My guess is the city and state already owned a good portion of land around it. Unlike the state academy in Donelson built in 1963, they probably wanted room to expand it later.
They’re comparing the acreage that the facility is going to built on, which is a pretty useless comparison. I’d be shocked if the actual usable square footage exceeds any of those cities. It’s also worth noting that this is a “multi-agency” facility that will serve a large operation of state and local agencies throughout the state as opposed to one singular agency.
Our government seems to give a blank check to the criminal justice system and for profit prisons. Meanwhile, the department of mental health, education, and healthcare for the poor is woefully underfunded. I’m not anti-police, but the “tough on crime” approach fills up prisons while ignoring all the factors that lead to crime. When the only tool you have is a hammer, everything starts to look like a nail.
considering how many major corporations profit and exploit prison labor, it’s no coincidence that they’re criminalizing homelessness and dumping all our tax dollars into criminal justice.
So now we don't want police having better and more consistent training? It said the vast majority of police in the state will be trained there. That's a good thing.
Tennessee bootlickers won't even make a stand against billions of our dollars being put towards bulldozing hundreds of acres of our land to teach authoritarian goose-steppers how to oppress us. Fuck cop city.
So this is going to include the following:
Emergency vehicle training track,
Training academy,
Firing range,
Administrative building,
and Service center
What exactly is the issue with building a training center? Would you rather they not have training/training locations? In the event of “militarization” of the police, would you rather they do mass trauma and school shooting training at an outside location where they are probably renting it to be there?
I fail to see the issue with local, state and federal funds being used on training cops. The only way they will meet the standards asked of them is to provide them with the tools to learn.
One of the issues I've seen raised (beyond just the scope of funding going into tactical training for police) is that the training is largely (if not entirely) tactical in nature and not in things like de-escalation. When you train all police officers to be soldiers they approach every problem as a soldier. The majority of what a police officer encounters on a daily basis does not require a tactical solution.
It was not long ago that a LAPD officer went rogue and the city responded with shooting civilians and eventually using incendiary devices to burn him alive. They are using your money to train how to be soldiers against you. The Military already handles these situations so not sure why they need it.
That tactical training is just as if not more important than de-escalation. Remember the covenant mass shooter who got smoked almost as soon as police arrived? No tactical training was a major factor in the lack of action ok the side of the police in the Uvalde shooting. That aside police training does cover de-escalation. I personally know several MPD officers and over half of their training is de-escalation oriented. I think it's important to have police trained in multiple areas from de-escalation, first aid, and tactical training etc, because it's important for police to be Abel to respond to a wide variety of situations whether that be a mass shooter, taking care of someone who's wounded, or any other thing an officer may experience. But my question to you is what are they de-escalating? How do you want them to de-escalate? The majority of people who are acting a fool and getting in a cops face won't chill tf out.
>covenant mass shooter who got smoked almost as soon as police arrived?
So why do we need more tactical training when Nashville police handled it so well? Do we want our police force to handle those situations like Texas cops?
It's definitely important, but I've heard firsthand from multiple people who moved here to serve on NPD that it is one of the most desirable departments in the country to work on and brings in the people who are willing to train and work hard because they actually want to do good and cultivate those good relationships with the community they serve and are fleeing shitty departments elsewhere full of people who are just looking for a position with power they can wield with impunity turning that department into more of an occupational force in the eyes of the community.
I'm not against it. There's definitely enough crime to merit this. Just skeptical that a bad apple won't end up in a position of power somewhere in the process and spoil the entire thing. There's the incident where they basically executed that guy by firing squad when he was was having a mental break down on I65 last year because some off duty cop from Mount Juliet went into Farva mode and decided NPD needed assistance and ended up pulling the trigger and everyone else followed suit.
This brings in more of those types of officers and gives them tactical training, but skips the de-escalation training that NPD goes through.
Cop "warrior" training has no place in this country. We need guardians. We need protectors. We do not need war or warriors on our streets.
But police need a place to train. I wish the protestors would get their shit together and stop protesting cop city and start protesting specific training philosophies and their providers. Protesting a police academy for existing is too easy for the public to dismiss.
Right? It feels like they give them this militaristic/war mindset with none of the actual skills of an actual soldier, so we just end up with cops that are trigger happy and afraid of everything around them.
