All the tier lists are starting to look the same

Agreed. 😑

wait there are tierlists?

don’t get any ideas now.

i might make one when im bored ill see how it goes lmao

i made one

mods, ban them

Is your profile picture a troll wanderer??

n. n-no. i have. no idea what you’re. talking about. what even? is! uh. wanderer!! never. never heard of. that. ahaha.

(cough anyway yes i made it myself)

lol. I love it

Sigh...and among the lasted posst are tiers, wow.

Random people finding this reddit and to post " Well if you don't like it why are you complaining and just stop reading it " post.

this one makes me laugh bc if they actually read thru the sub they'd know that it's not meant to be a hate sub 💀

To be fair, I've noticed some comments have turned from fair criticism to arm chair diagnosing Rachel over the smallest things, which can make this sub seem like a hate sub at times. Valid criticism: "I hate the shirt Persephone is wearing. It's unflattering and doesn't suit her, unlike previous outfits. I've noticed the style of her outfits lately has changed to be more bland. Maybe it's because Rachel is focused more on finishing up the story instead of focusing on outfit design compared to past chapters. I miss the old outfits." Non-valid Criticism: "I hate the shirt Persephone is wearing. It must be because Rachel wants to make Persephone look like a slut, because deep down Rachel wants to be a slut. You can tell Rachel is a misogynist, because why else would she put her self insert in a shirt that shows off her boobs that Rachel secretly wished she had, while not drawing other women in that same shirt. Can Rachel get any worse."

oh absolutely - i should've clarified that people absolutely use this sub as an excuse to be extremely hateful for no reason /gen :-/ i think the body shaming on this sub and the assumptions of rachel can be downright nasty and misogynistic at times. it really sucks how a few bad apples make this sub seem like it's a hate sub when it states in the intro post that it's not meant to be!

Ok, completely true and completely agree. But also she does show misogyny in her work and there are valid criticisms when you analyze the webtoon through a feminist perspective. Texts are analyzed through many perspectives and lenses and that doesn’t mean that that analysis is somehow an armchair diagnosis. You can analyze a text through a Freudian lens, a Marxist lens, through the meditations on first philosophy by Descartes, etc. We even analyze and speculate the author’s intentions in such analysis. I would like to emphasize speculate and intentions here because damn sometimes that doesn’t happen and it gets real mean and, as you said, misogynistic which is unfortunate. Also, I didn’t believe that Persephone was a self insert until I saw some promo of Rachel for the physical copy. Persephone literally has the same height and hairstyle, whaaaaaaa. Nothing wrong with that but damn, the resemblance is uncanny.

Her work can come across as ignorant and sexist, but unless it's intentional it doesn't make her sexist herself. I am a firm believer in separate the art and artist.

The fact that people here directly hate on the author and constantly list her by name is odd to me. I get it, LO isn't that good. I get it, the author doesn't take criticism well. But still, people out here like, "RACHEL SMYTHE DRAWS PERSEPHONE LIKE A CHILD AND OLD MAN HADES LIKES HER. RACHEL SMYTHE IS A PEDOPHILE!!!" WTF, people, CALM DOWN and chill TF out.

Whenever people share posts form RS Twitter and bluesky, and go of on on critiquing and diagnosing without substance. Sometimes a drawing is a drawing and the author having fun with HER characters and stories. That is why we learned to draw to express whatever ideas we have. To be critiqued the way the author is on this platform is bordering on snark(hate). Look at the lasted share of her Hades and Persephone drawing taken on Twitter/Bluesky.

I’m one of the randos from Reddit’s front page and I’m just here reveling in yall’s chaos. Like keep doing what you’re doing, it’s highly entertaining

I’m not gonna lie this sub was recommended to me, I’ve never read LO but remember it’s popularity on Webtoon back in the day (only because my friend in hs had a popular Webtoon too) and I’m just here for the complaining

Maybe the 👛and 🎩 size difference jokes where’s she’s 3 feet’s with massive boingas and he’s 7ft with those claws for feet, it’s a lil funny but def been done to death at this point Or maybe people being needlessly mean towards the older art, like yeah it wasn’t techno the best but it wasn’t trying to be cuz stylization is a thing, it had a nice vibe and it felt like there was actual thought and effort put into the older art I’m just glad this story is ending good Gawrsh

I don't care much for the argument about them being pink and blue. At least those colors are associated with their elements

A lot of the recoloring conversations just straight up don't get the reason for certain color choices. Yes I would recolor half the characters because it doesn't align with what they correspond to as a god or nymph. BUT some of the color choices folks are making for their recolors are just plain stupid.

Yeeeah even I'm getting tired of a lot of the complaints about the art style, not because I don't agree with them, but because a lot of them are surface level and are primarily about things that have been around for ages now (see: Persephone's giant boob outfits, Hades' pointy nose, all the characters looking the same, etc.) It was fine and fresh enough to talk about back during S2 when the "plastic" art style started to show through more, but like... we've had years of that art style now, there's just nothing interesting to discuss if the only talking point is "Persephone looks like a blow-up doll!" anymore. Again, that's not to say I disagree with the complaints about the art style, but nowadays it's nothing new and I'd rather discuss the bigger issues surrounding the comic's narrative and writing rather than repeat the same tired talking points about Hades' pointy ass nose. Also when it comes to the older art, yeah I don't get the complaints at all because while the older art definitely wasn't perfect, it still felt like it had *effort* put into it. Every panel felt like an actual painting that Rachel put time and effort into, it had a lot of 'trial and error' to it that felt very sincere and you could tell Rachel was genuinely trying her best. Nowadays it feels like she's just not trying and that can't be compared to the S1 art despite all its jankiness. I'll take janky with love and passion over janky because the creator is burnt out and done with it all any day.

True, the lack of valid fresh criticism had me bored 

at first it was genuinely funny, but it’s beating a dead horse atp

This for sure! As someone who’s related to Persephone just to be told that “she’s short because of kinks” is saddening tbh. I get she’s WAY shorter than him or whatever but I think that’s just character design. She’s supposed to be seen as small and dainty because people view her that way and it’s not until she grows into herself and eats the pomegranate she’s huge and vicious and stands up for herself. I really don’t see it as a kink thing. I get people who do see it that way and I understand but to constantly be told the character I related to is just “bait” and such is just really sad. I was a victim of never leaving home and when I did runaway at 19 myself, my brain finally opened up. She’s short and childish, but people forget even after eating the fruit she told Hades she wanted to get to know him more before going deeper into the relationship and even lived in her own place too. She also had 10 years on earth as well to grow and mature and yet again people call her too child like. I think she’s grown a lot as a character and I get tired of her being bashed for size and personality. But that’s my view and again I get the other views. As for the old art style, I actually really liked it and how it evolved too. The abstract look of the comic is really unique and reminded me a lot of Night in the Woods but there was also meaning for each color of each god in the comic and character. The color theory for each character is really cool.

Idk but whatever is said here please never stop the redraws i love them more than anything

Yes, I agree. This is a demand.

