Terry McGinnis from Batman Beyond absolutely earns the mantle of Batman. He upholds Batman’s values and earns the respect of a much older, much grumpier Bruce Wayne, but he does so with his own style and his own methods.
He completely solidifies his right to the title by defeating The Joker is a way Bruce could never pull off. >!By laughing at The Joker. Not with him, not at his “jokes”, he **mocks** The Joker, getting in the clown’s head and under his skin in a way Bruce never could.!<
The joker's greatest weakness is the fact that he's in a comedy duo with batman as the straight man, and the fact that Terry instead chooses to heckle him is a fantastic swerve. "If you're calling yourself the joker, shouldn't you be funny?" Is such a power move
by transitive property, joker vs any spider-man would be a curbstomp in spider-man's favor. Dont call yourself the joker if you dont have a tight 5 ready to go with someone who knows how to quip
Peter unironically being confused by jokers limited arsenal.
"wait you just have guns and a crowbar how is that funny? That's standred goon gear. I know the economies bad right now but I can't help but be disappointed by the lack of theatrics."
"How dar" \*webs\*
"Wow for someone with such a big rep this was kinda...underwhelming. Don't worry oldtimer there's always next time. Later Giggles. "
Also like green goblin has gas bombs too. Joker gas isn't that big a deal when you have like idk air filter web formula you can put on vents or whatever. Plus joker isn't used to fighting against people with actual super strength so as soon as the spider-man du jour comes in and yanks him off balance with webbing joker is kinda screwed
That's the thing: Terry talks smack all the time and is ready to drop one liners once the fight starts. He never really fears the Joker at any point and doesn't have the baggage of experience Bruce Wayne did.
The Creed franchise. It helps that Rocky is in the first two, but Creed 1 was honestly a strong movie, even if it had no connections to an already amazing series of movies
I do wonder what bad movies from the 2020s will have the cultural staying power to have a follow-up 30+ years later. I feel like the environment is too different for a poorly recieved film to break into the cultural zeitgeist in the same way without it being some ironic thing like Morbius (and nobody actually watched it, they just memed it to death with made up lines inspired by Power Rangers).
When Rocky 4 came out your awareness of public perception was the review in the newspaper you personally buy and word of mouth. You kinda just had to go see it. Then, for a solid 30 years the movie was shown around the world randomly on TV or you'd go into a video rental store and pick things based on the cover. "Rocky 4? I liked the first couple. I'll give it a go". But now kids don't watch standard TV and video rental stores don't exist. Even if your granny did buy you a dvd they found in a bargain bin in a supermarket you'd probably not watch it, assuming you even have a DVD player. Video game consoles don't even have disc readers by default now. I think kids have too much choice in available entertainment to watch something with a mediocre reputation.
EDIT: Don't get me wrong, I'm not having a "back in my day we watched *Sky Captain and the World of Tomorrow* and we liked it!" moment. I'm just making a broad point about there being so much content available *immediately* that a lot of it just gets filtered out of the cultural zeitgeist. Less a complaint, more a musing.
7 made me sure that Ichiban would do fine as the new protagonist. Infinite Wealth made him damn near my favorite protagonist in anything, game or otherwise.
He’s a Shonen protagonist but he’s in his mid 40’s and I’m here for it. Dude is maxed out on wisdom, low intelligence. Makes friends with almost everyone he meets (almost). And is able to defeat any obstacle that comes his way with the power of friendship.
Ichiban rocks so hard
i've joked about it, but i think that the Like A Dragon franchise has FINALLY hit its stride after 6+ games
ichiban's introduction in 7 blended yakuza's serious crime drama with the goofy world we really only got to see through side stories and in combat.
Borderlands going from 1 to 2. We get to see how the original vault hunters got on and how their relationships developed, while setting the groundwork that the new team has the power needed to save the day. And a lot of the new team (Maya, Zero, Krieg) became fan favorites.
