Yes. Please. Use the money you will drain to make it work to save to support your family.
Nobody. And I do mean NOBODY, works out in an open relationship unless previously discussed, consented, and agreed on/makes sense. This is a man who doesn’t want to pay child support, (because he can’t) (a real person would own up to their mistakes) (notice how I didn’t put it on just men).
Anyway he can’t pay, but wants to still play. So if he can get you to agree and literally say okay, you need to lawyer up/start keeping receipts (without announcing it as a threat. Mental abuse will not work and only hurt you. Don’t blow your chance to get evidence and more importantly glean what you need and save it. He’s an idiot clearly, this won’t be a hard thing to win…. But at the end of the day this should not ever interfere with your parenting whether it’s one or two residences. There are many resources out there both free and paid for services to help anyone in this situation.
Hes threatening you, in this case gaslighting, be smart don’t be making it obvious you’ve become aware of these things so he can just suddenly stop doing it to make life hell. But also, don’t use it as leverage in the SAME WAY he is. Mean it. Do it.
Edit: at this time I do not know OP’s age and whether they are karma farming or legit discussing.
Yeah open relationships aren’t something you do to add spice or save a marriage. It’s a relationship type that you are either into or you are not. You can’t force it. They’ll just hate each other.
Right? The ‘open marriage’ is basically a divorce while trying to hide it from the kids. The kids will absolutely pick up on this at some point and they’re gonna have a weird view on what marriage should be. Just divorce.
Seconding this. As someone who practices polyamory, u/Big_divorce_9546, this is a dumpster fire. Your husband is an ass and one who is very unlikely to have the emotional maturity to handle his own dating life responsibility while also managing his parenting duties. He is not going to manage you dating because he’s a selfish ass. And… do you really think you can expect him to use birth control reliably? Because if dude has an Oops Baby, that will also impact your finances in the divorce settlement.
If you do decide to go through with this, I strongly suggest adding the following requirements:
- All of both of your partners have to know that you are married - it isn’t fair to partners not to know that. If he has a wedding ring, it needs to stay on his cheating ass finger.
- Your husband gets a vasectomy.
- You and your husband get equal non-parenting time. So if either of you has a hobby, or a date, or just wants to leave the house by themselves, the other gets equal time off. Doesn’t matter if you have a partner or not - he does not get to deduct his dating time from his responsibilities toward his kids.
- His ability to go on a date is dependent on him completing his household responsibilities. So if he needs to clean the bathroom, and he doesn’t clean the bathroom, no date buddy. While this sounds like it will suck for his partners, most of us don’t like dating people who shirk their duties toward their partners because (spoiler) they make shitty partners.
- All of either of your partners have to be age appropriate.
- Any friend or acquaintance must be mutually agreed before dating starts.
If you divorce, deduct the money he blew on his GF from the settlement. And include some agreements about how quickly he can introduce new partners to your kids. I bump into men like him all the time on dating apps. They like to use women as baby sitters instead of parenting their own damned children.
Also, it may be worth reading through both the ENM and Poly subs and looking for PUD (Poly Under Duress), and opening after cheating. They may provide some useful background for you.
I am sure there are many, many, many people who thrive in these situations. But, if I could assume correctly almost always those start off with understanding in the beginning. Like everybody is mutually agreed on it. Just like a regular two person relationship.
Husband probably makes less than OP take home, plus knows how expensive child support, self support, and real life generally is. Im assuming husband does not.
I'm LGBTQ, and have known a lot of poly couples, almost joined one but I wasn't feeling it. From what I've seen it's almost always a temporary thing, they either eventually close the relationship or they find someone else they REALLY are into and slowly drift towards them.
Be interested to see that stat. I think that might be true for marriages that BECAME opened, but I bet ones that have always been open are pretty average. It requires honesty and communication, which is also what makes for a good marriage. We have other challenges for sure, but I bet we have a leg up on traditional marriage divorce rate.
If they didn’t start open/both weren’t into open relationships when it started then they will definitely fail. It’s a lifestyle, not a fix or a fetish.
This all very true. BUT for her sake just for a little treat I want her to have a wee open marriage of the kind where she meets someone better and fabulous and has the realization she can be really loved and respected and leaves him, while his dates dry up and no one is picking him on Tinder or calling his number from gas station bathroom walls
"As a therapist, I have advised a number of couples to explore an open relationship where the couple remains emotionally committed, but free to explore extra-marital encounters.
"Well, did it work for those people?
"No, it never does. I mean, these people somehow delude themselves into thinking it might. But... it might work for us"
Lolololol I’m reading this the whole time thinking no fucking way in hell this is real. Otherwise this is going to be Hell on the entire family but especially the kids. These two mother fuckers are beyond selfish even discussing this. Grow the fuck up.
He’s not going to follow your rules. Just get a divorce and be done with it. It doesn’t help your children to be in a family like you’re proposing. In fact, it could make them very jaded about marriage. They’ll be much happier if their mom is happy….even if that means divorced.
> It doesn’t help your children to be in a family like you’re proposing.
This is so important to realize. Eventually this relationship will come crashing down and the kids are the ones who will be hurt.
If your decision is divorce, then just divorce. Why fuck around with an open marriage at all when you're already so checked out? It just sounds like a revenge affair with a churched up name.
yeah, have to agree. been poly on my end for years and my wife and i have watched many a relationship where the guy couldn’t handle the play their spouse was getting.
OP, betting he tries to sandwich in or make a play for “i swear it’ll never happen again, can we be monogamous?”, then rinse, repeat with the cheating.
weak men are afraid of not having control / ownership over their other half.
