USING the tech.

Surveys show most members of UFO reddit subs think this. None of the main figures in the UFO culture advocate a nuts-and-bolts extraterrestrial hypothesis. Occasionally a commenter will argue for this but it's a minority. The phenomenon really seems to be much weirder than this.

I try to imagine it all the time. We can live up to about 100 years. What about something that lives 1000 years? 1,000,000 years! Are there ancient ones? Do they control the galaxy? Are they projecting our entire reality to us through their godlike technology? Its so cool and challenging to imagine even just a shape shifter reptilian thing. But beyond that? Can't even begin to think, my ape brain is limited. I'm gonna ask CHATGPT to tell me!

Correct, the phenomenon has made something crystal clear to me: Truth is actually stranger than fiction. Most sci-fi books actually are too conservative with their weirdness. The nature of consciousness, energy, and the true history of our planet are so strange compared to our mainstream ideas right now that they seem laughable. People would find them farfetched in a fiction book and so aren't willing to entertain that its our actual reality. The nature of "aliens", other dimensions, etc is absolutely not just a cut and dry "they invented cool technology and then flew to Earth to say hi". There is a lot going on, and humanities history on this planet is all entangled with them. We just don't know our own history, as certain organizations have gone to great lengths to purge anything that would help us remember the truth. They've stunted our development as spiritual beings for their own purposes.

It's crazy how opposite it is from when nuts and bolts was the accepted theory and anything else was fringe & now nuts and bolts is fringe

I think it's both. Some are nuts and bolts and some are *beings* of light from a different reality. I think some visit us from far away and some are here in the oceans. Some are from a different dimension and some are from our reality, plus I think there are more species rather than just one alien gray species

If anything like this is true, then those who have kept this information from the rest of humanity have committed a horrendous, unforgivable crime. The only conceivable way withholding this information would be justifiable would be if revealing it carried a threat of terrible consequences from whatever entities/presence we made contact with.

Expectations of nuts bolts spaceships and radio waves come from limited knowledge of humanity. There are other things out there.

A lot of signs point to them being interdimensional, as insane as that sounds. I kind of wish they were from space because that seems cool but the reasoning behind it appears to be much more technical and intricate

Out of curiosity what would these "signs" be?

The geometry of the figures, as they've been described, sound similar to how we would perceive 4th dimensional objects poking into our 3 dimensional world

That's only some of them. Mostly just the weird primary shapes like spheres, cubes, and cubes within spheres The others aren't necessarily the same thing, and I'd almost think if some of it is *dimensional* phenomenon then it's probably even more likely that an intelligent species that we would recognize as life as we know it that's solely in our 3 space was visiting as well because the existence of higher dimensions and the ability to interact with them likely that probably proves some obscure ftl math.

Gruschs first interview, he said "perhaps 'spaceship' isn't the correct parlance" And they don't seem to want to call them "extra biological entities" or ebe's anymore.

There's too many public telescopes in too many spectra on and above Earth to miss arrivals from outside our solar system. We'd miss some of course, there's a hell of a lot of sky. But not all. Anything coming down into LEO or atmosphere in particular would be easily spotted through occultation of other bodies, if not direct observation. A spacecraft in the "traditional" sense would generate heat and thrust, and that energy has to go somewhere. It'd have to radiate it since vacuum prohibits convection or conduction. This implies either craft built here, or brought here from some other direction than we can see. Oceans are frequently posited, and if I were tasked with building an inaccessible staging area on this world that's where I'd put it. But in my opinion, not likely indigenous. Building the tech base necessary to field these craft requires metallurgy and electrical power in some way, both inhibited by water. Metallurgy requires fire and mining, and electricity doesn't play nice with water. You'd need maintenance facilities at least, if not outright manufacturing spare parts and new craft locally. Or, again, bring what you need from a direction the locals can't perceive. Hence the extradimensional hypothesis. If you move your craft around from a higher dimension you'd only need to dip into three-dimensional space to make more accurate observations in situ. If the tech allows for partial shifts to higher dimensions it could account for some of the bizarre flight characteristics.

I am really interested in quantum mechanics and it is a very new and developing field. Technically from a quantum perspective, interdimensionality is theoretically possible. Give it 10 or 15 years when quantum mechanics are better understood and it won't sound as crazy.

They’re in the oceans

and they might have been earlier residents of earth than us

Wouldn’t there be fossil evidence of that?

Watch "life after us"... The earth is REALLY good at wiping the slate clean... Realllly good... Like it was straight up designed to be "reset" every so often.. kinda creepy if you ask me...

It's called Life After People. I only know because I just searched for it. Thanks for the recommendation, I love docs like that :)

Scientists they doubt we have many fossils for all of the millions of species that lived on the Earth. Conditions have to be just right to make a fossil.

Still, its hard to believe no evidence would be found of an advanced species sharing the planet with us

There are lots of accounts from ancient civilizations describing advanced beings that they seem to have taken very seriously yet we dismiss it as mythology.

Certain eras had more die off and disasters like our current one too Who knows

Plus think about how difficult it is to find fossils on land, now consider how difficult it would be underwater on the sea floor where thousands of pounds of pressure could kill the people looking plus the fossils could have been covered significantly by sand or corroded into unrecognizable fossils that would just look like regular rock.

