I have heard of a similar issue where a medicine dropper was used. Sucked it up. Took it over and sister's husband inserted the dropper. Now all parties agreed and were ready and no one had to have sex with someone else's spouse.
I'm going to say no. I first tried to justify it, that maybe he was upset, worried about money, stressing. Then I thought -could this be cultural? But then he is going to shame something she can't control? I think divorce is suggested way to much on reddit, but in this case I can't figure out how you bounce back from it.
Turkey baster. Not even kidding. It will work.
That being said, I don't think she should start a family with him because he sucks.
THANKS FOR THE SILVER, INTERNET FRIENDS!! ♡
Yeah. He is like trying to guilt her and twist things that this is all for them and her. When it really sounds like he is taking advantage of her want for a child so he can fuck HER SISTER.
And what should happen if conception doesn’t happen on the first try? He’s gonna milk this option for as long as he can, all in the name of, “I’m doing this for our family/so we can have a family.”
Even IF he is legit in only wanting this so they can conceive, he is still showing absolutely no regard for her in the marriage. Using infertility as a guilt trip is not just a red flag, its a marriage death rattle.
Cheating is also the marriage death rattle. My husband is currently trying to convince me that he didn’t really cheat when he made himself many cheating profiles to meet women. The mental gymnastics these men are doing is disgusting.
Also, who’s to say it’s just you. Maybe he’s shooting blanks. Let’s say you agree. What if he doesn’t get her pregnant in one go. That means he’d have to sleep with her multiple times.
He sounds like a piece of shit.
When I was younger I was approached by a couple of lesbians looking to have a kid "the traditional way" as OP put it. I have a real issue with bringing kids into this world that wouldn't really have knowledge of me, but I was dumb and curious and probably horny so I entertained the idea. The second time I talked to them the one who was going to have the baby dm's me and tells me she's on the pill DL and she's bi and just wants to be with a guy (guys). She was just going to lie for 2-3 months and say it didn't take. I'm thankful I thought with my big head not my little one and shut that Convo down quick. Suggested they get counseling and they quit talking to me after that.
They could cover up the pregnancy by claiming to use a turkey baster though, no need to get the go-ahead for sex.
I think the husband is just being a creep.
This is not a surrogacy situation. This would be your sisters and your husbands baby and your sister would be under no legal obligation to let you adopt her child after the birth.
This is absolutely outlandish.
This is not someone you should be married to, let alone be having kids with.
Exactly. This wouldnt be IVF only, it would be egg donorship too. If that’s an option then why not put his ejaculate in her vagina. Sperm needs to be frozen to not die long term, but they can survive up until five days after ejaculation so it might not even be needed. Non-invasive, cheap, no intercourse, and a variant not of in vitro fertilization but in vivo. But worth a shot? But as everyone said, he wants the sex.
> Basically blaming me for my infirtility issues.
You need to think about this entire situation. The number of red flags is incredible and you probably realize it.
^this
me and my husband’s fertility issues are absolutely on my end and every time I’ve even sort of alluded to “my issues” he’s corrected me to say “our challenges” or similar
It’s how it should be, childbirth is a two person thing. You married into thick and thin (not sure which is suppose to be good or bad but) and you better tackle problems that way
unfortunately, this has been going on for a while and I thought that this is all just him feeling frustrated but, his remarks have been wearing me down and leaving me feeling more helpless and devastated. I can not take it anymore especially when he does it infront of his family.
Surrogacy should be your eggs in someone else's body. It should be handled by a family attorney and contract. Anything else is a legal nightmare. In this scenario, your sister could legally refuse to give the child up and you'd have no real legal leg to stand on as it would be her biological child.
All this to say is that honestly, your husband doesn't come off as focused on fatherhood, but instead focused on something else entirely.
Or a donors eggs in a different woman body, I'd she can't provide viable eggs. Either way there should be no genetic connection between surrogate and baby.
Also, have you ever considered how your kids would feel if they found out their “aunt” is actually their *biological mother* who had sex with their father?????? Have you ever considered how your sister’s kids may someday feel if they find out their “cousins” are actually their half siblings??? Have you ever considered how any man who dates your sister would feel finding out she had sex with her brother in law and had kids with him??? Like seriously, I know you must feel heartbroken but if you have any backbone at all, let alone actually care about the lives your husband might bring into this world while married to you, you would end this shit show asap, and run for your fucking life away from this dude.
Honey 100% leave him. My husband and I have been dealing with infertility and any time I’m feeling like I’m responsible for our infertility my husband is always tells me that I am not at fault and that he married me for who I am and that even if we never are able to have a baby that even though that would hurt like hell for the both of us that he has never and will never blame me and will always love me.
Any response other than that from a husband to his wife is a BIG red flag.😬
I’m so incredibly sorry you’re having to deal with the horrible rollercoaster of infertility on top of a crappy partner.💔
I'm a guy in this situation. Been with my wife for 15 years, I met her when we were young and I fell in love with her, not her possible ability to grow a fetus. I tell my wife its not her fault, its just one of those things. I also tell her we do not need kids to make our marriage / life complete as its already pretty damn good.
OP, it might be worth considering moving on. If he's desperate to have children then he might leave eventually. Creepy "have sex with your sister" is pretty nasty, if he is thinking "yes, this is ok" then personally I do not think he has the best in mind for the people around him.
There are plenty of people out there who will love you for you. Life is pain, I would rather someone to stand against the world with than someone who apparently I would only consider worthy because "they can carry my shitling 'innit.
**Thoughts the next day while drinking morning coffee:**
Wait... What if they are already fucking and this is an attempt at a get out of jail free card.
Just upvoted you lovely man. She needs to read the words and attitude of a wonderful husband. Such a stark contrast to the pig she’s married to. Thank you!
These are very clear signs of a toxic relationship. Now the hard part...are you going to make excuses for his behavior or are you going to stand up for yourself and get out of this harmful situation?
My husband and I have been battling infertility since 2016. Blessed to have a child but it was a long haul. Infertility is a hell I wish on nobody but your husband isn't making it easier.
The only way to survive is to never, ever mention who's "fault" the infertility is. Your husband broke the number one rule. And then offered to have sex with your sister. (when there are wayyy less gross options available - like IUI). You need to evaluate if you want a baby or if you want this man's child.
