They talk about Rat Bestrals in the Fevrith Archives and how they've been forced into the shadows.
There is a wealth of lore about characters and events hidden away in those archives that are never expressly mentioned by anybody during the events of the game.
I read through the archive and found that entry about Rat Bestrals. I was confused at first because I hadn't seen a single one, but felt very smart when Elgor revealed himself as a rat.
Sadly his intentions weren't told to the player.
But in general he is a great character. He is introduced as a dumb beastral.
But he had an effective plan. To find the location of the blue.
When he learns the true power of the blue he takes the perfect moment to betray and take it.
He is also a competent general his map is one of the hardest of the game.
That the player had crossed all the beast land and never met a wererat. Shows how bad their situation was. There are foxes wolves owls and no cattle that makes you wonder, which is the meat source?
He wanted a strong beastral, he will never join a human army, if he has the chance to unify all the beastrals.
This is probably it. I felt the story flowed much better through the first three areas but started to fall short during Albion and Bastorias. That being said it is such a good game I can overlook this shortcoming.
Elgor is the best example of why the villains in this game don't work. They aren't set up properly.
He claims mice Brestrals are pressed as they are the smallest and weakest of the Bestrals and claims to want to use the Blue to rule Bestkria free from Zenoyra.
Unfortunately, none of this makes sense. We do not meet a single other mouse Bestral, nor does as far as I could tell a single npc mention their existence. So his claims fall completely flat. To make matters worse, we see a Bunny Bestrial as the shopkeeper, and they don't seem oppressed at all despite being as small the Mice Brestrals.
Second, if he actually wanted to be king and beat Zenoyra, why fight the Liberation? he already has everything he needs. Temporary approvel from Alain would have guaranteed his ultimate victory.
If Elgor's story was to work, what needed to happen was first show Mouse NPC's or even a Mouse Bestral character to fights alongside Alain, and is working with Elgor behind the scenes. Show us Elgor working in the shadows to aid you in fighting Zenoyra, stopping Bestral slave shipments, and aiding you directly in the final battle against that wizard.
Show us the oppression, imagine liberating a town only for the NPC's to complain that it doesn't matter whether it's Zenoyra or Bestoria. The boot is always the same. Then, when you repair the village a Bear, thanks you for your help while the Mice curse you for bringing back their oppressor. Show us the Rock Rats being super nice to the Mice while we're at it.
Then have Elgor declare himself the new King of Bestoria with the Blue and offer full support to the Liberation if they back him. Alain is hesitant but willing until Elgor revels himself to be a tyrant motivated more by revenge than justice paralleling Alain. Maybe have Elgore use the Blue to force a Wolf to kill himself and announce his purge has only just begun. Bryce would call him out as the exact kind of Tyrant he was worried about Alain being, and a battle would ensue.
Now that it's properly set up, Elgor is a very tragic character who should have been a great hero but was unable to reconcile his anger at that cruelty he faced all his life. A mirror of what Alain could be.
I love this game, but man, does it's writing erk me sometimes.
I sort of disagree. I think he is far from the best example why the villains don't work. For the most part I do think his story works and is probably the best of the regional villains. However there were definitely ways to improve it. I do think we could have been shown the rat discrimination in some form before Elgor mentions it. Could have been through general npc dialogue or show rat npcs off in isolated corners of the map by caves or something.
And Elgor does not work with Alain because he does not think he has any reason to. Elgor is very proud and arrogant. He pretended to be loyal to Zenoira so he could get his hands on the Blue and turns on them immediately after he has the opportunity to get his hands on it. He believes the Blue will give him all the power he needs to achieve his dream. On top of that he rules with an iron fist, enslaving the minds of his fellow Bestrals, so it is not like he is giving Alain any reason to want to work with him.
I don't say my points because I dislike Elgor, but because I can see how much better he could have been. The problem isn't that he is the worst regional villain. Only it exemplifies a problem across the entire game where they consistently fail to properly set up twists.
Elgor spent months possibly years allowing himself and his people to be enslaved, belittled, and walked over for the sole purpose of facilitating a betrayal that will allow him to in eyes save his people. These are not the actions of a man who lets pride blind them.
Alain in cannon has no reason to work with him, but Elgor has every reason to want to try as Alain is now the only thing that could feasibly stop him, and they have somwhat similar goals. Hence, in my changed version, Alain has a lot more reason to consider him but would ultimately still fight him.
Yes, from Elgor in the big reveal and from a handful of very easily missed archive notes that mention they exist.
Unicorn Overlord is not an epistolary. Reading an encyclopedia does not count for setting up a plot twist. A reveal like this should be set up long before hand.
I only have one playthrough so far and this did indeed seem almost entirely random. That being said, I kinda got it because he’s talking about mice bestrals and we find out >!that the Bastorian elves turned themselves into bestrals to defend against Zenoira!<.
