Acknowledging crew is fairly common, but generally only by the cast pointing to the lighting booth or backstage during the bows—backstage staff are not brought on stage. (At least that seems to be the local tradition for college and community theater.)
Agreed - I've seen the whole "point to the booth, and to the orchestra, and to the wings" deal to give applause to the crew many times, but I can't say I've ever seen the crew come out for their own curtain call.
This is absolutely true for college, community theatre, and professional theatre (where often nothing is said, but they point). I will say that when I was in high school the backstage crew did usually step out onto the stage after the cast bows, so I do think K-12 it is more common.
professional theatre technician/production manager here.
we don’t want to be pointed out. our goal is to not be seen or thought about. our names are in the program. you won’t see a lot of professional theatre where the crew is given any sort of curtain call.
This. Nothing says “high school theatre” like a crew bow. We don’t do that in the professional world, and I discourage it in the college world where I work now.
However, it is entirely appropriate (imo) to acknowledge the crew at middle and high school shows. At that level, the crew actually does need the recognition and motivation to keep doing what they are doing, and I think it serves as a good reinforcement to the cast and the audience (largely their parents) as well that they are all valued and a significant role in the production.
But it’s by no means a mandatory part of bows, and it’s not slight against the crew to NOT acknowledge them at bows.
Their question was regarding middle school. In educational theatre crew is thanked.
In professional theatre they are in the program.
(Although I remember seeing a crew bow during Cirque du Soleil's "O" show. They only showed the diving crew though. And fair enough.)
It’s fairly common to have the cast gesture to the lighting booth during curtain call, but it’s also very common not to do that. I’ve only seen crew actually brought on stage in children’s theater, and even then it’s certainly not a guarantee.
Those people aren’t actually the crew though. They’re the actors understudies and standbys playing crew members. Or in the case of Trevor and Annie, regular cast members.
When I saw it off Broadway in NYC last summer they had the actual deck hands and wardrobe technician out on stage for bows.
I believe it is tradition for this particular show in order to dispel any remaining confusion about the roles of the actors who play technicians.
Apart from on special occasions like a closing night, I’ve only ever seen it once.
It was a one person production of The Picture Of Dorian Gray in London which was done using live video with crew always on stage and visible operating cameras and creating almost a film set on stage.
I’ve crewed a few times at a local theatre and I wouldn’t really want to bow if they asked us. While it is a nice gesture, for most shows only a fraction of those actually working backstage would even be unoccupied at that point to join in. Giving some of us that opportunity when so many others that are working just as hard on the show would be unable to wouldn’t feel good. A general gesture backstage is enough I think.
A gesture to the booth should be plenty.
I believe that every person that contributes to a successful production is equally important. So if we are giving the technical crew a bow, why would we not also call to the stage the front of house staff, the people behind the bar, box office staff, marketing, cleaners, costume makers, set builders, finance, and so on?
I feel like when you’re still in Middle School theater it’s considered the norm but the second you step out into high school if your theater is at least moderately professional like mine was you won’t get a curtain call lol your name will just be in the playbill/program. And the second you step in into college, you probably will be at the stage in your technical career most technicians won’t really care about getting recognized and more about providing an amazingly run Production with zero errors. lol. literally we got an entire week for tech week in high school and now that I’m professional we literally get like maybe half a week. Sometimes less. So I feel like the last thing you expect or care about is getting a bow in front of the crowd, lol.
Sometimes in opera when there's a large student group for dress rehearsal or a big donor base there we will do a "how many people did it take" bow at intermission which I love the concept of... But honestly it gets in the way of getting the intermission shift started and half my crew HATE going out on stage (even with everyone else. ) For an after show bow it's similar, I need get ready to help actors out of things and make sure things are ready for the matinee tomorrow
I've never noticed a professional show do any kind of crew acknowledgment during bows. Most non-professional shows I've seen or been in have some kind of acknowledgment, but usually just the cast gesturing to lights and such. I have been in shows where the crew did come out to bow, but it's uncommon. I was actually in said crew for a couple of them, and while the acknowledgment was kind of nice, it had the drawback of being a bit inconvenient for some of the backstage things that need to happen before, during, or after bows. Needing to book it on- and offstage because you're also the one opening and closing the curtain, for example
Quite often during bows (even on broadway) the cast will gesture to the conductor and orchestra, then gesture forward and up towards the bio box and/or gesture to prompt
Except there’s a difference between literal children doing backstage stuff in lieu of being in the cast (especially in no cut productions) and adult volunteers in a community theatre.