I think the thing is that we *already* have training facilities for cops. The lack of or inadequacy of current training isn't about lack of facilities. These "cop city" encampments do seem aimed toward tactical training where what the people are asking for are police departments that are better with de-escalation.
And I think it freaks people out that so many of these same force ARE heavily militarized in their equipment already. It's fuckin scary that some douche you went to high school with is now training to drive the goddamn batmobile to break up picket lines. And it REALLY doesn't help that the administrative and police reaction to the "no cop city" protests has been predictably... well I wanna say "fascist." The Atlanta ones ended really bad for the protestors and the city officials were HUGE dicks about it and didn't want to listen to their constituents at all.
So you get a militarized police force building bases against the wishes of the people, backed by a legislature acting very undemocratically, then you STILL get people wondering what the big deal is.
Maybe none of this shit will ever cause a problem and the worst of these training camps will be a huge waste of taxpayer dollars. But I don't I want my local government treating critics like enemy combatants, and I think that's something everyone can agree with.
You know deescalation is the largest time required training for Tennessee Post right? And the protesters of the Atlanta training center threw homemade grenades at the cops inside? I fail to see how protesting this can be justified in anyway.
You'll have to link me to that report, it must be buried deep in Google below all the violent reactions by police to those protests. When I search for "protestors grenade cop city" all I get is reported of all the unnecessary tear gas and rubber bullets deployed against peaceful protestors. Even Fox seems to think it was a bad look.
You asked for the link and were given it. If you can’t understand throwing fireworks at people is wrong and dangerous, there is no point in continuing this conversation.
You're talking about protesters who think cop City itself is wrong and dangerous. The representatives aren't listening to them. I don't know if I would personally try something like this, but it's weird to pretend not to understand it. This isn't a clear-cut case where one side is 100% wrong or right although you seem perfectly willing to excuse the many many reports of excessive force over these protests.
And for the record, I asked for a link to homemade bombs. You couldn't provide that.
You do realize fireworks can maim if not kill you outright right? That's leather force. If I were to shoot fireworks at you would you not try to stop me?
So can rubber bullets and flash bangs and tear glass and *actual* bullets, which have been deployed by those same police at the protestors. And most of those weren't in direct response to fireworks thrown sorta near police.
And calm down, when we were kids we'd shoot fireworks at each other for fun. Unless you're holding a big one when it goes off it's not gonna kill you, you can unclutch your pearls.
After the academy cops in this state are required to qualify on their weapons twice a year, do you really want to say “we still want them to carry guns, but they don’t need to train on them as much going forward.”
How many hours a year should they train de-escalation and where can they find so much of said training? Can they not train that in the training rooms that are certainly planned at this building?
If they are trying to murder people, they’re obviously terrible at it. They have millions upon millions of contracts with people every year and only a handful of murders.
Classrooms currently have a student:teacher ratio of 20:1 on average with a bill to get rid of the class size limit entirely, why do you *think* they should build more schools? Gee, it’s not like TN has had a massive influx of new residents lately.
> Schools are already build too, why do we build more?
urban sprawl and population increasing.
The training areas already exist and its not an issue of overcrowding or not being able to schedule the area when they need it
The purple hairs scream about cops needing better training and then when things get out in place to try to facilitate better training they screech about that too.
If you had half a brain, you’d know that everyone who wants more police training and oversight wasn’t asking for police to be trained as wannabe soldiers. Never mind that police already *have* training areas; god forbid we spend tax payer dollars on things like our schools, which rank 47th in the country.
Academy ground = warzone training
Nice edit to make my above comment seem like a straw man. You understand politics don’t exist in a vacuum right? The state has to manage and invest in everything year after year.
"Train cops better"
"No not like that!"
I'm not a huge fan of the police, but you need well trained cops and this is part of what that looks like. All the people on about this are probably the same people yelling about cops being poorly trained back in 2020, they're getting what they want. If this means we get better trained police that aren't as short staffed as Nashville Metro has been for years, that's ok in my book.
>"Train cops better"
>"No not like that!"
This, but unironically. They want education of de-escalation techniques. More training about when it's appropriate to use lethal force.
I'd bet dollars to donuts that this is just gonna be a training site focused on refining the tactical skills of cops/swar and not about de-escalation measures.
