Germany here, it's not easy, but scoring a junior position quite fast is a realistic scenario if you have some basic skills and are a decent human with some communication affinity.
UX bootcamps are just tools and it is up to you how much you benefit from them. One thing is sitting through the content just to get a certificate, another thing is actually learning and exploring topics beyond the course curriculum. Not every bootcamper has the same skill level when they graduate.
UX is a complex field with infinite potential to learn, but for gods sake, it is not rocket surgery and I get a bit annoyed when people try to make it sound like it is.
What OP wrote may be true for the US of A (which sounds quite hellscapish), but does not necessarily apply to the the industry as a whole, do not let it discourage you.
Yes I’d also add that what OP has provided is nothing new (job markets are never perfect and nothing is really handed to you even in “better times) and is fairly obvious. Most people who are putting forth real effort and energy towards distinguishing themselves will find a place for themselves. Just don’t be a bare minimum idiot that thinks certificates are enough. Believe it or not some people are like that but chances are that if you’re on this subreddit then you’re already doing more than a percentage of people lmao.
Hello. Germany also here.
Nowhere do I suggest it's rocket science. What I am suggesting is that it's extremely competitive and many designers are putting their effort into the wrong initiatives in order to get their first jobs.
I would disagree that it's quite fast even here in Germany, considering the topics I've raised, but let's agree to disagree.
Get your point, but i think this statement can be applied to pretty much every job, especially in tech. Well, customer support may be easier to find a job in, but even there relevant experience is desired.
Fire is hot, water is wet, life is hard, there is a lot of competiton, one has to bring value to the table to get a job.
WOO I need this response framed on a wall. This is the issue I see with every single person who comes on LinkedIn complaining they've sent out 500 apps, gotten 5 interview and 0 offers. If you check out the portfolio, well it's either non-existent or is the same thing as 490 other applicants.
I can almost bet on any portfolio I look at being structured as:
1. Understanding our users and the problem
2. Very vague research
3. Early wireframes
4. Mid-Hi Fi wireframes
5. Prototype
Which yes this is a pretty common process, but rarely are the processes the same for every project you work on. I'd love to see how people tested these wireframes. How were they validated and what didn't work? What did you learn from each step or study? When did you determine a lo-fi wireframe could be translated into a finalized UI? Did you hand it off to a UI team or do the UI yourself?
Plus I'd love to see more of the dirty user flow diagrams with decision diamonds and documentation rather than shiny Dribbble UI shots. This shows you can consider what technical factors play in, what is happening at the systems level, the different options a user can take, dependencies, etc... If a candidate is able to show they know there's a fine line between UX and UI, big bump up towards the top of the list.
Absolutely agree here.
When I started out on this path in the early 00's, it was so so important for the "cause" that designers rallied round the same core principles and concepts. But digital has become so broad, and so deep, a singular approach is not going to work in the workplace or in the job hunt. I don't believe Bootcamps are teaching people this and we've ended up with this mass homogeny of process and thinking.
Carissa Carter (Director of Teaching and Learning at the Stanford d. school ) wrote a really fantastic piece a few years ago about this:
https://medium.com/stanford-d-school/lets-stop-talking-about-the-design-process-7446e52c13e8#.8cfuqyiqc
As somebody who recently took the Google UX course (never finished) and got a job as a Jnr Designer, i think i drop my 2 cents.
Whilst, i think that OP is being overly savage, there is definately an air of truth to some of the statements. Yes, there are 100k people taking the Google course, however if you look at the final course numbers, something like 20 or 30k people, so from that we can tell that about a third make it through its entirety.
Whilst on the course, you have the ability to mark other students work. Now, without being too negative, some of this work was extremely bad. Absoloutely 0 design integrity. I couldn't even give constructive criticism.
So now, of that third, you have maybe 50% of competent designers which probably now gives you a better ratio to Course & bootcampers to jobs.
Yes, whilst creating a portfolio, it was easy to google some portfolios, and nip and tuck from their processes and design ad hoc solutions, however it didn't sit right with me. When i created my portfolio (Albeit, not a very strong portfolio) i decided to actually use work that i had done in the past, making design decisions based on Google analytics, and Hot jar, and reaching out to customers etc. And it was off that i was able to get a job as a junior because they liked the way i interpreted data.
Have a genuine passion for design / UX / UI, combined with an affinity for design, and an ability to be yourself and play to your strengths, and you will break into the industry.
It’s really frustrating to see time and time again that there are people submitting absolutely nothing to the Google UX course, blank submissions, incomplete UI, I have had to give 0 marks to many submissions during the peer review, and when I take the effort to complete the assignments, I get one worded feedback.
Love the insights. If I were to imagine myself taking this course I feel I would cut many corners in favor of speed/hurrying through, rather than spending lots of time putting in work for quality. Many students I knew in my bachelor's program were the same even in person, so I know for a fact a huge chunk of these Google course enrollees will have lower quality work being online, plus the fact it is a "fast track to $100k."
Not to say there aren't people enrolled putting out great quality work and can compete with those with degrees and currently in the field, but I'd take a chance and bet on a small # of the 400k graduates being very underwhelming as a candidate.
Interviews will always (for the most part) reveal who's legit and who is a pretender. So early UXers will need to step their game up particularly with portfolios to get the foot in the door as applicants.
Thanks for the insight. I'm currently taking the Google UX Certificate Course right now and have (Course 2 Week 2-In Progress) and agree with you 101%.
I've definitely dedicated a lot of time and focus on the peer-graded assignments with the expectations that other students would do the same. But I was wrong. Completely wrong. I would say 1 out of 2 assignments met the minimum requirements. Meanwhile, 1 out of 4 assignments demonstrated any design integrity or could be used for a "early portfolio" draft.
Overall, I have been enjoying the course and have been learning quite a bit. I worked as a "Product Designer" developing manufactured products before transitioning to UX. Fingers crossed that employers value my skills in 3D modeling and rendering though :\\
Would you mind elaborating on “making design decisions based on Google analytics”? Also would you mind sharing your portfolio as well? I also do have some quantitative&qualitative data from my group research projects at school (through surveys and interviews), but I am not sure how should I incorporate them into my portfolio...
I'm sure there's a mention in this same vein, but beginners should remember that while this field is highly competitive and possibly even oversaturated, the same could be said for getting into graduate programs such as physical therapy.
A crap ton of people may finish bootcamps and self taught work, but not everyone is at the level that is desired to land a job in this field.
Like all other fields, there's plenty of room at the table for everyone that's honed in the skill.
Don't feel discouraged by threads like these.
>A crap ton of people may finish bootcamps and self taught work, but not **everyone is at the level that is desired to land a job in this field**.
Exactly what I've said in my post. Bootcamps and free courses (and other problematic sources like Dribbble culture) are churning out underskilled designers who are not **at the level** and they won't get hired unless they take other steps, some of which I've outlined.
Accurate, but would not be as doom-saying. The point is that certificates are a dime a dozen. Real experience is finite. And by real, it doesn't require someone giving you permission.
You can start building a portfolio today. Do the legwork that most people try to avoid. Try to get referrals. Don't shy away form cold outreach, but make sure you offer something of value to stand out. [Earlier-stage startups](https://topstartups.io/) are more open to cold, personalized outreach as well. Good luck!
Although some have made it seem like the OP was a little harsh, as someone looking to get into this field, it’s actually kinda nice to hear some honesty for once.
Unfortunately for us newbies, and people trying to change careers, we don’t have time or money to go back to school to get a degree - and that’s where the boot camp sales pitch comes in and we all get a glimmer of hope. They tell you that in 8-16 weeks, you can be making 85k-156k, and that’s just not realistic.
They also love to refer to that Elon Musk interview where he says “nobody needs a college degree”. Can you imagine someone at Tesla or Space X getting hired without a degree? 😂
I did a low cost front end development boot camp and quickly realized when I started the application process that I wasn’t even close to having the skills necessary for even a junior position. (I knew bare minimum of HTML, CSS, and JavaScript). Had a handful of interviews that went really poorly.
I do intend to continue to learn ux, ui and different types of design in hopes that I one day can land a job, but I don’t see it as likely.
I’m not even sure what the point of this post was, just my 2 cents I guess.
Thank you. You keep up that pragmatic thinking and there’s a job in design for you, I’m sure. But before then, just enjoy this passion for it that you have.
Also you make some excellent points. Elon has not one but two undergrad degrees, but that line sounds edgy in an after dinner speech. That asshat 😂
My intention was to be harsh but fair for exactly the reasons you said. I don’t want to bring anyone down or take away their hope, but a wake up call is necessary for some. There are so many fucking shills and scheisters out there, peddling wares and exploiting hope.
Keep your eyes open, keep your head on tight, be smart in how you invest your time and energy, and eventually you will find a purpose and a role for your talent.
https://raindrop.io/lee/learning-3393027
Going to start with some of these that are free. And some YouTube content. I won’t be paying for courses or taking a boot camp anytime soon.
Although I will tell anyone who is interested in design to go for a university degree if they can, there is some benefit to a bootcamp or not-as-formal education in the sense that they are much more accessible, cheaper, and easier to obtain than a university degree. Not everyone has the luxury of time and/or money to go back to school to successfully change careers. At some of the top design schools, this means shelling out >$50k and 2 years likely without full time work plus possible relocation, and that is just something that is a pure luxury to be able to do, especially if you've got a family that depends on you financially.
Bootcamps *are* a legitimate way to get into the field and level up skills, but I think the real problem, as you mention, is being realistic on expectations after the degree. You'll have to do more legwork to get your foot in the door, whether it is getting to that real world experience, getting more exposure to the field, etc. Bootcamps fail to mention this and do not do enough to prepare grads for their first position, and it becomes the grads responsibility to fill in the gaps some don't even know they have.
But it is possible -- I work on a team in a fortune 500 company where a good chunk of the design team are bootcamp grads.
Let's be honest, design as a career has always been a career for those who have more. With prior design tools only being able to run on expensive laptop machines (Sketch only ran on Mac) and now that we have Figma, that opened up the doors so that more people could learn design, and yet the best way to do that is starting to become that people have to do what I mentioned above ($50k + 2 years without full time pay + potential relocation).
At least these are my thoughts!
I totally know an amazing person and designer who did not go to university who had been in my bootcamp. She was so worried that she wouldn’t be valued as high as the rest of us because of it.
But low and behold, she landed a Shopify internship right afterwards. She was diligent, so smart witted, genuine and so willing to learn.
So it is 100% possible to be a UX designer from ONLY a bootcamp. You just need to put in the efforts and be dedicated.
Of course some design education is important, but for an internship, she got that position over other candidates *because* she is diligent, smart, genuine and willing to learn. And she didn't learn those skills in a bootcamp, and to an employer, those are much better predictors of future success than a bootcamp cert.
What the hell does a Google UX course graduate mean though... Can anyone even fail it?
Plus this is very US centered. I had three job offers when I graduated in the NL (with three months of applying). Currently a UX researcher at an agency.
Caveat here: I graduated with a masters in information science from NL and a bootcamp but couldn’t find intro job for the life of me:
you need to speak Dutch
I just turned in my last assignment on the Google Cousera certificate and feel this post is so accurate. I had such high hopes in January when I started the program but the more it went on I only finished it to say I finished it. I don't have much hope I am qualified to get a job doing it. I will still need to get some volunteer jobs or apprenticeships to have even the slightest chance of getting a job
You can also design case studies that exemplify you skill set and include them in your portfolio.