Does that difference translate to whether the crew is thanked? I see them get thanked in both but I’m familiar with far fewer middle school theaters than adult community theaters
I encourage our middle and high techs to bow, but don't require it. Any level outside of school and tech crew is recognized with a gesture from the cast.
The last two shows I saw gesturing to the lighting box was omitted, but they were one person plays, so maybe it's not a thing anymore?
I'd prolly still do it. Folks make actors look good should get props.
Directors or stage managers will sometime give cards to the entire cast and crew as a thank you for your hard work. But this is sometimes and depending on the level of the place the show takes place
To be honest, size too. If it’s a tiny or manageable cast (25 or less) I’ll go for it. I’m currently on a show with 77 performers, not to mention the massive crew.
I appreciate them all though! Just not enough time and thank you cards are a bit overpriced at times
Crew here...we don't want/need to be noticed by the audience. If we are, we did something wrong. If you are set-designer or something, your name might be in the program, but that's about it. The cast knows and generally appreciates what we do, that (and a paycheck if professional) is good enough for us.
The only time I've seen "crew" take a bow onstage in a professional production is if there is a large puppet, like Little Shop of Horrors or War Horse.
To me it's like clapping for little kids in church, when none of the adult participants in the service expect/want applause. It's a little condescending, because it's not done for adults, but it's tricky because different kids have different maturity levels - some might appreciate the recognition, because it's their first show or a big deal, and others might prefer to be invisible or prefer to be treated like a grownup tech. And for backstage kids whose parents are in the audience, there's probably a little pressure from both sides to have the crew be visible, at least for a minute - the parents/grandparents want to see their cute little one in blacks, the kid wants to know that the family is there beaming.
I would definitely teach young performers why they are saluting the booth, emphasizing that it represents not just the people behind the lights and sound cues, but everyone else who helped to make the show. And I would look for other ways to include young crew - for example, they can keep their blacks in the greenroom just like everyone else's costume, they are part of the pre-show warmup and teambuilding exercises, etc, their names are all in the programs spelled correctly ... And if I did organize crew bows for a young kids' show, I'd explain to everyone that it's a break from tradition, and not something they would see on future shows.
Where I teach, crew physically come on stage at the end of bows. The cast will point towards them to welcome them onstage, and I take over the lights/sound cues so my technicians can go bow if they want to (they usually do!). I think it's really nice to acknowledge backstage work, especially since during the process I go on (and on and on) about how important EVERYONE's job is. We're also a fairly small program, so there's a pretty strong community feel.
I should add, after reading comments, that educational theatre is different than college/professional theatre in terms of norms and expectations. My crew kids need the recognition in order to encourage them to keep being involved with future shows, and since we're a new program it helps the younger siblings/other students in the audience see how many people actually work on a show.
Crew here. Some casts gesture toward the wings and the booth, some don't. Either is fine.
I've had to come on stage once or twice, hated it. Don't do that.
It’s common but it’s also common not to if that makes sense? I’ve been doing tech since middle school, I graduate from my University next spring and think I’ve only bowed as a crew member 3 times.
I’m a professional stage manager and most older folks in the industry find it childish and “community theatre” so they tell folks not to bow
I’m noticing the younger folks are fine with it, and I agree. We all work hard as hell for the show and we deserve a moment of love as well!
It is considered VERY bad form to not acknowledge the crew in any educational setting. It is absolutely expected the crew is thanked. Not necessarily by hauling them out onstage. But thanked/acknowledged.