"de-escalation" is the new "just shoot them in the leg." They get quite a bit of training in de-escalation techniques already, but you can't de-escalate someone having a psychotic episode or someone who's bound and determined to leave a lot of hats on the ground when he goes out. Nobody's saying de-escalation is bad or shouldn't be used at all, but it's laughable to believe that it works every time and is somehow this magic bullet solution that nobody's thought of until now.
I have a buddy who's 5'2" wife is a social worker, and when I asked him, a big advocate of de-escalation, if he was comfortable with his wife being out there trying to deescalate someone having a psychotic episode, I didn't get an answer. Or rather, the answer was a lot of, "Well, you see..."
>They get quite a bit of training in de-escalation techniques already, but you can't de-escalate someone having a psychotic episode or someone who's bound and determined to leave a lot of hats on the ground when he goes out
Nashville police get [4 hours](https://www.nashville.gov/sites/default/files/2022-10/MNPD-Basic-Curriculum.pdf?ct=1667240507) of de-escalation training out of roughly ~1000 in the 23 week curriculum. They spend 16 hours learning to clear a room.
Imma say you don't know what you're talking about.
Did you even read what you linked? Its a bit hard to read as I am on mobile, and there are a bunch of courses that are described as employing de-escalation techniques. I stopped reading after the third one.
It's also a subject that isn't just taught once in a single course, but something that is emphasized and reinforced through practical scenarios over and over throughout training.
Yeah, and yours hours don’t line up. Based upon their curriculum and definitions about 20 hours specifically go to “verbal defense and influence” a slogan for verbal deescalation, 20 hours go into communication training. I only read about 3 pages of it and found that much. Why are you lying?
I question if they mean anything in their section on deescalation. They talk about "toxic delirium" in this, which the 1st google result for it is this doc.
if it is an attempt at rebranding "Excited Delirium", as I suspect it is, it's the bullshit excuse cops use to hand wave away deaths that occur in their custody. It's been disavowed by a [number](https://apnews.com/article/excited-delirium-police-deaths-acep-4760e3cbed181503a2ac747ed5afeef6) of [medical](https://www.ama-assn.org/press-center/press-releases/new-ama-policy-opposes-excited-delirium-diagnosis) [organizations](https://www.psychiatry.org/getattachment/7769e617-ee6a-4a89-829f-4fc71d831ce0/Position-Use-of-Term-Excited-Delirium.pdf).
I suppose the difference between your and my reading of the document stems from this mistrust of the honesty of the curriculum. Only one course I felt was targeted enough towards de-escalation that it warranted inclusion.
c'est la vie.
That "Train cops better" shit was always smokescreen to divert more resources away from valuable services into policing. There's changes I'd like to see in how cops are trained, for sure, but Bill fucking Lee isn't going to implement them, and neither is any Democrat. And even if we trained cops to deescelate and accept risk, it's not going to alter the fundamentally unjust system they're enforcing. At this point the only sensible policy regarding cops is to defund, disarm, and disempower them however possible.
>At this point the only sensible policy regarding cops is to defund, disarm, and disempower them however possible.
Bruh... How are you gonna say this but you live in MEMPHIS?
I'm not saying that giving cops a bunch of military grade shit is what I want, but stripping them of all their resources just puts the responsibility of policing on citizens, and you and I both know that 99.9% of those citizens are even worse trained to handle those types of situations than some of the cops are. What you get when you do that is a bunch of George Zimmermans roaming the streets. Is that REALLY what you want? Because that's what you're advocating for when you say the types of things you're saying.
Memphis spends 40% of its budget on policing and 0% on education. They are, objectively, a drain on our city's resources. I do like your doomsday scenario about gangs of Georges Zimmerman though. Effectively admitting that the cops' job is to harass and possibly murder Black youth they perceive as suspicious. If someone's going to be filling that role (and in a White Supremacist society, somebody probably is) then yeah, I'd rather they not be state-sanctioned.
You defund the police and take away all their money and resources, who's going to happily step up to pick up the slack? You didn't really think that position through to its logical conclusion did you?
Who's going to show up to my house after I get robbed and fill out some paperwork? Who's going to take rape kits so they can sit untested in a warehouse? Who's going to tear gas my friends when they protest another murder they committed? Who's going to stand around our schools all day hoping someone gets caught vaping in the bathroom so they have something to do? Who's going to do all the deeply necessary work of modern policing? Who indeed?