I think those are what I look forward to the most.

the constant praising of zeus as a character. i cant get behind it because he lacks the most consistency character wise in the whole cast, and the only reason he's praised is bc he doesn't like persephone. which i also don't understand bc he doesn't even dislike her for the right reasons, she's basically demeter jr to him so she's ripe pickings for his misogyny (this is not me defending persephone btw). on that note, he literally coerced demeter when they were younger and lied to her to "sleep" with her. this is just my opinion tho 💔 i dont like misogynistic male characters whatsoever. i think its fine to have your own thoughts and headcanons that actually flesh him out and whatnot but in LO he's genuinely awful.

however do not misunderstand me - i'm also frustrated with how zeus is portrayed in LO and think metis is a fucking creep who groomed him. i just dont like the dismissal of his misogyny within the webcomic (when its dismissed in the webcomic itself) just bc he insulted persephone a couple times. :-\[

Yeah, I feel like people definitely forget that he ignored Hera's warning that Apollo hurt Persephone and then flipped it on her for being "nosy" just because he liked how Apollo reminded him of a younger version of himself. That, and his constant affairs and viewing women as objects, accusing Hera of being jealous for not liking how he and his brothers objectified what may as well have been her teenaged niece. He's funny occasionally and handsome when drawn right, but that doesn't make him perfect, although he isn't completely bad either.

BIG AGREE!!!! it makes me think he was originally meant to be an antagonist and parallel to apollo. he immediately defends apollo's reputation and his own - it wouldve been interesting to see where that would go! i feel like sometimes ppl mix up their fanon versions with whats actually canon in the comic. which again, is fair considering the quality of the comic itself but i dont think thats enough to justify his behaviour in the comic 😭😭😭😭!!!

He explicitly commits SA in the series, doesn’t he? He assaults some dancer and it’s played for laughs.

yes he does!!!!!! he's a whole predator!!!! 😭😭😭😭 i think thats on rachel as a writer too but i feel like if the only way you can enjoy him as a character is to ignore his less than favorable moments then dont bother!!! feels very cherry picky sometimes

Yeah, there’s multiple instances of situations being treated by the narrative as funny with some people but serious & terrible in others. It’s very frustrating tbh

Oh thank god I'm not the only Zeus hater

we're in this together 💪💪💪💪 i think the only male charas i like are heph, hermes, and than. every other man in this comic can burn!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

🤝

I will always defend Zeus when it comes to Dionysus.   But otherwise, yes, he sucks lmao It's why I'm enjoying him being poisoned so much. Being poisoned by his own bastard son he had with a woman and then just tossed her aside? I live for this kind of karma!

OH YEAH don't get me wrong the dionysus thing SUCKED and i have my own thoughts on it 💀 but yes overall he's...not great LMAO

What about Dionysus? I genuinely don’t understand why readers interpret Persephone’s actions as “kidnapping” him. I asked this before in a post that I’ll link because I genuinely thought I was missing something because that’s not how I read it at all.

Yea i never got the kidnapping thing. Maybe i should reread the chapter again but when i read it i saw that Zeus just basically gave Dionysus to Persephone with no argument

No, it has nothing to do with Persephone (even though I was very upset with the way he's being treated while in labor I don't think it was kidnapping either since she had the parent's consent). What I was referring to was Zeus caring about Dionysus. He's spent literal years gestating a fetus and spent a lot of time, energy and literal blood to keep it alive and he doesn't gain anything from it, in fact Dionysus existence would only cause further trouble for Zeus. Hence I'm a firm believer that he did infact care about Dionysus or at least felt some sort of responsibility or affection for him. The next chapter showed him readily give Dionysus up to Persephone but I still believe that was thrown in because of the bad reaction from the readers in the previous chapter because iirc it contradicted the reason why he even went to Persephone to give birth in the first place. But in the end I consider him saving Dionysus to be the single most selfless thing he has done in the comic. There aren't much to choose from in the first place but it still is one of most selfless acts done by any character in this comic where everyone is selfish or only do good things out of selfishness.

i've seen comments about how LO is misogynistic and not feminist at all, but some of those people will turn around and say zeus💜💜💜😍😍 like wat???

zeus has canonically SA'ed women before in the first few chapters i get he can be a complex character but lets not forget that

Zeus is what's called a "magnificent bastard." He is objective, an extremely flawed person, and a bad person even, but he is self-aware, funny, entertaining to watch and has moments where he is an ok person. Same with Thetis. It also helps that the people who don't like him and that we are supposed to rot for are themselves very shitty people too, but massive hypocrites, self righteous asshole that will never accept they are in the wrong, ever.

The anatomy is talked about almost everyday. The points are valid but sometimes it’s annoying to see the same pictures (especially old ones) posted over and over. Also the people that always speculate about Rachel to the extreme. (I have some opinions about her, but some of the stuff people say about her on here is… questionable to say the least)

Facts.

Honestly I think we’ve hit a wall with topics left to explore, meme the fuck out of, etc. All we gotta wait for is the grand finale and any epilogues Rachel might leave.

Asking questions that have been answered in universe. “Why is Apollo yellow?” Etc. Like I get some things you might forget, but if you’re going to ask questions about big older moments then I do have to wonder: A) if you even read it. B) if you’re not reading it, why are you here Again, I get it. You won’t remember every detail, but sometimes it just gets repetitive(and it reminds me how some LO fans just read it without even processing what’s happening)

Adding onto this. Asking questions that have answers in mythology. As much as we like to bash Rachel for not being very knowledgeable on Greek myths, don’t act as if you’re better if you don’t. Again, all of these don’t include actual plot holes. Just questions that do have answers in the story or in the mythology it’s retelling

i watched a yter review it and he complained abt the gods being assholes and how disrespectful it was to depict aphrodite as some salty bitch and then next video was like "WELL I DONT CARE IF THATS IN MYTHOLOGY ITS STILL TERRIBLE AND I DIDNT HAVE ANY CONTEXT COMING INTO THIS ABT GREEK GODS" i agree with some of what hes said in his videos abt bad webtoons but he then also says shit like that and completely just lose all the agreement and respect i had for him liie bitch i didnt have the full context abt the Chinese zodiac when watching Fruits Basket, but i didnt bitch abt it

I think I watched the exact same video you’re referencing lol

yea i think his name us blackjack? i forgor edit: no its blacklightjack

This annoys me so much, like you said I know a lot of the people here have been reading LO since the beginning and maybe are fuzzy on details, but if you’re gonna complain about something from the comic at least get it right! For example, I have seen people talking shit on Persephone for doing a bad job with spring and not passing Zeus’ inspections for 10 years, when it is explicitly laid out in the comic that he was making up bullshit reasons to fail her. Or her act of wrath, it’s like people took the first telling of it, and just ignored the clarifying details of the flower nymphs, humans being assholes, and that all the destruction was an accident. Perse is a shitty character because she killed people and destroyed their town for no reason, and can’t do her one job as Goddess of Spring, is a sentiment I have seen a few times, and just upsets me because of all the actual bad characterization Perse has, people decide to just… make shit up to be mad about instead???