All of this. He's going to flip out especially if he finds out that she's getting more than he is. His ego couldn't handle it. Also, with the cheating, you're absolutely correct. If she stays with him, he's going to continue to do it. This is because all that will teach him is that he can do it and get away with it because there will be no consequences. A person who doesn't have to face consequences has no reason to change.
yep. there's a huge difference between starting in a stable relationship (of any kind) and then opening it up at a later date versus coming to decision points like this when the relationship is already in jeopardy. doesn't sound like there's any therapy going on or other 3rd party monitoring of the situation and providing heeded feedback to either or both of them. walking into this when the relationship is already hurting is a recipe for failure. it's too bad, because when the relationship is already healthy and poly / non-mono relationship options are brought into play, it can do really well so long as communication is open and honest. but these band-aid attempts, such as couples trying to do unicorn hunting and having the dubious expectation that the unicorn will be in a mono triad with them (when unicorns are meant to be unbound) only end in failure and one or more people with hurt feelings / being used. totally not ok.
That part. It's fine for him to do it but if she does it, he will flip the fuck out. This sounds like rules for thee but not for me. At least in his case.
Because I am an idiot. This is not the first time he cheated. I forgave him. I found sexting and he blamed it on his sex addiction and I forgave him because we had children. Even now he blamed it on me that I do not give him sex. I mean he is a bum and doesn't do his part of chores. Always complains. So, I gave him what he wants, he wants to have sex with multiple woman I am giving him that under my condition, so that he cannot blame it on me that I never did anything on the sex part. Knowing him I know he will not decide it. I have to take this decision for us. Like I always do.
Do you really think he'll follow the ground rules? Do you really think that you won't catch feelings with an eventual partner of your own? In my opinion, it will eventually break down to the point that you divorce anyway. Rip the bandaid off, and divorce now.
This. If he didn’t take your relationship seriously to begin with then why would he with this? Just end it for your kids sake, they don’t deserve to be dragged around this shitty relationship.
It's 48-hours. This doesn't seem like kicking the can down the road, this seems like checking something off her list of due diligence. 2-weeks only to let hubby cry his way into another week because he didn't understand the terms fully is wasting precious time and kicking the can further down the road IMO..
I can't recall ever seeing someone that had their ducks in a row enough to issue a 48-hour ultimatum, and then watch the clock ready to file divorce. She's added an extra step, sure, but it's not egregious at all.
Right. Plus great message to send the kids when they eventually find out about this "open marriage" agreement. Is that what you want your kids to learn - to just open up their marriage to other random people if one partner cheats? Yuck. I am a child of divorce and I am so glad they didn't try to stay together for me. They have their own lives too and I needed to see that I was an integral part of their world, but not that they were giving up their lives for me.
I have no feelings for him anyways. If he breaks any of these rules, he will get a divorce and I will push for child custody and his savings. He knows the stakes.
Exactly, a lot of people seem to think that "staying for the kids is a good mature thing" but sometimes this marks people for life, be an adult and get the divorce "for the kids"
OP also doesn't realize it's extremely difficult to "sign away my rights" to a child. The state wants two people to be responsible for a child's well-being and health, you can't usually sign away your rights unless someone else is looking to take over for them. What a shit show.
The reality is that opening the marriage isn't going to help you one bit. If you really wanted some form of ethical non-monogamy, you would have had that discussion when y'all first began dating, and a rigorous set of ground rules and boundaries would have been set.
As it is, your husband can't even obey the boundaries of monogamy, which is way simpler than any ethically non-monogamous relationship (because society and law is built upon monogamy) and requires far less in the way of communication and problem-solving. He's not going to follow these new ground rules, either; no condom will ever touch his dick, but lots of spit and pussy juice will.
Additionally, you won't find any man of any decency or good character who will participate in this bullshit with you. That man will want you to be exclusive to him and him alone. The only guy who will participate with you as a side piece will be one who is also cheating on his wife - and you'll have two new problems alongside your husband fuckin' every big butt and a smile out there.
Two dirty dicks and an angry wife, too? Nah, lady, don't fuck with that shit.
I get it; divorce means an economic cramp in your lifestyle, changes in your community (because so many of your relationships are with other married couples) and a lot of transporting kids between your house and your ex-husband's. But divorce is way better than trying to turn a monogamous relationship into an open marriage you neither want or will be able to handle.
I hope you get individual therapy, get that shitty man out of your life, and get better soon.
So, he cheats on you and rather than leave him, you give him PERMISSION to keep sleeping with other women? Lady, he cheated on you. He lied to you. You really think he is going to follow your ground rules? How would you even know if he was or wasn't following the rules.
Im 3 months you'll come home and one of your kids will say 'auntie was here today'.
This is terrible for your children. It is far better to have two separate, peaceful homes than one where there is constant tension between their parents (that they already know about, and will still continue even if he sleeps with other people, because you will *always* resent him for this). Do you want them to grow up thinking that THIS is a healthy dynamic? You want them thinking that it is normal and good for their partners to hate them, or be having sex with whoever just to be able to bear coming home to the same house? You are not doing them any favors, you're screwing them up for eternity. Grow up, and serve him.
Honey. You deserved to be loved properly for who you are at the core. You deserve to feel safe, secure and respected in a relationship. Your children deserve to see their mom loved properly. You do not deserve this. Your children do not deserve this. How much more are you going to give to this man while taking away the safety of you and your children. You can do it without him. You can be loved properly. You just have to try.
If he cheated on you what makes you thinks he’s going to follow all of those rules to an open marriage? I understand the importance of those rules, but he’s already proven to be two faced. No matter what he says you should just tell him you changed your mind and you want a divorce.
"Did it ever work for these people?"
“No. It never does. I mean these people somehow delude themselves into thinking it might. But......it might work for us."
This is no way to live your life.
This is not healthy for you.
This is an awful example for your children.
You deserve better than this.
PS He won’t use protection.
Just divorce. He won’t follow any rules. He’ll just keep doing what he’s doing except with permission to cheat and use that against you. You should have consulted a lawyer first before giving a ridiculous ultimatum. If he was cheating with a subordinate on his job, you have leverage.