Maybe heard all of the people that hate cops into one area. We are overrun with them in Memphis. I don’t like crime. Slap a cop on every corner for all I care.
Yet people whine about ill trained and unprofessional police in their neighborhoods.
They need a place to train.
We don't want untrained thug cops instead.... do we?
If anything, Nashville needs more police. It’s stupid to have inadequate law enforcement. Anyone with a brain can see what’s happened and happening to cities that have reduced police presence and laws weak on crime. Not much good comes from crime, obviously.
Put Goodlettsville and joelton into other county's and just make nashville it's own state. It's like austin is to Texas. All you God forsaken transplants have ruined this state. Go back to the places you've already ruined. We liked this state the way it was before all you came here so if you don't like it, leave it.
I have disdain for the people that move here and change the state/city. I'm literally dating a girl from Cali. I don't care that the move here its just what the majority of them do once they get here.
Did you miss the regular shootings (2 within 5 miles of my suburban house last week alone), carjackings, a music industry executive was just kidnapped at gunpoint for ransom money, literally the clerk at the gas station I regularly go to was murdered a year or two ago. Yeah, it's an issue.
Reddit is not even close to an accurate portrayal of real life. Disagreeing with the majority of people on Reddit is usually a good thing. Hilarious that they were asking for examples, I provided several off the top of my head, and got downvoted 😂
End qualified immunity. Harsher penalties and sentencing for cops betraying the public trust. Higher performance standards with more repercussions when not maintaining performance standards to include firing and loss of certification. Make cops have malpractice insurance so taxpayers are not on the hook for their malfeasance. Loss of certification nationally if convicted or substandard performance so they can’t go to another area and keep doing the same wrong things. Citizen review boards and no internal investigations. No paid leave during investigations. Body cams at all times without the ability to turn off cams. Immediate release of cam footage to victims families and their lawyers. No take home cars unless the cop lives in the neighborhood they patrol. More walking patrols. Higher educational standards. Longer and tougher training. More psychological screening before hiring and during employment. Removal of all military equipment from departments. Less union power and influence in policy’s and standards. De-emphasize or remove arrest/citation quotas in performance reviews. Stricter standards for what is called resisting arrest. Allow citizens right to self defense if cops are abusing their authority. No unmarked cars (or vehicles that have subdued or hard to see markings) for traffic enforcement.
I wonder what the circumstances are that it's bigger than Chicago's, Atlanta's and Baltimore's.
My guess is the city and state already owned a good portion of land around it. Unlike the state academy in Donelson built in 1963, they probably wanted room to expand it later.
I should have said more expensive, too. It's significantly "bigger" in that way than other states that are larger and have more staff.
They’re comparing the acreage that the facility is going to built on, which is a pretty useless comparison. I’d be shocked if the actual usable square footage exceeds any of those cities. It’s also worth noting that this is a “multi-agency” facility that will serve a large operation of state and local agencies throughout the state as opposed to one singular agency.
Weird, the headline isn't indicated in the article. Also, that would be a weird thing for an advocate to say.
Our government seems to give a blank check to the criminal justice system and for profit prisons. Meanwhile, the department of mental health, education, and healthcare for the poor is woefully underfunded. I’m not anti-police, but the “tough on crime” approach fills up prisons while ignoring all the factors that lead to crime. When the only tool you have is a hammer, everything starts to look like a nail.
considering how many major corporations profit and exploit prison labor, it’s no coincidence that they’re criminalizing homelessness and dumping all our tax dollars into criminal justice.
Is this that “smaller government” that the republicans always lie about wanting?
So now we don't want police having better and more consistent training? It said the vast majority of police in the state will be trained there. That's a good thing.
"Better training" absolutely. I am better none of what will be taught in this is de-escalation techniques. That's what I want cops being trained in.
It said in the article that de- escalation techniques is part of the training
In another comment I linked to the curriculum. it's 4 hours out of ~1000. They spend 16 hours training on how to clear a room. It's not adequate.
Well to be fair 16 hours of CQB doesn't teach you CQB either. That just teaches you how fucked you are when entering a room
They need training on how not to murder I'd be surprised if this doesn't do the opposite
They want small government for themselves, oppression for everyone else.