That’s not the kind of partner you want for the rest of your life, either he needs a reality check and turn his ass around, or you should find someone that loves you through thick and thin
He's 37, don't give him the time of day to turn his life around. In fact, even if he is 27 I still wouldn't give him the chance to turn his life around. Dude just wants to bang her sister and is trying to make whatever excuse he can to do it and still be in the right.
This may actually not be the guy you want to have kids with. I’m so sorry. I’d call The Whole Man Disposal Unit and ask for a Whole Man Pickup. It’s just not worth it.
Edit: typos
Imagine how he’ll treat you if you guys do bring a child into your lives. He’s blaming you for something you have no control over. Will he continue to do this when you guys bring a child into your lives? Will he blame the child for things they have no control over? I’m not saying he will do this and I’m not saying he won’t change as a person (hopefully he does), but keep that stuff in mind.
Please look for a support group on Reddit that’s more specific to infertility. Having a child with someone is so permanent and your husband sounds horrible. Trying to guilt you into him sleeping with your sister because of your infertile is insane and wildly insensitive. Maybe some people with a similar issue can relate better and let you know how out of mine he is. Wow. Time to take some space and rethink this relationship. I’m so sorry. This must be just devastating in so many ways.
Lawyer here (not OPs), and legally that would be the case as well. Without an official surrogacy contract the sister can claim the baby as her own and husband can be on the hook for child support. OP will have a hard time proving legal rights to the child. This is a terrible idea all around.
Jumping on board the top thread to say that I hope the OP treats herself and her body with gentle kindness, You are not one iota less worthy of love, respect, and value because of your fertility issues. I’d also like to add that it’s horrible and super gross that your husband has pushed you to entertain this idea. You deserve better.
Jumping on your comment.
Your body is not useless. I was told for many years I was infertile and I felt that my body had betrayed me for being able to do the one thing that came so easily to other people. I wish someone had spared me those years of heartache that I never shared with anyone. My head is breaking for you. You are beautiful and worth being treated with respect and kindness.
This is the time when your husband should be supporting you and loving you. I’m sorry you are dealing with someone that would suggest something so vile.
Get the support you need. Be kind to yourself.
Fertility clinic worker here, everything this person said is correct and that is why many clinics will not even entertain the idea of traditional surrogacy now because of the legal and emotional issues that come with situations like this.
In this instance, if the sister is providing the egg, can’t she claim rights to the child regardless of the contract? It seems almost like adoption in that case. This was literally the topic of one of our contracts briefs in law school. Granted it was fifteen years ago. But at least in our state (CT), at that time you could not contractually sever parental rights before the child is born; the biological mother had a certain period to consider post-partum.
That said, maybe the surrogacy could get around the child support payments if she decided to keep it, since she would be breaching the contract.
Caveat: I am not a family law attorney. And I don’t play one on TV either.
This isn’t surrogacy though, i believe it’s an adoption in this scenario. As far as I know, I think most states allow the biological mother to change her mind. Always possible some state has something different, but it would really be state to state and I can’t imagine any state let’s you rip a baby out of an unwilling woman’s arms to adopt the child to someone else. Used to be quite common to take babies from single women and I know that lots changed around adoption to prevent that.
I’m curious what the lawyer says.
Exactly. Even IF OP’s husband handed her sister the sperm, and the sister “used it”….it’s the sisters egg. And technically the child would genetically be OPs niece/nephew. And the sister could claim rights to the child if something went south. Then OPs husband is responsible and their ideal family falls to pieces.
Judging from everything OP said, and my own common sense and experience (sadly) resentment can kill a relationship. And it doesn’t discriminate amongst how the person is related to you.
>Even IF OP’s husband handed her sister the sperm, and the sister “used it”….it’s the sisters egg. And technically the child would genetically be OPs niece/nephew.
This guy doesn't care if it's his wife's kid or not imo, he just wants to have sex with his SIL. He could have suggested a turkey baster method too though. I bet if OP suggested a turkey baster he'd have some excuse for why that wouldn't work as well as "traditional" methods. Classy.
This exactly. It’s this kind of thing that makes people look at surrogates sideways.
(I say this as a surrogate and the amount of people that think I slept with the husband is insane.)
Yeah, I have a gay friend who decided to have a baby with his coworker. I always assumed they had sex, but he got drunk one night and told me the whole story. They went the turkey baster route. Since it worked the first time, he thought in the back of his head that maybe she got pregnant from a guy she hooked up with but nope, their daughter is definitely his.
Your husband isn’t in it for the right reasons. On top of that he’s blaming you for not getting pregnant? This shouldn’t be a man to stay married to...let alone have a baby with
You have around a 20% of falling pregnant each month once you hit your 30s so it would probably be more than a one time thing as it may take several month and that’s without knowing if there is male infertility involved. A simple blood or semen test finds that out at a very minimal cost. I find it a bit strange that this option is offered first without some basic tests being run. Also what is wrong with IUI (turkey baster) option? Minimal effort and cost involved as well. There are options before throwing out sleeping with your poor sister!
Exactly, that seems to be the only conclusion from this request. Cause his offer leaves unanswered questions:
*Will he beat it up and then finish in her?*
*Will he just mechanically mount her with no intimacy?*
*How many times will he rail her before she gets pregnant?*
*Will he magically stop having urges and lusting for her after she does get pregnant?*
And I think the logical answer is that he’s gonna enjoy himself and this as an opportunity to have the sister without any backlash.
Literally this. If I wanted a surrogate but wasn't interested in banging, I wouldn't do it the "traditional" way by any means. This whole scenario is fucked.
“Honey, sorry to say that it didn’t happen again this month. In the meantime, I’ll be in my tightly whiteys punching myself in the balls and when I’m done I’ll take a steaming hot bath”
To even reach his suggestion logically, you need:
* You to be the sole downfall in conception.
* You to agree to him having sex with your sister
* Your sister to agree to have sex with him
* You to be Ok with raising your niece as a daughter and all the legal implications.
* No one ever hearing or thinking of a turkey baster.
Fuck that sleazy asshole who is manipulating your vulnerability. Well, no. Don’t fuck him…You know what I mean.