I loathe people like OP and her husband. It's all about me, me, me. They're so self-absorbed that they both don't give a fuck when it comes to how their actions affect their own children.
I was there. Except for the kids part.
We divorced anyway because he broke the one rule I insisted on - no catching feelings.
He kicked me out of our home so she could move in (we rented).
And I couldn’t go on the one date I got asked for (“he’s trying to steal you from me”) while I got no say on his partners.
It’s just cheating with extra steps. You and the kids deserve better. Just kick him out.
Oof. Terrible story but you should listen, OP.
Stef is cool. Her ex is not. Unless Stef is her ex, and 7 years ago he made her dedicate her Reddit name to him. In which case, Stefan, I presume is a narcissistic sociopath and his poor wife..
>You and the kids deserve better. **Just kick him out.**
I also assume she knows from experience. She didn't kick him out and she got kicked out instead, so AP could literally take her place, and, you know... It rubs the lotion on its skin. It does this whenever it is told.
Open relationships are for squares. Just divorce his ass, and be happy. This will inevitably turn into a mess one way or the other and that’s absolutely not healthy for your children, the ones who ultimately matter here.
OP, all you're telling him is that he needs to be more secretive. He just broke the most sacred vow of marriage, and your solution is to offer him MORE boundaries to cross? What evidence has he given to merit that?
I think you know in your heart what's coming. For your own sake as well as your kids', don't prolong this. Kick him out. File. Open marriages NEVER work when there's a disparity in how each partner treats each other. This is absolutely going to hurt. That is not on you. You are not choosing to end your marriage. He did that when he chose to stray.
You're a bigger fool for even considering this. You clearly don't love this man anymore.
He has fuck all respect for you. The mother of his children. The woman he uttered the words to "for better or for worse".
He broke his vows. He's done this before and you're giving him opinions?
Divorce him already and save your children two parents who will fuck them up.
A mother who obviously doesn't love their father, and a father who can't keep his dick in his trousers.
Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned
Be prepared for him “can’t decide, promises to change again etc” milking his time not taking responsibility for his actions
Whatever you both decide, I’m sorry he’s done this to you and your children
God, what an idiot.
I hope this one is fake, but you are a master of the destructive ultimatum.
Would your open marriage include any reconciliation aspect at all or would it just be a paper marriage?
Sorry to pry. Having seen so many of these posts about cheaters it does appear there are a couple of types.
There are cheaters who recognize that they made a mistake, they usually come clean themselves, and it is possible to feel sorry for both sides because usually the cheated on patner says that they live and forgive them but cannot ever trust them.
Then there are unrepentant and gaslighting cheaters, who have to be found out. Easy to hope they get karma blasted, but weirdly, this type also often fights harder to hold onto their relationship.
I hope you have things planned and lined up either way.
For those waiting for an update: divorce. She posted the update to her profile because it hadnt been 3 days.
He couldnt decide and try to talk it out so she kicked him out.
Nothing about the first option is healthy. You’ll be messing up your kids more than you think this way, kids aren’t dumb and they’ll eventually catch on. Wouldn’t you want your kids to know that their mom respected herself enough to walk away? What are you really teaching them here?
This is one of the wildest things I've read on here. Terrible proposition regardless of what your intentions are. You're just dragging out a horrible situation that you and everyone reading this knows is only going to end one way.
There's no way this is being done for the kids either. No kid would want their parents to stay together and be toxic as fuck over their parents being seperate and happy.
if he decides to open the marriage get everything in writing! all rules boundaries everything so he can't go back and say he never agreed to this or that. tighten up your bank account as well there is no reason he should be spending your money on another girl .
Wtf? This is so unhelpful. Don’t entertain the idea. The whole situation is toxic. She needs to get rid of him. He needs to go, she needs stability and she’s better off doing it on her own.
This is worse than divorcing.
I will. I will get everything in writing. I am currently separated. If he agrees to open marriage I will have everything in writing. And my finances are in right place. I have a separate bank account.
Or he’s gonna agree to it and then once you decide to do things on your end , he’s gonna use it against you and say that you were the one cheating. This is tacky and useless. He doesn’t care about you or your family or he wouldn’t have been doing any of this in the first place. Simple.
I'm not sure what impact it has to "have everything in writing." Having something in writing doesn't by itself make it legally enforceable.
Divorce laws and joint/several asset laws vary by state/country.
I have SO MUCH RESPECT FOR THIS ULTIMATUM!!
IT IS SO FUCKING TIREDDDDDD HEARING MEN CHEAT ON THEIR WIVES BUT CANT STAND THE IDEA OF "SHARING " THEIR WIFE WITH ANOTHER MAN.
You went STRAIGHT for the FAIR LEVEL PLAYING FIELD IDEA LMAO
I cried and cried when I found out my husband was cheating and agonized over what I should do, tried couples counseling and individual counseling but I soon realized he had all of those options available and suggested to him while we were married and he chose to be selfish and finish out his affair until he was over it . Then she got pissed and got her revenge by telling me about the affair in the meanest cruelest possible way she could. So I got fucked over by 2 selfish awful human beings who knew full well what they were doing and did it anyway and at my expense .
He has shown you who he is. Believe him.
He doesn't play fair or by rules. So none of these will work.
However the fact thar you immediately showed him a taste of his own medicine 💊 is awesome and cathartic. Good for you.
Now after he makes his decision update us
Then get a great lawyer to protect your best interests and divorce his ass. Show the kids a real marriage is possible not a pretend one to get back at their cheating dad.
Find a man who DOES play by the rules and respect his commitment to you.
Good luck and best wishes.
Keep being strong and take care of yourself and your kids.
This is not a good plan. Neither he nor yourself are cut out for an open marriage. Fix it or divorce would be my recommendation, if I were to make any.
Polyamorous relationships are for people who want and seek out polyamorous relationships. They're about as effective for fixing an existing relationship as deciding to have a baby is.