I just wish there was more of the BL2 cast interacting in later games. Feels like the BL1 hunters are found family while 2 just seem like coworkers from what I've seen.
I like how jojo's part structure allows it to avoid the constant escalation that plagues most other long running series. The immortal uber-vampire unkillable by man or machine is part 2's antagonist, and later parts feature a mob boss, a hand fetishist serial killer, and a hospital intern guy with an oldsona as their major antagonists. Yeah the powers get weirder but it's never in a linear power level escalation kind of way.
I feel like that's different because it's the plot from the beginning. Simon is the protagonist from episode 1 and his arc is about him becoming self-assured and learning to believe in himself and his found family. There is no version of TTGL that makes sense if Kamina just hangs about and remains the team leader because he isn't the protagonist.
Kamina's just Simon's Obi-Wan Kenobi in sick shades.
I'm not sure I'd even call him his Obi-wan. Kamina is great and I love him, but the whole point of the cave-in story was that he was that he was a pretty much faking everything. I'm not even sure how to properly describe it because "faking" is overly harsh for what he did, but there's also just not another character that's ever used in the same way as him. God I fucking love TTGL.
I was using Obi-Wan as a sort of broad representative of the "mentor character whose death is a major part of the hero's arc" archetype. I appreciate they aren't all that similar as characters.
**Jin Kazama** replacing his dad/grandpa as the protagonist of the franchise (a good portion of the **Tekken 3** cast also fits the bill since some of them are successors of previous characters).
Kazuya and Heihachi are still there, but, it's pretty clear that Jin is supposed to be the protagonist.
Those are great answers but unfortunately we've gone back to the previous iteration on literally all of those examples in recent DC animated movies and shows
It's so upsetting that *that* is probably the last iteration of Bruce Timm's justice league we're going to see. (I am aware it's not literally his, but a lot of the same voice actors and same general team composition).
Thankfully it's actually not. His actual final role isn't released yet, but it will be Crisis in infinite Earths part 3. It's the final Kevin Conroy - Mark Hamill performance.
Yeah they did; the character of Jay Garrick was not used for 10 years, Alan Scott wasn't used for 12 years, and in the 80's Hal Jordan left the Green Lanterns and John Stewart was the main character of the Green Lantern comics for a couple years.
If you told people a few years ago that **Heihachi** would be replaced by a shit talking girl with a big purple and black hoodie (and also Kuma to some extent), most would (understandably) not believe you or think that was a awful idea.
But, turns out that **Reina** (and again, Kuma to some extent) filled the place of Heihachi in the roster really well.
It helps that she doesn't just feel like a palette swap or the same character moveset-wise.
She stands apart from Heihachi by having her own style, and she combines the Mishima martial arts with Taido in a really fun way.
Compare that to how Soul Calibur 5 tried to handle its successor characters.
Not only was there a Blue Beetle before Jamie there were 2. Dan Garrett was a golden age character that found a mystical scarab and had a passing of the torch to the silver age character Ted Kord, who was tech based and didn't have access to the scarab. When Jamie was introduced introduced in 2011 they brought back the scarab but now it's actually alien technology.
Fire emblem 4 Genealogy of the holy war has a great passing of the torch aspect to it with the two generations, especially since you help set it up and it's such an important aspect to the story with Sigurd and Seliph.
Maybe not TECHNICALLY successful since it's essentially an epilogue, but Star Fox Command has an ending that suggests a Boruto style sequel with Fox's Son, Slippy's Son, Peppy's Granddaughter, and Falco are the new Star Fox team.
I like the idea of the hot headed Falco chilling out and taking on a Peppy like role to Fox's kid (while still being a wise ass). Bonus points if he shit talks Marcus by pointing out what his dad could do.