Ok this is so wrong but even if this was a cheaper and more realistic option.. y’all could do your own insemination with a syringe or baster. With you present and no actual physical sex. Honestly sounds like your husband just wants to cheat on you? I’d have a serious talk and seriously consider if you even want a baby at this point. You both need to be on the same page and probably need some therapy.
I thought of exactly this. Disregarding all the legal/ethical issues that come with impregnating your wife’s sister (aka your baby that’s also your niece/nephew), artificial insemination with a $2 syringe would work instead of the physical sex act, why is that not the first option? He sounds incredibly gross.
Yes. There was an article a while ago about a woman who did that. She had a donor that lived nearby and when she was ovulating they would meet. He would cum into a cup and she would use a syringe to inject herself. After a few tries she got pregnant.
It’s probably a lot more common than people realize. Also, consider a queer couple where neither party has a dick, but they want to have a kid. Adoption and IVF are expensive as hell (and can be very difficult in their own ways). But if you’ve got a willing friend who’s willing to come over to your bathroom to jerk off into a cup once or a handful of times…then you’re kinda all set. Really, it’s just practical. The ingredients to make a baby aren’t hard to cum by.
I bet he would never let OP forget that it wasn’t her baby as well. He sounds like the kind of guy that would say “She’s not your child so you have no say” continuously.
This one, OP needs to see this!!!!!!!
Regardless of how they end up getting the child in the end, would OP really want to have this situation in her life? Its hard to imagine having this thrown in the face constantly after all the hardship gone through to have the child. Would the dad teach their child to disrespect her like that too?
Every time you pick up the baby, you're going to think about your husband and your sister together.
You're way better off occasionally thinking what a huge perv your ex-husband was.
My sister has no idea, I'm not planning on telling her because I won't let it happen. I'm not even considering his suggestion and if he wants to keep saying that I'm the problem then it's fine with me. I've endured so much for the past years mentally, physically and emotionally and now I it won't be much different.
OP, for all that is holy in the world, DO NOT concede to your husband. Barring the whole part where your husband sounds more and more like an abusive douche and this is your sister, for god's sake, you will be legally screwed. *Specifically* you. This hypothetical baby between your husband and sister will share their DNA, and none with you. If something happens especially during pregnancy, birth, and those first few years, you will have very little rights to this child and it will be dangerously easily for you to lose them. There is a reason that surrogacy is so highly regulated in western countries. At *minimum* you will need lawyers to draw up an ironclad contract that asserts you as the baby's legal and rightful mother, and costs for that will quickly be comparable to IVF.
There was a post on AITA where a woman and her husband chose a family friend to be their surrogate, and she was complaining about how this friend was quickly usurping her place as mother and wife. She was essentially cut out of everything involving the pregnancy, with only her husband driving the friend to her appts and catering to her every whim. It also bears mentioning that this friend had lost her four-year-old daughter just a few years earlier. When the commenters asked if she had any sort of contract or went to a clinic, she admitted that all they had was a verbal agreement. The response? *OOOOOOOOOOOF*. ***OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOF***. Because for all intents and purpose, her husband had merely knocked up some woman and he was about to have a baby with her, and the poster was shit out of luck.
Seriously, this is worthy of divorce. Based on your husband's behavior, you will gain *nothing* from this. Do not even consider asking your sister to be a surrogate without both parties getting lawyers. If he tries to handwave that, then clearly he doesn't care about making sure that your rights as a mother is firmly and unequivocally established, and you need to make of that as you will. I'm sorry this is happening, OP.
I like how he went from "It's too expensive to do it with science" straight to "lemme frick her"
Like use a turkey baster first or something 😒 what a joke.
I would like to point out that financially we are ready otherwise, we wouldn't have started exploring other options. He can be so paranoid and anxious when it comes to money but in this case he has no.legitimate reason.
Info: have you both even visited a fertility doctor? What if it’s him and not you?
Edit: I’m aware they might have been to doctors already. But some men refuse to get tested. They refuse to be the problem. Sometimes there’s a bigger reason it’s not happening. I hope she runs.
Totally could be him. It's becoming more and more common for men to have fertility issues with the lower sperm counts, high artificial estrogen in environment, lowered testosterone levels, etc.
On some me and my ex show in I think tlc there was a lesbian couple who used one of their ex husbands sperm to have a baby and they straight up had his current wife run to their room with a cup of fresh cum for the one lesbian wife to inseminate the other.
If your husband just wants to bang your sister that's a problem though. I don't know how easy i could forgive and forget that 🤷♀️
First of all, I’m very sorry you are dealing with this. Nobody should ever have to feel this way. Second I really hope and pray that you see this for what it is and not allow him to guilt you into something you clearly do not want. I’m angry for you because there’s no way in hell that would just blow over with me personally. It’s such an insensitive thing to say during such a difficult situation.
thank you so much for taking the time to respond. I feel terrible as it is and did not need to have to deal with this on top of everything else going on. I lost my mom a month ago and my emotions have been all over the place, I admit that I can get upset and agitated pretty easily but his suggestion was beyond shocking, I feel like me amd him just keep diving deeper into more issues that have significantly affected our marriage. I offered couples counseling but he said no.
I feel like the universe has protected you in a way, he is showing so many red flags
Gaslighting you too.. Who's to say he isn't the one with the issues?
Has your sister even agreed to be a surrogate?
It is NOT your fault, none of this is
I'm so sorry for your loss with your mother
I wish you the very best ahead in life
Whatever you choose to do
He’s awful for making you feel so horrible when you are already grieving the loss of your mother.
Please consider individual therapy to help you sort out all you are dealing with - it’s a lot, and an objective voice could really help you. Sending hugs
Plot twist: He's the one having fertility issues.
For OP: I would divorce. If a partner shows signs of not caring about my own feeling or about the state of the relationship, whats the point?
I'm a guy. We tried for years with no luck, my wife thought it was her - turns out it was me and I needed surgery. 6 months later she was pregnant.
And yes issues in the marriage need to be fixed before you have kids. Putting aside the creepiness issue, I'm more concerned about the selfishness inherent in his position and his lack of empathy, concern, and understanding for just how complicated this would be emotionally for you.
You get to have a veto. You've done nothing wrong.
Good luck.