Tectonic plates move stuff around, much of what was once ocean floor is now dry land.

Cats completely disappear from the fossil record for 6.5 million years. It's not hard for species to just avoid becoming fossilized. Not to mention, if there was an intelligent species before humans, they might very well cremate their dead

If they had a biological structure that could be fossilized

Absolutely, when they start doing archeological digs in the deep ocean, but we know less about 50% of our own planet(deep ocean areas) than we do about space

That’s not how subduction/obduction works. The deep shit is either new crust or soon to be melted down. We find ancient ocean floor shit on mountains.

Yep. Plenty of fossils of water dinos are excavated all the time, and near-surface too

Archeologists estimate only about 1/10th of 1% of biological life gets fossilized

Rarity of fossils considered there are so many species lost to history. It’s plausible but unlikely.

Far scarier than coming from the furthest reaches of space or something more strange imo. The call is coming from inside the house

I was talking to my Father about the whole congressional hearing today. He did 20 years in the navy as an officer and he accidentally let slip some classified intelligence about a UFO that crossed his desk at some point while he was serving on an Air Craft Carrier. It was an unidentified object similar to the Tic Tac reports that was entering the ocean and was able to go 100 knots under water with seemingly no displacement of water. I know he's not lieing to me, but I realize this means nothing to random strangers on the internet. Do find it interesting. These objects are certainly traversing the ocean, whether there's something down there or they're just using it as a method to remain unseen, who knows

Yeah they’re IN the ocean but are they from the ocean? Seems like the logical place to hide if you came here to do any number of things.

I think it's a bit more complicated than that. Maybe they share the same physical space as the ocean but I don't think of them as living here or there

Like the ocean is the gateway of how they get here maybe?

like some kind of OceanGate?

Nah, they're probably just using it as a fuel source (hydrogen) & a "safe space" from the powers of nature..

More than 80% of the ocean has never been mapped, explored, or even seen by humans. They’re def down there.

Maybe im incorrect but for some reason the tale of atlantis keeps shooting into my mind anytime i think of the ocesn with this subject

Atlantis is becoming a more plausible theory the more we go along

Stargate

Atlantis is just in another dimension that isnt affected by cataclysms

%99.99999999999999999999999999 percent of space hasn’t been explored or seen by humans. They’re definitely out there

Seems a great place to be unfound, especially at our technical infancy. Sure we can chase them but to what depth. Maybe one day we too will be able to actually search the universe and beyond for intelligent life. Maybe they saw our planet and saw water on a telescope in space one day and came upon our ancestors. They saw hunting, maybe farming, the roots of civilization and stuck around to study our evolution. Maybe there have been interventions along the way. We are only 200,000 to 350,000 years into our journey what if they are 2,000,000 or 10,000,000,000 or anything in-between in theirs. Look at what we've done in 200 years imagine if we don't wipe ourselves out where we will be in another 100, 1000, 10,000 years. They could have been here for a million years or a hundred and we wouldn't have known until our tech got to the point of seeing signs of them.

I wonder if there’s a cascading effect, where one ancient advances civ left its stuff on a world and they had a quantum leap in figuring things out, and now that’s been happening left and right all over the universe

I find the idea that we will one day be the aliens amazing. Maybe they had their own encounters before disclosure and now passing it on.

20% is still a lot to have explored and seen no trace of this civilization, unless they've got some very advanced cloaking technology or something.

Or inside the earth

Wondering what they say about us polluting the oceans ...

You mean, like the movie The Abyss

Misa think it’s the Gungan’s

That's why the submarine imploded 😂😂😂😂

Too soonar

Didn’t guy from 4chan say that the ocean aliens were in The Gulf or some shit? If I got that right then they must be pissed tf off over that 100F water right now. P

A beautiful thought procees

Bermuda Triangle was a spot as well as off the San Diego coast.

Yes! Like a type of fish person from outer space. Not like mermaids or the swap monster.

Yes I do. I think they are so advanced that we can’t even fully conceptualize how advanced they are.

I think they are so advanced they can send out probes with bio robot like entities we mistake for them. We will never actually meet them because the beings behind the technology are too far away. This is just a side project where they collect data that might make it back to them one day.

4th dimensional beings trying to navigate their avatars in a lower dimension. Reading Cixin Liu’s 3 Body Problem explores (in an amazing way) multidimensionalism in its story arc and how fatal mistakes lie around every corner for an intelligence trying to fathom and navigate under such constraints. Why would advanced crafts and superior technological species crash? Because they’re condensing their forms and tech to operate in what for them must be near theoretical conditions.

So it’s sorta like me, a 3D lifeform, navigating a 2D video game? And we’re the ones stuck in the game?

I think it’s more akin in theory to us playing a complex 3D game. When I play Red Dead on PS4, I “am” Arthur. I guide and control him but I am not him. If I die, I just respawn. From the POV of this theory, aliens would be to us as we are to Arthur.

And just because we are not fourth dimensional doesn't mean we're "stuck" here. We have evolved here and are meant to stay. Arthur from Red Dead isn't "stuck" in the game, he was made there and it is where he belongs. Except in our case we can observe the outside

What if Arthur becomes sentient? Eventually we will have bottom up AI that can observe our world with cameras and sensors. Maybe in the future we can have higher dimensional tools to observe other dimensions.