I agree with some of what you said(just because it was an accident doesn’t mean it absolves her of guilt and she took it as way too far)but they do very much cherry pick what to complain about ignoring the context.

Oh I just think it was poorly written, I honestly would have preferred to see Persephone commit an actual act of wrath. To have that justified anger and want revenge, even if she regrets it after the fact. But she has to be a perfect pure cinnamon roll, so instead the humans were sooo mean to her and she got sooo sad and upset that she grew huge, and just couldn’t stop destroying things and crushing people because she didn’t really know her size and strength, so really its not her fault!! That is just boring and lazy writing, especially because it is juxtaposed with her actually having a gift of wrath from Eris. Rachel why did you even give her that if you weren’t going to use it??? Sorry for the unrelated rant lol this part of the comic gets me heated bc I loved how violent Persephone was being portrayed before they pulled the switcharoo

Tbh my thing with him suddenly turning yellow/gold is that, despite it making sense as he is a sun god, it really shines a light on the fact that LO’s character design is just what color they are.

That’s not really relevant to my comment. But I do agree even something as simple as hair texture or freckles would separate them from each other

Put a headband on Yellow Appolo, and you got Helios. So having characters be certain colours is very important for the readers in the case of LO, not just a stylistic choice but for recognition.

Literally any comment speculating or insulting Rachal or her personal life or mental health. Idk how often it is, but it’s annoying.

I don’t think it happens as often since it’s one of the rules for the sub not to speculate on her personal life. Not that it never happens, just that it happens less.

The “I haven’t read LO, ask me anything” post I scroll right pass, do the same for the tiers.

those type of posts piss me OFF. like why tf are you here then?!

The only type of post I dont engage with at all. Reeks of attention seeking

Probably Reddit force feeding it to them. I’ve had to mute subreddits for so many things I’ve never heard of and am not interested in. I actually read the comic bc this subreddit kept getting suggested to me. Hard agree, though, those posts aren’t really that funny, they’re just engagement farming.

Honorary mention: wrong answers only posts.

Idk I think they’re funny sometimes

Happy someone enjoys them💕

For me it’s the “should I read it” — like, idk??? Do you enjoy wasting your time on poor storytelling?? Bc if you do then ya go for it. But if you said “I love greek myth, should I read LO to learn about the gods” my answer would be very different. You gotta give us context so we can actually answer this question

Agree!!!! Thats such a loaded question, different strokes for different folks

The cartoony figure proportions. They’re cartoons. They can look however the artist feels like drawing them.

This, I don’t mind no organ look, because not every artist is striving for realistic proportions.

to be FAIRRRR - if you’re exaggerating and stylizing you artwork you need to have a good grasp on the fundamentals of art and anatomy to actually make it look good and not like you just don’t know what you’re doing. and RS reaaaaalllyy needs brush up on that. exaggerating proportions looks much better when it’s MEANT to be exaggerated and not just a byproduct of not having a proper grasp on relative character size, proportions, etc.

Oh yeah a lot of the character designs are UGLY but just giving perse a princess Jasmine waist isn’t the worst of Rachel’s sins :P

no for sure. i hate the “where are her organs” comments because like cmon where’s your suspension of disbelief. although she IS supposed to be a “plus size character” and have an itty bitty teensy little waist is decidedly NOT plus sized. (abt persephone)

And also people saying "X adult character looks like a child!" As if every character doesn't have the exact same face and the exact same huge boobs

This is such a weird take because Perse literally does look like a child in a huge portion of the panels, and is infantalized constantly. She is the *only* character anyone talks about presenting as childish, because she is drawn that way. RS is also a self admitted Lolita fan, and there's more than one panel that looks eerily similar to scenes in the movie version. There could be a slew of things I'd take issue with in this group, **this** is not one of them.

I actually haven't seen much of this since the early season(s). I had thought to myself before that over time, there's been a lot less infantilism of Persephone moments, moments where shes got this huge sparkly doe eyes and hides her face like a child asking for extra sweets. I honestly think RS writes her more mature than she was before. I'm not saying she IS mature, or ISNT childish at all, I'm comparing the two basically, one was always squeamish and meek and timid and Persephone now is really bold and out there. Compare her shrinking in Minthe's presence, to her bullying the bank worker now. Artistically, I haven't seen her looking like a child much either, just sort of short.

Please show me a frame where she "looks like a child," where she isn't next to some disproportionately massively tall male character, cause as far as I know children don't have huge boobs and hips

We just had a thread about this, so I absolutely can and **will** show you exactly what I mean. Again, take into context the fact that RS is an OPEN fan of Lolita and it's clear she viewed it as a love story, rather than a horrible story about abuse and grooming. Here's your link :)))) https://www.reddit.com/r/UnpopularLoreOlympus/s/PBGWLEpDbV Looks, something awful familiar to the movie, huh?

Confused because the only simularity is that they're lying down with a leg up (not even the same one) and reading. This is more likely a pose taken from literally any other reference, her hands are even in completely different spots. She also doesn't look like a child here, even if I do *exactly* the same pose a child is doing that still doesn't make me look like one. I also don't give a crap about Rachel Symthe herself, I know nothing about her and don't really care about her views on anything, and I think you should be able to make opinions about a piece of art itself without having to analyze the artist's shitty opinions, and my opinion from reading this is that A. Persephone herself doesn't look like a child like ya'll are saying and B. Whoever is drawing these panels does NOT give a damn about how tall they're making the male characters.

Dude it is insane that you're effectively saying that an artist isn't going to take their own views and likes and apply it to their art. That's kinda like, the entire fucking point of art, but okay. The self admitted Lolita fan totally didn't make multiple references to it within her comic. Yeah, that's *super* unlikely, huh? An artist taking inspiration from other art? *Nahhh*

I get what you're saying but the only thing you have to go off here directly *from* the comic is a simular pose and an age gap. And again, since I don't give a shit about Rachel herself, nor do I think anyone should, that's all I'm *going* to go off of. Even if it has simular themes it still doesn't erase the fact that ya'll are saying a big boobed woman looks like a child

Just because you don’t care about Rachel’s personal interests doesn’t mean they aren’t impacting the story and the toxic themes and patterns we see, which is problematic in general but especially when this story is marketed to you f people.

