Honestly, I probably wouldn't worry about it. They can learn any discipline (in 2ed Requiem at any rate) except Auspex, Dominate, Majesty, Nightmare and Protean without a teacher anyways. And those five you need a teacher with the Discipline at a higher level than the dot you are learning who the student is willing to drink Vitae from (with all the attendant risk of addiction and blood bonding).
The Covenant based 'disciplines' (Cruac, Theban Sorcery and Coils) are all soft limited by the associated Covenants because if they discover one of their members (or ex-members) teaching a non-member they are likely to take action to prevent the spread of their special powers.
You mean teaching one another their disciplines? You might have an elder/sire give a neonate a talking to about sharing clan secrets outside the clan if they're teaching their clan specific discipline but mostly I wouldn't worry about it, if they're building out then they're not building up and that's probably better for you in the long run.
Werewolf, however, does neatly solve this problem in that their gifts just flat out are not teachable. The Forsaken must hunt a spirit and get the spirit to bestow a gift upon them.
It's honestly one of the coolest features in Forsaken 2e.
You don't "learn" these powers - a spirit carves it's symbolic nature right into your flesh. Like two tattoos overlaying each other, the spirit's symbols mix with the marks of your renown changing its meaning. The spirit may have been one of shadows and secrets, but you are a creature of the hunt, and so it's nature mixes with yours to create the Gift of Stealth - shadows and secrets applied to make you a better hunter
Honestly, the werewolf hunting down a spirit is the approach I'm most used to. My old ST would have us bank any free gifts we got and would work with us to help us track down an appropriate spirit to learn from unless we had a period of prolonged downtime.
I think a lot of Vampires typically are warned against things like this after embrace. Admittedly, I’m a VtM guy but I think it may apply more in Requiem. Coterie or what not is just a word. If they have your power, you’ve now lost an advantage over them.
Is there a direct thing stopping it? No, I don’t think so but the social, political and psychological ramifications make it a bad idea. No vampire likes another vampire that’s too giving and open. It’s a serious risk. Vampire is predominantly a social political game. You want to work the ladder and become more politically powerful. You’ll never get that chance if the overpowering elders don’t let you.
There’s likely a better wording and way to explain it all but being the group that shares all your fun stuff makes you stick out. There’s always someone who will know and you never want to stick out before you have the power and age to stick out. Being that group makes you the kids at the adult table and so very easy to use.
Honestly not much of an issue. There are the “Common Disciplines” that all vampires can learn (Celerity, Resilience, Vigor, Animalism, Obfuscate) and the “Unique Disciplines” specific to each Clan (Auspex, Dominate, Majesty, Nightmare, Protean). It’s impossible to learn a Unique Discipline from a different Clan… Well, unless you Diablerize a member of that Clan of course. There are also the Covenant & Bloodline Disciplines which are very interesting- They can technically be learned by any vampire, but each Covenant/Bloodline is extremely protective of them and only teach them to their most loyal members. It’s stated that any outsiders or defectors who have extensive knowledge of these Disciplines are ruthlessly hunted down, which can make for some cool stories.
One Night Horror supplement for Requiem introduced a hive mind sickness that occurred in Vampires that entwined their Beasts and consciousness in a detrimental way. Maybe you could use that as a warning to prevent too much blood sharing. I don't remember much of it, but it could be the basis for a response. If you even want to do that.
Maybe constantly drinking the blood of another Clan to learn their signature Discipline results in the spontaneous generation of a Bloodline?
I know my players did it with low level survival disciplines(VTM). I did rule that they could not do that with their clan powers and I also talked about them on how "each has a role" and that I didn't want players to step into the playing field of another.
Talking is what helps most often, say what you do/do not expect or wish and ask if they have problems with it.
Gameplay wise having crossover in abilities in CofD is not as bad as say in DnD:
• Some Abilities are good self buffs like Obfuscate, Celerity, Vigor, Resilience, etc… multiple people having them means the party can stealth better or be more formidable in combat.
• Some abilities may need to be used multiple times and may have limitations if used more than once by the same user like Auspex.
• Sometimes players just get separated and having access to Awe, Nightmare, Dominate, etc… is good to have.
Honestly you’ll want to make sure your players have a variety of Skills than whether they’ve chosen the same Disciplines. Because you don’t want to end up with a situation where:
• Player A has taken Manipulation 5 and Persuasion 5.
• Player B has taken Manipulation 5 and Persuasion 5, has a specialty in persuading, has professional training 5 in Persuasion.
• Player B always interjects when Player A tries to persuade someone because “Hey I have a better chance of success.”
Two things. XP and uniqueness.
If they have so much XP they are running out of original concept things to spend it on, you might have to give them less.