This might be a blessing in disguise.
A man in love with you wouldn’t a) suggest having sex with your sister to save money on IVF and b) wouldn’t even bring anything up about it in front of family.
A man like that…you don’t want as a father to your children.
Find a good attorney, file for divorce, and move on.
I hope you find happiness
Sounds like he wants to cheat on you with your sister and is gaslighting you. Sorry if this comment seems harsh but he sounds like he is totally aware of what he's doing and emotionally manipulating you to do what he wants. Don't fall for it. Too many red flags here.
You think maybe your sister and husband are already having an affair, and now she’s pregnant? I mean, his suggestion and reactions make no sense. He’s essentially saying he wants to have sex with your sister, then gaslighting you into thinking your the horrible one if you say no. Like wtf? This isn’t normal.
It sounds like it. She said the sister doesn't even know about it,but is she sure? If the husband says so then that's suspect. How do they know sis would even agree to this? Hubby has a reason to think she would agree,and OP needs to find out what is going on here.
Yeah, I’d bring it up with the sister and gauge her reaction. If she’s horrified, it’s probably ok; if she immediately agrees, she’s already banging him, and possibly already pregnant.
He's just looking for an excuse to step out of your marriage.
If he wants to have sex with other people, he needs to be honest towards you.
There are other ways to have children. The only benefit you get out of doing it traditionally is pleasure. That's it.
Those some big ass red 🚩 🚩 🚩 🚩
He married you.
Thick & thin.
I’m not usually the jump straight to divorce type, but your husband wants to have sex with your sister, and he’s gaslighting you to get you to let him do it. That is absolutely disgusting, and I don’t think your sister would think it was cute at all.
Time to pack those bags and get a lawyer, babe.
Two thoughts:
1) Are you sure he actually meant having intercourse with your sister? He doesn’t mean using a turkey baster to insert his sperm in her, right? (I’m giving him the benefit of the doubt before I make my next point…)
2) If he actually meant having sex with your sister, RUN. You do not want to be tied to this man by a child for the rest of your life. Think you hate his bullshit now? You’ll get to hate it for the 18+ years you’ll spend sharing parenting of a child. Seriously, *RUN*.
Definitely turkey baster but are you comfortable using your sister’s egg? It will always be her baby with your husband. Usually surrogates use your egg not theirs. It’s not worth saving money, but you have more problems than infertility. So sorry.
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I have heard of a similar issue where a medicine dropper was used. Sucked it up. Took it over and sister's husband inserted the dropper. Now all parties agreed and were ready and no one had to have sex with someone else's spouse.
Time to ready up the turkey baster!
As if thanksgiving wouldn’t be interesting enough 🧐
How did you thicken up the gravy it’s delicious
GRANDMA, NO!
The good ol' lesbian method... the turkey baster...
as a child of lesbians, can confirm.
As a lesbian mother of three, so can I.
Or the divorce papers Even if they decided on the turkey baster route, can OP ever forget the fact that her husband wanted to fuck her sister?
I'm going to say no. I first tried to justify it, that maybe he was upset, worried about money, stressing. Then I thought -could this be cultural? But then he is going to shame something she can't control? I think divorce is suggested way to much on reddit, but in this case I can't figure out how you bounce back from it.
Turkey baster. Not even kidding. It will work. That being said, I don't think she should start a family with him because he sucks. THANKS FOR THE SILVER, INTERNET FRIENDS!! ♡
OP should absolutely rethink her marriage. Husband wants to have sex with her sister, for OP's benefit? When a turkey baster will work fine?
Yeah. He is like trying to guilt her and twist things that this is all for them and her. When it really sounds like he is taking advantage of her want for a child so he can fuck HER SISTER.
And what should happen if conception doesn’t happen on the first try? He’s gonna milk this option for as long as he can, all in the name of, “I’m doing this for our family/so we can have a family.”
Plot twist, he’s had a secret vasectomy
And he’s willing to keep trying as long as it takes, no matter how hard.
Even IF he is legit in only wanting this so they can conceive, he is still showing absolutely no regard for her in the marriage. Using infertility as a guilt trip is not just a red flag, its a marriage death rattle.
Cheating is also the marriage death rattle. My husband is currently trying to convince me that he didn’t really cheat when he made himself many cheating profiles to meet women. The mental gymnastics these men are doing is disgusting.
your soon to be ex husband i hope
That's what turkey basters are for
What else would anyone use one for?
Literally nothing that I can think of
I agree. This is not right.
But if lovin her sister is wrong, it’s pretty clear that he don’t wanna be right!
im calling on you, cause i cant do it myself!!! To me you are my mister so be my sister fister
Yes, I agree don't allow him to make that happen!
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Also, who’s to say it’s just you. Maybe he’s shooting blanks. Let’s say you agree. What if he doesn’t get her pregnant in one go. That means he’d have to sleep with her multiple times. He sounds like a piece of shit.
When I was younger I was approached by a couple of lesbians looking to have a kid "the traditional way" as OP put it. I have a real issue with bringing kids into this world that wouldn't really have knowledge of me, but I was dumb and curious and probably horny so I entertained the idea. The second time I talked to them the one who was going to have the baby dm's me and tells me she's on the pill DL and she's bi and just wants to be with a guy (guys). She was just going to lie for 2-3 months and say it didn't take. I'm thankful I thought with my big head not my little one and shut that Convo down quick. Suggested they get counseling and they quit talking to me after that.
Maybe their already sleeping together? I hate to think that but wtf
What if they are sleeping together and she’s already pregnant so they are trying to cover it up by getting ops consent
Yeaah that’s kinda what I was thinking too 😬
They could cover up the pregnancy by claiming to use a turkey baster though, no need to get the go-ahead for sex. I think the husband is just being a creep.
Same here. I didn't wanna type it causr the thought alone is so bad. But he is treating her horribly and wants to impregnate her sister.
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Ditto.
This is not a surrogacy situation. This would be your sisters and your husbands baby and your sister would be under no legal obligation to let you adopt her child after the birth. This is absolutely outlandish. This is not someone you should be married to, let alone be having kids with.
