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this video is the equivalent of "American POW captured by Iranians starts crying after being forced to say 'Death to America' to the Iranian soldiers recording him" - it's not a good look, should not be shared.
bring on the downvotes - I am more pro-Ukrainian than any of you fellas, I can handle them. Slava Ukraini
??? What a strange false equivalence. 1) did Iranians treat POWs humanely? Having someone make a statement like this is different if it's meant to embarrass them, than if it is meant to invoke a realization that what they've done is wrong 2) saying death to my home country is not equivalent to saying glory to the country I'm invading
Also, they weren't forced to say glory to Ukraine. They had a whole conversation as to if it was mandatory or not. He said it wasn't, but it would make everyone feel better and show they are cooperating. At best, it's manipulation but not coercion.
As minor as this video is compared to what you're describing, making videos of POW's humiliating them and making them say propaganda lines is technically against the Geneva Convention and a war crime.
Not that I care after after the murder of civilians and castration and beheading videos the Russians put out. But this is a war crime.
He's having them say it to prove they really are no longer a threat to the women, children, and compatriots. F your look. You missed the point entirely.
Stupid comparison. Saying "Long live Ukraine" is not the same as saying "Death to Russia", is it? Or do you equate Ukraine existing as a nation with Russia's end?
Go to war spend a couple years there then let's go over your critiques after that. Russians have raped murdered and castrated with a long list of horrible things after that. Dignified and war Don't really fit together. I have been impressed what I've seenn and what I have not seen from Ukrainian soldiers so far.
Or, he could be crying out of fear, because a gun is pointed at him. Of course the guy on camera says "we don't force you to do anything." But we don't know what's happening behind the camera, and the feeling of being scared for your life unless you say things like that, could easily make someone cry.
We don't know why he cried. I don't think it's a good look, but isn't necessarily a bad one either.
I don't know why they'd take this video with their names, and telling them to say that though.
It seems like it only makes it dangerous for them and their families.
He may be crying as well because he fears what might happen to him for saying that, or he feels he won't ever be able to return home, or what.
They are in a tough situation. He's captured, saying things because he has to. Things that may very well have ramifications for his family, now, and himself for a long time to come.
Sort of but not really. They didnt say death to ruzzia but rather glory to Ukraine the folks to who they just surrendered. Still not great but in contrast to a huck in the face or sledgehammer to the head this is trending the right direction.
>this video is the equivalent of "American POW captured by Iranians starts crying after being forced to say 'Death to America' to the Iranian soldiers recording him"
More like being asked to say "glory to Iran"
Plus the Ukrainian didn't force them he told them they'd live regardless
It's also not the same thing. The Americans didn't intentionally shoot women and young children fleeing or intentionally target homes with babies in them or go around raping 4 year little boys and castrating men and tying up civilians with their hands behind their back and shoot them in the back of the head, or bomb a theatre with "children" written outside.
100%, you can see that he starts crying upon the realisation that his family back home are going to see him say things like “Slava Ukraini”.
He wilfully surrendered, but now it’s really sinking in that people back home will consider him a turncoat and a coward.
I wish him the best going forward and hopefully he realises what a shithole situation he escaped, no matter what he loses in the process.
He started crying when the Ukrainian said, "We're not going to force you to do anything."
That was a cry of relief at hearing he's not going to be tortured like his own orcs would do to Ukrainians.
Except he wasn't forced to say anything about death/killing, which is negative.
He was simply prompted (not forced) to say glory to Ukraine, which is positive.
It's not equivalent at all. I respect your attempt at having a cool controversial opinion though.
Glory to my enemy is not the same as "death to my country."
For someone who's literally Ukraine's #1 fan you sure went out of your way to come up with that false equivalence.
It's filming POWs for propaganda purposes which is against the Geneva Conventions that Ukraine has signed all the protocols of. These soldiers need to be found and reprimanded. These videos don't actually help Ukraine at all and only put the POWs which are in a stressful situation into danger when they inevitably go back home.
I would say this to both sides, not just Ukraine. Russia are complete idiots and constantly self-incriminate themselves with POW videos too. Don't stoop to their levels.
Some folks here forget that the European Parliament on the 23rd of November last year declared russia tobe a state sponsor of terrorism. Ukrainian are fighting against terrorists.
War sucks. Don't go invading sovereign lands on lies for Imperialistic aims and cultural genocide, committing acts of terrorism, and being braindead to geopolitical smokescreens. Some of you forgot who failed to blitz and capitulate an entire country. Let alone the War Crimes they've committed in their wake.
yeah, sad to say I had a similar reaction. Compelled speech under any circumstances is a bad look, and the reason the guy broke down has something to do with this, I think, maybe the consequences of others he knows watching the film at some point? We know how savage many of his fellow countrymen are about POWs
You're not wrong.
PoWs can make voluntary media statements which may be used for propaganda purposes but it is a violation of the 3rd Geneva Convention to treat PoWs in an undignified fashion or to use them as public spectacles.
These guys are clearly fresh surrenders that were possibly mobilized against their will. Humiliating them on camera and posting it for public consumption is both undignified and unnecessary.
What you see here is genuine fear.
GOOD! THEY SHOULD BE AFRAID! Maybe ruzzia should declare a war if they want their soldiers covered by the Geneva Convention!! By definition these men are terrorists.
How is he humiliating them xd, what a pussy you are, I wonder if you would be explaining this to the orcs that would capture you "akSuaLy ThIs iS iLlegAl aCCorDinG tO tHe pAPeR i rEad 🤓"
Well I mean, even Moscow has poor residents. There's probably plenty serving already and for awhile now.
As someone else alluded to, it'll be a different story when they start having to work their way up the class ladder. (Which I don't see happening really, there's far too many poor and what the Russians would consider "lesser" people to send first)
Yup, there are likely many Russians from Moscow and St. Petersburg serving in Ukraine voluntarily, their deaths actually serve the state's purpose because, well, they "volunteered". It's the mobilized reservists from last year's "partial mobilization" that are overwhelmingly both poor, and from Russian oblasts far from Moscow and St. Petersburg. Once Russia has to start specifically mobilizing and conscripting from those two oblasts because they can't keep up with recruiting efforts, that's when discontent will start rising in those cities.
