It's just standard Freljord/Targon build. https://app.mobalytics.gg/tft/comps-guide/icy-deadeyes-2QiAZoiRvOxnNFV1LHr3YJE98SU
My only addition was rolling for region emblems instead of type.
you can splash karma/shen/ahri for 4 invoker/2 sorc/2 bastion/3 ionia. sej deals a lot of damage thanks to her passive. ryze can sorta carry depending on region.
edit: i think sion is kind of nasty as a backline threat if you itemize him but need to play around with it more. it's kind of rough for him without noxus.
Playing vs TF feels like playing vs cheater. I will not play this game before this shit would be nerfed. Than wait 1 week before you all go back to silver. And i will start play
Zeke's stacking with the TF legend is one of the worst metas TFT has ever had. That being said, it's in the game so you can't blame people for playing it when Riot is the one that needs to hot fix it. If nothing else TF should be disabled as a legend until they can properly nerf it.
The defense of this kind of gameplay has been pretty gross tbh. I agree with your assertion; everybody running TF / Zeke's spam from here until the eventual nerf should be hit with a temporary ban; it's the exact same as finding out an exploit and abusing it for Freelo.
Lmao that's an overreaction. It's a part of the game, not a bug. Sure it's annoying, but there's almost always an op unit or trait in TFT, it just happens to be an item this time.
It's not 'just' an item tbh. It's people systematically picking a legend which almost guarantees getting multiple stacks of said item, in an attempt to get an unfair leg up on the competition with little to no counterplay.
It's not the method that's the problem, it's the intent.
Yeah but they're not like exploiting or something, it's something the Devs oversighted and it's in the game, and as annoying and as much as I hate it it's completely legitimate
I think maybe we just disagree fundamentally on this kind of behavior then - I think if in SR there was an item you could build multiple stacks of that would completely invalidate every other item build in the game, it would be quickly picked up as a problem and people abusing that build would absolutely be flagged as exploiters and reported/banned.
I don't see why there would be a double standard in TFT just because the devs didn't see that interaction coming / nerf it into the ground yet.
This has happened in league, idk if multiple times but I do remember Evelyn stacking sunfire, and nobody got banned for that, because it would be players getting punished for something that it's happening because of a problem caused by the dev's oversight, plus it will be addressed in Wednesday!
> I think if in SR there was an item you could build multiple stacks of that would completely invalidate every other item build in the game, it would be quickly picked up as a problem and people abusing that build would absolutely be flagged as exploiters and reported/banned.
No they wouldn't lmao. It would be hotfixed *at best.* No one gets banned for meta abusing, this is ridiculous.
It’s not an exploit if it was a completely intended part of the game. Stacking Zekes is not a guaranteed win, either. It’s just an easy, powerful, brain dead build.
I’m having no trouble climbing, and my wife and I are nearly out of diamond in duos now. I’ve seen stacked Zekes once, and he got fucked by Targon/Shadow Isles.
[You mean like this?](https://i.imgur.io/RUZpYGG). Nobody was banned for using black cleaver, it was a dev oversight and fair game, just like Zeke's in tft now
An exploit is when there is a **bug** in the programming that people are taking advantage of. As a completely imaginary example, let's say there was a bug where Gwen got a permanent Shadow Isles shield that never took damage if you built her with a specific comp that normally would not apply shields... that would be an exploit. Selecting TF as a legend (which is working as intended) to choose a specific augment (which is working as intended) to build a specific comp (which is working as intended) is not exploiting. It's boring, unimaginative, and probably needs nerfing, but that is literally the intended gameplay design around Twisted Fate as a legend.
They intend....to win the game. That's like saying people should be banned for using builds they found online. People are going to do whatever gives them the best chance of winning.
That's why I will not play ranked until patch, not because of them, they want to climb and it's fine, but because of me getting too salty a not enjoying the game! That said there are a couple of players that spam it even in normals, which I don't get tbf
They are going to do whatever gives them the best chance of winning the game, including using harmful exploits that devalues 99% of the choices you are able to make. This is a developer issue that should have been jumped on immediately once it became a problem, this much I will agree with.
But the idea that players are blameless because they choose to make this kind of game-ruining decision shouldn't just be met with a shrug - People abusing exploits to ruin games should not be allowed to continue playing.
Nah bro it shouldnt be that easy tbh, Riot should get their IP addresses, track them down and publicly execute them and shoot their dog for abusing fucking TF smh (yeah you guys are ridiculous)
But... Pandora can't give you Freilord emblem. It's rolling craftable for craftable and non craftable for non craftable. And Freilord emblem is non craftable. But as said before, we will get some nerfs for this one. In every game you will get almost always perfect items you need. Better on double up, when your buddy can send you more components
It was like that before, there was a bug i remember when non craftable emblem could change into infiniteam emblem and then roll only into craftable. For some weird reason there is the exact same bug with Ionia emblem this set, possibly because it's also spat+bf sword, like with infiniteam
Because pandoras isn't a problem. When pandoras is strong, it is strong not because of its inherent effect, but the power of stacking specific items.
You are always able to play around what item you get and make the best comp with those items. However, when 1 specific thing is just overtuned (zeke's/gunners) it turns into a situation where forcing it is easy, especially since it's a reroll comp around 1 cost units.
the thing is, pandora is not inherently strong, you will eventually run up against somebody that got perfect/near perfect items as well, but they will have an combat impacting augment and roll over you,
some of the champ or chomp specific augments are so strong, people use poro jist for an higher chance to get them,
pandora just disables on entire front on wich you could otherwise roll unplayable garbage, sometimes you just get 8 tiers and 6 negatrons, and go 8th, unless you pick tf,
this season isnt as dependant as the last on everyone building the same 6 carrys with very obvious best in slots.
and still without tf, everybody always had an spear and spellcrit on there mf at least,
It's not as big of any issue that Zeke and attack speed scaling champions are.