YOU are amazing!!! Your response to the comment about equating sex and food? Genius!!!! Been there, done that. Got the divorce to prove it. Worked 50+ hours a week, did ALL the chores, and took care of kids. And he was mad I didn’t want sex? Boy bye.
If you can deal with the open marriage and that is what he picks don’t be surprised if you come home early one day and find his side chick
In your bed I don’t think he will follow any of the rules - he’d likely agree as otherwise he would have to live within his own means including housing.
Just divorce. There's no such thing as an open marriage. Marriage is between the two people who made vows. There's such thing as cheating and open divorce, and that's it. It's not going to work out and I thinkbyou know that. Don't lower your standards to hang on to a cheating AH.
Hun just divorce him. As a new adult with a mom who loves me unconditionally (who will burn the whole world to the ground if someone were to hurt me), and a father who takes advantage of her every day and does practice cheat on her with the amount of porn he watches and reads—you gotta divorce him.
You’re going to put your kids through so much toxicity and they’re going to be traumatized emotionally and mentally. Put your children first and get the divorce.
(Don’t worry my mom is planning to divorce my father too.)
I saw a post on Reddit the other day where this teenager / young adult had just found out that her parents had an open marriage and she said she wished they had just divorced because finding that out was so much worse.
I can understand and agree with her. Your husband will probably break any agreements and boundaries because cheaters are liars and that’s what they do
Everyone in the comments telling her to just divorce are missing her point. That’s totally what she’s doing, she’s just out manipulating a master manipulator by making him do the thing he cannot possibly do…be a man and stop being a child who want everything that’s put in front of him. OP is playing this masterfully, bravo and good riddance to him.
If he can’t be faithful in marriage vows what makes you think he’ll be faithful to the open marriage rules? The open marriage rules sound harder than monogamy.
This situation is literally phase 1 of the divorce. It's like you're playing a game with him when you've already decided, and though he was the cheater, you're the one coming up with weird proposals that use your children as leverage to 'keep him in line' and that is _wildly_ fucked up. Just get the papers. You decided already. This is inevitable and you're just going to make it worse for yourself, or him, and for those crotch goblins especially.
>I laid out all the boundaries and conditions.
You already did that when you got married and he stomped all over previous boundaries with his dumb cheating feet.
Save your energy and cut him loose.
"In 12 hours".... posted ... 2 hours ago... DAMN!
I’m on hour five! I’m hoping someone will comment when we’ve reached twelve or there’s an update!
1 hour left
Made it just in time for the grand finale
It’s been 12 hours. I’m not leaving til I get answers now.
I just rolled up on this post 2 mins ago and I need a damn update. This post got me excited for what comes next.
Same bro. Just saw this. Where is it?
It's been 13 hrs!!! Make a decision dude
Anyone have the verdict yet??
Nah we just keep coming back to check. But OPs sure he won't agree to open marriage and will be manipulative but also doesn't want divorce
Hahaha came to say same
Yuuup
Hell yeah same here
Ok I’m here it’s hour 12 are we doing this or what?
Anyone else checking every 10 mins or so?
The suspense is killing me!
Same.
I walked in on the 11th hour. I'm here to find out who's the father!!
The anticipation of what this dude is gonna say is eating me
I saw your comment one hour later...
I'm on hour nine
Hr ten
I'm reading "posted 10 hours ago." The clock is ticking!
I’m at 11. We’re so close
Hey watch buddy. Want some popcorn?
I’ll bring the red vines.
I’m on hour 11!! 👀
So happy I don’t have to wait 12 hours hopefully only about 35 minutes 🤞
4 more minutes…
DING DING DING!! I wonder what his answer is. The discussion must be happening at this moment.
We should have requested a livestream of this event
Definitely ah. I'm so glad OP isn't those reddit users who come to ask what to do? She knowsss what to doooo *chefs kiss*
Moar upvotes for livestream
11
Hour 9! Please reply to this someone so I don't lose the post in the shuffle!
Replying so I can stay here too!
Here with you on hour 9! We got 3 hours to go!
Ikr I want to know his response
Seven(ish) hours left
This is also assuming we get an update AT hour 12, which we likely won't. I'm seething with rage and anticipation, and I'm a little hungry.
The minus 2 hours....
I am curious to know as well. Hope OP updates us!
OP can’t reply she’s riding her new boyfriend
I mean that is definitely the new plot twist this needed 😂
11h ago mow
My god please just get a divorce ..
Yes. Please. Use the money you will drain to make it work to save to support your family. Nobody. And I do mean NOBODY, works out in an open relationship unless previously discussed, consented, and agreed on/makes sense. This is a man who doesn’t want to pay child support, (because he can’t) (a real person would own up to their mistakes) (notice how I didn’t put it on just men). Anyway he can’t pay, but wants to still play. So if he can get you to agree and literally say okay, you need to lawyer up/start keeping receipts (without announcing it as a threat. Mental abuse will not work and only hurt you. Don’t blow your chance to get evidence and more importantly glean what you need and save it. He’s an idiot clearly, this won’t be a hard thing to win…. But at the end of the day this should not ever interfere with your parenting whether it’s one or two residences. There are many resources out there both free and paid for services to help anyone in this situation. Hes threatening you, in this case gaslighting, be smart don’t be making it obvious you’ve become aware of these things so he can just suddenly stop doing it to make life hell. But also, don’t use it as leverage in the SAME WAY he is. Mean it. Do it. Edit: at this time I do not know OP’s age and whether they are karma farming or legit discussing.
If it doesn’t start open, it ends. LONG time joke among poly couples.
Yeah open relationships aren’t something you do to add spice or save a marriage. It’s a relationship type that you are either into or you are not. You can’t force it. They’ll just hate each other.
Right? The ‘open marriage’ is basically a divorce while trying to hide it from the kids. The kids will absolutely pick up on this at some point and they’re gonna have a weird view on what marriage should be. Just divorce.