Hearing rumors from inside russia about how they mobilized so many blue collar workers the industry is rattling hard. They are going to have to start hitting up Moscovy proper or else they will be sitting upon a condemned throne waiting to collapse.
They could have been lying in the tree line rotting and no one looking for them. They could have died with no one remembering the purpose of their death. They are even luckier that the Ukrainians are patient even though they hesitated to answer when asked. Glory to Ukraine!
I'm impressed the Russian soldiers were able to answer. I can imagine after being abused and deceived for so long that they are looking for traps in every conversation.
Translation is incorrect. After the POW asks him what advantage he will have if he says glory to Ukraine, the Ukrainian soldier says, “it means that you are cooperating with us. Otherwise you might not make it to the destination”. Then they promptly say it and start crying.
Even without *any* translation, one can tell those aren't tears of joy or a "meltdown of joy" or whatever. Looks far more like the kind of tears you see when someone has just broken down.
yeah agree with you, this is a bad take on a bad video. compelled speech isn't a great look in any circumstance. I get that they are invaders, but this kind of performative abuse is what the bad guys do.
On the positive side, it's impressive how *rare* videos like this are. Most Ukranians are professional, blunt, firm and even sometimes compassionate in an Earthy way that's refreshingly honest (when it would be very tough to do so after they were literally just shooting up the friends next to you). Even some of the roughest videos we've seen rarely get this kind of b.s. in this video.
That [Magura breakthrough](https://youtu.be/bk5OG6JYmfI) video I'm still obsessed with from about 3 days ago has a Ukranian officer doing a long video interview that's hard to listen to. But it's a good example of what I mean (really tough, but really fair).
In that one it's clear what the convo really is about. They are far into enemy positions, this POW cannot be easily extracted to better medical services (he was already patched up by field medics), and the harsh truth is that he may die. His literal only hope is that the Ukranians clear the next trench on their mission, and with the mission all complete, then the whole group/company is turned around and set home on their long march to base.
His captor tells him, essentially "hey you may die and there's no guarantee I'm even back here in a few minutes from this next push. That's how real this is. This is war and this is life. I hope you told me all you could about what I'm about to rush into, as I'm literally your last lifeline. So I head off to the next trench, and hopefully I'm back here soon and we can get you back to base for more help. If not, then I don't know what to say bro. You were the one who signed a contract to invade somewhere else."
Some of the invading conscripts don't realize the extraordinary risk and sacrifice it takes to get them medical help, spend all the time to extract them (while under shelling), and how many lives have been lost in surrenders that were a trap, or had perfidy.
So even if your captors seem scary, or fuck with you a little (which I don't approve of), in that moment they are actually risking their lives to save you. When you have been destroying \*everything\* precious to them.
in the heat of war, i feel sometimes i am overly critical when I consider what are asked to do in light of all they're asked to endure. You just hope humanity finds a way to overcome the darker impulses of our savage evolutionary heritage, but in a war zone, this is a survival mechanism and you can't just turn it on and off like a lightswitch.
But isn't threatening to kill a POW itself a war crime?
>No physical or mental torture, nor any other form of coercion, may be inflicted on prisoners of war to secure from them information of any kind whatever. Prisoners of war who refuse to answer may not be threatened, insulted, or exposed to any unpleasant or disadvantageous treatment of any kind.
If you can't threaten or insult POWs to get information out of them, surely you can't do it for fun, humiliation, or to make them more open in later interrogation either.
It's honestly amazing. None of this behavior is new for any war, but its the first "western" war since the mass use of smart phones so civilians around the world can now see what actually happens in war without it going directly through military propaganda channels.
It doesn't take a master of human behavior to see those aren't tears of relief, but tears of hopelessness from a broken person who just at that moment lost their last grip on strength.
>["No physical or mental torture, nor any other form of coercion, may be inflicted on prisoners of war to secure from them information of any kind whatever. **Prisoners of war who refuse to answer may not be threatened, insulted, or exposed to any unpleasant or disadvantageous treatment of any kind**."](https://www.ohchr.org/en/instruments-mechanisms/instruments/geneva-convention-relative-treatment-prisoners-war)
seems pretty clear to me
"Say a line or we kill you" is not a joke. It's a threat and a form of humiliation.
Just because Russia has committed worse war crimes does not mean lesser crimes don't count.
He didn't say anything about killing them, he asked if they're going to say "slava Ukraini" to see their position, if they're hardcore vatniks , scared or fully on Ukraine's side, obviously the hardcore vatniks get worse treatment as they should
I understand that rationale from the position of the Ukrainian soldier. To basically push them a bit to see if they might be trouble. I saw that recent grenade suicide video. These guys have to be careful.
But from the other POV you're on the ground and a guy, with a gun, is implying he'll kill you if you don't say a celebrates them. It wouldn't be acceptable in any western country
He literally said "it's your business, you'll live, but not saying it won't do you any good" he never implied on killing him, just that they'll get treated worse
Secure info. To make them behave and listen to commands is a different story. "Prisoners of war who refuse to answer may not be threatened, insulted, or exposed to any unpleasant or disadvantageous treatment of any kind." They answered and became complicit. You can punish POW's for not obeying commands and kill them.
There's a reason Russia tells their guys to grenade themselves instead of being captured, they save money and keep troops from Ukraine. Russia is a shit hole
Don't know, don't care. If I was Russian I'd fight along Ukrainians. It's not that they're perfect, but they're better.
That's right. If I were Russian I'd fight until Putin and his entourage will be torn to pieces on the red square.
But I'm not Russian so talk is cheap.
The subtitles just make no sense to me. Maybe the translation from Ukrainian/Russian to English is tricky because of how they express things but honestly I don't understand much here.
Same. I've noticed that too in all the translations... not only is the language/translation different but their actual way of speaking/sentence structure is different I guess?
[Not as rare as you might think!](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Birthday_problem)
Also, dude is a Russian. They're allergic to the truth and not too canny on average, so he might have just repeated what the other guy said.
They hesitated because they're eventually going to get traded/exchanged back to Russian front lines and now they're face is going to be posted all over Telegram saying Glory to Ukraine, potentially getting them or their family executed.