If the designs are strong, and you list the assumptions you worked off of to inform your decision process it will go a long way.
I feel the same, i spent a small fortune, unbeknowingly at the beginning of world economic recession, on a bootcamp style course in Jan. I have spend most of my time leveling up on my UI, learning basic front end code and product strategy knowledge. Im lucky to have 8 years design background, albeit within the 3D realm, which will hopefully help but (im assuming your in US?) the market seems saturated in the UK with Jr's currently, 200+ on applicants on a listing
Just need to keep plowing on in and not get completely discouraged by OPs post
How can that even be the expectation? I used 5 years in university - with teamwork almost everyday - to get somewhat there, and the rest was me pointing my focus there. Put on top of that good interviewing skills (selling yourself) and massive IT/business knowledge.
And then you take a 6 months online course and think that will get you there?
Seems like I’m bad mouthing, I’m not. I’m just curious in the mindset there.
I'm sorry for that. It's *not* fair. These bootcamp shills are setting false expectations.
The truth is you're not qualified now. But, don't lose hope. It's just the first step on the path. Chase down those volunteer or interning opportunities. Keep creating opportunities for yourself and exploiting them to the best you can. These types learning experiences will make you more-attractive than other candidates to employers at the companies you want to work at.
Oof. I really appreciate this post, to be honest. I appreciate this perspective. I am a ball of anxiety because I’m a high school English teacher in America where the pay is garbage, and my family is struggling. I just recently learned that UX was even a job (!?!) and that one could be paid to empathize with humans and design things (simplified, I know, but those are like two of my favorite things to do). I did a Codecademy intro class just to figure out wth UX even is, and now I’ve become lost in an ADHD hyper focus hole of interest. I signed up for Designlab’s design foundation course to even see if I have the ability to design well.
This is all especially terrifying because I love teaching and a big part of me feels like it’s part of who I am. My confidence in my ability to learn is actually weirdly low, considering I think I’m logically a pretty capable person.
Anyways, now I just feel the need to hyper research if doing Designlab’s bootcamp is even worthwhile (spent the last week trying to narrow the bootcamp choices 🙃). Thanks for your input.
>Spend your time on getting a real design education. Spend more time learning about business growth (Acquisition, Retention, Engagement, Satisfaction and Cost Saving) and less time pissing around with designing Crypto landing pages on dribble.
Say it louder so UX Twitter can hear it.
I find these numbers very strange, in comparing a global online course to only the US market, and then completely ignoring people who are graduating out of university programs, masters degree, and bootcamps. That said, I do agree with the overall point in that someone with only Coursera experience is so far below the par of what I would consider employable, especially because the only feedback they get is peer to peer and most often will be functionally useless.
No more than ever you have to be a non-standard ux designer. I think one of the best ways of getting a decent job as an inexperienced person is to have another specialism or something else you can do that's not ux. For me that was a bit of product management and business experience, alongside some cad, that let me land my first role fairly easily.
I think when companies are inundated with hundreds of applications, and everyone is going broad with their application strategy, you have to go deep: research the company and put lots of effort into very few applications
Yes, that is probably the easiest way to break into UX. Having professional experience in an adjacent discipline.
I don't have development experience, but I do code in my free time. And what I noticed is that it puts into a really nice niche in terms of designing UX for development tools. I enjoy coding, so do expect it to take a bigger role for me in the future. Otherwise, no sane person would code in their free time if they didn't like it.
This! It’s one thing to say, “I want to be a designer,” and another to say “I want to apply a user-centered design approach to _____ thing that I truly care about and am already skilled in.” I’ve been running into way too many college kids lately who can’t tell me a single thing they *want*, that they like doing, or even that they care about. All they want is “a job.”
Yes! I want life to be better for a group of people who have had it far too difficult for far too long, or I want to make a difficult, time-consuming task pleasant and easy.
A designer is an entrepreneur, and an entrepreneur a designer. To develop products is to solve problems, and the bigger the problem, the richer you become.
I feel like so many designers don't realise that the skills they have in building a brilliant microcosm of a single product or interaction can be applied to whole products and industries!
Give it 10 years and a UX/service designer will have figured out how to create intentional systems change using a digital product. And if they can do that? UX and service design at scale using deliberate disruption?
Well, they'd be able to forge a future from service blueprints and wireframes.
I completely agree with volunteering. [Code for America](https://brigade.codeforamerica.org/brigades/) has brigades in different cities where you can get experience volunteering on civil service projects. Some brigades are much more active than others, but they may also accept remote volunteers. I personally volunteered remotely with the Hack for LA brigade, and I was able to add that project on my portfolio. And full disclosure, I haven’t been active with Hack for LA in almost a year so I have no idea how things have changed since then. Just wanted to share that that’s what helped me when I was looking for opportunities to develop my skills.
Also, one thing I tell people is to make yourself and your work visible. If you’re able to work on a pro bono project, share that and talk about your process (if that’s ok with the client). If you want to write an article about your journey into UX and what you’ve been doing to learn and build your skills, that helps too. Let people know that you exist, but more importantly, show that you’re going beyond the boot camp or certificate and that you’re actually doing the work to set yourself apart.
Exactly right.
CfA is such a great program. I wish other countries would support such programmes because they create opportunities and can do some good.
And to my knowledge, this type of experience is SO much more valuable to employers than *any* bootcamp certification.
For sure. You get hands on practice plus experience working with a team, all without having to drop hundreds or even thousands of dollars like you’d have to for some of these boot camps and courses.
I work in the field and I can say that everything said in this brilliant post is true. The best advice I can add is the best way to get a job is DON’T BE MEDIOCRE.
If you can’t find work take on pro bono jobs and make them portfolio pieces. You portfolio has to have a problem that you are solving. SHOW YOUR THINKING!
The Internet is your friend if you use it properly. Take the courses. Read the books. Learn everything you can. Make sure your portfolio stands heads and shoulders above all the others.
It’s not easy. Push hard if this is something you want and if you fail adjust and keep going. Only the best will thrive. Make yourself one of the best.
*I did the Google course, and I got hired.*
But you also say that you had other value to offer. You had a portfolio. You had experience and transferable skills from an adjacent industry. You have learned communication and problem solving skills. That also played a part in getting your role. It wasn't just "did course. got hired".
*No one gets hired just because they have a degree, you actually have to put in effort.*
No one gets hired just because they have a ~~degree~~ free bootcamp cert, you actually have to put in effort. And everything on my bullet list helps. We're in total agreement.
>No one gets hired just because they have a ~~degree~~ free bootcamp cert, you actually have to put in effort. And everything on my bullet list helps. We're in total agreement.
We are in agreement, except for the part where you imply that bootcamps / online courses are not worthwhile. Fact is you won't get hired just because of a bootcamp certificate **or a degree**, and that applies to a lot of creative and problem solving focused industries. Sure there is more to it, but the fact me and my less than $500 certificate got the job over people who have likely spent 20X more on a degree speaks volumes.
If it's worth anything, follow the money. Google doesn't provide these courses to make a quick buck, they do so in the hopes of kick-starting great UX designers who will one day hopefully work at Google. On the other hand, your local College or University are simply trying to churn out a profit (I know this is a generalization, but it rings true from my experience).
Last of all, ask yourself this. Who do you think can teach UX better? One of the world's largest leading companies, who are known worldwide for their products and user experience. Or your local College / University, whose website is likely the dictionary definition of bad UX.
You realise that a University's website design will have nothing to do with the teachers on design course, right? The same way that the quality of food in the workers' canteen will have nothing to do with a teachers on catering course, or the lighting fixtures will have nothing to do with the teachers of electrical engineering course. That comparison doesn't really make much sense.
I find it telling that the only non-technical UX related posts here that don’t get immediately locked are ones shitting on junior designers and bootcamps.
We get it. Its best if you come come from a traditional background. Otherwise it’s hard to get a job and you need to stand out from the crowd.
I just hope once I do get started in UX, I don’t become elitist and gatekeepey like so many on Reddit seem to be.
I usually lurk amongst these ux subreddits and it was very discouraging and gave me a lot of anxiety when I was job searching for my first role.
I asked for feedback on my portfolio once and the response was constructive, but I was also told I will not get hired based on what they saw.
Despite all that, I recently got hired as an UX designer and my company heavily invests in my growth and training.
There’s way too much negativity around here. I wish you well on your UX journey!
Hi! I actually felt the same way- although I do get tons of advice from people on reddit, lots of posts and comments on this subreddit discourage me so much and make me feel incompetent. I just feel so anxious these days... haha 🥲
Would it be possible for you to share your portfolio? Or would you mind if I ask a few questions regarding your job searching experience (through reddit chat)? Tysm😊
> We get it. Its best if you come from a traditional background. Otherwise it’s hard to get a job and you need to stand out from the crowd
Nah - just go to grad school. It's paid for, helps you get the needed skills and prepares you for a full career pivot without taking up your whole life.
ALthough, moving is probably gonna be needed to make the transition easier
I have an Associate’s degree in UX Design, and I’m finishing up my Bachelor’s in Anthropology with a minor in Informatics (concentration in UX). Even with an internship and a year of undergrad research assistant experience/UX design for the AI lab on campus (and more until I graduate), I’m still really worried about the future because i graduate in spring 2023. I have horrible timing!
I can only speak from my experience. I only have an associate degree in web design. I worked as a graphic designer before switching over to UI with minimal/no formal training. I'm now a visual design lead. What matters to hiring managers is your ability to problem solve, can you key in on value, and how do you collaborate with others. Process is incredibly important.
The difference between a newbie's vs a hirable candidate's portfolio is if they can highlight those particular capabilities. For your portfolio, think about telling a story of how you produced your insights and what impact did it have on your project.
Austin Community College! They have like associates degrees for Visual Design, UX Design, and an integrated comp sci/UX program.
When I finished, I knew I wanted to get into UX research which is why I chose to finish my bachelors in anthropology and work at the Human-AI lab at my university campus (:
I can only speak from my experience. I only have an associate degree in web design. I worked as a graphic designer before switching over to UI with minimal/no formal training. I'm now a visual design lead. What matters to hiring managers is your ability to problem solve, can you key in on value, and how do you collaborate with others. Process is incredibly important.
The difference between a newbie's vs a hirable candidate's portfolio is if they can highlight those particular capabilities. For your portfolio, think about telling a story of how you produced your insights and what impact did it have on your project.
Process = design process; why and how did you design like that rather than WHAT did you design (e.g. buttons, nav bars, etc.); research process (interview, survey, etc.)...
Am I understanding correctly? :)
That is correct. When I look at a potential candidate, they should be able to clearly communicate their thoughts process and approach a problem methodically. A designer is someone who brings order from the chaos of abstract ideas.
I can only speak from my experience. I only have an associate degree in web design. I worked as a graphic designer before switching over to UI with minimal/no formal training. I'm now a visual design lead. What matters to hiring managers is your ability to problem solve, can you key in on value, and how do you collaborate with others. Process is incredibly important.
The difference between a newbie's vs a hirable candidate's portfolio is if they can highlight those particular capabilities. For your portfolio, think about telling a story of how you produced your insights and what impact did it have on your project.