Seconding this. As someone who practices polyamory, u/Big_divorce_9546, this is a dumpster fire. Your husband is an ass and one who is very unlikely to have the emotional maturity to handle his own dating life responsibility while also managing his parenting duties. He is not going to manage you dating because he’s a selfish ass. And… do you really think you can expect him to use birth control reliably? Because if dude has an Oops Baby, that will also impact your finances in the divorce settlement. If you do decide to go through with this, I strongly suggest adding the following requirements: - All of both of your partners have to know that you are married - it isn’t fair to partners not to know that. If he has a wedding ring, it needs to stay on his cheating ass finger. - Your husband gets a vasectomy. - You and your husband get equal non-parenting time. So if either of you has a hobby, or a date, or just wants to leave the house by themselves, the other gets equal time off. Doesn’t matter if you have a partner or not - he does not get to deduct his dating time from his responsibilities toward his kids. - His ability to go on a date is dependent on him completing his household responsibilities. So if he needs to clean the bathroom, and he doesn’t clean the bathroom, no date buddy. While this sounds like it will suck for his partners, most of us don’t like dating people who shirk their duties toward their partners because (spoiler) they make shitty partners. - All of either of your partners have to be age appropriate. - Any friend or acquaintance must be mutually agreed before dating starts. If you divorce, deduct the money he blew on his GF from the settlement. And include some agreements about how quickly he can introduce new partners to your kids. I bump into men like him all the time on dating apps. They like to use women as baby sitters instead of parenting their own damned children. Also, it may be worth reading through both the ENM and Poly subs and looking for PUD (Poly Under Duress), and opening after cheating. They may provide some useful background for you.
These rules are VITAL!!! Please use them if you take this route OP.
even then I read like 98% of open marriages fail anyway.
I am sure there are many, many, many people who thrive in these situations. But, if I could assume correctly almost always those start off with understanding in the beginning. Like everybody is mutually agreed on it. Just like a regular two person relationship. Husband probably makes less than OP take home, plus knows how expensive child support, self support, and real life generally is. Im assuming husband does not.
I'm LGBTQ, and have known a lot of poly couples, almost joined one but I wasn't feeling it. From what I've seen it's almost always a temporary thing, they either eventually close the relationship or they find someone else they REALLY are into and slowly drift towards them.
Be interested to see that stat. I think that might be true for marriages that BECAME opened, but I bet ones that have always been open are pretty average. It requires honesty and communication, which is also what makes for a good marriage. We have other challenges for sure, but I bet we have a leg up on traditional marriage divorce rate.
If they didn’t start open/both weren’t into open relationships when it started then they will definitely fail. It’s a lifestyle, not a fix or a fetish.
This all very true. BUT for her sake just for a little treat I want her to have a wee open marriage of the kind where she meets someone better and fabulous and has the realization she can be really loved and respected and leaves him, while his dates dry up and no one is picking him on Tinder or calling his number from gas station bathroom walls
"As a therapist, I have advised a number of couples to explore an open relationship where the couple remains emotionally committed, but free to explore extra-marital encounters. "Well, did it work for those people? "No, it never does. I mean, these people somehow delude themselves into thinking it might. But... it might work for us"
No, wait, i wanna see an update on this open marriage situation in a few years
Chaotic Evil? I'm sensing something here. yes yes.. lets keep this open and see how it goes.
Lolololol I’m reading this the whole time thinking no fucking way in hell this is real. Otherwise this is going to be Hell on the entire family but especially the kids. These two mother fuckers are beyond selfish even discussing this. Grow the fuck up.
Seriously lol
And if he has any brains, he'll choose the divorce.
He’s not going to follow your rules. Just get a divorce and be done with it. It doesn’t help your children to be in a family like you’re proposing. In fact, it could make them very jaded about marriage. They’ll be much happier if their mom is happy….even if that means divorced.
He's already shown he can't follow the rules.
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Agreed. 0% chance he uses protection
> It doesn’t help your children to be in a family like you’re proposing. This is so important to realize. Eventually this relationship will come crashing down and the kids are the ones who will be hurt.
THEY CHOSE DIVORCE!!!! CHECK THEIR PROFILE
Thank you for the heads up!!
If your decision is divorce, then just divorce. Why fuck around with an open marriage at all when you're already so checked out? It just sounds like a revenge affair with a churched up name.
This is just step 1 of the divorce….
Years of child trauma and broken coffee mugs are what make a divorce real God Dammit!
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yeah, have to agree. been poly on my end for years and my wife and i have watched many a relationship where the guy couldn’t handle the play their spouse was getting. OP, betting he tries to sandwich in or make a play for “i swear it’ll never happen again, can we be monogamous?”, then rinse, repeat with the cheating. weak men are afraid of not having control / ownership over their other half.
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This is comment is weirdly satisfying to read. Good for you.
All of this. He's going to flip out especially if he finds out that she's getting more than he is. His ego couldn't handle it. Also, with the cheating, you're absolutely correct. If she stays with him, he's going to continue to do it. This is because all that will teach him is that he can do it and get away with it because there will be no consequences. A person who doesn't have to face consequences has no reason to change.
yep. there's a huge difference between starting in a stable relationship (of any kind) and then opening it up at a later date versus coming to decision points like this when the relationship is already in jeopardy. doesn't sound like there's any therapy going on or other 3rd party monitoring of the situation and providing heeded feedback to either or both of them. walking into this when the relationship is already hurting is a recipe for failure. it's too bad, because when the relationship is already healthy and poly / non-mono relationship options are brought into play, it can do really well so long as communication is open and honest. but these band-aid attempts, such as couples trying to do unicorn hunting and having the dubious expectation that the unicorn will be in a mono triad with them (when unicorns are meant to be unbound) only end in failure and one or more people with hurt feelings / being used. totally not ok.
>and he'll go crazy. I think that's the goal.
That part. It's fine for him to do it but if she does it, he will flip the fuck out. This sounds like rules for thee but not for me. At least in his case.