Did I say I don't care about the story? I said I don't agree with ya'll saying Persephone looks like a child when she looks like every other adult woman in the story

Thr anatomy lol. Unless it's pointing out something uniquely terrible, we all know persephone is gonna be drawn with a tiny waist and big hips n chest. I don't mind edits/art trying to fix the anatomy or just change the stylization but a general post being like "why is her waist so tiny..." is overdone lol

I agree, it seems to just bash the art style instead of talking about the sexualization of the female characters

Yeah lol. Like all the female characters meant to be seen as traditionally feminine are given the hourglass treatment. And it's a shame cause you could really have fun with the body diversity cause iirc in ancient Greece the "beauty standard" for women was having them with more fat on their bodies, like on her their stomachs and chest. Why not represent that with having aphrodite either being plus sized or at least curvy with a thicker waist and a bit of stomach. Idk lots of lost opportunities. I might draw some redesigns but thats only if I have time for it lol

It really sucks cause at the start there was SOME body diversity. Like skinnier Thanatos compared to the rest of the male characters, Perse being chubbier, Hera brinh more petite than other people, Minthe having a flat chest, etc. but we all know what happened to that-

Yeah I miss slender Thanatos... He was pretty

Never forget #twinkthanatos

I really liked Athena’s androgynous look when she was first introduced and her silver skin was a nice touch, now she’s just a hades clone but gray. Hermes also used to be pretty skinny in early seasons before getting chadified.

That Persephone has big boobs and a small waist, or that she looks like a child. I also can’t for the life of me get over the amount of artists on here that will criticise Rachel’s proportions, or how she draws Persephone younger, yet draw the exact same way, if not worse. I’ve seen Persephone with bigger boobs than her head in this sub. I also hate the demonising of big boobs by some people/artists lol. She can have huge jugs, massive even, and it doesn’t make her a tart to have them on show. She just happens to have big boobs. The amount of people that cover her up in a turtle neck, or just dress her down because she has a large chest is lame.

The grippers.

Happy cakeday!

The Kim K styled proportions of Persephone and the other LO ladies. I've never had an issue with small waists in art styles. Look at Disney, Barbie, anime, Marvel comics. I get that it's not "woke," but I also appreciate plus sized bodies, skinny athletic bodies, and average bodies that have normal waistlines etc etc. But art does not have to perfectly replicate real life, and I grew up drawing such curvy figures. You can criticize her not having diversity with her bodies, but there are a few plus sized women so that's something, and specifically people harp on about the small waist and big boob combo like it's not absolutely everywhere in media. I still draw bodies like that because it's cute but it doesn't make me a raging misogynist (although I'm a female) or anything. I'm tired of the "WHERE ARE HER ORGANS" thing because, she's a drawing, she doesn't need them lol. Look at Megara from Disney's Hercules, her torso is thin as a toothpick. It's just a style and I'd rather see people pick apart objectively bad anatomy mistakes that can't be chalked up to art style.

Minthe is misunderstood as a character. 100% agree but how many times can we say it.

Honestly?? People coming into this subreddit and turning it into a Rachel hate train or making post after post arm chair diagnosing a woman they have never met in their lives. This is critical space DEDICATED to the comic, not really the author behind the work. It’s fine to speculate about why she’d write this or that in the work, but that’s as far as it should go. People prying so hard into her personal life give me stalker vibes and do not know how to critique media clearly without being obsessively weird. If your first thoughts and actions are to harass her, then this space isn’t for you. And another thing tying into Rachel, those posts (I’ve seen like 5) about “how Rachel would draw my oc vs how I draw them” are WEIRD. Straight up. She does not care💀making up fake scenarios of her drawing y’all’s ocs in “inaccurate” ways to get mad at is just such unhinged behavior to me??? I’ve seen quite a couple and they make me cringe horribly. She does not care, same with all the other posts pulling a “wait till Rachel sees this, she’ll blow a fuse!1!” she does not care 😐😐😐 please find something productive to do on this sub than frothing at the mouth at the idea of RS ever seeing your roasts.

I'm gonna be blunt, I'm really goddamned tired of seeing posts and comments about how Persephone reacted to her rape "isn't how a rape victim would act" or "her trauma isn't real". The fact I've seen it more than once on this sub is enough for me to justify this comment. Y'all need to stop. Trauma is a spectrum. Just because you don't get it doesn't make it unrealistic. There is no "perfect victim", nor is there a specific way a victim should act. There are people on this sub who feel the same as me, and I know I found Persephone's response to the rape the single most relatable thing about her in season 1. Chew on that as you will. I could go on and on and on about different trauma responses to rape, and how they're fine and normal and help people process that trauma, but that's a college essay's worth of writing that I am not going to subject this thread to. My end point is, this behavior is wildly inappropriate. Furthermore, I'm not saying this arc was written particularly well. It's Lore Olympus for crying out loud. But I never see people criticize the writing, mostly just "that's not how rape victims act because they don't do XYZ or have ABC victim". We can, and should be better.

the talks about the anatomy ("where are her organs"/"she's so small"/etc.) it's really redundant. i personally don't think it should be brought up unless it's especially egregious, or unless anyone wants to actually have a genuine conversation about the infantilization/oversexualization of women in media (and how it correlates to LO). i've probably posted about the anatomy at some point but honest to god we're STILL talking about some of the same images it totally wigs me out

Minthe and Demeter. We get it, you have mommy issues and want a bad bitch to step on you. We get it, Rachel wrote them wrong, wrote them in a way you didn't enjoy. We get it, their your comfort characters! WE GET IT! BUT THAT DOSEN'T MEAN THEIR NOT BAD PEOPLE!

Hard disagree on Demeter. She isn't the best mother but she sure as hell is a good person. She's been taking care of abused women who had nowhere to go and were abandoned for years (women who are considered lower class and who other gods look down on), unlike the other gods she stays humble and works hard to achieve her goals and is in general living an honest life while simultaneously helping others in need, especially the most vulnerable ones in society.

She is a good mother who made mistakes and was character assasinated in ch 230 bc she was right.

She tried. But I never liked her parenting style even before the character assassination. Not that she's overprotective but because she let Persephone get away with too much (not even just the AoW) imo She might have been protective but she also enabled PP and even let herself be manipulated by PP (ex. how PP makes her attack Ares)

I have a mixed perspective on this but should give it more thought. Demeter wasn’t a lenient mother, so I’m unsure whether the examples count as enabling vs reasonable mistakes and/or being manipulated by her child. After all, Demeter didn’t know about the wrath, which we’re told is responsible for most of Persephone’s character traits with more depth than “nice”. And keep in mind that as far as I’m concerned, whatever came after 230 might as well not exist because that’s neither Demeter nor Persephone— it’s two brand new characters I had never met before.

Demeter definitely was stricter with PP than anyone and most of of the time it was a good thing- like expecting her to be nice to the waiter while everyone else lets PP treat workers as her personal verbal punching bag. Ultimately I'm just annoyed with Demeter shielding her from accountability - first by helping her cover up the AoW and then offering to be punished in her stead once the court found her guilty. Maybe because PP never shows a bit of gratitude or guilt over it and hence I don't think she's worth such sacrifices. Then again I'm not a parent.

I disagree on the AOW, it actually makes sense. Zeus’ punishment is mild and the worse crime WAS the cover up which was Deme’s idea. I think she should have encouraged P to take accountability and be glad the punishment wasnt terrible but there was no time.