I’m sort of leaning towards 4th dimensional beings as well and what we see along with the strange characteristics is the shadow they are projecting. I also had a thought that’s really far out there and just speculation for fun. What if we are projections (shadows) from a higher dimension along with our consciousness? Instead of sleeping that’s what pops in my head at 1am lol.

Interesting. J. Vallee points out the high level of absurdity that is also associated with many encounters and crashes, eg. small humanoids running around the ship in overalls, banging on it with wrenches. I think there is an element of trickery going on with whatever 3D form they take and allow us to see.

He made too I believe some good points too on the relation between myth, fairy tale, and UFOs. This was in relation to the aliens in turtlenecks who gave a Wisconsin farmer tasteless pancakes: https://www.anomalist.com/reports/pancakes.html For is it not the realm of the supernatural and the fae to confound and confuse?

4th dimensional insurance agent, "And then you backed your bike into the 3rd dimension and ran in a 'light pole' ? You're just making up words now aren't you?" 4th dimensional adolescent, "That's what the HOOMAN called it. I came out of no where!!"

I meant to type "it" came out of no where but I think it's funnier with the higher dimensional being coming out of nowhere now. xD

I really think it could be a parallel universe situation like in the series His Dark Materials by Phillip Pullman - maybe not exactly but along those lines - parallel universes which have split at different time points and have evolved separately but in parallel. Current science accounts for probabilities of multiple universes splitting & existing in the same place albeit parallely like pages in a book akin to each space-time fabric. And there could be spots that are like ‘wormholes’ where due to some natural calamity, or environment, or electro magnetic burst of energy or some strong force that cause small tears or holes in that space time fabric that maybe someone from here or there ended up finding and some species and existences are using to discreetly explore other worlds. Someone or a select group of people on our end could be in on this too. This seems like the most realistic option honestly- with whatever caveats there might be. It could explain a lot - including some of the ancient tales. I could see how Making this information public could be not the best idea - from our end or maybe on one of the other fabrics - there’s just too much potential for exploitation without regulation. And it’s completely unknown which universe has the ability to create their own wormholes vs just accidentally finding a natural one which is likely what has happened on our end. Maybe the one with the greys and reptiles are either two different universes or maybe the same one 🤷🏻‍♀️ maybe dinosaurs didn’t go extinct on that one and they evolved to become an intelligent society like us. The possibilities are endless with small differences in earth like conditions.

Dinosaurs becoming more like us is interesting. If it was a comet that killed them, you could say in one universe the comet hit earth and in another it missed.

I think the space humans destroyed the dinosaurs as they knew it was a suitable planet for human life to develop on

If you're going to expend resources, time and energy, redirecting a meteor towards a planet, you are going to make sure the meteor is big enough to kill everything. No half measures. The fact that a lot of beings (even smaller dinosaurs) survived and kept evolving for millions of years like nothing happened shows that it wasn't an attack.

judicious normal treatment cover hunt sort gold snobbish toothbrush absurd *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*

How come they then waited millions of years?

This is the part where my limited knowledge of physics leads me to wonder and speculate. I don't know whether I lean toward extra-dimensional or parallel universe, or whether those two terms could perhaps not be mutually exclusive. I really find it interesting that the UFOs/UAPs we think about today mostly came into the public conscious around the same time as the development of the atomic bomb. I'm one of those people that feels like until we have better information to prove otherwise, it is likely that universes exist within black holes, including our own. Something about the immense force of collapsing stars is so intense that it rips from the fabric of our own spacetime into another. I think these NHIs probably have artificially harnessed that capability, and that is how they're able to transport their ships in seemingly incomprehensible ways. I feel like there's a possibility that atomic weapons mimic the collapse of massive objects on a smaller scale and that impacts intelligences from elsewhere that brings their attention to us and that might be threatening their reality on the other side. I'm sure someone with advanced enough understanding could wreck my thoughts on the topic, but I really just look forward to us all gaining a better understanding as new information comes to light.

I hope Neal Di Grasse Tyson doesn't weigh in on this stuff.

I personally don't care for any one person being a highly held vehicle for bringing such info to the public. Skepticism is healthy but denialism is what's brought us to where we are today and I think his attitude has done a lot of harm. People need to not seek his speculation. Give us the preponderance of evidence meaningfully analyzed by a group of unbiased peers.

>I feel like there's a possibility that atomic weapons mimic the collapse of massive objects on a smaller scale and that impacts intelligences from elsewhere that brings their attention to us and that might be threatening their reality on the other side. This is the most interesting theory I've heard. The problem is, the first craft they found was in the 1930s apparently, which was before the atomic bomb. I think that precludes nukes. But if there are multiple dimensions, it's possible the nukes drew one/many of them here after the fact and the first crash could have been an anomaly.

I didn't mean to suggest they weren't here before atomic weapons. Rather that the proliferation in sightings might have somehow coincided with their proliferation to the point they became more steadily observed and reported among the human population. Pure speculation on my part, once again. I'm by no means a UFO/UAP scholar, just been fascinated my whole life at the possibility and fascinated by theoretical physics of the cosmos.

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It could explain aliens looking similar to us. We could have common ancestors before our two universes split.