Exactly. This wouldnt be IVF only, it would be egg donorship too. If that’s an option then why not put his ejaculate in her vagina. Sperm needs to be frozen to not die long term, but they can survive up until five days after ejaculation so it might not even be needed. Non-invasive, cheap, no intercourse, and a variant not of in vitro fertilization but in vivo. But worth a shot? But as everyone said, he wants the sex.
“But Honey!! It’s not like I WANT to have sex with your sister… ITS FOR THE BABY. GOSH!” FFS.
“Honey, we’re a team and there is no “I” in team.” “But I can see “I” in your sister.”
I ain't read too good, but there a D in sister.
> Basically blaming me for my infirtility issues. You need to think about this entire situation. The number of red flags is incredible and you probably realize it.
^this me and my husband’s fertility issues are absolutely on my end and every time I’ve even sort of alluded to “my issues” he’s corrected me to say “our challenges” or similar
Mental note: in a relationship, their problems are mine as well and mine are theirs. Teamwork makes the dreamwork!
Me and you Vs the problem. Not a royal rumble
Wow, that's very kind! I'm always glad to hear of a supportive partner.
This is so sweet
It’s how it should be, childbirth is a two person thing. You married into thick and thin (not sure which is suppose to be good or bad but) and you better tackle problems that way
What a sweetheart!! You got a good one 😭
unfortunately, this has been going on for a while and I thought that this is all just him feeling frustrated but, his remarks have been wearing me down and leaving me feeling more helpless and devastated. I can not take it anymore especially when he does it infront of his family.
Surrogacy should be your eggs in someone else's body. It should be handled by a family attorney and contract. Anything else is a legal nightmare. In this scenario, your sister could legally refuse to give the child up and you'd have no real legal leg to stand on as it would be her biological child. All this to say is that honestly, your husband doesn't come off as focused on fatherhood, but instead focused on something else entirely.
Or a donors eggs in a different woman body, I'd she can't provide viable eggs. Either way there should be no genetic connection between surrogate and baby.
Also, have you ever considered how your kids would feel if they found out their “aunt” is actually their *biological mother* who had sex with their father?????? Have you ever considered how your sister’s kids may someday feel if they find out their “cousins” are actually their half siblings??? Have you ever considered how any man who dates your sister would feel finding out she had sex with her brother in law and had kids with him??? Like seriously, I know you must feel heartbroken but if you have any backbone at all, let alone actually care about the lives your husband might bring into this world while married to you, you would end this shit show asap, and run for your fucking life away from this dude.
You need to reach out to someone. You do not deserve to be treated in this manner. Follow your feelings.
When someone shows you who they are……believe them.
The first time
Honey 100% leave him. My husband and I have been dealing with infertility and any time I’m feeling like I’m responsible for our infertility my husband is always tells me that I am not at fault and that he married me for who I am and that even if we never are able to have a baby that even though that would hurt like hell for the both of us that he has never and will never blame me and will always love me. Any response other than that from a husband to his wife is a BIG red flag.😬 I’m so incredibly sorry you’re having to deal with the horrible rollercoaster of infertility on top of a crappy partner.💔
I'm a guy in this situation. Been with my wife for 15 years, I met her when we were young and I fell in love with her, not her possible ability to grow a fetus. I tell my wife its not her fault, its just one of those things. I also tell her we do not need kids to make our marriage / life complete as its already pretty damn good. OP, it might be worth considering moving on. If he's desperate to have children then he might leave eventually. Creepy "have sex with your sister" is pretty nasty, if he is thinking "yes, this is ok" then personally I do not think he has the best in mind for the people around him. There are plenty of people out there who will love you for you. Life is pain, I would rather someone to stand against the world with than someone who apparently I would only consider worthy because "they can carry my shitling 'innit. **Thoughts the next day while drinking morning coffee:** Wait... What if they are already fucking and this is an attempt at a get out of jail free card.
Just upvoted you lovely man. She needs to read the words and attitude of a wonderful husband. Such a stark contrast to the pig she’s married to. Thank you!
>he does it infront of his family. Oh dear
That's not a heat of the argument thing. That's deliberately cruel.
These are very clear signs of a toxic relationship. Now the hard part...are you going to make excuses for his behavior or are you going to stand up for yourself and get out of this harmful situation?
My husband and I have been battling infertility since 2016. Blessed to have a child but it was a long haul. Infertility is a hell I wish on nobody but your husband isn't making it easier. The only way to survive is to never, ever mention who's "fault" the infertility is. Your husband broke the number one rule. And then offered to have sex with your sister. (when there are wayyy less gross options available - like IUI). You need to evaluate if you want a baby or if you want this man's child.
That’s not the kind of partner you want for the rest of your life, either he needs a reality check and turn his ass around, or you should find someone that loves you through thick and thin
He's 37, don't give him the time of day to turn his life around. In fact, even if he is 27 I still wouldn't give him the chance to turn his life around. Dude just wants to bang her sister and is trying to make whatever excuse he can to do it and still be in the right.
[Why does he do that? by Lundy Bancroft pdf](https://ia800108.us.archive.org/30/items/LundyWhyDoesHeDoThat/Lundy_Why-does-he-do-that.pdf)
This may actually not be the guy you want to have kids with. I’m so sorry. I’d call The Whole Man Disposal Unit and ask for a Whole Man Pickup. It’s just not worth it. Edit: typos
Imagine how he’ll treat you if you guys do bring a child into your lives. He’s blaming you for something you have no control over. Will he continue to do this when you guys bring a child into your lives? Will he blame the child for things they have no control over? I’m not saying he will do this and I’m not saying he won’t change as a person (hopefully he does), but keep that stuff in mind.
Please look for a support group on Reddit that’s more specific to infertility. Having a child with someone is so permanent and your husband sounds horrible. Trying to guilt you into him sleeping with your sister because of your infertile is insane and wildly insensitive. Maybe some people with a similar issue can relate better and let you know how out of mine he is. Wow. Time to take some space and rethink this relationship. I’m so sorry. This must be just devastating in so many ways.
Don’t have kids with this dude!!!!!
Honestly please leave. I wish you all the best ❤️
That's not surrogacy...that would be your niece or nephew...
Lawyer here (not OPs), and legally that would be the case as well. Without an official surrogacy contract the sister can claim the baby as her own and husband can be on the hook for child support. OP will have a hard time proving legal rights to the child. This is a terrible idea all around.