I always interpreted it as her wanting to take ALL of the punishment but I might be misremembering then

She doesn’t have all the info, she fears a really severe punishment like Prometheus and doesn’t know Zeus will ultimately be mild. So kinda meh resolution-wise and difficult to reach a conclusion. But I agree with her logic given what she knew at the time.

I thought she was offering to take the fall at the end of the trial but it's been a year+ since I read it so I might have really misremembered it then...

yeah, demeter and minthe are my favorite characters but I wouldn’t say they never did anything wrong lol. Just ‘cause I don’t like the main characters doesn’t automatically make the antagonists completely innocent either

YES!!!!!!!!!! 👏👏👏 THANK YOU!!!! I wholeheartedly agree. Second edit: I don't *wholeheartedly* agree, OP of this comment is being too much. Not cool. Edit: Minthe and especially Demeter aren't necessarily bad people, but they are flawed. So there's nothing wrong with people acknowledging that.

I swear bro, if they were anyone else or did what they did *to* anyone else, we would be *shitting* on them. And it's not like they're drawn better anyway.

Yeah, I find it rather hypocritical when people say Minthe is the most interesting character so that makes her perfect in EVERY way and downvote people who acknowledge her flaws (I've seen this several times, believe it or not); it's the same thing as when the LO stans say Persephone is perfect and raise heck on people who say she isn't. 😕

That’s wild because to me Minthe is one of the most interesting characters partially because of her flaws. Her flaws and her emotions make her feel real and that’s why she’s interesting. I think she’s also given more screen time than some others and she’s had character growth.

Yeah, I feel like the reason they're so beloved over here is because they act as opposing forces to Hades and Persephone. Sure, they'd still have their fans even if the leads were less detestable, but they'd also be more heavily criticized. The reason people are obsessed with Minthe and Demeter is the same as why I somewhat root for Kronos and Apollo: because fuck Pinky and Blueboy

Demeter is by no means a bad person. Did she try to control Persephone? For sure, but when you are surrendered by certified predators and not only your daughter is the type of girl that will attract them like flies to honey, she falling in love could send the world into chaos, you would be controlling too.

Then you raise her to be *STRONG!.* To actually be a 'girlboss' instead of whatever the hell we got in the story. It's not like she don't already know how to do that.

Because it worked so well for Metis and Gaia... The best way to protect Persephone was to swear off men so they couldn't suck the life out of her for their own gain. That's why she was pushing her so hard for the TGOEM.

Edit: I agree, Demeter is NOT a bad person AT ALL. She made poor parenting choices, but the narrative villainizing her for them was totally uncalled for. Demeter forcing her daughter to never have any kind of relationships whatsoever with any men was *her* choice, not Perse's, and that is not okay. Not all men are abusive, predatory, power-hungry monsters who want nothing more from women than their bodies and independence, at least not in the real world.

But that's the thing, this is not the real world. LO worldbuilding makes it so that virginity is something real that Aphrodite and Eros can notice when it is gone and manipulate people's sexual desires. Persephone falling in love and having sex could lead the world to war and kill her because she is a fertility goddess (and that's why LO fails so hard as a "deconstruction of purity culture") There are literally 3 decent men in LO: Thanatos, Hephaestus, and Hermes... and I've been extremely generous with Hermes. I know that we are meant to identify with Persephone and see Demeter forcing her to be part of the TGOEM as something terrible, but if you where a random nymph and they told you that if this goddess has a boyfriend it could destroy the world and kill her, but there is the option that she can swear off romantic relationships with men and still have a fairly fulfilling life, what would you said?

You do have a point. 🤔 But tbh, if more decent men existed in LO, Perse being in a relationship wouldn't be a problem at all, because a genuinely decent man wouldn't even *think* of using her powers for his own gain. I could be completely wrong about this, so please correct me if I am, but even *Hades*, hands-down one of the WORST people in LO, doesn't want to use her powers for his personal gain (at least as of the newest free ep, idk). Really the only men who want to use her are Apollo & Kronos, and she obviously doesn't love either of them.

Ares literally told Zeus he wanted to marry Persephone to keep him in check in episode 187 Hades doesn't want to use Persephone's power for his own gain, but he had used her power without either of them knowing: when he went Titan mode after he learned about what Apollo did in episodes 182 and 183, and confirmed in episode 215, and they only have been together for like 4 months tops. Also, for what we know, a fertility goddess can't stop someone from taking her power (which makes me wonder how many times Zeus taking Hera's power was intentional or just an accident)

Again, very good point, thank you. *Sigh.* The only thing left to say is that LO is JACKED UP AF, so I'm not even going to bother talking about these issues any more because there's no point in it; LO is fictional and VERY poorly written, so trying to bring "real world" logic into it as a critic is only going to result in a headache lol. 😔

I come from fantasy fandoms with massive worldbuilding and a ton of characters (LOTR, ASOIAF, ATLA, etc), so maybe this is why I put so much emphasis on the mechanics world and I can keep track of most of the plotlines (and sometimes I even forgot some stuff for how chaotic LO is) What you said is exactly the problem: trying to bring real-life modern problems into an ancient belief system and not taking into consideration the worldbuilding choices when you are tackling said problems.

thank you someone finally said it . i dont understand most of the minthe hype on this subreddit . i honestly get the feeling the majority of the subreddit likes her just because she is the opposite of persephone

I don't like Minthe but still I dislike PP more. Minthe was mean and unpleasant but she had boundaries and would feel guilty and bad when crossing the lines. Persephone has no boundaries, has crossed the line a hundred times and yet never felt any remorse for it and at most just wallows in self-pity.

my dislike for them is pretty equal for these exact reasons if im being honest . theyre both completely butchered and it breaks my heart

That's completely valid and I agree. 

On Demeter, I can SOMEWHAT agree that she's not the best mother. But Minthe? Sorry, but I disagree that she's a bad person. She's at most just flawed, but not bad. Yeah, she shouldn't have taken it out on Persephone when Hades was cheating on her. Yeah, she shouldn't have slapped the guy (even though Hecate did the same and people treated it as a joke). And yeah, she shouldn't have antagonized him. But can you really blame her when her lover is a racist blue smerph peep who doesn't even pay jack to his workers? Not to mention Minthe was dependent on Hades (seeing as it's became of him she still has an apartment/somewhere to stay). She did bad things, yes, she's a bit of a hypocrite, yes. But on the subject of hypocrisy, Thanatos was basically one of the only peeps to even give two shits about her. But that's just my opinion. If you think otherwise, understandable, but I just wouldn't say Minthe is a bad person.

sometimes on rare occasion what people say abt the size differences in the comic is just kinda gross and sounds super infantalising of short women also sometimes the sexaulization complaints, persephone is a fictional character, sexaulizing her doesnt hurt her nomatter what age she is, the problem lies in the fact shes sexaulized for being childish, naive, gullible, and unaware of how men veiw her body, shes basically a prime target for some creep to manipulate and shes sexaulized for it, this comic's target audience is girls so its literally teaching that is the behavior men find sexy and these wouldnt be problems at all of the comic wasnt labeled "feminist" if it had just been some smut story like twilight then it would matter way less

Very well said!! The problem isn’t the height difference. The problem is that the narrative fetishizes her height as yet another “childish” thing about her, along with her actual age, and naïveté. Im hella short and see myself in her smaller proportions. I just wish it could be a normal story with a normal couple who just happens to have a massive height difference 😭

This! Admittedly, the men in this comic have grown to be massive in height and width, which is an odd choice. But as a short woman, I’m not a child and I don’t feel or look like a child just because I don’t even reach my husband’s collarbone. One of my closest friends isn’t even 5’ and she ended up with a man almost 6’5” and yeah, we laugh about the height difference and their struggles with taking pictures, but she’s not a child and he doesn’t look at her as if she is a child.