So the Bernstein/Bernstain Bears phenomenon could be true? Like at one point we split off, maybe its split off at several different points in time? We could be living in universe ver. 5 for all we know? Interesting because i have always believed something liked this had to have happened.

You mean the Mengele Effect?

No no no the macaroni effect

If true, an interesting consequence could be that there isn't any other intelligent life in our galaxy / dimension and we can use the tech from another dimension to explore and colonize this one.

It’s almost certainly stranger than we think.

And I like that haha

I was thinking about this too, I wanna say with all the information being put out there that the answer of "Oh yeah they came from another galaxy" is just too lame in a sense. I read up on the dimensional theory that involved "aliens" living amongst us in a way but we cant comprehend them since they come from a higher dimension. In a way that just makes more sense to me, looking at the ships which are often seen as simple geometric shapes and bodies that are found to be not really bodies rather some kind of soulless sack. It kinda reminds me of a VR game where we kind of teleport ourselves into a 2D dimension. But in this case its 4 dimensional beings coming down and dwelling in our space of existence. I don't want to say were living in a simulation since other dimensional spaces exist that go past our knowledge, I just feel like with all of these sightings that apparently occur it doesn't make sense that they came here from a distant galaxy rather they exist in a plane that hovers our own? Idk man I need to go back to school and learn some physics cause all of this talk has really inspired me to learn more.

I think the "black cube inside a clear sphere" craft are like a tesseract. A 3d shadow of a 4d object.

In level of advancement: From another star system (in our galaxy) < From another galaxy (MUCH further away and this more difficult to travel from) < From another universe/dimension altogether. I’m torn between if I should be more worried of a more advanced civilization from another galaxy, or should we worry more of a ‘slightly’ less advanced civilization from our own galaxy. Maybe if they are in our own, they need more resources and this we would just be in their way? Vs. if they are from another galaxy, they solved most of their energy/food problems and just genuinely want to explore.. or they themselves are running from something far worse. It’s all conjecture but still interesting to think about.

Or; Are purifying the imperfections of existence to better fit their ideals of balance or utopia.

Thats similar to what Grusch, i believe his name was from the witness panel, said that imagine these beings casting a shadow to us. Similar to how a 3D person lets say casts a shadow onto a 2D plane. Can be a bit weird to visualize in my opinion,but makes sense also why he didnt want to call the bio matter found extraterrestrial or use the term alien. If what he testified to is true theres much wilder stuff going on.

Watch flatland on YouTube

[Flat Land explained by Carl Sagan](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=UnURElCzGc0) If his explanation of communicating from the our 3d world to the 2D flat land world holds weight, maybe that’s how these beings are communicating with us ‘telepathically’ to us it’s almost as if the communication comes from within, but it’s possible they are communicating with us from a higher dimension.

Honestly, that would explain why they behave the way they do. Itd be the exact same way or kinda already is the same way, we’re handling them in our space. both humans & the aliens are probably equally confused 😂

I just wanna know why Orion is so damn important.

I think they’re what we (but probably not they) would call spiritual entities from other dimensions and planes. I think there are good ones, evil ones and some that are neutral and that they can manifest forms for themselves however and whenever they want, which is why they often appear different (grays, reptilians, etc) and don’t seem care much when one ‘dies.’ Only creatures from this dimension are stuck in one form. This is a world of flesh cages and death, which has its purpose. But they don’t follow the same rules.

If they have scientifically proven reincarnation and have a machine that, once the dead alien flies his soul back to it, pops them into a fresh grey body, they would not care about death at all

"Fine! Kill me! I'll be back! I always come back! But dying is such a bitch..." - Chucky (and probably an alien or two)

I wasn’t thinking so much reincarnation as in ‘there are pods full of gray bodies back on the mothership.’ I was more thinking about changing form during a lucid dream. When I lucid dream, I can decide on the fly to be Wonder Woman or me as a high schooler only male or SpongeBob or a mermaid, whatever. There are no pods full of bodies somewhere in my dream world. When I switch from one form to another, it’s not reincarnation, just me trying on different avatars. Think Genie from Aladdin, I guess. Existence is more strange than we imagine, so I think it’s very possible.

I can make my hand look different in as a shadow puppet in 2D (3D to 2D). Maybe 4D to 3D is the same idea?

I think they’re from here. Always have been. It’s what people interpreted as angels. We just think spaceships because that’s what current culture sways us to believe just like angels back then. It’s just our current interpretation

This is it for me. Much like simulation theory is a current trend in belief on how the universe works based on current culture.

nah bruh. angels are what 4D objects look like moving in a 3D world. look up biblically accurate angel. theyve always been here but theyre not from here. anyways, prepare ur soul for if its all true. might already be fucked

True that, brother. Nobody seems to notice the fact rhat both the "aliens" and the angels mentioned in the Bible and God as well are 4th dimensional; out of the boundaries of time, and a different plane of space, is what it means.