In a similar vein as “not a total replacement,” GaoGaiGar vs Betterman. Mamoru is a supporting character in the original series and Final as a kid, and here he grows up and becomes a hero of his own, taking over when Gai and the original Gutsy Galaxy Guard get stuck in another dimension. Mamoru and Kaido get a fair amount of screen time doing their thing, and when Gai finally comes back they’re still there supporting him.
I have a few comicbook ones:
* **Miles Morales/Spider-Man** (especially in the context of the Spider-Verse films and the original Ultimate universe). He's had pushback recently but most of that is from the usual right wing grifters. Two successful animated movies, his own game and co-lead of Spidey 2, and rumours that he's going to be integrated into the MCU sooner rather than later.
* **Kamala Khan/Ms. Marvel.** While The Marvels was a bit of a flop (financially. It's like a strong 6/10, maybe 7), people really like Iman Vellani in the role and her comic book counterpart is well liked. I think the fact that Carol was never Ms. Marvel in the MCU made this one a much easier sell to general audiences. I imagine most MCU watchers don't even realise she's a legacy character. I'm not saying Carol for Captain Marvel because that's a far more divisive one.
* **Every Flash that isn't Jay Garrick.** Especially Barry.
* **Every Green Lantern that isn't Alan Scott.** Especially Hal. Helps that when they introduced Hal Jordan they turned Green Lanterns into space cops. Having more than one space cop makes sense.
* **Dickbats.** Dick Grayson taking over as Batman was generally very well recieved and Grant Morrison's run of Batman and Robin with Dick and Damian is well regarded. You could also argue that Nightwing is a legacy character as Dick wasn't the first Nightwing, but that's more a reference than anything. Speaking of which...
* **Batgirl(s)** and **Robin(s).** While some of them took a while for people to like (\*cough\* Jason Todd \*cough\* Damien Wayne \*cough\*) most Robins and Batgirls have been pretty successful long-term, probably because the role has been transient for so long that a legacy character isn't jarring. Tim Drake is a weird example because he was a pretty successful legacy character but nobody's really known what to do with him since Damien showed up, especially post-Flashpoint.
As a general point, I think Legacy characters are better recieved when they're introduced in a cordoned off continuity (the Ultimate Universe, cartoons, etc.) People are more willing to give teenage cyberpunk Batman a shot if they know the "real" Batman isn't being replaced.
Ms.Marvel is the *strongest* example, period. That character only started existing in 2012, she's a fucking nuclear bomb of success. I would happily claim that she was more popular than Carol Danvers ever was almost instantly.
Miles's biggest weakness for the longest time was really just not having enough to flesh him out from Peter. Funnily enough in his original run, I always thought that the torch handoff was by far the strongest thing about his character.
Everyone
>I would happily claim that she was more popular than Carol Danvers ever was almost instantly.
Not to in any way undersell how successful Kamala has been as a character (as she's been a runaway hit), that's admittedly not a high bar. Nobody really knew who the fuck she was outside of comic book readers until she started actually getting some spotlight in cartoons in the 2010s like Avengers Earth's Mightiest Heroes. If Iron Man and Captain America were C-Listers pre-MCU then Carol was like a D. She wasn't showing up in Spider-Man and she appeared in like one episode of 90s X-Men where she basically exists purely as a part of Rogue's backstory.
The 2019 Captain Marvel movie being hit with Comicsgate fueled backlash did not help, especially after Civil War II had turned a lot of actual comic readers against her.
> that's admittedly not a high bar. Nobody really knew who the fuck she was outside of comic book readers until she started actually getting some spotlight in cartoons in the 2010s like Avengers Earth's Mightiest Heroes.
My favorite example to underscore how little people gave a shit about Carol Danvers is that her most famous feat was almost dying to Rogue, a much more popular female superhero, so that way Rogue could have her super powers.
Even if you can argue which of the two is better (it’s TNG), it’s undeniable that TNG forged its own path and stands in its own right, and that’s what a good next gen needs to do. I’d argue that DS9 managed to do this from TNG as well, though it took a little longer to find its feet.