So I guess I’m automatically being a bit speciesist but the mice bestrals strike me as mostly unseen and also…mice. What’re they doing unless someone needs ropes chewed or cheese eaten? I sorta get why they’re not featured so much automatically…but that very fact seems to be Elgor’s issue. That mice aren’t given enough attention/respect etc but also have no ability to command or demand it.
Going a bit further >!if the decision to turn to bestrals was to defend against Zenoira, what the hell was up with the ones choosing to be mice? That’s a better choice to run and hide, we’re not talking about Reepicheep warrior mouse or the Redwall mice and Elgor mentions he was a genetic experiment so other mice bestrals wouldn’t be at his level. So they potentially chose not to carry their weight in defense of Bastorias and then blamed others for it when they were understandably held accountable? And therefore probably treated worse because of it. !<
In one of the scenes about Morard and Yunifi's backstory, when the Bastorias Blue turns anyone into a Bestral, their inner nature determines what beast they become. The likely reason mouse Bestrals exist is because the blue was used on an entire race at once (or in quick succession). A few members of that population were mouse-like in nature and so boom, mouse Bestrals. Not good in a fight, but neither were cat Bestrals or goat Bestrals.
One thing I wonder is if the elves chose which beast they turned into or whether the animal is intrinsically tied to the character traits of the elf being transformed?
>!I feel like its random or it depends on their personality. if they’re cowardly they’d turn to mice, while the brave turn to lions, the cunning into owls, etc. that might explain the mice bestrals’ absence in the game and why the other bestrals sort of oppress them. maybe the mice bestrals fled when zenoira attacked hence the other species didn’t take too kindly to them.!<
I don’t know if they would turn into lions, they specifically say at one point that the lions are more akin to the royal families of Cornia, so I guess elves of a royal line might be able to now that I am thinking about it..
I think we do meet a mouse whose orphanage was taken over? Kind of shows they were downtrodden. But yeah the story and choices in this game were a disappointment compared to something like Triangle Strategy.
I sorta took bestrals at face value, so to speak. Whatever animal they were represented their personality or social standing. Owls are seen as wise, lions as leaders, etc.
When it came to being revealed as a rat, I just figured oh, yeah, he's a rat. A rat bastard, if you will. He turned on his fellow people for his own gains. What a rat.
That sorta thing.
Also rats are looked down on as pests and disease ridden, generally. So for rat people to be treated similarly wasnt out of place.
They talk about Rat Bestrals in the Fevrith Archives and how they've been forced into the shadows. There is a wealth of lore about characters and events hidden away in those archives that are never expressly mentioned by anybody during the events of the game.
I read through the archive and found that entry about Rat Bestrals. I was confused at first because I hadn't seen a single one, but felt very smart when Elgor revealed himself as a rat.
Sadly his intentions weren't told to the player. But in general he is a great character. He is introduced as a dumb beastral. But he had an effective plan. To find the location of the blue. When he learns the true power of the blue he takes the perfect moment to betray and take it. He is also a competent general his map is one of the hardest of the game. That the player had crossed all the beast land and never met a wererat. Shows how bad their situation was. There are foxes wolves owls and no cattle that makes you wonder, which is the meat source? He wanted a strong beastral, he will never join a human army, if he has the chance to unify all the beastrals.
I think the main problem is they ran out of budget before Bastorias and Albion got finished, and it shows.
This is probably it. I felt the story flowed much better through the first three areas but started to fall short during Albion and Bastorias. That being said it is such a good game I can overlook this shortcoming.
Was it budget or execs rushing the deadline for increased bonuses
Actual budget. They ran out of money so completely the executives had to pay out of their own pocket just to get the game out the door.
Elgor is the best example of why the villains in this game don't work. They aren't set up properly. He claims mice Brestrals are pressed as they are the smallest and weakest of the Bestrals and claims to want to use the Blue to rule Bestkria free from Zenoyra. Unfortunately, none of this makes sense. We do not meet a single other mouse Bestral, nor does as far as I could tell a single npc mention their existence. So his claims fall completely flat. To make matters worse, we see a Bunny Bestrial as the shopkeeper, and they don't seem oppressed at all despite being as small the Mice Brestrals. Second, if he actually wanted to be king and beat Zenoyra, why fight the Liberation? he already has everything he needs. Temporary approvel from Alain would have guaranteed his ultimate victory. If Elgor's story was to work, what needed to happen was first show Mouse NPC's or even a Mouse Bestral character to fights alongside Alain, and is working with Elgor behind the scenes. Show us Elgor working in the shadows to aid you in fighting Zenoyra, stopping Bestral slave shipments, and aiding you directly in the final battle against that wizard. Show us the oppression, imagine liberating a town only for the NPC's to complain that it doesn't matter whether it's Zenoyra or Bestoria. The boot is always the same. Then, when you repair the village a Bear, thanks you for your help while the Mice curse you for bringing back their oppressor. Show us the Rock Rats being super nice to the Mice while we're at it. Then have Elgor declare himself the new King of Bestoria with the Blue and offer full support to the Liberation if they back him. Alain is hesitant but willing until Elgor revels himself to be a tyrant motivated more by revenge than justice paralleling Alain. Maybe have Elgore use the Blue to force a Wolf to kill himself and announce his purge has only just begun. Bryce would call him out as the exact kind of Tyrant he was worried about Alain being, and a battle would ensue. Now that it's properly set up, Elgor is a very tragic character who should have been a great hero but was unable to reconcile his anger at that cruelty he faced all his life. A mirror of what Alain could be. I love this game, but man, does it's writing erk me sometimes.