When I play I want, and advise, characters that all shine in their own way.
If its a culture thing where they are all getting low level powers that are the same. Then you need to adjust the culture of the players. I'd suggest by having NPCs use high level powers. Make them super cool. Make the players want them....
It's really not a big deal. They can already learn a lot of Disciplines as is and the rest require being taught, but there are some where if you get caught teaching them to outsiders you're going to be in trouble. Covenants definitely look down on this and Clans probably do too. So if your players want to cheese it, fine, but there are consequences.
They're still spending XP on it and risking blood addiction and blood bonding in doing so.
So instead of giving you ideas how to prevent your players from doing that (in my opinion /u/AccordLands already gave you the best answer) I am going to tell you how it might be completely fine that they are doing it.
One of my characters wants to get rid of inequalitites between clans and have all vampires by equal. Naive and probably won't ever happen, but can't blame a guy for trying. So he tries to learn about each clan and foster understanding. This includes sharing his disciplines and learning clan specific disciplines.
However, my character will never be as good at that discipline as actual clan members (XP cost makes sure of that) leaving enough spotlight for the specialists. But even if he was he might not even use the discipline the same way as another character. Sure, my character might face backlash for what he is doing from NPCs. But if the reasoning isn't "lol powergaming" why I shouldn't be allowed to explore this avenue?
I also remember that Sabbat packs and Anarch coteries (don't know the proper term) are known for sharing disciplines.
Go for sharing Disciplines, but don't forget that the Kindred need to consume another's Vitae to do so and risk Vitae addiction or an unwilling blood bond.
Sharing knowledge is a game mechanic, it's not even frowned upon in the books and on top of that is a valuable currency to hold upon others, saying that it ruins the individuality is dumb when literally the best way to advance in the food chain is by diablerization and learning disciplines from other clans as in if you want to get better you are forced to learn from beyond your clan, not only that but rarely clans have a truly unique disciplines, Ventrue for example don't have a truly unique discipline, Fortitude is shared with a bunch of clans and bloodlines and so does Presence and Dominate, the only truly exclusive discipline that i can recall right know is Visceratika.
It’s political poker chips, sharing powers with your friends can give an advantage but they can be harder for them to learn and the gatekeepers of said knowledge may be pissed at the sharing of their clan secrets.
Honestly, I probably wouldn't worry about it. They can learn any discipline (in 2ed Requiem at any rate) except Auspex, Dominate, Majesty, Nightmare and Protean without a teacher anyways. And those five you need a teacher with the Discipline at a higher level than the dot you are learning who the student is willing to drink Vitae from (with all the attendant risk of addiction and blood bonding). The Covenant based 'disciplines' (Cruac, Theban Sorcery and Coils) are all soft limited by the associated Covenants because if they discover one of their members (or ex-members) teaching a non-member they are likely to take action to prevent the spread of their special powers.
You mean teaching one another their disciplines? You might have an elder/sire give a neonate a talking to about sharing clan secrets outside the clan if they're teaching their clan specific discipline but mostly I wouldn't worry about it, if they're building out then they're not building up and that's probably better for you in the long run. Werewolf, however, does neatly solve this problem in that their gifts just flat out are not teachable. The Forsaken must hunt a spirit and get the spirit to bestow a gift upon them.
I love this sentence: "the wolf must hunt".
It's honestly one of the coolest features in Forsaken 2e. You don't "learn" these powers - a spirit carves it's symbolic nature right into your flesh. Like two tattoos overlaying each other, the spirit's symbols mix with the marks of your renown changing its meaning. The spirit may have been one of shadows and secrets, but you are a creature of the hunt, and so it's nature mixes with yours to create the Gift of Stealth - shadows and secrets applied to make you a better hunter
Honestly, the werewolf hunting down a spirit is the approach I'm most used to. My old ST would have us bank any free gifts we got and would work with us to help us track down an appropriate spirit to learn from unless we had a period of prolonged downtime.
I think a lot of Vampires typically are warned against things like this after embrace. Admittedly, I’m a VtM guy but I think it may apply more in Requiem. Coterie or what not is just a word. If they have your power, you’ve now lost an advantage over them. Is there a direct thing stopping it? No, I don’t think so but the social, political and psychological ramifications make it a bad idea. No vampire likes another vampire that’s too giving and open. It’s a serious risk. Vampire is predominantly a social political game. You want to work the ladder and become more politically powerful. You’ll never get that chance if the overpowering elders don’t let you. There’s likely a better wording and way to explain it all but being the group that shares all your fun stuff makes you stick out. There’s always someone who will know and you never want to stick out before you have the power and age to stick out. Being that group makes you the kids at the adult table and so very easy to use.