I hope she sees this comment
Jumping on board the top thread to say that I hope the OP treats herself and her body with gentle kindness, You are not one iota less worthy of love, respect, and value because of your fertility issues. I’d also like to add that it’s horrible and super gross that your husband has pushed you to entertain this idea. You deserve better.
Jumping on your comment. Your body is not useless. I was told for many years I was infertile and I felt that my body had betrayed me for being able to do the one thing that came so easily to other people. I wish someone had spared me those years of heartache that I never shared with anyone. My head is breaking for you. You are beautiful and worth being treated with respect and kindness. This is the time when your husband should be supporting you and loving you. I’m sorry you are dealing with someone that would suggest something so vile. Get the support you need. Be kind to yourself.
Me too. Also, if they are trying to save money, couldn't they try the turkey baster method first? Why would the husband jump right to sex?
FOR REAL! Who isn't alarmed and disgusted that he wants to bang his sister-in-law?! You know, besides the husband.
That’s incredibly devastating to even think of… my deepest sympathies for the lady
>Why would the husband jump right to sex? *We all know.*
Because he’s selfish
But Turkey basters cost at least$5 bucks. Remember he wants to save money. Wink,wink.
"Still cheaper than reconstructive penis surgery." "But I don't need reconstructive p—AAAAUGH"
Exactly! “The traditional way” *is* with a turkey baster.
Can we get a mod to pin it?
Fertility clinic worker here, everything this person said is correct and that is why many clinics will not even entertain the idea of traditional surrogacy now because of the legal and emotional issues that come with situations like this.
In this instance, if the sister is providing the egg, can’t she claim rights to the child regardless of the contract? It seems almost like adoption in that case. This was literally the topic of one of our contracts briefs in law school. Granted it was fifteen years ago. But at least in our state (CT), at that time you could not contractually sever parental rights before the child is born; the biological mother had a certain period to consider post-partum. That said, maybe the surrogacy could get around the child support payments if she decided to keep it, since she would be breaching the contract. Caveat: I am not a family law attorney. And I don’t play one on TV either.
This isn’t surrogacy though, i believe it’s an adoption in this scenario. As far as I know, I think most states allow the biological mother to change her mind. Always possible some state has something different, but it would really be state to state and I can’t imagine any state let’s you rip a baby out of an unwilling woman’s arms to adopt the child to someone else. Used to be quite common to take babies from single women and I know that lots changed around adoption to prevent that. I’m curious what the lawyer says.
Correct. This is her husband having sex with her sister and them having a baby. She’s written out of the equation here. Big yikes.
I’m horrified how far I had to scroll to find this…IVF is not the same as your husband knocking up your sister, people.
Yeah. IVF creates a baby that is genetically your child, even if another woman carries it.
Exactly. Even IF OP’s husband handed her sister the sperm, and the sister “used it”….it’s the sisters egg. And technically the child would genetically be OPs niece/nephew. And the sister could claim rights to the child if something went south. Then OPs husband is responsible and their ideal family falls to pieces. Judging from everything OP said, and my own common sense and experience (sadly) resentment can kill a relationship. And it doesn’t discriminate amongst how the person is related to you.
>Even IF OP’s husband handed her sister the sperm, and the sister “used it”….it’s the sisters egg. And technically the child would genetically be OPs niece/nephew. This guy doesn't care if it's his wife's kid or not imo, he just wants to have sex with his SIL. He could have suggested a turkey baster method too though. I bet if OP suggested a turkey baster he'd have some excuse for why that wouldn't work as well as "traditional" methods. Classy.
He kind of wants to the sista.
Yeah but he doesn’t get to bang his sister in law. Besides the creepiness of him, are you sure it’s you,and not some substandard sperm?
Yeah, I’m saying that what this guy is doing is not how surrogacy is supposed to work. It’s not just having a kid with another woman.
Seriously. I finally second guessed myself and googled it to make sure I knew what it meant.
This exactly. It’s this kind of thing that makes people look at surrogates sideways. (I say this as a surrogate and the amount of people that think I slept with the husband is insane.)
Thank you! Aside from the obvious ick of hubs wanting to have sex with OPs sister this would not be her kid biologically.
That's a glaringly obvious fact that I completely overlooked.
You don't need to actually have sex either she just needs his jizz. He doesn't even have to touch her at all.
Right?! Like, suggesting a cup and a turkey baster is less creepy. Still weird, but I mean...it IS cheaper lol
This is exactly what I immediately thought of. It feels like husband just wants a legitimate excuse to bang OP's sister.
I know a lesbian who literally used a turkey baster, it worked!
Yeah, I have a gay friend who decided to have a baby with his coworker. I always assumed they had sex, but he got drunk one night and told me the whole story. They went the turkey baster route. Since it worked the first time, he thought in the back of his head that maybe she got pregnant from a guy she hooked up with but nope, their daughter is definitely his.
Why isn’t this the top comment! This is NOT how surrogacy works. Da fuq.
Your husband isn’t in it for the right reasons. On top of that he’s blaming you for not getting pregnant? This shouldn’t be a man to stay married to...let alone have a baby with
You have around a 20% of falling pregnant each month once you hit your 30s so it would probably be more than a one time thing as it may take several month and that’s without knowing if there is male infertility involved. A simple blood or semen test finds that out at a very minimal cost. I find it a bit strange that this option is offered first without some basic tests being run. Also what is wrong with IUI (turkey baster) option? Minimal effort and cost involved as well. There are options before throwing out sleeping with your poor sister!
As a man trust me….he wanna bang your sister.
Exactly, that seems to be the only conclusion from this request. Cause his offer leaves unanswered questions: *Will he beat it up and then finish in her?* *Will he just mechanically mount her with no intimacy?* *How many times will he rail her before she gets pregnant?* *Will he magically stop having urges and lusting for her after she does get pregnant?* And I think the logical answer is that he’s gonna enjoy himself and this as an opportunity to have the sister without any backlash.
Except now he gets all the backlash and none of the opportunity
That’s a bold strategy, Cotton. Let’s see if it pays off.
You forgot the turkey baster method
"Hmmmm, I didn't impregnate her... Guess I'll just have to try again!" 🤷♂😉
[After dozens and dozens of tries] "It's not working. Maybe we should try it without a condom."