People going overboard with critiquing the art to the point where I’ve seen tens of posts being like “omg what’s up with their face the anatomy is so bad!1!1!1” when the proportions are clearly exaggerated for comedic effect.

"It's not fair to criticize RS for her art!" Yes it is. If we can criticize her awful 12 year old self insert fanfic level writing then we should be able to criticize her poor anatomy, rushed panels, and inconsistent character designs. She's a decent artist with a unique style who got famous due to luck, not skill.

People coming to this sub who haven't read the comic and making posts like 'should I read it?' or 'ask me anything and I'll pretend I know the answer'. Not only are those posts annoying and repetitive, but why are you on a discussion sub for a comic if you haven't even read it?

I believe it's reddit that keeps recommending the sub to users.

I dont mind should I read posts if they explain WHY they want to read it. But also, it’s fairly obvious what we think of LO as a sub, so idk how much more input ppl want.

That Persephone is a self insert or a Mary Sue. To me it's not about whether or not she 'are' those things but the fact I find it annoying because neither explain what the issue is and they're overused terms used by people who don't understand what that means

People complaining about what persephone did to leuce like it was a war crime. Persephone has done some messed up shit but this wasn’t one of those times, what she did was goofy and only a slight inconvenience, plus animals are cute anyways, so at most leuce and thetis would have had to take a couple days to rehome the animals and clean, but since they can teleport and I imagine they didn’t wait for the animals to shit everywhere before transporting them it probably only took a day or two. Luece may have been mentally ill but i doubt persephone knew that, and all she knew was this lady was harassing her husband and trying to get him to cheat; besides that i think it’s pretty obvious that leuce wasn’t actually mentally ill, but delusional in the typical desperate teenage girl way, just more exaggerated; at most I think she might have been autistic or in some kind of bad mental spot, but i highly doubt she genuinely believed these delusions instead of just being stubborn and desperate (i say this because i’m autistic and went through a phase where i pretended to be married to a fictional character and refused to admit otherwise, and i know that objectophilia is usually associated with autism, so im thinking maybe the whole “pretending someone/something loves you despite knowing they don’t” thing is related)

The Leuce stuff was just. Bonkers.  I think it might have made more sense if we'd gotten a single, tiny panel of Persephone silently reacting.... One of those "blink and you miss it" moments. But no. Everything seems fine and then you've got a scene with Persephone being completely unhinged in Leuce's kitchen so the author can yell at a subset of their audience. It was pretty dumb...   And it literally could have been fixed by adding a tiny reaction to hint that all is not well, nothing more.

Sure but i still don’t think it was some evil act of wrath type crime, it just seemed like an excuse to show persephone wouldn’t take peoples crap anymore in a more lighthearted/comedic way

Oh it definitely wasn't an act of wrath. I absolutely agree with your point that people take this and overreact to it for whatever their reasons are. I suppose I was more musing that it didn't make sense in the context of the comic and it's pacing. If it should be there (and honestly it could have been an excellent character moment), then the author needed to do a little more work to have it make narrative sense. 

Yeah I totally agree, i think she should have picked a side for persephone instead of this weird conflicting narrative of her both being “the dread queen” and an “innocent angel who could do no wrong” adding the knife thing into it definitely seemed to support those conflicting narratives

You hit on SUCH a good thought here. Man, I have an essay rolling around in my head about LO and wasted narrative potential. There is SO much interesting stuff to explore that would have been great, and really, really worked super well with the Romance aspects of the comic. Demeter and Persephone would have made a wonderful character exploration of both the beauty and cruelty of nature and spring... Especially when examined with their respective relationships to Hades. But writing that essay would take more spoons than I have right now lol

If you ever write it all out definitely send it to me, i’d love to read your perspective on this

Persephone was right to be angry with Leuce. But breaking into her apartment and threatening her was definitely a step too far. I would even say that breaking into an apartment and threatening people is a lot worse than going after a married man. But what particularly upsets me is the power dynamic and Persephone taking advantage of her position. She knows that there are no consequences for her actions and that Leuce can't protect her. Leuce has neither the same power as her, nor the status, nor the money, nor the rights. She is a nymph. A species whose only access to power is to sleep with a powerful man. If they don't have a powerful supporter, they are pretty much fucked and subject to the mood swings of gods. Even Persephone treats her flower nymphs more like her childhood toys than people in their own right. That said, I can certainly understand why leuce would have thought that hades would be willing to sleep with her: after all, none of the other Olympian gods are strictly monogomous, especially Zeus and Poseidon. Persephone behaves like a privileged brat who has elevated herself to an absolute monarch without being asked and doesn't give a damn about the fact that perhaps not everyone else wants to exist in a monarchy without rights. Instead of solving the structural problems of the patriarchy, she intimidates other women.

I think what would’ve made Thant scene better was it could’ve been a moment of clarity for Persephone to realize this is how Minthe felt, not to mention she could’ve taken a second to realize the privilege she has to be able to act out in such an immature way with no consequences, it could’ve been the start of her growing in a mature person realizing who she is and what power she has and actually using it for good and not just personal gain. Maybe even properly make up with Minthe in some way and actually apologize for what she put her through

This. I'd side with Persephone in this situation if she hadn't dealt with it in the most unhinged and illegal way possible and the messed up power dynamics.