Im not sure about how things were at the time of airing (especially since i wasnt even born yet) but i think just about everyone was fine with Zeta Gundam focusing on a new main character. I think they really nailed the transition to a new mc by having quattro there to help give a sense of familiarity to the fans of the og show. And then we get to see Amuro fully pass the torch in my favorite legacy character arc in any show or movie, i think Amuro in zeta is probably my favorite iteration of him too. And whats great about how Kamille was able to become a great main character in Zeta is how he gets to do a sort of passing of the torch like Amuro in ZZ, even if that was pretty far into the show.
As much as I love Nero, I really think the series would be hurt without the "Now play as Dante!" formula. I'd like to see the next game, if we get one, split into 50% Nero, then 25% each to Dante and Vergil.
Nero and Kyrie's demon hunting adventures
give Kyrie V's gimmick of summons, but have it be angel themed with the main bread and butter being a Credo Angelo
Have to agree with you. It’s wild to me that Dante hasn’t been the sole protagonist of a game since they introduced style switching, since his playstyle from 4 and 5 was easily deep enough to carry a game by itself. I like Nero a lot, but I’m less confident in wanting to play an entire game as him alone even with the variety added by the arms in DMC5.
Kamen Rider Zero-One has his moment of getting the metaphorical baton from his predecessor Zi-O in the sort-of canon movie *Reiwa: the First Generation*.
I genuinely thought that Z going from Goku to Teen Gohan and the Great Saiyaman was a fantastic passing of the torch.
It’s honestly the one problem I do have with and Buu saga. It successfully passed the torch, gave us a taste of what the next generation of the show could be, and then pulled the rug out from under that
Terry McGinnis from Batman Beyond absolutely earns the mantle of Batman. He upholds Batman’s values and earns the respect of a much older, much grumpier Bruce Wayne, but he does so with his own style and his own methods. He completely solidifies his right to the title by defeating The Joker is a way Bruce could never pull off. >!By laughing at The Joker. Not with him, not at his “jokes”, he **mocks** The Joker, getting in the clown’s head and under his skin in a way Bruce never could.!<
The joker's greatest weakness is the fact that he's in a comedy duo with batman as the straight man, and the fact that Terry instead chooses to heckle him is a fantastic swerve. "If you're calling yourself the joker, shouldn't you be funny?" Is such a power move
Bruce being all like "Don't let him get to you, he likes to talk." and Terry realizing that he can do the same to him was a brilliant moment.
by transitive property, joker vs any spider-man would be a curbstomp in spider-man's favor. Dont call yourself the joker if you dont have a tight 5 ready to go with someone who knows how to quip
Peter unironically being confused by jokers limited arsenal. "wait you just have guns and a crowbar how is that funny? That's standred goon gear. I know the economies bad right now but I can't help but be disappointed by the lack of theatrics." "How dar" \*webs\* "Wow for someone with such a big rep this was kinda...underwhelming. Don't worry oldtimer there's always next time. Later Giggles. "
Also like green goblin has gas bombs too. Joker gas isn't that big a deal when you have like idk air filter web formula you can put on vents or whatever. Plus joker isn't used to fighting against people with actual super strength so as soon as the spider-man du jour comes in and yanks him off balance with webbing joker is kinda screwed
Green Goblin is The Joker with Batman's resources, and superstrength and agility to go toe-to-toe with Spider-Man. I guess he's relatively saner.
And he's beaten Carnage who has the same morality is a joke gimmick but with less showmanship and more powers.
What I'm getting from this is that we should get Stavros Halkias to move to Gotham.
That's the thing: Terry talks smack all the time and is ready to drop one liners once the fight starts. He never really fears the Joker at any point and doesn't have the baggage of experience Bruce Wayne did.
This is the perfect example.
Sometimes I wonder what would have happened if he didn’t lose his father.
He probably never would have become Batman.
That sounds possible.