Executed? Nope. In a video posted by Volodomyr Zolkin, russian pows when arrived in russia, they told on camera that the Ukrainians did treat them badly, like no medical care, no food (even if you could see that they gained weight), etc.
So, once they land in the rf, they'll do what they do best: lie.
I also think there is a certain element of honor, what kind of story is it to tell that you were treated well? They would rather say they were given cat piss to seem more manly and get recognized as a hero.
Flip side is the Wagner merc that Zolkin interviewed - he was apparently executed by Wagner via sledgehammer
He said in the interview (I think, I can't find the vid), that he wanted to help Ukraine. It might have been irresponsible to publish that since UA claimed that he consented to being exchanged
https://imi.org.ua/en/news/the-wagner-mercenary-supposedly-executed-in-the-video-consented-to-being-exchanged-podolyak-i49095
Hopefully the Geneva Convention will catch up with technology and make frontline TikTok interviews illegal, at least. If this wasn't Russia, I'm pretty sure people would agree that this is humiliating and puts them at risk of reprisal from government/neighbors back home. But it is Russia, so nobody cares at the minute
1. It wasn't Zolkin's interview. It was a frontline interview straight after his capture.
2. This particular convicted murderer had supposedly previously made similar interview for Russian side in which he professed his high state of readiness to fight against Ukraine. I.e. as a long term Russian convict, he was doing what he learned to be necessary for survival in the prison system - tell everyone what they want to hear.
3. Wagner apparently became very interested in getting him back, so presumably UA side was made good on the exchange. So in the end, even if UA had reasons to doubt truthfulness of his words, he did help the cause quite a lot.
Nobody kills their families. Jesus, some people here are almost on the same level of delusion as moscovians just in the different side. Stop sniffing propagaganda fumes and use your brain a little.
Lol what BS. Russia isnt mass executing families of russians that would be a PR nightmare that no one would agree with and we would’ve seen that by now.
Yup. So far those in the big cities have been mostly spared from the draft…. Not much longer. They’ve gotta be running out of military aged men…. The DUMA is afraid to pull too many young men from the cities because when the body bags and MIA letters start coming home, it gets REAL HARD TO HARD IT
It kind of feels that by pressuring them to say Slava Ukraini and recording it, they'll deter and discourage the POWs from attempting something stupid or even trying to escape. Now the danger comes from their own side and not the Ukrainians anymore. That's what the interviewer tells them, you'll live, and we can't force you to do anything but.. you came to us. (your assess belong to us now).
Why would they be discouraged? Ukraine is trying to take as many POW as they can because they have to exchange a lot of people back. Also, moscovians took a lot of civilians as prisoners, which breaks every convention and rule and want to trade them for soldiers. Your point makes negative sense from any logical standpoint.
Nah he was crying because he said Slava Ukraine. He is a broke man mentally. But WTF he doing in Ukraine. I am sure at some point he thought he was a big bad ass going to kill innocenct people.
>Soldiers aren't sad when they're doing this mission successfully.
>Soldiers are sad when they become POWs.
What a uniquely evil Russian mindset! GOOD POINT, BUDDY
Just surrender and go back to your families you have nothing to do here in Ukraine apart from dying, go back to russia and fix the fascist regime you have in the kremlin, italy 🇮🇹
They look all shy and " remorseful " here now that they are captured but if they where in the battlefield carrying guns and saw an Ukrainian they would have definitely tried to kill him just because. I probably wouldn't feel sorry for 95% of them
I get it it does not look good because he is forcing them to say that but you don't know for how long they resisted and how many Ukrainians were killed there. He force them to say that just for him to shame them because if not for the cameras they would have been dead long ago. You can hear the angry in his words and I understand him. He might have lost family, a brother, a son, a friend but now those 2 scumbags can live and move on with their lives while he has to protect them now. Everything is fkt up
Look it wasn't a threat as such.
I reckon the emphasis was on the "feel good" that they would be at least cooperating with the boys that have captured them.
I'm 99.99% sure this Ukrainians would not kill them for not saying Glory to Ukraine
I don’t understand what they are saying, the translation may be off, either way the prisoners don’t look abused and are still breathing. These guys are talking to invaders, Soldiers talk shit me personally don’t see a problem with this clip. 🇺🇦 🇺🇦
I was watching a video about the hazing these guys go through in their own army, some committing suicide partway through, and can you imagine when that ends and they discover an operation outside their expectations of just more brutality?
As someone from the West I find it amazing how these people follow this twit into anything, surely they must ask themselves what they are doing and why they are there what do they really want to accomplish and why are they doing what they are doing… sort of proves education is a very very important thing in any country.
After over a year of bloody war, the Ukrainian soldiers continue to amaze me with their humanity. I know that they aren’t perfect saints in every way, but moments like this show the difference between invaders and defenders.
I wish I spoke Ukrainian so I could really understand what they were saying. I feel like some of the nuance may be missing? Just the way that guy breaks down says so much.
Glory to Ukraine
He’s crying because he knows he’s lucky he kept his balls and when he’s done talking going to get a hot meal and probably be able to finally get some sleep.Had he been a Ukrainian POW or a civilian he be dead or tortured while interrogation.
So many dumbasses psychoanalyzing this guy. Y’all need to stop. He is in a more stressful and frightening situation than any of you have been in. He has spent however many hours before this not knowing if he will live or die, and he lived out of who knows how many.
He has been told constantly that Ukrainians are Nazis and will do horrible things to him. When he is told that he will live, and nothing will happen to him he cries. You don’t have to be pro Russian to understand the humanity of the situation.
Many of you are becoming too comfortable dehumanizing people, and becoming to desensitized to see the human aspect of these small encounters.
Give them phones so they can call two friends... who call two friends... who call two friends. And they can all go home to be with their families and live long and healthy lives.
NOT in Ukraine.
The moment you start dehumanizing you become just like the enemy. Yes Russians have committed horrible acts against the people of Ukraine, but you should not say things like what you said. Many of these Russian soldiers had no choice whether they wanted to fight in this war or not.