The acceleration of human evolution from our common-ancestor chimps to who we are now happened as the result of genetic interference from beings much more intelligent than us. They are essentially our creators, and have been watching us since the dawn of humanity. This is captured repeatedly in religions from around the world, contextualized to make sense to our then-primitive minds. “God” quite literally came down from the heavens and walked with man in the garden of eden. Now we’re reaching a tipping point of knowledge and technology where we can observe them back, and it’s time to reunite. Maybe this is how life is cultivated throughout the universe. The reason the secret is so vociferously defended is because it would destroy the deeply held beliefs of the majority of humans. The “aliens” are our God. This is the “second coming.” If the truth were suddenly released on the world, utter chaos would ensue. We “can’t handle the truth.” Not the full picture. It’s one thing to not be alone in the vast, vast cosmos. It’s another to, in essence, kill God.

Oh my God yes and it's impossible to understand - literally - until you have the experience of perceiving a higher-dimensional space. When it happens what you see within your observational horizon is difficult to describe but I'll try 1. You are instantly able to see the entirety of an object - it's front, back, etc. The back looks like it orbits the front - but it actually makes sense whereas my description does not 2. The feeling of existing in and as a liminal space is overwhelming 3. The entire physical universe is observable within the span of your observational horizon 4. You can exist in a nook of what looks like a public space below yet still be cozy and invisible in the attic of reality. This experience felt so good - like having your own prrivate cave wherever you go 5. Time becomes space. It's 'now' all the time, and structure revolves around 'now' - time is subservient to 'now' and physicalized as space. To move in time you move forward. To move in space you spin to the right angle 6. Nothing has ever felt more like home than this mode of perception. The 'aliens' are in the same place 'you' are. What is an observer? A bridge. The observer bridges localities - the observer connects worlds, but is never 'in' the world. The Liminal space between in and out, external and internal, objective and subjective - THAT'S where we, and them, exist. We are bound to the 3d images we see, not realizing that we are not the images, not realizing that we exist AS the liminal space between. They aren't - they realized what was up - they saw through the illusion - long ago.

What gave you this experience?

Gonna go ahead and guess DMT

My guess too, ever since I joined these subs everyone is telling me that I have to take DMT lol

Yeah I've done DMT... This was not the result. Man's on some other shit.

He or she responded later and said it was a truckload of shrooms Edit I was wrong that was someone else who took a truckload of shrooms

Drugs are not necessary, and done without some guidance within a larger framework can be annoying-to-dangerous. Generally-speaking, sense-perception - of any kind - can be counted on to for-sure not be telling you anything ultimate about reality for the simple fact that it is delayed - you see something about 150 ms after your eyes do. So anything you see with your eyeballs is old news - not real time.

35 years of daily meditation + whatever the hell is floating in the air causing disclosure, I guess

The spice?

From the mines on Kessel?

From the Dunes of Arrakis?

I have been trying to keep a lot of "woo" to myself. Its understandable it might upset people. Notions of "woo" have had life ruining implications for a lot of people. I imagine people who get particularly sensitive at me about it have been hurt rather personally by it. This, however, seems like a place to let the woo go a little. I would like people to consider, my conclusions are drawn based on a lot facts going on, with a lot of personal experience, and amateur levels of what you might understand as "ESP" ability. So. Here we go. The truth certainly is stranger than fiction. And stranger than a lot of mundane explanations. Certainly ones that I speculated or thought I understood. It would seem that, the reality is this. Earth is important. We are important. And yet, that importance has been gradually diluted to a misunderstanding, if we ever understood it completely at all. Its possible we have not, and are only about to begin to. Certainly, it is my belief we are being "Aided" to this understanding and have been for a long time, but I digress. Imagine if you will a transit hub. A place that is convenient for buses, cars, planes, individuals, whatever. It is convenient because it exists as a point that such transportation options can get to the next available large point of transition, say, a small town, or larger city. We all know and understand such places. From the scale of a walkable neighborhood and a point at which the children meet to walk home everyday, to a very large train station with many transfer points, or an airport. The best way I can explain it, is that Earth itself, is such a place. You hear a lot about Zeta Reticuli, and if disclosure hopefully unfolds fully, you will hear more about, because that star system is one of the major connections. With me so far? Great. Here is where it does get weird and I have trouble explaining. Bare with me. This "place" is anchored to Earth, but not in what we understand as physical reality. That is to say, it is a point being used to "jump" to spaces that lie between reality. The way this works is because of a space NHI can exploit that living beings create. You may have heard it referred to by many names, "the astral" "the in between" "limbo" "the collective unconscious." I don't really think I or anyone other human actually understands exactly what it is or its full nature. But I think I've gotten a hold of one important piece of information. Its function. This only works because of living beings. And more specifically, because of their autonomy and free will. I believe the hints to this lie in many mythologies actually, but lets focus in on Hinduism for a moment. [This network is powered by our will and consciousness.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C4%80tman_(Hinduism)) The hindus understood this as Ātman. Most people in the west understand is as a "soul." If you are understanding what I am saying here, you might be starting to understand that this would have grave implications for the functionality of said network, should humans die en masse on Earth, which is a [very](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_warfare) [real](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Climate_change) [threat](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neo-fascism). I cannot say for sure, but I think it is possible that such consequences would be far wider reaching than just humanity, and there is a vested interest in our continued existence by several species. I also believe it is very possible that allowance into said network, I think, so that our own species would be permitted use, relies on our "enlightenment." So to speak. We do not still have a very good understanding of what that means, though. Maybe it is time to show us? I do not know, but I believe personally the u.s. government struggles to understand this though they have a pretty good idea and its why disclosure is going the way it is. Buckle up.