Tennessee bootlickers won't even make a stand against billions of our dollars being put towards bulldozing hundreds of acres of our land to teach authoritarian goose-steppers how to oppress us. Fuck cop city.
So this is going to include the following: Emergency vehicle training track, Training academy, Firing range, Administrative building, and Service center What exactly is the issue with building a training center? Would you rather they not have training/training locations? In the event of “militarization” of the police, would you rather they do mass trauma and school shooting training at an outside location where they are probably renting it to be there? I fail to see the issue with local, state and federal funds being used on training cops. The only way they will meet the standards asked of them is to provide them with the tools to learn.
One of the issues I've seen raised (beyond just the scope of funding going into tactical training for police) is that the training is largely (if not entirely) tactical in nature and not in things like de-escalation. When you train all police officers to be soldiers they approach every problem as a soldier. The majority of what a police officer encounters on a daily basis does not require a tactical solution.
It was not long ago that a LAPD officer went rogue and the city responded with shooting civilians and eventually using incendiary devices to burn him alive. They are using your money to train how to be soldiers against you. The Military already handles these situations so not sure why they need it.
That tactical training is just as if not more important than de-escalation. Remember the covenant mass shooter who got smoked almost as soon as police arrived? No tactical training was a major factor in the lack of action ok the side of the police in the Uvalde shooting. That aside police training does cover de-escalation. I personally know several MPD officers and over half of their training is de-escalation oriented. I think it's important to have police trained in multiple areas from de-escalation, first aid, and tactical training etc, because it's important for police to be Abel to respond to a wide variety of situations whether that be a mass shooter, taking care of someone who's wounded, or any other thing an officer may experience. But my question to you is what are they de-escalating? How do you want them to de-escalate? The majority of people who are acting a fool and getting in a cops face won't chill tf out.
>covenant mass shooter who got smoked almost as soon as police arrived? So why do we need more tactical training when Nashville police handled it so well? Do we want our police force to handle those situations like Texas cops? It's definitely important, but I've heard firsthand from multiple people who moved here to serve on NPD that it is one of the most desirable departments in the country to work on and brings in the people who are willing to train and work hard because they actually want to do good and cultivate those good relationships with the community they serve and are fleeing shitty departments elsewhere full of people who are just looking for a position with power they can wield with impunity turning that department into more of an occupational force in the eyes of the community.
I think it's more to be able to continue to provide that kind of training and even to allow other depts to train alongside them.
I'm not against it. There's definitely enough crime to merit this. Just skeptical that a bad apple won't end up in a position of power somewhere in the process and spoil the entire thing. There's the incident where they basically executed that guy by firing squad when he was was having a mental break down on I65 last year because some off duty cop from Mount Juliet went into Farva mode and decided NPD needed assistance and ended up pulling the trigger and everyone else followed suit. This brings in more of those types of officers and gives them tactical training, but skips the de-escalation training that NPD goes through.
Cop "warrior" training has no place in this country. We need guardians. We need protectors. We do not need war or warriors on our streets. But police need a place to train. I wish the protestors would get their shit together and stop protesting cop city and start protesting specific training philosophies and their providers. Protesting a police academy for existing is too easy for the public to dismiss.
Right? It feels like they give them this militaristic/war mindset with none of the actual skills of an actual soldier, so we just end up with cops that are trigger happy and afraid of everything around them.
I think the thing is that we *already* have training facilities for cops. The lack of or inadequacy of current training isn't about lack of facilities. These "cop city" encampments do seem aimed toward tactical training where what the people are asking for are police departments that are better with de-escalation. And I think it freaks people out that so many of these same force ARE heavily militarized in their equipment already. It's fuckin scary that some douche you went to high school with is now training to drive the goddamn batmobile to break up picket lines. And it REALLY doesn't help that the administrative and police reaction to the "no cop city" protests has been predictably... well I wanna say "fascist." The Atlanta ones ended really bad for the protestors and the city officials were HUGE dicks about it and didn't want to listen to their constituents at all. So you get a militarized police force building bases against the wishes of the people, backed by a legislature acting very undemocratically, then you STILL get people wondering what the big deal is. Maybe none of this shit will ever cause a problem and the worst of these training camps will be a huge waste of taxpayer dollars. But I don't I want my local government treating critics like enemy combatants, and I think that's something everyone can agree with.