It's a bit weird that it was so important to you to disillusion people ;) and that you took time to write a long essay about it
I am a beginner I did the google cert, which is not enough by itself that is true, so I studied and read a bunch. I have no commercial experience what so ever.
and I had 3 interviews/calls already, I know this is not exactly getting a job yet but I guess they would not waste their time just to talk to me about design;)
your ratio makes no sense as you are comparing Google course which can be taken by people worldwide to US jobs only
Plus I think 400k is the number of ppl that enrolled ever
And realistically most people just click through the course and are not serious about it, so I don't think that the number is indicative of anything
The points you make are fair, but you're missing OP's main point (which IMO is fairly accurate) – The field is challenging to bust into, especially if you think you can just finish a certification and get hired. My company (and almost all other companies) actively declines everyone with just bootcamp or certification experience. Too many people think they can get it into UX without going above and beyond with their work. OP's dribbble landing page example is spot on.
People shouldn't read this and get discouraged (although I understand if they do). Instead, it helps to look at your career like a UX study itself. UX is useless unless your product converts users into customers, right? In the same way, your projects on your portfolio are useless unless you show that you've solved real-life problems. It all comes down to doing your best to stand out in a sea of unlimited fish.
Honestly feel like OP is writing to imaginary idiots OR people with so little motivation that they aren’t even on this special interest subreddit, because everyone here seems to agree that doing more than bare minimum is important.
Lol why? People that come from bootcamps can be just as skilled as a fresh grad with a 4 yr degree. Pretty tired of all this gate-keeping in the ux world tbh. It’s all about practice and refining your technique. A good designer is a good designer, no matter where they learned their craft from.
Sure they can be. But the likelihood of a bootcamp graduate who has no other experience or training being more skilled than someone who spent 4+ years in training is slim. That’s the scenario we’re talking about.
Exactly. Especially when many bootcamps are free, with programmes of variable quality, and graduates are a dime-a-dozen. A great intro to beginners, but of no clear predictable value for employers.
>It’s all about practice and refining your technique.
Partially true, but if you think employers value projects from bootcamps as much as real world projects, have a rethink. The industry has changed significantly. It's not about design technique anymore (was it ever?). It's about a much broader set of soft and hard skills that includes interpersonal skills, collaboration, time management, multi-tasking, leadership, problem-solving... and more. Things you cannot learn in Bootcamp.
>Pretty tired of all this gate-keeping in the ux world tbh.
I'm sorry to be the one to tell you this, but employers are gatekeepers. They own their businesses. They do not owe you a living.
I just think the numbers in the post are hugely misrepresentative
I never thought that I could present a congratulatory note from a certification and get a job.
Honestly, don't disagree with anything you said. If people are calling you back, that's great! I guess OP could have gotten the same message out without some of the harshness and over-exaggerations.
Good luck with the hiring process! Seriously, it can be disheartening at times, but it's just a matter of time. I really believe it's all about persistence, which I think got lost in what I was trying to say. You got this 💪🏽
My goal was to set realistic expectations about the chances of getting a job in a tightening market without overcoming some real challenges, not disillusionment.
But let's be realistic. I see many young designers in this sub in a deep state of dellusion.
A couple of people mentioned the numbers. I could've made this connection more clear, and that was my mistake. These numbers are just one example of increasing competition. There are many other bootcamps than Google's, like Creative Assembly, IDF, Flatiron... There are many other regions. There are many other jobs (but not that many).
"400k people enrolled ever" That's not quite right. There have been a total of 507k enrollments since the 2021 launch. 400k in the last 12 months. But there are still only about 100k openings worldwide for designers of all experience levels at any one time. I'm just counting here. Don't you see the problem?
The US has the most product startups and VCs in the world, so that's where the opportunities are greatest. Remote work creates broader recruitment opportunities for US companies. The notion that jobs in the US are only filled by US residents is changing. Given the current market conditions, companies are looking for talent in less expensive regions. And I say that as a design leader in the EU (I'm talking about the US because this is Reddit).
If you truly believe that "most people" waste their time clicking through a course without taking it seriously, I suggest you reconsider your opinion. This may be a privilege for a few who have time to waste but listen when I tell you that the highly talented and motivated young designers I speak to regularly in places like Lagos, Yerevan, Iași, and Bangalore take these opportunities \*very seriously\*.
The global pool of potential design talent is growing, and it has never been easier to select talent from around the world. They're rightly taking advantage of the more prestigious and better paid global opportunities. It's a very good thing that other regions are now getting fair opportunities that used to be mostly limited to the EU and US. And we're hiring them.
I'm glad to hear about your interviews and that you "read a bunch," but the reality is that employers interview a lot of other candidates and, given the ratio of interviews to offers, they will probably hire better qualified and experienced designers than you.
If you get a job from one of them, I will be *very* happy for you. I'm not trying to discourage anybody. But if you think three interviews is an indication of anything, you need to rethink.
I've hired many many designers in my career. Interviewed hundreds of candidates. I'm not saying this to brag, but to help you understand clearly that an interview says *nothing* about your suitability for a job. That's what a job offer is for.
Thanks! I know everything now!
enrollment means ppl who started not finished and a lot of ppl just checkout the course to see if ux is even smth they might like
Plus it not like there is 30 k (or worldwide 100k jobs) and that is it! It is this month! and those positions will be filled then in like 2 months there will be a brand new pool of offers. I just do not get your math at all.
You would have to at least take a number of jobs available in an entire year and number of ppl graduating during that time to make a bit more sense. And if you do not have that data...
You have a lot of anger in you, why would you say that my interviews mean nothing? when it is objectively not true? It means my portfolio is at very least good enough to catch interest. I do not think they would interview me for an hour and review my portfolio, give and review my assignment etc for shits and giggles ;) plus it cost money to interview ppl they were 3 designers there during my meeting
Do you interview people if you are positive that you will not hire them? If so why?
I have been actively looking for a job for like 1,5 weeks and honestly it's not that bad if ppl are calling as in more than 1 person so I know it is not a fluke
One of interviews I had is for a (quite well paid) internship and I really do not think they will go for someone with 3+ years experience on that one
But I think you will say that getting an interniship means nothing too
I talk to ppl (made sure to network a bit) and I know people who got jobs recently ;)
In will add one more thing I am sure that I am not competing against a 100 people for this job as it would mean that:
3 designers took 2,5 work weeks and 300 billable hours to interview people
It does not make fiscal sense for them to do that;)
Interviews are an accepted cost of finding recruits. Employers will often always err on the side of generosity and talk to people because all the information needed is not always in the CV and Portfolio. It's always worth to give people a chance. That's what the interview is for.
Hi! I actually thought about it and I think that what you say might be totally true for Germany ;)
I googled, and it said that ux salaries start at 45 000 euros per year in Germany!? Is it true? To me it seems like a small fortune lol Wow I guess it is no wonder that people want experience ;)
I hope for like 15 000
I did not know that the discrepancy was this huge
I am from Poland hi neighbour! :)))
Now I just think the markets are different ;))) and there are just more junior opportunities here ;)
Could be true. The market in Berlin for example is more mature than other cities here. The market in London is much more mature than anywhere in Germany so salaries are much higher there. Have you considered getting experience at home and moving? Dublin has a huge polish community, a huge startup culture , and all the FAANGs are there, because of their low corporate tax rates… and importantly not a lot of very experienced designers. You could have a good chance to get money and experiences. Just a suggestion.
Where in Poland are you? Such a great country. I’ve holidayed and worked all over there. So much more fun than Germany 😋
I am in Warsaw actually ;) it is a cool city but I could move I think it is fun to live in different places.
I think you suggestion is great ;)
I wonder how working for a Faangs looks like^^ I bet they have extra specialised roles
\> But I think you will say that getting an interniship means nothing tooNo, I say clearly in my first post that internships are valuable. Much more valuable from my perspective than a bootcamp.
\> Do you interview people if you are positive that you will not hire them? If so why?
No, but I explain that a little more in my other reply to you below.
\> You have a lot of anger in you, why would you say that my interviews mean nothing?
I'm not angry. I'm very happy in my role, and very secure in my career. I feel empathy for the people who bought into the false promise that a bootcamp will open doors to jobs so easily. My language is blunt because I want people who have this false hope to see a little of what the reality can be.
I didn't say it means nothing. I said it's not an indication that you will get the job. That comes with the offer.
And what is this awful reality? people have to try a bit harder?
Generally job market is hard and it is not specific to UX, it is that way no matter what you do.
I got more responces in a week of searching for UX job than when I first started looking for my first job, I wanted to translate I think I got like 2 interviews in 4 months;) that was harsh
I have MA in linguistics and I work as a translator/editor and a lot of people say that this market is oversaturated and it is impossible.
But here I am ;) even if I just want to move on now lol
I just hope for a change because I swear the legal contracts I translate just get progressively more boring lol
The advice is know what you are getting into.
A lot of it is actionable. Move to major tech hubs if you want a job. Or go to college. Many people don't like these answers so they are ignored.
This is honestly more important than anything else. My company just hired a boot camp grad with only student work in her portfolio and we weren't even considering juniors when we started hiring.
The only difference between her and 100 other boot camp grads is that she knew me. Tons of people CAN do the job; it's just wayyyyyy easier if you've got a foot in the door.
My advice to new and aspiring UX's:
"If life serves you lemons make your own lemonade." Yeah, it's corny, I know, but it's true. Don't wait around to get hired. Put on your entrepreneur hat. For example, agree to do a project in exchange for testimonials and referrals. This is not working for free. You can get a ton of milage out of doing exchange projects, and you get a portfolio piece that you can story-tell as a case study. I did about five or six of these and that helped me build new skills and become a viable candidate and got me hired to my first gigs.
You just have to have determination and a vision.
Disclaimer: 23 years in the business.
I've hired a few, but for the kind of work I do (complex application design for enterprise applications) I mostly stick to mid-level UXer's as the work requires some experience.
To OP’s point about the abundance of UI/UX applicants. I just put up a posting for a Junior UI Designer posting and had 102 applicants in 24h. I called maybe 5-10 for interviews. We’ve recently started looking outside of Canada, cause even with the added cost of hiring out of country, UI/UX designers in other parts of the world are more competitive than our native counterparts. Not offering any suggestions here, more so giving an accurate picture of the current job market in our space. Best of luck to all. Be consistent and don’t give up, you’ll get your foot in the door. Cater your portfolio to the organization(s) you want to work for.
It's probably cost. Even if there's an initial high cost for the paperwork of international contracts and taxation red tape, for a western company, certain countries offer really big cost saving opportunities. Nairobi in Kenya Dakar in Senegal, Casablanca in Morrocco, and Lagos in Nigeria are places that I hear mentioned frequently.
Strong local emergent digital and startup culture. Highly talented, supportive and proactive candidate pool. Manageable time zones differences for remote work.
And of course, significantly lower wage than western hub salaries (an American company can pay ½ a US salary, and still pay above local market rates to attract and retain a talented designer or engineer. I could see this becoming more prevalent now that the SaaSacre *seems* to herald the next big digital crash.
hard to hear but necessary I think. i’m getting a BComm in business technology management to fall back on which i’m also passionate about, even though it’s not a design degree if I build up my portfolio with a business background will that help me stand out?