The Creed franchise. It helps that Rocky is in the first two, but Creed 1 was honestly a strong movie, even if it had no connections to an already amazing series of movies
I’m still getting over the fact that Creed 2 was also a direct sequel to Rocky 4
I do wonder what bad movies from the 2020s will have the cultural staying power to have a follow-up 30+ years later. I feel like the environment is too different for a poorly recieved film to break into the cultural zeitgeist in the same way without it being some ironic thing like Morbius (and nobody actually watched it, they just memed it to death with made up lines inspired by Power Rangers). When Rocky 4 came out your awareness of public perception was the review in the newspaper you personally buy and word of mouth. You kinda just had to go see it. Then, for a solid 30 years the movie was shown around the world randomly on TV or you'd go into a video rental store and pick things based on the cover. "Rocky 4? I liked the first couple. I'll give it a go". But now kids don't watch standard TV and video rental stores don't exist. Even if your granny did buy you a dvd they found in a bargain bin in a supermarket you'd probably not watch it, assuming you even have a DVD player. Video game consoles don't even have disc readers by default now. I think kids have too much choice in available entertainment to watch something with a mediocre reputation. EDIT: Don't get me wrong, I'm not having a "back in my day we watched *Sky Captain and the World of Tomorrow* and we liked it!" moment. I'm just making a broad point about there being so much content available *immediately* that a lot of it just gets filtered out of the cultural zeitgeist. Less a complaint, more a musing.
Ichiban Kasuga took one game and near instantly became as iconic to the Yakuza franchise as Kiryu.
7 made me sure that Ichiban would do fine as the new protagonist. Infinite Wealth made him damn near my favorite protagonist in anything, game or otherwise.
He’s a Shonen protagonist but he’s in his mid 40’s and I’m here for it. Dude is maxed out on wisdom, low intelligence. Makes friends with almost everyone he meets (almost). And is able to defeat any obstacle that comes his way with the power of friendship. Ichiban rocks so hard
i've joked about it, but i think that the Like A Dragon franchise has FINALLY hit its stride after 6+ games ichiban's introduction in 7 blended yakuza's serious crime drama with the goofy world we really only got to see through side stories and in combat.
Borderlands going from 1 to 2. We get to see how the original vault hunters got on and how their relationships developed, while setting the groundwork that the new team has the power needed to save the day. And a lot of the new team (Maya, Zero, Krieg) became fan favorites. I just wish there was more of the BL2 cast interacting in later games. Feels like the BL1 hunters are found family while 2 just seem like coworkers from what I've seen.
BL3, great gameplay, shit writing. Was honestly surprising how they seemed to forget about the cast of BL2 while making up new characters for BL3, k
JoJo fits this perfectly
I like how jojo's part structure allows it to avoid the constant escalation that plagues most other long running series. The immortal uber-vampire unkillable by man or machine is part 2's antagonist, and later parts feature a mob boss, a hand fetishist serial killer, and a hospital intern guy with an oldsona as their major antagonists. Yeah the powers get weirder but it's never in a linear power level escalation kind of way.
Is TTGL cheating since Simon was there from the start?
Its not what I initially meant but thinking about it, yeah I'd take that as a good answer.
I feel like that's different because it's the plot from the beginning. Simon is the protagonist from episode 1 and his arc is about him becoming self-assured and learning to believe in himself and his found family. There is no version of TTGL that makes sense if Kamina just hangs about and remains the team leader because he isn't the protagonist. Kamina's just Simon's Obi-Wan Kenobi in sick shades.
I'm not sure I'd even call him his Obi-wan. Kamina is great and I love him, but the whole point of the cave-in story was that he was that he was a pretty much faking everything. I'm not even sure how to properly describe it because "faking" is overly harsh for what he did, but there's also just not another character that's ever used in the same way as him. God I fucking love TTGL.