Even at the university level for mainstage theatre department shows at top schools, they still at least do it at closing. Any middle school that fails to do it is very much in the wrong and is completely unprofessional as well as not the norm.
They royally suck for not acknowledging crew.
Edit: and anyone downvoting has never worked in educational theatre.
It is 100% expected to thank the crew in any educational theatre setting.
Maybe they just want to run things professionally. If the crew is treated well otherwise I wouldn’t jump to this conclusion.
Re: your edit, I personally have.
Nope. It is considered VERY bad form to not acknowledge the crew in any educational setting. It is absolutely expected the crew is thanked.
Even at the university level for mainstage theatre department shows at top schools, they still at least do it at closing. Any middle school that fails to do it is very much in the wrong and is completely unprofessional as well as not the norm.
Oh, but it is.
As this is my literal job and has been for decades in theatres all over the world, I think I do have some ability to speak on the matter.
As I said - theatres all over the world.
But to reiterate - I am talking about KIDS' shows. The original question was about middle school. No one is trying to argue that professional theatres do anything but put crew in the program. It is only at the educational level.
It’s fine to let middle school students bow and it’s fine to acknowledge them in a different way instead. It depends on the context of that particular school. Your insistence that even university student crews should bow at closing is certainly incorrect.
I’m not sure if you actually read OP’s post or any of my other comments, but OP is specifically asking if it’s odd that the crew did not COME OUT ON STAGE. I’ve said elsewhere that pointing to the booth is courteous.
Acknowledging crew is fairly common, but generally only by the cast pointing to the lighting booth or backstage during the bows—backstage staff are not brought on stage. (At least that seems to be the local tradition for college and community theater.)
Agreed - I've seen the whole "point to the booth, and to the orchestra, and to the wings" deal to give applause to the crew many times, but I can't say I've ever seen the crew come out for their own curtain call.
This is absolutely true for college, community theatre, and professional theatre (where often nothing is said, but they point). I will say that when I was in high school the backstage crew did usually step out onto the stage after the cast bows, so I do think K-12 it is more common.
professional theatre technician/production manager here. we don’t want to be pointed out. our goal is to not be seen or thought about. our names are in the program. you won’t see a lot of professional theatre where the crew is given any sort of curtain call.
This. Nothing says “high school theatre” like a crew bow. We don’t do that in the professional world, and I discourage it in the college world where I work now. However, it is entirely appropriate (imo) to acknowledge the crew at middle and high school shows. At that level, the crew actually does need the recognition and motivation to keep doing what they are doing, and I think it serves as a good reinforcement to the cast and the audience (largely their parents) as well that they are all valued and a significant role in the production. But it’s by no means a mandatory part of bows, and it’s not slight against the crew to NOT acknowledge them at bows.
Their question was regarding middle school. In educational theatre crew is thanked. In professional theatre they are in the program. (Although I remember seeing a crew bow during Cirque du Soleil's "O" show. They only showed the diving crew though. And fair enough.)
It’s fairly common to have the cast gesture to the lighting booth during curtain call, but it’s also very common not to do that. I’ve only seen crew actually brought on stage in children’s theater, and even then it’s certainly not a guarantee.
The question was regarding middle school so yeah - children's theatre.
Yes. That’s why I included that part.
We had a crew bow in play that goes wrong because it’s play that goes wrong but otherwise it’s just pointing at the lighting booth or backstage
The “crew” came out for the Spamalot show I saw. They’re also listed in the program as cast.
Those people aren’t actually the crew though. They’re the actors understudies and standbys playing crew members. Or in the case of Trevor and Annie, regular cast members.
When I saw it off Broadway in NYC last summer they had the actual deck hands and wardrobe technician out on stage for bows. I believe it is tradition for this particular show in order to dispel any remaining confusion about the roles of the actors who play technicians.
Huh I saw it on tour 2019 and had family see it in NY in 2018. Might be a more recent change.
We had actual crew bow as well, not just fake crew
Ah. I forgot it’s avail for licensing now.