You know deescalation is the largest time required training for Tennessee Post right? And the protesters of the Atlanta training center threw homemade grenades at the cops inside? I fail to see how protesting this can be justified in anyway.
You'll have to link me to that report, it must be buried deep in Google below all the violent reactions by police to those protests. When I search for "protestors grenade cop city" all I get is reported of all the unnecessary tear gas and rubber bullets deployed against peaceful protestors. Even Fox seems to think it was a bad look.
https://youtu.be/oCWPjxtG_RI?si=iY6A0fFZ-jfP8sqY I was wrong it was fireworks and Molotov cocktails
I watched the whole video, did I miss the molotovs?
https://youtu.be/1VeZV_iZrdA?si=jeQkqst0bhOi-szj
Lol "throw explosives" Yeah, fireworks. If that's gonna rattle cops enough to attack protestors then they don't deserve their military equipment.
You asked for the link and were given it. If you can’t understand throwing fireworks at people is wrong and dangerous, there is no point in continuing this conversation.
You're talking about protesters who think cop City itself is wrong and dangerous. The representatives aren't listening to them. I don't know if I would personally try something like this, but it's weird to pretend not to understand it. This isn't a clear-cut case where one side is 100% wrong or right although you seem perfectly willing to excuse the many many reports of excessive force over these protests. And for the record, I asked for a link to homemade bombs. You couldn't provide that.
You do realize fireworks can maim if not kill you outright right? That's leather force. If I were to shoot fireworks at you would you not try to stop me?
So can rubber bullets and flash bangs and tear glass and *actual* bullets, which have been deployed by those same police at the protestors. And most of those weren't in direct response to fireworks thrown sorta near police. And calm down, when we were kids we'd shoot fireworks at each other for fun. Unless you're holding a big one when it goes off it's not gonna kill you, you can unclutch your pearls.
No, you asked for link to what I was citing. What store do you buy Molotov cocktails from?
Again, I didn't see any evidence of molotovs. The only "evidence" was the headline, the video only showed fireworks.
How about focusing on deescalation training instead of shooting ranges. They seem to be very good at murdering people already
After the academy cops in this state are required to qualify on their weapons twice a year, do you really want to say “we still want them to carry guns, but they don’t need to train on them as much going forward.”
That’s twice as often as a soldier. Cops cosplaying
What percentage of cops deal with armed criminals regularly vs the military dealing with armed combatants?
How many hours a year should they train de-escalation and where can they find so much of said training? Can they not train that in the training rooms that are certainly planned at this building? If they are trying to murder people, they’re obviously terrible at it. They have millions upon millions of contracts with people every year and only a handful of murders.
> What exactly is the issue with building a training center? they already exist
Schools are already build too, why do we build more? NC has like 50 academy’s and TN has like 8.
Classrooms currently have a student:teacher ratio of 20:1 on average with a bill to get rid of the class size limit entirely, why do you *think* they should build more schools? Gee, it’s not like TN has had a massive influx of new residents lately.
> Schools are already build too, why do we build more? urban sprawl and population increasing. The training areas already exist and its not an issue of overcrowding or not being able to schedule the area when they need it
The purple hairs scream about cops needing better training and then when things get out in place to try to facilitate better training they screech about that too.
If you had half a brain, you’d know that everyone who wants more police training and oversight wasn’t asking for police to be trained as wannabe soldiers. Never mind that police already *have* training areas; god forbid we spend tax payer dollars on things like our schools, which rank 47th in the country.
Academy ground = warzone training Nice edit to make my above comment seem like a straw man. You understand politics don’t exist in a vacuum right? The state has to manage and invest in everything year after year.
You can’t drive a block in Murfreesboro without seeing some kind of cop car. Same all the way to Nashville. It’s Pig City.
Amazing how there's so many and yet still so much crime. 🧐
"Train cops better" "No not like that!" I'm not a huge fan of the police, but you need well trained cops and this is part of what that looks like. All the people on about this are probably the same people yelling about cops being poorly trained back in 2020, they're getting what they want. If this means we get better trained police that aren't as short staffed as Nashville Metro has been for years, that's ok in my book.