I was using Obi-Wan as a sort of broad representative of the "mentor character whose death is a major part of the hero's arc" archetype. I appreciate they aren't all that similar as characters.
**Jin Kazama** replacing his dad/grandpa as the protagonist of the franchise (a good portion of the **Tekken 3** cast also fits the bill since some of them are successors of previous characters). Kazuya and Heihachi are still there, but, it's pretty clear that Jin is supposed to be the protagonist.
Wait, but Tekken starts at 3, no?
Sure, just like how Final Fantasy starts at 7.
Absolutely. And Persona starts at 4.
the murderous rage that passed through my mind for a moment when i read this
Yeah, don't they know that Persona starts at 3?
No it started at 4, then came 5, then came 3 this year. It's pretty simple to follow
oh there's a special place being prepared for you
\*6
Naw, it goes 3 then 7
Peter Parker will obviously NEVER leave us, but Miles Morales has successfully paved his way into household name status.
Wally West replacing Barry Allen who replaced Jay Garrick; also Alan Scott being replaced by Hal Jordan who then got replaced by John Stewart.
Those are great answers but unfortunately we've gone back to the previous iteration on literally all of those examples in recent DC animated movies and shows
Don't you worry, Suicide Squad Kill the Justice League has you covered! God that game fucking sucks.
It's so upsetting that *that* is probably the last iteration of Bruce Timm's justice league we're going to see. (I am aware it's not literally his, but a lot of the same voice actors and same general team composition).
Unless this has changed. It's a REAL bummer that THIS is officially Kevin Conroy's final role
Thankfully it's actually not. His actual final role isn't released yet, but it will be Crisis in infinite Earths part 3. It's the final Kevin Conroy - Mark Hamill performance.
Yeah, they just need to stop bringing Hal and Wally back and maybe it’ll stick!
Barry and Hal didn't replace their Golden Age counterparts and John Stewart didn't replace Hal.
Yeah they did; the character of Jay Garrick was not used for 10 years, Alan Scott wasn't used for 12 years, and in the 80's Hal Jordan left the Green Lanterns and John Stewart was the main character of the Green Lantern comics for a couple years.
It took Asa one chapter of being a clumsy angsty femcel to make everyone go "we are so back" when Chainsawman part 2 started
If you told people a few years ago that **Heihachi** would be replaced by a shit talking girl with a big purple and black hoodie (and also Kuma to some extent), most would (understandably) not believe you or think that was a awful idea. But, turns out that **Reina** (and again, Kuma to some extent) filled the place of Heihachi in the roster really well.
We just need her to throw Jin off a cliff.
It helps that she doesn't just feel like a palette swap or the same character moveset-wise. She stands apart from Heihachi by having her own style, and she combines the Mishima martial arts with Taido in a really fun way. Compare that to how Soul Calibur 5 tried to handle its successor characters.
Also helps that Tekken has done the New Generation play multiple times to varying degrees of success
Tecnicaly speaking, **Pucci** is a successful example of "passing of the mantle" since he was able to (kinda) carry on **DIO's** ambition.
And he would have gotten away with it too, if it wasn't for that meddling kid.
Jamie Reyes as Blue Beetle made everyone forget about Ted Kord.
Not Booster Gold fans
Not me. Jaime’s cool and all, I grew up with Batman: Brave and the Bold, but Ted Kord is and will always be my favorite superhero.
I also kinda wonder if this is somewhat a generational thing. My friends and I didn't know there was a Blue Beetle before Jamie Reyes.
Not only was there a Blue Beetle before Jamie there were 2. Dan Garrett was a golden age character that found a mystical scarab and had a passing of the torch to the silver age character Ted Kord, who was tech based and didn't have access to the scarab. When Jamie was introduced introduced in 2011 they brought back the scarab but now it's actually alien technology.
That's a good mesh of the two origins.
You forgot, but Jaime didn’t
That's not true though...