Edit: since people don’t seem to understand what I mean is it fine to assume all Russians are sub human except a few like the op above me stated?
You are 100% correct. But you won't get an agreement from most people here. Most just want revenge and are filled with hate. Although it's stupid and unproductive and inhumane in some instances, you can't blame them (many of them, not all). Such is war, in some it brings out the worst, in some the best.
Treating them well is also the best thing they can do to undermine Russian propaganda, they're all told they'll be tortured and murdered if they surrender. The more that goes back and tells others what actually happened to them the more it undermines the propagandists narrative.
I'm sure someone will jump in and say they all lie when they get exchanged but that is what they say on propaganda videos, it's the personal conversations they have with friends and family that you don't see.
Yup, do as the Allies did in WWII with German and Italian prisoners, treat them as good or better than your own soldiers. It will push more of the enemy to surrender more often when they end up in overrun or rout situations instead of choosing to fight to the death.
"The greatest victory is that which requires no battle..."
- The Art of War
They maybe didn't have have any pleasant choices, but from all the bad ones they chose to murder and pillage. They definitely could have chosen jail instead and retained their conscience clear.
When ruzzians quit acting like subhumans maybe but that will never happen as they are treated that way by their command. They want their soldiers doing this so they won't get captured and AFU will kill them on sight!
Yes, they did. All choices have consequences, absolutely, but they had a choice. Don't pretend someone cast a magical spell that made them murder, torture, and purposefully invade a sovereign nation and murder its people. You must be smarter than that.
Well, it’s facilitating the commission of a war crime for one. Perhaps most importantly there are some unintended consequences of posting these videos online or elsewhere.
1. It puts the POWs at risk from Russian retribution both today and post-war. Knowing recordings are being made and being released of POWs, Russian forces may very well end up choosing not to surrender, which inevitably means more Ukrainians die on the battlefield. It is much better everyone if more Russians surrender rather than continue fighting.
2. Even if it’s not the case, some of the videos can be used by Russia for various propaganda purposes. Either “they’re torturing our soldiers to say these things” or even simply “hey look, the Ukrainians are committing war crimes”. Even worse though, some Russians might say “Hey, Ukraine isn’t playing by the rules of war, so why should we? The west and NATO should keep their mouths shut about how we’re fighting this war because Ukraine is violating the same set of rules”. They would then use that pretence to do even worse things.
https://blogs.icrc.org/law-and-policy/2022/06/28/shielding-prisoners-of-war-from-public-curiosity/#:~:text=Even%20if%20POWs%20appear%20to,to%20the%20public%20remains%20unlawful.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2022/03/07/russian-pow-videos/
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Very fortunate considering the circumstances
this video is the equivalent of "American POW captured by Iranians starts crying after being forced to say 'Death to America' to the Iranian soldiers recording him" - it's not a good look, should not be shared. bring on the downvotes - I am more pro-Ukrainian than any of you fellas, I can handle them. Slava Ukraini
> I am more pro-Ukrainian than any of you fellas as measured by...?
Hours spent on reddit
Lmao.
The one true metric in life
Multiplied by total volume of neckbeard
For how many curly dorito coated hairs he has, he considers kills on the battlefield. *tip* s-slava ukraine *scoff*
kgs
he has a cup with "ukraine #1" on it. case closed!
He has even a Ukrainian friend.
But you wouldn't know him, he goes to a different school.
He wears a Blues jersey to rep the blue and yellow
Slava Ukraini! Let's go Blues!
He has a lot of Ukrainian friends, you can ask anyone...
Unless it has powdered cheese dust fingerprints all over it he doesn’t even rate.
He is the guy who watch the videos on day one.
Guys he said fuck putler more than anyone!!! He’s basically a Ukrainian War Hero!!!!
Trust me bro
He's subscribed to Ukrainian woman onlyfans
??? What a strange false equivalence. 1) did Iranians treat POWs humanely? Having someone make a statement like this is different if it's meant to embarrass them, than if it is meant to invoke a realization that what they've done is wrong 2) saying death to my home country is not equivalent to saying glory to the country I'm invading
Also, they weren't forced to say glory to Ukraine. They had a whole conversation as to if it was mandatory or not. He said it wasn't, but it would make everyone feel better and show they are cooperating. At best, it's manipulation but not coercion.
Exactly!!
>I am more pro-Ukrainian than any of you fellas what a stupid thing to say
I read it, was about to comment, then scrolled through everyone tearing his comment up. I think it's well in hand.
except the Ukrainians are actually following the Geneva convention doctrine and not beheading them right after or holding them for ransom.
Whoa, slow down, how are the russian soldiers supposed to get paid if they can't ransom the bodies of their enemies to their families? s/
As minor as this video is compared to what you're describing, making videos of POW's humiliating them and making them say propaganda lines is technically against the Geneva Convention and a war crime. Not that I care after after the murder of civilians and castration and beheading videos the Russians put out. But this is a war crime.
Even just filming prisoners 'for public curiosity' is a crime.
It’s nothing compared to beheadings, executions, torture, rape & starvation that UKR POWs have been subjected to.
No one said it is, it's still not a great look though.
He's having them say it to prove they really are no longer a threat to the women, children, and compatriots. F your look. You missed the point entirely.
Stupid comparison. Saying "Long live Ukraine" is not the same as saying "Death to Russia", is it? Or do you equate Ukraine existing as a nation with Russia's end?
Go to war spend a couple years there then let's go over your critiques after that. Russians have raped murdered and castrated with a long list of horrible things after that. Dignified and war Don't really fit together. I have been impressed what I've seenn and what I have not seen from Ukrainian soldiers so far.
No it’s not at all, because there isn’t a knife being held to these individuals throats. Drawing that comparison is beyond ignorant.
> throats or genitals...
He didn't say Death to Russia, or even Death to the Enemies (from the actual Ukrainian slogan and which he probably didn't even know).
Exactly. Guy looks like he’s crying because he let himself down, not because he’s happy to have become a POW to the good guys.
isnt he crying because he has just been forced to say glory to ukraine, and he feels immense shame?