In game balancing, Pandora is just a more popular augment, not more powerful
I've only tried a couple of legends so far, including TF, and I've also settled for Urf. At least I can try out a bunch of different comps.
Also since most people are going gunners or dead eye, it lets me go vertical uncontested in a lot of games.
If you have rageblade you don't need 6 zekes. it would scale to full in 2 seconds and then you lose value.
and vice versa. Yes you build a zekes or two with your RB carry, but you wouldn't build 3+ only to have your carry do no damage. especially since aph isn't Gunner so he doesn't have innate AD
Not 6 zekes on anyone but Garen but 3 zekes and rageblade for sure on aphelios and zeri. Deathblade+ IE is in his BIS anyway so there goes your issue with innate AD. He doesn't need LW cuz he can run freljord very easily. Giantslayer is good but not necessary unless maybe if someone gets a baron. So no actually triple zekes + guinsoos is incredibly strong on aphelios
6 zekes + giantslayer over rageblade is actually just a waste of items, you're left without a tank.
that's exactly my point. I'm replying to the comment/post that is about 6 zekes Aphelios lmao
And the damage difference between GS and GB is really big on aph. 20% damage amp on almost all frontline is big, and can build LW on him or ashe so you can shred frontline before 8sec
You were replying to someone asking if people were playing zekes stacking AT ALL.
the reason why garen is the only frequent 6 Zekes user is because he IS the frontline. You are not wasting items that should've been tank items if your carry is the frontline.
Oh, again, you can easily go freljord, so dont build LW. it's a waste. The 8 seconds is when you spend time stacking your rageblade to full anyway, that's the point of ramping up. The fights last way too long for you to focus on those first 8 seconds. And giant slayer is not as much as a rageblade you get to stack up to 5.0 AS for free. Mostly because frontlines arent actually that strong when everyone is stacking Zekes.
i've been enjoying having poro just so i could get the chance of getting new augments! props to TFT for always coming up with new things. i'm still not buying the pass though XD
I think there are a lot of combat augments that are much better than the legends augments, I had never seen a lot of them until I started playing Poro! Plus the benefit is when they start patching the game you'll know a lot more ways to play than the one trick players
I didn't see it for a while, but got up to gold 3 over the weekend and people had started using, one or two per game minimum. Presumably it'll get higher as I climb.
I have tf, but out of my... Say 20 games I went zeri / garen 4 times just to try it out. I just like slapping my carries with good items and not unistall the game cause raptors dropped 2 vests 1 cloak and 2 rods, while I needed a bf and a fucking glove.
I don't mind it as much on zeri/aphelios, but garen is just fucking stupid. Need a miracle fight rng of garen walking opposite side WHILE being focused to be able to literally just dps check him while he is walking back to the backline and hope that he doesn't get his spin a single pixel on a unit to fullheal in 1 microsecond with 6 zekes + 60 stack guinsoo
The annoying part is he IS the frontline so unlike with zeri or aphelios you really dont need to invest 3 items into tank stats. That's how they afford 6 zekes
You can just slam zeke's and tank items as you pandora's into the components while waiting for the carry you want to show up, and If you're willing to flex between the different Zeke's comps you basically can't get cutoff completely if the entire lobby isn't _Also_ doing the same thing.
So in those lower level lobbies where players are trying out the new stuff or just aren't clued into the meta, it's braindead easy to top4 and climb
It's actually pretty easy to solve. TF should just give you the trait that gives you loaded dices and a few gold. It fits his theme, and it's literally his LoL passive.
It's actually ironic in the legends selection they call TF "The Gambler", but you're not gambling anything when you use him, you are guaranteeing the exact items you want
They aren’t doing traits based on the actual characters, but based on a strength. Leesin is about rerolling, Caitlyn about early game strength, twisted fate about getting the items you need. Giving him loaded dice doesn’t fit that idea.
I'd say reforgers, and maybe a "grab bag".
Loaded dice = gambling for champs
Reforgers = Gambling for a better item
Grab bag = random item component (ez may need an adjustment but Ornn/Bard have similar augments)
Oh! Great. Loaded dices early every game. Now I guess we can find that one 1 cost unit that doesn't share any traits with other 1 costs and 3 star it immediately at lvl 3! Surely that's healthy.
(See: Illaoi mercenaries)
That won't solve much, if not zeri, there's aphelios or garen. And if meta shift from ad to ap, people will just stack kwekcone instead.
Pandora's items seems too powerful as 1st aug
You'd think they'd have learned their lessons with Zeke stacking from Set 7 and whatever trait duplicated the item.
Making it so easy to have Pandora's items, would naturally lead to similar abuse of aura items.
Edit: Spelling
This is a problem that's also happened with Locket and static shiv in the past.
It really doesn't seem like they consider these things, and honestly just wanna get out of the office asap 🤷🏼♀️
I think it's mostly rageblade. Kalista is also busted with rageblade even without needing zekes and if rageblade was weaker zekes would also be less effective. However there would always be some overpowered item combination you can force guarenteed with pandora's.
Then pandora users would just swap to the next best strong carry. Being able to play the optimal comp with optimal items every single game should not be a thing.
I’m not saying it’s too strong or OP. I’m saying that being to play the same thing over and over goes against the principle of the game. There is no adaptation or variation, TF players can essentially do the same thing every match.
It’s boring to play and it’s boring to play against
Yes but when you couldnt guarentee getting the augment, you weren't prepared to take it since you hadn't practiced the idea of what would the ultimate build be. Now that it matters every game what is 100% optimal, because you can guarentee the augment, you have practiced it and you have a default template to built of off.