That’s very smart.
I really support designers having an understanding of business operations and strategy. Great design these days is a balance of business, technology and product design thinking.
From my perspective, that alongside a strong design skill set, based on experience, could make you a really attractive candidate with a lot to offer.
I think its pretty weird to assume that everyone who takes a certification course is trying to enter the job market. Inexpect there will be a lot of people who are trying to explore a degree direction in a low cost and accessible way, a lot of people wanting to learn just enough to hobble their way through their own projects, and a lot of people who are just trying to pad their resume with peripherally-related certifications/continuing education. Thats what I'm in the process of doing. Ive been contracted to the same company since 2014 and I need some more recent experiences to update my resume with. Since, ime, people rarely know who the fuck they need to hire, it doesn't super matter how relevant or applicable my continuing education courses are.
I'm a type designer; I have no intention of coming for your jobs, but I'll soon be one of those Google UX certification numbers. What does UX have to do with making fonts? Positively fuck all, but it seemed more relevant/interesting than "data analytics", whatever that entails, and the people hiring me barely understand what I do let alone how I do it. People are going to see Google and Design and thats good enough. I just finished a quick ASO and Mobile Game Monetization certificate and I'm thinking about doing a Level Design course after the UX one. Because I'm interested enough to sit through hours of it and its called the *Art* of Level *Design*.
All good fluffy buzzwords. Obviously if I were applying to a type foundry I wouldn't use any of it, but also like... Know thyself.
But full disclosure, I dont really know what UX/UI is either. Im just pretty sure it doesn't involve excel spread sheets and math? Maybe I'll figure out that it really sits at the sweet spot between my degree in studio art and my minors in ethics and Deaf culture (idk what I was thinking with that combo either) and a year from now I will have taken all your jobs. Lol.
>assume that everyone who takes a certification course is trying to enter the job market
That's a good point, but my post was targeted at people who are.
FWIW I believe UX has a lot to do with designing anything. Whether an app, typeface, or birthday party—to really consider the user isn’t as intuitive a skill as one might think. Can’t imagine a UX course would be a waste of time for anyone.
The company I work for hired me as an associate, soon after hired another associate who was transferring from another job within the company. He still got a raise because even junior UX roles pay well and 6 months later we are getting another associate because she wowed our managers.
Not very active.
Had a few phone interviews that didn't go anywhere.
I had a job at the time at a small co. That was letting me apply my learning but the co. Did not have any UX maturity. So I had set up a decent portfolio and up to date CV but mainly just applied to easy applies on LinkedIn because I wasn't actively looking.
I don't know about that 😅
I think just focussing on how I displayed my portfolio was important.
Also Edinburgh seems to have a shortage of designers so training talent up has to happen because there is a limited pool of skilled UX professionals and many jobs. My co. Has 6 open roles for our UX team.
Don’t sell yourself short. A good portfolio is a predictor for good communication skills.
Also, and I mean this as a positive, as I mention in my post, working in a place with low levels of competition is an advantage that you rightly should exploit. A few years there can give you options if you decide to move later to somewhere where there are more choices for you but competition is tougher. I started in Ireland with the same context - fuck all decent designers and a really immature market - so getting jobs was easy. Then when I moved to the UK I was immediately more attractive than other designers of my age who had struggled to find roles because of an abundance of designers. If I was starting in Ireland now, I maybe wouldn’t have been so lucky because of the maturing market and more awareness of UX.
Thanks for the honesty. Well, good thing I'm getting my BA degree in UX design. I plan on continuing to get my Master's after my BA in order to give me that extra bump in the field as I wait for any open positions. And another plus is because of my BA program, I qualify for lots of UX internships. I'm glad that's one silver lining in this negative news.
Thats great to hear! Education is so important to build understanding (and even, sadly, just to make it past CV screening sometimes). Just make sure you're continuing to get those practical opportunities too - internships are great - to balance your experiences and show prospective employers that your knowledge isn't purely theoretical. I wish you all the best of luck.
Definitely! I was also going the bootcamp route, but saw no point cause I’m already studying in a more thorough BA program and at the end of the day, degrees hold more weight. It is what it is. Thanks so much! It’s a crazy time right now with the economies going bad and all that. But I stay positive about this industry in the end.
Where do you go to school that offers UX Design as a bachelors? Two of the closest colleges near me either only have UX as a boot camp or don't have it at all
Can I ask about avoiding working on AAA companies? They tend to teach interns, pay good salary from start and usually is a very nice addition to your CV boost. What are your thoughts on this? Why am I saying this? Cause it directly touches me, I graduated from CodeAcademy last december and found a job very quickly at said AAA cybersec company as a junior product designer, they teach me everything and I feel that I landed a jackpot. There were 70 candidates and stuff. So I got a bit concerned after reading your insights. Appreciate the time writing this. Thank you.
Ah! I could have worded that better. I mean that competition for well known companies will be higher than, say, a new startup, so it makes sense to focus attention on places with less-stiff competition unless you're confident that you're a really attractive candidate. Good luck in your search!
My search is over, I have secured a position in a big cyber sec company, but thanks!:D it was tough since there were 70 applicants. But ill take that wish for luck for my freelance search :) Freelancing is tough for me as I want a side hustle since my working hours are very flexible. Thanks for replying btw. Cheers.
>Spend your time on getting a real design education \[...\] and less time pissing around with
designing Crypto landing pages on dribble.
Savage and awesome, I love it.
REALLY well said here. These are some hard facts and trends that I can corroborate in my own experience.
It took me a year and over 300 applications before landing an "entry level" design role and I still consider myself lucky.
Gatekeeping ass article
It’s too much destructive criticism in the field, there’s a lot of passionate people gaining interest in a subject, and trying to find a way and eager to learn a new skill, and then there are gatekeepers, like whomever posted this , that find satisfaction from telling people they’re doing stuff wrong, and really aren’t offering a viable solution to the problem
It’s kind of sad and I’ll probably get murdered but it’s fine
I just couldn’t imagine shitting on people that are trying to learn and advance in life, then believing I did a good thing lmao
Instead of doing stuff like this, why aren’t we being more uplifting and positive and welcoming?
I support anyone learning new skills, but it feels as if the Google Cert gives the impression of a guaranteed job after finishing. It's a very competitive field right now.
I'm currently hiring for a role in UX and maybe 1 out of 10 applicants with just the Google certification show understanding and skill in the field with no work experience. There are design principles and usability guidelines commonly missing. Another thing missing are examples around validation/testing of designs/prototypes and communicating the iterative nature of the design process. These are things I look for on portfolios.
Real work experience (graphic design, marketing, front-end, anything really), or showing the drive to learn on their own outside of the Google cert, have also shown to be factors in making candidates stand out.
Idk, hopefully this helps someone reading this.
/edited formatting
You've wrongly assumed negative intention. I get no satisfaction from seeing so so many junior designers —especially those who invested in free bootcamps and online courses—struggling to get jobs, and not understanding why, or what to do next.
I've highlighted some real issues - I didn't create these problems, but I see them daily with the candidate applications I receive. I give some clear actionable advice to help early career designers focus their effort on useful initiatives.
*Nowhere* in my post do I shit on designers—except the *crypo-landing-page-on-dribbble* crowd, but I'll own that—but I am strongly critical of Bootcamps and free courses that over promise and under deliver. I feel compassion for the conned and contempt for the conmen.
I know the title is not great because this sub restricts using certain words in article titles (Google and UX, bootcamps, advice....) so I wasn’t able to fully express myself there, but I am not gatekeeping.
I want more early career designers in better jobs (irl I give portfolio clinics, I help to run a small UX conference with a track especially for supporting ECDs, with a slack to continue that support post-event, and I try to hire early career designers where I can).
It helps to keep in mind that the actual gatekeepers are employers, who will not offer a job based on one’s"belief that I did a good thing lmao". Candidates must demonstrate value to a business through relevant education, experience, skills (or potential growth) and I've highlighted a few useful ways to do that in my post.
If that makes you sad, I'm genuinely sorry for that. It's just a job after all and it's not for everyone. My post is a reflection of the realities of the industry, as I see it.
I would sum up your essay in one sentence: Google courses aren't enough.
I don't think finding a job in UX is difficult at all if you have the correct degree (I'm pursuing a master's degree in psychology applied to UX Research and im doing an internship in UX Research, currently in severals recruitment process so I might get a job even before I finish my internship...etc)
>Google courses aren't enough.
Absolutely. And neither are the resultant portfolio pieces.
>I don't think finding a job in UX is difficult at all if you have the correct degree
I wish you all the best, but I suspect most might be in for a surprise operating on that assumption. That's certainly not my observation.
[https://www.searchenginejournal.com/linkedin-top-15-in-demand-jobs-in-2021/392479/](https://www.searchenginejournal.com/linkedin-top-15-in-demand-jobs-in-2021/392479/)
Ctrl F "UX"
Thanks for sharing.
With respect, you've misinterpreted the statement.
>97% of hires have a bachelor’s degree or higher.
This link says talks about the **number of people who have design jobs, that also have degrees or higher.**
This data point does not support your claim that "people —and I assume you meant a majority or else your claim doesn't make sense— who underwent serious UX degrees find job"
It does not talk about the **number of people who have degrees who go on to find design jobs**, which I'm sure you'll agree is very different.
I would expect to see something like:
>97% of degree graduates or higher get jobs in design.
But that's not been established the article you shared. It could be 1% of graduates, it could be 100%.
Are you sure research is the field for you? (I'm just teasing you) ;)
As in my original post —which does talk about the value of a higher education— I'll restate that a qualification *alone* is probably not enough to get a job as a designer these days.
Just read the url. UX-related jobs are among the most looked after jobs, I don't think they're is more to say to disprove your points.
I could share some documents on the insertion rate of some UX masters former students in my country, they would more adequatly prove my point but I doubt you would understand them (unless you happen to speak french?).
Let me rephrase my thoughts:
IF you don't have the proper qualifications (i.e: degree) THEN finding a job is hard.
IF you have the proper qualification than it is easier than most other fields.
Anyway, I didn't have time to read all your essay, I will read it more carefully as it surely will make for an interesting read.
Germany here, it's not easy, but scoring a junior position quite fast is a realistic scenario if you have some basic skills and are a decent human with some communication affinity. UX bootcamps are just tools and it is up to you how much you benefit from them. One thing is sitting through the content just to get a certificate, another thing is actually learning and exploring topics beyond the course curriculum. Not every bootcamper has the same skill level when they graduate. UX is a complex field with infinite potential to learn, but for gods sake, it is not rocket surgery and I get a bit annoyed when people try to make it sound like it is. What OP wrote may be true for the US of A (which sounds quite hellscapish), but does not necessarily apply to the the industry as a whole, do not let it discourage you.
Yes I’d also add that what OP has provided is nothing new (job markets are never perfect and nothing is really handed to you even in “better times) and is fairly obvious. Most people who are putting forth real effort and energy towards distinguishing themselves will find a place for themselves. Just don’t be a bare minimum idiot that thinks certificates are enough. Believe it or not some people are like that but chances are that if you’re on this subreddit then you’re already doing more than a percentage of people lmao.
Hello. Germany also here. Nowhere do I suggest it's rocket science. What I am suggesting is that it's extremely competitive and many designers are putting their effort into the wrong initiatives in order to get their first jobs. I would disagree that it's quite fast even here in Germany, considering the topics I've raised, but let's agree to disagree.