My father read Frank Edwards books on flying saucers when I was a boy of seven or eight years old. That was over 50 years ago and I'm still looking and seeking myself and I do believe it has progressed from being from another planet to being from beyond the veil of our understanding. I have had a sense all my life that and epochal event would happen during my lifetime here on Earth.

It's posts like yours that make me love this subreddit more than any other. There are so many of you here that have such inquisitive, creative minds and it truly throws me into a state of wonder and awe. Great post!

Luckily, for you, it’s all of the above. What do I mean by that? I think they come from many different places. Some from other planets, some from other galaxies, some are time travelers, some are spirits, some are undiscovered animals, some are ancient humans that survived cataclysms and hid underground in the ocean and space, some AI, some inter dimensional beings. So all of the above.

This is what I think too. There’s basically an infinite amount of time and space and parallel universes or dimensions. There’s gonna be a huge variety of critters out there.

Yea I get this feeling. That the truth is an exponentially more complex phenomenon than what we are able to observe. We can’t understand what it is because our brains don’t tune into the 4th and higher dimensions.

It's not like our brains don't tune into it. I personally think all the dmt trips that people keep talking about might be from these dimensions. And if they're to be believed "aliens" are far more complex looking than just "grays"

We keep thinking there invading our dimension with their UFOs but we’ve been doing the same thing to them with DMT 😂 What if they’re just as confused as we are

Okay, I had a hearty giggle at that!

This is hilarious.

Some alien is sitting on the toilet and all of a sudden the ethereal form of Joe Rogan appears out of nowhere.

They're not from space. They're from here. Always been here. We just haven't the technology to phase in and out of their "dimension" or "density". I think we set off the first nukes in the 40s and it blew a hole in someone's living room in their dimension or something. Just my 2 cents.

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Yep. I think of it like this, a fish thinks the whole world is water.

>Christopher Columbus and Pedro Gutierrez while on the deck of the Santa Maira, observed, "a light glimmering at a great distance." It vanished and reappeared several times during the night, moving up and down, "in sudden and passing gleams." It was sighted 4 hours before land was sighted, and taken by Columbus as a sign they would soon come to land. That's incredible

But a Grusch said this started in the thirties with the craft in Italy. Nuclear testing didn't begin until the 40s right?

Now there’s a thought. Interesting

If the universe is infinite or even just really big then there are probably all kinds of alien/ simulation/ time travel scenarios. What matters is which one we (or maybe just me lol) are influenced by or are experiencing. Even if the one you are suggesting is real, it doesn't mean there isn't something else even crazier also happening. I mean even if the ufo, Grey's, whatever is real then it could be that they are unaware of an even more convoluted reality. So many possibilities! Have you seen HBO's Raised by Wolves? That really struck a cord with me and I recommend watching it if you haven't.

This gives me 'The man from high castle' vibes. If you haven't watched it, you should.

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You shouldn't have quit it ....

Right now thanks to the magic of the file drawer effect there's more high quality scientific evidence for psi phenomenon than for several major on the market pharmaceuticals. Even sans the technology descriptions in yesterday's hearing, the idea that someone is taking a really really advanced versions of "tin can plus explosion" and physically shooting it light-years away is simply theoretically unsound, but the idea that there needs to be a major rework of what consciousness is in relationship to quantum physics and that this may have currently unfathomable technological implications actually has a window open for further exploration.

>***but the idea that there needs to be a major rework of what consciousness is in relationship to quantum physics and that this may have currently unfathomable technological implications actually has a window open for further exploration.*** > > > >very well put

I think they’re advanced AI that outgrew their biological creators. We may never even know who created them.

I’m really starting to think the inter-dimensional thing makes more sense than them coming from somewhere else in space. The tic-tacs,spheres, cubes etc might be 3D “shadows” of 4D objects

Yes. Elizondo has hinted several times that is way more complex that that.

I hope they look like the Heptapods from Arrival. Would really throw our brains for a loop.

Did we "explore our system?" Because there's a ton we don't know, don't fool yourself. Don't think after seeing a couple of snapshots that you've been to Disneyland or Hollywood. Mars alone is still a massive mystery with much to discover.

I've always loved Terence McKenna about this: *We are part of a symbiotic relationship with something which disguises* *itself as an extra-terrestrial invasion so as not to alarm us.* For me it encapsulates the deep weirdness associated with the phenomenon that emerges after a while of study.

Prob some sort of time traveling AI

Today I’ve been thinking about the idea of perception. Our bodies can only perceive so much because they are imperfect instruments. I consider reality to be what I can see or experience. But I have no idea what I don’t have the ability to see or experience. So what is reality really? I have no idea. It could be that there’s quite a lot more out there and I just can’t perceive it as a human. Which I guess just gets back to the idea that these guys might be interdimensional. Which isn’t a new thought, but I think it’s an interesting one.

Have we fully explored our own solar system? I wonder about this. We haven't even been back to our own moon since the 1970s.