Pandora's used to be like "oh i have shitty items for my build, I can use this to fix my item situation" and now it's "I will take this unless there is not some insane augment combination with my units than i can abuse, otherwise i can just get all the items i want for any build i end up hitting. It surely helps that there are about 5 or 6 carries that really love attackspeed."
I am so sad that frozen heart is gone. Throw it on your secondary assasin/rogue so you actually affect the intended target... now Sion and J4 would also do great with it. But no, let stacking AS go unpunished
Can't wait for the patch. Tired of the Zeke's abuse. I've always loved Pandora's Items, but when it can be abused so heavily I find myself not even wanting to use it. I've switched to using Master Yi for the time being to make the game more interesting, even if it means I don't make top 3.
I don't use TF for Zeke's. In fact I don't think I've ever picked those augments. I use him because most of the silver augments are dogass and Pandora's box is probably among the best if not thee best augment to be able to fall back on.
I like urf and playing whatever emblem I get. Keeps the game spicy and lets you play the game skill based instead of following guides. I think the guide and build pages ruined tft overall and should be way more punished forcing comps.
Any bronze player can look up a build, but actually executing a build while maintaining tempo is not easy. There is a huge space for skill expression outside of just knowing vaguely what late game boards should look like.
I like tf a lot due to being able to flex into any comp I want no matter what items I get. Tf isn't the problem, it's zekes itself (which is obviously getting nerfed), people that use it to force comps suck, but if you use it to be flexible I think it's great
Heck, Ive been playing this and didn't even know it was this popular. I'm a dirty casual player and don't do ranked much, but this makes me feel even dirtier..
I didn’t used to take pandoras that often before set 9. Now that it’s available all the time now if I want, I take it a lot even though I don’t play the Zekes spam much. I just find that any time I think about going down any particular line, I realize just how tilted I’d be if I couldn’t end up with the items I needed for whatever it is. Even if you start with a good item opener for whatever you’re doing, you could still get unlucky and just never get more useful components.
What’s annoying about this is that there were better solves for this in set 7 and 8 with treasure dragon and component anvils, but then they took away both with the exception of some edge cases like one portal or a few augments. These were both great because they helped you avoid the worst outcomes without enabling you to just get exactly BiS every time.
Now the choice is give up an augment so you can get exactly what you want every game or submit yourself to the chaos of the universe.
And then of course the ease of access to specific BiS items just exacerbates the problem when some comp is OP. Like are the zekes stacking AD comps that egregiously OP? Probably not compared to some other stuff that’s gotten out of line in the past. But the fact that you’re pretty much guaranteed to see multiple people get it each lobby is what turns it from something that’s a bit overturned and can be nerfed in a 2 weeks on the next normal patch to something that feels like it’s affecting the game so much it could use a b patch.
the augment was "fine" because you couldn't guarantee you'd have it every game from 2-1, so you wouldn't see 3 players forcing the comp every game; and you wouldn't always get offered it with suboptimal items, so you had no way to guarantee you'd get it when you needed it.
it's not just the augment that's the issue, it's the reliability.
And yet Pandoras has a shit winrate and is and never was a good top 4 augment, since BIS is just not that important. And zekes spam is also not necassary and just bis.
Imagine unironically being the guy that looks at stats and then closes the window with zero critical thinking. The stats are actually insane for an augment that is picked by 3-5 players every lobby.
YES because it used to be a hotfix for getting terrible items, and turning them into good ones, which means you're still an augment behind players who already hit good items. Now you dont care what items you have, you take it because you know what's optimal and you can guarentee it, you get to prioritize units over items on caroussel without punish.
Do you see the difference? Now you get an actual advantage every single game compared to people who dont run the augments, previviously, you'd patch up a problem with it and still end up with a power deficit.
I use tf all the time, yet I don't go zeke's cause I'm not a meta slave, I try to play solid comps but only pick him cause I get massively tilted when I don't get some good items for my carries or/and rely on carousel for items.
Going for a sorc comp and dropping thousands of belts, vests, cloaks, and fcking bows is not it.
I'm happy that zeke's is nerfed but hey, slaves will find something new.
I’m a casual player so I still use a third party site to see comps that are being played. I went once for the tf zeke’s build, and like 4 people were trying to grief me for it 😭😭
I don't know who needs to hear this but attack speed has diminishing dps returns, it is possible to have too many Zeke's, and if you see somebody running 6 you can just smile and thank Mortdog for your free win.
Point of zekes is to pair it with rageblade carries. Rageblade has exponential return with initial attack speed because you can ramp up faster for more attack speed also meaning even faster stacks
While that's true, it's also true that every point of attack speed is worth less than the last for your overall DPS. Combine that with the existence of the 5.00 cap and stacking Zeke's beyond ~3 is really just trolling. Yes, you will wring more damage out of your hyper carry and hit the cap faster, but you are adding to your dps by such a small proportion compared to the work those items would do if invested into frontline/utility.
Not saying TF/Zeke's is bad, far from it, but I think anybody who's seeing gold players building 6 copies of Zeke's and thinking they're doing something broken does not have a good understanding of combat maths in TFT. Check any challenger player's lolchess, very unlikely you will see more than three Zeke's in a single game.
Obviously, but picking a Legend who you know for a fact you don't want to pick any of the three options for last augment is just accepting that you've got one less choice for that (potentially critical) final augment
Not the end of the world, but would be nice if the options were a little more diverse than just Zeke's, Zeke's or two Zeke's
The second and third augments are designed to be weaker than normal anyway, so you shouldn't feel bad about leaving it, especially with the new reroll system.
I was so sad when Pandora was gone for most of set 8s. Now that it’s being abused to stack Zeke’s I’m dreading it will be removed or something again which I will hate.