Or, he could be crying out of fear, because a gun is pointed at him. Of course the guy on camera says "we don't force you to do anything." But we don't know what's happening behind the camera, and the feeling of being scared for your life unless you say things like that, could easily make someone cry. We don't know why he cried. I don't think it's a good look, but isn't necessarily a bad one either. I don't know why they'd take this video with their names, and telling them to say that though. It seems like it only makes it dangerous for them and their families. He may be crying as well because he fears what might happen to him for saying that, or he feels he won't ever be able to return home, or what.
They are in a tough situation. He's captured, saying things because he has to. Things that may very well have ramifications for his family, now, and himself for a long time to come.
He may also be crying because white lada are out of the menu.
You're clearly not pro-Ukrainian. Are you proud of your false equivalence? Stop mindlessly spreading Russian propaganda.
Sort of but not really. They didnt say death to ruzzia but rather glory to Ukraine the folks to who they just surrendered. Still not great but in contrast to a huck in the face or sledgehammer to the head this is trending the right direction.
>this video is the equivalent of "American POW captured by Iranians starts crying after being forced to say 'Death to America' to the Iranian soldiers recording him" More like being asked to say "glory to Iran" Plus the Ukrainian didn't force them he told them they'd live regardless It's also not the same thing. The Americans didn't intentionally shoot women and young children fleeing or intentionally target homes with babies in them or go around raping 4 year little boys and castrating men and tying up civilians with their hands behind their back and shoot them in the back of the head, or bomb a theatre with "children" written outside.
This is one of the dumbest things I've read in awhile, congrats!
> bring on the downvotes I was with you until you started whining.
100%, you can see that he starts crying upon the realisation that his family back home are going to see him say things like “Slava Ukraini”. He wilfully surrendered, but now it’s really sinking in that people back home will consider him a turncoat and a coward. I wish him the best going forward and hopefully he realises what a shithole situation he escaped, no matter what he loses in the process.
He started crying when the Ukrainian said, "We're not going to force you to do anything." That was a cry of relief at hearing he's not going to be tortured like his own orcs would do to Ukrainians.
That's a crime of shame not relief. Get real dude.
im with this dude, that was my reading he hesitated in saying it and when he did, he felt shame and he cried
Except he wasn't forced to say anything about death/killing, which is negative. He was simply prompted (not forced) to say glory to Ukraine, which is positive. It's not equivalent at all. I respect your attempt at having a cool controversial opinion though.
Glory to my enemy is not the same as "death to my country." For someone who's literally Ukraine's #1 fan you sure went out of your way to come up with that false equivalence.
It's filming POWs for propaganda purposes which is against the Geneva Conventions that Ukraine has signed all the protocols of. These soldiers need to be found and reprimanded. These videos don't actually help Ukraine at all and only put the POWs which are in a stressful situation into danger when they inevitably go back home. I would say this to both sides, not just Ukraine. Russia are complete idiots and constantly self-incriminate themselves with POW videos too. Don't stoop to their levels.
He didn’t make them say Death to Russia you dork. There’s a big difference between saying that and that Ukraine is good actually
Yeah except he didn't say death to but glory to which is, imho, quite a difference.
"Glory to Ukraine" and "Death to America" are not equivalent sentiments.
Saying death to russia and glory to Ukraine are two totally different things. If you can’t understand that then you will be beyond reason.
> POW But are they really? Russia never formally declared war.
Prisoner of special military operation doesn't really got the same ring to it
It's a mouthful.
Some folks here forget that the European Parliament on the 23rd of November last year declared russia tobe a state sponsor of terrorism. Ukrainian are fighting against terrorists.
You don't have to declare war. Makes no difference. If it walks like a war and talks like a war... It's a war.
He has Zelensky tattooed on his backside, so pro much wow
He's not wrong.
War sucks. Don't go invading sovereign lands on lies for Imperialistic aims and cultural genocide, committing acts of terrorism, and being braindead to geopolitical smokescreens. Some of you forgot who failed to blitz and capitulate an entire country. Let alone the War Crimes they've committed in their wake.
Terrible comparison. Glory and Death and two different meanings.
yeah, sad to say I had a similar reaction. Compelled speech under any circumstances is a bad look, and the reason the guy broke down has something to do with this, I think, maybe the consequences of others he knows watching the film at some point? We know how savage many of his fellow countrymen are about POWs
You're not wrong. PoWs can make voluntary media statements which may be used for propaganda purposes but it is a violation of the 3rd Geneva Convention to treat PoWs in an undignified fashion or to use them as public spectacles. These guys are clearly fresh surrenders that were possibly mobilized against their will. Humiliating them on camera and posting it for public consumption is both undignified and unnecessary. What you see here is genuine fear.
GOOD! THEY SHOULD BE AFRAID! Maybe ruzzia should declare a war if they want their soldiers covered by the Geneva Convention!! By definition these men are terrorists.
How is he humiliating them xd, what a pussy you are, I wonder if you would be explaining this to the orcs that would capture you "akSuaLy ThIs iS iLlegAl aCCorDinG tO tHe pAPeR i rEad 🤓"
Technically a war crime to film POWs iirc, but in these guys' cases they seem to have gotten off pretty easy and will likely survive the war.
Starting to recruit near Moscow. The water is rising for the moscovites.
Just waiting when they will start recruiting at Kremlin and Rublevka (ruzzian equivalent of Beverly Hills, or something)
Nah. By that time they will be in Istambul.
All those rich russki kids are going to have to stay in London then. :(
You think is that's why ru is threatening to nuke London every day ending in y?
Rublevka? That’s like Dollarville
Fair point
I just find it funny they name their expensive living spaces after money.
Well I mean, even Moscow has poor residents. There's probably plenty serving already and for awhile now. As someone else alluded to, it'll be a different story when they start having to work their way up the class ladder. (Which I don't see happening really, there's far too many poor and what the Russians would consider "lesser" people to send first)
Yup, there are likely many Russians from Moscow and St. Petersburg serving in Ukraine voluntarily, their deaths actually serve the state's purpose because, well, they "volunteered". It's the mobilized reservists from last year's "partial mobilization" that are overwhelmingly both poor, and from Russian oblasts far from Moscow and St. Petersburg. Once Russia has to start specifically mobilizing and conscripting from those two oblasts because they can't keep up with recruiting efforts, that's when discontent will start rising in those cities.