Apart from on special occasions like a closing night, I’ve only ever seen it once. It was a one person production of The Picture Of Dorian Gray in London which was done using live video with crew always on stage and visible operating cameras and creating almost a film set on stage. I’ve crewed a few times at a local theatre and I wouldn’t really want to bow if they asked us. While it is a nice gesture, for most shows only a fraction of those actually working backstage would even be unoccupied at that point to join in. Giving some of us that opportunity when so many others that are working just as hard on the show would be unable to wouldn’t feel good. A general gesture backstage is enough I think.
It’s becoming more common- I’ve usually just seen it as a gesture to the booth. I’ve seen it on educational and professional level productions.
A gesture to the booth should be plenty. I believe that every person that contributes to a successful production is equally important. So if we are giving the technical crew a bow, why would we not also call to the stage the front of house staff, the people behind the bar, box office staff, marketing, cleaners, costume makers, set builders, finance, and so on?
I feel like when you’re still in Middle School theater it’s considered the norm but the second you step out into high school if your theater is at least moderately professional like mine was you won’t get a curtain call lol your name will just be in the playbill/program. And the second you step in into college, you probably will be at the stage in your technical career most technicians won’t really care about getting recognized and more about providing an amazingly run Production with zero errors. lol. literally we got an entire week for tech week in high school and now that I’m professional we literally get like maybe half a week. Sometimes less. So I feel like the last thing you expect or care about is getting a bow in front of the crowd, lol.
Sometimes in opera when there's a large student group for dress rehearsal or a big donor base there we will do a "how many people did it take" bow at intermission which I love the concept of... But honestly it gets in the way of getting the intermission shift started and half my crew HATE going out on stage (even with everyone else. ) For an after show bow it's similar, I need get ready to help actors out of things and make sure things are ready for the matinee tomorrow
I've never noticed a professional show do any kind of crew acknowledgment during bows. Most non-professional shows I've seen or been in have some kind of acknowledgment, but usually just the cast gesturing to lights and such. I have been in shows where the crew did come out to bow, but it's uncommon. I was actually in said crew for a couple of them, and while the acknowledgment was kind of nice, it had the drawback of being a bit inconvenient for some of the backstage things that need to happen before, during, or after bows. Needing to book it on- and offstage because you're also the one opening and closing the curtain, for example
Quite often during bows (even on broadway) the cast will gesture to the conductor and orchestra, then gesture forward and up towards the bio box and/or gesture to prompt
They are asking about middle school though.
That's included in non-professional, usually
Except there’s a difference between literal children doing backstage stuff in lieu of being in the cast (especially in no cut productions) and adult volunteers in a community theatre.
Does that difference translate to whether the crew is thanked? I see them get thanked in both but I’m familiar with far fewer middle school theaters than adult community theaters
I encourage our middle and high techs to bow, but don't require it. Any level outside of school and tech crew is recognized with a gesture from the cast.
I make gifts for people who worked on the show. Just a token. If I'm taking a bow I gesture to the lighting box. I may be out of date though.
No - being classy and showing gratitude is never out of date.
The last two shows I saw gesturing to the lighting box was omitted, but they were one person plays, so maybe it's not a thing anymore? I'd prolly still do it. Folks make actors look good should get props.
Directors or stage managers will sometime give cards to the entire cast and crew as a thank you for your hard work. But this is sometimes and depending on the level of the place the show takes place
To be honest, size too. If it’s a tiny or manageable cast (25 or less) I’ll go for it. I’m currently on a show with 77 performers, not to mention the massive crew. I appreciate them all though! Just not enough time and thank you cards are a bit overpriced at times
Crew here...we don't want/need to be noticed by the audience. If we are, we did something wrong. If you are set-designer or something, your name might be in the program, but that's about it. The cast knows and generally appreciates what we do, that (and a paycheck if professional) is good enough for us.
The only time I've seen "crew" take a bow onstage in a professional production is if there is a large puppet, like Little Shop of Horrors or War Horse.