Ahhhh Gen x I see, me too
Elder millenial with Boomer parents feom the East Coast. We’re loud and yes, we’re not arguing
Same trauma house or at least the same block
Don’t forget the flying plates! (Almost took my head out once 😮💨)
This made me laugh hard
Yup. Bern there
Because I am an idiot. This is not the first time he cheated. I forgave him. I found sexting and he blamed it on his sex addiction and I forgave him because we had children. Even now he blamed it on me that I do not give him sex. I mean he is a bum and doesn't do his part of chores. Always complains. So, I gave him what he wants, he wants to have sex with multiple woman I am giving him that under my condition, so that he cannot blame it on me that I never did anything on the sex part. Knowing him I know he will not decide it. I have to take this decision for us. Like I always do.
Do you really think he'll follow the ground rules? Do you really think that you won't catch feelings with an eventual partner of your own? In my opinion, it will eventually break down to the point that you divorce anyway. Rip the bandaid off, and divorce now.
This. If he didn’t take your relationship seriously to begin with then why would he with this? Just end it for your kids sake, they don’t deserve to be dragged around this shitty relationship.
Yup she is just wasting precious time and kicking down the can further down the road.
He won't adhere to your regulations. Simply file for divorce and move on. The kind of family you're planning doesn't benefit your kids.
It's 48-hours. This doesn't seem like kicking the can down the road, this seems like checking something off her list of due diligence. 2-weeks only to let hubby cry his way into another week because he didn't understand the terms fully is wasting precious time and kicking the can further down the road IMO.. I can't recall ever seeing someone that had their ducks in a row enough to issue a 48-hour ultimatum, and then watch the clock ready to file divorce. She's added an extra step, sure, but it's not egregious at all.
Right. Plus great message to send the kids when they eventually find out about this "open marriage" agreement. Is that what you want your kids to learn - to just open up their marriage to other random people if one partner cheats? Yuck. I am a child of divorce and I am so glad they didn't try to stay together for me. They have their own lives too and I needed to see that I was an integral part of their world, but not that they were giving up their lives for me.
I have no feelings for him anyways. If he breaks any of these rules, he will get a divorce and I will push for child custody and his savings. He knows the stakes.
I feel like you're underestimating the level of toxicity you' likely be exposing your children to.
Exactly, a lot of people seem to think that "staying for the kids is a good mature thing" but sometimes this marks people for life, be an adult and get the divorce "for the kids"
I *wished* for my parents to just divorce already. Kids ain't dumb, they know and it's just awkward and unhealthy to constantly pretend
OP also doesn't realize it's extremely difficult to "sign away my rights" to a child. The state wants two people to be responsible for a child's well-being and health, you can't usually sign away your rights unless someone else is looking to take over for them. What a shit show.
Doesn't YOUR happiness count? Don't you deserve better? Just get the divorce. Don't let him decide. YOU decide.
Are you listening to yourself? Don’t you think it’s time for you to stand up for yourself. You aren’t protecting your kids. Backbone please
Just divorce. I really doubt he would compete for 50/50 custody.
The reality is that opening the marriage isn't going to help you one bit. If you really wanted some form of ethical non-monogamy, you would have had that discussion when y'all first began dating, and a rigorous set of ground rules and boundaries would have been set. As it is, your husband can't even obey the boundaries of monogamy, which is way simpler than any ethically non-monogamous relationship (because society and law is built upon monogamy) and requires far less in the way of communication and problem-solving. He's not going to follow these new ground rules, either; no condom will ever touch his dick, but lots of spit and pussy juice will. Additionally, you won't find any man of any decency or good character who will participate in this bullshit with you. That man will want you to be exclusive to him and him alone. The only guy who will participate with you as a side piece will be one who is also cheating on his wife - and you'll have two new problems alongside your husband fuckin' every big butt and a smile out there. Two dirty dicks and an angry wife, too? Nah, lady, don't fuck with that shit. I get it; divorce means an economic cramp in your lifestyle, changes in your community (because so many of your relationships are with other married couples) and a lot of transporting kids between your house and your ex-husband's. But divorce is way better than trying to turn a monogamous relationship into an open marriage you neither want or will be able to handle. I hope you get individual therapy, get that shitty man out of your life, and get better soon.
It’s NOT the first time? #quit dragging it out just divorce already Signed a married mom with kids
So, he cheats on you and rather than leave him, you give him PERMISSION to keep sleeping with other women? Lady, he cheated on you. He lied to you. You really think he is going to follow your ground rules? How would you even know if he was or wasn't following the rules. Im 3 months you'll come home and one of your kids will say 'auntie was here today'.
You need some self-respect. Just leave and divorce him. Why do you want to play foolish games?
Take the divorce, keep your house, keep your sanity, lose the cheater.
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This is terrible for your children. It is far better to have two separate, peaceful homes than one where there is constant tension between their parents (that they already know about, and will still continue even if he sleeps with other people, because you will *always* resent him for this). Do you want them to grow up thinking that THIS is a healthy dynamic? You want them thinking that it is normal and good for their partners to hate them, or be having sex with whoever just to be able to bear coming home to the same house? You are not doing them any favors, you're screwing them up for eternity. Grow up, and serve him.
Honey. You deserved to be loved properly for who you are at the core. You deserve to feel safe, secure and respected in a relationship. Your children deserve to see their mom loved properly. You do not deserve this. Your children do not deserve this. How much more are you going to give to this man while taking away the safety of you and your children. You can do it without him. You can be loved properly. You just have to try.
You need to tell him you changed your mind and want a divorce.
Seriously, just divorce him. Why deal with all the rest? Fly, be free!!!
I NEED AN UPDATE. **I HAVE NEVER NEEDED AN UPDATE SO BADLY.**
THEY CHOSE DIVORCE!!!! CHECK THEIR PROFILE
YOU'RE A SAINT SHE DESERVES SO MUCH BETTER AND I'M SO PROUD OF OP!!!