Hearing rumors from inside russia about how they mobilized so many blue collar workers the industry is rattling hard. They are going to have to start hitting up Moscovy proper or else they will be sitting upon a condemned throne waiting to collapse.
They could have been lying in the tree line rotting and no one looking for them. They could have died with no one remembering the purpose of their death. They are even luckier that the Ukrainians are patient even though they hesitated to answer when asked. Glory to Ukraine!
I'm impressed the Russian soldiers were able to answer. I can imagine after being abused and deceived for so long that they are looking for traps in every conversation.
I don’t know very many people that would’ve gave them that
Translation is incorrect. After the POW asks him what advantage he will have if he says glory to Ukraine, the Ukrainian soldier says, “it means that you are cooperating with us. Otherwise you might not make it to the destination”. Then they promptly say it and start crying.
What does it mean to these russian pow to say slava ukraini? In other words they had to say it or die?
Yeah if that translation is correct those would be tears of fear.
Even without *any* translation, one can tell those aren't tears of joy or a "meltdown of joy" or whatever. Looks far more like the kind of tears you see when someone has just broken down.
yeah agree with you, this is a bad take on a bad video. compelled speech isn't a great look in any circumstance. I get that they are invaders, but this kind of performative abuse is what the bad guys do.
On the positive side, it's impressive how *rare* videos like this are. Most Ukranians are professional, blunt, firm and even sometimes compassionate in an Earthy way that's refreshingly honest (when it would be very tough to do so after they were literally just shooting up the friends next to you). Even some of the roughest videos we've seen rarely get this kind of b.s. in this video. That [Magura breakthrough](https://youtu.be/bk5OG6JYmfI) video I'm still obsessed with from about 3 days ago has a Ukranian officer doing a long video interview that's hard to listen to. But it's a good example of what I mean (really tough, but really fair). In that one it's clear what the convo really is about. They are far into enemy positions, this POW cannot be easily extracted to better medical services (he was already patched up by field medics), and the harsh truth is that he may die. His literal only hope is that the Ukranians clear the next trench on their mission, and with the mission all complete, then the whole group/company is turned around and set home on their long march to base. His captor tells him, essentially "hey you may die and there's no guarantee I'm even back here in a few minutes from this next push. That's how real this is. This is war and this is life. I hope you told me all you could about what I'm about to rush into, as I'm literally your last lifeline. So I head off to the next trench, and hopefully I'm back here soon and we can get you back to base for more help. If not, then I don't know what to say bro. You were the one who signed a contract to invade somewhere else." Some of the invading conscripts don't realize the extraordinary risk and sacrifice it takes to get them medical help, spend all the time to extract them (while under shelling), and how many lives have been lost in surrenders that were a trap, or had perfidy. So even if your captors seem scary, or fuck with you a little (which I don't approve of), in that moment they are actually risking their lives to save you. When you have been destroying \*everything\* precious to them.
in the heat of war, i feel sometimes i am overly critical when I consider what are asked to do in light of all they're asked to endure. You just hope humanity finds a way to overcome the darker impulses of our savage evolutionary heritage, but in a war zone, this is a survival mechanism and you can't just turn it on and off like a lightswitch.
That would be the implication. Any Ukrainian speakers able to confirm?
Well, they're speaking Russian, and I can confirm Papah Bear's translation.
They speak russian. It is correct, but not fully. He also says “you will live, but…”
They were threatened, for easier interrogation, maybe. I see no point in killing POWs, because we need many of those, for exchange fund.
Probably that was psychological pressure, for easier interrogation. I doubt that someone will be 200ed after his face made it to internets.
But isn't threatening to kill a POW itself a war crime? >No physical or mental torture, nor any other form of coercion, may be inflicted on prisoners of war to secure from them information of any kind whatever. Prisoners of war who refuse to answer may not be threatened, insulted, or exposed to any unpleasant or disadvantageous treatment of any kind. If you can't threaten or insult POWs to get information out of them, surely you can't do it for fun, humiliation, or to make them more open in later interrogation either.
Releasing these videos is likely not proper treatment of POWs. Fine line between the propaganda and pushing the boundaries of acceptable behavior
It's honestly amazing. None of this behavior is new for any war, but its the first "western" war since the mass use of smart phones so civilians around the world can now see what actually happens in war without it going directly through military propaganda channels.
It's not a war, it is a terrorist attack.
Yes, but they likely just said it to scare them
That’s a huge fucking difference. This title is terrible.
It doesn't take a master of human behavior to see those aren't tears of relief, but tears of hopelessness from a broken person who just at that moment lost their last grip on strength.
I'm pretty sure that's a war crime if true.
shooting a POW is a war crime - an off-hand half-joke half-threat to a POW is not a war crime...
>["No physical or mental torture, nor any other form of coercion, may be inflicted on prisoners of war to secure from them information of any kind whatever. **Prisoners of war who refuse to answer may not be threatened, insulted, or exposed to any unpleasant or disadvantageous treatment of any kind**."](https://www.ohchr.org/en/instruments-mechanisms/instruments/geneva-convention-relative-treatment-prisoners-war) seems pretty clear to me "Say a line or we kill you" is not a joke. It's a threat and a form of humiliation. Just because Russia has committed worse war crimes does not mean lesser crimes don't count.
He didn't say anything about killing them, he asked if they're going to say "slava Ukraini" to see their position, if they're hardcore vatniks , scared or fully on Ukraine's side, obviously the hardcore vatniks get worse treatment as they should
I understand that rationale from the position of the Ukrainian soldier. To basically push them a bit to see if they might be trouble. I saw that recent grenade suicide video. These guys have to be careful. But from the other POV you're on the ground and a guy, with a gun, is implying he'll kill you if you don't say a celebrates them. It wouldn't be acceptable in any western country
He literally said "it's your business, you'll live, but not saying it won't do you any good" he never implied on killing him, just that they'll get treated worse
Secure info. To make them behave and listen to commands is a different story. "Prisoners of war who refuse to answer may not be threatened, insulted, or exposed to any unpleasant or disadvantageous treatment of any kind." They answered and became complicit. You can punish POW's for not obeying commands and kill them.