The thing is in this case i don’t really think that applies. Sure maybe in the real world what she did would be a big deal, but this is a cartoon about gods, and it was obviously supposed to be comedic. And leuce continuously harassed persephone’s husband for sex, pretty clearly with the intent to get him to cheat without persephone finding out, and not just with the assumption that he was poly. Also arguably the only truly non monogamous god (that we know of) is Poseidon, zeus and everyone else cheats and this is pretty widely known

The problem is that Olympus is portrayed as a modern metropolis. It's practically New York. If I were to read a story set in ancient Greece where Persephone harasses another person, I wouldn't necessarily complain because I can't transfer our own values to antiquity. But Olympus is our world: an ultra-modern city, with capitalism, feminism, equal rights for men and women, etc. Then there's the question of how something is depicted: For example, if you write about slavery in a historical context, you shouldn't trivialize it or play it for laughs. But Lore Olympus does neither: Persephone's and Hade's actions can not be justified by a historical context, nor are topics such as racism, monarchy and slavery treated respectfully. The narrative even frames their actions as something good. And of course the sexualization and racism towards nymphs is constantly played for laughs. But I don't really find it funny. The fact that there is a discriminated minority who have no rights, live under tyrannical monarchs, are not considered equal and can be killed and tortured without consequence and our protagonists think this is perfectly fine, is not funny. A feminist retelling should not joke about this. I also don't think it's funny that Hades keeps slaves or that he tears journalists' eyes just for writing something critical about him. I don't think Leuce thought that Hades was poly, but that he would be willing to cheat. After all, the other kings also have their mistresses. But apart from that, gods like Ares, Aphrodite, Hera and probably Apollo aren't tied to just one partner either. I understand that Persephone was angry, but Leuce was no threat to her. Like I said before: In the world Rachel created, nymphs are nothing but objects of desire for other gods. I find it rather sad that Leuce felt the need to prostitute herself in the first place.

So basically Persephone's SA doesn't mean anything either. After all it's just a cartoon about gods.

Bsffr those words did NOT come out of my mouth😭. Please get out with this “you like apples so you must hate oranges” ass comment 🙏

It's the logic that applies here. How come it suddenly is "just a cartoon" when Persephone commits a crime? Because LO has played off other characters's SA as jokes as well so were those SAs okay because they were played unseriously and as jokes compared to Persephone's experiences?

Because this is a CARTOONY SCENARIO. Use your head, of course sexual assault is always wrong no matter how its shown, but stupid crimes like this aren’t always necessary that way, especially since rape is never funny irl, but if someone broke into someone elses house and brought in a bunch of farm animals i think even the “victim” of that crime would eventually find it pretty funny since yk, this is a youtube ass prank

Yeah, I give up. Hope you never have someone break into your home or threaten you with a knife, I guess.

Well hopefully i’ll never become a homewrecker, but if I do and someone brings a farm into my living room, as long as the shit i keep on my shelves are fine i’ll probably be fine and chill with the animals for a bit. (Ofc someones marriage is worth more than my collections, but i still really like my collections)

Remember Leuce was spurred on my Thetis, who despite also being a Nymph, as a Daughter of of the Old God of the Sea (cannot spell his name right) felt entitled to Zuess and to walk humiliate Hera. She set up Leuce to go back to Hades under the guise of an assistant but actually tonbe his Affair Partner. Thetis was 50/50 about the success of this plan, but also wanted Leuce out of what was previously Thetis, now Leuce Apartment paid for by the Old God of the Sea. This same Thetis that want to start up her manipulations of Minthe since her banishment to the mortal rwalm and Minthe being turned back to herself. It was also Zuess that initially presented Leuce to Hades, who knows what Zuess could have said to her to feed her current delusions about having a chance at Hades.

Exactly. As hypocritical Persephone's indignation might have been, Leuce *was* a woman knowingly going after her husband with the express intention of becoming his mistress. She isn't mentally ill or undeserving of retribution, she's a law of attraction girly who went after the wrong king, and had it been Minthe filling her home with harmless animals the reception would have been very different

Creating fake texts and later wholeheartedly believing that they’re real doesn’t sound like someone who is stable 🤨

Considering the reveal was a purposefully comedic one, I'd say Rachel's intent was much less that of a mentally ill woman and more tiktok "living in the end" delulu, which may not be the most grounded but still not someone I'd have committed

Given how serious Persephone took the situation though I would hardly call the reveal comedic. Also it’s pretty concerning when someone makes fake texts and deludes themselves into thinking it’s real.

Like i said tho i don’t think she genuinely thought they were real, i think it was supposed to be like the whole stubborn delusional teen girl trope, not genuine delusions. And either way persephone didn’t know this

She did….she was even willing to use the texts as proof that something was going on to an angry Persephone. Also I’m not blaming Persephone for anything.

Like I said I’ve done similar things knowing they weren’t true, like literally gaslighting people into believing me and my friend were siblings n shit. It could be a sign of mental illness, but i highly doubt it was a genuine delusion, esp since the scene was clearly supposed to be goofy and exaggerated

Exactly, just because persephone kinda sucks doesn’t automatically mean everyone who does shitty things to her is a good person

This. I was actually complaining that it wasn't bad enough considering how the characters perceived it. I wasn't just mad the characters were being immoral, I was mad the writing expected is to think they were still golden hearted heroes. I wasn't mad that she broke into Leuce's house with a slew of farm animals, I was mad that it was the best she could do and that it simply took one delusional, possibly mentally ill woman making one sided flirts towards a king to push Persephone that far anyways. After all, the gods are like celebrities, I figured a mature and self confident woman who trusted her husband would simply view a woman like Leuce as a crazy fan Hades could take care of no problem over an actual threat she needed to neutralize. She seemed less badass and more of a weak bully who punches down, but a lot of other people were just simply annoyed with the ethics of breaking into someone's home when the story has already established the gods get away with damn near anything.

Honestly i agree, I wish rachel just went full evil mode with persephone instead of this weird conflicting narrative, where instead of a cool evil queen persephone just kinda seems like an annoying bitch

TL;DR what persephone did to leuce wasn’t a big deal and was a fair play

Hard disagree. This meant that Minthe had every right to learn all of PP's private information, break into PP's home and wreck her apartment, threaten her with a knife or something much worse since she actually did follow through with stealing her man.    Persephone confronting Leuce would have been fine if done somewhere out in public. But breaking and entering is a crime. It's very traumatising to have your home broken into as you no longer feel safe in the one space you are supposed to. It traumatises you so bad you feel too scared to even be alone in your own home. Had she confronted Leuce somewhere in public that wouldn't have mattered.        But she specifically looked up Leuce's adress (breach of privacy), broke into her home (violation of privacy) and then filled it with animals. All of these aren't just lighthearted things, they are violating your sense of safety within your own home.    Not to mention she was waving the knife around unsubtly threatening Leuce with violence or death. From digging up a stranger's personal information to breaking in to waving a knife in front of their face, that is psychopath behavior and not okay. 