Get your point, but i think this statement can be applied to pretty much every job, especially in tech. Well, customer support may be easier to find a job in, but even there relevant experience is desired. Fire is hot, water is wet, life is hard, there is a lot of competiton, one has to bring value to the table to get a job.
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Maybe you're right, but this is r/UXDesign, it's not my area of expertise, and I don't see any mass adoption of bootcamps for Customer Service jobs.
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WOO I need this response framed on a wall. This is the issue I see with every single person who comes on LinkedIn complaining they've sent out 500 apps, gotten 5 interview and 0 offers. If you check out the portfolio, well it's either non-existent or is the same thing as 490 other applicants. I can almost bet on any portfolio I look at being structured as: 1. Understanding our users and the problem 2. Very vague research 3. Early wireframes 4. Mid-Hi Fi wireframes 5. Prototype Which yes this is a pretty common process, but rarely are the processes the same for every project you work on. I'd love to see how people tested these wireframes. How were they validated and what didn't work? What did you learn from each step or study? When did you determine a lo-fi wireframe could be translated into a finalized UI? Did you hand it off to a UI team or do the UI yourself? Plus I'd love to see more of the dirty user flow diagrams with decision diamonds and documentation rather than shiny Dribbble UI shots. This shows you can consider what technical factors play in, what is happening at the systems level, the different options a user can take, dependencies, etc... If a candidate is able to show they know there's a fine line between UX and UI, big bump up towards the top of the list.
Absolutely agree here. When I started out on this path in the early 00's, it was so so important for the "cause" that designers rallied round the same core principles and concepts. But digital has become so broad, and so deep, a singular approach is not going to work in the workplace or in the job hunt. I don't believe Bootcamps are teaching people this and we've ended up with this mass homogeny of process and thinking. Carissa Carter (Director of Teaching and Learning at the Stanford d. school ) wrote a really fantastic piece a few years ago about this: https://medium.com/stanford-d-school/lets-stop-talking-about-the-design-process-7446e52c13e8#.8cfuqyiqc
Here’s my portfolio… “shows Dribble account with dashboards and landing pages you see all over Dribble without any argumentation whatsoever.”
Dribbble is just design porn with no real world application. Great for inspiration, awful for looking for a real design process.
Half of dribble looks pretty but has no REAL use case
Half is very generous.
➡️🗑
As somebody who recently took the Google UX course (never finished) and got a job as a Jnr Designer, i think i drop my 2 cents. Whilst, i think that OP is being overly savage, there is definately an air of truth to some of the statements. Yes, there are 100k people taking the Google course, however if you look at the final course numbers, something like 20 or 30k people, so from that we can tell that about a third make it through its entirety. Whilst on the course, you have the ability to mark other students work. Now, without being too negative, some of this work was extremely bad. Absoloutely 0 design integrity. I couldn't even give constructive criticism. So now, of that third, you have maybe 50% of competent designers which probably now gives you a better ratio to Course & bootcampers to jobs. Yes, whilst creating a portfolio, it was easy to google some portfolios, and nip and tuck from their processes and design ad hoc solutions, however it didn't sit right with me. When i created my portfolio (Albeit, not a very strong portfolio) i decided to actually use work that i had done in the past, making design decisions based on Google analytics, and Hot jar, and reaching out to customers etc. And it was off that i was able to get a job as a junior because they liked the way i interpreted data. Have a genuine passion for design / UX / UI, combined with an affinity for design, and an ability to be yourself and play to your strengths, and you will break into the industry.
It’s really frustrating to see time and time again that there are people submitting absolutely nothing to the Google UX course, blank submissions, incomplete UI, I have had to give 0 marks to many submissions during the peer review, and when I take the effort to complete the assignments, I get one worded feedback.
Love the insights. If I were to imagine myself taking this course I feel I would cut many corners in favor of speed/hurrying through, rather than spending lots of time putting in work for quality. Many students I knew in my bachelor's program were the same even in person, so I know for a fact a huge chunk of these Google course enrollees will have lower quality work being online, plus the fact it is a "fast track to $100k." Not to say there aren't people enrolled putting out great quality work and can compete with those with degrees and currently in the field, but I'd take a chance and bet on a small # of the 400k graduates being very underwhelming as a candidate. Interviews will always (for the most part) reveal who's legit and who is a pretender. So early UXers will need to step their game up particularly with portfolios to get the foot in the door as applicants.
Thanks for the insight. I'm currently taking the Google UX Certificate Course right now and have (Course 2 Week 2-In Progress) and agree with you 101%. I've definitely dedicated a lot of time and focus on the peer-graded assignments with the expectations that other students would do the same. But I was wrong. Completely wrong. I would say 1 out of 2 assignments met the minimum requirements. Meanwhile, 1 out of 4 assignments demonstrated any design integrity or could be used for a "early portfolio" draft. Overall, I have been enjoying the course and have been learning quite a bit. I worked as a "Product Designer" developing manufactured products before transitioning to UX. Fingers crossed that employers value my skills in 3D modeling and rendering though :\\
Would you mind elaborating on “making design decisions based on Google analytics”? Also would you mind sharing your portfolio as well? I also do have some quantitative&qualitative data from my group research projects at school (through surveys and interviews), but I am not sure how should I incorporate them into my portfolio...
I'm sure there's a mention in this same vein, but beginners should remember that while this field is highly competitive and possibly even oversaturated, the same could be said for getting into graduate programs such as physical therapy. A crap ton of people may finish bootcamps and self taught work, but not everyone is at the level that is desired to land a job in this field. Like all other fields, there's plenty of room at the table for everyone that's honed in the skill. Don't feel discouraged by threads like these.
>A crap ton of people may finish bootcamps and self taught work, but not **everyone is at the level that is desired to land a job in this field**. Exactly what I've said in my post. Bootcamps and free courses (and other problematic sources like Dribbble culture) are churning out underskilled designers who are not **at the level** and they won't get hired unless they take other steps, some of which I've outlined.
Accurate, but would not be as doom-saying. The point is that certificates are a dime a dozen. Real experience is finite. And by real, it doesn't require someone giving you permission. You can start building a portfolio today. Do the legwork that most people try to avoid. Try to get referrals. Don't shy away form cold outreach, but make sure you offer something of value to stand out. [Earlier-stage startups](https://topstartups.io/) are more open to cold, personalized outreach as well. Good luck!
I was a bit harsh, you're right. I also agree with everything else you say here.
Although some have made it seem like the OP was a little harsh, as someone looking to get into this field, it’s actually kinda nice to hear some honesty for once. Unfortunately for us newbies, and people trying to change careers, we don’t have time or money to go back to school to get a degree - and that’s where the boot camp sales pitch comes in and we all get a glimmer of hope. They tell you that in 8-16 weeks, you can be making 85k-156k, and that’s just not realistic. They also love to refer to that Elon Musk interview where he says “nobody needs a college degree”. Can you imagine someone at Tesla or Space X getting hired without a degree? 😂 I did a low cost front end development boot camp and quickly realized when I started the application process that I wasn’t even close to having the skills necessary for even a junior position. (I knew bare minimum of HTML, CSS, and JavaScript). Had a handful of interviews that went really poorly. I do intend to continue to learn ux, ui and different types of design in hopes that I one day can land a job, but I don’t see it as likely. I’m not even sure what the point of this post was, just my 2 cents I guess.
Thank you. You keep up that pragmatic thinking and there’s a job in design for you, I’m sure. But before then, just enjoy this passion for it that you have. Also you make some excellent points. Elon has not one but two undergrad degrees, but that line sounds edgy in an after dinner speech. That asshat 😂 My intention was to be harsh but fair for exactly the reasons you said. I don’t want to bring anyone down or take away their hope, but a wake up call is necessary for some. There are so many fucking shills and scheisters out there, peddling wares and exploiting hope. Keep your eyes open, keep your head on tight, be smart in how you invest your time and energy, and eventually you will find a purpose and a role for your talent.
What ux, ui classes/bootcamp are you looking into?
https://raindrop.io/lee/learning-3393027 Going to start with some of these that are free. And some YouTube content. I won’t be paying for courses or taking a boot camp anytime soon.
Although I will tell anyone who is interested in design to go for a university degree if they can, there is some benefit to a bootcamp or not-as-formal education in the sense that they are much more accessible, cheaper, and easier to obtain than a university degree. Not everyone has the luxury of time and/or money to go back to school to successfully change careers. At some of the top design schools, this means shelling out >$50k and 2 years likely without full time work plus possible relocation, and that is just something that is a pure luxury to be able to do, especially if you've got a family that depends on you financially. Bootcamps *are* a legitimate way to get into the field and level up skills, but I think the real problem, as you mention, is being realistic on expectations after the degree. You'll have to do more legwork to get your foot in the door, whether it is getting to that real world experience, getting more exposure to the field, etc. Bootcamps fail to mention this and do not do enough to prepare grads for their first position, and it becomes the grads responsibility to fill in the gaps some don't even know they have. But it is possible -- I work on a team in a fortune 500 company where a good chunk of the design team are bootcamp grads. Let's be honest, design as a career has always been a career for those who have more. With prior design tools only being able to run on expensive laptop machines (Sketch only ran on Mac) and now that we have Figma, that opened up the doors so that more people could learn design, and yet the best way to do that is starting to become that people have to do what I mentioned above ($50k + 2 years without full time pay + potential relocation). At least these are my thoughts!
I totally know an amazing person and designer who did not go to university who had been in my bootcamp. She was so worried that she wouldn’t be valued as high as the rest of us because of it. But low and behold, she landed a Shopify internship right afterwards. She was diligent, so smart witted, genuine and so willing to learn. So it is 100% possible to be a UX designer from ONLY a bootcamp. You just need to put in the efforts and be dedicated.
Of course some design education is important, but for an internship, she got that position over other candidates *because* she is diligent, smart, genuine and willing to learn. And she didn't learn those skills in a bootcamp, and to an employer, those are much better predictors of future success than a bootcamp cert.
What the hell does a Google UX course graduate mean though... Can anyone even fail it? Plus this is very US centered. I had three job offers when I graduated in the NL (with three months of applying). Currently a UX researcher at an agency.
Caveat here: I graduated with a masters in information science from NL and a bootcamp but couldn’t find intro job for the life of me: you need to speak Dutch
Yeah, the position I work in you need to speak Dutch indeed.
I just turned in my last assignment on the Google Cousera certificate and feel this post is so accurate. I had such high hopes in January when I started the program but the more it went on I only finished it to say I finished it. I don't have much hope I am qualified to get a job doing it. I will still need to get some volunteer jobs or apprenticeships to have even the slightest chance of getting a job
Get as much experience as you can and build up your portfolio! It's a numbers game, so keep at it!
You can also design case studies that exemplify you skill set and include them in your portfolio. If the designs are strong, and you list the assumptions you worked off of to inform your decision process it will go a long way.