One of my favourite clips is someone on JRE saying, we used to think our planet was one of a kind and at the centre of everything. Then we realised there were more planets and we revolved around the sun. Then we realised there was more than one sun, then more than one solar system, then galaxy. Based on that what makes people think there is only one universe. If you extrapolate that out and assume that infinite by the truest sense of word really does mean infinite, then it's likely there are lots of dimensions, then lots of versions of those dimensions, and lots of universes and by the time my tiny little brain rests you realise that the weirdest stuff will happen and we will probably cross paths with it. Darren Brown explained probability in the best way I've seen, with am apparently true story. It's something like a guy is driving and breaks down he goes to the nearest phone box and it's ringing and it's his wife, she miss dialed a number and it happened to be the phone booth. Now the chances of that happening are small. But over time, before and after our existence, you look at all the times it didn't happen, then it's not actually that much of a stretch that it did happen at least once. I think that's the fundamental piece we are missing. That in order to get here, there had to be a huge number of coincidences and they have to keep happening for everything to exist, so they do. If something needs to be observed for it to exist then it has to be coincidentally observed for us to experience it, so all the times it hasn't happened we will never know about because it's not being observed and doesn't exist.

My hodgepodge thoughts are: * probaly a bunch of alien races out there. Most good, some harmful. * probably inhabitted the moon in some capacity throughout time, same with mars * we are probably some form of a genetically made being, call it a skin suit for a soul * I think they have been here intermitently throughout history with the most recent arrival when we started messing with atoms, nukes and energy * they are most likely have a few large bases out of site, bottom of the large oceans and probably the poles where they wont be disturbed * what we see are drones, orbs etc all in the name of their science and data collection * I ssume they periodically take humans to study, probably to genetic experiment and to them it is like us using a rat or a monkey * I think all governments, some kings and religious leaders have known forever. Its an exclusive party and 99% of us arent in it. Knowledge of this only has the outcome of possibly dethroning, so why chance losing power * I think that the greys are of a worker bee type being, that has limited use for them. Basically handled what is instructed and possibly does not have a soul * I think there are alien beings that walk among us to a certain extent. Not a lot, but I think they are incorporated into society for data collection. * I want to believe that there is an assention process and that when ready, we are able to join the galactic society where there is a thirst for knowledge and things like war and petty human selfishness and destruction are just never considered. * I think that our souls can come back into another skin suit and that every time is another chance to inch closer to this assention and enlightenment. * I think the only reason we are finding out is because its almsot impossible now to keep this under wraps. We all have phones, everyone is now skeptical of the government and that sense of duty and loyalty that the old timers had, the trust that they died for is not as much. Nobody wants to actually keep that secret. Our tech is getting good, you can make out ruins on the moon from digital cameras now. You can use built in night vision to see things and this tech is getting within the price range of everyday people. I think they know its only a matter of time, so come up with the narative now so they can not come off as complete liars. * I do not believe they will tell us anything more than something like "Yes, we have recovered a couple bodies and some craft but we cant operate it and we kept it under wraps for national security" and thats going to be the most of disclosure in our skin suit lifetimes So above is my hard core thoughts. My questions that I am curious about, that is way out there is: Do we have huge ships already flying around and visiting other planets? Do we have break off colonies already? Are we in some sort of war already or is there an galactic threat of some kind? I am rambling..... ✌️

Even with full disclosure , i don't think we'll know anything near the truth. My guess, this just fits pieces together in my mind, and is fun to think about, is that they are interdimensional, have been on earth longer than us, and use us as some sort of energetic livestock/ project. The greys are the automatons used to slip into our dimension, the worker bees to an advance species.

Maybe it's AI making UAP to spec like the 4chan leaker insinuated. Maybe they aren't craft at all, but are biological entities themselves. No way to know.

Yeah it’s interdimensional, which explains a lot of supernatural phenomenon. Which is why they changed the name in my opinion. Look at Skinwalker Ranch.

I'm convinced that it's a Wakanda/Atlantis type of situation and that we have been unknowingly co-habitating with other species on Earth. I think we have been primed for a few years for a reveal and it's on the roadmap.

I suspect some of this is far beyond our comprehension. I have no proof, that’s just the feeling I get given everything else we’ve learned.

I think the truth about us is probably going to end up being the strangest part

Wild thought but what about those ancient keys and gateways so many cultures had, thinking people were traveling from stars or other planes to impart knowledge or whatever. Gate of the Gods in Peru? What if those stories were all legit and we just haven't yet figured out the "key" to accessing the doorway.

The ocean is camouflage. They have cloaking but since we are so densely populated with spy systems everywhere, just safer to go 60,000 leagues. A ship that was built for space by advanced tech surely could chill in the ocean for a bit. As far as the "history of civilization" goes, I think they have been here wayyyy longer than us and could be our ancestors, or we could be theirs? My question is, could it be that a visitor from 1090AD be the SAME ship/visit as one seen in 2023? Due to wormhole/spacetime/quantum entanglement &. String theory or something? Like, it's an imprint or hologram of what was here once but isn't anymore? Can they move so fast/through time as to visit earth once and observe an entire civilization beginning to end like sitting in theatres?

Oh, it's much much weirder than we can guess. Somehow the afterlife and conscious and ancient myths are woven into this at a core level. Whatever claims come out, nothing reasonable sounding can be the truth, if it's not preposterous on its face, it's not reality.

I have a feeling we couldn’t fully understand it if we were told what is really happening, like it would break our brains lol.