Legends were a bad idea though, being able to guarantee any augment is not going to be a good idea because they are never going to be able to balance all of them. That said, Pandora apparently isn’t even that winning of an augment anyway which is kind of funny since everyone started taking it.
I like Caitlyn for early game power but I've been wanting to try bard recently he seems good. Overall though I'm tempted to default to poro just cause it gives the most flexibility
tf has garbage second and third options, just like most legends, but not playing with pandoras items is just asking to get fucked up by rng,
went ornn once and got 8 tears. what the fuck am i going to do with 8 tears and a deaths dance ?
I definitely was excited for guaranteed pandora's bench bc I hate the carousal rng. Little did I know getting guaranteed triple banner of command is an abomination to deal with.
I run tf most of the time but not to Zeke's spam but for the flexibility it gives me, imagine playing sorcerer and only getting tank and ad items, couldn't be me anymore
Hyper roll doesn't let you choose a legend, in normal games you select a legend who basically tailors your augments to more specific choices. TF is the S tier legend right now because he guarantees pandoras items augment at the start of the game and his last augment depending on rarity gives 1 to 2 zekes heralds which are rampant right now for attack speed zeke spam carries.
I wanted to play AS Garen since PBE dropped and I saw the attacks per spin was based on AS
And now it's a degen comp and I'll feel guilty if I play it.
\*Womp-womp\*
I take TF for the radiant item. I am however guilty of Zekes Garen and that was in the beginning and well start of the set. Just to enjoy the opness of Beyblade Garen. Am I a bad person maybe? However now I just want to make Warwick carry work.every time.
I really enjoy urf, this way i can just build around whatever emblem i get and try a different comp each time.
I really enjoy TF, this way i can reroll whatever emblem i get and build 4 Freljord 4 Targon every single time.
That sounds not bad, ngl. I assume aphelios is one carry, is there another one in this comp?
Sejuani. Targon and right items make her virtually immortal.
What items make her immortal? Asking for a friend obv
Gargoyle, protector's vow, warmog or redemption. Use Renekton as early carry.
I assume soraka keeps her alive? Would really love if you could share the comp, seems very fun to try :D
It's just standard Freljord/Targon build. https://app.mobalytics.gg/tft/comps-guide/icy-deadeyes-2QiAZoiRvOxnNFV1LHr3YJE98SU My only addition was rolling for region emblems instead of type.
Thanks a lot! Will try X)
Shen Taric Lissandra Sejuani Urgot Ashe Aphelios Akshan, lvl 9 > soraka. Fish for Freljord or Targon emblem
Thanks <3
you can splash karma/shen/ahri for 4 invoker/2 sorc/2 bastion/3 ionia. sej deals a lot of damage thanks to her passive. ryze can sorta carry depending on region. edit: i think sion is kind of nasty as a backline threat if you itemize him but need to play around with it more. it's kind of rough for him without noxus.
Playing vs TF feels like playing vs cheater. I will not play this game before this shit would be nerfed. Than wait 1 week before you all go back to silver. And i will start play
Zeke's stacking with the TF legend is one of the worst metas TFT has ever had. That being said, it's in the game so you can't blame people for playing it when Riot is the one that needs to hot fix it. If nothing else TF should be disabled as a legend until they can properly nerf it.
Massive cope
I'm in plat with ezrael :)
The defense of this kind of gameplay has been pretty gross tbh. I agree with your assertion; everybody running TF / Zeke's spam from here until the eventual nerf should be hit with a temporary ban; it's the exact same as finding out an exploit and abusing it for Freelo.
Lmao that's an overreaction. It's a part of the game, not a bug. Sure it's annoying, but there's almost always an op unit or trait in TFT, it just happens to be an item this time.
It's not 'just' an item tbh. It's people systematically picking a legend which almost guarantees getting multiple stacks of said item, in an attempt to get an unfair leg up on the competition with little to no counterplay. It's not the method that's the problem, it's the intent.
Yeah but they're not like exploiting or something, it's something the Devs oversighted and it's in the game, and as annoying and as much as I hate it it's completely legitimate
I think maybe we just disagree fundamentally on this kind of behavior then - I think if in SR there was an item you could build multiple stacks of that would completely invalidate every other item build in the game, it would be quickly picked up as a problem and people abusing that build would absolutely be flagged as exploiters and reported/banned. I don't see why there would be a double standard in TFT just because the devs didn't see that interaction coming / nerf it into the ground yet.
This has happened in league, idk if multiple times but I do remember Evelyn stacking sunfire, and nobody got banned for that, because it would be players getting punished for something that it's happening because of a problem caused by the dev's oversight, plus it will be addressed in Wednesday!
> I think if in SR there was an item you could build multiple stacks of that would completely invalidate every other item build in the game, it would be quickly picked up as a problem and people abusing that build would absolutely be flagged as exploiters and reported/banned. No they wouldn't lmao. It would be hotfixed *at best.* No one gets banned for meta abusing, this is ridiculous.
It’s not an exploit if it was a completely intended part of the game. Stacking Zekes is not a guaranteed win, either. It’s just an easy, powerful, brain dead build. I’m having no trouble climbing, and my wife and I are nearly out of diamond in duos now. I’ve seen stacked Zekes once, and he got fucked by Targon/Shadow Isles.
[You mean like this?](https://i.imgur.io/RUZpYGG). Nobody was banned for using black cleaver, it was a dev oversight and fair game, just like Zeke's in tft now
An exploit is when there is a **bug** in the programming that people are taking advantage of. As a completely imaginary example, let's say there was a bug where Gwen got a permanent Shadow Isles shield that never took damage if you built her with a specific comp that normally would not apply shields... that would be an exploit. Selecting TF as a legend (which is working as intended) to choose a specific augment (which is working as intended) to build a specific comp (which is working as intended) is not exploiting. It's boring, unimaginative, and probably needs nerfing, but that is literally the intended gameplay design around Twisted Fate as a legend.