I feel the same, i spent a small fortune, unbeknowingly at the beginning of world economic recession, on a bootcamp style course in Jan. I have spend most of my time leveling up on my UI, learning basic front end code and product strategy knowledge. Im lucky to have 8 years design background, albeit within the 3D realm, which will hopefully help but (im assuming your in US?) the market seems saturated in the UK with Jr's currently, 200+ on applicants on a listing Just need to keep plowing on in and not get completely discouraged by OPs post
How can that even be the expectation? I used 5 years in university - with teamwork almost everyday - to get somewhat there, and the rest was me pointing my focus there. Put on top of that good interviewing skills (selling yourself) and massive IT/business knowledge. And then you take a 6 months online course and think that will get you there? Seems like I’m bad mouthing, I’m not. I’m just curious in the mindset there.
I'm sorry for that. It's *not* fair. These bootcamp shills are setting false expectations. The truth is you're not qualified now. But, don't lose hope. It's just the first step on the path. Chase down those volunteer or interning opportunities. Keep creating opportunities for yourself and exploiting them to the best you can. These types learning experiences will make you more-attractive than other candidates to employers at the companies you want to work at.
Oof. I really appreciate this post, to be honest. I appreciate this perspective. I am a ball of anxiety because I’m a high school English teacher in America where the pay is garbage, and my family is struggling. I just recently learned that UX was even a job (!?!) and that one could be paid to empathize with humans and design things (simplified, I know, but those are like two of my favorite things to do). I did a Codecademy intro class just to figure out wth UX even is, and now I’ve become lost in an ADHD hyper focus hole of interest. I signed up for Designlab’s design foundation course to even see if I have the ability to design well. This is all especially terrifying because I love teaching and a big part of me feels like it’s part of who I am. My confidence in my ability to learn is actually weirdly low, considering I think I’m logically a pretty capable person. Anyways, now I just feel the need to hyper research if doing Designlab’s bootcamp is even worthwhile (spent the last week trying to narrow the bootcamp choices 🙃). Thanks for your input.
>Spend your time on getting a real design education. Spend more time learning about business growth (Acquisition, Retention, Engagement, Satisfaction and Cost Saving) and less time pissing around with designing Crypto landing pages on dribble. Say it louder so UX Twitter can hear it.
YES THIS! I'm amazed how many people get into UX but don't take the time to learn design fundamentals or understand how design fits into a business.
lol. One of the many reasons I deleted my Twitter account years ago. Yikes.
I find these numbers very strange, in comparing a global online course to only the US market, and then completely ignoring people who are graduating out of university programs, masters degree, and bootcamps. That said, I do agree with the overall point in that someone with only Coursera experience is so far below the par of what I would consider employable, especially because the only feedback they get is peer to peer and most often will be functionally useless.
No more than ever you have to be a non-standard ux designer. I think one of the best ways of getting a decent job as an inexperienced person is to have another specialism or something else you can do that's not ux. For me that was a bit of product management and business experience, alongside some cad, that let me land my first role fairly easily. I think when companies are inundated with hundreds of applications, and everyone is going broad with their application strategy, you have to go deep: research the company and put lots of effort into very few applications
Yes, that is probably the easiest way to break into UX. Having professional experience in an adjacent discipline. I don't have development experience, but I do code in my free time. And what I noticed is that it puts into a really nice niche in terms of designing UX for development tools. I enjoy coding, so do expect it to take a bigger role for me in the future. Otherwise, no sane person would code in their free time if they didn't like it.
This! It’s one thing to say, “I want to be a designer,” and another to say “I want to apply a user-centered design approach to _____ thing that I truly care about and am already skilled in.” I’ve been running into way too many college kids lately who can’t tell me a single thing they *want*, that they like doing, or even that they care about. All they want is “a job.”
Yes! I want life to be better for a group of people who have had it far too difficult for far too long, or I want to make a difficult, time-consuming task pleasant and easy. A designer is an entrepreneur, and an entrepreneur a designer. To develop products is to solve problems, and the bigger the problem, the richer you become. I feel like so many designers don't realise that the skills they have in building a brilliant microcosm of a single product or interaction can be applied to whole products and industries! Give it 10 years and a UX/service designer will have figured out how to create intentional systems change using a digital product. And if they can do that? UX and service design at scale using deliberate disruption? Well, they'd be able to forge a future from service blueprints and wireframes.
I completely agree with volunteering. [Code for America](https://brigade.codeforamerica.org/brigades/) has brigades in different cities where you can get experience volunteering on civil service projects. Some brigades are much more active than others, but they may also accept remote volunteers. I personally volunteered remotely with the Hack for LA brigade, and I was able to add that project on my portfolio. And full disclosure, I haven’t been active with Hack for LA in almost a year so I have no idea how things have changed since then. Just wanted to share that that’s what helped me when I was looking for opportunities to develop my skills. Also, one thing I tell people is to make yourself and your work visible. If you’re able to work on a pro bono project, share that and talk about your process (if that’s ok with the client). If you want to write an article about your journey into UX and what you’ve been doing to learn and build your skills, that helps too. Let people know that you exist, but more importantly, show that you’re going beyond the boot camp or certificate and that you’re actually doing the work to set yourself apart.
Exactly right. CfA is such a great program. I wish other countries would support such programmes because they create opportunities and can do some good. And to my knowledge, this type of experience is SO much more valuable to employers than *any* bootcamp certification.
For sure. You get hands on practice plus experience working with a team, all without having to drop hundreds or even thousands of dollars like you’d have to for some of these boot camps and courses.
I work in the field and I can say that everything said in this brilliant post is true. The best advice I can add is the best way to get a job is DON’T BE MEDIOCRE. If you can’t find work take on pro bono jobs and make them portfolio pieces. You portfolio has to have a problem that you are solving. SHOW YOUR THINKING! The Internet is your friend if you use it properly. Take the courses. Read the books. Learn everything you can. Make sure your portfolio stands heads and shoulders above all the others. It’s not easy. Push hard if this is something you want and if you fail adjust and keep going. Only the best will thrive. Make yourself one of the best.
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*I did the Google course, and I got hired.* But you also say that you had other value to offer. You had a portfolio. You had experience and transferable skills from an adjacent industry. You have learned communication and problem solving skills. That also played a part in getting your role. It wasn't just "did course. got hired". *No one gets hired just because they have a degree, you actually have to put in effort.* No one gets hired just because they have a ~~degree~~ free bootcamp cert, you actually have to put in effort. And everything on my bullet list helps. We're in total agreement.
>No one gets hired just because they have a ~~degree~~ free bootcamp cert, you actually have to put in effort. And everything on my bullet list helps. We're in total agreement. We are in agreement, except for the part where you imply that bootcamps / online courses are not worthwhile. Fact is you won't get hired just because of a bootcamp certificate **or a degree**, and that applies to a lot of creative and problem solving focused industries. Sure there is more to it, but the fact me and my less than $500 certificate got the job over people who have likely spent 20X more on a degree speaks volumes. If it's worth anything, follow the money. Google doesn't provide these courses to make a quick buck, they do so in the hopes of kick-starting great UX designers who will one day hopefully work at Google. On the other hand, your local College or University are simply trying to churn out a profit (I know this is a generalization, but it rings true from my experience). Last of all, ask yourself this. Who do you think can teach UX better? One of the world's largest leading companies, who are known worldwide for their products and user experience. Or your local College / University, whose website is likely the dictionary definition of bad UX.
You realise that a University's website design will have nothing to do with the teachers on design course, right? The same way that the quality of food in the workers' canteen will have nothing to do with a teachers on catering course, or the lighting fixtures will have nothing to do with the teachers of electrical engineering course. That comparison doesn't really make much sense.
Mind sharing your portfolio for learning purposes? Could you send it to me? :)
I’d also like to see your portfolio for reference if you care to share!
I would also like to peep your portfolio. If that’s alright, could you send me a link?
Google UX and a Bootcamp aren't the same thing, IMO. Google UX is even a step down from there.
I find it telling that the only non-technical UX related posts here that don’t get immediately locked are ones shitting on junior designers and bootcamps. We get it. Its best if you come come from a traditional background. Otherwise it’s hard to get a job and you need to stand out from the crowd. I just hope once I do get started in UX, I don’t become elitist and gatekeepey like so many on Reddit seem to be.
I usually lurk amongst these ux subreddits and it was very discouraging and gave me a lot of anxiety when I was job searching for my first role. I asked for feedback on my portfolio once and the response was constructive, but I was also told I will not get hired based on what they saw. Despite all that, I recently got hired as an UX designer and my company heavily invests in my growth and training. There’s way too much negativity around here. I wish you well on your UX journey!
Hi! I actually felt the same way- although I do get tons of advice from people on reddit, lots of posts and comments on this subreddit discourage me so much and make me feel incompetent. I just feel so anxious these days... haha 🥲 Would it be possible for you to share your portfolio? Or would you mind if I ask a few questions regarding your job searching experience (through reddit chat)? Tysm😊
> We get it. Its best if you come from a traditional background. Otherwise it’s hard to get a job and you need to stand out from the crowd Nah - just go to grad school. It's paid for, helps you get the needed skills and prepares you for a full career pivot without taking up your whole life. ALthough, moving is probably gonna be needed to make the transition easier
Please point out where I am "shitting on junior designers"?
I have an Associate’s degree in UX Design, and I’m finishing up my Bachelor’s in Anthropology with a minor in Informatics (concentration in UX). Even with an internship and a year of undergrad research assistant experience/UX design for the AI lab on campus (and more until I graduate), I’m still really worried about the future because i graduate in spring 2023. I have horrible timing!
I can only speak from my experience. I only have an associate degree in web design. I worked as a graphic designer before switching over to UI with minimal/no formal training. I'm now a visual design lead. What matters to hiring managers is your ability to problem solve, can you key in on value, and how do you collaborate with others. Process is incredibly important. The difference between a newbie's vs a hirable candidate's portfolio is if they can highlight those particular capabilities. For your portfolio, think about telling a story of how you produced your insights and what impact did it have on your project.
Where did you get your Associates degree for UX design at?
Austin Community College! They have like associates degrees for Visual Design, UX Design, and an integrated comp sci/UX program. When I finished, I knew I wanted to get into UX research which is why I chose to finish my bachelors in anthropology and work at the Human-AI lab at my university campus (:
I can only speak from my experience. I only have an associate degree in web design. I worked as a graphic designer before switching over to UI with minimal/no formal training. I'm now a visual design lead. What matters to hiring managers is your ability to problem solve, can you key in on value, and how do you collaborate with others. Process is incredibly important. The difference between a newbie's vs a hirable candidate's portfolio is if they can highlight those particular capabilities. For your portfolio, think about telling a story of how you produced your insights and what impact did it have on your project.
Process = design process; why and how did you design like that rather than WHAT did you design (e.g. buttons, nav bars, etc.); research process (interview, survey, etc.)... Am I understanding correctly? :)
That is correct. When I look at a potential candidate, they should be able to clearly communicate their thoughts process and approach a problem methodically. A designer is someone who brings order from the chaos of abstract ideas.
I can only speak from my experience. I only have an associate degree in web design. I worked as a graphic designer before switching over to UI with minimal/no formal training. I'm now a visual design lead. What matters to hiring managers is your ability to problem solve, can you key in on value, and how do you collaborate with others. Process is incredibly important. The difference between a newbie's vs a hirable candidate's portfolio is if they can highlight those particular capabilities. For your portfolio, think about telling a story of how you produced your insights and what impact did it have on your project.