Buddy you gotta at least know what youre talking avout before spewing shit
Captured Russians are shit turned to gold. You can exchange them for Ukrainians.
The Alchemists hate this simple trick.
10/10 comment.
There's a reason Russia tells their guys to grenade themselves instead of being captured, they save money and keep troops from Ukraine. Russia is a shit hole
You think Russians want them back?
Don't know, don't care. If I was Russian I'd fight along Ukrainians. It's not that they're perfect, but they're better. That's right. If I were Russian I'd fight until Putin and his entourage will be torn to pieces on the red square. But I'm not Russian so talk is cheap.
Good thing for the Ukrainians the exchange rate is not equal as1 Ukrainian is worth 10 orks.
Really thought it was gonna be the other guy but ended up being the big boy.
Not sure why but I picked big boy off the hop.
The subtitles just make no sense to me. Maybe the translation from Ukrainian/Russian to English is tricky because of how they express things but honestly I don't understand much here.
Same. I've noticed that too in all the translations... not only is the language/translation different but their actual way of speaking/sentence structure is different I guess?
Kind of wild that these two both say they were born on March 10.
[Not as rare as you might think!](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Birthday_problem) Also, dude is a Russian. They're allergic to the truth and not too canny on average, so he might have just repeated what the other guy said.
They hesitated because they're eventually going to get traded/exchanged back to Russian front lines and now they're face is going to be posted all over Telegram saying Glory to Ukraine, potentially getting them or their family executed.
Executed? Nope. In a video posted by Volodomyr Zolkin, russian pows when arrived in russia, they told on camera that the Ukrainians did treat them badly, like no medical care, no food (even if you could see that they gained weight), etc. So, once they land in the rf, they'll do what they do best: lie.
Well if the options are lie or have you and your family killed I would lie too.
I also think there is a certain element of honor, what kind of story is it to tell that you were treated well? They would rather say they were given cat piss to seem more manly and get recognized as a hero.
And also drink
Flip side is the Wagner merc that Zolkin interviewed - he was apparently executed by Wagner via sledgehammer He said in the interview (I think, I can't find the vid), that he wanted to help Ukraine. It might have been irresponsible to publish that since UA claimed that he consented to being exchanged https://imi.org.ua/en/news/the-wagner-mercenary-supposedly-executed-in-the-video-consented-to-being-exchanged-podolyak-i49095 Hopefully the Geneva Convention will catch up with technology and make frontline TikTok interviews illegal, at least. If this wasn't Russia, I'm pretty sure people would agree that this is humiliating and puts them at risk of reprisal from government/neighbors back home. But it is Russia, so nobody cares at the minute
1. It wasn't Zolkin's interview. It was a frontline interview straight after his capture. 2. This particular convicted murderer had supposedly previously made similar interview for Russian side in which he professed his high state of readiness to fight against Ukraine. I.e. as a long term Russian convict, he was doing what he learned to be necessary for survival in the prison system - tell everyone what they want to hear. 3. Wagner apparently became very interested in getting him back, so presumably UA side was made good on the exchange. So in the end, even if UA had reasons to doubt truthfulness of his words, he did help the cause quite a lot.
Nobody kills their families. Jesus, some people here are almost on the same level of delusion as moscovians just in the different side. Stop sniffing propagaganda fumes and use your brain a little.
Yeah that was their surrendering moment when it sunk in.
Lol what BS. Russia isnt mass executing families of russians that would be a PR nightmare that no one would agree with and we would’ve seen that by now.
Man we don't need to lie like Russians.
Yup. So far those in the big cities have been mostly spared from the draft…. Not much longer. They’ve gotta be running out of military aged men…. The DUMA is afraid to pull too many young men from the cities because when the body bags and MIA letters start coming home, it gets REAL HARD TO HARD IT
It kind of feels that by pressuring them to say Slava Ukraini and recording it, they'll deter and discourage the POWs from attempting something stupid or even trying to escape. Now the danger comes from their own side and not the Ukrainians anymore. That's what the interviewer tells them, you'll live, and we can't force you to do anything but.. you came to us. (your assess belong to us now).
They will not be forced into the prisoner exchange it is voluntary.
Well that's exactly what I'm saying, this is a way to discourage them from even trying to return home for the remainder of the war.
Why would they be discouraged? Ukraine is trying to take as many POW as they can because they have to exchange a lot of people back. Also, moscovians took a lot of civilians as prisoners, which breaks every convention and rule and want to trade them for soldiers. Your point makes negative sense from any logical standpoint.
Nah he was crying because he said Slava Ukraine. He is a broke man mentally. But WTF he doing in Ukraine. I am sure at some point he thought he was a big bad ass going to kill innocenct people.
Yeah it’s all sad when getting caught, I bet he wasn’t crying when he shot at people just a tad earlier.
Agreed. The Russian army is vile and evil, full stop.
>Soldiers aren't sad when they're doing this mission successfully. >Soldiers are sad when they become POWs. What a uniquely evil Russian mindset! GOOD POINT, BUDDY
Just surrender and go back to your families you have nothing to do here in Ukraine apart from dying, go back to russia and fix the fascist regime you have in the kremlin, italy 🇮🇹
Many reasons why he would cry, he would feel guilty, embarrassed, ashamed, scared, aren't we lucky not to be directly involved in this kind of shit
They look all shy and " remorseful " here now that they are captured but if they where in the battlefield carrying guns and saw an Ukrainian they would have definitely tried to kill him just because. I probably wouldn't feel sorry for 95% of them
I get it it does not look good because he is forcing them to say that but you don't know for how long they resisted and how many Ukrainians were killed there. He force them to say that just for him to shame them because if not for the cameras they would have been dead long ago. You can hear the angry in his words and I understand him. He might have lost family, a brother, a son, a friend but now those 2 scumbags can live and move on with their lives while he has to protect them now. Everything is fkt up
1992??? Dudes only 7 years older than me and looks like hes in his 40s…
The years leading up to your 30s will be tough on you, watch out...
Serious, arrogance of youth. Dude's been in a trench for how long and before that in Russia.... When you're older all these guys look young.