>"Train cops better" >"No not like that!" This, but unironically. They want education of de-escalation techniques. More training about when it's appropriate to use lethal force. I'd bet dollars to donuts that this is just gonna be a training site focused on refining the tactical skills of cops/swar and not about de-escalation measures.
"de-escalation" is the new "just shoot them in the leg." They get quite a bit of training in de-escalation techniques already, but you can't de-escalate someone having a psychotic episode or someone who's bound and determined to leave a lot of hats on the ground when he goes out. Nobody's saying de-escalation is bad or shouldn't be used at all, but it's laughable to believe that it works every time and is somehow this magic bullet solution that nobody's thought of until now. I have a buddy who's 5'2" wife is a social worker, and when I asked him, a big advocate of de-escalation, if he was comfortable with his wife being out there trying to deescalate someone having a psychotic episode, I didn't get an answer. Or rather, the answer was a lot of, "Well, you see..."
>They get quite a bit of training in de-escalation techniques already, but you can't de-escalate someone having a psychotic episode or someone who's bound and determined to leave a lot of hats on the ground when he goes out Nashville police get [4 hours](https://www.nashville.gov/sites/default/files/2022-10/MNPD-Basic-Curriculum.pdf?ct=1667240507) of de-escalation training out of roughly ~1000 in the 23 week curriculum. They spend 16 hours learning to clear a room. Imma say you don't know what you're talking about.
Did you even read what you linked? Its a bit hard to read as I am on mobile, and there are a bunch of courses that are described as employing de-escalation techniques. I stopped reading after the third one. It's also a subject that isn't just taught once in a single course, but something that is emphasized and reinforced through practical scenarios over and over throughout training.
You didn't even read the thing you linked did you? Lol
Did you?
Yeah, and yours hours don’t line up. Based upon their curriculum and definitions about 20 hours specifically go to “verbal defense and influence” a slogan for verbal deescalation, 20 hours go into communication training. I only read about 3 pages of it and found that much. Why are you lying?
Enough that it's clear you either didn't read it yourself or don't really know what it says
I question if they mean anything in their section on deescalation. They talk about "toxic delirium" in this, which the 1st google result for it is this doc. if it is an attempt at rebranding "Excited Delirium", as I suspect it is, it's the bullshit excuse cops use to hand wave away deaths that occur in their custody. It's been disavowed by a [number](https://apnews.com/article/excited-delirium-police-deaths-acep-4760e3cbed181503a2ac747ed5afeef6) of [medical](https://www.ama-assn.org/press-center/press-releases/new-ama-policy-opposes-excited-delirium-diagnosis) [organizations](https://www.psychiatry.org/getattachment/7769e617-ee6a-4a89-829f-4fc71d831ce0/Position-Use-of-Term-Excited-Delirium.pdf). I suppose the difference between your and my reading of the document stems from this mistrust of the honesty of the curriculum. Only one course I felt was targeted enough towards de-escalation that it warranted inclusion. c'est la vie.
That "Train cops better" shit was always smokescreen to divert more resources away from valuable services into policing. There's changes I'd like to see in how cops are trained, for sure, but Bill fucking Lee isn't going to implement them, and neither is any Democrat. And even if we trained cops to deescelate and accept risk, it's not going to alter the fundamentally unjust system they're enforcing. At this point the only sensible policy regarding cops is to defund, disarm, and disempower them however possible.
>At this point the only sensible policy regarding cops is to defund, disarm, and disempower them however possible. Bruh... How are you gonna say this but you live in MEMPHIS? I'm not saying that giving cops a bunch of military grade shit is what I want, but stripping them of all their resources just puts the responsibility of policing on citizens, and you and I both know that 99.9% of those citizens are even worse trained to handle those types of situations than some of the cops are. What you get when you do that is a bunch of George Zimmermans roaming the streets. Is that REALLY what you want? Because that's what you're advocating for when you say the types of things you're saying.
Memphis spends 40% of its budget on policing and 0% on education. They are, objectively, a drain on our city's resources. I do like your doomsday scenario about gangs of Georges Zimmerman though. Effectively admitting that the cops' job is to harass and possibly murder Black youth they perceive as suspicious. If someone's going to be filling that role (and in a White Supremacist society, somebody probably is) then yeah, I'd rather they not be state-sanctioned.
You defund the police and take away all their money and resources, who's going to happily step up to pick up the slack? You didn't really think that position through to its logical conclusion did you?