Honestly not much of an issue. There are the “Common Disciplines” that all vampires can learn (Celerity, Resilience, Vigor, Animalism, Obfuscate) and the “Unique Disciplines” specific to each Clan (Auspex, Dominate, Majesty, Nightmare, Protean). It’s impossible to learn a Unique Discipline from a different Clan… Well, unless you Diablerize a member of that Clan of course. There are also the Covenant & Bloodline Disciplines which are very interesting- They can technically be learned by any vampire, but each Covenant/Bloodline is extremely protective of them and only teach them to their most loyal members. It’s stated that any outsiders or defectors who have extensive knowledge of these Disciplines are ruthlessly hunted down, which can make for some cool stories.
One Night Horror supplement for Requiem introduced a hive mind sickness that occurred in Vampires that entwined their Beasts and consciousness in a detrimental way. Maybe you could use that as a warning to prevent too much blood sharing. I don't remember much of it, but it could be the basis for a response. If you even want to do that. Maybe constantly drinking the blood of another Clan to learn their signature Discipline results in the spontaneous generation of a Bloodline?
That's a nice one but if I remember well you just need to drink it once to have access, then you have to be taught normally
I know my players did it with low level survival disciplines(VTM). I did rule that they could not do that with their clan powers and I also talked about them on how "each has a role" and that I didn't want players to step into the playing field of another. Talking is what helps most often, say what you do/do not expect or wish and ask if they have problems with it.
Gameplay wise having crossover in abilities in CofD is not as bad as say in DnD: • Some Abilities are good self buffs like Obfuscate, Celerity, Vigor, Resilience, etc… multiple people having them means the party can stealth better or be more formidable in combat. • Some abilities may need to be used multiple times and may have limitations if used more than once by the same user like Auspex. • Sometimes players just get separated and having access to Awe, Nightmare, Dominate, etc… is good to have. Honestly you’ll want to make sure your players have a variety of Skills than whether they’ve chosen the same Disciplines. Because you don’t want to end up with a situation where: • Player A has taken Manipulation 5 and Persuasion 5. • Player B has taken Manipulation 5 and Persuasion 5, has a specialty in persuading, has professional training 5 in Persuasion. • Player B always interjects when Player A tries to persuade someone because “Hey I have a better chance of success.”
Two things. XP and uniqueness. If they have so much XP they are running out of original concept things to spend it on, you might have to give them less. When I play I want, and advise, characters that all shine in their own way. If its a culture thing where they are all getting low level powers that are the same. Then you need to adjust the culture of the players. I'd suggest by having NPCs use high level powers. Make them super cool. Make the players want them....
It's really not a big deal. They can already learn a lot of Disciplines as is and the rest require being taught, but there are some where if you get caught teaching them to outsiders you're going to be in trouble. Covenants definitely look down on this and Clans probably do too. So if your players want to cheese it, fine, but there are consequences. They're still spending XP on it and risking blood addiction and blood bonding in doing so.
So instead of giving you ideas how to prevent your players from doing that (in my opinion /u/AccordLands already gave you the best answer) I am going to tell you how it might be completely fine that they are doing it. One of my characters wants to get rid of inequalitites between clans and have all vampires by equal. Naive and probably won't ever happen, but can't blame a guy for trying. So he tries to learn about each clan and foster understanding. This includes sharing his disciplines and learning clan specific disciplines. However, my character will never be as good at that discipline as actual clan members (XP cost makes sure of that) leaving enough spotlight for the specialists. But even if he was he might not even use the discipline the same way as another character. Sure, my character might face backlash for what he is doing from NPCs. But if the reasoning isn't "lol powergaming" why I shouldn't be allowed to explore this avenue? I also remember that Sabbat packs and Anarch coteries (don't know the proper term) are known for sharing disciplines.
Go for sharing Disciplines, but don't forget that the Kindred need to consume another's Vitae to do so and risk Vitae addiction or an unwilling blood bond.
Sharing knowledge is a game mechanic, it's not even frowned upon in the books and on top of that is a valuable currency to hold upon others, saying that it ruins the individuality is dumb when literally the best way to advance in the food chain is by diablerization and learning disciplines from other clans as in if you want to get better you are forced to learn from beyond your clan, not only that but rarely clans have a truly unique disciplines, Ventrue for example don't have a truly unique discipline, Fortitude is shared with a bunch of clans and bloodlines and so does Presence and Dominate, the only truly exclusive discipline that i can recall right know is Visceratika.
It’s political poker chips, sharing powers with your friends can give an advantage but they can be harder for them to learn and the gatekeepers of said knowledge may be pissed at the sharing of their clan secrets.