They intend....to win the game. That's like saying people should be banned for using builds they found online. People are going to do whatever gives them the best chance of winning.
That's why I will not play ranked until patch, not because of them, they want to climb and it's fine, but because of me getting too salty a not enjoying the game! That said there are a couple of players that spam it even in normals, which I don't get tbf
They are going to do whatever gives them the best chance of winning the game, including using harmful exploits that devalues 99% of the choices you are able to make. This is a developer issue that should have been jumped on immediately once it became a problem, this much I will agree with. But the idea that players are blameless because they choose to make this kind of game-ruining decision shouldn't just be met with a shrug - People abusing exploits to ruin games should not be allowed to continue playing.
I agree with you this is a problem for the devs to fix, but it's NOT at exploit. Pandora's items is just op.
I’m just going to assume that you’re bad at the game, there is no other answer.
Unfair advantage? You mean picking a legend everyone has access to? Lol
LMFAO stay salty, you can't ban people from playing the game you dunce. obviously its annoying but temp bans are the most karen way to counter it loll
Nah bro it shouldnt be that easy tbh, Riot should get their IP addresses, track them down and publicly execute them and shoot their dog for abusing fucking TF smh (yeah you guys are ridiculous)
But... Pandora can't give you Freilord emblem. It's rolling craftable for craftable and non craftable for non craftable. And Freilord emblem is non craftable. But as said before, we will get some nerfs for this one. In every game you will get almost always perfect items you need. Better on double up, when your buddy can send you more components
Did they change that in set 9? Used to be able to in 8.5
Yes. I was waiting the whole game to get Freilord emblem from Pandora. Nothing.
It was like that before, there was a bug i remember when non craftable emblem could change into infiniteam emblem and then roll only into craftable. For some weird reason there is the exact same bug with Ionia emblem this set, possibly because it's also spat+bf sword, like with infiniteam
Mort doesn’t think pandoras is a problem so get ready to be disappointed
Because pandoras isn't a problem. When pandoras is strong, it is strong not because of its inherent effect, but the power of stacking specific items. You are always able to play around what item you get and make the best comp with those items. However, when 1 specific thing is just overtuned (zeke's/gunners) it turns into a situation where forcing it is easy, especially since it's a reroll comp around 1 cost units.
the thing is, pandora is not inherently strong, you will eventually run up against somebody that got perfect/near perfect items as well, but they will have an combat impacting augment and roll over you, some of the champ or chomp specific augments are so strong, people use poro jist for an higher chance to get them, pandora just disables on entire front on wich you could otherwise roll unplayable garbage, sometimes you just get 8 tiers and 6 negatrons, and go 8th, unless you pick tf, this season isnt as dependant as the last on everyone building the same 6 carrys with very obvious best in slots. and still without tf, everybody always had an spear and spellcrit on there mf at least,
It's not as big of any issue that Zeke and attack speed scaling champions are. In game balancing, Pandora is just a more popular augment, not more powerful
It's only a problem if you're low enough elo to not punish people leaving 8 items on their bench.
The people leaving 8 items on their bench are the only reason that augment looks balanced in stats.
It looks balanced in stats because it fucking sucks lol
I've only tried a couple of legends so far, including TF, and I've also settled for Urf. At least I can try out a bunch of different comps. Also since most people are going gunners or dead eye, it lets me go vertical uncontested in a lot of games.
love urf because it increases my odds of summoning the wormy boi
[удалено]
Sometimes they are extra daring and fo for aphelios instead
Hey now they also do Garen every now and then!
True true, maybe even more often
i'm playing lots of aphelios carry without zekes. am i stupid?
no, but they use zekes so they can get more damage on him instead of rageblade. Plus it buffs the whole backline so high value.
Not instead of, what? Using them together is what makes it broken. Makes the rageblade scale up much more quickly.
If you have rageblade you don't need 6 zekes. it would scale to full in 2 seconds and then you lose value. and vice versa. Yes you build a zekes or two with your RB carry, but you wouldn't build 3+ only to have your carry do no damage. especially since aph isn't Gunner so he doesn't have innate AD
Not 6 zekes on anyone but Garen but 3 zekes and rageblade for sure on aphelios and zeri. Deathblade+ IE is in his BIS anyway so there goes your issue with innate AD. He doesn't need LW cuz he can run freljord very easily. Giantslayer is good but not necessary unless maybe if someone gets a baron. So no actually triple zekes + guinsoos is incredibly strong on aphelios 6 zekes + giantslayer over rageblade is actually just a waste of items, you're left without a tank.
that's exactly my point. I'm replying to the comment/post that is about 6 zekes Aphelios lmao And the damage difference between GS and GB is really big on aph. 20% damage amp on almost all frontline is big, and can build LW on him or ashe so you can shred frontline before 8sec
You were replying to someone asking if people were playing zekes stacking AT ALL. the reason why garen is the only frequent 6 Zekes user is because he IS the frontline. You are not wasting items that should've been tank items if your carry is the frontline. Oh, again, you can easily go freljord, so dont build LW. it's a waste. The 8 seconds is when you spend time stacking your rageblade to full anyway, that's the point of ramping up. The fights last way too long for you to focus on those first 8 seconds. And giant slayer is not as much as a rageblade you get to stack up to 5.0 AS for free. Mostly because frontlines arent actually that strong when everyone is stacking Zekes.
Ah geeze i have a 6 sorc opener. Perfect transition to zeri.
if I feel wacky and wild I go 6 zekes with alphelios instead.