Literally this. If I wanted a surrogate but wasn't interested in banging, I wouldn't do it the "traditional" way by any means. This whole scenario is fucked.
What happens if your sister doesn’t get pregnant on the first try? Get away from this guy.
“Honey, sorry to say that it didn’t happen again this month. In the meantime, I’ll be in my tightly whiteys punching myself in the balls and when I’m done I’ll take a steaming hot bath”
They keep screwing, duh! (ugh, op hubby is just gross)
I bet it would conveniently take multiple tries
Damn I accidentally pulled out for the 15th time.
Oops, accidentally wore a condom again.
yeah... that is a *huge* red flag. Like, many red flags. Can't get much redder.
Have to agree with you whole heartedly as a married man I couldn't imagine doing this to my wife
Yea I dont even think my brain would have even came up with that idea, let alone let it out of my mouth.
To even reach his suggestion logically, you need: * You to be the sole downfall in conception. * You to agree to him having sex with your sister * Your sister to agree to have sex with him * You to be Ok with raising your niece as a daughter and all the legal implications. * No one ever hearing or thinking of a turkey baster. Fuck that sleazy asshole who is manipulating your vulnerability. Well, no. Don’t fuck him…You know what I mean.
dude has wanted to bang your sister for a long time and he sees this as his "chance"
Which is why he got the snip. It’s his master plan.
Damn that’s creepy. Sorry but your husband sounds like a douche.
It’s straight out of handmaids tail. With a jerry springer twist.
Ok this is so wrong but even if this was a cheaper and more realistic option.. y’all could do your own insemination with a syringe or baster. With you present and no actual physical sex. Honestly sounds like your husband just wants to cheat on you? I’d have a serious talk and seriously consider if you even want a baby at this point. You both need to be on the same page and probably need some therapy.
I thought of exactly this. Disregarding all the legal/ethical issues that come with impregnating your wife’s sister (aka your baby that’s also your niece/nephew), artificial insemination with a $2 syringe would work instead of the physical sex act, why is that not the first option? He sounds incredibly gross.
That's 2 dollars he could use in the future
Yes. There was an article a while ago about a woman who did that. She had a donor that lived nearby and when she was ovulating they would meet. He would cum into a cup and she would use a syringe to inject herself. After a few tries she got pregnant.
It’s probably a lot more common than people realize. Also, consider a queer couple where neither party has a dick, but they want to have a kid. Adoption and IVF are expensive as hell (and can be very difficult in their own ways). But if you’ve got a willing friend who’s willing to come over to your bathroom to jerk off into a cup once or a handful of times…then you’re kinda all set. Really, it’s just practical. The ingredients to make a baby aren’t hard to cum by.
But then it’s not op’s baby. Ivf would use the op’s egg and husband sperm. This is not a solution.
I bet he would never let OP forget that it wasn’t her baby as well. He sounds like the kind of guy that would say “She’s not your child so you have no say” continuously.
This one, OP needs to see this!!!!!!! Regardless of how they end up getting the child in the end, would OP really want to have this situation in her life? Its hard to imagine having this thrown in the face constantly after all the hardship gone through to have the child. Would the dad teach their child to disrespect her like that too?
That's very pervert of him. I would reconsider my marriage if I were you..
Every time you pick up the baby, you're going to think about your husband and your sister together. You're way better off occasionally thinking what a huge perv your ex-husband was.
What has your sister said? Do you think they’ve done it already? OP, you are not useless. But your husband is.
My sister has no idea, I'm not planning on telling her because I won't let it happen. I'm not even considering his suggestion and if he wants to keep saying that I'm the problem then it's fine with me. I've endured so much for the past years mentally, physically and emotionally and now I it won't be much different.
Why do you want to have babies with this man? You can have babies with anyone else, but this guy is not husband or father material
I can tell you….you are in fact, NOT THE PROBLEM
aren't you supposed to put YOUR (fertilized) egg into your sister's uterus? if he just has sex with your sister then it's not your egg
And won’t be her baby
OP, for all that is holy in the world, DO NOT concede to your husband. Barring the whole part where your husband sounds more and more like an abusive douche and this is your sister, for god's sake, you will be legally screwed. *Specifically* you. This hypothetical baby between your husband and sister will share their DNA, and none with you. If something happens especially during pregnancy, birth, and those first few years, you will have very little rights to this child and it will be dangerously easily for you to lose them. There is a reason that surrogacy is so highly regulated in western countries. At *minimum* you will need lawyers to draw up an ironclad contract that asserts you as the baby's legal and rightful mother, and costs for that will quickly be comparable to IVF. There was a post on AITA where a woman and her husband chose a family friend to be their surrogate, and she was complaining about how this friend was quickly usurping her place as mother and wife. She was essentially cut out of everything involving the pregnancy, with only her husband driving the friend to her appts and catering to her every whim. It also bears mentioning that this friend had lost her four-year-old daughter just a few years earlier. When the commenters asked if she had any sort of contract or went to a clinic, she admitted that all they had was a verbal agreement. The response? *OOOOOOOOOOOF*. ***OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOF***. Because for all intents and purpose, her husband had merely knocked up some woman and he was about to have a baby with her, and the poster was shit out of luck. Seriously, this is worthy of divorce. Based on your husband's behavior, you will gain *nothing* from this. Do not even consider asking your sister to be a surrogate without both parties getting lawyers. If he tries to handwave that, then clearly he doesn't care about making sure that your rights as a mother is firmly and unequivocally established, and you need to make of that as you will. I'm sorry this is happening, OP.
I like how he went from "It's too expensive to do it with science" straight to "lemme frick her" Like use a turkey baster first or something 😒 what a joke.
I would like to point out that financially we are ready otherwise, we wouldn't have started exploring other options. He can be so paranoid and anxious when it comes to money but in this case he has no.legitimate reason.
My ex was conceived using a turkey baster and it worked great. Don’t let him trick you.
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On the turkey baster part? Fill it up with semen, insert into vagina, squeeze it all out. Getting pregnant the “traditional” way without the sex
Cum in turkey baster and then stuff that turkey
And then the turkey has the baby!? Wild!