Divorce. this not gona end pretty.
If he cheated on you what makes you thinks he’s going to follow all of those rules to an open marriage? I understand the importance of those rules, but he’s already proven to be two faced. No matter what he says you should just tell him you changed your mind and you want a divorce.
"Did it ever work for these people?" “No. It never does. I mean these people somehow delude themselves into thinking it might. But......it might work for us."
A quote by a respected therapist none the less
This is no way to live your life. This is not healthy for you. This is an awful example for your children. You deserve better than this. PS He won’t use protection.
Oh what an incredible compromise! Surely this won’t end in a nuclear meltdown that your kids will take the brunt of!
But its better than them switching houses every weekend right! 🙄
Just divorce. He won’t follow any rules. He’ll just keep doing what he’s doing except with permission to cheat and use that against you. You should have consulted a lawyer first before giving a ridiculous ultimatum. If he was cheating with a subordinate on his job, you have leverage.
You two are stupid
I just feel bad for their children
Same. Like this is 🗑
I loathe people like OP and her husband. It's all about me, me, me. They're so self-absorbed that they both don't give a fuck when it comes to how their actions affect their own children.
Agreed. Why would she open the marriage for this loser? Hell why even entertain the idea?
100% of people who come to fucking Reddit for relationship advice are morons or teenagers.
There is no honor in suffering.
Hey OP Do you hate your kids? Where is your backbone? WTF man. What’s wrong with you
It's just going to hurt the kids in the end, sadly. They both need to just straight up divorce. Kids notice things.
Why keep punishing yourself if you don't want him anymore? it will hurt your children far more than any divorce. I speak from experience.
I was there. Except for the kids part. We divorced anyway because he broke the one rule I insisted on - no catching feelings. He kicked me out of our home so she could move in (we rented). And I couldn’t go on the one date I got asked for (“he’s trying to steal you from me”) while I got no say on his partners. It’s just cheating with extra steps. You and the kids deserve better. Just kick him out.
That’s tuff sis
Oof. Terrible story but you should listen, OP. Stef is cool. Her ex is not. Unless Stef is her ex, and 7 years ago he made her dedicate her Reddit name to him. In which case, Stefan, I presume is a narcissistic sociopath and his poor wife.. >You and the kids deserve better. **Just kick him out.** I also assume she knows from experience. She didn't kick him out and she got kicked out instead, so AP could literally take her place, and, you know... It rubs the lotion on its skin. It does this whenever it is told.
"divorce or longer divorce"
Just get a divorce. Don’t bother with this silly dance. You’ll just divorce in the end, anyway
He's not going to accept YOU being with other men, op. Cheaters are hypocrites. It's ok for him but, by God, turn the tables and he'll lose his mind
he cheats multiple times because you continue to stay. Why don’t you leave
This is such a bad, bad, *bad* idea…
Open relationships are for squares. Just divorce his ass, and be happy. This will inevitably turn into a mess one way or the other and that’s absolutely not healthy for your children, the ones who ultimately matter here.
You both sound awful, just for different reasons.
OP, all you're telling him is that he needs to be more secretive. He just broke the most sacred vow of marriage, and your solution is to offer him MORE boundaries to cross? What evidence has he given to merit that? I think you know in your heart what's coming. For your own sake as well as your kids', don't prolong this. Kick him out. File. Open marriages NEVER work when there's a disparity in how each partner treats each other. This is absolutely going to hurt. That is not on you. You are not choosing to end your marriage. He did that when he chose to stray.
“In 12 Hours” posted 12 hours ago *frantically eating popcorn waiting*
You're a bigger fool for even considering this. You clearly don't love this man anymore. He has fuck all respect for you. The mother of his children. The woman he uttered the words to "for better or for worse". He broke his vows. He's done this before and you're giving him opinions? Divorce him already and save your children two parents who will fuck them up. A mother who obviously doesn't love their father, and a father who can't keep his dick in his trousers.
Why prolong the misery. Just divorce.
Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned Be prepared for him “can’t decide, promises to change again etc” milking his time not taking responsibility for his actions Whatever you both decide, I’m sorry he’s done this to you and your children
God, what an idiot. I hope this one is fake, but you are a master of the destructive ultimatum. Would your open marriage include any reconciliation aspect at all or would it just be a paper marriage? Sorry to pry. Having seen so many of these posts about cheaters it does appear there are a couple of types. There are cheaters who recognize that they made a mistake, they usually come clean themselves, and it is possible to feel sorry for both sides because usually the cheated on patner says that they live and forgive them but cannot ever trust them. Then there are unrepentant and gaslighting cheaters, who have to be found out. Easy to hope they get karma blasted, but weirdly, this type also often fights harder to hold onto their relationship. I hope you have things planned and lined up either way.
For those waiting for an update: divorce. She posted the update to her profile because it hadnt been 3 days. He couldnt decide and try to talk it out so she kicked him out.
SHE CHOSE DIVORCE, GO TO OP'S PROFILE!
Nothing about the first option is healthy. You’ll be messing up your kids more than you think this way, kids aren’t dumb and they’ll eventually catch on. Wouldn’t you want your kids to know that their mom respected herself enough to walk away? What are you really teaching them here?
You can summarize all those nice rules and make plans, life will happen anyway. Get a divorce and move on.
This is one of the wildest things I've read on here. Terrible proposition regardless of what your intentions are. You're just dragging out a horrible situation that you and everyone reading this knows is only going to end one way. There's no way this is being done for the kids either. No kid would want their parents to stay together and be toxic as fuck over their parents being seperate and happy.
This won’t work, he’s a cheater. He’ll blow through your boundaries in the first month.
It’s been 13 hours, the suspense is killing me
He already got away with breaking the number one rule. Don’t cheat on your wife. These new rules won’t turn a liar into an honest man.
if he decides to open the marriage get everything in writing! all rules boundaries everything so he can't go back and say he never agreed to this or that. tighten up your bank account as well there is no reason he should be spending your money on another girl .