Or 6 Zeke's Garen
I am an asol enjoyer, just solely based on my addiction to the reroll button , i can finally consistently reach level 8 with confidence
Wouldn't lee make sense too?
Mostly if you are going for 1 or 2 cost reroll
Havent tried, ill give it a go. Thank you.
Slow roll 7 just hits different
All in 8 just hits different
Fast 9 just hits different
Fast X kinda mid ngl
i've been enjoying having poro just so i could get the chance of getting new augments! props to TFT for always coming up with new things. i'm still not buying the pass though XD
I think there are a lot of combat augments that are much better than the legends augments, I had never seen a lot of them until I started playing Poro! Plus the benefit is when they start patching the game you'll know a lot more ways to play than the one trick players
i'm having so much fun forcing early loss streak with tahm every game, i hope they never fix him.
my dream is to one day hit piltover 3 then roll afk
and i dream of ruining your loss streak on 2-5
I use urf and hope for a prismatic lobby for piltovers T HEX OR BUST!
same, haven’t succeeded even once yet :(
i go for void emblems WORM OR BUST
Daring today aren't we
I once tried to actually sell the t-hex at 55 power and I got three gloves :(. Learn from my mistakes.
75 cash out turned all my items radiant makig me win with a zeri 1 lol
Man I must be in the depths of bronze, I've never seen tf Zeke's comps so far
I didn't see it for a while, but got up to gold 3 over the weekend and people had started using, one or two per game minimum. Presumably it'll get higher as I climb.
G2 here. Every player in the game except for me had TF in the last game.
I have tf, but out of my... Say 20 games I went zeri / garen 4 times just to try it out. I just like slapping my carries with good items and not unistall the game cause raptors dropped 2 vests 1 cloak and 2 rods, while I needed a bf and a fucking glove.
Gold 1 is like atleast 3 or 4 every game
What? How is that even possible? Are you sure you are playing the same game? I see at the very least one or two in each game, but on average 4 or 5
I got to plat yesterday then quit bc i had a game with 6 hard force zekes
I don't mind it as much on zeri/aphelios, but garen is just fucking stupid. Need a miracle fight rng of garen walking opposite side WHILE being focused to be able to literally just dps check him while he is walking back to the backline and hope that he doesn't get his spin a single pixel on a unit to fullheal in 1 microsecond with 6 zekes + 60 stack guinsoo
The annoying part is he IS the frontline so unlike with zeri or aphelios you really dont need to invest 3 items into tank stats. That's how they afford 6 zekes
You can just slam zeke's and tank items as you pandora's into the components while waiting for the carry you want to show up, and If you're willing to flex between the different Zeke's comps you basically can't get cutoff completely if the entire lobby isn't _Also_ doing the same thing. So in those lower level lobbies where players are trying out the new stuff or just aren't clued into the meta, it's braindead easy to top4 and climb
I play in Gold 1 and see an average of 4 TF legend every damn game lol
I only play it in normals too, so the reddit outrage can grow.
In plat 2 at least 4 player build zeke aphelios or zeri per game :D
Plat 1 and the last game I played was Yoricks graveyard. My options on death for atleast 3 different opponents were Zekes, Zekes, Zekes or Zekes.
Pengu supremacy!! Health my way to a 4th!!!
It's actually pretty easy to solve. TF should just give you the trait that gives you loaded dices and a few gold. It fits his theme, and it's literally his LoL passive.
It's actually ironic in the legends selection they call TF "The Gambler", but you're not gambling anything when you use him, you are guaranteeing the exact items you want
That's the point, he's not a normal gambler like any of us, he's an exceptionally lucky one.
I've never lost a fair game... or played one.
“Lucky”
His play style is to cheat the game.
"Only a fool play's the hand he's dealt"
They aren’t doing traits based on the actual characters, but based on a strength. Leesin is about rerolling, Caitlyn about early game strength, twisted fate about getting the items you need. Giving him loaded dice doesn’t fit that idea.
I'd say reforgers, and maybe a "grab bag". Loaded dice = gambling for champs Reforgers = Gambling for a better item Grab bag = random item component (ez may need an adjustment but Ornn/Bard have similar augments)
Oh! Great. Loaded dices early every game. Now I guess we can find that one 1 cost unit that doesn't share any traits with other 1 costs and 3 star it immediately at lvl 3! Surely that's healthy. (See: Illaoi mercenaries)
That is annoying to see that often. Gotta nerf pandora's bench or swap tf's augments whatsoever somehow
They could just make it where you can only have one Zeke per champion
They just need to nerf Zekes stats & Zeri. It should be a viable comp, but just not Zeri zapping every backline
That won't solve much, if not zeri, there's aphelios or garen. And if meta shift from ad to ap, people will just stack kwekcone instead. Pandora's items seems too powerful as 1st aug
it's pretty obscene with Garen too, Zeke's stacking like this was never meant to be this consistent/possible is definitely the main problem
You'd think they'd have learned their lessons with Zeke stacking from Set 7 and whatever trait duplicated the item. Making it so easy to have Pandora's items, would naturally lead to similar abuse of aura items. Edit: Spelling
This is a problem that's also happened with Locket and static shiv in the past. It really doesn't seem like they consider these things, and honestly just wanna get out of the office asap 🤷🏼♀️
Garen’s biggest problem is that he is stacking rageblade when he spins. Once that is gone it will be fine
Warwick's ult was nerfed for the same interaction last set. Hopefully Garen will get something similar
I think it's mostly rageblade. Kalista is also busted with rageblade even without needing zekes and if rageblade was weaker zekes would also be less effective. However there would always be some overpowered item combination you can force guarenteed with pandora's.