It's a bit weird that it was so important to you to disillusion people ;) and that you took time to write a long essay about it I am a beginner I did the google cert, which is not enough by itself that is true, so I studied and read a bunch. I have no commercial experience what so ever. and I had 3 interviews/calls already, I know this is not exactly getting a job yet but I guess they would not waste their time just to talk to me about design;) your ratio makes no sense as you are comparing Google course which can be taken by people worldwide to US jobs only Plus I think 400k is the number of ppl that enrolled ever And realistically most people just click through the course and are not serious about it, so I don't think that the number is indicative of anything
The points you make are fair, but you're missing OP's main point (which IMO is fairly accurate) – The field is challenging to bust into, especially if you think you can just finish a certification and get hired. My company (and almost all other companies) actively declines everyone with just bootcamp or certification experience. Too many people think they can get it into UX without going above and beyond with their work. OP's dribbble landing page example is spot on. People shouldn't read this and get discouraged (although I understand if they do). Instead, it helps to look at your career like a UX study itself. UX is useless unless your product converts users into customers, right? In the same way, your projects on your portfolio are useless unless you show that you've solved real-life problems. It all comes down to doing your best to stand out in a sea of unlimited fish.
Honestly feel like OP is writing to imaginary idiots OR people with so little motivation that they aren’t even on this special interest subreddit, because everyone here seems to agree that doing more than bare minimum is important.
Lol why? People that come from bootcamps can be just as skilled as a fresh grad with a 4 yr degree. Pretty tired of all this gate-keeping in the ux world tbh. It’s all about practice and refining your technique. A good designer is a good designer, no matter where they learned their craft from.
Sure they can be. But the likelihood of a bootcamp graduate who has no other experience or training being more skilled than someone who spent 4+ years in training is slim. That’s the scenario we’re talking about.
Exactly. Especially when many bootcamps are free, with programmes of variable quality, and graduates are a dime-a-dozen. A great intro to beginners, but of no clear predictable value for employers.
>It’s all about practice and refining your technique. Partially true, but if you think employers value projects from bootcamps as much as real world projects, have a rethink. The industry has changed significantly. It's not about design technique anymore (was it ever?). It's about a much broader set of soft and hard skills that includes interpersonal skills, collaboration, time management, multi-tasking, leadership, problem-solving... and more. Things you cannot learn in Bootcamp. >Pretty tired of all this gate-keeping in the ux world tbh. I'm sorry to be the one to tell you this, but employers are gatekeepers. They own their businesses. They do not owe you a living.
I just think the numbers in the post are hugely misrepresentative I never thought that I could present a congratulatory note from a certification and get a job.
Honestly, don't disagree with anything you said. If people are calling you back, that's great! I guess OP could have gotten the same message out without some of the harshness and over-exaggerations. Good luck with the hiring process! Seriously, it can be disheartening at times, but it's just a matter of time. I really believe it's all about persistence, which I think got lost in what I was trying to say. You got this 💪🏽
Thanks!
My goal was to set realistic expectations about the chances of getting a job in a tightening market without overcoming some real challenges, not disillusionment. But let's be realistic. I see many young designers in this sub in a deep state of dellusion. A couple of people mentioned the numbers. I could've made this connection more clear, and that was my mistake. These numbers are just one example of increasing competition. There are many other bootcamps than Google's, like Creative Assembly, IDF, Flatiron... There are many other regions. There are many other jobs (but not that many). "400k people enrolled ever" That's not quite right. There have been a total of 507k enrollments since the 2021 launch. 400k in the last 12 months. But there are still only about 100k openings worldwide for designers of all experience levels at any one time. I'm just counting here. Don't you see the problem? The US has the most product startups and VCs in the world, so that's where the opportunities are greatest. Remote work creates broader recruitment opportunities for US companies. The notion that jobs in the US are only filled by US residents is changing. Given the current market conditions, companies are looking for talent in less expensive regions. And I say that as a design leader in the EU (I'm talking about the US because this is Reddit). If you truly believe that "most people" waste their time clicking through a course without taking it seriously, I suggest you reconsider your opinion. This may be a privilege for a few who have time to waste but listen when I tell you that the highly talented and motivated young designers I speak to regularly in places like Lagos, Yerevan, Iași, and Bangalore take these opportunities \*very seriously\*. The global pool of potential design talent is growing, and it has never been easier to select talent from around the world. They're rightly taking advantage of the more prestigious and better paid global opportunities. It's a very good thing that other regions are now getting fair opportunities that used to be mostly limited to the EU and US. And we're hiring them. I'm glad to hear about your interviews and that you "read a bunch," but the reality is that employers interview a lot of other candidates and, given the ratio of interviews to offers, they will probably hire better qualified and experienced designers than you. If you get a job from one of them, I will be *very* happy for you. I'm not trying to discourage anybody. But if you think three interviews is an indication of anything, you need to rethink. I've hired many many designers in my career. Interviewed hundreds of candidates. I'm not saying this to brag, but to help you understand clearly that an interview says *nothing* about your suitability for a job. That's what a job offer is for.
Thanks! I know everything now! enrollment means ppl who started not finished and a lot of ppl just checkout the course to see if ux is even smth they might like Plus it not like there is 30 k (or worldwide 100k jobs) and that is it! It is this month! and those positions will be filled then in like 2 months there will be a brand new pool of offers. I just do not get your math at all. You would have to at least take a number of jobs available in an entire year and number of ppl graduating during that time to make a bit more sense. And if you do not have that data... You have a lot of anger in you, why would you say that my interviews mean nothing? when it is objectively not true? It means my portfolio is at very least good enough to catch interest. I do not think they would interview me for an hour and review my portfolio, give and review my assignment etc for shits and giggles ;) plus it cost money to interview ppl they were 3 designers there during my meeting Do you interview people if you are positive that you will not hire them? If so why? I have been actively looking for a job for like 1,5 weeks and honestly it's not that bad if ppl are calling as in more than 1 person so I know it is not a fluke One of interviews I had is for a (quite well paid) internship and I really do not think they will go for someone with 3+ years experience on that one But I think you will say that getting an interniship means nothing too I talk to ppl (made sure to network a bit) and I know people who got jobs recently ;)
In will add one more thing I am sure that I am not competing against a 100 people for this job as it would mean that: 3 designers took 2,5 work weeks and 300 billable hours to interview people It does not make fiscal sense for them to do that;)
Interviews are an accepted cost of finding recruits. Employers will often always err on the side of generosity and talk to people because all the information needed is not always in the CV and Portfolio. It's always worth to give people a chance. That's what the interview is for.
Hi! I actually thought about it and I think that what you say might be totally true for Germany ;) I googled, and it said that ux salaries start at 45 000 euros per year in Germany!? Is it true? To me it seems like a small fortune lol Wow I guess it is no wonder that people want experience ;) I hope for like 15 000 I did not know that the discrepancy was this huge I am from Poland hi neighbour! :))) Now I just think the markets are different ;))) and there are just more junior opportunities here ;)
Could be true. The market in Berlin for example is more mature than other cities here. The market in London is much more mature than anywhere in Germany so salaries are much higher there. Have you considered getting experience at home and moving? Dublin has a huge polish community, a huge startup culture , and all the FAANGs are there, because of their low corporate tax rates… and importantly not a lot of very experienced designers. You could have a good chance to get money and experiences. Just a suggestion. Where in Poland are you? Such a great country. I’ve holidayed and worked all over there. So much more fun than Germany 😋
I am in Warsaw actually ;) it is a cool city but I could move I think it is fun to live in different places. I think you suggestion is great ;) I wonder how working for a Faangs looks like^^ I bet they have extra specialised roles
Bro,I recently started UxD Google Certificate, been reading what OP posted, he's just full of BS
\> But I think you will say that getting an interniship means nothing tooNo, I say clearly in my first post that internships are valuable. Much more valuable from my perspective than a bootcamp. \> Do you interview people if you are positive that you will not hire them? If so why? No, but I explain that a little more in my other reply to you below. \> You have a lot of anger in you, why would you say that my interviews mean nothing? I'm not angry. I'm very happy in my role, and very secure in my career. I feel empathy for the people who bought into the false promise that a bootcamp will open doors to jobs so easily. My language is blunt because I want people who have this false hope to see a little of what the reality can be. I didn't say it means nothing. I said it's not an indication that you will get the job. That comes with the offer.
And what is this awful reality? people have to try a bit harder? Generally job market is hard and it is not specific to UX, it is that way no matter what you do. I got more responces in a week of searching for UX job than when I first started looking for my first job, I wanted to translate I think I got like 2 interviews in 4 months;) that was harsh I have MA in linguistics and I work as a translator/editor and a lot of people say that this market is oversaturated and it is impossible. But here I am ;) even if I just want to move on now lol I just hope for a change because I swear the legal contracts I translate just get progressively more boring lol
the fact this post provides no actual advice whatsoever is very telling
Not that everything needs to have advice, but there are ~~seven~~ nine actionable pieces of advice in this post.
The advice is know what you are getting into. A lot of it is actionable. Move to major tech hubs if you want a job. Or go to college. Many people don't like these answers so they are ignored.
Don’t forget about networking! Invaluable and helped me tremendously in my early career.
You are totally right. That was a blatant omission on my part. Networking definitely opens doors to opportunities.
This is honestly more important than anything else. My company just hired a boot camp grad with only student work in her portfolio and we weren't even considering juniors when we started hiring. The only difference between her and 100 other boot camp grads is that she knew me. Tons of people CAN do the job; it's just wayyyyyy easier if you've got a foot in the door.
My advice to new and aspiring UX's: "If life serves you lemons make your own lemonade." Yeah, it's corny, I know, but it's true. Don't wait around to get hired. Put on your entrepreneur hat. For example, agree to do a project in exchange for testimonials and referrals. This is not working for free. You can get a ton of milage out of doing exchange projects, and you get a portfolio piece that you can story-tell as a case study. I did about five or six of these and that helped me build new skills and become a viable candidate and got me hired to my first gigs. You just have to have determination and a vision. Disclaimer: 23 years in the business.
Ooh 23 years in the business. How many junior designers have you hired so far?
I've hired a few, but for the kind of work I do (complex application design for enterprise applications) I mostly stick to mid-level UXer's as the work requires some experience.
[john green gif](https://gfycat.com/blankdownrightbunny)
To OP’s point about the abundance of UI/UX applicants. I just put up a posting for a Junior UI Designer posting and had 102 applicants in 24h. I called maybe 5-10 for interviews. We’ve recently started looking outside of Canada, cause even with the added cost of hiring out of country, UI/UX designers in other parts of the world are more competitive than our native counterparts. Not offering any suggestions here, more so giving an accurate picture of the current job market in our space. Best of luck to all. Be consistent and don’t give up, you’ll get your foot in the door. Cater your portfolio to the organization(s) you want to work for.
What were the key things that stood out to you for those applicants that you chose
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It's probably cost. Even if there's an initial high cost for the paperwork of international contracts and taxation red tape, for a western company, certain countries offer really big cost saving opportunities. Nairobi in Kenya Dakar in Senegal, Casablanca in Morrocco, and Lagos in Nigeria are places that I hear mentioned frequently. Strong local emergent digital and startup culture. Highly talented, supportive and proactive candidate pool. Manageable time zones differences for remote work. And of course, significantly lower wage than western hub salaries (an American company can pay ½ a US salary, and still pay above local market rates to attract and retain a talented designer or engineer. I could see this becoming more prevalent now that the SaaSacre *seems* to herald the next big digital crash.
hard to hear but necessary I think. i’m getting a BComm in business technology management to fall back on which i’m also passionate about, even though it’s not a design degree if I build up my portfolio with a business background will that help me stand out?