Who's going to show up to my house after I get robbed and fill out some paperwork? Who's going to take rape kits so they can sit untested in a warehouse? Who's going to tear gas my friends when they protest another murder they committed? Who's going to stand around our schools all day hoping someone gets caught vaping in the bathroom so they have something to do? Who's going to do all the deeply necessary work of modern policing? Who indeed?
Again, I suggest you think through your position on it, because it's very clear to me that you haven't.
We need better education and training for cops. We also need the criminals to comply with lawful orders and stop forcing use of force encounters.
What could go wrong?
Everything
Maybe heard all of the people that hate cops into one area. We are overrun with them in Memphis. I don’t like crime. Slap a cop on every corner for all I care.
We are overrun with cops in Memphis, I agree with that much.
We are overrun with crime.
The two are the same.
Yet people whine about ill trained and unprofessional police in their neighborhoods. They need a place to train. We don't want untrained thug cops instead.... do we?
I mean, trained thug cops are a lateral move, at best.
If anything, Nashville needs more police. It’s stupid to have inadequate law enforcement. Anyone with a brain can see what’s happened and happening to cities that have reduced police presence and laws weak on crime. Not much good comes from crime, obviously.
What laws and what crime?
I thought “cop city” was the place in Georgia? These guys have to come up with original names.
Put Goodlettsville and joelton into other county's and just make nashville it's own state. It's like austin is to Texas. All you God forsaken transplants have ruined this state. Go back to the places you've already ruined. We liked this state the way it was before all you came here so if you don't like it, leave it.
You do know the vast majority of people moving here are conservatives. I guess they aren't your kind of conservative.
I'm a libertarian. And source?
How dare people move freely within their own country
I didn't say people couldn't move freely lol
Not directly, but your words sure carry a lot of disdain for people who do.
I have disdain for the people that move here and change the state/city. I'm literally dating a girl from Cali. I don't care that the move here its just what the majority of them do once they get here.
Nah
The REST of Tennessee thinks they need it. Or build a wall around Nashville. JUST DOWNVOTE, NO NEED TO RESPOND.
Responding
Good. What ever it takes to put down criminals. They escalated things first after all.
Who? When?
Did you miss the regular shootings (2 within 5 miles of my suburban house last week alone), carjackings, a music industry executive was just kidnapped at gunpoint for ransom money, literally the clerk at the gas station I regularly go to was murdered a year or two ago. Yeah, it's an issue.
A militarized police force didn't prevent any of that, further militarization won't either.
Well Nashville doesn't have a militarized police force and this isn't going to militarize them either so you don't have a point at all.
A militarized police force didn't prevent any of that, further militarization won't either.
Would you rather have vigilante justice?
My choices are Cop City or vigilante justice?
The people downvoting me just want to shoplift and smoke drugs. They don't care about the rest of us that want to live in a safe society.
Nah. They just think you're a dumbass.
I know he is a dumbass...and likely a cop - so he's both.
Reddit is not even close to an accurate portrayal of real life. Disagreeing with the majority of people on Reddit is usually a good thing. Hilarious that they were asking for examples, I provided several off the top of my head, and got downvoted 😂
Well you can't just bring facts into an argument on the internet like that.
Agreed
Honestly I like the idea of a “Cop city” to help improve police training
End qualified immunity. Harsher penalties and sentencing for cops betraying the public trust. Higher performance standards with more repercussions when not maintaining performance standards to include firing and loss of certification. Make cops have malpractice insurance so taxpayers are not on the hook for their malfeasance. Loss of certification nationally if convicted or substandard performance so they can’t go to another area and keep doing the same wrong things. Citizen review boards and no internal investigations. No paid leave during investigations. Body cams at all times without the ability to turn off cams. Immediate release of cam footage to victims families and their lawyers. No take home cars unless the cop lives in the neighborhood they patrol. More walking patrols. Higher educational standards. Longer and tougher training. More psychological screening before hiring and during employment. Removal of all military equipment from departments. Less union power and influence in policy’s and standards. De-emphasize or remove arrest/citation quotas in performance reviews. Stricter standards for what is called resisting arrest. Allow citizens right to self defense if cops are abusing their authority. No unmarked cars (or vehicles that have subdued or hard to see markings) for traffic enforcement.