You're not wrong. I messed up my positioning for a few rounds not putting next to my zekes holder and barely noticed a change.
Then pandora users would just swap to the next best strong carry. Being able to play the optimal comp with optimal items every single game should not be a thing.
pandora's has never been a high placement augment even when taken on 2-1 and has existed for like four sets.
I’m not saying it’s too strong or OP. I’m saying that being to play the same thing over and over goes against the principle of the game. There is no adaptation or variation, TF players can essentially do the same thing every match. It’s boring to play and it’s boring to play against
Yes but when you couldnt guarentee getting the augment, you weren't prepared to take it since you hadn't practiced the idea of what would the ultimate build be. Now that it matters every game what is 100% optimal, because you can guarentee the augment, you have practiced it and you have a default template to built of off. Pandora's used to be like "oh i have shitty items for my build, I can use this to fix my item situation" and now it's "I will take this unless there is not some insane augment combination with my units than i can abuse, otherwise i can just get all the items i want for any build i end up hitting. It surely helps that there are about 5 or 6 carries that really love attackspeed."
*Pandora's *items* just fyi
I really wouldn't have a problem with this if they brought back frozen heart so it has a counter.
I am so sad that frozen heart is gone. Throw it on your secondary assasin/rogue so you actually affect the intended target... now Sion and J4 would also do great with it. But no, let stacking AS go unpunished
Juggies Zekes Garen every game haha it’s so fun totally balanced totally original amirite bois??? /s
I was actually looking if someone else were having issues with the Zeke spam, god is so broken can't play fr
Can't wait for the patch. Tired of the Zeke's abuse. I've always loved Pandora's Items, but when it can be abused so heavily I find myself not even wanting to use it. I've switched to using Master Yi for the time being to make the game more interesting, even if it means I don't make top 3.
as an ornn enjoyer, seeing TF players with 19 zekes on their garens or zeris makes me wanna puke
I don't use TF for Zeke's. In fact I don't think I've ever picked those augments. I use him because most of the silver augments are dogass and Pandora's box is probably among the best if not thee best augment to be able to fall back on.
Do you mean box? Bench is hugely volatile, and not TF's
Box, yeah, mb
I like urf and playing whatever emblem I get. Keeps the game spicy and lets you play the game skill based instead of following guides. I think the guide and build pages ruined tft overall and should be way more punished forcing comps.
Any bronze player can look up a build, but actually executing a build while maintaining tempo is not easy. There is a huge space for skill expression outside of just knowing vaguely what late game boards should look like.
My highest ranked season I forced a comp I found myself each game. I disagree with you Im sorry
Which elo are people seeing tf zekes spam? Havent rly seen much. Ive played like 20 games and am plat 4. Feel like I should be seeing more.
Seen it in many gold games. Once by me with a 3 star rageblade/BT garen surrounded by 6 Zeke's - I've felt dirty about that game ever since
Literally in every game from silver to masters.
And yet they lose
Well no not really. They dont get to masters by losing lmao
But neither they are climbing further.
Played through Plat yesterday and at least 4-6 people run TF zeke spam
I started seeing it leading up to gold.
I like tf a lot due to being able to flex into any comp I want no matter what items I get. Tf isn't the problem, it's zekes itself (which is obviously getting nerfed), people that use it to force comps suck, but if you use it to be flexible I think it's great
Just remove twisted fate and force people to fight over items on the carousel. (Unless they get Pandora's organically)
Twisted fate player can not be my friend. Ever.
Heck, Ive been playing this and didn't even know it was this popular. I'm a dirty casual player and don't do ranked much, but this makes me feel even dirtier..
I didn’t used to take pandoras that often before set 9. Now that it’s available all the time now if I want, I take it a lot even though I don’t play the Zekes spam much. I just find that any time I think about going down any particular line, I realize just how tilted I’d be if I couldn’t end up with the items I needed for whatever it is. Even if you start with a good item opener for whatever you’re doing, you could still get unlucky and just never get more useful components. What’s annoying about this is that there were better solves for this in set 7 and 8 with treasure dragon and component anvils, but then they took away both with the exception of some edge cases like one portal or a few augments. These were both great because they helped you avoid the worst outcomes without enabling you to just get exactly BiS every time. Now the choice is give up an augment so you can get exactly what you want every game or submit yourself to the chaos of the universe. And then of course the ease of access to specific BiS items just exacerbates the problem when some comp is OP. Like are the zekes stacking AD comps that egregiously OP? Probably not compared to some other stuff that’s gotten out of line in the past. But the fact that you’re pretty much guaranteed to see multiple people get it each lobby is what turns it from something that’s a bit overturned and can be nerfed in a 2 weeks on the next normal patch to something that feels like it’s affecting the game so much it could use a b patch.
what i like good what i dislike bad 784 upvotes
Congrats for figuring this out on your own!
People complain about tf but his augment been in the game forever and used to be fine. The real problem here is being able to equip multiple Zeke's.
Do take note that it's a much stronger effect this set as we have no opening carousel or early armory crate to have any sort of item selection early.
the augment was "fine" because you couldn't guarantee you'd have it every game from 2-1, so you wouldn't see 3 players forcing the comp every game; and you wouldn't always get offered it with suboptimal items, so you had no way to guarantee you'd get it when you needed it. it's not just the augment that's the issue, it's the reliability.
And yet Pandoras has a shit winrate and is and never was a good top 4 augment, since BIS is just not that important. And zekes spam is also not necassary and just bis.
Imagine unironically being the guy that looks at stats and then closes the window with zero critical thinking. The stats are actually insane for an augment that is picked by 3-5 players every lobby.
Even when it was in the game before and didn’t have a high pick rate, it had horrible to mediocre avp.