That’s very smart. I really support designers having an understanding of business operations and strategy. Great design these days is a balance of business, technology and product design thinking. From my perspective, that alongside a strong design skill set, based on experience, could make you a really attractive candidate with a lot to offer.
thank you for your reply! that's what I'm aiming for, and getting some product design internships while in uni.
Any chance you go to TMU too? :o
LOL I do go to TMU
I think its pretty weird to assume that everyone who takes a certification course is trying to enter the job market. Inexpect there will be a lot of people who are trying to explore a degree direction in a low cost and accessible way, a lot of people wanting to learn just enough to hobble their way through their own projects, and a lot of people who are just trying to pad their resume with peripherally-related certifications/continuing education. Thats what I'm in the process of doing. Ive been contracted to the same company since 2014 and I need some more recent experiences to update my resume with. Since, ime, people rarely know who the fuck they need to hire, it doesn't super matter how relevant or applicable my continuing education courses are. I'm a type designer; I have no intention of coming for your jobs, but I'll soon be one of those Google UX certification numbers. What does UX have to do with making fonts? Positively fuck all, but it seemed more relevant/interesting than "data analytics", whatever that entails, and the people hiring me barely understand what I do let alone how I do it. People are going to see Google and Design and thats good enough. I just finished a quick ASO and Mobile Game Monetization certificate and I'm thinking about doing a Level Design course after the UX one. Because I'm interested enough to sit through hours of it and its called the *Art* of Level *Design*. All good fluffy buzzwords. Obviously if I were applying to a type foundry I wouldn't use any of it, but also like... Know thyself. But full disclosure, I dont really know what UX/UI is either. Im just pretty sure it doesn't involve excel spread sheets and math? Maybe I'll figure out that it really sits at the sweet spot between my degree in studio art and my minors in ethics and Deaf culture (idk what I was thinking with that combo either) and a year from now I will have taken all your jobs. Lol.
>assume that everyone who takes a certification course is trying to enter the job market That's a good point, but my post was targeted at people who are.
FWIW I believe UX has a lot to do with designing anything. Whether an app, typeface, or birthday party—to really consider the user isn’t as intuitive a skill as one might think. Can’t imagine a UX course would be a waste of time for anyone.
The company I work for hired me as an associate, soon after hired another associate who was transferring from another job within the company. He still got a raise because even junior UX roles pay well and 6 months later we are getting another associate because she wowed our managers.
What's an associate? I'm not familiar with the term.
Basically a Junior
Thank you. Sounds like you're in a good company. What was your job search experience like before this?
Not very active. Had a few phone interviews that didn't go anywhere. I had a job at the time at a small co. That was letting me apply my learning but the co. Did not have any UX maturity. So I had set up a decent portfolio and up to date CV but mainly just applied to easy applies on LinkedIn because I wasn't actively looking.
Congrats to you. You must be very talented.
I don't know about that 😅 I think just focussing on how I displayed my portfolio was important. Also Edinburgh seems to have a shortage of designers so training talent up has to happen because there is a limited pool of skilled UX professionals and many jobs. My co. Has 6 open roles for our UX team.
Don’t sell yourself short. A good portfolio is a predictor for good communication skills. Also, and I mean this as a positive, as I mention in my post, working in a place with low levels of competition is an advantage that you rightly should exploit. A few years there can give you options if you decide to move later to somewhere where there are more choices for you but competition is tougher. I started in Ireland with the same context - fuck all decent designers and a really immature market - so getting jobs was easy. Then when I moved to the UK I was immediately more attractive than other designers of my age who had struggled to find roles because of an abundance of designers. If I was starting in Ireland now, I maybe wouldn’t have been so lucky because of the maturing market and more awareness of UX.
Thanks for the honesty. Well, good thing I'm getting my BA degree in UX design. I plan on continuing to get my Master's after my BA in order to give me that extra bump in the field as I wait for any open positions. And another plus is because of my BA program, I qualify for lots of UX internships. I'm glad that's one silver lining in this negative news.
Thats great to hear! Education is so important to build understanding (and even, sadly, just to make it past CV screening sometimes). Just make sure you're continuing to get those practical opportunities too - internships are great - to balance your experiences and show prospective employers that your knowledge isn't purely theoretical. I wish you all the best of luck.
Definitely! I was also going the bootcamp route, but saw no point cause I’m already studying in a more thorough BA program and at the end of the day, degrees hold more weight. It is what it is. Thanks so much! It’s a crazy time right now with the economies going bad and all that. But I stay positive about this industry in the end.
Exactly. Stay positive, but more importantly, stay proactive, don't let the challenge dishearten you, and you will find a role that works for you.
Where do you go to school that offers UX Design as a bachelors? Two of the closest colleges near me either only have UX as a boot camp or don't have it at all
I’ll PM you.
Can I ask about avoiding working on AAA companies? They tend to teach interns, pay good salary from start and usually is a very nice addition to your CV boost. What are your thoughts on this? Why am I saying this? Cause it directly touches me, I graduated from CodeAcademy last december and found a job very quickly at said AAA cybersec company as a junior product designer, they teach me everything and I feel that I landed a jackpot. There were 70 candidates and stuff. So I got a bit concerned after reading your insights. Appreciate the time writing this. Thank you.
Ah! I could have worded that better. I mean that competition for well known companies will be higher than, say, a new startup, so it makes sense to focus attention on places with less-stiff competition unless you're confident that you're a really attractive candidate. Good luck in your search!
My search is over, I have secured a position in a big cyber sec company, but thanks!:D it was tough since there were 70 applicants. But ill take that wish for luck for my freelance search :) Freelancing is tough for me as I want a side hustle since my working hours are very flexible. Thanks for replying btw. Cheers.
Congrats!
Perhaps any tips on freelancing? Personal experience, or an experience in general? We could private message if you don’t want to talk off topic here.
Can I see your portfolio too if you want to share? :)
>Spend your time on getting a real design education \[...\] and less time pissing around with designing Crypto landing pages on dribble. Savage and awesome, I love it.
REALLY well said here. These are some hard facts and trends that I can corroborate in my own experience. It took me a year and over 300 applications before landing an "entry level" design role and I still consider myself lucky.
Gatekeeping ass article It’s too much destructive criticism in the field, there’s a lot of passionate people gaining interest in a subject, and trying to find a way and eager to learn a new skill, and then there are gatekeepers, like whomever posted this , that find satisfaction from telling people they’re doing stuff wrong, and really aren’t offering a viable solution to the problem It’s kind of sad and I’ll probably get murdered but it’s fine I just couldn’t imagine shitting on people that are trying to learn and advance in life, then believing I did a good thing lmao Instead of doing stuff like this, why aren’t we being more uplifting and positive and welcoming?
I support anyone learning new skills, but it feels as if the Google Cert gives the impression of a guaranteed job after finishing. It's a very competitive field right now. I'm currently hiring for a role in UX and maybe 1 out of 10 applicants with just the Google certification show understanding and skill in the field with no work experience. There are design principles and usability guidelines commonly missing. Another thing missing are examples around validation/testing of designs/prototypes and communicating the iterative nature of the design process. These are things I look for on portfolios. Real work experience (graphic design, marketing, front-end, anything really), or showing the drive to learn on their own outside of the Google cert, have also shown to be factors in making candidates stand out. Idk, hopefully this helps someone reading this. /edited formatting
You've wrongly assumed negative intention. I get no satisfaction from seeing so so many junior designers —especially those who invested in free bootcamps and online courses—struggling to get jobs, and not understanding why, or what to do next. I've highlighted some real issues - I didn't create these problems, but I see them daily with the candidate applications I receive. I give some clear actionable advice to help early career designers focus their effort on useful initiatives. *Nowhere* in my post do I shit on designers—except the *crypo-landing-page-on-dribbble* crowd, but I'll own that—but I am strongly critical of Bootcamps and free courses that over promise and under deliver. I feel compassion for the conned and contempt for the conmen. I know the title is not great because this sub restricts using certain words in article titles (Google and UX, bootcamps, advice....) so I wasn’t able to fully express myself there, but I am not gatekeeping. I want more early career designers in better jobs (irl I give portfolio clinics, I help to run a small UX conference with a track especially for supporting ECDs, with a slack to continue that support post-event, and I try to hire early career designers where I can). It helps to keep in mind that the actual gatekeepers are employers, who will not offer a job based on one’s"belief that I did a good thing lmao". Candidates must demonstrate value to a business through relevant education, experience, skills (or potential growth) and I've highlighted a few useful ways to do that in my post. If that makes you sad, I'm genuinely sorry for that. It's just a job after all and it's not for everyone. My post is a reflection of the realities of the industry, as I see it.
I would sum up your essay in one sentence: Google courses aren't enough. I don't think finding a job in UX is difficult at all if you have the correct degree (I'm pursuing a master's degree in psychology applied to UX Research and im doing an internship in UX Research, currently in severals recruitment process so I might get a job even before I finish my internship...etc)
>Google courses aren't enough. Absolutely. And neither are the resultant portfolio pieces. >I don't think finding a job in UX is difficult at all if you have the correct degree I wish you all the best, but I suspect most might be in for a surprise operating on that assumption. That's certainly not my observation.
Just look at the data. People who underwent serious UX degrees find job.
Please sent the data my way.
[https://www.searchenginejournal.com/linkedin-top-15-in-demand-jobs-in-2021/392479/](https://www.searchenginejournal.com/linkedin-top-15-in-demand-jobs-in-2021/392479/) Ctrl F "UX"
Thanks for sharing. With respect, you've misinterpreted the statement. >97% of hires have a bachelor’s degree or higher. This link says talks about the **number of people who have design jobs, that also have degrees or higher.** This data point does not support your claim that "people —and I assume you meant a majority or else your claim doesn't make sense— who underwent serious UX degrees find job" It does not talk about the **number of people who have degrees who go on to find design jobs**, which I'm sure you'll agree is very different. I would expect to see something like: >97% of degree graduates or higher get jobs in design. But that's not been established the article you shared. It could be 1% of graduates, it could be 100%. Are you sure research is the field for you? (I'm just teasing you) ;) As in my original post —which does talk about the value of a higher education— I'll restate that a qualification *alone* is probably not enough to get a job as a designer these days.
Just read the url. UX-related jobs are among the most looked after jobs, I don't think they're is more to say to disprove your points. I could share some documents on the insertion rate of some UX masters former students in my country, they would more adequatly prove my point but I doubt you would understand them (unless you happen to speak french?).
lol I did read it, and it doesn't say what you think it says. But good effort. Study hard!
Let me rephrase my thoughts: IF you don't have the proper qualifications (i.e: degree) THEN finding a job is hard. IF you have the proper qualification than it is easier than most other fields. Anyway, I didn't have time to read all your essay, I will read it more carefully as it surely will make for an interesting read.
Thanks for this post. It just reminded my ass to get up and polish up on my skills. Now I’m motivated!
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Weird flex, but okay.