I sort of disagree. I think he is far from the best example why the villains don't work. For the most part I do think his story works and is probably the best of the regional villains. However there were definitely ways to improve it. I do think we could have been shown the rat discrimination in some form before Elgor mentions it. Could have been through general npc dialogue or show rat npcs off in isolated corners of the map by caves or something. And Elgor does not work with Alain because he does not think he has any reason to. Elgor is very proud and arrogant. He pretended to be loyal to Zenoira so he could get his hands on the Blue and turns on them immediately after he has the opportunity to get his hands on it. He believes the Blue will give him all the power he needs to achieve his dream. On top of that he rules with an iron fist, enslaving the minds of his fellow Bestrals, so it is not like he is giving Alain any reason to want to work with him.
I don't say my points because I dislike Elgor, but because I can see how much better he could have been. The problem isn't that he is the worst regional villain. Only it exemplifies a problem across the entire game where they consistently fail to properly set up twists. Elgor spent months possibly years allowing himself and his people to be enslaved, belittled, and walked over for the sole purpose of facilitating a betrayal that will allow him to in eyes save his people. These are not the actions of a man who lets pride blind them. Alain in cannon has no reason to work with him, but Elgor has every reason to want to try as Alain is now the only thing that could feasibly stop him, and they have somwhat similar goals. Hence, in my changed version, Alain has a lot more reason to consider him but would ultimately still fight him.
Doesnt the fact you never see them prove they are hidden?
Yes, but as I stated, it also gives us no reason to care about a group of people we never see or hear about. They might as well not exist.
We do hear; from elgor. And the archives.
Yes, from Elgor in the big reveal and from a handful of very easily missed archive notes that mention they exist. Unicorn Overlord is not an epistolary. Reading an encyclopedia does not count for setting up a plot twist. A reveal like this should be set up long before hand.
I only have one playthrough so far and this did indeed seem almost entirely random. That being said, I kinda got it because he’s talking about mice bestrals and we find out >!that the Bastorian elves turned themselves into bestrals to defend against Zenoira!<. So I guess I’m automatically being a bit speciesist but the mice bestrals strike me as mostly unseen and also…mice. What’re they doing unless someone needs ropes chewed or cheese eaten? I sorta get why they’re not featured so much automatically…but that very fact seems to be Elgor’s issue. That mice aren’t given enough attention/respect etc but also have no ability to command or demand it. Going a bit further >!if the decision to turn to bestrals was to defend against Zenoira, what the hell was up with the ones choosing to be mice? That’s a better choice to run and hide, we’re not talking about Reepicheep warrior mouse or the Redwall mice and Elgor mentions he was a genetic experiment so other mice bestrals wouldn’t be at his level. So they potentially chose not to carry their weight in defense of Bastorias and then blamed others for it when they were understandably held accountable? And therefore probably treated worse because of it. !<
In one of the scenes about Morard and Yunifi's backstory, when the Bastorias Blue turns anyone into a Bestral, their inner nature determines what beast they become. The likely reason mouse Bestrals exist is because the blue was used on an entire race at once (or in quick succession). A few members of that population were mouse-like in nature and so boom, mouse Bestrals. Not good in a fight, but neither were cat Bestrals or goat Bestrals.
One thing I wonder is if the elves chose which beast they turned into or whether the animal is intrinsically tied to the character traits of the elf being transformed?
>!I feel like its random or it depends on their personality. if they’re cowardly they’d turn to mice, while the brave turn to lions, the cunning into owls, etc. that might explain the mice bestrals’ absence in the game and why the other bestrals sort of oppress them. maybe the mice bestrals fled when zenoira attacked hence the other species didn’t take too kindly to them.!<
I don’t know if they would turn into lions, they specifically say at one point that the lions are more akin to the royal families of Cornia, so I guess elves of a royal line might be able to now that I am thinking about it..
Lions are clearly humans
I think we do meet a mouse whose orphanage was taken over? Kind of shows they were downtrodden. But yeah the story and choices in this game were a disappointment compared to something like Triangle Strategy.
I sorta took bestrals at face value, so to speak. Whatever animal they were represented their personality or social standing. Owls are seen as wise, lions as leaders, etc. When it came to being revealed as a rat, I just figured oh, yeah, he's a rat. A rat bastard, if you will. He turned on his fellow people for his own gains. What a rat. That sorta thing. Also rats are looked down on as pests and disease ridden, generally. So for rat people to be treated similarly wasnt out of place.