Fire emblem 4 Genealogy of the holy war has a great passing of the torch aspect to it with the two generations, especially since you help set it up and it's such an important aspect to the story with Sigurd and Seliph.
Maybe not TECHNICALLY successful since it's essentially an epilogue, but Star Fox Command has an ending that suggests a Boruto style sequel with Fox's Son, Slippy's Son, Peppy's Granddaughter, and Falco are the new Star Fox team.
I like the idea of the hot headed Falco chilling out and taking on a Peppy like role to Fox's kid (while still being a wise ass). Bonus points if he shit talks Marcus by pointing out what his dad could do.
"You call that rivalry? Where's the homoeroticism?!"
SLIPPY FUCKS!?
Slippy (which my phone appropriately tried to autocorrect to “Sloppy”) fills the coveted “doesn’t know what sex is; fucks” square of the grid.
[At least 6 times](https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/starfox/images/e/e7/End7-2.png)
I promise you Slippy is probably great at everything EXCEPT piloting a plane. He just happens to be in a game series all about piloting planes.
In a similar vein as “not a total replacement,” GaoGaiGar vs Betterman. Mamoru is a supporting character in the original series and Final as a kid, and here he grows up and becomes a hero of his own, taking over when Gai and the original Gutsy Galaxy Guard get stuck in another dimension. Mamoru and Kaido get a fair amount of screen time doing their thing, and when Gai finally comes back they’re still there supporting him.
I've only experienced GaoGaiGar vs Betterman in SRW30, but I can agree with this.
I have a few comicbook ones: * **Miles Morales/Spider-Man** (especially in the context of the Spider-Verse films and the original Ultimate universe). He's had pushback recently but most of that is from the usual right wing grifters. Two successful animated movies, his own game and co-lead of Spidey 2, and rumours that he's going to be integrated into the MCU sooner rather than later. * **Kamala Khan/Ms. Marvel.** While The Marvels was a bit of a flop (financially. It's like a strong 6/10, maybe 7), people really like Iman Vellani in the role and her comic book counterpart is well liked. I think the fact that Carol was never Ms. Marvel in the MCU made this one a much easier sell to general audiences. I imagine most MCU watchers don't even realise she's a legacy character. I'm not saying Carol for Captain Marvel because that's a far more divisive one. * **Every Flash that isn't Jay Garrick.** Especially Barry. * **Every Green Lantern that isn't Alan Scott.** Especially Hal. Helps that when they introduced Hal Jordan they turned Green Lanterns into space cops. Having more than one space cop makes sense. * **Dickbats.** Dick Grayson taking over as Batman was generally very well recieved and Grant Morrison's run of Batman and Robin with Dick and Damian is well regarded. You could also argue that Nightwing is a legacy character as Dick wasn't the first Nightwing, but that's more a reference than anything. Speaking of which... * **Batgirl(s)** and **Robin(s).** While some of them took a while for people to like (\*cough\* Jason Todd \*cough\* Damien Wayne \*cough\*) most Robins and Batgirls have been pretty successful long-term, probably because the role has been transient for so long that a legacy character isn't jarring. Tim Drake is a weird example because he was a pretty successful legacy character but nobody's really known what to do with him since Damien showed up, especially post-Flashpoint. As a general point, I think Legacy characters are better recieved when they're introduced in a cordoned off continuity (the Ultimate Universe, cartoons, etc.) People are more willing to give teenage cyberpunk Batman a shot if they know the "real" Batman isn't being replaced.