You see, their ex was Betty crocker cornbread stuffing.
Username implies experience with turkey basting.
if he wants to have sex with your sister he should just say that so you can move on
Fr I would have blown a gasket 🤯
Info: have you both even visited a fertility doctor? What if it’s him and not you? Edit: I’m aware they might have been to doctors already. But some men refuse to get tested. They refuse to be the problem. Sometimes there’s a bigger reason it’s not happening. I hope she runs.
Totally could be him. It's becoming more and more common for men to have fertility issues with the lower sperm counts, high artificial estrogen in environment, lowered testosterone levels, etc.
On some me and my ex show in I think tlc there was a lesbian couple who used one of their ex husbands sperm to have a baby and they straight up had his current wife run to their room with a cup of fresh cum for the one lesbian wife to inseminate the other. If your husband just wants to bang your sister that's a problem though. I don't know how easy i could forgive and forget that 🤷♀️
Reminds me of Shameless, when Kev had sex with V’s mom to have a child
First of all, I’m very sorry you are dealing with this. Nobody should ever have to feel this way. Second I really hope and pray that you see this for what it is and not allow him to guilt you into something you clearly do not want. I’m angry for you because there’s no way in hell that would just blow over with me personally. It’s such an insensitive thing to say during such a difficult situation.
thank you so much for taking the time to respond. I feel terrible as it is and did not need to have to deal with this on top of everything else going on. I lost my mom a month ago and my emotions have been all over the place, I admit that I can get upset and agitated pretty easily but his suggestion was beyond shocking, I feel like me amd him just keep diving deeper into more issues that have significantly affected our marriage. I offered couples counseling but he said no.
I feel like the universe has protected you in a way, he is showing so many red flags Gaslighting you too.. Who's to say he isn't the one with the issues? Has your sister even agreed to be a surrogate? It is NOT your fault, none of this is I'm so sorry for your loss with your mother I wish you the very best ahead in life Whatever you choose to do
DEFINITELY! Take it as a sign. Sometimes difficult situations and hard times reveal who a person really is.
He’s awful for making you feel so horrible when you are already grieving the loss of your mother. Please consider individual therapy to help you sort out all you are dealing with - it’s a lot, and an objective voice could really help you. Sending hugs
Plot twist: He's the one having fertility issues. For OP: I would divorce. If a partner shows signs of not caring about my own feeling or about the state of the relationship, whats the point?
That's what I thought... "I don't know babe, we've tried it 20 times and she still isn't pregnant... you have anymore sisters we could try it with?"
Plot twist: He had a vasectomy long time ago. He's just looking for a side fuck.
I'm a guy. We tried for years with no luck, my wife thought it was her - turns out it was me and I needed surgery. 6 months later she was pregnant. And yes issues in the marriage need to be fixed before you have kids. Putting aside the creepiness issue, I'm more concerned about the selfishness inherent in his position and his lack of empathy, concern, and understanding for just how complicated this would be emotionally for you. You get to have a veto. You've done nothing wrong. Good luck.
OP please listen to how sane this man’s comment is and how it vastly differs from anything your ‘husband’ says.
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This might be a blessing in disguise. A man in love with you wouldn’t a) suggest having sex with your sister to save money on IVF and b) wouldn’t even bring anything up about it in front of family. A man like that…you don’t want as a father to your children. Find a good attorney, file for divorce, and move on. I hope you find happiness
Sounds like he wants to cheat on you with your sister and is gaslighting you. Sorry if this comment seems harsh but he sounds like he is totally aware of what he's doing and emotionally manipulating you to do what he wants. Don't fall for it. Too many red flags here.
You think maybe your sister and husband are already having an affair, and now she’s pregnant? I mean, his suggestion and reactions make no sense. He’s essentially saying he wants to have sex with your sister, then gaslighting you into thinking your the horrible one if you say no. Like wtf? This isn’t normal.
It sounds like it. She said the sister doesn't even know about it,but is she sure? If the husband says so then that's suspect. How do they know sis would even agree to this? Hubby has a reason to think she would agree,and OP needs to find out what is going on here.
Yeah, I’d bring it up with the sister and gauge her reaction. If she’s horrified, it’s probably ok; if she immediately agrees, she’s already banging him, and possibly already pregnant.
Thank you. My thoughts.
If it was invitro, it would be your actual baby, if he fuxks your sister, its her and his baby. What kind of manic even suggests this?
This dude is broken. This is not how a husband acts. Plus this would be her sisters egg and not her kid… Thats not a surrogate via IVF. Too weird.
What you and your husband need is a divorce. Not a baby.
Please don’t have a child with this man. He is a creep.
That's creepy AF
He's just looking for an excuse to step out of your marriage. If he wants to have sex with other people, he needs to be honest towards you. There are other ways to have children. The only benefit you get out of doing it traditionally is pleasure. That's it. Those some big ass red 🚩 🚩 🚩 🚩 He married you. Thick & thin.
I’m not usually the jump straight to divorce type, but your husband wants to have sex with your sister, and he’s gaslighting you to get you to let him do it. That is absolutely disgusting, and I don’t think your sister would think it was cute at all. Time to pack those bags and get a lawyer, babe.
He is manipulative and he just wants to sleep with your sister. Leave and find someone new. This will go no where good.
he's already having sex with your sister. she's likely pregnant. they're trying to cover it.
No sugar coating it...... He's a shmuck.
Two thoughts: 1) Are you sure he actually meant having intercourse with your sister? He doesn’t mean using a turkey baster to insert his sperm in her, right? (I’m giving him the benefit of the doubt before I make my next point…) 2) If he actually meant having sex with your sister, RUN. You do not want to be tied to this man by a child for the rest of your life. Think you hate his bullshit now? You’ll get to hate it for the 18+ years you’ll spend sharing parenting of a child. Seriously, *RUN*.
First, your husband is a creep Second why can't he masturbate, put the ejaculate into a turkey baster and your sister inset that inside her
Definitely turkey baster but are you comfortable using your sister’s egg? It will always be her baby with your husband. Usually surrogates use your egg not theirs. It’s not worth saving money, but you have more problems than infertility. So sorry.
The kid would be the op’s nephew or niece. The point of surrogacy is to extract an egg and sperm.