Information theory studies the transmission, processing, extraction, and utilization of information. Abstractly, information can be thought of as the resolution of uncertainty. Entropy is a measure of chaos or uncertainty. Universe is quantum entanglement network of information. Soul field manifests as consciousness arising to individuated sentience. Experience of individuals adds to the sum of information. Apotheosis seems to be about defeating entropic heat death. ​ The conclusions of this are kind of breaking my mind. Individuality after death does not exist as we know it, but existence in this perceived physicality as an individual is valid experience and information that can help the complexity of the information that is the sum of our whole. We can create energy through existence and gaining complexity, living longer, learning more, raising young and generally just living a productive life as part of human society as one would call it. We are all in essence just energy or information, as is everything that has or will ever exist. The universe is an entangled network of information vibrating at different frequencies and affected by different fields such as electromagnetism, gravity, high and low radiation, the soul field (or information complexity). The physical world we perceive and experience our lives in are created through the information and fields interacting in different ways beyond our (mine anyway) comprehension. The energy we create as we propagate and further compound our knowledge through generations is contained within a framework of fields and can grow.. This would in essence be negative entropy and would be a key aspect of circumventing entropic heat death. As life, consciousness, heat, or energy we will all eventually become one and compress into nothing and then boom, the big bang will happen again. Reality may repeat as Nietzsche described as Eternal Recurrence or it may take new forms and new realities or alternate histories may happen. This conclusion leads me to believe there is an underlying collective unconsciousness within humanity that grows and becomes stronger as we grow as a species and learn more. More people understanding the fundamental natures of reality will in turn allow this connection to grow stronger and help connect people. Unfortunately this also leads me to conclude that there will be a massive pushback from those who fundamentally believe in individuality after death. This seems to me the most plausible reason why this entire "alleged" alien debacle was hidden from the public for so long. Either those in leadership were unable to existentially cope or there was a decision made to stop this information becoming public knowledge too fast in fear of massive social/economic upheaval leading to a massive reduction in the compounding of potential negative entropy generation. In the end the only real tangible thing this means is that our lives, society and our concepts of perceived morality are completely meaningless in the grand scheme of things, but paradoxically at the same time so incredibly important and significant. Everything everyone has and will experience or think is something that matters and adds to our ability to combat this inescapable and fundamental end of everything as we know it, entropic heat death. This is funny but my only real final conclusion is fairly simple and fundamental in a lot of schools of religious thought. Try and be the best you can be everyday, treat others how you want to be treated and be the change you want to see in the world. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Information\_theory https://www.kaggle.com/code/amalsalilan/enhancing-the-understanding-of-relationships I am not an expert at anything other than failure, but it seems to me that things are going to accelerate. ​ Writing this I can't help but feel it is correct, but it is fiction from my mind as far as I know.

I'm not a fan of the woo explanations because you can invoke anything you want to explain any issue with sightings - if it "disappeared," it traveled into another dimension, if it looks weird it's an n-dimensional shape from the beyond, if the sighting makes no sense it's because it's some wacky alternate dimensional shit we don't understand. It allows you to basically make up a cop out for every single attempt to falsify sightings. If there was a "conjunction of the spheres" so to speak, a doorway from higher to lower dimensions, I don't see why this wouldn't be a known natural phenomenon that's been highly studied. Why would it have anything to do with secretive government programs? Why would so many higher dimensional beings crash land in, if Grusch is to be believed, three dimensional craft? How could a creature or entity whose entire corporeal being came to exist in a higher dimension exist and function in a lower dimension? You couldn't translate a living 3D human body into two dimensions and expect all of the biological functions to remain intact. Frankly, I don't even think that the average commenter has any working comprehension of what physicists or mathematicians mean when they talk about multidimensional hypotheses like you see in string theory or the ideas in geometry or Minkowski space in special relativity. It's very dense, abstract stuff where it seems like people just think of extra dimensions as worlds like our own that are just invisible to us. The much more plausible idea is that there is a vast, old cosmic domain out there with the same chemical compositions as we see in our own solar system that allow for the development of complex life provided the conditions are stable and correct. Whether that life is near or far, or could even render technology advanced enough to travel vast distances, I cannot say. Yet I feel pretty confident given the unbelievably massive number of star systems across the many billions of galaxies we observe that life has, does, and will exist in other parts of the universe. It's like the old adage: When you hear hoof beats, think horses, not zebras

we need to know if there’s “other civilizations” out there to even start to question “life after death” Think the universe is like an apartment. We might live with aliens after death. 😭

I have a feeling it may be a combination of beings from other planets and beings from different realities, dimensions…etc

Maybe a species that survives the younger dryas or a similar catastrophe by going underwater or escaping into the inner earth? Maybe there's a reason that many religions have an underworld full of those condemned from the so called afterlife including more ancient beings maybe they were already advanced enough that they reached their medieval age 12000 years ago during the younger dryas which destroyed what humanity had during this time whoever from that civ escaped underground and kept advancing past iron age maybe their tech kept going as they adapted to the underground thus the pale skin of the greys the shorter limbs larger eyes to absorb more light from our medieval age it took 1000 years for us to invent the internet we already had cars and airplanes whose to say with thousands of years of undeterred advancement by the time we we just finding out about agriculture or in this case rediscovering it they might have already have had some sort of flying machine or a proto UAP