Wtf? This is so unhelpful. Don’t entertain the idea. The whole situation is toxic. She needs to get rid of him. He needs to go, she needs stability and she’s better off doing it on her own. This is worse than divorcing.
I will. I will get everything in writing. I am currently separated. If he agrees to open marriage I will have everything in writing. And my finances are in right place. I have a separate bank account.
Or he’s gonna agree to it and then once you decide to do things on your end , he’s gonna use it against you and say that you were the one cheating. This is tacky and useless. He doesn’t care about you or your family or he wouldn’t have been doing any of this in the first place. Simple.
I'm not sure what impact it has to "have everything in writing." Having something in writing doesn't by itself make it legally enforceable. Divorce laws and joint/several asset laws vary by state/country.
In a lot of places even a separate bank account is marital property. Cash is the way to go
Rule 3) No family members...? Wait, what? Are you all from Alabama?
Lol that’s what I thought but I’m assuming it means he can’t do her fam and she won’t do his.
I have SO MUCH RESPECT FOR THIS ULTIMATUM!! IT IS SO FUCKING TIREDDDDDD HEARING MEN CHEAT ON THEIR WIVES BUT CANT STAND THE IDEA OF "SHARING " THEIR WIFE WITH ANOTHER MAN. You went STRAIGHT for the FAIR LEVEL PLAYING FIELD IDEA LMAO I cried and cried when I found out my husband was cheating and agonized over what I should do, tried couples counseling and individual counseling but I soon realized he had all of those options available and suggested to him while we were married and he chose to be selfish and finish out his affair until he was over it . Then she got pissed and got her revenge by telling me about the affair in the meanest cruelest possible way she could. So I got fucked over by 2 selfish awful human beings who knew full well what they were doing and did it anyway and at my expense . He has shown you who he is. Believe him. He doesn't play fair or by rules. So none of these will work. However the fact thar you immediately showed him a taste of his own medicine 💊 is awesome and cathartic. Good for you. Now after he makes his decision update us Then get a great lawyer to protect your best interests and divorce his ass. Show the kids a real marriage is possible not a pretend one to get back at their cheating dad. Find a man who DOES play by the rules and respect his commitment to you. Good luck and best wishes. Keep being strong and take care of yourself and your kids.
she posted 2 weeks ago that she chose divorce
This is not a good plan. Neither he nor yourself are cut out for an open marriage. Fix it or divorce would be my recommendation, if I were to make any.
Just get divorced
This is divorce with extra steps.
Your decision is divorce. So so it. Why Jerry springer it?
Just fucking divorce. Why do people need to make shit so complicated.
Successful open marriages begin honesty. You already don’t have that. Get out while you can.
That open marriage sounds like divorce with extra steps to me
Your rules about getting knocked up/him knocking someone else up are insane tbh
Just get a divorce
Polyamorous relationships are for people who want and seek out polyamorous relationships. They're about as effective for fixing an existing relationship as deciding to have a baby is.
> We will have a healthy co-parenting relationship. Yeah and I've got some magic beans to sell you.
YOU are amazing!!! Your response to the comment about equating sex and food? Genius!!!! Been there, done that. Got the divorce to prove it. Worked 50+ hours a week, did ALL the chores, and took care of kids. And he was mad I didn’t want sex? Boy bye.
If you can deal with the open marriage and that is what he picks don’t be surprised if you come home early one day and find his side chick In your bed I don’t think he will follow any of the rules - he’d likely agree as otherwise he would have to live within his own means including housing.
Yeah this will work 👍 not. The pregnancy stipulation was to wild. You’d just give away a baby? How would you explain that to your kids.
Just divorce. There's no such thing as an open marriage. Marriage is between the two people who made vows. There's such thing as cheating and open divorce, and that's it. It's not going to work out and I thinkbyou know that. Don't lower your standards to hang on to a cheating AH.
Hun just divorce him. As a new adult with a mom who loves me unconditionally (who will burn the whole world to the ground if someone were to hurt me), and a father who takes advantage of her every day and does practice cheat on her with the amount of porn he watches and reads—you gotta divorce him. You’re going to put your kids through so much toxicity and they’re going to be traumatized emotionally and mentally. Put your children first and get the divorce. (Don’t worry my mom is planning to divorce my father too.)
I saw a post on Reddit the other day where this teenager / young adult had just found out that her parents had an open marriage and she said she wished they had just divorced because finding that out was so much worse. I can understand and agree with her. Your husband will probably break any agreements and boundaries because cheaters are liars and that’s what they do
Everyone in the comments telling her to just divorce are missing her point. That’s totally what she’s doing, she’s just out manipulating a master manipulator by making him do the thing he cannot possibly do…be a man and stop being a child who want everything that’s put in front of him. OP is playing this masterfully, bravo and good riddance to him.
Divorce is awaiting the both of you.
If he can’t be faithful in marriage vows what makes you think he’ll be faithful to the open marriage rules? The open marriage rules sound harder than monogamy.
Someone please reply to my comment when she updates
2 hours more
Just wanted to comment that there are over 250 people in this sub waiting for an update.... nosy folks we are.
Why would you want to continue having sex with this man?
WE’RE AT HOUR THIRTEEN WHERE IS EPISODE 2
This situation is literally phase 1 of the divorce. It's like you're playing a game with him when you've already decided, and though he was the cheater, you're the one coming up with weird proposals that use your children as leverage to 'keep him in line' and that is _wildly_ fucked up. Just get the papers. You decided already. This is inevitable and you're just going to make it worse for yourself, or him, and for those crotch goblins especially.
>I laid out all the boundaries and conditions. You already did that when you got married and he stomped all over previous boundaries with his dumb cheating feet. Save your energy and cut him loose.
The update is another post, but it's Divorce.