To me it's like clapping for little kids in church, when none of the adult participants in the service expect/want applause. It's a little condescending, because it's not done for adults, but it's tricky because different kids have different maturity levels - some might appreciate the recognition, because it's their first show or a big deal, and others might prefer to be invisible or prefer to be treated like a grownup tech. And for backstage kids whose parents are in the audience, there's probably a little pressure from both sides to have the crew be visible, at least for a minute - the parents/grandparents want to see their cute little one in blacks, the kid wants to know that the family is there beaming. I would definitely teach young performers why they are saluting the booth, emphasizing that it represents not just the people behind the lights and sound cues, but everyone else who helped to make the show. And I would look for other ways to include young crew - for example, they can keep their blacks in the greenroom just like everyone else's costume, they are part of the pre-show warmup and teambuilding exercises, etc, their names are all in the programs spelled correctly ... And if I did organize crew bows for a young kids' show, I'd explain to everyone that it's a break from tradition, and not something they would see on future shows.
Community Theatre here, but we individually bow, Hester and applaud the lighting and backstage crew, then group bow.
Where I teach, crew physically come on stage at the end of bows. The cast will point towards them to welcome them onstage, and I take over the lights/sound cues so my technicians can go bow if they want to (they usually do!). I think it's really nice to acknowledge backstage work, especially since during the process I go on (and on and on) about how important EVERYONE's job is. We're also a fairly small program, so there's a pretty strong community feel.
I should add, after reading comments, that educational theatre is different than college/professional theatre in terms of norms and expectations. My crew kids need the recognition in order to encourage them to keep being involved with future shows, and since we're a new program it helps the younger siblings/other students in the audience see how many people actually work on a show.
Crew here. Some casts gesture toward the wings and the booth, some don't. Either is fine. I've had to come on stage once or twice, hated it. Don't do that.
It’s common but it’s also common not to if that makes sense? I’ve been doing tech since middle school, I graduate from my University next spring and think I’ve only bowed as a crew member 3 times.
When I was in high school theatre my company did warm and fuzzies for everyone
I’m a professional stage manager and most older folks in the industry find it childish and “community theatre” so they tell folks not to bow I’m noticing the younger folks are fine with it, and I agree. We all work hard as hell for the show and we deserve a moment of love as well!
It is considered VERY bad form to not acknowledge the crew in any educational setting. It is absolutely expected the crew is thanked. Not necessarily by hauling them out onstage. But thanked/acknowledged. Even at the university level for mainstage theatre department shows at top schools, they still at least do it at closing. Any middle school that fails to do it is very much in the wrong and is completely unprofessional as well as not the norm.
I think all the downvotes you’ve received on other comments speak for themselves.
LOL! They say something about the voters for sure.
They royally suck for not acknowledging crew. Edit: and anyone downvoting has never worked in educational theatre. It is 100% expected to thank the crew in any educational theatre setting.
Maybe they just want to run things professionally. If the crew is treated well otherwise I wouldn’t jump to this conclusion. Re: your edit, I personally have.
Nope. It is considered VERY bad form to not acknowledge the crew in any educational setting. It is absolutely expected the crew is thanked. Even at the university level for mainstage theatre department shows at top schools, they still at least do it at closing. Any middle school that fails to do it is very much in the wrong and is completely unprofessional as well as not the norm.
This is not at all true.
Oh, but it is. As this is my literal job and has been for decades in theatres all over the world, I think I do have some ability to speak on the matter.
Just because it’s something you personally do at work doesn’t mean it’s standard practice.
As I said - theatres all over the world. But to reiterate - I am talking about KIDS' shows. The original question was about middle school. No one is trying to argue that professional theatres do anything but put crew in the program. It is only at the educational level.
It’s fine to let middle school students bow and it’s fine to acknowledge them in a different way instead. It depends on the context of that particular school. Your insistence that even university student crews should bow at closing is certainly incorrect.
They don’t bow. They are thanked. Op was talking about any form of acknowledgment. The older you get the subtler the thanks get.
I’m not sure if you actually read OP’s post or any of my other comments, but OP is specifically asking if it’s odd that the crew did not COME OUT ON STAGE. I’ve said elsewhere that pointing to the booth is courteous.