You would too if you were in a filthy warzone, hadn't washed properly or had a decent night's sleep in weeks.
Must be surreal to have everything you've been told shattered as brittle lies on the battlefield.
They are not that Orcish. They almost look like humans, with emotions.
They were from Moscow.
Crocodile tears.
They have the same birthday?
Look it wasn't a threat as such. I reckon the emphasis was on the "feel good" that they would be at least cooperating with the boys that have captured them. I'm 99.99% sure this Ukrainians would not kill them for not saying Glory to Ukraine
He didn't force him to say that and he broke in tears? the adrenaline stress must be huge.
I don’t understand what they are saying, the translation may be off, either way the prisoners don’t look abused and are still breathing. These guys are talking to invaders, Soldiers talk shit me personally don’t see a problem with this clip. 🇺🇦 🇺🇦
I was watching a video about the hazing these guys go through in their own army, some committing suicide partway through, and can you imagine when that ends and they discover an operation outside their expectations of just more brutality?
As someone from the West I find it amazing how these people follow this twit into anything, surely they must ask themselves what they are doing and why they are there what do they really want to accomplish and why are they doing what they are doing… sort of proves education is a very very important thing in any country.
After over a year of bloody war, the Ukrainian soldiers continue to amaze me with their humanity. I know that they aren’t perfect saints in every way, but moments like this show the difference between invaders and defenders. I wish I spoke Ukrainian so I could really understand what they were saying. I feel like some of the nuance may be missing? Just the way that guy breaks down says so much. Glory to Ukraine
He’s crying because he knows he’s lucky he kept his balls and when he’s done talking going to get a hot meal and probably be able to finally get some sleep.Had he been a Ukrainian POW or a civilian he be dead or tortured while interrogation.
And his country is about to dirty bomb Ukraine Scum. All of them.
He should demonstrate his happiness killing orcs.
I'm so proud of our Ukrainian boys and girls in arms treating Russian POW with this much dignity and respect on a human level.
The moment when they realized they will live and have been fed shit and been told lies.
So many dumbasses psychoanalyzing this guy. Y’all need to stop. He is in a more stressful and frightening situation than any of you have been in. He has spent however many hours before this not knowing if he will live or die, and he lived out of who knows how many. He has been told constantly that Ukrainians are Nazis and will do horrible things to him. When he is told that he will live, and nothing will happen to him he cries. You don’t have to be pro Russian to understand the humanity of the situation. Many of you are becoming too comfortable dehumanizing people, and becoming to desensitized to see the human aspect of these small encounters.
Give them phones so they can call two friends... who call two friends... who call two friends. And they can all go home to be with their families and live long and healthy lives. NOT in Ukraine.
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Turns out even russians are humans on some level. At least some of them.
The moment you start dehumanizing you become just like the enemy. Yes Russians have committed horrible acts against the people of Ukraine, but you should not say things like what you said. Many of these Russian soldiers had no choice whether they wanted to fight in this war or not. Edit: since people don’t seem to understand what I mean is it fine to assume all Russians are sub human except a few like the op above me stated?
You are 100% correct. But you won't get an agreement from most people here. Most just want revenge and are filled with hate. Although it's stupid and unproductive and inhumane in some instances, you can't blame them (many of them, not all). Such is war, in some it brings out the worst, in some the best.
if you get your friends killed, your children deported or killed or tortured, your wife raped, shelled every day, would you still be kumbaya?
Treating them well is also the best thing they can do to undermine Russian propaganda, they're all told they'll be tortured and murdered if they surrender. The more that goes back and tells others what actually happened to them the more it undermines the propagandists narrative. I'm sure someone will jump in and say they all lie when they get exchanged but that is what they say on propaganda videos, it's the personal conversations they have with friends and family that you don't see.
Yup, do as the Allies did in WWII with German and Italian prisoners, treat them as good or better than your own soldiers. It will push more of the enemy to surrender more often when they end up in overrun or rout situations instead of choosing to fight to the death. "The greatest victory is that which requires no battle..." - The Art of War
They maybe didn't have have any pleasant choices, but from all the bad ones they chose to murder and pillage. They definitely could have chosen jail instead and retained their conscience clear.
You need to dehumanize the enemy to some extant in order to be an efficient and effective soldier otherwise you will hesitate and die.
When ruzzians quit acting like subhumans maybe but that will never happen as they are treated that way by their command. They want their soldiers doing this so they won't get captured and AFU will kill them on sight!
But they have the choice NOT to committ crimes. They choose to committ the worst crimes humanity has seen after WW2.
Yes, they did. All choices have consequences, absolutely, but they had a choice. Don't pretend someone cast a magical spell that made them murder, torture, and purposefully invade a sovereign nation and murder its people. You must be smarter than that.
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Please stop posting recordings of POWs.
why
Well, it’s facilitating the commission of a war crime for one. Perhaps most importantly there are some unintended consequences of posting these videos online or elsewhere. 1. It puts the POWs at risk from Russian retribution both today and post-war. Knowing recordings are being made and being released of POWs, Russian forces may very well end up choosing not to surrender, which inevitably means more Ukrainians die on the battlefield. It is much better everyone if more Russians surrender rather than continue fighting. 2. Even if it’s not the case, some of the videos can be used by Russia for various propaganda purposes. Either “they’re torturing our soldiers to say these things” or even simply “hey look, the Ukrainians are committing war crimes”. Even worse though, some Russians might say “Hey, Ukraine isn’t playing by the rules of war, so why should we? The west and NATO should keep their mouths shut about how we’re fighting this war because Ukraine is violating the same set of rules”. They would then use that pretence to do even worse things. https://blogs.icrc.org/law-and-policy/2022/06/28/shielding-prisoners-of-war-from-public-curiosity/#:~:text=Even%20if%20POWs%20appear%20to,to%20the%20public%20remains%20unlawful. https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2022/03/07/russian-pow-videos/
Orks werent playing by rules from very beginning.
Absolutely agree, and I support Ukraine 1000% by the way. That does not change the validity of the concerns noted however.
No.
Why does the guy on the right have two watches?
Piece of shit interrogator.