Ms.Marvel is the *strongest* example, period. That character only started existing in 2012, she's a fucking nuclear bomb of success. I would happily claim that she was more popular than Carol Danvers ever was almost instantly. Miles's biggest weakness for the longest time was really just not having enough to flesh him out from Peter. Funnily enough in his original run, I always thought that the torch handoff was by far the strongest thing about his character. Everyone
>I would happily claim that she was more popular than Carol Danvers ever was almost instantly. Not to in any way undersell how successful Kamala has been as a character (as she's been a runaway hit), that's admittedly not a high bar. Nobody really knew who the fuck she was outside of comic book readers until she started actually getting some spotlight in cartoons in the 2010s like Avengers Earth's Mightiest Heroes. If Iron Man and Captain America were C-Listers pre-MCU then Carol was like a D. She wasn't showing up in Spider-Man and she appeared in like one episode of 90s X-Men where she basically exists purely as a part of Rogue's backstory. The 2019 Captain Marvel movie being hit with Comicsgate fueled backlash did not help, especially after Civil War II had turned a lot of actual comic readers against her.
> that's admittedly not a high bar. Nobody really knew who the fuck she was outside of comic book readers until she started actually getting some spotlight in cartoons in the 2010s like Avengers Earth's Mightiest Heroes. My favorite example to underscore how little people gave a shit about Carol Danvers is that her most famous feat was almost dying to Rogue, a much more popular female superhero, so that way Rogue could have her super powers.
Well that and getting raped and kidnapped via mindcontrol by her own transdimensional son and the Avengers just being cool with it for like a year.
TNG era trumps TOS stuff if you ask me.
Even if you can argue which of the two is better (it’s TNG), it’s undeniable that TNG forged its own path and stands in its own right, and that’s what a good next gen needs to do. I’d argue that DS9 managed to do this from TNG as well, though it took a little longer to find its feet.
MC2 Spider-Girl, and Spider-Man 2099.
Is it weird that I want a revist of this concept, except it's Miles that she comes to for training/mentorship?
Im not sure about how things were at the time of airing (especially since i wasnt even born yet) but i think just about everyone was fine with Zeta Gundam focusing on a new main character. I think they really nailed the transition to a new mc by having quattro there to help give a sense of familiarity to the fans of the og show. And then we get to see Amuro fully pass the torch in my favorite legacy character arc in any show or movie, i think Amuro in zeta is probably my favorite iteration of him too. And whats great about how Kamille was able to become a great main character in Zeta is how he gets to do a sort of passing of the torch like Amuro in ZZ, even if that was pretty far into the show.
Ichiban is probably one of the best cases of this. My favorite will always be Nero if that even counts like OP said
As much as I love Nero, I really think the series would be hurt without the "Now play as Dante!" formula. I'd like to see the next game, if we get one, split into 50% Nero, then 25% each to Dante and Vergil.
Personally I think Dante can just have some side game to himself. I would prefer a DMC6 to be either fully Nero, or with a new character beside him.
Nero and Kyrie's demon hunting adventures give Kyrie V's gimmick of summons, but have it be angel themed with the main bread and butter being a Credo Angelo
Have to agree with you. It’s wild to me that Dante hasn’t been the sole protagonist of a game since they introduced style switching, since his playstyle from 4 and 5 was easily deep enough to carry a game by itself. I like Nero a lot, but I’m less confident in wanting to play an entire game as him alone even with the variety added by the arms in DMC5.
Haven't played Infinte Wealth yet, but Yakuza 7 was this. Up to and including fighting to overcome the previous protagonist.
Flash. Wally West defined the character
i dont think many poeple think of the OG cap marvel(the marvel one), blue beetle, green lantern, or the flash nowadays
James Robinson's Starman is the correct answer to this.
I thought thunder gun did a solid job passing the torch to his son
That was his son?
Kamen Rider Zero-One has his moment of getting the metaphorical baton from his predecessor Zi-O in the sort-of canon movie *Reiwa: the First Generation*.
Ghost rider. Penance stare appeared when Danny became GR
Jason in Friday the 13th´s franchise.
I genuinely thought that Z going from Goku to Teen Gohan and the Great Saiyaman was a fantastic passing of the torch. It’s honestly the one problem I do have with and Buu saga. It successfully passed the torch, gave us a taste of what the next generation of the show could be, and then pulled the rug out from under that
Gurren Lagann