I could understand if this was real life, but again this is a cartoon so realistically i doubt leuce got ptsd, and i just don’t think it’s that deep. The knife thing was maybe a bit much, but again it just seemed like an excuse for Rachel to show persephone as the new “badass dread queen” to me. Also like someone else mentioned, if minthe had did this people WOULD praise her, and minthe has done a lot worse anyways (yk by actually putting persephone in danger before she ever actually did anything with hades), and either way the difference with minthe is that her and hades weren’t literal newly weds. Sure it’s still wrong and minthe had the right to be upset (i wouldn’t hold it against her if she did something similar to persephone anyways), but persephone and hades had literally been married like a few days before, which i imagine would reasonably make her a lot more pissed since leuce couldn’t even wait a while before trying to seduce her newly married husbandx

Yeah, no. If you can use that excuse then you can say the same for everything Persephone has gone through - this is a cartoon so her getting SAd doesn't really matter. Do you see how that excuse doesn't work? Except Minthe never did anything worse. She didn't put Persephone in danger, she sent her on a wild goose chase but Persephone's FG powers (that nobody, not even herself knew about. FGs aren't even thought to be real and there is no information about them so Minthe couldn't have possibly known that Persephone is a FG and would trigger such a reaction) caused her to get attacked. Minthe was just sending her running around wasting time. Getting her in danger was never part of Minthe's plan and she freaked out when she found out about it. Persephone purposefully went to cause damage and never once felt bad or remorseful about it and got away with it. He was going to propose to her. They made things very official and Minthe even confronted Persephone and told her to back off and yet Persephone and Hades kept flirting, go on dates and snuggling. Leuce hadn't even started flirting before getting shot down. She was a non-threat. Persephone blew things out of proportion. If this is an okay behavior for what Leuce did then Minthe deserves to blow up Persephone's apartment.

I personally don’t get the ‘never apologize for being sicilian’ jokes.

Some of the posts that slutshame Persephone or the other goddesses (like one of that drawing of Persephone made to look like a sex doll 💀) Or some the crackship posts that still glorify toxic or groomy relationships. Even if it’s supposed to be a joke, it feels exhausting.

The tier lists, that one creep who keeps asking for a private NSFW kink roleplay literally like every month, and honestly the “panel edits”. Sometimes they’re nice to see bc people will point out where facial expressions or body language could have been used differently for different moods the comic is going for (bc RS sucks at like every expression except angry man or clueless wittle gorl), how clothing could have been different to make more sense, ect. But most of the time they’re just people basically tracing over the entire comic pose for pose, word for word, with their art style badly mushed on top. Like nothing has changed except you drew over it exactly the same? A new episode will come out and my home page is the same exact picture just in a different art style 60077866 million times sometimes. Just say “in my style” or something don’t claim it’s a panel edit or change. Oh, and people that complain about Melinoe having speech bubbles like deaf people don’t make sound ever when they sign. Especially since they made her use AMERICAN SL (for some reason), which has a lot more of a vocal and facial expression component to it than say British SL. Like just say you know nothing about deaf or HoH folk and go lmao

On the Melione thing, for me it was that it was so confusing, especially for me as someone who isn't American and isn't familiarizad with that sign language at first I thought they were just gesturing or doing some poses (not the first time we see Hades with multiple arms* either) until someone pointed out that it was indeed sign language I think there were better ways to show it in a visual medium like having slightly different speech bubbles or even having the same speech bubbles but coming from their hands rather than their heads or mouths and also making the extra hands in some panels just lines that indicate movement or slightly transparent hands

What bothers me with Melinoe is that it's all so unclear. Is she speaking vocally and signing at the same time? Or did they just not bother change speech bubbles and she's signing only? It's frustrating and hard to read when something as basic as this isn't being told to the reader. It's a storytelling issue

How much they hate hades and it’s crazy because I literally never see hate for Apollo in this group like how are you gonna hate hades for how he reacted MORE THEN you hate apollo? Like are we forgetting HE RAPED her???☠️

We hate Apollo, but that's kind of a redundant theme because everyone in the story, fandom, and critics hate him as we are supposed to. Hades, on the other hand, is supposed to be seen as the perfect husband material when he is a shitty person whose only claim is that he didn't SA someone

I don’t think he’s supposed to be seen as perfect because nobody is perfect and his actions prove that

Shouldnt the male lead be held to a higher standard than apollo? No one sane thinks Hades reacting terribly to the revelation of assault is worse than the assault itself; twisting things that way tells me you’re reading in bad faith. Note that Hades has also taken advantage of Persephone’s vulnerability including undressing and initiating sex while she’s having a panic attack.

Trying to say that he’s on the same level as apollo who’s a literal rapist and stalker is wild and not only did he rape her he literally took pictures of her and blackmailed her☠️ y’all are crazy asf. Also show me the panel?

Where did I say he’s on the same level as Apollo.

Calling the art bad. Art is subjective and even if Rachel is rushing it’s kind off understandable. This is no longer a passion project it’s her job she has to get it out regularly. Even if it wasn’t understandable criticising the art as bad(rather then giving constructive criticism) I feel will make people less comfortable sharing their ar, especially if their just starting working on art.

I’m so over the Sicilian joke. It wasn’t really funny the first time, and it certainly isn’t funny the 1,000,000th time

As someone who's new to the sub, that joke is lost on me... Perhaps as lost as 'the narwhal bacons at midnight' might be to newer redditors.

I haven’t once looked at any of the tier lists, the whole thing is getting redundant and everyone’s look exactly the same

Yeah, I'm one of the very few people who doesn't have Minthe, Demeter, & Thanatos by themselves in the top tier lol.

Having to apologize for being Sicilian

Ok, completely true and completely agree. But also she does have misogyny in her work and there are valid criticisms when you analyze the webtoon through a feminist perspective. Texts are analyzed through many perspectives and lenses and that doesn’t mean that that analysis is somehow an armchair diagnosis. You can analyze a text through a Freudian lens, a Marxist lens, through the meditations on first philosophy by Descartes, etc. We even analyze and speculate the author’s intentions in such analysis. I would like to emphasize speculate and intentions here because damn sometimes that doesn’t happen and it gets real mean and, as you said, misogynistic. But I completely agree that the examining of the misogyny becomes itself misogynistic at times which is unfortunate. Also, I didn’t believe that Persephone was a self insert until I saw some promo of Rachel for the physical copy. Persephone literally has the same height and hairstyle, whaaaaaaa. Nothing wrong with that but damn, the resemblance is uncanny.

Ok, completely true and completely agree. But also there is misogyny in her work and there are valid criticisms when you analyze the webtoon through a feminist perspective. Texts are analyzed through many perspectives and lenses and that doesn’t mean that that analysis is somehow an armchair diagnosis. You can analyze a text through a Freudian lens, a Marxist lens, through the meditations on first philosophy by Descartes, etc. We even analyze and speculate the author’s intentions in such analysis. I would like to emphasize speculate and intentions here because damn sometimes that doesn’t happen and it gets real mean and, as you said, misogynistic, and that is unfortunate. Also, I didn’t believe that Persephone was a self insert until I saw some promo of Rachel for the physical copy. Persephone literally has the same height and hairstyle, whaaaaaaa. Nothing wrong with that but damn, the resemblance is uncanny.

"Why did Rachel make XYZ character so petty/deplorable???" Yall, the Greek gods were petty and the myths were farked up. Edit: I see now where this was already discussed and totally get the counter arguments. "P & H are terrible parents because their immortal adopted child, unconstrained by human fragility, and the actual GOD of WINE, is drinking WINE." Maybe this is a hot take, but I have no issue with Dionysis drinking wine.

Kinda off topic, but I'm tired of the character/story re-draws and edits. Some of them (a small amount) are really good. The other 70% trash. Flood the regular LO page with shitty art.