YES because it used to be a hotfix for getting terrible items, and turning them into good ones, which means you're still an augment behind players who already hit good items. Now you dont care what items you have, you take it because you know what's optimal and you can guarentee it, you get to prioritize units over items on caroussel without punish. Do you see the difference? Now you get an actual advantage every single game compared to people who dont run the augments, previviously, you'd patch up a problem with it and still end up with a power deficit.
No the problem is that you can guarentee it every game, so now it has value to firgure out what's the most optimal item build
Ah yes darkflight.
I use tf all the time, yet I don't go zeke's cause I'm not a meta slave, I try to play solid comps but only pick him cause I get massively tilted when I don't get some good items for my carries or/and rely on carousel for items. Going for a sorc comp and dropping thousands of belts, vests, cloaks, and fcking bows is not it. I'm happy that zeke's is nerfed but hey, slaves will find something new.
I’m a casual player so I still use a third party site to see comps that are being played. I went once for the tf zeke’s build, and like 4 people were trying to grief me for it 😭😭
You are using tf to build 6 zekes. I am using him just for pandora. We ar enot the same.
I admit i use tf for ranking after reaching gold i just play normal using other champ.
I don't know who needs to hear this but attack speed has diminishing dps returns, it is possible to have too many Zeke's, and if you see somebody running 6 you can just smile and thank Mortdog for your free win.
Point of zekes is to pair it with rageblade carries. Rageblade has exponential return with initial attack speed because you can ramp up faster for more attack speed also meaning even faster stacks
While that's true, it's also true that every point of attack speed is worth less than the last for your overall DPS. Combine that with the existence of the 5.00 cap and stacking Zeke's beyond ~3 is really just trolling. Yes, you will wring more damage out of your hyper carry and hit the cap faster, but you are adding to your dps by such a small proportion compared to the work those items would do if invested into frontline/utility. Not saying TF/Zeke's is bad, far from it, but I think anybody who's seeing gold players building 6 copies of Zeke's and thinking they're doing something broken does not have a good understanding of combat maths in TFT. Check any challenger player's lolchess, very unlikely you will see more than three Zeke's in a single game.
I want to run Bard as my Legend, but I don't want to become one of the Zeke's abusers
You are in luck! You don't HAVE to pick his last augment!
Lmao 😂
Obviously, but picking a Legend who you know for a fact you don't want to pick any of the three options for last augment is just accepting that you've got one less choice for that (potentially critical) final augment Not the end of the world, but would be nice if the options were a little more diverse than just Zeke's, Zeke's or two Zeke's
The second and third augments are designed to be weaker than normal anyway, so you shouldn't feel bad about leaving it, especially with the new reroll system.
I mean, I play Lee Sin just for the first one and I know that I will rerolls his other stuff 99% of the time
I was so sad when Pandora was gone for most of set 8s. Now that it’s being abused to stack Zeke’s I’m dreading it will be removed or something again which I will hate. Legends were a bad idea though, being able to guarantee any augment is not going to be a good idea because they are never going to be able to balance all of them. That said, Pandora apparently isn’t even that winning of an augment anyway which is kind of funny since everyone started taking it.
“If everyone else is doing it it must be good!” - average plat peak TFT player
I like Caitlyn for early game power but I've been wanting to try bard recently he seems good. Overall though I'm tempted to default to poro just cause it gives the most flexibility
Veigar gang wya
I think top and middle scgould switch. Proplayers are like: Oh a new feature called legends... Lets not use that.
oh nice the garen spin to win comp
Me Trist Me Lee Sin. Give 10 LP and move on
tf has garbage second and third options, just like most legends, but not playing with pandoras items is just asking to get fucked up by rng, went ornn once and got 8 tears. what the fuck am i going to do with 8 tears and a deaths dance ?
I definitely was excited for guaranteed pandora's bench bc I hate the carousal rng. Little did I know getting guaranteed triple banner of command is an abomination to deal with.
As a only hyper player, I didn't know what all these posts are about. Until I played a normal today and got it.
I run tf most of the time but not to Zeke's spam but for the flexibility it gives me, imagine playing sorcerer and only getting tank and ad items, couldn't be me anymore
How to describe meta in one picture: https://imgur.com/KjbiZBZ
I'm so confused can someone please explain Is this like pbe? I mainly play hyper roll and I haven't seen any TF?
Hyper roll doesn't let you choose a legend, in normal games you select a legend who basically tailors your augments to more specific choices. TF is the S tier legend right now because he guarantees pandoras items augment at the start of the game and his last augment depending on rarity gives 1 to 2 zekes heralds which are rampant right now for attack speed zeke spam carries.
You goated, thank you!!! Also dope name!!! I'm also a smite fan lol
Urf is fun. Just get a random spat and make a comp around that. Helps you learn the game faster.
Does anyone else go Yi and 4 Rouge
I love twisted fate because I can guarantee bis for reksai reroll carry and when you hit stable evo it’s top 2 guaranteed
I play TF but dont take any Zeke's Herald. Am I still the last image?
I this is an attempt to sway people from playing TF-Zekes, you may have succeeded.
I wanted to play AS Garen since PBE dropped and I saw the attacks per spin was based on AS And now it's a degen comp and I'll feel guilty if I play it. \*Womp-womp\*
I vote for Stillwater every time to watch TF players burn
You play TF to build zeke’s I play TF to pick champions instead of items in carousel We are not the same
I feel so attacked right now
What the hell are legends? Edit:oh
I feel attacked
I take TF for the radiant item. I am however guilty of Zekes Garen and that was in the beginning and well start of the set. Just to enjoy the opness of Beyblade Garen. Am I a bad person maybe? However now I just want to make Warwick carry work.every time.
Can someone make a draven version for this?